How We Made Rice Wine - Is it Sake? Beer?

[@FunkyFyreMunky]

I've always argued that Sake is a beer rather than a wine, particularly at customs trying to bring back 16 liters rather than the limit of 4.

[@tanizaki]

Sake has a different fermentation process than beer. The ABV is also higher than you would get with a beer.

[@FunkyFyreMunky]

@@tanizaki Sake has a different fermentation process to wine, it is most similar to that of beer. Like beer, the sugars are lockeds up in starch and require enzyme activity to break it down into fermentable sugars. Considering that there are commercially available beers that rival spirits in stength, the abv argument falls flat.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

You cannot ferment reliably past 20-22%. Spirits usually START at 30-35%.

[@FunkyFyreMunky]

@@CitySteadingBrews There are commercially available beers up to 60ish%. They may be fortified, they may be distilled, but they are still "beer" by legal definition.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Well sure, you can fortify anything to those levels, and legally they may be beer but we all know that is not really beer anymore.

[@keystonecop2005]

I used your methods to make a batch. WOW! My neighbors, the sake junkies, said its the best they ever tasted. I thought it was great, and have started two more batches.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Heh, that's awesome.

[@DestrolioOnline]

You guys always seem to make a video on whatever alcohol I'm planning on making next, it's incredible! And incredibly helpful!

[@royfamilyhomestead3196]

Hey guys, this is why you guys are our go to channel. Being new at making any sort of fermented beverage, I researched and watched several video/channels and y’all’s channel is the most complete. Thank you for helping our little homestead. Btw... September 4th will be 2 months since I made my first honey mead and hopefully it’ll be ready to bottle. Video to follow.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Our pleasure!

[@lennynepoose2183]

Can I Use CalRose Japanese Rice & What Was That Special Yeast Called Again?

[@richardb22]

My wife is from Asia ( Monday Edit : My wife was from Asia ) where every country has a rice alcohol. Definitely no water. Liquid/alcohol will appear . It is slow but fascinating to see the rice break down . It won't break down a lot. You will panic that it will go bad. You will panic if it goes a bit yellow or brown. You will remember someone told you never to reheat rice or eat old rice. It won't go bad or poison you . It will smell lovely. Breath in the fumes. If you have an asian grocery where you can buy 20kg sacks of sticky rice thats great . Tiny bags of rice do imo make it an expensive experiment. With the liquid you have added I have no idea how thats going to turn out. With no liquid and that amount of rice you could have expected an teacup ( after pressing) of something that to my mind is very sherry like. Maybe 20% sweet and very warming. And when you feed the leftover rice to the chickens, ducks, pigs etc they will love you . I think the way to approach it is the same way as making a really blue cheese. Strange things are happening to that rice but it will all turn out great. ps airlocks and suchlike are not used "up country" . If any bacteria in the air tries to compete with the rice yeast ( and I strongly suspect there are other bacteria that break down the starch etc in an asian yeast ball ) the rice yeast will swiftly sumo/kungfu/maithai it. Richard

[@CitySteadingBrews]

With all the brewing and fermenting we've done, panic is not something we do easily, lol. I won't feed my chickens alcohol, not really all that good for them. We use airlocks due to having cats, more than anything else with things like this!

[@kennethurbina7360]

Man, if your wife passed away. I am truly sorry man, and thanks for the great information cheers!

[@Melissa-dh6fj]

Loved this comment. I’m new to sake making at home and looking forward to trying open air as well as air lock methods. Cheers!

[@marcusoodian5603]

I wouldn’t be so quick to dismiss the possibility of a 25% abv product. Under the right conditions sake can definitely get this high. This is because the colonies of the two main microbes involved, Aspergillus oryzae (Koji-kin) and good ol’ Saccharomyces break down the starch to sugar and ferment it simultaneously. So the koji is effectively ‘step-feeding’ the yeast sugars keeping it super healthy as it slowly ferments. Love your easy and no fuss method, looks rlly effective hope it goes well!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Fair enough... but 25 is still a bit high. I'd go 20 or so.

[@Jimjolnir]

Their no fuss methods have begun the brewer in me. I would like to try rice wine/sake, I wonder if I'll be able to find that Koji-kin here, though.

[@alexanderrowley9870]

Given that turbo yeast caps out at 20%, I'm pretty sceptical of it going any higher. The fact that those microbes are capable of feeding the yeast well enough to keep it going that far is impressive enough anyway, given all the enzymes and nutrients that the turbo yeasts need to do the same job. Perhaps the stories of 25% have leaked in from the distilled versions of the beverage? Or maybe even a freeze-fractioned version, given we now have high-abv beers such as Snake Venom, that use that process. Perhaps some variety of Hokkaido sake for example? Someone leaves their sake out overnight and finds it part-frozen in the morning, yanks out the ice and discovers that it tastes even better the next cold night. It's just conjecture, but now I'm going to have to research and see if this exists. This feels too plausible of a drink to not exist somewhere!

[@ICUdoUCme1982]

One of the reasons The Great Wall of China"s mortar hasn't crumbled into dust in roughly 2700 years is because they used sticky rice in the process.

[@awhalestale623]

😂

[@LloydMolefe]

😭

[@garyzhang6662]

the surviving sections are relatively new, constructed during the Ming Dynasty

[@LloydMolefe]

@@RichardCockerill RATIOD 😭

[@wmd40]

The oldest parts are actually out in the desert in the West. There's a really cool documentary about it.

[@aaronwolfenbarger2122]

Thanks Brian and Derica, really interested to see how this turns out! Appreciate all the effort and information that you put forth in making these videos!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!

[@andrewyek]

@@CitySteadingBrews I am eager to see the result of your rice wine.. i believe you have tasted sake before, so i want to see your taste testing if it is exactly like sake from japan.

