Pistol Primaries in Games

Pistols are weapons that show up in almost every shooter. While they're depicted as secondary weapons most of the times, there are a significant number of games in which you can use a pistol as a primary weapon.
How often have pistols been used as primaries in real life? And why is it such a relatively popular trend in games?

[@Rlowe247]

Handguns always have an ease of use advantage in VR games, match the controllers and no two-handing issues.

[@dan_loeb]

a big part too is how the controller is such a good tactile analog for it. two handed weapons, you have to simulate the controllers being connected together in vr (unless you're using a mounting/ stock device that holds the controllers). combine that with the magazine in most modern handguns being in the pistol grip, you also know how to reload instinctively too, bringing your hands together to insert the magazine.

[@ARWINGx1]

In fact, if possible, I would've used only Pistols. (in whatever VR game that I own)

[@JohnPeacekeeper]

This is always why I carry a pistol or a sawn-off shotgun in VR games that have guns, because having a sidearm that you can easily move around with one hand offers a lot of versatility, and it's very intuitive to swap to even while holding your primary in your off-hand

[@JohnPeacekeeper]

Also one thing I find having a pistol good for is blind firing behind cover. This may also be doable with a sawn-off or SMG, and very difficult to do with a rifle, and impossible to do with a sniper, but it is very easy to do with a pistol

[@Rlowe247]

@@JohnPeacekeeper H3VR has an excellent sawn-off to load and flick shut. Nice two-handing system for handguns where you only need the controllers near eachother.

[@AxiamWolfe]

Funny that Tarkov was shown when talking about the lack of virtual drawbacks for extended mags, when Tarkov is one of the games where heavy extended mags prominently affect the handling of said firearm.

[@zaniatnik]

And tend to malfunction more often and they take slower to refill.

[@meatbeatmania]

​@xeon7663 there is the failure to feed chance which does work just doesn't happen often unless the gun is low durability

[@thepjup4507]

@@xeon7663 failure to feed can happen on a 100% durability gun. it happened to me recently, so you're just outright wrong young boyo

[@Azra_Fox]

Tarkov wasnt always that way, and the drawbacks were never more than the pros it gave. Back in the day, it was common to strafe corners, hipfiring with a 60 round drum in an m4, and youd have great accuracy. Also, mags in tarkov dont jam, your mag has nothing to do with whether your rifle will fire. it may fail to feed, but not jam. That is all dependent on the condition of your gun.

[@tunderstorm2769]

​@xeon7663 the fuck are you talking about? theres literaly a descriptor for each mag that tells you thr malfunction chance

[@AKX-DTGRSMP]

When I hear "pistol primary" I'm like:"Why not. Why shouldn't I use this pistol chambered in 7.62x54mm".

[@civilianuseonly]

Conceal carry an Obrez like God intended

[@thedesignerblacksmith5953]

Not the Obrez but MACVSOG literally made M1 carbine sawed off for themself, as they can carry it on sling and bring it out faster than M1911. So yes, battle proven

[@therandomscout6590]

The Nagant Revolver is chambered in 7.62 and can be suppressed

[@AKX-DTGRSMP]

@@therandomscout6590 *7.62x38mmR

[@NeostormXLMAX]

Why hasnt anyone made a pistol shotgun yet? Like the short stop from tf2

[@TacticalMischief-zj8tn]

A huge disadvantage pistols have nobody really talks about is shooter fatigue. I shoot competition and after running two PCC stages with a PCC, I decided to run the final stage with a pistol. Over 100 rounds of shooting and halfway through the stage, my accuracy was completely shot. I couldn't hold the pistol steady anymore because my hands had cramped. I was shooting a Glock model 45 with the stock trigger and a red dot. 60 rounds in and I switched hands because my shooting hand was too tired to keep shooting. My final time was double what I would have gotten if I just ran the PCC.

[@civilianuseonly]

PCC cheater gang

[@cdgonepotatoes4219]

Yeah, one of the many reasons why multiple points of contact is vital for accuracy. Even if the pistol you use has a light load, has low bore axis, a light trigger, soft and gradual recoil and a fairly ergonomic grip, you're still going to get tired and lose accuracy far quicker than if you had the same plus the barest minimum that could be classified as a stock. The Flux Raider is a fantastic example of what a "pistol primary" can be. While still unable to compete in power and being too large for serious civilian use, it's still light and compact enough to carry on the hip like a pistol and should be taken as proof of concept going forward by SO.

[@hydroxide5507]

skill issue

[@NeostormXLMAX]

Use exo suits and argument humans in the future, or something like from elysium etc

[@ShakyBakey]

@@hydroxide5507 "skill issue", he said, his 350 lbs sticking to his chair, not having ever seen the light of day nor practiced with his "just as good" firearms he bought with savings from his disability check. You own a Taurus G3. Don't @ me, poor.

