Do Borders Change Food?

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Hey guys, a few notes: 1. The vegetable used in Yunnan suanpacai can be varied. The most classic being xiaokucai (小苦菜), which may - or may not - be rapini. But the general idea is some sort of leafy brasicca that has a slight bitterness in it, such as mustard greens. 2. Speaking of rapini, apparently it's, uh, more expensive than kale? Apologies, should've thought to double check that before including it in the script. Again, use what you've got local that's cheap :) 3. The sour component works quite well in cutting the bitterness. There’s this dish in Yunnan that belongs to the “vegetable in water” (kzbin.info/www/bejne/laW1n5KoppiHZ7c) category, that is boiling some of this “bitter vegetable” in water and it’s named “bitter veg soup”. As the name suggest, the soup can be bitter as coffee and it all come from the veg. However, but adding some sort of sour component when stewing, that bitterness magically disappears and leaves us a very pleasant tasting soup that’s great with rice. 4. Chinese quince is actually a really interesting fruit. Its Chinese name “酸木瓜” or simply “木瓜” is what “木瓜(Mugua)” historically signified throughout Chinese literature, until “papaya” came and started to take over the term “木瓜”. If you’re learning Chinese and reading some scripts like Classic of Poetry, remember that “木瓜” means this Chinese quince and not papaya. 5. In the spirit of using any sour component available to you, other candidates we can think of include quince, sour plum either fresh or in dry form, like the Japanese umeboshi, hawthorn berry (山楂/shanzha) either fresh or in dry form, like the hawthorn berry for tea at Chinese supermarkets, and cranberry maybe? 6. When choosing stewing greens, please do use whatever hearty leafy green that’s available to you. Watercress would be a good one, which is also a classic stewing green in Cantonese soups. Anything cheap would be ideal, like collard green, Swiss chard, or bak choy (big or small). 7. The chili for topping in the Yunnan version is often slightly roasted in the ashes on the side of a fire pit, which is called 火烧辣子 (huo shao la zi). It slightly chars and wilts the chili a bit but given we don’t have a fire pit at home so fresh it is. Restaurants nowadays also often just use fresh chili straight up and that’s why we follow suit. 8. Some people would add a couple pieces of star anise and tsaoko (草果) into the soup base for the Yunnan version as well. These two spices are two hyper common seasoning choices in many Yunnan dishes. 9. Besides the combo we showed in the video, Suan pa cai in Yunnan can take on other forms, here’re some possible add-ins you can play with: a. Some other sour components we didn’t mentioned in the video include dried fermented vegetable (干腌菜) and sometimes even tamarillo (called 树番茄, meaning tree tomato, in Yunnan). And people may use more than one sour component in a soup in order to achieve the ideal taste. Interestingly, tamarind is often used a fruit for juice or candy in Yunnan and not so much in cooking. b. And you can add in a slab of fresh pork skin in the stew as it’s also a popular ingredient in suan pa cai. The fat and collagen in the pork skin helps to cut some of that bitter sharpness from the veg. c. Some people would also add in a piece of non-refined brown sugar at the beginning to stew together, which coincides with an older northern Thai version which uses sugar cane juice. d. You can also see a version using long beans and potato, which is very similar to the Myanmar one called Thizon Chinyay. 10. As you can see, Yunnan suan pa cai is a dish that has many forms, which jives with some Yunnan friends’ description of the dish, i.e. a home cooking thing that you throw in anything you have in the kitchen and make a simple yet delicious soup. Well, this is long enough of a note, more discussion on our Substack post if you’re curious to know more about these dishes and the relating eating habits: chinesecookingdemystified.substack.com/p/the-en-rice-ification-of-yunnan

[@TVOme]

fyi. When Lanna recipe asking for "nam aoi(น้ำอ้อย)". It doesn't mean "sugar cane juice" but It does mean a block-unrefine-sugar cane. There some fun stuff about calling sugar(naam taan) in Thailand. In southern, they might call sugar as naam peung(น้ำผึ้ง-honey) and for naam taan(น้ำตาล) it might mean wine that fermented from palm nectar(also น้ำตาล or น้ำตาลเมา).

[@LauraTeAhoWhite]

An alternative plant you can use would be Gai Lan (芥兰). Its called Chinese Kale and Chinese Broccoli in the west and is available at Asian Supermarkets.

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

@@TVOme Oh awesome, thanks for the correction! That makes much more sense than sugar cane juice. Apologies, we're still beginners with Thai and're definitely prone to these sorts of mistakes. We saw two sources that said that they'd use sugar in place of pork when times were tough, does that jive with your understanding as well or nah?

[@TVOme]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified Sorry, I am more of a Southerner but i have few of friend that might know.

[@chanceDdog2009]

I’m excited for your 1 million subscriber video. I’m hoping for a feast or a colab. Recently I’ve been watching a Chinese tea KZbin channel. He’s American but speaks of china’s culture within sight similar to you.

[@LoanNguyen-zx5zx]

We have a similar Vietnamese soup. It’s called “Canh Dua Chua” (sour vegetable soup). The ingredients are pickled mustard greens, tomatoes, onions and protein (typically beef shank or pork ribs). We eat it along with rice or vermicelli. This soup comes from Northern Vietnam. Now I see where the influence is from. Thanks for this great information.

