Civilization 7's BIGGEST Problem

[@GnosticAtheist]

I will do what I always do. Wait until the game is completed and on sale in a package. If it never gets cheap enough, I will never play it. Its very easy.

[@allenzelt4481]

It took nearly 3 years for the final gameplay expansion pack for Civ 6, and for two years after that they were still releasing leader packs. So I expect that to be worse for Civ 7... maybe come 2030 it'll be worth paying for.

[@bluerendar2194]

@@allenzelt4481 I'll just be "demoing" it beyond a fair price that'll I pay for.

[@madcatlover7554]

That’s what I did for CIV 6

[@Jack_Gibby]

Why stop there? Buy the game and DLC using a Steam key

[@kotzpenner]

Thank God I waited with buying Beyond Earth, will be the same here. Friend basically got scammed into preordering lol

[@peterfodor7656]

Can't wait for Civilization 8 where only the ancient era will be included with the game and every age from then will have its own season pass with an age pack, a cosmetic pack, a leader pack, a map pack and wonders pack.

[@philipramsden4975]

😂 don't give them any ideas

[@matthew7073]

No no no, you have it wrong. Civ 8 will allow for you to choose how to start the world either big bang or creation and then lock everything behind paywalls

[@awtqrtrkjsrs]

B-but it will have 40 civs base game! (You can only have 5 civs in the game at once because of a stupid player cap and civ switching)

[@GabiN64]

and the AI will still be crap. basically farmville at this point

[@Jondiceful]

Or they'll just make a subscription game. Like we need another subscription in our lives.

[@Volkmannx]

I'm going to do what I do best - procrastinate.

[@nickjeffery536]

I am intending to procrastinate as well, but maybe tomorrow...

[@kotzpenner]

Laziness often pays off

[@kineticstar]

I'm gonna wait for a humble bundle!

[@mixingcat5213]

About two or three years civ 7 with every dlc will gonna be under 30 bucks with discount and that's the perfect time.

[@alosha4321]

Gatekeeping 8 whole civilizations behind the founders edition is criminal

[@PMMagro]

What crime is that?

[@sionbarzad5371]

1st degree crime

[@preppen78]

Let them. Just cements my disinterest in the game.

[@FrankJ222]

@@preppen78 Yep same here

[@usernametaken5619]

Highway robbery for sure!

[@cecarter10]

This has 2K written all over it.

[@tsuna666]

Yeah, 2K has been doing this for a decade.

[@KnightofAges]

2K being the final full price of the game + all DLCs....

[@Hungryboi-ey1ct]

@@KnightofAgeswe suffer together

[@antokarman2064]

I dread the time when they implement something like vbucks in the civ series

[@justinjames2436]

Better than EA

[@Draconisrex1]

I'm 63. I was in graduate school when I picked up Civilization. I have played every single one of the main line plus Alpha Centuari and Beyond Earth. I think I'm done. There comes a point in time when you come to the conclusion I'm not being nickled-and-dimed to death, but out-right exploited. At this point I pretty much only buy Indi games because they're mostly made by people who love to make games and the money is only there so they can make the next game and not buy the shareholders another golden palace.

[@RobBCactive]

Yeah, I bought Civ2 on a deal as a box set which had extra content on CDs. You know what? Like so often I never played the extra stuff, the basic game was more than enough. When I tried Civ6 without the DLC on sale it literally wasn't playing like the game content creators had and I lost interest.

[@Antonio-lt1sp]

@@Draconisrex1 same here. Or get complete (and fixed) games at sales. I don't care about playing the latest stuff anymore. Yesterday I started playing The Witcher 3 - almost 10 years after its release - and I'm having a lot of fun.

[@bmardiney]

I’ve also been playing since Civ 1, though I was just a kid. I’m done as well. Civ 5 was the high point, it’s been downhill from there. Harriet Tubman is the final nail in this ridiculous coffin.