[@tivonoston3068]

The reason they sprinkle the starter is because, ideally the dried koji spores (oryzae) and some other oft added molds (like Rhizopus oligosporus; tempeh mold that adds new flavors to sake) are evenly dispersed. Hence why a lot of "traditional" ways let the rice sit for a day after this step, so the mold can culture, (also because it is more sensitive to water than yeast). Then, 24hrs later adding water and yeast. Thus making the world's only known edible, simultaneous-fermentation ("multiple parallel fermentation,") and is a process that is entirely unique to sake. of two completely different microbes! Note *A lot of industrial sake brewery houses produce sake at 18-20 % and dilute with water to 15 %; which was the more or less average abv of quality rice wine, historically.

[@AndrewTrembley]

Yep. "Koji" is the magic word.

[@jukeboxhero91]

There's plenty of sour beers and mixed cultured ferments that are two completely different microbes. Many wines also go through malo-lactic fermentation using lactic acid bacteria alongside the yeast that ferments the sugar to alcohol. Saying it's the only edible co-fermentation is completely off the mark.

[@tivonoston3068]

@@jukeboxhero91 Its more that theres a direct change in "multiple parallel fermentation" From this point, the koji will convert the starch in the rice into glucose, which the yeast will then use to create alcohol and carbon dioxide. The conversion of starch to sugar and sugar to alcohol takes place in parallel all in the same tank. This is known as "multiple parallel fermentation," and is a process that is entirely unique to sake. Yes, there are other things that have multiple microbes. But sake is the only one using mold and also having 1 complete cycle that converts and not just changing two separate chemicals.

[@창녀줄리가청와대접수]

The word "sake" derives from a Korean word that means "aged" or "fermented." Korean people taught Japanese people to ferment things like soy sauce, miso and alcoholic beverages.

[@CKNonsense]

@@tivonoston3068 Keeping it fairly rough: If you change "sake" to "rice wine", then yes. Don't forget the other rice wine products of korea, vietnam and china. Sometimes they add a different mold than Koji kin (aspergillus oryzae), like the one in red yeast rice (monascus purpureus) or the one most commonly in chinese yeast balls (rhizopus oryzae). Nevertheless I would still say, that japanese rice wine is the one with the most attention to detail among them :)

[@annhans3535]

Amazing. Was watching a Korean show and they were discussing rice wine. I thought hey, I want to make this....so here we are. Thank you for the video.

[@TM-ro7lh]

“I wonder if CS has a sake video.” Of course they do!

[@kenwincel]

I've been spending literally hours each night watching your videos. Not even sure how I got recommended your channel, just showed up Klingon Blood Wine. Of course I had to watch that, but then moved on to Mead which I've been planning to make. Now Rice Wines is one of my specialties. Having made 100's of batches for the past 10 or more years. I make both sake and makgeolli (Korean, which you actually get three products out of. To include Soju, Cheongju 'Rice wine' and Makgeolli 'rice beer') Since this is 'Sake' and I'm sure you've probably figured this out by now. Don't need to add water. The amylase (Enzyme that breakdown the starches to sugar) will pull apart the rice leaving you with the water you used to make the rice. I've found adding extra water to make the rice give you a better yield. This also makes the sweet rice very sticky. You can use long grain rice, but you really have to love your brew and stir it 2-3 times a day, and taste every couple of days. If that hint of lemon creeps in, you have to add sugar. If you're lucky and temperature is right, you won't need to add anything. Use short grain (new rice) sweet rice, and you will be perfect. (Though until things break down, keep an eye out for mold, and pull off right away). Stirring daily is soooo important. Eventually everything will liquefy. Also, if you don't add water the 1st sign of liquid that comes out is nigori (Sweet unfiltered sake), that's ready to drink right away. But I prefer to age to about 4-6 months, pouring the top off every month or so. The milk colored sake becomes crystal clear. Okay, back to watching the rest of this series.

[@nickm2890]

Wish you guys could've seen my excitement when I saw this notification. Awesome awesome post, guys!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Our pleasure!

[@asabovesotabelow]

I have been very close to attempting an attempt at making Junmai Daiginjo Sake, you all have just pushed me a bit closer to attempting this!!

[@roybarnes-thewildlifeman1855]

I’m following your exact recipe right now, here in AUStralia. I love your videos; the two you are so personable and present very well. You’ve educated me a lot! Thank you VERY much!

[@roguishowl3915]

I to am from Aus!! Were did you find/buy your Koji-kin from, within Aus.

[@roybarnes-thewildlifeman1855]

@@roguishowl3915 I bought it on eBay….

[@vaughngriffiths3148]

Bravely done sagely guides! in my everlasting quest to brew using "available" and organic ingredients this has been on my list,. Really dig it when you do these experimental videos.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Glad it was helpful!

[@vaughngriffiths3148]

@@CitySteadingBrews I only started to brew after watching your channel, and the more I brew, the more I enjoy learning new things, and the more enjoyable my brews become.

[@mnc1126]

Make mine with Jasmine rice and brewers yeast. 15 days Open and stir sealed vessel for 1 minute each day. Don’t make much. What is there is great stuff . The first “ brew” I ever made was this 15 day sake . I’m glad it turned out well because it peaked my Interest and brought me to this most excellent channel. Learning so much here ❗️

[@CitySteadingBrews]

But... you have nothing to convert the starches to sugars.

[@dv7533]

@@CitySteadingBrews I'm thinking wild bacteria might have gotten in, such is the magic of fermentation.

[@DSK2007]

Every time I think I have a nice stable of recipes and experiments to try, you all come along, and make me just want to dive into another branch of the home brew tree 🤣. Thank you

[@DuetToIt]

I packaged up a few pound of pilsner malt and crushed it. Added a pound or so of flaked corn to it. After that I grabbed some dried rice extract. I'm simply brewing a corona. I'm going to pitch some w34/70 and lager it. I've never brewed with flaked corn so that's a first, but the dried rice extract package I realized is what's going to drive up the gravity in this beer. The grain bill is next to nothing without throwing down on a pound of the rice extract. I enjoy your channel. Thanks.