[@michaeljcdo335]

In the South we also have Canh Dưa Chua. Maybe it's because of the waves of Northern Viet migrants

[@BS-my2ky]

Yup. This soup is super addictive if you cook like Lao's style or Hue's style by adding mắm ruốt huế

[@violetviolet888]

Chinese influence on Vietnamese cuisine has been dominant for over 1,000 years. This influence includes the use of chopsticks, stir-fries, and noodles. Chinese cuisine also introduced several dishes, spices, and cooking methods that are still popular in Vietnam. “Ten centuries of Chinese rule introduced such things as Confucianism, writing, methods of administration, art and architecture. The Chinese also contributed the custom of eating with chopsticks, the art of stir-frying and deep-frying in a wok, and food staples such as soy sauce, bean curd and noodles, among others. However, the Vietnamese, ever conscious of retaining the native character of their culture, assimilated rather than adopted Chinese cooking, leading to a distinctly different cuisine"-South China Morning Post

[@LoanNguyen-zx5zx]

@@BS-my2kyoh I’ve never heard of this. Will try next time I make the dish!

[@bigpop1996]

​@@LoanNguyen-zx5zxI think it originated with Dai Lum (Black Tai).

[@cd-zw2tt]

Both of these would SMACK with some collards. Honestly, the flavor bases dont even seem that far off -- collards use ham hock, greens, garlic, onion, and red wine vinegar -- plus afterwards, you put on a bunch of hot sauce. Plus the BBQ / biscuit pairing you mentioned at the end makes total sense.

[@damnhatesyou]

What are collards?

[@Antaios632]

​@@damnhatesyou Collard greens are a member of the brassica family like cabbage or broccoli that are rather tough and require long cooking (I don't think anyone eats them raw). They are particularly popular in the American South.

[@2dub2steady]

Collards would be awesome in this. I would make cornbread(not sweet) to eat with this.

[@Knitspin]

I was thinking the exact same thing - so similar to collards but less smokey (by way of not using smoked pork).

[@FrothyTheRabidBugbea]

Literally my first thought was this is almost one for one Southern style collard greens with Asian ingredients.

[@thantkyaw6084]

Hi Burmese here, the dish is called Chin Hinh and is eaten similar to the Yunnan style except its used to cut heavy almost Indian curries. The main souring agent is a leaf called Chin Maung that is stewed alongside some Chinese Okra. I like to leave a little soup at the bottom of my rice bowl so I get a bit of acid with every bite.

[@heidiaom2832]

🤣

[@SaiWoonHein]

It's Mhon Nyin Saw (မုန်ညှင်းစော) of Shan State's Phak Kart Jaw.

[@MintyFarts]

the way you showed to eat using sticky rice reminds me of how fufu in Nigerian and other African regions is used for swallows. it is pounded starches, usually yucca and plantain, served with soups/stewed veggies in a similar way often family style or with the fufu in the middle of the dish. I could see some amazing similarities in Nigerian and certain regions of Chinese cooking also. fermented locust bean and spices are used to make base flavors with or without animal bones or proteins. I can see ground melon seed as their version of tofu. Given the similarities in how flavors are built and food is served I would find it to be a very interesting cross over episode where the two styls are compared and married by capable chefs exploring each other's cuisine.

[@VictoryDanDukor]

Tofu will be ground soya seeds which is awara and its commonly eaten in the north. Its literally tofu with some regional spices incorporated in the process

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Fufu is awesome. Western African cuisines are some of mine and Steph's favorites

[@ชยพลเอี่ยมสนธิ]

Hello, a local from Northern Thailand here. First of all, I don't usually hear the foreigner use the name "Lanna", which is the actual name of the region, referring to the area of Northern Thailand, they would instead simply called "Northern Thailand. So thank you for using the correct name of our ancestral homeland. (Although nowadays, even local would just called Northern Thailand.) Second, thank you for bring up this local dish of us. Chor pak kad (จอผักกาด), "Chor" referred to a very specific way of cooking which is to boiled the vegetable with the adding of sour condiment in the end like tamarind but NEVER the lime or tomato or kaffir lime.ผักกาด in Thai actually means "cabbage" but we use it as an umbrella term to cover other vegetable too, in this case is a choy sum. We called it "ผักกาดกวางตุ้ง" or in short "ผักกวางตุ้ง" which is literally means "Guang dong vegetable".For your method of cooking is actually surprisingly corrected in many steps, but I never see anyone straining the tamarind like that but I think that it's permissible. There's actually a joke going on around the local that Chor pak kad needs to have pork in it because some of the vendors would just ignored adding the meat altogether to save the cost. In the end thank you for bringing up this beloved local dish of us and you might using the same technique of cooking to cook other vegetable too, I think that the result would be great.

[@AceChina]

I'm currently in Northern Thailand and notice a lot of places are called Lanna. Lanna Square, Lanna Hotel, Lanna Pharmacy, Lanna Coffee, etc. I was wondering "why do Thais like this name so much?". Now it makes sense! 😄

[@TheLadyinblack1989]

I noticed that Singha Soda bottle 😜I knew right away that you were somewhere in Thailand@@AceChina

[@JKenjiLopezAlt]

Super interesting video and nice observations! That short shot of barbecue and Snow reminded me of a night that Adri and I had in Wuhan sitting on plastic chairs on the street drinking snow and eating tiny piano wire skewers of grilled lamb. We filled the table with bottles and had a cup filled with skewers by the end of the night. We were wondering why they never cleared the empties from the tables until we realized they just count everything at the end to charge you. Ps your comment about using something cheaper than kale if you were in the us… did you mean cheaper than the price you paid for kale in Bangkok or something cheaper relatively in the US? I ask because in Seattle kale is WAY cheaper than rapini.

