China Does Capitalism Better Than America

For all appearances, China has emerged unscathed from the global economic crisis, in stark contrast to its biggest debtor, America. China's admirers point to its ability to mobilize state resources, quick decision-making and business-friendly environment as reasons for its economic ascendency. But can its brand of state-directed capitalism overcome rampant corruption and the threat of growing inequality, or will the American model of innovation and free markets prevail?
For: Orville Schell
For: Peter Schiff
Against: Minxin Pei
Against: Ian Bremmer
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[@Birdylockso]

9 years later, the smart old guy is winning the debate. The jury is still out though, but my money is in Asia, maybe China also.

[@YstenID]

In my opinion, the only panelist who actually debated the topic was Orville Schell. He was on-point and system-oriented. Peter Schiff was only taking from his idea that less taxes are better. Pei and Bremmer were basically arguing that a developed country is better than a developing country, which does not contribute to the discussion at hand.

[@ruiq.z314]

China is a Socialist society with a Capitalist economy and Confucius ideology. Whats amazing about China is its flexibility as a nation, and the high efficiency just proves China's Meritocracy.

[@leoleo811]

Bredah Jake I'm a Chinese And I'm not a CCP. You are so ridiculous.pls go to China live over 3months,then give your ideas,As a Chinese,what you said just make me laugh,You know little about China and you believe that you are right.Go to China to see the truth of China , some of aspects in China,actually,far more advance than US

[@leoleo811]

Bredah Jake As my experience,I thought USA media makes American become blind.Curtain of Americans do not know the changes of the world. US are not freedom,your ways to get information are being controlled by media and politicians and you guys do not know that,that makes me feel amazing, I used to think America is liberal freedom and democracy,but what I have seen tell me that I'm wrong.

[@zack_120]

Leo Leo ·>> You are exactly right. The all-wrong polls on President Elect Trump over the past year fully prove that American media are politally motivated and seriously biased, 180° from what they were taught in college. Only a few including IBD/TIPP and LAT/USC have been truthful to report the facts that Trump was leading all the way.

[@RonJeremysfan]

u r ignorant

[@pardeeptandon]

The leaders of China become members of CCP on merit and not by dancing in Hollywood movies or doing real estate deals. Chinese leaders have to go and prove there leadership qualities in the field for at least two to three decades before they reach the top . Do American leaders do that ?

[@hungmanxxxx2462]

Ian and Pei are probably hiding in their basement right now lol 😂.... let’s review in 10 years

[@TheLastEmperorXiXinPig]

yes so let's review now, how is the Evergrande economy doing!? 😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@darkprince809]

China's economic policy is a mixture of socialism and capitalism.. and it seems to work really well for them..

[@solarpanel420]

+Dark Prince There will always be some level of "socialism." Anytime the government does anything, that can be considered socialistic, but as someone who currently lives in China, I can say that there is much more of a free market here than in the United States. It's their free market policies that is propelling their economy at upwards of 8-10% growth every year. It's the street vendors, restaurant owners, and businesses that don't have to deal with roadblocks like they would in the United States

[@weiyilan3227]

We can't not compare China who has only less than 30 years experience of running capitalism with US. With such limited experience and plenty of objectives to be achieved in the past 30 years, sure China will have a lot of problems currently. But the point is whether China can fix the those problems by itself or not. If a system has a better self-reparing capability, then we should regard this system a better one. There is no sense to compare Apple with other Chinese brands cuz the situation is always changing.

[@nithence]

i dont think the system that China has been using in the last 30 years is a good one. State capitalist that China has been committing so far is a system that its own State get most out of the whole benefit and very little share to its own people. A lot mistakes that created by this system has not been fixed instead it has been hidden ,ignored or fabricated.. So in the long run those problems's gonna get bigger and bigger and finally exploiting out..

[@pewpewpistol]

What's China's problems now versus America's? 😂

[@johl2586]

The point is that Modern China is running based on capitalist not it’s so called communism with Chinese characteristics.So China is actually is a modern capitalism country just like any other country.But the reason why China has such successful modernization is based on it’s cruel working conditions and long working hours which at least 85 to 90 or even more hours per week without overtime fees as well as China’s huge amount of people.Combining dictatorship and such original capitalism.This phenomenon is even more common in today’s China in 2022 and workers will have a dark future.

[@stevelenores5637]

@@johl2586 Some of us remember when we thought Japan was taking over the lead in capitalism. "Times are a changing..." Bob Dilan

[@billzhang4138]

China is a civilization state that allows multiple systems running at the same time to reach their goals effectively!

[@dakuang4647]

Won a debate (battle) and lost the plot (war)... That's the best characterization that I could come up with for this debate.

[@toughwang2820]

I'm happy that MinXinPei can always convince US to believe China is not moving ahead but dropping into crisis.Unfortunately US today in 2018 understand China 2025 plan can really lead China to super power.So MinXinPei,please work harder to do so.

[@pr0newbie]

Minxin Pei was right on a lot of the negative little things about China but he forgot that the Chinese system is self-correcting. He's very unfairly expecting a young modern country to have established systems and protocols like a developed countries. Funny how it's now the US that is having a milk formula shortage.