[@rayclemenes7638]

A lot of games have pistol muzzle rise as if it were a weapon with a stock.

[@asteroidrules]

It's kind of a side effect of how video games don't exactly give the most accurate depiction of firearm recoil. Most commonly the way recoil is created in video games is by applying an angular offset to the point of aim after firing. This is at least a decent approximation, but is a little awkward for pistols since they don't kick your shoulder the way a long gun does.

[@fenrirsrage4609]

Speaking of pistols as primary weapons. Considering how common it is in most media from movies, cartoons, comics, tv shows and more. Its really interesting how Handguns have become a sort of quintessential Hero or Protagonist weapon in fiction, similar to Swords.

[@AethenTheProotTheSecond]

Hewo fenrir :3

[@michaelgarcia4035]

I mean, they literally are sword stand-ins in that modern Romeo and Juliet movie

[@Baalur]

They also fulfill the same role as swords did historically. Both swords and pistols are secondary weapons that you fall back on when all else fails. Both can also be a kind of status symbol allthough this isn't quite as much the case for pistols anymore.

[@justalurker3489]

They ARE modern swords: secondary weapons that are significantly more convenient to carry around. In military uses they're associated with officers (or at least used to be), and have uses as a civilian defensive weapon. They're "heroic" because of their connections to the idealized military officer, and in media they make sense because they can be carried around plausibly, and their reduced capabilities don't matter because it's fiction.

[@JohnPeacekeeper]

Sidearms in general have a good hero look since they always carry them

[@gameragodzilla]

Pistol primaries are appealing for the same reason swords are often the primary weapon in melee games, despite spears (like rifles) being superior battlefield weapons. Carrying a pistol or a sword is much more convenient for day to day life than a rifle or a spear, so for someone who just wants to be armed for self defense (something that's carried often and used very rarely), the convenience overrides firepower. But that also means it's your only weapon if something does happen, which makes people want to get proficient with them.

[@RyuTheAsian47]

Pistols are actually a primary weapon in the United States for civilians who choose to conceal carry a weapon, laws permitting. There's also been a shift in the culture of concealed carry in the United States from ultra reliable duty pistols, i.e. standard Glock 17's with no internal parts change, to things like the Roland Special type builds or Staccatos in an effort to squeeze as much performance out of a handgun against an unknown adversary

[@waffel7664]

Only change is really the proliferation of cheap reliable pistol dots. Vast majority of people don't carry comps/lights/2011's still.

[@Razor-gx2dq]

Difference is that they are deployed as a defensive weapon not an offensive weapon

[@yungpark6435]

somebody seems to be a fan of brass facts

[@CharliMorganMusic]

Pistols hold the same place as swords-they're secondary weapons thst people want to use bc they're cool status symbols.

[@dascommissar5264]

The main reason I like to use pistols in games is ammo availability. You’ll *always* find pistol rounds, if it doesn’t just have infinite reloads.

[@HQ_Default]

A lot of games actually just have the pistol do more damage than a rifle round (assuming we're comparing them to full-auto rifles), by logic of "Semi Auto guns require more owie per shot"

[@alephkasai9384]

Do more damage, but more bullet drop and damage falloff It's pretty standard way to do it yeah. Though some games with armour systems can have pistol calibers do about the same or more damage but have less penetration ultimately leading to less damage against armoured opponents.

[@noobguy9973]

You also forgot duel wielding. From Mad max and Killing floor to Trepang 2 and Payday 2, going akimbo is a viable choice in these games and most only allow pistols or small SMG's to be duel wielded only.

[@jacksongoodman3625]

Um Mad Max doesn’t have duel wielding

[@kirbyis4ever]

​@@jacksongoodman3625I'll compensate for him: another Max game, Max Payne, does allow it for duelies.

[@jacksongoodman3625]

@@kirbyis4ever no no he put mad max not max payne

[@akusav333]

@@jacksongoodman3625 I automatically thought about Max Payne instead of Mad Max. He definetly slipped his tongue

[@jacksongoodman3625]

@@akusav333 I played through the entirety of mad max and there ain’t no way to duel wield

[@DarthCody700]

A really underrated pistol primary was running the Tac45 in BO2 as a primary, with the pick 10 system, you could use your lack of primary to kit out the secondary and take extra perks or equipment, and the Tac45 was a perfectly viable primary at close range with good aim.

[@ticket2space]

Brother...? Is that you?

[@codyharney2997]

I agree but I ran the 5-7 with long barrel. Best match was a nuke on containers just 5-7

[@Alpha.Phenix]

I know of at least one pistol with 30 round extended mags...it is the Five Seven though, so have fun filling those mags.