[@arjansudra]

Great to see you here ❤❤

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

>I ask because in Seattle kale is WAY cheaper than rapini. Ah whoops. Shows just how familiar I am with the going price of various vegetables in the USA these days :) I remember getting some sticker shock at how expensive kale was in Pennsylvania, and I just sort of... assumed? that rapini was cheaper. Should've thought to double check before including it in the script, will edit the notes. As a tangential aside, been enjoying your recent supermarket haul videos!

[@suzu9404]

I love this small world of food YT

[@theo7049]

Hah, the best food always comes from the small side-street places with the plastic chairs for sure

[@trinarchong3011]

My grandma used to cook a similar dish in Malaysia but with mustard greens and tamarind peel.. and usually left over meats . Loved this video! Thank you !

[@oldmanbanjo]

In a world where so many youtubers that attempt history or politics fudge so many details or truths this channel is a constant gem. And I'm glad to see the two of you leaning into that uniqueness.

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Cheers :) We try to share history and such that's basically cut and dry, try to lean away from our own theorizing. It's surprising how much stuff is incredibly clear in Chinese sources but is completely ??? hogwash if you just, like, try to Google the same stuff in English. For these sorts of things, I think we might start sharing sources/further reading in the Substack posts. We *are* just a food KZbin channel, so I don't exactly feel compelled to make, like, a proper bibliography (and I don't think anyone actually reads that stuff anyway). But I think there's stuff that we can recommend if someone's interested in learning more, especially if they know Chinese.

[@ThePelitin]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified As someone who's actively learning Chinese for the primary purpose of learning more about cuisine, I'll always appreciate any recommendations for further reading.

[@MrsDaedalus_]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified I just stumbled upon your channel and as someone with an academic background in cultural anthropology and global history, I am very impressed with the work that you guys are doing here. I have also worked with Chinese sources before when I did my bachelor's in CA and I totally feel your pain when it comes to try to find English or in my case German sources (I study in Vienna and I am a Chinese-Austrian) of the same topic. Either it's BS or you find nothing! 😅Within my master program in global history, I have a lot of professors who are specialised in food history, and let just say that I have not encountered anyone in my studies that has a specific interest in the Chinese cuisine or Asian cuisine. This field of study kind of stays within the continent, I feel. Otherwise, we would have it easier to find sources related to this topic in English or German.🙈

[@telebubba5527]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified Just wondering if you are aware of the channel Little Chinese Everywhere. It's a Chinese woman who has traveled at least in Europe and Asia, but momentarily is 'doing' China and visits the most remote areas. She also loves visiting markets and eating just about anywhere and anything. And of course she gives some context to it all, historically, tastewise, regionally and so on. She is a real good supplement to your channel to be honest. If you don't know her, I think you really like what she's doing.

[@AntoniusTyas]

What starts out as cooking channel now becomes a culinary culture cooking channel. God I love these type of videos...

[@weifan9533]

The connection between South / SW China and SE Asia (particularly Indochina) is highly underrated and underappreciated by many, thanks for bringing things up.

[@yannaingsoe3524]

I grew up eating this dish in Northern Shan State of Myanmar. As a Chinese+Tai(Shan) descendant, this is one of my favorite foods. My mom used to cook two versions. One similar to Yunan version and one sweeter(use brown slabbed cane sugar to sweeten, more balanced version).

[@nyhyl]

The sheer amount of reflection, cultural translation and local adaption you present in this and also your other videos is insane. It is absolutely invaluable!

[@kristaj0]

For anyone outside Asia interested in the tua nao (fermented aoybean disks), there is a recipe for these in Naomi Duguid's excellent cookbook "Burma: Rivers of Flavor" (Random House, 2012). You ferment the beans for a few days, make a paste, then you form it into disks and dry them. They are delicious and they last forever. I have some in the cupboard now.

[@Pammellam]

Tua nao What beans are used, I wonder? _Soy beans??_ If so, I wonder if the flavor of _“tua nao”_ is like Japanese _natto_ _納豆_ ?? Natto is made of cooked/steamed soy beans that are _fermented_ for a few days and then eaten with rice in a still soft fermented state with a bit of soy sauce added. They are very sticky but have a mild flavor.

[@bigjohnbriggs]

@@Pammellam yeah it's fermented soybean. it's an important component in น้ำพริกอ่อง, a northern Thai dish that ends up tasting like a spicy marinara/bolognese. Could work on pizza/lasagna as a fusion easily, but it's eaten here with sticky rice and fresh vegetables.

[@bigjohnbriggs]

ถั่วเน่า is the spelling in thai if you wanted to look up pics

[@deepblue2]

You know, this is looking alot like Filipino Sinigang, which is also a savory and sour soup and stew. Sinigang, however, leans more towards the Thai side because of its use of tamarinds.

[@Jestersage]

This is why I tend to believe that some recipes - especially if one ignore the precise ingredient use - develop by parallel. We all need the same nutrients - vitamin C, etc. Thus preference for acid. And we like Unami flavor - sea salt, soy sauce, fish sauce (which was develop seperately on opposite side of Eurasia contienient) We may all grow different kinds of grains and herbs, but we grow them by the fact of agricultural. Grain is made into either porridge, bread/cake, or dumplings. Stew/Soup is easiest to make (water + pot + heat) and retain the most nutrients (thanks Adam) Meat for most civilization in general is reserved for festivities or nobles due to difficulty to acquire in agricultural society. Hot food > cold food Obviously, what makes one dish differ from another is due to the local ingredient, but depends on how abstract you go, you can find similar recipes across nations.