[@iamsister8764]

The fact that China lifted 850 million people out of poverty says a lot about the system. On the other hand , how many Americans have slid into poverty ?

[@judithokemwa2807]

Ten years down, Peter Schiff seems to have been right.

[@strongbrain3128]

China has been said collapsing by the western experts in the last 20 years, but getting stronger in reality.

[@pbrlpgu5601]

Peter Schiff seems less prejudice than the opposite.

[@obj6989]

When your debate is on things based on emotion instead of rationality, you'd only convince weaker mind of an audience, they'd be glad to hear what they want to hear. Well, it is what it is.

[@pardeeptandon6730]

The fact is that last year Chinese GDP grew 2.5 times faster than the growth of American GDP.

[@thatguywiththeface9463]

This was already addressed by the speakers. Developing countries have more potential for economic growth.

[@TheLastEmperorXiXinPig]

how is the Evergrande economy doing today!? 😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@z76776]

I like the Minxin Pei. He is a very good comrade of China, same as Obama. There is a norm for person like Minxin Pei in china, "dai lu dang (routing party)". Dailu dang is always eager to guide USA to believe that China will crap in no time. This "party" works very hard to relax USA, which helps China grow up to superpower in 30 years without alerting USA. Thanks, Professor Minxin Pei.

[@CrusoeAI]

+Ke Zhong Man, you just enlightened me. 愿我有生之年，得见您君临天下

[@user-ly8rc6mg2r]

true

[@SpiritsBB]

Wait, I thought that was Gordon Chang?

[@YM-vu7zd]

战忽局北美分部？

[@columbine7]

我们中出了一个叛徒？

[@ninu5719]

This is 2019.Almost after seven years,let's put together the same panelists again and continue the debate.

[@user-qg6fs5wd3n]

hahaha,but who would like to be slapped on the face?

[@baijinhua]

good idea

[@derekbaker777]

@Kwok Wai Lai: I disagree. America's economy is booming right now thanks to President Trump. Ian Bremmer and Professor Pei were right.

[@htlow3598]

@@derekbaker777 , what evidence do you have to back up your statement? The is no change whatsoever with the way the economy is driven - it's just driven on debts. I think we are coming to the end of the petrol dollar.

[@derekbaker777]

@Kwok Wai Lai: The economy is junk right now thanks to COVID19. But it was in decent shape before the virus hit.

[@normanvirutgraw8980]

Peter is a highly intelligent guy. His statements are full of fact and figures. ( no emotion). He sees trends and predicts the future with great accuracy many years ahead.

[@johnnywalker8536]

it's really funny to see this now, everybody putting across your point of view and today China is still growing faster than America five years after. Someone who sees this today must laugh too much, but it isn't America.

[@ch1kusoo]

I was just searching for Peter Schiff videos, in particular videos of him talking about China and here I am lol. This video was uploaded 8 years ago and it's amazing that a lot has changed in regards to China since then. Peter is right AGAIN

[@juanvaca905]

It’s funny how the US is trying to contain China and stop it’s growth

[@RabeltCorez]

peter is right? have you looked at any data about the economy in china? obviously not

[@hallo84]

@@RabeltCorez So who's leading the tech innovation? The tech war is already won.

[@NYProfessional]

I could not believe the results???? This is a no brainer. The population differences never came up??? The sheer number of 600 to 800 million middle class Chinese contributions is going to dwarf and overwhelm the American capitalism.

[@WayneHuo]

Because population plays a smaller factor in the exponential growth of an economy. Take India for example, with 100 million less people than China, started their economic development at roughly the same time. They are 7 times smaller with a liberal democratic capitalist system.

[@gideondavid30]

Cry human rights all you want but China has come along way. Any progression, whether economic or civil, is good for China. It amazes me how people can criticize the way in China going about its growth considering where it came from.

[@beyeberyl6107]

Wrong debate Title ! The title should "does china economic system better than america"

[@billy.7113]

I agree totally.

[@navegantezen5983]

As the Chinese say, the point is Good Governance against Bad Governance.

[@howdareyou7829]

No dumby u obviously dont understand much

[@mmokwmmokw1280]

True...To add to that China is for the people and USA is for the individuals.

[@EzraMerr]

Na, I've loved in china it has a more capitalist free market than the west has ever been... UK and America started adopting socialism in the late 80s and Asia started creating capitalist free market models based off of Japan, America, and Singapore... 30 years later they are doing better off than the west in most countries

[@truthmatters5536]

Chinese capitalism is the secondary economy. Chinese main economy is socialism. China grew because of socialism, not because of capitalism.

[@ryanbell9376]

Us standard of living is higher than china so why do we want to be like them again?

[@truthmatters5536]

@@ryanbell9376 Chinese middle class populaiton is many mroe than the entire US popualtion. Which standard are you talking about? They do not worry about gun violence, criminal's attack, drugs, etc. They do not have homelss on teh street.

[@ryanbell9376]

@@truthmatters5536 I’m guessing I’m talking about their overpopulation problem. Gun violence isnt a problem for me because I stay strapped dude. What are you talking about?