[@gregoriuschristian]

In indonesia, we usually let the rice sit in the fermentation vessel for about a month. I used about 3 kilograms of glutinous rice the last time i tried to make it and get about 1,7 L of rice wine.

[@lchai6209]

Wah gimana caranya kak klo bole tau?

[@tomjerry9668]

Bagi resep dong kak, aku mau juga

[@jeanmartin6410]

I love sake! Excited to find out how this turns out.

[@paulallerston3771]

This has been on my to-do list for EVER! Intrigued to see how it turns out

[@louism357]

Yes! Thank you for doing this! I just started doing meads this spring with help from your videos and tried some soju at a party last week and love it. just started researching on how to make it, so your rice wine video is very timely. thank you so much for this video.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Wonderful!

[@brandoncolon9906]

Been saying I wanna start this for a while now but haven't made sence of how yet.....u guys come through in the clench again

[@theflashhobbyist]

I’m making Sake and needed to share an interesting event: you need to watch it because of the parallel fermentation and just because you used a blow off tube once doesn’t mean it won’t calm down and then do it again! The process is converting starch to sugar and then fermenting that and it looks like theres a critical concentration for the sugars to convert rapidly so the mash has basically been breathing/expanding in he container and contracting. I had it go down to almost nothing after a vigorous day or two with a blow off tube and a day or two later i walked in on it needing a blow off tube again! You have to stir it every couple of days to burp and remix it and wow it took off again.

[@jamesgolden7317]

I've always loved how ticky sake can be. Especially how significantly the flavor can change, just from how long it's heated, and the temperature. I did some different tries with sake, and noticed even a few seconds can change it from a sweet to tart flavor. It's like sake is a naturally judgemental and selfish drink. Lol

[@kronoscamron7412]

As everything japanese . It frowns upon anything less than efficiency.

[@Heartadia]

I'm a Taiwanese born guy (Grandparents from China), who moved to the USA at a very young age, and than moving again to Canada and having lived here since then. First fell in love with Japanese Sake even before I was old enough to start drinking. Now learning how to make Asian style rice wine from 2 white people. Nothing but love for you all. =D

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Lol

[@foxhollerhomestead]

I have been making "Makgeolli" pronounced Ma-cole-lee which is a korean rice wine. Yall can watch a video by the you tube channel "Maangchi" Korean rice liquor, this is where i got my recipe. Done in 9 days!! My mother in law is Korean and says that this is very traditional. Its very simple and delicious!!

[@amykitchens10]

YES! I actually combined Maangchi's recipe with B&D's recipe and it turned out fabulous. I can't have the nuruk because it contains wheat. Just substitute kame-koji instead of the nuruk and you get doburoku.

[@foxhollerhomestead]

@@amykitchens10 super awesome, definitely gonna check that out!! Thank you

[@TacticalSMRI]

You guys are literally awesome, you explain everything so perfectly

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thank you. We work really hard to do so!

[@tezz3t250]

Do you know about the "chicha" a kind of beer made whit fermented corn ? And have your ever think about doing a video on it ? P.s. thanks you for all this good videos !

[@CitySteadingBrews]

We're not chewing corn and spitting it out, no.... but a chicha like product is something we're working on.

[@SombreroPharoah]

@@CitySteadingBrews it's actually not as bad as you'd think lol. I got my group of friends at a festival to just chew, spit, and drove it all back home a few years back and was pleasantly surprised. (Naturally, shared with all those who made it lol). Be intrigued to see how you guys go about similer. You've got a new sub from this vid for sure.

[@stevecuffe3061]

Great to see a new type of brew and method. Very informative, look forward to seeing how it turns out.

[@Luzviminda777]

Sticky rice tastes amazing , hold with fingers and dip in your favorite sauces or soupes

[@theoriginsessions2770]

Read many of the comments here. Found your channel recently and I'm very inspired in general. Seeing this video really got my attention, as I adore Sake. I never even dreamed of making it. Wow. Im inspired, and you two remind me of my husband and I. Hes going to be very excited when I show him this video. We live on an island in Alaska. He is a burgeoning baker. We are in our early 50's. You are a delight, and so is this video. Not sure when, and we will be trying this one for sure. Do you sell the fermentation bottles? We are cider people in general, and both love Japanese food and culture - so this is great. I love how you cover so many styles. Will be fun to experiment with you and grow together. Blessings my friends.

[@491n4he5]

I live in Korea and I am at the moment making Korean makgeoli 먹걸리 and hit has come out surprisingly sour. I have made beer for more than 12 years and never had a beer sour on me. I though it was the temp, it was fermenting between 24-27C but I am currently making a barley beer using the Korean yeast source nuruk 누룩 but icing it to make sure it never ferments above 21C (72F) but it's still souring. I believe that nuruk누룩 just produces more lactic acid that other types of yeast. I have read a few pieces on nuruk specifically and lactic acid seems to be a main by product rather than a secondary byproduct to alcohol and carbonation like all of the beers I have made before. Kinda frustrating.

[@AnnhilateTheNihilist]

I love makgeolli how did you go did you get it right?

[@TheKimJoel]

I think this is just the nature of using nuruk as a starter. I wonder if you could use a different source of amylase and then just ferment it with yeast?

[@chrisx1138]

A little late to the game. However, the trick is to ferment the sugars before the lacto gets to high. Temp control is key. Never let it get above 22C and try to keep around 20. Also, copitch some wine yeast with the nuruk. Bottle and refrigerate before fermentation is complete. This will help you get some fizz, keep some sweetness to counter the sour, and minimize the amount of lactic acid.