[@tommydoez]

@@Jestersage .... Thailand, the Philippines, and Yunnan, China are close enough that they can share cultural dishes by way of cross culture trading.

[@pushslice]

I thought the same thing, but just FWIW use of tamarind was actually just one localized variant of many for our sinigang. It just happened to become the “most popular” nowadays, because of the convenient drying/portability (or even outright-packaging) of tamarind base. But Depending which locality you dig back into in the Philippines, they might be using Santol, Camias, even Guava. as the souring agent. They all taste a bit different. While not traditional to do , whenever we had access, our family actually like to BLEND the different bases, to create something altogether unique.

[@daveprice5911]

​@@JestersageAnother good example of this is the similarities between haggis and bremen's knipp

[@Kalithrasis]

Ilonggos in the Philippines tend to prefer batwan fruits, although because they're only found in the Philippines, can be hard to find if you're outside of it especially because the trees are always wild grown and not grown in orchards. But for most Filipinos, you're right, it's tamarind that's the choice.

[@souffka]

The whole world is obsessed with sour soups, there's a wikipedia page listing them and it's missing quite a lot of entries including this one

[@thehumus8688]

Sour indicate presence of Acid. and its good preservation qualities for food ancient people speculated developed sour cuisine to keep their food edible for longer

[@twigwigsoso]

@@thehumus8688well we can't ignore it just taste good, humans like acid, just like how we love sweet and salt- it's beautiful little human thing

[@RoryStarr]

I really appreciate videos that emphasize the philosophy of a dish over direct imitation. A regional stew that is meant to be a cheap daily dish so often gets turned into some expensive complicated pursuit of authenticity on youtube. It's admirable in it's own way to do that, but as you show here, the precise ingredients aren't the point. It's about using the dish's principles to make the best of the ingredients you have locally.

[@brokebebe]

Quince is pretty common in Europe but its used mostly for making jams. Never thought I could dry it and use it in a soup

[@MrSome1ne]

I was wondering whether it's the same quince fruit used to make membrillo

[@Hopcarr]

Membrillo is indeed made from quince. I had never seen dried quince before, but I see it's readily available on-line. @@MrSome1ne

[@saulemaroussault6343]

@@MrSome1nechinese quince (Pseudocydonia) is more sour than quince (Cydonia, the one used for jams and fruit leathers and membrillo) as far as I can tell. But it might be worth a try ? Quince was used quite a lot in medieval/renaissance cooking.

[@mzleveli]

European quince is not that sour, it wouldn't work as a souring agent.

[@ndwolfwood09]

To answer the question if a dish in two different countries can change.. YES! Look at black bean sauce noodles - zhajiangmian (China) and jajangmyeon (Korea).

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

... one day we'll look into all of the Zhajiangmians in all of their glory haha. It's been on the list for a WHILE, it's just hard to know where to stop Like... a super fun video would be "Beijing vs Korea vs Japan vs Taiwan vs Dongbei vs Sichuan vs Shandong vs Cantonese", but uh, that's a lot of noodles to test

[@aidanwarren4980]

Hearty greens stewed with pork and acid, plus garlic and spicy chilis? That sounds a lot like the American South’s approach to collard greens. Collard greens stewed with a smoked ham hock, finished with hot pepper vinegar. What an interesting case of convergent evolution.

[@247videos247]

Really really love these videos incorporating some SEAn context and comparisons. I got really into making Chinese cuisine during the height of the pandemic and recently visited Laos and Thailand, and I am now obsessed with that sort of cuisine so this is super fun!

[@violetviolet888]

4:31 I've got fresh Chinese Quince on my countertop. I knew it was used for tea. Nice to have this culinary use added to my list! Thank you.

[@thaipaulnow]

Love the western adaptation y'all came up with. Seems to maintain all the essence of the dish without sacrificing any flavors. It also fits in perfectly with Southern US cuisine similar to collard green/ham hog + apple cider vinegar.

[@yothiga]

Omg, I'm a born Chiangmai woman and I never ever guess China has similar thing as Cho phak gard. It's one of the most northern dish and the first vegetable dish I ate (I was picky eater when very young,lol). This one the second mind blowing after the tomato and egg drop soup I found on Chinese food channel.

[@porsuwannashom1715]

I'm Thai. And when i went to northern part of Thailand. I heard that northern peoples really interest putting fragrant in their food. When i saw they made Larb. (in northern recipe) Dry chili, shallot, lemongrass was grilled in charcoal. Shrimp paste also grilled and all of them were mortar until smooth and put into Larb. Larb spice (Mixed spice such as cardamom, coriander seed , dill seed, long pepper, nutmeg and everting i don't know) was mixed into pork. minced garlic was fried until golden brown and finished on top. And fried Chilli as well. The taste was not intense or spicy that much, but it was full of fragrant. (rather than of flavor) Very time consuming to made. (compared to Larb E-sann recipe)

[@bobthestick99]

There's a concept in anthropology called "schismogenesis" where cultural differences (i.e., cooking styles) develop within groups of people as a way to more uniquely define themselves compared to others nearby.