[@truthmatters5536]

@@ryanbell9376 Alwayns thinjk about yourself only.. Typical.

[@pardeeptandon]

Eight years after this debate it is proved that China does Capitalism better than America.

[@wenxuyao5934]

Have you thought about it’s just state capitalism better than Laissez-faire capitalism?

[@consciously1212]

Minxin Pei made some thoughtless points. His statement about China being less capitalist in terms of competitiveness, efficiency and a provider of social justice is completely ludicrous. It wouldn't surprise me if he was sent by the Chinese government to keep us Americans complacently nodding hour heads in agreement day after day until a major collapse.

[@HP-de2qo]

LOL

[@z76776]

you know too much.....

[@WayneHuo]

He left china for 40 years. He is out of touch with the country. People living outside China likes to take the extreme cases happening in China and then defining that as China. It's sort of like thinking the Presidents of the United States based on the watergate scandal. Think of their human rights concern based on the mass genocide of the Native Indians. Base their cities and states on Flint Michigan where there is still no access to clean water. Base USA on some parts of Detroit where they still don't have internet. American sees and presents themselves to the world as Manhattan New York, while only having one New York. Majority of America is rural farmlands with nothing. But the people living in these rural areas where there's only one house for 2km thinks they are living in the best conditions in world.

[@Birdylockso]

I came here to say that the Chinese guy seems to be out of touch with the current reality in China, because he has been out of the country for so long. He may have been an expert in China 40, or even 30, years ago, but not any more. He's stuck in his own reality of the past.

[@obj6989]

We Chinese were exactly like this way back in the 18 and early 19th century. We can spot the disease in split of a second. There is no cure for such disease, you just have to let it run its course.

[@pr0newbie]

Minxin Pei is funny. Any investor knows that the Chinese 5 year plan must be taken seriously.

[@hallo84]

Because it gets implemented and officials are scored on its results. Look at solar power, china has completed 350% of its stated 5 year plan goals. Minxin Pei needs to say what he is paid to say. That is what the audience paid to hear so that they can cope. Look at the people smiling as they salf congratulate everytime Minxin Pei criticize the chinese system. It makes them feel good and that is what they came to hear. They do not want to know that the chinese system performs better.

[@bouncingBrain]

His opinions are not aging well.

[@indeficit2]

The biggest problem we have with our economy which Peter Schiff alluded to at least twice seems to have fallen on deaf ears. But I guess that is understandable given how the audience may not have a basic understanding of macroeconomics. I also want to point out that Minxin Pei's observation of cronyism in China may not have been inaccurate, since this was 2012, and before Xi Jinping and his crackdown on corruption. Pei also correctly pointed out that China would have to make some major changes to push for consumerism from within in order to keep growing. And that's EXACTLY what they have done! It's almost as if Xi Jinping saw this debate and made sure to steer China's economic growth in the right direction.

[@RabeltCorez]

in the right direction? slower growth and more debt?

[@indeficit2]

@@RabeltCorez Hey what's up buddy?

[@RabeltCorez]

@@indeficit2 not your buddy

[@indeficit2]

@@RabeltCorez you're still upset? Come on. She came on to me! Get over it.

[@RabeltCorez]

@@indeficit2 so no argument? Cool, tipical Chinese bot

[@weseeendoscope9659]

我很难想象如果中国完全听美国的话来治理自己的国家，那将是21世纪最大的灾难

[@chiefouko]

Am watching this in 2022. How wrong they were🤣🤣🤣 China is excelling 👍

[@slightlygruff]

Privatizing giant state entities isn't a good idea

[@auu2009]

I just watched the show.5 years later.all I've to say don't let Ian bremmer and minxin pei on the show.cause we will never learning anything's from a fool.

[@johnnyq4260]

Look at how satisfied and self-congratulatory the audience is. This is funny.

[@user-hr6tb9fh8k]

what a show, this is just entertainment

[@hallo84]

Its called coping

[@quanhusheng6637]

They won the debate but lost at reality.

[@umliuq]

7 years later, jokes are on Ian and pei

[@johnniewalker7628]

Jokes are us, waiting for my next stimulus check to arrive.

[@mustangx]

Richest country argues over a small check.

[@kindface]

Totally and utterly. In debates on other platforms in more recent years, like last 3-4 years, Ian has selectively changed his tunes.

[@cadhlaohanlon4443]

Quit being silly darling, the jokes were always on them.

[@coryhung1685]

OMG, what a pity of Minxin Pei. What he said including many figures and data were wrong. Is he a professor?

[@coryhung1685]

Shan Li 中央政府应该给Pei先生颁一个大大的奖状，他成功地在战术上掩护了中国的战略崛起。

[@coryhung1685]

只是有点时候看到这些人一本正经的胡说八道，着实难以置信，这些人不懂、不清楚，没有关系，实地去研究、调查，实在不行，花一点钱到市场里请一些的中立的研究所、中心去采集数据，综合各个的数据和实地的查看，应该不难得到一个准确的结论，但他们为啥要这样不靠谱地说话呐？

[@maggietang4216]

如果他说中国各方面强，他的工作不会受重视。

[@WayneHuo]

His data was from 2011. Lots have changed in the last 7 years. China has surpassed the United States in many fields now. China has also just broke into top 20 for innovations at world rank 17 last year. Western world has always doubted that the Chinese could ever innovate. Oh they just work hard, they can copy well but they can't create, they are not creative. Well, looks like they were wrong. All these numbers will just keep getting better.