[@eqGismo]

Agreed, played every civ game, ac, be and colonization. I was already skeptical when the first announcements came out but this is too much. In the end, I've arrived at the same conclusion as you. Won't preorder, won't buy on release. Maybe in a few years, when I can buy all content at an acceptable price...

[@M24071]

Yeah that's why i switched to Old World it's so good it very much feels like civilization but it's from a small indie company i highly recommend it

[@antondzajajurca7797]

I love Civ to death. I'll be getting Civ7 in 2030 .

[@JayGarrickFlash]

Get it for 1/16th the price. Smart. Civ 6 has enough content to keep us occupied till then anyways!

[@antondzajajurca7797]

@@JayGarrickFlash This is how I bought Civ6. Played Civ5 till the prices dropped for Civ6, four years later and then bought rest of dlc's last year. :D

[@craigfriot3384]

You only have one life. And it's slipping away. Why wait until 2030 to buy the game on sale? You'll spend twice that at a restaurant for an experience that lasts 30 minutes.

[@HiLoMusic]

Cool, I'm sorry that the prospect of spending 40 bucks less for you is worth waiting years for lmao. I'll just buy it and play it,

[@andrek6920]

​@@craigfriot3384People like you are the reason this is even a discussion in the first place. Will pay full price immediately no matter what because youve apparently got nothing better to do with your life. Theres more games than you could ever play in your lifetime and you think people are missing out by waiting to buy civ 7 lmao? Nah, theyre spending their time more wisely, by working less to get more content with less bugs and issues. All while getting a better experience in the meanwhile in other more complete games.

[@MHMichaelHooper]

So the biggest complaint they wanted to solve was "Civ late game isnt fun." So they just removed it?

[@ginkamikaze2]

They moved it behind a paywall so paypigs appreciate their kindness in fleecing the players for content that was previously free... it's just "aggressive monetization" at it's finest XD

[@JavierSalcedoC]

And if you disagree you're a bigot😂😂😂😂😂

[@Mankorra_Gomorrah]

The fact that they are selling alternative skins for your leaders is actually really worrying me. It’s iffy when live service free to play games charge you $5 for a top hat but having firaxis sell me early 2000s aqua core Abe Lincoln for $10 just doesn’t feel right after I’ve paid for the whole game.

[@TLhikan]

My ability to gaslight myself into thinking 7 will be good is starting to fail.

[@LigeVerloR]

He has me questioning everything...

[@jimbob8840]

It'll be good is six years when you can buy all the content for $50 on sale

[@mathhews95]

​@@jimbob8840 basically the same as civ6 then

[@kevinkrug466]

I want it to be good so badly... but I'm worried

[@llamingo696]

Maybe in 3 years it will become a good game

[@otz111]

Compared to what Larian just did with the Baldur’s Gate free content drop, this is highway robbery

[@rodh1404]

Larian is currently a major exception to the rule. And to be fair, giving away more free content when you have already provided something that provides great value for money shouldn't be expected. Although I note Stardew Valley still gets very regular updates even after all these years as well. The Civilization team have previously provided all their DLCs in a pack that is offered at a massive discount compared to buying each pack individually. Compared to many other games that have lots of DLC, that's a lot better than what they do. Still nowhere near as good as what Larian or ConcernedApe do for their customers, but it's far better than the industry norm.

[@HiLoMusic]

You cannot expect every company to operate as Larian has - this is the fucking problem with you people. They were given such a fucking lucky break to develop at their own rate, with a massive budget backed via kickstarter and early access, and with no third party pressuring release. THIS IS NOT THE NORM! You cannot function under this pretense for any other game besides Larian, otherwise you are being extremely ignorant.