[@491n4he5]

I didn' t realize this post had continued to develop into a convo, hadn' t paid attention to it. But thank you everyone for the input. I have come to conclude it waz the 누룩 itself. This parallels what Ken said. I have continued to make 막걸리 and spoken to some older people. 누룩 is used to make 된장 (korea' a version of miso) as well as vinegar and 막걸리. Way back when, when starting with a 누룩 cultivar, the didn' t know if they would get 막걸리 or vinegar. To ensure they got 막걸리 they would use starter from a previous batch. In doing so they were creating a brew strain. This brew strain outpaced the lactobacillus and when alochol was produced this eventually killed the lactobacillus creating a positive feedback loop to produce specifically brew yeast. At least this is how I understand it to be the case. I brew now with basic bread yeast and have no issuss with too much lactic acid since the switch.

[@gterplaasboer]

I finally started my first mead last night (after many fruit wines and ginger beers). As per me, it wasn't something simple, but a Yule mead, with spices and cake fruit and a whole lot of honey. So basically a Christmassy Sack Mead (1.130 Gravity). Only afterwards did I realise that I channelled my inner Brian by encouraging that first bubble with the exact same words. "Come on, Bubble, you can do it!" As I am typing here, the mead is happily bubbling away under my kitchen table. Going to be a long wait before I can taste it, but "Don't worry, Tessa, you can do it!" Hope Brian's fingers are feeling better by now. See the mummy wraps are off, at least.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Hehe, yeah, good job. My fingers are better, no pain now, not sure if the skin will stay or peel off. Definitely some nerve damage, but I'll be alright, thanks for asking :)

[@zeldatrek]

"We'll be making our rice wine the traditional way." Then proceeds to show yest and culture packet instead of having a shrine maiden spit into the jar. I have watched too much anime.

[@gliderspace]

your are mixing two different drinks. Sake and Kuchikamizake

[@freedomlover9560]

Sake isn't rice wine, it's beer.

[@adambeer1171]

@@gliderspace super interesting reading up on it. Thanks for pointing it out :)

[@felixarbable]

@@freedomlover9560 sake is koji rice, which produces A amylyse and yeast and regular rice. its not beer. its certainly considered rice wine. it has a completely different way of fermenting to beer, called a parrallel fermentation where the koji transforms the rice into glucose and the yeast turns the glucose into alcohol

[@felixarbable]

actually saliva has the same enzymes that break down the rice, you do see this method in asia especially in poor communities

[@MacDaAce]

Awesome work guys! thank you so much for your info and the links! I will be trying this very soon!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Have fun!

[@Hawaiian_Shirt_guy]

6:32 excellent description of the two-step fermentation process. You can also make a "corn wine," or even a "barley wine" or really any type of "grain wine" this way (although a beer made using this method would be undrinkable due to the extracted tannins.. yeah, one time I experimented with a "barley wine" made like this when I had a left over yeast ball and some barley sitting in the brew cabinet.. Don't do it :)

[@thiago.assumpcao]

How did corn wine taste?

[@setandcollect]

I've been wanting to learn how to do this so I am definitely following this one

[@amykitchens10]

I finally made this! I used kome-koji rice instead of the koji-kin starter. It turned out STRONG so I ended up diluting it with water and backsweetening it with 1/4 cup sugar so I could actually enjoy it LOL! (I saw Maangchi do this when she made her magkeolli.) I discovered that when you make it this way and don't over-filter it, it's called doburoku (or farm house sake). Apparantly "real" sake has some extra steps to make it more purified. I think I like the "rice milk" quality to it though. I'm drinking it now as I eat some bean curry and it pairs really well. Oh, btw I decided to leave the fermenter out on my counter so I could stir it every day. I didn't want it to get too much light so I crocheted a jar cozy to darken the jar. It worked great!

[@Hawaiian_Shirt_guy]

9:04 it should come out perfect. you're using the exact method I was taught. It should come out with a sweet and sour rice taste... absolutely delicious.

[@killslay]

I didn't even think about making my own sake! Looks like I got some rice to buy

[@renzocoppola4664]

it isn't just yeast, it's also an enzyme producing fungi

[@Pontwam8]

Weirdly the only active ingredient in the packet they used was the microfungus Rhizopus oryzae (no bacteria or yeast as stated in the video). Guess it gets the job done of both breaking down starches and fermenting the resulting sugars? Modern sake-making methods use a specific mold (Aspergillus oryzae) referred to as "koji" to produce the enzymes necessary to break down the starches. A sake-specific yeast strain is added separately. Additionally, lactic acid plays a part in the process and if not added directly as a lactic acid solution is produced by lactobacillus bacteria which either is added or naturally present. This video had almost nothing to do with either traditional or modern sake making, but perhaps reflected a different tradition of some sort of "rice wine". Not sure...

[@mykulpierce]

@@Pontwam8 how is this fungus cultivated. I love the idea of making a rice wine from true scratch. It's apparently a world wide fungus but Google has not been kind to know how it's cultivated.

[@ryckbirch8089]

@@mykulpierce the fungus is Aspergillus oryzae. It's called Koji and names both the growing fungus and the molded grains. The molded grain Koji is used for making both sake and miso paste. Gem Cultures has multiple types of Koji spores for sale. Making koji isn't hard with a bit of right equipment (beer cooler, seedling heating mat and a temperature regulator) and some practice. There's a miso FB group that can give you a wealth of of tips on Koji making.

[@mykulpierce]

@@ryckbirch8089 thanks I'll check it out!

[@007cantos]

I'm on batch 5, I use 2kg Indonesian glutenous rice. the Angel brand rice leaven you used. I get up to 1 gallon on Sake average is 16%. The last 2 batches I bagged and after I see no more activity I squeeze the bejeausus out of it, then rack and let it settle, after about a month total I get about 4-5 750 bottles of nectar. A straw colour Amazing flavour

[@elricthebald870]

3:41 An American admitting metric is easier? WOW!! 😲 I've always known it was possible but never dared to think I'd actually witness it someday. 😋🤪 Cheers B&D. Love your vids. 👍

[@setandcollect]

I agree metric would be much easier than imperial but there is hardly anything that uses it here in the states

[@papasmurf9146]

In this case, metric was only easier because of the granularity of the measurement, not the conversion between units. For the reasons it was easier, Fahrenheit would be easier than centigrade.