[@ericlum4795]

Cory Hung 看他讲的一本正经的，不愧是战忽局的好同志😂

[@Bavafa1]

"Americans have a very short memory" No truer statement has been spoken

[@larryhongkham694]

Mr. Pei is another Gordon Chang

[@desmondqu8755]

Pointless debate, you want a real one? Get a few Chinese experts and hold the debate in neutral countries.

[@denghua123]

Chinese experts will never say China is capitalism. lol

[@aarongao3578]

yes, I totally believe it

[@mustangx]

Hahahahaha. China is kicking America’s ass. It’s like a pro team playing against an ordinary high school and that’s being generous

[@countchoc90]

I find Schiff very easy to listen too, and he is very good at explaining ideas in layman's terms.

[@mikeli9941]

Ian Bremmer has no points but scolding based on non sense.

[@yiqinuk]

lol， funny bebate. Look how happy the American audience by the end of it. That was nearly three years ago. Keep on dreaming.

[@yiqinuk]

***** Racial dividing towards a crisis! Global influencing weaken especially in Mideast. However, American life still pretty much the same compare with three years ago. Everybody want to know how USD is doing for the next two years. What do you think?China is not a winner too.

[@HypermarketCommodity]

@Shan Li funny thing os that most US apologist use projection against there enemies.

[@wenxuyao5934]

8 years have passed, the answer is clearer and clearer

[@yiqinuk]

@@wenxuyao5934 Indeed. It is very interesting to look back. I nearly forgot I made than comment five years ago.

[@kayem3824]

They are like an Oprah show dumb audience, instant fake happiness.

[@kindface]

So let me see if I get this - if I go to McKenna Whatever College and get Minxin as my prof, all he’s going to do is quote rank tables to tell me how the world works? I still don’t regret not doing a graduate degree in business management; my rigorous undergrad education has served me mighty well. If I have to countenance talk shops, I’d still prefer to do it in the real world any day than to listen to some academician who hasn’t the balls to go out and compete in the school of hard knocks and instead hides in his secure little ivory tower where students contrive to regurgitate some abstract theories taught by some guy who doesn’t like to compete.

[@aresaresares6669]

I think we can ALL agree the decision at the end had less to do with the ability of debaters to persuade people and more to do with people's self pride in ones own country. Do this debate in China and I will guarantee the voting would favor for China. This is a bit like going to Vatican city and ask the question "Is the catholic church a force of good". Which btw, had been done, but with a moderate audience with stephen fry as part of the debate team. Either way, you get the point.

[@user-dp9go8do9u]

iqsquared is an anti-China institution. while it may feature prominent speakers on the subject, it is done so on the basis of a Western bias, and they do not represent the views of the Chinese.

[@kindface]

Minxin’s only justification for being invited is that he’s yellow skinned and speaks Chinese. I can’t think of one thing he has said here (I was going to say “one point he has made” but then he hasn’t made any) that has any independent merits or backed by hard facts. He just enjoys the audience’s presumption that he is the final authority on China among the debaters just because he was born Chinese. But the reality is that China changes so rapidly that any foreigner economist who’s lived in China for the past 7-8 years would know infinitely more about China than Pei who has been hiding in his ivory tower in the US for decades.

[@2012meditation]

I think that he simply lost his soul

[@joyxing9340]

China: you guys keep debating, we're moving forward. 两岸猿声啼不住，轻舟已过万重山。

[@fredlee4250]

The question is odd. China has market capitalism under communism political system.

[@wentaoyu8187]

裴敏欣是战忽局的好同志 潜伏工作不错 辛苦了

[@satyamprakash7030]

我不懂中文

[@user-ok8gp4vx3t]

真的是太辛苦了！加鸡腿

[@zegzezon5539]

I stop watching the video when IAN *BREMMER* started raising and waving his hands like some darn Sunday preacher demonizing materialism yet asking for more _tightings!_ *WTF!*

[@DrPhilipChen]

On hind sight in April 2018, almost everything the opposing side said has been proven wrong. I wonder how these two debaters managed to stay in business. The biggest problem is that they didn’t know what the chinese, both government and the private sector, have been doing for the future. They were not even qualified to be speaking on stage with such ignorance.

[@ashikhodaili4436]

Latest Research and Debate about China's economy and American Capitalist Economy MUST Start After 2023.....or so... Happy New Years Global Citizens For World Peace and Debate and Mutual Development A World Without End....Under Heavens

[@hencrazy]

Imo yes and no, depends on the industry. Strategic industries - steel manufacturing, mining, etc. - NO - extreme central govt / govt own corp control. Consumer industries - electronics, toys, textiles - YES - it's basically an ancap environment limited only by land leasing/zoning regulations

[@kchoo1118]

Ian Bremmer is a comedian. China's economy is failing... Well even if it failing, the USA model is not the solution. USA middle class hasn't seen improved living standards for over 30 years. One can go on about ideology and rhetoric, but at the end of the day the common man only wants a good life. It is not important which system delivers that.