[@otz111]

@@rodh1404 “The rule” hasn’t existed that long - this is something you’ve been tricked into believing, probably because you’re young. It wasn’t until a few years after App Store was invented, less than 10 years ago, that companies realized they could do incremental up-charges and micro-transactions. For most of video game history, we got a full game when we bought it. Yes, there were expansion packs, but for the most part you got a complete game and then the expansions weren’t 3x a year; they were more like a couple over 2-4 years. I think studios like Larian can change things because there’s so much negativity for games that gouge like this. But things will never change if you just accept it for what it is.

[@chrisjackson1215]

@@rodh1404 How far we've fallen. Yes, it should be expected. What *shouldn't* be expected is for games to be released with cut or incomplete content that is then finished and added back in later. Larian may have done something rare, but even what they did is something that no Dev should be doing to begin with. You're praising a company for finally finishing a product and giving it to you "free of charge" after selling you the unfinished product a year beforehand and sitting on your interest. Those kinds of statements are why companies can keep pushing and pushing to see how far they can screw you over in the first place.

[@kingpaddy9009]

@@rodh1404 tbh Eric is well off with the Stardew Sales (I doubled down on this because i bought 4 or 5 times, imagine it is a really good present for people who only casually play games, they love it immediately) but he is such a lovely guy I would pay again 20€ for a DLC he is programming only for him to have his best life.

[@galvendorondo]

If they have the audacity to charge for the fucking Information Age DLC I am going to finally call it quits.

[@alswelman]

Only way they don’t make all future updates paid dlc is if enough people don’t buy it until they address this issue

[@AhmadSammy]

That’s exactly what Gathering Storm did though, right?

[@HiLoMusic]

I don't think the expectation has been set for the player beyond 3 ages - and if they have loftier ideas for an information/future age, then that expectation was not set from the last games. It's clear no one here plays or cares about Civ, just looking to whine about game politics.

[@kevshelby1679]

@@alswelmanunfortunately people are still stupid and even “pre-order” this shite..

[@DanBarry851]

That is exactly what is going to happen. Civilization is now a product not a game, I won't be supporting it.

[@haleyk10198]

But Firaxis isn't paid enough to fix their multiplayer netcode!

[@whisperware]

Ong this

[@whisperware]

It's been dog water since V

[@logoski589]

I'll see about it next Christmas. If the deal isn't there then I'll wait another year.

[@petatirrumator3005]

Or just sail the high seas until then.

[@Hunter-e7e]

Last christmas I gave you a deal

[@slavaskii8443]

I cannot endorse this video enough. Anyone who tries calling this problem out on Reddit or Civfanatics gets called some variation of “poor,” or they just “don’t understand how much AAA games cost today.” None of that matters however, if the game is being shipped INCOMPLETE with two major DLCs and a FOURTH AGE all but guaranteed in the near future. Not to mention “skin packs.” Like fuck right off, in a world where there are thousands of free to play games that provide endless content, I am not going to be nickel and dimed for the 7th version of, essentially, the same game, when I’m still having tons of fun with 5.

[@graethynne]

I guess I don't understand people on the internet anymore, if I ever did. Two things can be true at the same time 1) You don't need Civ 7. 2) There is nothing predatory about what we know of for Civ 7. You get to choose how you spend your money, but something not being worth it "to you" doesn't mean it is a ripoff or a con. Cheers!

[@slavaskii8443]

@ I respect that, but (2) is not substantiated. The video, and comments, are all about how the marketing is predatory. Never before has a Civ game been filled with this many micro transactions. Heck, Civ VI was pushing it, but at least that iteration didn’t have the gall to leave out a series favorite / mainstay (England) and then save it for the *very first DLC* (as is almost certainly happening here). If that’s NOT the definition of a cash-grab, I don’t know what is, I’m sorry.

[@wombatillo]

Tourists and corpos are running the gaming industry now. It's sad that greed and incompetence is rewarded.

[@timpeterjensen2364]

So you have never bought an expansion to a game before? thats what those two big DLCs are, future expansion content, that you can just buy early, likely at a discount compare to buing it seperately at launch. Look at the Crusader Kings 3 model for the sales model.