[@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582]

Metric is sooo much easier. The only thing I'd a problem with is deciding what to wear if I heard the temperature in °C because my whole life I hear °F.

[@elricthebald870]

@@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582 I'd have same issues with Fahrenheit. Centigrade is a actually pretty easy: 20 is room temperature. 30 is hot, 10 is cold. 40 is sauna/fever. 0 is literally freezing. In Fahrenheit I'd have no flaming idea. All I know is 100F = 37C (body temp). And -40F = -40C (coincidence?)

[@CitySteadingBrews]

For the record, as an American, I am not given a choice which system my country chooses to use therefore my saying Metric is easier is just my opinion. I use metric for all my cooking videos. Why? It's better. I have no problem admitting that, but me being American has nothing to do with it. I can no easier change my country to metric as you could change yours to Imperial.

[@engacemilani4119]

Took me the same A lot of studying and tinkering to get it the way I liked it. Cheers y'all

[@TheTranceGamer]

I tried it with cooked rice. It looked and smelled super funky in 10 days. I literally started a batch today. Added raw rice (500g) and sugar (1kg) to boiling water (3ltr) and then cut the heat, last night. This morning inoculated with yeast and stored it away. Im seeing activity in 12hrs. In secondary I'm gonna try vanilla pod and cinnamon - to get a horchata-esque flavour.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

If you didn't use the rice leaven type yeast or Chinese yeast balls, it's not going to ferment that rice, just the sugar, like I said in th evideo.

[@ebridavid179]

its good to see your hand is doing better Brian. i wish this project all the luck.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thanks 👍

[@daedaluslv2032]

You can get this yeast on ebay 3-4 euro a pack of 5.

[@parttimebus1151]

I was just thinking about how to make Sake a few days ago..perfect timing!

[@melissaleeo]

Liking this video before even watching it 😂

[@RamDragon32]

This was fascinating to watch. Normally in beer making, you start by malting the grain (wheat, barley, corn, etc) because the grain already contains the enzymes needed to convert the starches to sugars the baby sprout can use. That natural process can't be leveraged to kick off the conversion in rice because the husk is stripped off before the grain is stored. The husk, in the case of rice, contains all those important enzymes, and stripping it is how rice is stabilized for storage. (It's also mostly indigestible and that's why brown rice and whole-grain rice are not healthy alternatives to white rice.) That's why an enzyme has to be added to the rice first; it does the same job as malting. Since the first step to prepping the rice for use is rehydrating it with so much water, you could have gotten away with adding a lot less to the fermentor and probably ended up with higher alcohol content. I've said it before, what you guys do on this channel is like alchemy. I love watching you perform something half-way between science and magic with these brews.

[@armedbear529]

Parchment paper lined sheet trays may be a good idea.

[@fred1919-e8e]

This is what I use.

[@kumaril05]

Tribal People in Bengal where I live use Rice to make a sour tasting Beer like drink called Haria, it's ritualistic in their Tribal Culture at every festival & weddings & I was once offered it & that stuff was very nasty but gives a good kick

[@anneirenej]

Ooo this is exciting. I am looking forward to seeing the whole process

[@robertraffensberger9051]

Rice yeast doesn't like water at the start to much will kill off the yeast all together but a small amount or none is best

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Interesting.... didn't see that in any of my research.

[@frankrobinsjr.1719]

@@CitySteadingBrews Did they say anything about hulling the rice?

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Nope.

[@frankrobinsjr.1719]

@@CitySteadingBrews I knew a guy who made his own when I lived in Japan. I wasn't curious enough to ask when I was that young.

[@generrosity]

I visited a little Japanese sake brewery. They did have a drier step in between when they use another mold or yeast to develop the cooked rice flavours. They mentioned that shelling and polishing off the outside of rice gives different flavours too as you get closer to the central core of the grain (most rice we get is already shelled and given a quick polish). But everywhere had their own technique... Looking forward to the result! :)

[@kumaril05]

Brian has the perfect presentation skills... As a Non English speaker it's very easy to understand, not hill Billy at all very nice

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Wow, thanks.

[@RobKinneySouthpaw]

Curious to find out as the starch breaks down how much of the solids just...vanish

[@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582]

I was wondering about that too.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

It does break down to mush.

[@MistressKuroko]

Koji!

[@generrosity]

I think that's where some of the resulting water comes back from

[@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582]

@@generrosity definitely the water the dried rice soaked up to become moist and sticky.

[@Beerbatter1962]

Kool. Interesting engineering tidbit. The pressure inside the vessel can easily be determined by the hydrostatic pressure in the air lock. The "Head" pressure generated is governed by the difference in height between the lower meniscus and the upper meniscus of the fluid in the air lock and the density of the fluid. In this case, lets say water in the air lock and a height difference of 1 inch. So rho X g X h is about .032 psi above atmospheric in the vessel. And yeah, the sudden release of continuous bubbles is caused by the pressure building up in the vessel to push the water up in the air lock and build up the head pressure. The small, twisted path of the air lock with the alternating spheres creates some resistance, which once the pressure is high enough to overcome, is released. Once the first bubble moves through, this "resistance" is less (static vs dynamic resistance) and more bubbles easily pass through. Also, the first bubble passing through kind of helps the ones behind it along. So they pass through more easily. This continues until the pressure in the vessel is reduced enough that the air lock stops the flow. As you mentioned, since the vessel has quite a bit of volume relatively speaking, many bubbles have to pass through to get the pressure down enough to stop the gas flow. Yeah I know, nerdy comment, but hey, I'm an engineer.