[@keenahudson1853]

It makes sense that there are many varieties of green leaf soup flavoured with a little meat and plenty of sourness. Sour reduces the bitterness of so many greens. People have commented they have similar dishes not just in Asia but Africa and the American South. They're not all based on the Chinese Thai version but the fundamental flavour profile of bitter greens

[@arescue]

As a westerner from California, I wasn’t familiar with this soup. But, anytime there is a sour component, I always want to try it. It looks delicious.

[@gooblepls3985]

What's up with the garlic skins being left on in the Thai version - is that something you can do with this specific type of garlic, or just in general?

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

This type of garlic is very tiny and the skin is quite soft that you can eat it straight up after it's deep fried, it becomes part of the "crispiness". But if you're using general bigger garlic, then you do need to peel before frying since those skin is not so good for eating.

[@headcheeez]

First thing I was going to ask.

[@macontu01]

We have 2 types of garlic 1. Thai garlic which is very thin and small. It taste sharper and more pungent. If we use it raw or boil we have to peel it too but if we deep fried it then we leave the skin as it is because it gave us better aroma with crispiness. 2. Chinese garlic which is less pungent and big. This type can't be eaten without peeling it.

[@bigjohnbriggs]

จอผักกาด and ต้มจับฉ่าย are two of my favorite "soup" accompaniments with breakfasts in north Thailand, ต้มจืดเต้าหู้สาหร่าย as well. It's my trifecta of meal roundedness if I want more bitter/rich greens, or just something more bland to go along with the spicier things on rice. Great dish.

[@Elia1988seoul]

I live in Thailand for 4 years and northen Thai food (often Thai Chinese) is my favorite, there are so many beautiful dishes coming from Chin Ho and Teochew migrants. please explore more. Like Khao Soi, Khao Ka Moo.

[@leehaseley2164]

The Lanna version is just wonderful. It is delicious and heartwarming at the same time. Any time we eat jor pak gaat, we eat it with năm prik ta daeng❤

[@sahiriothstill]

Quince should be readily available to viewers who live in larger European cities. I've seen it in Sweden, France, Portugal, Denmark and Austria. Haven't tried chinese quince (pseudocydonia sinensis), but I've been told that the flavor is very similar to the European one (cydonia oblonga). Certainly would be the closest substitute you could get in Europe - but more likely fresh than dried. (btw Chris, it's pronounced "kwinns", not "keens" - but you're likely influenced by the Spanish word for "fifteen")

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Ha, yeah, unfortunately I've never had quince straight up - can't get it over here in Asia, and it wasn't something I grew up with in the USA. I mean, apparently I can't even pronounce the word :P

[@saulemaroussault6343]

@@ChineseCookingDemystifiedquince straight up is very astringent, like chinese quince. it needs to be cooked to be eaten. So it’s kind of a blessing you never had it. (But it smells so good, I always want to take a bite, even if I know my mouth will feel like paper afterwards x)) It used to be included in a lot of savoury recipes (you find meat with quince recipes from the medieval period for example) nowadays it’s mostly desserts, jams and paste in particular, sometimes tarts.

[@gretahardin1392]

The European one is tannin-y as hell. And isn't as sour - more like orange v. grapefruit in sourness levels. It needs to be cooked and have a hellova lot of sugar added for the way it's consumed now.

[@pacquing]

This resembles Filipino sinigang which uses tamarind, calamansi, or guava as a souring agent, pork bones for protein, stewing greens, and tomatoes and fish sauce for umami.

[@lalarolala]

In Spain, Quince is really popular to make jams and the green vegetable (what you call 小苦菜) thing looks exactly like Grelos, witch is the flowering part of the turnip.

[@goblinwizard735]

I really appreciate the premise and structure of this vid! Nice one

[@LauBuk]

As people from Yunnan, I'm quite amazed by your knowledge on the local cruisines

[@SilverScarletSpider]

did u guys see the video titled: "The Story and Secrets of Thailand's Legendary Crispy Pork" about Thai Moo Krob and Hong Kong Siu Yuk?

[@tbirdparis]

I'd love to see you guys do a collab on this topic with Pai from Pailin's kitchen. I'm pretty sure she mentioned she's from a Thai-Chinese family,, and the fact that she comes across as 100% unambiguously Thai makes sense given the period of coerced assimilation to Thai culture I learned about just now in your excellent video. I'm sure there'd be a lot to learn from her, especially about her own family's culinary history since the first family members arrived from China to Thailand.

[@bestsynth4102]

Hi, Chinese-American here. I didn’t know about this, which makes me want to visit the Mainland even more. I saw a similar eating practice between the Northern Thai (mountainous Southeast Asian) sticky rice, and a West African (Ghanaian) food material named “fufu”. It’s a pounded cassava and plantain… dough? and you use it scoop up foods like stews.

[@Metaflossy]

as soon as i saw the ingredients, i was thinking of some kind of collard green soup. i cant wait to try it

[@thekingminn]

It makes sense both of these areas used to be part of the Taungoo Empire for centuries.

[@mimanda]

I'm a Chinese Thai American who grew up in Bangkok, and this channel still teaches me so much

[@thaipaulnow]

same

[@Pammellam]

_Tua nao_ sounds like an interesting ingredient. Cooked, molded, then sliced and dried for longer storage. _Soy beans_ are used in Asia in many many ways from the mainstream _miso/bean paste_ to _tofu_ . But, this way of saving/storing an ingredient is very smart! I wonder if the flavor of _“tua nao”_ is like Japanese _natto_ _納豆_ ?? Natto is made of _cooked/steamed soy beans_ that are _fermented_ for a few days and then eaten with rice in a still soft fermented state with a bit of soy sauce added. They are very sticky but have a mild flavor. Today they are enjoyed for breakfast mostly.