[@slavaskii8443]

@ I have bought plenty of DLC before, and regret that I did so for Civ 6. Oh boy, 2 DLCs (that are likely ready and should’ve been included at launch) at a marginally better price, where there will still be at least 2 $50+ expansion packs down the road? And microtransactions to boot? No thank you 🤮

[@OBudful]

For the 1st time I am not interested in a new Civ game. I don’t really like the new things they bring to the table. I think I won’t buy the game.

[@JavierSalcedoC]

They destroyed star wars. What is a nerdy strategy game franchise in comparison 😢

[@fernandoporto6464]

Me neither. The Civ switching along the ages is anathena to the very concept of the game. It's like trying to sell dry water.

[@ChessJew]

I'm going to wait to buy it later, if I buy it at all. The feeling of being milked for every dollar wipes out any appreciation I might have for the game.

[@mollari1560]

already got tired of the constant dlc sludgepump during the last games, this is just getting absurd. why even bother buying a 70$ game on release when its not even the full version and there will be more dlcs/addons down the road so might aswell wait for a good steam sale 1-2 years after release.

[@TheSaxyGamer]

This is a good way to put it. I think the game itself will probably be quite good and enjoyable, but the feeling that you are being milked for money pulls a lot of enjoyment away from the game and damages the community's interest in it. If the game released with all of this content in it without having to pay for it, I think we can all agree that we would be much happier with it and more likely to recommend it to people. It feels like a hype cash grab where they trade day-1 community excitement for more day-1 money.

[@inyobase127]

​@@TheSaxyGameragreed, its predatory and milimg the very players that are niche enough as it is.

[@Boredom_Incarnate]

It also might sound like a disconnected take, but go back and play other games you probably bought on sale and haven't touched. A couple years ago I was saving up for a house and had to find a cheap hobby, so I decided to work through the Steam backlog. Getting all the achievements felt like a good arbitrary way to say I'd "done everything in the game", and so far I've gotten through maybe 5 titles. This year I put almost 800 hours into Steam (including the time I went afk of course), and completed Dark Souls 3, Atelier Ryza 2, and Persona 5 Royal. Seriously, by the time I bother to get Civ 7 it'll be at the same Christmas Sale levels as Civ 6. And remember most titles nowadays are buggy piles so try to temper your own hype.

[@deathscythe0054]

Yes, don't give in to FOMO. I made that mistake with Civ VI, never again.

[@herlandercarvalho]

This is what I do. Why buy new stuff, when I still have shitloads of old stuff I haven't bought or played yet?

[@canariancat]

I've been playing Civ since the 90s. This is the first time I have zero interest in a new Civ game. I am definitely not buying it at launch and will wait for a sale.

[@ethanr0x]

same...playing since v1

[@KnightofAges]

Same, bought all Civ games from 1 to 6. This one, I'll be skipping, at least until all DLC are out, it's on deep sale AND people say it's good. I won't get it otherwise.

[@tiotom9217]

If you're planning on buying it in a sale then you clearly have more than "zero interest".

[@canariancat]

@@tiotom9217 I have zero interest right now, but I could change my opinion in time. And when and if I do buy it, it will be on sale. One thing is certain. I won't be buying it at launch.

[@davidfinch7407]

Same here. The creeping wokeism got me disinterested while trying out Civ 6. I got the base game but I started to recognize their war against my race, culture and gender. So I swore not one more penny from me for their add-ons, and no Civ 7 for me. Like so many franchises, their political mindset is killing them.

[@samuelconnolly347]

'Editions' make no sense with digital purchases. With a physical product, I kinda get it - pay more and you get more stuff, which has a manufacturing cost. You used to get things like art books and miniatures - stuff that doesn't affect gameplay, but some fans like. With digital purchases, all the work has been done already. It's withholding gameplay content for no reason other than greed, exploiting FOMO. When I buy a game, I want the whole game. I won't be purchasing at launch - definitely wait for sale. I really hate this sort of monetization.