[@cocoslover100]

To stay clear from delusion, focus on self and reflect.

[@patmoh4204]

Minxin Pei is no match for the higher thinkers around him.

[@moviola12]

Then how come he won the debate?

[@deadbutmoving]

China is not a capitalist country China is more of a nationalist country. Chinese Venture Capitalist and Political Scientist Eric Li said it best: If the interest of the Chinese Nation state comes into conflict with the interests of Capital the Chinese Nation state's interest will always win. That is very different from the American Capitalist system where the interest of capital can often supersede that of the American Nation state. Just look at how big capital interests such as Goldman Sacs, Big Banks, Halliburton, Lobbyists, and Lockheed Martin often get their interest promoted over the interest of the American nation state. Whether or not capitalism is good or bad can be up for debate. But what is not up to debate is the fact that China is DEFINITELY NOT a Capitalist country.

[@TheSiggyMan6]

Peter Schiff was right about the collapse, the housing bubble, and gold. He is also right about china.

[@user-pg5uo3oo8d]

It is 2020 now… Will they sit together to have a debate again?

[@lichen5426]

Hahahaha, a great debate and a great vote at the end. I am sure the result will be the other way round if the debate happens in China. But who cares as long as the Americans are happy and the Chinese are happy.

[@_starter]

Ian Bremmer's opening statement more of a stand-up routine and emotional outburst than it was a statement against the motion.

[@whfmax]

For sure never existed any kind of "communism" in China. It's just CAPITALISM (now Super-capitalism).

[@HanZhang1994]

+whfmax under mao it was a communism, definitely not a capitalism.

[@whfmax]

Mathematics is not an opinion - [Materialistically]

[@HanZhang1994]

+whfmax Are we stating random facts now? XD

[@yibojing3345]

It's truly stunning how deep the steotypes can grow..... Debating about economy and captilism and somehow he could mention the fact that China doesn't have facebook lol

[@The667251]

This is not a debate "Who's better capitalism" at all, rather it gets to "Who's better in running economy"!

[@agbokad5k71]

The US's problem is the "fear" of the financial rise of those they considered their former "slaves". The economy is deliberately designed to permanently make them poverty striken . The Caucasians over pay themselves, give all gravy contracts to themselves, and even made majority Caucasian females a "minority" to qualify them to take the set-aside contracts for the minority Africa- Americans, all in order to hoard cash by conserving it for an imaginary "raining" days. That financial imbalance or apartheid operated for centuries had now come back to engulfed the whole nation, and had now started to take more Caucasians as victims. The same with their "war on drugs" waged on African Americans, but had now taking more Caucasians victims voluntarily. China on other hand, had no one in mind "racially" to have nightmares about within their economic structures. This fear is real folks, but many will deny it, and that alone is their stumble block to face their innermost fear. The fox hole just keeps getting deeper.

[@ZsXie10]

MinXin Pei was right. Americans you should listen to him.

[@ThePayola123]

That was a really very low blow from Ian Bremmer about the Tunisian Fruit Vendor. But then again it's no surprise coming from a know it all dweeb.

[@charlespiliero3709]

it's more comfortable (for all people) to live in america than any other country. and, its way of life should prevail despite the adjustments necessary to sustain its existence and growth throughout the world. it's less a matter of governance change, as it is a way to end the competitive strife between formed classes of people and trade between nations. there must be a way to live peacefully within a monetary world economy without resorting to subversive reasoning and war. first off - i think end the unnecessary destructive force of usury against the productivity of people. secondly, end the lively existence of all stock trade so that no one is taken advantage of. thirdly.....what do you think??

[@The667251]

In terms of Human Rights, the utmost import right is personal safety. In this regard, America is 100 folds worse!

[@pardeeptandon6730]

Chinese planning and execution is way ahead of USA. Compared with Chinese infrastructure American infrastructure is third world. Chinese Debit is virtually 100% internal while 42% of American Debit is external. And is much more dangers . Recent Pew survey showed 80% of Chinese are happy with their government while similar survey in US showed only 25% are happy with their government. The ex Chinese man does not know China.

[@manuelmanuel9248]

Capitalism without taxes is capitalism without government and no government makes capitalism impossible

[@rangeryeh6054]

China had a really long and rugged way to go in order to provide the citizen a better environment and basis to live and start-up. The debate on the term ' Capitalism' is outmoded, however it expand the welfare of the people, that is the system people want most! BTW, Pei is just like a crown himself, who always use incidents or phenomena to represent the realities. Such kind of man could be professor, that is really a pity to the mother university of USA....