[@thejuggercat]

Glocks have 33 rounders (haven't watched the video yet so if it's mentioned ignore me)

[@vampire847]

@@thejuggercat The p320, m9, mac10/11 style pistols, and the B&T USW A1 are the ones I know of that also have 30 rounders

[@Jester4460]

@@thejuggercatthere is another

[@user-ro9zf9kz1h]

@@thejuggercatI think the Glock has a 50 round drum. Correct me if I’m wrong.

[@kingezekiel125]

​@@user-ro9zf9kz1h And a 100 round double drum

[@thedesignerblacksmith5953]

Nice you mentioned the VP-70 here but for your idea, WW2 literally proved that what you need is a simple SMG that can be produced fast rather than a pistol. Sten, MP3008, M3, PPS-43. All major countries have SMG that can be cranked out as fast as possible

[@0lionheart]

The Liberator pistol was the same concept; a cheap, disposable pistol you give to civilians to kill an enemy and take their weapon. Didn't work then, no surprise it didn't work for the VP-70. Like you say, just make a Sten for the same price and cut a step out.

[@ShakyBakey]

@@0lionheart It's less that it "didn't work" and more that the logistics of deploying them to captured civilians or resistance was incredibly hard to coordinate, that difficulty would have been the main issue with providing other more practical arms to civilians or resistance in captured enemy land as well. It wasn't the weapon that was the issue, and any invading army or occupying force would have hell in their hands if they were forced to occupy a heavily civilian armed country like the USA. To the point that most countries with invasion plans for the USA don't include occupation and instead would prefer to glass it after winning a conventional war as holding it would simply be an impossible task. The even simpler reality is, finding a single, isolated soldier with superior arms to ambush in the first place is the hard part...And that could simply be done with numbers, or a kitchen knife...which has the added benefit of not making a loud "bANG HEY THERE'S TROUBLE OVER HERE GUYS" noise when you do what you have to do.

[@LeftistMuslimGynocracy]

i cant believe they added the wii zapper as a primary weapon to ready or not

[@PedroElPolako]

love every video that uses gameplay from Vegas 2, still unmatched tactical lite games.

[@civilianuseonly]

The last good Rainbow Six

[@0lionheart]

@@civilianuseonly what's truly sad is that Siege's terrorist hunt, before it got broken and removed, genuinely was a step up. Enemies didn't spawn in clumps of 5 around you. No regenerating health. Genuinely good enemy AI. Great gun feel and impacts. Just needed an open loadout and friendly AI to be a really good successor but instead they binned it all for eSports PVP

[@phulam3458]

in Payday 2, when you mask up, you always pull out your handgun first, or whatever weapon you have in the "secondary" slot, but still mostly handguns or the Judge, this makes me think that handguns in this game are the actual primary weapons

[@HalfWolf2]

I have noted that, I think the more likely reason is that your secondary is often better suited for stealth or close quarters, if you're putting on the mask in front of an enemy, I doubt there's a lot of depth to that as a feature

[@Wally_Bally]

I do believe the default control configuration for the pc version is to have the 1 key as your pistol and your 2 key as your “primary.” So this checks out

[@Cam64viper]

I love using pistols in games! As you can tell by profile lol. They are always overlooked. Great vid!

[@redcell9636]

the MK23 SOCOM is not just chambered for run of the mil .45 ACP; it is meant to handle higher pressure ammunition as well, such as .45 SUPER and still be somewhat quiet with a suppressor.

[@Stunzeed76]

Interestingly the offensive handgun concept kind of still is alive. All these dudes rolling with a Stacatto that’s heavy and likely comped for little recoil doubly so if you have good technique, 20-24 round magazines, crisp light triggers that rival rifle triggers, running large window red dots like an SRO, and high candela lights like an x300T that can PID out real far. For an LEO running this, this is their lifeline and likely their primary right there.

[@KeptYouWaiting1]

Video starts at 13:26

[@stefani.5737]

Rule of cool. It just feels right. Especially when akimbo.

[@joaquimbonazza6686]

shame you didnt touch on the concept of magnum pistols

[@hunterhess8433]

While it's possible, sure, it's highly unrealistic.

[@Jester4460]

@@hunterhess8433I always conceal carry my 500 smw

[@sijul6483]

​@@Jester4460 "is that a 500 smw in your pants or are you happy to see me?" I'll see myself out.

[@ShakyBakey]

​@@hunterhess8433 Uhh, what part of it is unrealistic? Plenty of them exist and people use them all the time just for fun. FBI statistics show most pistol rounds take around 4-5 hits to actually stop someone. While .357 magnum stopped 80% of people shot by it a SINGLE TIME in their tracks and dropped them to the ground.... Anyways, my .460 rowland with the ballistics of a .44 magnum in a semi automatic 1911 says you're wrong.