[@icholas1527]

This was exactly my thoughts when I looked at the store page. Wild to be selling dlc for a game that's not even out yet.

[@slavaskii8443]

I know, it’s disgusting. Especially because the fanbase has become so rabid, that anyone pointing out this issue gets completely cast aside. *Nobody* should be paying over $100 for a game at launch, ever, and games should not be $300+ to be “complete.”

[@EikoHarvey]

I'm not at all saying it's ok but it has to be said that ALL modern games have been doing that- it's not specifically a Civ VII issue.

[@cecagna]

I was already in doubt over the civ switching mechanic but the aggressive monetization sealed the deal for me.

[@HiLoMusic]

The Civ switching seems pretty cool to me. No different than it is now other than a new set of opportunities as the game goes on

[@roberthart3305]

As a player of all the previous versions, buying them as soon as they were available, I'm more than likely giving this one a pass initially. They haven't convinced me that the game is worth $70, let alone $130. I'm not going to succumb to FOMO.

[@Zimionz]

I feel the same way. I was so hyped about every previous civ game that came out. But this time I just feel... indifferent. Civ changing, leaders that won't match the civ you're playing, the same 10 civs in every age of every playthrough, maps that will expand when you enter a new age, no information age, a damn " pay-more-money-to-play-5-days-early" scheme... this might be the first civ game since civ 2 that I'm not buying on release....

[@dantrianon4248]

It is a disaster, in Brazil, it gets as expensive as 800 BRL, which is more than half a minimum wage

[@JohnnyMartinsC]

Absurdo! Mas compraremos hahaha

[@superandreluizduarte]

@@JohnnyMartinsC Se compraremos você quer dizer navegar os sete marés.... Sou fã da franquia mas só imbecis vão gastar esse valor

[@arthurrelke]

@@superandreluizduarte atracar no porto russo, ele nos espera

[@MaxHardcore-p7t]

Lmao your country is poor.

[@maxmustermann-zx9yq]

wdym "more then half"? per hour? that would actually be super cheap in minimum wage terms, to buy a game in germany for comparison you would have to work for about 6 hours

[@negojiboia]

Yeah, nowadays, for most games, purchasing at launch is a bad idea. Youll pay full price for a half-finished, bug ridden, product. You basically pay more to be a beta tester for the game. Much better to just wait it out and buy it later for less money and more quality (assuming the game continues to be supported)

[@erinharkiewicz7239]

Heed the words of Eric Cartman: "When you pre-order a game, you're just committing to paying for something that some a$$h0le$ in California haven't even finished working on yet"

[@f3192-o7u]

Diablo4 flashbacks give me PTSD...

[@changer_of_ways_999]

Yep, wait 6-12 months for every game. By then, you'll have a stable version, post launch content drops, and discounts. And if not, it's probably dead and it's a good thing you didn't pick it up in the first place.

[@lamename2010]

notice the smallprint, with every increase in price you get "6 dlcs". Considering the content described in the chart is so little, with just a few leaders and what not, it seems like each leader will be their own dlc. And yes, this means that you pay for unreleased future content in the premium edition.

[@piotrjeske4599]

So if base game is missing leaders etc shouldn't it be cheaper then a full 70$ game ?

[@mrmichaelencke]

For me it is two things. First, I don’t feel like I am anywhere near being done with Civ 6. Second, I will be waiting for those quarterly sales early in its life before even thinking about buying it.

[@Arms1234]

I’m just going to wait 6 years after it comes out and buy the whole thing with the winter discount

[@HiLoMusic]

Lol idk why you think it's admirable to wait 6 years to play something instead of dropping 30 bucks now. the time to cost ratio is off.