[@ong4288]

He’s a clown right

[@JohnzeeMr]

Johnah the Whale: The Big Friendly Giant I had the Most weird dream. In the past when i was young, we used to have a reunion. In preparation for when the grown ups will come and the celebrattion start. We were trying to repair the distiller like water source pump (i forgot some really weird and imaginative details here about why water was a problem). We were frantic at finding the right tools and equipment that could fit the leaking and cause it to flow the winelike fit for celebration water(this was the detail i forgot cause too long more like the only source of water was fruit so their is a reason for the celebration and forgot what started the drought, basically its life or death). Then we were all frantic cause the grown ups are about to start and the midnight hour of nigh is upon us. After so hours and so many tries we gave up and decided not to inform and scare the grown ups and just join the celebration with a very heavy saddest ever heart. Then all of a sudden someone found an idea, that's right and said, "wait a minute one of the wrappings that is dangling down could be the solve the problem by it self. But he warned don't hold your horses yet but we were all hopeful cause sure enough the leaking stopped. With anticipation the genious wrapped and wrapped the dangling high tech rag-like rubber and put it in a tie. To our great joy and relief it was repaired and anticipating to join the grown ups. Just as we are about to leave in his high point of glory her decided to overdo it and bask on his vanity and exerted his wieght on the it causing it to leak even more. Their was a celebration and everybody went as if nothing happened without informing everyone of the dire fate that will eventually happen. Did not remember the events but the next day their was a mango climbing, its quit complex and interesting but i forgot it, but thats when i decided to go to school and ride a habal habal and everybody was like what your leaving us. The mango falls to the roof and is connected to the water purifier. That's when I decided i have to leave everything cause we can't go on like this. As I was travelling i could see the devastation of the ??? but hopelessness and lack of strength to do anything concrete. Oddly enough I can control the habal habal with a unseen extending of my arm like a psp, the driver told me to stop it, but I tried to steer cause a boy deliberately crossed at the last minute (note I forgot very nice part of the dream here which explains what is going on in this place but basically this place used to be forest and I used to walk here). The driver blammed me for causing such effort when we could just stop but i said we will loss the momentum it save us time to just steer, either way the driver got his way(another long part of the dream I forgot) When we reached our destination above hill looking below he said their how will you get over the wall. It told him thanks and its ok the wall is not that long, but he was right, up close it was unscallable no matter how much I tried. Fortunately those in the hillside was not yet complete and i just jump into a section which is illegal since I pealed the section of the wet cement with me however another guy shortly followed jump me. We talked about getting caught but thankfully we can just use the muddy habal habal travel that everyone use as the reason we got dirty. When I reached school with my raincoat like attire wonder why this place has so much rain and water than our place. The attendant told me why are you wearing coat its not raining, I told him the one the way its so muddy besides it always rains here and was expecting it and dont want to be wet in school. So he said then change quickly cause your dirty then the guy who jumped after me told me I shouted at you to get your bag that you throw overboard but I guess you did not hear, they might find out. So I went back...then as I change and put my things on the locker I had to keep on bowing cause their are many Koreans in the school. Then finally recess everybody is excited field trip time because the BFG is coming as always. He came and was a giant, only pink thin furry and started stepping on the bean inside the school which started to lean and slowly fall. I shouted don't it will fall and destroy the wall, but everybody though i was ignorant, and the giant said its ok that's how everybody gets in, the rich that is which most in this school are, from beyond the wall. So everybody joined the giant and as his feet forced the bean in an arch to touch the ground on the other side of the wall he merged with the bean along with us all. And the process was so cool he we were like moving like water with the bean and the giant its like we are a part of it transfering from twig to twig, branch, swinging vines, leaves and the body itself. Finally when we reach the shore the BFG transformed into a whale as it left the bean but we still get to move everywhere in the whales body experiencing the wonders of the ocean until we reach our distination. The students went out and explored the caverns the whale eat the petals clinging to the walls and Akihiko was sad and separated I told him its okay the whale eats these stuff even though they are orchid beautiful its still plentiful in the feeding grounds Mitsuru asked him if he got the film. He said yes, but I did not get it. Akihiko pointed to the walls where the beautiful petals where then i saw that they used to be hanging albums and when i looked all over the celings and such I saw some albums not yet covered and grown over by the orchids. Finally I saw our former Principal and landlord of our place and thats when I realized where on our previous school that has sunk beneath the sea or was it we where mermaids before and evolved or was converted and overpowered. Regardless Mitsuru showed us to a secret room and inside a book amidst all the broken things and chaos was a in the middle a forbidden film. Akihiko finally gave a signal and the deal was on, Mitsuru got the film while Akihiko told me to put in my brief the film cause he's to famous and is always being watched by everybody, me on the otherhand...Then the BFG whale started making asound signalling everybody those that wander to merge with him cause field trip is over. Thats when I realized what if I get searched and what if we are probably the only ones that suspeciously went off the BFG back we could raise suspecion. So I told them to go ahead I need to position the film in my brief. I put a part of the film back in the book while getting parts of the book and putting the the film inside it just in case. I woke up! Will finish articles this month, and summarize walkthroughs for maybe 2 psp games I'm going to use.

[@Few_politicians_run_your_life]

This is the dream show of people who could not stand for China bring better. Hello, 34 years of success and you think they are going to stop! We American fail because we always think we are the best no matter what happenning. Many of us never travel oversea or not spend enough times oversea so, they just stuck in the resort of shopping mall without real experience the real counture.