[@happyhaunter_5546]

"Primary weapon" is a *little* misleading when talking the Mauser C-96 in regards to discussing cavalry/officers/logistics/artillery crew personnel where their primary PURPOSE isn't front line combat. They're not taking a pistol over a rifle as a primary weapon; their taking a pistol because their job doesn't facilitate them carrying a service rifle. The Hk Mk 23 is the only "offensive weapons system" and thus actually intended "primary" weapon that was discussed here; but even still, it was intended to serve specialized warfighters whose primary job was not front line combat, so, again, it is not necessarily being chosen OVER a service rifle. I also don't know where you're getting that the Mk 23 is the most notable "primary" pistol used in combat when the Colt Single Action Army exists.

[@graysnake8585]

Everytime, pistols are the primary weapon of most Metal Gear protagonist

[@NafedalbiFilms]

Trepang2 my beloved...

[@nah_bro_really]

I'd like to add one more note to this. Handguns work in video games where the ranges are basically point-blank, by modern standards. While it's possible in a few games like Cyberpunk or Fallout to attempt to employ handguns at very long ranges, this is a quirk of their design; most of the time, in both of those games, ranges are < 50 meters. If the handguns are anything like at all realistic in their behavior, especially in terms of aiming stability, then they're not very effective past about 30 meters, just like they are IRL. Games like Counter Strike have players treating handguns like laser pointers, especially on the first shot (the famous Deagle Sniper meta). This isn't realistic, but none of the rest of the game is realistic, either, so it's fine. Ready or Not features real-world scenarios that practically always occur in buildings, so handguns also make some sense, although most of the time, a SMG in .45 is probably the best answer. But when you're playing, say, ARMA, a handgun is obviously the worst choice almost all of the time, and a SMG is better, but not as good as a rifle, just like the real world. Where things get fuzzy and the argument is interesting is games like Far Cry, where a large-caliber handgun can perform about as well as a rifle, and the only thing holding it back from identical performance is the semi-auto fire, higher recoil per round, the lack of a powerful scope, and the low capacity. These are all things that limit handguns IRL, too, with perhaps the exception of semi-auto (since IRL most soldiers are trained to avoid using automatic / burst except in a few situations).

[@JohnPeacekeeper]

One interesting thing about spec ops teams like the Navy Seals using pistols because of their size while being relatively effective and quiet harkens back to when swords were also sidearms. If you look at the actual ninjas, for example, the ninjato was an ideal weapon because it was a shortsword.

[@ringoreddo308]

Modern gun manufacturers discover pistol carabines.

[@Azra_Fox]

Ngl, the Raider X is a super cool gun they added to ready or not, I just dont know why it was labeled an SMG. Its really just a glorified Roni kit. And unlike in other games, you cant fire this one full auto.

[@harveyknguyen]

i mean SMG is the closest thing that describes it out of "assault rifle", "SMG" and "shotgun"

[@aceofspades0074]

My personal favorite is probably the blacktail from resident evil (2004 classic) looked pretty slick.

[@f.b.l.9813]

in Dead Space, the first and only weapon you need is the starting weapon which acts as the game's pistol type weapon.

[@Prizm17]

2:42 a wooden stock that also doubles as a case to hold the weapon if you’ll notice on the one he shows there’s a line and hinge towards the butt that flips open and holds the gun and I think a few stripper clips

[@Umbra_Nocturnus]

My favourite primary pistol is probably in Ghost Recon Breakpoint, where they let you put a 30 round mag in a 1911.

[@BlazingOwnager]

I still have fond memories of the first Deus Ex, which let me pistol-primary the entire campaign. The first game like that, honestly.

[@pendantblade6361]

Handguns are a primary arm in survival horror games tho.

[@nopenoperson9118]

One of my proudest Tarkov moments was taking three geared PMCs on Woods to the KIA screen with me having nothing but a Chiappa Rhino 200DS in double action in my hands as well as every one of my pockets. I felt like Meryl Stryfe lmao

[@somerandomdragon4655]

handgun rounds out of handgun length barrels dont go fast enough to generate a temporary wound cavity, which limits effectiveness. 357 or 10mm out of a PCC might generate a small cavity but rifles still have more hemorrhaging/trauma power

[@immikeurnot]

[Laughs in shotgun.]

[@ShakyBakey]

@@immikeurnot [ laughs in ability to pierce plate carrier, bigger wound channels from basic rifles, higher fire rate as well as capacity ]

[@PurpleBossonius]

Buuuuuuuut, pistols don't shoot spitzers meaning you can just put hollow point, ez problem solved

[@somerandomdragon4655]

@@PurpleBossonius lack of armor penetratoin

[@PurpleBossonius]

@@somerandomdragon4655armor penetrating is not as important as you think, even if it fails to penetrate armor, the impact would still temporarily incapacitate the target, and that is good enough sometimes.