[@chrisharmon8316]

Brian and Derica, I started my rice wine with your directions here, i used the sweet rice and the rice levin, Have to say it looks just like yours so far, Have a bit more time before i even get to racking it off, BUT my son thanks you since he enjoys Japanese things greatly. Thanks for all your advice and the beginning of a fun hobby

[@TheSlassor]

I did this about two years ago.found it really easy

[@CitySteadingBrews]

It is easy, just a very different method to most brews.

[@johnaldrich3668]

I have a whole bunch of "rice balls" for making rice wine and I'd be happy to send you some. Something else you might want to try when making rice wine/sake is red yeast rice. Makes the rice wine red. It's fun to watch rice ferment with the yeast balls as mold grows over and through the rice. The red yeast rice contains monascus mold to help break down the starch in the rice

[@CitySteadingBrews]

What we used is essentially the same as the rice balls just already crushed up :)

[@johnaldrich3668]

@@CitySteadingBrews have you tried red yeast rice?

[@jakattah]

The enzyme is amylase that converts starch to sugar. Naruk is sold in some Asian stores which does the job. Saliva contains amylase and some strains of lactobacillus can do it.

[@jakattah]

Koji is the Japanese equivalent. Homebrew stores sell amylase as well.

[@Sa1d1n]

@@jakattah Koji is a fungus (Aspergillus oryzae). Lactobacillus is used to lower the pH, I believe - not necessarily to break down the starches in this process. That's what sets sake apart from beer brewing - it's a parallel fermentation as opposed to the mashing -> fermentation .

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thus I said more like beer, though it's not the same exactly.

[@Sa1d1n]

@@CitySteadingBrews Well, since @jakattah mentioned saliva...I believe there's a very traditional version (for rituals, etc) where the rice is chewed beforehand and then left to ferment. I trust this is something you are unlikely to try out :D!?

[@jakattah]

@@CitySteadingBrews yup! Koreans have Makgeolli which is considered a rice beer. Comes in over 12% but they tend to water it down. I was in South Korea last year and tried the local beer. It seemed unhopped and I have no idea how they could enjoy it ;)

[@TheFirstManticore]

I have made delicious rice wine. The method was different, but I don't remember it in detail. The first time, the odor made me think it had gone vinegar. But it hadn't; it came out perfect.

[@tazblink]

You can add more rice and yeast to your fermentor even now. Its fine and works well. It takes along time for it to complete but the method you used will work well. Couple tips if you don't add water it helps to soak the rice in water before you steam it for several hours to get as much water into the rice as you can. Also to get the fermentation going faster add the yeast to the rice on the tray and fold it in, that helps make contact of the fungus and yeast with all grains of rice and kickstarts your fermentation. Your way will work fine and it will taste great just be very patient.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thank you. We're exploring options going forward with this series and that is one. :)

[@majrovits4902]

This may already be in the works but if not id love to see y'all do either a coconut water wine or mead. You two taught me how to brew properly several months ago and ive had much success, this is my next experiment coconut water mead I feel would be and interesting tropical flavored hydromel type of beverage. With some lime peel added for tannins love all the content keep living your dream you two its very inspiring.

[@007cantos]

Thanks for the videos, I have a brew in using your technique. 1 week in currently bubbling it's happy little self. See what we have in a month or so

[@Pef273]

Great video! Funny note, I was watching an Asian family home brew this stuff and the camera person caught footage of the house cat taking a drink out of the stuff after it started fermentation. (They all enjoyed the stuff later in the documentary)

[@andrewyek]

I guess it is just like a lot of westerner let the dog or cat lick their mouth and lips.. which asian felt it is disgusting.. but no away, some asian themselves also the same - let the dog licks their face. anyway, i believe those dogs are cleaner, they don't eat poo or random stuff from everywhere.. *no meaning of debase anybody, just my neutral opinion*

[@dankauffman8568]

I was in Japan in the early eighties . They serve it warm . Really couldn't get into that . Good video !!

[@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582]

Love it warm! Brings out more flavors!

[@DukeTrout]

Warm sake is typically for the lower grade sakes. High-end sakes are usually drank room temperature or chilled. FYI.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

This is a myth actually. Sometimes it's more or less true, but not really.

[@mycrazylifewfawnlisette3582]

@@DukeTrout I have had $10/bottle and $80/750ml (and many priced inbetween) sake at both cool and warm. I prefer them warm. I will agree the warmth takes a little bit of the bite out of the cheap ones. But all in all the warmth brings out the subtleties in flavor. It's like icing a whiskey (only opposite). Brian, when you taste yours you should do both warm and cool/room temp

[@DukeTrout]

Fawn Ricciuti Sure, you can do that. You would probably get some very polite stink-eye if you drink a high quality sake warm in Japan. I’m not just making things up here - my brother-in-law is a sake brewmaster, trained in Japan. He knows what he’s talking about.

[@Twobirdsbreakingfree]

What temperature did you guys have the rice beer fermenting at approximately? I believe the "Rice Levain" packet you used already contains yeast, along with a filamentous mold called Rhizopus oryzae (for converting the starch to sugar) so there was no need to add in additional yeast. I read that Rhizopus oryzae virtually ceases all activity below 22°C, so that's why I'm asking you what temperature you fermented the rice at.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Probably right around 75f

[@Twobirdsbreakingfree]

@@CitySteadingBrews alright, I'll wait for the weather here to warm up just a tad and then I'll give it a whirl.

[@tech5278]

You guys are awesome. Love watching your channel. I am planning to setup a Meadery.

[@TheVonhollan]

mix yeast with hands in to the rice before adding water let sit for 24 hours check must and mix 2 liters of water, let sit for a few more days then drain 2 to 3 times. i was in Japan 10 years ago. Love warm Sake!

[@joshuarodrigues7123]

This video came out at a very perfect time. The day before this video hit, I had a thought about making sake for my brother in law for his birthday. Lol I'll be following you on this. 😁

[@fred1919-e8e]

It's also really nice to use for cooking.

[@joshuacaruana5478]

Great video, it's going to be interesting form what I can remember the enzyme that converts the starches to sugars can look like mould.