[@KnightofAges]

@@HiLoMusic While we wait, we're playing the other 6 year old games we're getting now for pennies. At the end, we'll end up enjoying all the games you will enjoy, except we'll be paying 1/4th to 1/8th of the price you paid for them. And we won't be beta testers, so we'll get them fully patched.

[@HiLoMusic]

@ and whilst you wait I’ll have enjoyed those games to their fullest extent, gotten fun little patches along the way, and then have moved on to the next thing

[@suleiman1520]

⁠@@HiLoMusicgood for you then. What you fail to realize is that people have different time cost ratios. Why tf do you care if someone wants to save some money?

[@HiLoMusic]

@@suleiman1520 Only because many of you feel morally superior as a result of your cost-saving methods. The hyperbole is stupid.

[@iainsan]

As a player of PC games since the 1980s, I'm getting sick of this. Not only are recent games largely unfinished at launch, but they keep squeezing money out of the devoted fans of the more popular ones. Larian Studios are a noble exception.

[@alphatucanaletsplay]

I think the model is moving towards that of some of the 'free' games: the basic game with those is free to play, but they make their money from the small number of mugs who spend a fortune on pay-to-win gimmicks.

[@CharlieKellyEsq]

Same problem with all paradox games. If you bought eu4 base and paid for all dlc's at time of release, that would be over $500 for the entire game

[@MaxHardcore-p7t]

Oh, they had it on sale for some weeks ago. About ~€300.

[@Cascadia88]

Yeah I just bought it during the steam sale for $40 with all the dlc. Probably what I’ll do with this game

[@theWebWizrd]

Well, if you did do that you probably have at least 500 hours in the game. That is 1$ per hour of entertainment. That is dirt cheap.

[@AdmiralTails]

I'd honestly say this is worse, Paradox's games at least take a few years of piling up, Civ 7 is gonna be launching with the same total price of a like... 2-3 year old Paradox game, with probably less in terms of additional content gained, *and* not really supporting general ongoing development like you get with Paradox. I still think they need to do something about that piling up problem, but there's still certainly something to said about Paradox's like... ~$300 over 8 years or so vs. Civ 7 going for $130 right out the gate with plans for probably at least $200 already in motion for within two years or so.

[@giddyspiderboy]

i was about to defend paradox (its a decade old game, theres a 5 dollar subscription) but the fact those are true are ridiculous themselves

[@priscillaemerald987]

Indeed. No game is worth $130. I'd say wait until a few years until they drop the price.

[@anonimosu7425]

to me the game isn’t releasing in 2025, it’s releasing in 2029

[@StyledObject]

they think they're smart scamming their fans who have supported them for decades but I dont think they understand how many are not going to bother as a result, I'm not paying £60 for a game that's had content intentionally removed in order to try and squeeze more money from me

[@monkeytime9851]

I'm impressed with the honesty and integrity of the speaker here (Saxy Gamer). Not paid off to be a shill clearly.

[@f3192-o7u]

yes, appreciate the honesty!

[@HiLoMusic]

Who exactly is supposed to be the shill here?

[@dwkmcw6]

But the speaker is still going to buy the game to make money showing it off to the same people he told not to buy the game… ok…

[@monkeytime9851]

@@dwkmcw6 I don't see anything wrong with that. If he's open about it.

[@DavidJevon]

Splitting up the player base on day one is asinine. We were already waiting to see how a simultaneous release on cpu and console was going to operate. Imagine spending $120+ tax on a game, then having to turn the extra features that you paid for off to play with the rest of the community who got the standard edition. I feel that Take Two's corporate greed is going to stop Civ 7 from being more mainstream than it was lined up to be.