[@FrostM04]

Wow. Love that Splinter Cell Blacklist song in the background. Great video mate!

[@simulacra7885]

This is VERY ahoy, and very good. Good work.

[@kolper6799]

Pistol primaries actually are much more ancient concept than it seems. First muzzleload firearms were much more ranged than their accuracy allowed to effectilvy use, witch means that you could get away with carrying few one shot flintlocks increcing your firepower at small cost of range. Note that weight was not an issue as soldiers of a time wore no heavy armour, or might've been on the back of the horse like nobles or dragoons. There is actually more to earliest firearms when it comes to handgun vs longgun things but fact that you could clop on to enemy, clap on the enemy and clop off the front was biggest equaliser. Horse+kirasa+8 flintlocks on your belt and chest=fun

[@OfficialDJSoru]

I tend to keep medium to low caliber handguns in Payday 2 as secondary for the very reason you mentioned near the end. In that game, high dealing weapons tend to have the worst ammo pickup rate compared to low damage ones, so a semi auto pistol with a large mag that I can dump the entire contents into a Bulldozer and with luck, NOT have to reload before the Dozer goes down is a godsend, and when running shotgun builds on primary, it's a safer choice for dealing with snipers. On average pistols in games that don't really have major bullet drop mechanics or effective range limits turn into jack-of-all-trades for all ranges.

[@uncivilized_caveman]

"one of the first documented cases of a pistol being used as a primary weapon" *laughs in Texas Rangers and the red river war*

[@immikeurnot]

Pistol as a primary(ish) for cavalry goes back to the flintlock days.

[@uncivilized_caveman]

@@immikeurnot ima say not in the same way lol. Flintlock days you were definitely not using your pistol as a primary. You were using your blade, whether it be a saber or pike as primary. If for any reason you have to pull your flintlock, it’s because shit got too close for comfort and you won’t be able to use it again until you dismount or become stationary. The red river war (or Indian wars at large really) mark the actual short lived jump from melee cavalry to ranged cavalry which used pistols and occasionally lever action rifles, which could be actioned with one hand becoming the primary weapon in an attempt to dominate Native American guerilla tactics which relied on bows and arrows to maintain distance from the American cavalry. They’re incredibly distinct use cases and in the case of the latter event, the pistol was ACTUALLY the primary. Not an emergency backup

[@immikeurnot]

@@uncivilized_caveman I'm pretty sure they would use the pistols for skirmishing and a saber/lance for closer work.

[@uncivilized_caveman]

@@immikeurnot strangely enough, not really. Horseback plus (most commonly) smooth bore pistols did not make for good ranged weapons. Melee was a given in most cavalry exchanges (since their purpose was to break the enemy lines) and the pistol was far more of a counter weapon if another cavalryman got too close. But again. You only get to use it once since you can’t reload horseback. This changed specifically because of American cavalry and their six shot rifled pistols which could be reloaded in theory on horseback in a short amount of time. It was also born of a unique situation where the enemy very intentionally never got close enough for traditional pike. Making a ranged horseback weapon a necessity for the American situation specifically. Eventually this would obviously spread to the rest of the world but it would be more so with rifles and even then it was short lived with WW1 all but killing off the standardized cavalryman.

[@saltypotato42]

I love pistol in games, especially in horror games.

[@brosefmalkovitch3121]

While not being actually that effective IRL(compared to rifles at least), the pistol retains its cult of personality around it in part due to the difficulty in using them as mentioned so they are seen as more 'skill-reliant' weapons but also probably due to how pistols have historically been the weapon of the nobility and the upper echelons of society, a person carrying a handgun is usually someone important or cool. This has also been pretty prevalent in media, think John Wick or any of the John Woo movies. Long-arms might make brief appearances but handguns are always the star of the show.

[@zulik9831]

a gun that has the actual potential to be a primary weapon is the FK BRNO PSD, a high power good range 7.5mm pistol, the only bad thing is that it is expensive

[@asteroidrules]

The game Receiver 2 very accurately sums up the concept of primary and secondary arms by comparing pistols to swords and rifles to spears. Rifles and spears are generally superior weapons to pistols and swords, they have greater range, greater wounding potential, and are even easier to use. The problem is that an officer, diplomat, specialist, etc. will generally find it impractical to carry a rifle or spear, but can't go fully unarmed either, they thus need weapons with which they can defend themselves. This makes for situations where people will have to trust their life to weapons that they know are outclassed, and thus put a great amount of time and effort into developing proficiency with those weapons. Max Payne 3 made a clever attempt at portraying the advantages and disadvantages of carrying a long gun versus pistols, in that game you have holsters for two pistols, but no ability to stow a long gun. The long guns all have superior damage and range to the handguns, but require both hands to use and one hand to carry when not in use. This gives a sense of the long gun weighing you down, while the pistols can be holstered to free up your hands, of course it also has Hollywood style dual-wielding of pistols which is totally impractical in real life but another reason for the popularity of handguns as primary arms in video games.