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

The degree of fermentation is similar for sure - like, early on in the tua nao process it's an absolute dead ringer for natto. But I think the drying and then the toasting end up giving it a very pretty different flavor? Any fermented funk/depth is *really* really subtle, the dominant flavor is definitely 'toasted nuttiness'. If you wanted to make your own Tua Nao I think you could *start* with natto potentially, but if used directly I do think that kinako is much much closer actually

[@Pammellam]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified Kinako isn’t fermented but it does have that nutty toasted vibe as you say. It is also possible, sometimes, in some places in Japan to find dried Natto which is sold as a sort of “snack”. I’ve never tried it.

[@bq535]

Cho phak kat can be divided into two types: sweet and sour. This depends on the taste of the tamarind used. If it's in my neighborhood The sour version does not include fried garlic and oil. As for sourness You can choose between raw tamarind or sour ripe tamarind.

[@DianeH2038]

hi! it's me, your favorite pettifogger, here to tell you that the English pronunciation of quince is kwintz. with zero ill will intended, as always. learning pronunciation is a true hobby of mine and it doesn't bother me when people pronounce things differently, but I know I always appreciate being pointed in the right direction and I believe you guys do, too. thanks for another fascinating video about Asian dishes across borders. side note: I'm so envious you can get that wonderful tiny Thai garlic that doesn't need to be peeled. I hope you're doing well in Thailand! edited to add: the eating system dryness scale is brilliant!

[@jamesheng1878]

Interesting we have tbis in Cambodia too but we use pineapples to addy be sourness and sweetness with tomatoes as well

[@acb723]

Bonnggg 🙏😎😁 actually one of my favourite dishes in Cambodian eats. Not Cambodian but love the culutre and especially the food.i looove Salaw manchu yeun 🤤🤤 with pork ribs its bless

[@WingChunBoyz]

That is a different dish you’re referring to salaw Machu yuon(cảnh chùa) which is from the Mekong delta region.

[@xiehe5186]

Wow thank you so much for the recipe!!! Suanpacai is something I always order at restaurants growing up. I couldn't find a good recipe for this since I moved to Canada.

[@Antifrost]

I'll be honest, I got distracted from the recipes a few times by your beard :v The first thing that came to mind when you talked about how sticky rice was eaten was eba over here in western Africa, which is part of a larger family of foods collectively referred to as "swallows" (my personal favorite is pounded yam). You have fufu on your scale towards the end, which is eaten the same way. Even though I've preferred keeping my hands clean as I eat as I've grown older, there are some things that are just better eaten with your hands, regardless of the mess.

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Hahaha, still clean(ish) shaven, that's my hair. My head is down looking into the mortar

[@antonc81]

What a fascinating video. I go to China yearly to visit the in-laws.. will have to do a side trip to Yunnan at some point. I also love northern Thai cuisine.. and Thailand in general - would probably move there in a heartbeat if we didn’t have the little one.

[@platoami]

Thank you for your support

[@VictoryDanDukor]

i think tamarind is readily available in the US. Especially in the south. Or at least at a Mexican supermarket.

[@taxdragon]

I was going to mention that. An online friend who lives in Florida buys it fresh and locally grown.

[@sheelahtolton3998]

Tamarind is available in my local big chain grocery here in Canada and is a staple in Indian cuisine.

[@taxdragon]

@@sheelahtolton3998 Good to know, which chain is that? Do you mean the blocks of tamarind or the fresh pods?

[@embreedowling]

That must be why it’s so easy to find. It’s even at my Publix, which doesn’t have collards half the time

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Oh that's awesome! Even western supermarket available too these days? We did want to sort of get creative trying to use specifically western *ingredients* too (e.g. trying to use what'd be local in the west), though I guess the cilantro sort of flirts that line. But definitely noted for when we touch on these cross-border China/Thailand stuff in the future

[@wortcunning]

Great stuff, thank you both! I made the Western supermarket version with savoy cabbage and it was really hearty and nourishing. The fermented soybean sheets look really interesting, shame I can't get them easily here in Austria. But at least there's good unpasteurised sauerkraut everywhere ;)

[@AppleGameification]

The "one dish, two systems" in the thumbnail sounds kinda familiar lol, was that intentional?

[@deaffatalbruno]

Hey, for the fermented soy bean thing. Outside of this area, Korean fermented soy bean paste ( for bean paste soup ) is very similar, just longer fermentation, that paste is available very widely across the world. ( mostly in brown box) . Another options, but different flavour is miso paste, also widely available.

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Just a reminder that tuonao soy bean cake doesn't have salt though. If you're using store bought bean paste then you'll need to caution the amount and salinity, just add a bit at a time.

[@Boonwongree]

Holy shit i would never dream for จอผักกาด (the thai soup) to go global. Let’s goooo

[@雅君墨客-i9z]

？？？？？？？你难道不知道起源于中国南部？

[@newcamomile]

Chinese quince is a pretty common flowering shrub in Western backyards, so it's quite likely that people might have some in their backyards or growing locally.

[@daszveroboy]

This is so similar to a Chinese Indonesian pork ribs with fermented mustard green that I'm familiar with. The mustard green is used as the sour component of the dish.