[@prayfortruejustice]

The US charges it’s citizens tax on income regardless of where in the world they world. No other major countries on the planet do. Investments in the US and for citizens are heavily and unfairly regulated under the pretext of the nanny government protecting people. For example ICO are blocked to US and Singapore Citizens. If you spend a year in China, away from Beijing (or on the dwindling back streets within Beijing), you know that the Mom and Pop shops and unregulated establishments do not collect TAX in China. I have always been amazed with the mostly unregulated free market (yet not without corruption and safety issues) at the street and small business level.

[@pardeeptandon6730]

90% Chinese see a bright future for themselves while only 24% of Americans do. ( PEW Survey)

[@kmarinas86]

"In economics, capital goods, or real capital, or capital assets are already-produced durable goods or any non-financial asset that is used in production of goods or services." Source: Wikipedia - Capital (economics) Therefore, any particular approach, model, methodology, or ideology concerning the development, allocation, and management of capital ahead of most other concerns can be called "Capitalism". "Capitalism" may as well stand for "economic materialism". It means just as little.

[@ViolaGMidi]

Move a village to build a road? Well, there’s a new road built through my grandma ‘s village and everyone was happy.

[@wwyytt20]

10 years later, just come here to check out the comment section.

[@illusionist11]

That's what separates the United States among the other countries in the world. Economic resiliency.

[@garethxue8938]

Accidentally watched this debate uploaded 9 yrs ago. What would you guys say if you come to a stage again

[@pardeeptandon6730]

On Human Rights USA in 2015 drop 26000 bombs in 7 countries while China pulled out 600 million out of poverty and recently USA pulled out of UNHRC

[@pardeeptandon6730]

The most basic Human right is to be able to eat three meals a day and on this parameter China has pulled out of extreme poverty 500 million people while in 2015 USA dropped 20000 bombs in 7 countries and killed thousands without UN sanctions , was that following rule of law or protecting Human rights?

[@yimingyang8244]

"CHINA DOES CAPITALISM BETTER THAN AMERICA" implies capitalism is better than socialism, and this point itself should be the debate.

[@yimingyang8244]

+Grandfather_Din_Racket Well, then you need to re-enforce your basic economics and ask why the western under capitalism is not doing well recently.

[@fsteh787]

I have vowed to avoid following any presentation or buying any books written by both Ian and Pei, bcoz their predictions are so falling apart, collapsing and disintegrates.. 7 -year period is sufficient for us to see who has the crystal ball and who isn’t.

[@Thanatar13]

Peter Schiff makes good points, but fundamentally has- in my opinion a misunderstanding or disagreement- with the notions/ideologies of socialism and capitalism (as well as some wrong notions about China and in truth, some sad misinterpretations/underestimations of America's golden age). Yes; the US is very, _very_ far detached from capitalism as it was originally intended- "traditional capitalism," as it arose out of monarchism and empire, god and king- it's immensely detached from the capitalism of the period it was founded in, or even the prevailing notions of capitalism in the early to mid-20th century. However, his worldview is one where ideology remains stagnant, and it is nations that move from or away from it- while this shift is certainly possible and has occurred many times, the notion of ideology as set in stone- something dead, to be preserved, is something I disagree with, and that socialism by and large and in its very roots- all the way back to Marx- disagrees with. It's a fundamental difference in understanding between the capitalist and the socialist; capitalist post-modernism, if you will. In the capitalist understanding of the world, the dominance of the "free market" is the pinnacle of human development and the end of that line- but to assume that a "free market" will- even in complete isolation- remain "free," that wealth will not naturally coalesce and create its own captive audiences, shape the society and institutions to its interests- is just wrong. The socialist understanding of capitalism is exactly that- that the modern progression of the US, its inherent contradictions and corruption, are the undeniable end product and unspoken goal of the actors behind the scenes, or openly. "Corporate welfare," monopoly and price-fixing, and self-cannibalizing short and medium-term business decisions at the behest of stockholders _is_ the natural result of capitalism- there are examples who try to stem the flow of this progression, add band-aids to an ever-growing and festering wound- but this is what late stage capitalism looks like- not as detached from feudalism as the liberals would like to think- and a stepping stone in the path towards either socialism, or fascism to maintain the ruling class and hierarchy as is. In contrast- China's "capitalism" is a controlled, restrained asset- one that ultimately moves for the good of the people and is reined in and accountable as such- state capitalism, not capitalist statism. The Soviet Union held this as well, but to a far lesser level- a difference between mainstream communist understanding and practice pre- and post-Deng. This is a fundamental and irreconcilable difference between the US and China- and yes, China may have capital, and even the (controlled, moderated) accumulation of wealth- but it is not run by it; in contrast to the US, which has certainly stayed consistent in its one prerogative- that capital, and those who (domestically) hold it and control it- also dictate the affairs of the state, and continue to do so. Or rather, in other words, "genuine" capitalism. Both China and the US are not "capitalist" in the sense of capitalism as an ideology of "letting the market decide," sure. In the US, this is because the key actors of the market decided- as they always will- that it rather liked not having the instability of the market, and liked guaranteed (socialized) returns at the cost of the people. The taxes, judicial and penal system, the military and the military-industrial complex, all of it is dictated to, and subservient to (and exploited by) this. Contrast this to China- Chinese taxes do, undeniably, provide a more robust social safety net (not the accurately described "Ponzi scheme" of Social Security Peter noted), a more successful education system and a more innovative environment as well as a blatantly superior healthcare system. The inequalities and geographic challenges China faces are also being undeniably addressed in contrast to the states- what else can you call China's immense and well-publicized rural outreach and development, its infrastructure development (housing, transportation, and so on) across the nation? This is capital as a means to an end, not capital as an end justifying the means- society-based rather than wealth-based development. In this I would say- yes; China resembles 1950s America far more than modern day America does, itself. The economic growth and prosperity, roles as creditor nations, and the considerations of their new places in respect to world order all do seem comparable at first glance. But the similarities end there, because structurally, organizationally, both states are and were polar opposites. Even then, the US had its New Deal and countless amazing public works/infrastructure projects- but ultimately those too were, and ended up beholden to private interests over public good. The US, structurally, today, is exactly as it consistently has wanted and been mandated to be. It may not be what the average American wants- for instance, there is bipartisan support of healthcare by the average citizen- but it is what the state wants. Externally, sure- the US would prefer to maintain its hegemony- and is acting to maintain it- but structurally, organizationally the ruling classes of the US are very comfortable and firmly entrenched and acting as they see fit. If China was not developing- had not developed, and remained an agrarian, impoverished nation- if somehow no state rose to parity with the US and it maintained its hegemony or even expanded it- would American capitalism change? Would there be no "war on terror" or some other nebulous threat either present, or manufactured to maintain profits for the military-industrial complex? Would the corruption and profiteering evident in the justice and penal (particularly incarceration) systems not exist? Would the "American style capitalism" of bottom line, short-term, make-like-a-bandit, vulturous shareholder beholden self-cannibalization cease to exist? Would the public institutions and infrastructure not continue to be privatized and squeezed of their budgets, only checked by occasional public outcry but always, inevitably standing poised at the edge of the abyss? Would the two-party monopoly not continue to maintain its charade of choice and string society along its various "culture wars" while in truth maintaining the status quo? I think we all know the answer to that.