[@Greglag_Goose]

i came for the name of the gun in the thumbnail, i satyed for the everythign else

[@IndieLambda]

All this with no mention of hand cannons? Desert Eagle, Python, Golden Gun, ETC... cause for exemple, in Halo CE, in the player's spawning loadout, the rifle is the player's side arm and the pistol is his main work horse, by design, that was intentional, the pistol was intended to be the heavy duty precision weapon, and it was amazing.

[@CommandantLennon]

Video games often like to play into Guns As Art, both in design and utilization, and there's absolutely no better piece of firearm artistry than a nice pistol. Despite the fact that the engravings give you no tactical advantage whatsoever.

[@mastervintorez5038]

The author missed quite a few additional points. He remembered the VP-70, but completely ignored the APS, which was used by USSR pilots. Its main feature is a fully automatic firing mode, and the APB modification even has a silencer. Well, we must not forget about special-purpose pistols. Revolvers are great for hunting small animals (even in games), and special forces use pistols like the PSS Vul to silently eliminate the enemy.

[@theodorehazel6920]

the vp70 was ahead of its time by miles

[@immikeurnot]

Yep. It was a Hi Point before Hi Point was cool.

[@Vladimir_4757]

A lot of pre wwii revolvers and pistols that used stocks and long barrels. I’ve never seen a revolver rifle in a video game so I’m not sure if any game has had revolver rifles. I want to see more pre wwii pistol carbines and revolver rifles. The Mateba MTR08 and Mateba Unica 6 had revolver rifle variants too

[@phantom4E2]

5:27 this also reminds me of another cheap and reliable handgun, the famous ghetto blaster C9

[@justgunsolid]

Pistols with stock, to bridge the gap as a primary. Nature is healing. I once saw a picture a Belgian CTU, a plate carrier with just 2 P90 magazines and other accessories but still agile. That's plenty for a passive kit, I would imagine the same would apply for 9mm 30 rounders, you may have to carry more mags but the mags take less space (still lesser than what a P90 mag would take). A small sling backpack can provide enough space and capacity to carry a pistol primary like Flux Raider kit with spare mags to make the round count rivaling the standard STANAG high-speed low-drag kits. It won't perform like rifles, but it won't stick out like trying to carry a rifle. I'd always thought VP70 stock was an afterthought, nice to know. B&T USW A-1 made an appearance in this video but doesn't have a videogame showcase (the only thing I could think of was Resident Evil Village). It's a nice gun, iirc I think it predate Flux Raider kit for P320 and was marketed to law enforcement than military. It's an interesting approach to Flux Raider where USW A-1 sits on a pistol that could be a primary-side, whereas Flux Raider sits on a PDW-ish piece that could be a pistol. With the recent Flux Raider kit for SIG P365, that seems to hit closer what HKVP70 could have been, especially for civilians.

[@civilianuseonly]

The VP70 walked so pistol chassis could run

[@ticket2space]

Why did people take the broom handle as a primary? Because it's the coolest thing anyone's ever seen. The real question is... Why did anyone make another gun AFTER the broom handle?

[@immikeurnot]

The VP70's barrel is designed with oversize grooves, which ends up downgrading the 9mm to .380 ACP power levels. I have a Flux Raider, one of my friends liked it enough to buy one. Sig Sauer sells 30 round sticks that work great in them. I really wish the version used in RoN used 30s instead of 21s. Pistols are also important to special forces types because of concealability. Those guys aren't always wearing uniforms when they're out doing their thing, and even an MP-7 gets kind of hard to conceal. I know the SAS had extended mags for their Brownings in the '80s.

[@That1OneKobold2]

I'll give an example why it's good in Isonzo, it's WW1, and people aren't bullet sponges, people didn't have body armor, just a uniform, so if you shoot a guy in the chest twice, they're probably gonna die.

[@icommitdie8756]

“Pistols aren’t a viable primary weapon!” mfs when I whip out a revolver and my coin purse:

[@samduffy7628]

Love the sawn off shotgun as a good in between primary and secondary

[@BaconPuncakesX]

10:07 Homefront: The Revolution makes VERY good use of this idea.