[@mythic_snake]

Maangchi made makgeolli, which is the same concept but more like an ale than a wine. She dried the rice out until it was crunchy on the outside but still soft on the inside before adding it to the vessel. Makgeolli uses nuruk instead of koji. Nuruk is made on a wheat base, while koji is made on a rice base. I can't figure out if they are interchangeable though. I may sort of merge these two methods and see what happens.

[@katerinasamajova4048]

I've noticed that most koji moulds have Aspergillus oryzae mould while Chinese yeast cakes and Korean nuruk has Rhizopus oryzae. I guess these different moulds and the wheat based yeast cake produce different notes, but technically speaking, they're all the same method with minor variations. I'm about to experiment with all three soon to see the difference.

[@warriorworkstraining]

You guys are wonderful communicators.

[@astocrabman2099]

I'm experimenting with rice wine too, so glad you're giving it a try and making videos about it, you've confirmed that I'm on the right track with my experiment, the biggest difference to what you're doing compared to what I'm trying, is the amount of added water, one video I've watched has a rice to water ratio of 1 to 10, i.e. 1kg of rice to 10 litres of water. That video initially adds a similar amount of water as you did in this video, they waited several days, confirming that fermentation has started, then added the remaining water. Owing to the size of vessels, the quantity of rice verses yeast balls etc I'm using, the rice to water ratio is closer to 1 to 5 or 6....seems to be working so far.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

I've been told that water is bad for the young fermentation.

[@astocrabman2099]

@@CitySteadingBrews please explain

[@CitySteadingBrews]

ASTO Crabman it’s essentially a mold so they don’t like to be underwater.

[@astocrabman2099]

@@CitySteadingBrews fare enough, this is my first time trying to brew any form of alcohol. I have been brewing my own probiotics for the last 4-5 months, but that's a whole story of it's own. Back to my rice wine the "extra" water doesn't seemed to have prevented any fermentation, taking your advice from some of your other videos I decided to let it ferment longer than the 4 weeks (because it was still fermenting) suggested by some other people. However, after 6 weeks (last weekend) I decided to strain it through some cheese cloth, put it into a 5 litre Demijohn (I think you Americans call them Carboys?), added more water and about 200 grams of raw sugar (I couldn't help myself) and the fermentation has really taken off, the air lock has been releasing every 3 seconds. In the meantime I've obtained a second 3 litre Kilner fermentation kit, this afternoon with the first 3 litre kit, as a control, I've started another rice wine experiment using the same method as you have used in this video, tomorrow, as a second control, I'll repeat your recipe, with the second 3 litre kit, only I won't add any water at all.

[@nevermind501]

Dude! You had me cracking up after you put the water in. Your face! So worried 😂😂😂

[@sanjeevagunaratne2432]

Thanks for being very educational as well!

[@davidhowell7279]

Oh....my...goodness! My new favorite beverage! Well....under 40% abv. Like yourself, I enjoy a quality bourbon on occasion. I mostly followed your recipe. Where I deviated was the rinsing of and quantity of rice. I didn't rinse mine. I rarely do for preparing jasmine for eating either. My thoughts were that if the rice has a small amount of powdery starch coating it, then that would be all the better. More starch to convert to sugar, more sugar to convert to tasty alcohol. Also, I prepared enough rice to fill a 1 gallon wide mouth jar, with an airlock of course. I decided to experiment with the same packet of starter that you used for one batch, and crushed balls for the other. The ball batch fermented twice as fast as the packets. Two packets, two balls. The rice floated and compacted in the top half of each jar leaving clear liquid in the bottom half. When it started turning cloudy at 12 days, I decided to remove the rice. Didn't want the flavor to get too strong. Pear, green apple, and pineapple. Just shy of too sweet (for me). Very strong alcohol balances out the sweetness. Thank you for the inspiration. Gravity reading at the end is 1.050. For what it's worth anyway. Keep up the goodness.

[@davidhowell7279]

Oh, I have to mention that you also succeeded in inspiring my sanitization protocols. I use Star San in my 15 gallon T.ub O.f Absolute S.anitizatin T.reatment, or T.O.A.S.T.. When completed, my equipment has been TOASTed.

[@davidhowell7279]

Apologies, I have mixed bipolar disorder and ADHD so, I can get excited and can ramble. That being said, I want to mention, I took the somewhat cheesecloth strained rice and split it between two (TOASTed) 1/2 gallon fermenters with airlocks, as an experiment to see how far it goes without getting too funky. Smells very fruity so, high hopes. Airlocks began bubbling immediately.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

TOASTed. I love it! Thanks for watching!

[@zegon2703]

I saw this pop up on my phone and got so excited ! Thank you!

[@JRainshadow]

Thank you for this video! Worth it for the special 'yeast +' tip alone. I found a video on Nepalese rice wine and was going to try it with brewer's yeast - glad I didn't! In that video they didn't add liquid; when it was over they strained out the rice and the liquid was the wine. They then squeezed out the rice for a much stronger drink that had a different name. Very curious how strong this brew turns out.

[@CarlosMoreno-zp1mk]

Saludos desde Perú .perfecta tu explicación muy clara. Greetings from Perú ....a pretty Nice and clear explanation....You boths ate increíble.....

[@Siriox9102]

I want to see the outcome. This is going to be very interesting

[@CookwithNate]

I just have a few questions! The Rice Wine yeast is said to convert starches to sugars right? And the whole point of rinsing the rice is to remove the starches right? So to preserve alot of the starch should you prevent washing the rice grains?!?!? I'm really confused

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Every advice I saw said to rinse it. I believe it’s to get dirt and dust off the rice. The tiny amount of starch won’t matter.