[@kma3647]

It's pretty clear that the strategy is to release an unfinished game, use the players as beta-testers while they patch all the bugs they missed in QA and balance the game. Then, they'll roll out half of the actual features of the game and major game systems as DLC, which you'll have to pay more for. And the best part is they're asking you to pay for this unfinished, buggy, unbalanced content long before it's ever released while they're still writing the code. You get some promises to tide you over for a few months. They get your cash. I complained about this on Steam and got banned for it, because they don't allow criticism. Even on CivFanatics, I ended up having my comment on the issue brigaded and even had mods demand an explanation from me for why I posted it. Even the fan community is gatekeeping for them while they do this. It's amazing. Of course, you're a KZbin streamer, so you won't get banned... They need to hear this. It's abusive monetization and it needs to be called out.

[@FozzyBBear]

I'll look for VII in the 2027 Christmas sale. Some time this year VI finally overtook my Beyond the Sword playtime on Steam, meaning those two games combined have taken close to a year of my life, somewhere around 8,000 hours. My experience of the game since the late 80s has been that they introduce some great new ideas in the odd-numbered games, including the original, but they don't get them right until the even-numbered games. I rage-quit V after 11 hours of gameplay back in 2012 but VI eventually grew on me when I got it at a deep discount late in 2019 when it had already been out over 3 years and most of the kinks had been ironed out with the expansion packs. It was maybe $40 for the base game, the expansions, and all the pre-release/premium content.

[@NikolaHoward]

I feel the same. I never got the hang of V either... Was too strange and my then PC was really not up for it. So, I essentially skipped from IV to VI... And I think right now I get way more pleasure watching others play VI than I do playing it myself. And that's only got a time cost

[@theWebWizrd]

I can't understand how people would enjoy Civ 6 more than playing Civ 5 with the Vox Populi community modpack. That is just perfect Civ for me and my friends. I am resigned that I will never find a better Civ game with the way the series have been going.

[@creativityfails1]

@@theWebWizrd Civ 5 just has the most half baked ideas of the mainline titles since 3 and not everyone wants to run a bunch of mods. And of course every Civ since 2 has leaned into add-on content but civ 4 was one of the best titles as just the base game and civ 5 was definitely one of the worst, if not the worst mechanics-wise.

[@PapaRoboto]

You know, for a minute there, I was considering getting civ 7, even though it's literally Humankind 2, and I hate Humankind. But really? Firaxis wants to fomo me out of $60? Even more than that because I'm Canadian? Yeah, HARD PASS.

[@apogeecreativitee7596]

Honestly I’m not bothered by expensive dlc content cause this isn’t unusual for civ. What does bother me is that THE INFORMATION ERA ISN’T INCLUDED????

[@dantrianon4248]

@@apogeecreativitee7596 I have a bad feeling more than one era will be upsold as DLC

[@radiofrequency5801]

I think literally every other bit of monetization is overdone here, but i really dont care about the information age as much as everyone else seems to. When has that era ever added anything substantial to the game? At that point youre finishing up the game, ready for it to be over, and maybe the techs are giving stronger versions of preexisting units, or the civics are giving some decent but somewhat uninteresting policies, but really nothing that makes me excited to reach that part of the game. I hope that it being dlc means that they will add something interesting to the super late game, but im not really holding my breath for it.

[@Stu-Bo]

​@@radiofrequency5801 I agree. Once you have nukes, fighters, bombers, AA. You already have cultural wonders and political systems in place, there's not enough added into the information era imo. Since this is a game based on history. I never liked the direction towards theoretical futures.

[@lopoa126]

@@radiofrequency5801 it is a sign that more eras will become DLC

[@kofer99]

@@radiofrequency5801 yep, i honestly cant remember when i reached a turn more than like turn 300 (out of 500) in a standard speed civ 6 game . While i am not a great civ6 player when i play on emperor or so i usually either have won by turn 200 and just go through the motions to finish the game or i have lost by turn 200 and stop. So what do i care about information age it is entirely irrelevant to me. Now i dont like all the preorder and big pack dlc stuff, but the age thing is really a non issue. IIRC every age will last about 200 Turns so just about as long as a game of civ6 really took.