[@noobguy9973]

11:59 that was a bit of an opsie :P

[@icarusgaming6269]

Submitted title for DeArrow: The history of pistols as primary weapons in the military, and why they don't work in video games Reason: Misleading Thumbnail: 4:24 I would also have included the notoriously banned 5.7x28mm armor piercing round that was known to have rifle-like penetration capabilities in a pistol cartridge. There's been a lot of fetishization over the Five-seveN in general, but it's that specific round that fixed some of the ballistic limitations

[@jeremiahthompson9367]

Five and 6 shot revolvers were invented decades before the first viable repeating rifles; at best you had two shots with a double barrel followed by a looooooong reload, vs 5 or six, with some models incorporating a captive cylinder retention pin, so you could carry multiple extra cylinders and reload in 10 seconds or less.

[@WoodEe-zq6qv]

Your script writing style does not match your delivery.

[@Sesm1c]

The Koch in H&K is pronounced like the brand name Coke as stated on their website. 4:22

[@stevenbobbybills]

His pronunciation is about halfway between the "English" pronunciation listed on the website and the actual German pronunciation.

[@petersmythe6462]

One thing I could see that would dramatically increase the effectiveness of your low velocity large caliber type handguns is different round types. Right, nothing a sensibly sized rifle can dish out will compare in energy to .45 ACP *Minengeschoss*

[@thememester1190]

Not including the smart-pistol from Titanfall 2 feels like a crime.

[@howtomundane3109]

The Smart Piss is not an acceptable weapon to use.

[@NorroTaku]

Its an awesome invention called a *"submachinegun"*

[@2copy3copy4cpoy]

been playing a lot of Project Zomboid lately. its depiction of aiming as a skill is pretty ass-backwards (pistols being fundamentally easier to use than longarms) but that just means it's great for pistol-enjoyer gunslinger types.

[@amhuman5138]

based PZ enjoyer

[@PeninsulaCity2024]

Reminds me when a certian Slovenia-based guntuber asked which gun would be the primary weapon if you had a loadout consisting of an MP5 paired with a .50 AE Desert Eagle.

[@thedesignerblacksmith5953]

Polenar? But yes, as a joke, if you're make out of metal plate, then that would do. Otherwise, not like you would survive half of 9mm mag

[@stringsandsprockets7845]

glock 19, threaded barrel, compensator or suppressor, red dot, 33 round stick and recover tactical brace= SMG that can be turned into CCW in a mere minute or so.

[@perspicacity89]

Finally, you're back.

[@arforafro5523]

Easy solution for videogames, double dip into the unrealistic. Handgun as a secondary?, you get a pistol, Handgun as a primary?, you get akimbos baby.

[@sunnycat69]

It's smallest pdw on market 💚 love mine

[@diveninenewton]

i use a airsoft beretta with full auto and drum mag as my airsoft primary

[@thedesignerblacksmith5953]

I though this was a video specifically on video game. Well, real life is okay too. The only time I see pistol specifically shine over submachine gun and rifle is in CSGO. How so? The CZ-75 high rate of fire, meaning that you can put more round to the enemy than normal SMG or rifle. This balance the low damage of pistol round when compare to rifle. Put as I learn about this tactic from a semi-pro, that means not everyone is okay with that, and in fact, to really use the higher rate of fire, the range has to be point blank. So still a hard chance for pistol to really shine as primary.

[@angelsaxon6499]

Don’t forget 5.7 as well, that round is pretty spooky for a pistol round, a lot more bite than bark. And it’s only getting more and more popular… 👀

[@lukemccullough9279]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Combat Evolved

[@spivel]

please make more of these i love you

[@jackspade5316]

The .45 statistically isn't better at stopping than the 9mm, and while neither is great at penetration, the 9mm is better. SOCOM chose the .45 because normal loads are nearly subsonic, so you can create subsonic loads that don't appreciably sacrifice performance. This is important for a pistol that was going to be used with a suppressor as often as not.

[@bananaboye3759]

Surprised to get through this whole video with hardly any mention of the deagle, which I feel is one of the most commonly primaried handguns in FPS

[@hawklp9150]

13:20 How can you mention problems with pistols concerning ballistics, range, magazine capacity, poor penetration against body armor and recoil without mentioning the 5.7×28mm round and the FN Five-seveN? Anyways cool video idea, great presentation!

[@kirbyis4ever]

The Five-seveN is basically cheating since its using unobtanium Belgian space magic bullets! But it would have been nice to hear him go over it in details. 20 rounds crammed in there is kinda nuts.

[@hawklp9150]

@@kirbyis4ever I don't understand why the Belgians of all people are on space mage level when it comes to making good handguns. I mean, I'm German, we have great gun manufacturers. But FN's guns just have that certain something that always fascinates me. I'd certainly like to see more guns chambered in that caliber.