[@daviclor6670]

It's interesting how you approached this. Clearly you did research. Now, contaminants from the air are definitely a potential problem, but I think the reason why other sake makers are initially putting cheesecloth on top, and leaving out the water, at least initially, is the because the koji culture (Aspergillus oryzae), which is the fungus that breaks down the starches and proteins down in the rice, requires oxygen. (The entire process is aerobic versus the anaerobic process of ethanol production, which explains the negative pressure in your airlock.) Thus, placing the rice initially in an airtight container and adding water may have reduced your sugar yield from the koji. I haven't watched the other parts of this video yet, but I suspect if you broke the pitching of the koji and the pitching of the yeast into separate steps and made sure the koji had enough oxygen, you would improve your ethanol yield. Mushroom growers probably have a better idea of how to keep the koji growth free of contaminants as Aspergillus oryzae is a multicellular fungus and you might look to those techniques for ideas to enhance your sugar production. I think the largest challenge of sake making is learning to handle the cultivation of two different organisms with different requirements in a specific sequence.

[@JuanFlores-fl1he]

I wonder how this wine rice is going! I can’t wait to watch the next vide!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Update is recorded, coming out in a week or two.

[@JuanFlores-fl1he]

@@CitySteadingBrews sweet!!

[@Hawaiian_Shirt_guy]

2:49 you are 100% correct about that. That's rice flavored sugar wine, and since making homemade rice wine is incredibly messy (which I'm sure you're about to demonstrate), this is how a lot of home brewers make "rice wine." The flavor profile will be off, though.

[@ryancarlson5838]

Hello! Thank you for the video. I’m a very novice mead maker. I live in Japan. I wanted to make two comments just to add my two bits. First is that when I visited sake breweries in Japan they generally call this part where you add the bacteria to the rice “malting the rice.” I’ve been to maybe twenty breweries and it always looks extremely dry at the beginning of the process when the bacteria is first added and then the rice sort of sweats as the starches are converted to sugars. It often looks like a little mushy at the end. Their fermentation areas are usually wood with a lot of humidity control devices. Second is that you said that malted barley had no fermentable sugars. I thought barley had only starch and the malting process is what converted the starches to fermentable sugars. Is that wrong? Thank you for your videos! I hope you can continue to make more!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Barley has starches, malted barley contains the enzyme to convert the starches ti sugar but it has to be activated.

[@deroy2829]

I really hope your still checking this page. :) I over cooked my rice. It's mostly a oatmeal consistency. I added my yeast ball anyway because the rice wasn't cheap. It is starting to bubble so fermentation is happening. Am I wasting my time because of the over cooking of the rice? I'm sure I'll get some kind of alcohol but I want a nicely flavored rice wine. Anything you can give me on what to expect. Maybe I should just start again? Fermenters and space are a premium so I don't want to waste my time on a sure flop. Thanks for your time.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

I'm not a rice wine expert, but I don't think it should affect it.

[@kckdude913]

Have you guys heard of pulque? It's a beer (or wine?) made from the sweet agave nectar. It's what tequila was originally distilled from. Would be interesting to know if it can be brewed in the US.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

We are working on some alternative fermentables, yep.

[@spike_spencer]

I was excited that you might have some additional insight on making kōji rice with aspergillus oryzae before I start making my own. This is a technique I was not expecting. Was the stuff in the packet not a kōji starter? Good luck, I look forward to seeing how this turns out for you.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

It was.

[@spike_spencer]

@@CitySteadingBrews at least as I understand it you want to use a alcohol tolerant yeast like 1118 or if you can get it Sake yeast number 7 and combine the kome kōji (rice molded with an aspergillus oryzae inoculation) with additional steamed rice and water. The kome kōji is used to convert the additional steamed rice the same way you use 2 or 6 row with a lot of diastatic power to convert other grains with amylase but unlike all other starch to sugar conversions used in brewing this takes place at the same time you're fermenting it which means it feeds the yeast just the right amount of sugar to establish a good strong fermentation. High quality sake even reduces the temperature to slow things down even further.

[@gabrielgarza9724]

Great video. About the starches, can you make a mash with the rice and a little amount of malted barley, so the malt enzymes can get to the rice starches and convert them to fermentable sugars?

[@CitySteadingBrews]

In theory, you can, you just have to make sure you have enough barley to have enough diastatic power to do all the conversion.

[@XxdjforrestxX]

Can’t wait for the update!!! Maybe a Japanese beer brew video is in the works?

[@CitySteadingBrews]

We don't do a lot of beer because our audience in general really doesn't appreciate beer videos. Every one we have done has drawn a very low audience.

[@liamgreaney4176]

Very excited to try this. I am sure you cover it in another video but what size bung do you use in place of the cap for the wide mouth fermenter?

[@CitySteadingBrews]

We use a lid with a grommet for the wide mouth and the stopper that came with for the big mouth bubbler.

[@theoriginsessions2770]

BTW, gave this video a thumbs up to help you grow, and because its a great video! Blessings!

[@range8977]

great vidio, i wondering where you got your big mouth vessels with the red tops and there was a peace at the end of your syphon tube that goes inside the bottle and it controlls the flow of wine ?

[@NomadeDigital]

Although sake is a type of rice wine, this is technically not sake, sake is made with a special rice called Sakamai and with koji, nor is it korean Magkeolli that is made with nuruk, the ingredients and process differ quite a bit from basic rice wine. All those variations are pretty interesting to dive into and for home brewers like us it's really interesting!

[@CitySteadingBrews]

The research I did said the names are interchangeable. Sake is simply Japanese rice wine, and there are a thousand ways to make that too.

[@mike50911]

Can I use miyako koji to make this? I found it at my local Asian market. One of the workers said I could make sweet sake but in looking further into that it's not the same kind of sake. So I just really like your videos and wanted your opinion.

[@douglasbuchholz1509]

Funny, been watching "Midnight Diner" on Netflix the last few days and having made mead off & on for the last few years, was wondering about Sake making. I am going to try this. I enjoy your videos, they are very informative, covering a lot of things other's leave out. I am looking forward to follow up videos on the Sake.

[@CitySteadingBrews]

Thank you, much appreciated.