[@wesmb5]

You cannot grow your own potatoes.

[@pardeeptandon6730]

USA produces cotton cheaper than Chinese do. But still you buy Chinese VESTS from Walmart . So who does capitalism better?

[@billy.7113]

This debate was 5-year old. Please have a round 2.

[@whaikuratuhaka7029]

You need to keep this story on China does Capitalism Better ,we don't want to Embarrass the West.

[@haiguike]

"When are they going to stop?" They just stopped this year.

[@quanhusheng6637]

Sorry that's not true. History proved that.

[@billhong4216]

One doesn't need to look further than the amount of money America spends on wars. Take that expenditure away and America's balance sheet will be significantly better.

[@marcopolo3001]

Suuuure thats makes sense, lets debate this topic in an impartial country like America. Wow didn't see that result coming.

[@jmitterii2]

Canada's healthcare law stipulates if a person requires immediate care that isn't able to obtain because of waiting, they paid to get it elsewhere such as the US or Europe or India or wherever its available as prescribed by a doctor. So those trips Canadians take to get care outside if it is for immediate care that wasn't attainable within a 72 hours, are paid for their trip and medical expenses. Just let you know, if we don't come up with a down payment we go without treatment in the US.

[@pardeeptandon]

On Human Rights : The fundamental human right to be able to eat three meals a day and China has puled out of poverty 500 million in the last 20 years which no other country has done . While American record is Bombing and killing millions in Afghanistan , Libya, Syria and Iraq is that taking care of human rights ?

[@BKLau70]

2019 ... Wonder what they think now ...

[@pardeeptandon]

The second speaker is basing his arguments on his expectations of future while the debate is on “ Does “ ie present

[@Nayuk2010]

And 5 years later....

[@TheKibeer]

It's all intertwined o/c but we should focus on the drag and on the motor - when you repair that you don't need to elaborate with wires. I blame 08 on a bubble - bubble wouldn't been so big if 1. not for artificial interest rates pushing speculation 2. Gov propping (sub prime) housing market 3. Subsidizing risks by deposit insurance and Freddie and Fannie and past bailouts 4. unstable currency policy pushing speculation 5. granting or shielding monopoly to certain players 6. bailouts

[@zanecai0]

Truth is often in the hands of a few.

[@ck.youtube]

This debate was in 2012. Now it is Dec 2017. And look at all the further achievements China has made. How about another debate? By the way, the debate should NOT be a comparison of the current "assets" both countries have accumulated thus far, because that is unfair, as US has 240 years of capitalism while China has barely 40 years. The comparison should be on the trends and speed and efficiency of accomplishing national goals between both countries. At the current trends where China is heading upward while US slowly declining, it is clear who is doing "capitalism" better.

[@nsambataufeeq1748]

Good arguments on both sides,they got me on evolution and climate change, the US is so behind the curve on those