[@ForOne814]

5.7 still has poor penetration against body armor. It's only good against soft body armor. And it's a tradeoff, the cartridge's terminal ballistics suffer from the choices made to achieve such results. From what I've read Russian armor-piercing 9x18, 9x19 and 9x21 cartridges achieve similar results on armor while also retaining decent performance in the flesh. Although the effective range is lower.

[@madspooks]

​@@ForOne814This. The 5.7 penetration is wildly mythologized. You are not penetrating armor plates with a 5.7 pistol and AP rounds. Not even with a P90.

[@hawklp9150]

@@madspooks just because 5.7×28mm can't penetrate armor plates doesn't mean it isn't a good round. From what I've heard the round can still penetrate armor till level IIIA.

[@intecrisis]

Stalker mentioned (also lol that your gun jammed)

[@LordRazer3]

You are either flexing or your a sniper with an x8 scope. Granted I've done both.

[@bleepingbunny4446]

you can never talk about the socom without mentioning metal gear at least once lol

[@1111Tactical]

Hopefully I'll be getting a Flux Raider for my 320 soon. So cool.

[@alan3940]

Best pistol in gaming is definitely the plasma cutter in dead space

[@petersmythe6462]

I think where you'd likely see realistic handguns used is in survival or GTA type games with gritty realistic inventory sizes. If carrying a rifle is just not stealthy and takes too much space, and good enough short range shot placement with a handgun can still take down an enemy, why bother with the big bulky rifle?

[@lyca0n535]

Main reason for a pistol primary is insurgent or concealment related. I would advise looking into the myanmar portable industrial line manufactured glock clones and FGC carbines they use for equipping loyalists and their conversions are used heavily in urban areas in myanmar with little concern for discarding replacing craftmade weapons similar to gangland hits while increasing the overall stockpile the democratic army professional forces get those arms siezed during frequent assassinations across the entire country stretch occupation to every village to prevent assassination OR if that becomes too costly they isolate forces to their barracks or rural areas where the arms/equipment seized during these actions is used for concealed mortar/drone strikes and ambushes IRA style. Che geuvara loved the sawn off shotty and the DIY grenade/molly launchers imrovised from them for this reason, essentially combining the accessibility of a hunting weapon that's nearly everywhere (1960's so product of the times before this wasn't the case) with his practical experience of bombing the shit out of places or ordering hits. In the middle east the disgusting level of accessibility to firearms makes this pointless as a akSU or any soviet dump marakov can fill this role but in nations that haven't been the proxy campaign of yanks and soviets for nearly a half a century we may see demand by urban geurillas for PDW conversions within the upcoming decades due to the availabilty provided in handguns by both sides of it from the drug war If we are talking non paramilitary though your video points out that since the 40's spec forces have better options available if they need concealment with better firepower. Example of infamy being the cut down uzis of the Secret service and embassy staff implemented during Reagan, mp7's of most spec forces and god knows how many Gunsmithed SMG's they get made in europe. Vast majority of those that would seek to convert a pistol into a primary are either police legally restricted by not being able to justify a occupational garrisons loadout or civilians these days. Just some food for thought if you were to equip a group like the resistance in half life, MTF's in a apocalyptic world or any other faction with recommended loadouts in the future as availability and stockpile is the NO 1 issue for any group that need's to mobilize universally. Having a police armory or train people with siezed arms and their own 100000 9mm munitions stockpile can be better for a group needing fire supremacy,equiping civilians or assassinations short term than 100 armalites and a standing army trained by a group halfway across the globe

[@pyeitme508]

Heck yeah, anyways hope u make vids about night vision devices & even ammo options.

[@Stuntman175]

Don't know if the explanation for the VP70 being similar to the C96 makes sense... The C96 was designed in 1895 and the VP70 in 1969, 74 years apart from each other. Any designer that would have worked on the C96 would be at least 90 years old. Paul Mauser himself worked on the C96 and he died in 1914... At 74 years old.

[@scunthorpe5513]

Doctrinally completely different. The VP70 is closer in doctrine to the liberator pistols during ww2. The similarities between the mauser and the VP70 seem completely superficial.

[@aefad]

I mean pistols are just cooler sometimes

[@garryli2030]

Bro you didn't mention that Walther MPL Machinepistol. I feel that was the real"Volksmachinepistol"

[@Sir-Prizse]

Great video, well done!

[@therandomscout6590]

Okay, now talk about revolvers

[@deleteduser3455]

The thing is pistols look cool but they are always inferior to rifles and shotguns

[@azalkathegunpowderdragon9439]

No, they brought back the VP in the us, i have the vp9 and its a very nice pistol for $600

[@pinkeypie1966]

Check out the Stechkin automatic pistol, rsh 12, LeMat, CZ-75, etc. Love to see a part two....