[@KilanEatsandDrinks]

Rada mirip baikut sayur asin, ya? 😅 They do have something similar in แกงจืดผักกาดดอง or _gaengjued pak kat dong_ which is a common Chinese Thai dish. But I’d imagine _suan pa cai_ to be lighter in taste as the vegetables are not pickled. I wonder if we can replicate _cho pak kat_ by adding our own _terasi_ in the mix.🤔

[@雅君墨客-i9z]

​@@KilanEatsandDrinks他就是中国移民带去东南亚的，起源于中国，中国文化的确对亚洲影响。

[@KilanEatsandDrinks]

@@雅君墨客-i9z 我们知道这些菜肴来自中国移民。

[@PsychoEkan]

In europe, kale and Lacinato kale (black kale i think) is quite seasonal this time of the year.

[@DuckDuckGoose13]

This looks really yummy. Side question - I'm not sure if it's my headphones or if it's the video (maybe like a background noise?), but any time he talks it sounds like there's a low buzzing sound constantly. Anyone know what is causing that?

[@ozilan7284]

I would definitely be interested in watching more content about the relationship between Chinese cuisine and thailand

[@songyoung4969]

wow, as someone who came from this border in China, i never thought in my lifetime i would see someone do a video on this !

[@wewenang5167]

both name of the dish is literally means sour vegetable soup. So yeh it is the same dish but slightly different way of cooking and eating. People in all over south East Asia actually used to eat just with their hands even for noodles back in the day until Chinese immigrants introduce spoon and chopstick. The traditional way Thai, Cambodian, Malaysian, Indonesian, Filipino and Burmese eat are with hands just like in India. Although after the colonial era Thais, Burmese and some Malaysian adopted the fork and spoon habits, but the habits only lasted in urban places in Thailand but in rural area and in Malaysia and Indonesia people still eat with their bare hands, unless they were eating noodles. western people always feel squeamish when seeing South Asian, Middle eastern and South east Asian eating with bare hands, as if we didn't wash our hands first. Because we used our hands for eating our hands are always almost clean! So we didn't neat with dirty hands mind you. Even the Romans and the Greek were eating with their bare hands. :P

[@AutriBanerjee]

we have many similar dishes to this in many north eastern indian states actually. They share a border with Myanmar so. maybe it came from there to India? but it's cool either way

[@ffroutyaiz]

As a Thai people. We eat rice&curry dish with forks and spoons. Eat noodle dish with chopsticks and spoons. Eat western dish, like steak, with knife and forks. And eating local dish, that has be eaten with sticky rice with clean hands. 😊

[@chadchan1316]

Yes. absolutely. Just look at the various versions of Hainan Chicken Rice in SEA

[@Phoenixx713]

omfg if you're doing wings and biscuits you have GOT to do collards (honestly collards>kale in every application though) and ham hocks

[@kattkatt744]

A good chunk of the areas talked about in this video making up what was the Nanzhao and then later on the Dali kingdom. In addition the ethnicities we see in the areas that is today Northern Thailand is made up by descendants from people migrating south from these kingdoms. So it seems you do have a foundation in history for your guess about this dish. Edit: spelling etc

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

Nanzhao is super interesting! For a long time it was thought that it was a Tai kingdom, but in the last couple decades it's been shown that it was actually Yi/Black Mywa (ruling over a mostly Bai/White Mywa populace, though Tai migrations probably also colored the picture). During that time, the Yi/Black Mywa were known as excellent horsemen. In the ashes of the Nanzhao kingdom, that ruling class seemed to move southward. There's a gap there, but the Burmese people first arrived on the scene along the Irrawaddy as the 'Myanma' - i.e. "swift horsemen". Over the centuries, this group would form what's now known as the Pagan empire. From a food perspective, there's a danger, of course, in reading too much into these migrations. This stuff happened around a thousand years ago... and most 'dishes' you can name usually only go so far as a few centuries. Knowing this sort of history helps give a little context and set the stage, but when it comes to culinary history the last 200-300 years or so are much more relevant to all of our interests I think :)

[@lovetaimusic9370]

In Dehong ,the sour water in suanpacai is made of shuiyancai . 水腌菜。

[@EmsThaBreaks441]

It might say something about my viewing history but one of KZbin's recommendations from this video was the dish Schezwan - and that is exactly how it was written - rice. Borders can be permeable as well as iron curtains, leading with misunderstandings if not plain falsehoods. The lesson clearly is not to cheat too much. (And is tamarind really that difficult to obtain in a large US city with a sizeable Asian diaspora?)

[@iEGeek]

Huh, the way it’s described it kinda reminds me of the Boyanese celok and also singgang. Tamarind base, stewed vegetable and protein, only we use fish more in our sour soups. Got me craving some white rice and celok kacang Panjang right now.

[@Carlo.WTF416]

In The Philippines we have sinigang, which is a sour tamarind soup, and it might be my “deathrow meal” if I had to choose

[@Sam-hk6gr]

Would black limes be a good substitute? They hit a similar sour/earthy flavor and go well with stewed greens.

[@Fgurs]

today i learned what a black lime is! so cool

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

The black lime I'm familiar with - the Cantonese sort - isn't really sour, per se. I think it would be a very nice ingredient to add some more depth (would probably be better than sauerkraut?), but you'd probably want something to still give it a bit of kick of sourness :)

[@2dub2steady]

They're Omani limes. Pretty sour. They have an arabic name that is interchangeable with Omani lime.

[@Sam-hk6gr]

@@ChineseCookingDemystified I mostly use them in Persian recipes where they're stewed with greens to add sourness. It seems similar to how the dried quince is used in the Yunnanese version

[@christao408]

Fantastically interesting video. Well done.

[@choss0]

fwiw I think tamarind is pretty easy to find in the US these days. Basically every Asian grocery has it. If there's not an Asian grocer nearby there is probably a Mexican one and they probably have it too!

[@pushslice]

I have better luck at the Mexican markets then in the (east) Asian ones, but yes, can try looking at both. Obviously if you have an Indian market, there’s a good probability as well.

[@d.b.2215]

The Southern Vietnamese cousin to this "canh chua cá" - sour fish 🐟 soup. Tamarind is the souring agent, and we count ripe pineapple among the fresh veggies 😂 There's also a related dish to this one in Cambodia i think

[@zerro6132]

An interesting video! From what I’m seeing, Yunan dishes seem to use more fungi and bamboo shoots for the umami, but Thai dishes would more likely use shrimp paste?

[@stevenhtut3388]

At 11:27, is that a tea leaf salad?

[@mzleveli]

If one were to use Rumex (e.g. sorrel) leafs than it could provide the leafy vegetable part + a very satisfying sour taste. What do you think? This could be a West Asian version of that dish, or would it change the essence, if one were to supplement the Brassica?

[@toin9898]

This is definitely something I'm exploring. I've never been to Asia aside from a layover in Beijing but I can definitely spot the similarities across SE asian food and how Chinese/Korean/Japanese foods also intersect (not for great reasons!!). The history behind the foods and how they reached their "final"/modern standardized form is fascinating and opens up a lot of doors for making good "asian" food that while not authentic to a specific region, captures the vibes that the original cooks were going for, using what is available to me, which is exactly what the original cooks were doing in the first place.

[@雅君墨客-i9z]

因为起源于中国，中国影响亚洲其他国家中国古代一直都是亚洲和世界其他国家学习模仿偷学的对象。

[@luise7439]

I always love your videos and have learned so much from them over the years! I also wanna note that they‘re really aesthetic and I appreciate that a lot :) (in this one specifically: cute elephants 😄)

[@DaybidLay]

this dish reminds me of my mom's vietnamese sour soup, canh chua and sinigang from the phillipines.

[@MrRufusjax]

Loved this video. The Schnauzer was the icing on the cake!

[@jenreiss3107]

So glad I have a thai market near my house! This'll be good

[@koojaba5911]

มันคือ จอผักกาด​ใส่ซี่โครงหมู นะเผื่อจะไม่รู้กัน in North of Thailand we called this dish Jor puk kard with pork rip .. Just in case...

[@nathanieljack395]

The American version of this is clearly braised collard greens. Traditionally made with a ham hock, garlic, chilies, and vinegar.

[@grungus935]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who's fixated on quantifying food with obscure scales and systems that I invent

[@rionthemagnificent2971]

Would this work with rib bones from a smokehouse, I smoke my own pork and wonder if it could work to flavor the broth, which could go well with a Southern US style bbq meal. Especially if you replace the Kale with collards, or other southern US staple greens.

[@CommunitySkratch]

loving this direction

[@higashirinchiah1013]

It looks similar to Chai Buey dish in Penang or North Malaysia

[@pthill65]

Loved the animation, super cool!!

[@miggly2128]

This actually also looks like the Filipino dish called “Sinigang.” Although, I haven’t tried any of these soups, a sour broth, meat, and lots of veggies is pretty much what makes the dish.

[@starlinguk]

Kale is dirt cheap in most of Europe, maybe because it isn't a health fad but a staple winter vegetable.

[@machinshin2253]

I wonder how pickeld/marinated lemons (from Syrian cuisine) would work in here. That’s actually pretty easy to get here in CA, US , at least

[@BenjiSun]

小苦菜 is Spiny sowthistle(Sonchus asper, sometimes Yunnan sowthistle). For East Asians and the Mediterraneans, if you want a decent alternative, try 茼蒿(春菊 Glebionis coronaria, sometimes called crown daisy, or garland chrysanthemum).

[@ChineseCookingDemystified]

I think the common 小苦菜 that's used in Yunnan and Spiny sowthistle are two different vegetables since the leaves and flower of the two look quite different, especially the flower. Unless xiaokucai is an umbrella term and some pockets in Yunnan people also use the same name to describe this chrysanthemen-liked leaves?

[@tktyga77]

You know, these do seem very similar to a kind of sour vegetable dish found in northeastern India as well as a kimchi-like dish (I wish I remember the names of both atm, though gundruk may fit the latter) also found in the sister states in a way very unlike the pickles found in mainland India

[@Suree.Lifestyle]

Could you dry natto, or use it directly in place of the fermented soy?

[@SundayMatinee]

This is a recipe? Had to rewind a few times to check that's what you said. Love the video though!

[@saulemaroussault6343]

I’d eat the westernised version with bread and cheese honestly. And maybe a fried egg. Excellent video 💚

[@donaldlee8249]

The cultural similarities within Zomia is truly astonishing and beyond the imagination of many who live there now but separated by the zigzagging borders

[@MichaelMcDougle]

Great video. You should check out La Mesa Coffee if you’re still in Bangkok. Good coffee and good food.

[@wewenang5167]

You can find similar dish all over South East Asia with slightly different ingredient!