[@igavinwood]

When 2K dropped a secondary launcher on top of the Steam launcher, I checked the small print and withdrew permission to data mine me. In return Civ VI stopped loading. Up to that point I had no issues with it and even had a handful of mods from the Steam Workshop working. When you add the sheer underhanded scum-baggery around how players are being milked by the greed monkeys to this, for me that was the end. I have played Civ in every iteration since 1996. I even purchased my pcs based on the required specs for this game. Never again. 2K can go to hell and they'll take Civ and XCOM with them.

[@allnaturalnutknitting4272]

I will wait. Dragon Age used to be my other big game and I still haven't bought the new one of that either. I also never made an account to get the one leader in Civ 6, because I don't want another log and it was just ridiculous.

[@trappist1-e301]

in south africa civ 7 is 1300 rands , i will wait for steam sales to drop the price below 500 rands. i got civ6 when it was jut 70 rands

[@djpunkIIDX]

if I learned anything from civ 6, it's that I won't be buying this for at least a year minimum

[@YangShaoqing778]

That's literally been the rule since about Civ IV. The game is never great until at least the first expansion. I mean, play Civ IV vanilla and play Civ IV BTS.... They feel like two different games.

[@godfreyofbouillon966]

It has been a theme with Civ since Civ 4

[@djpunkIIDX]

@@godfreyofbouillon966 did you guys learn your lesson since civ 4 then? I started at 6 so

[@nevilleneville6518]

Thank you for having the balls to stand against this BS pricing model. Finding out that only 3/4 of the game would be playable at launch and we could "look forwards" to future DLC with the remaining 25% was the final straw to me. Seeing Civ content creators ignore this issue, and redditors gloating about it because it made all the "gamers" mad has me questioning my sanity

[@urnad12345]

You should’ve mentioned how map sizes seem to be extremely limited. The maximum map size they’ve shown is the equivalent to a small map size in civ 6. They’ve massively decreased the scale of the game for some reason

[@usernametaken5619]

So they can sell you a world size map at a later date no doubt. Mark my words.

[@cow1816]

Reminds me of Victoria 3's launch, for some reason major gaming companies are allergic to releasing a finished game.

[@psicorps3683]

The more I learn about Civ VII, the less interest I have in buying or playing it, no matter what price tag it has.

[@ntrg3248]

I bought Civ 6 with All DLC last year for like 37 bucks. I wouldn't dream of buying civ 7 for retail price when they're just gonna keep making DLC anyway.

[@HiLoMusic]

If you like civ, Idk why you see buying a 60 title is that absurd? Games depreciate with demand, like anything else.

[@ntrg3248]

@HiLoMusic cause 1. I'm not really hyped for civ7 at all, I probably won't end up playing it for ages. 2. I'm in Australia, and on steam it costs $119 AUD for the cheapest version. 3. I prefer getting games on sale unless it's one of my fav franchises, civ isn't one of them. 4. I've got other things going on in my life such as having been kicked out of home a few months ago, and trying to get my driver's licence. I'm trying to save money so buying a game I might not even like at full price isn't for me.

[@yongle404]

$37 is WAY WAY too much

[@ntrg3248]

@@yongle404 for what would normally cost 200+?

[@Antonio-lt1sp]

I'm playing since Civ 1, back in 1994. This next Civ is the first I'm going to skip. Game design decisions that are questionable, outrageous prices to get an incomplete game, aligning with the greed commonly seem in triple A scene. I'm done with it. They take our goodwill for granted, and keep pushing to see how far they can go. If that depends on me, they will find it out now.

[@smackattack23]

Facts

[@RedSands8921]

Welcome back Saxy. Hope you’re doing well.

[@LowmanXIII]

I am no longer going to purchase games at launch when they are doing predatory pricing. I have a huge backlog to play and I'm going to go through it while I wait for games and companies to stop sucking.

[@AB-gm4yi]

Never buy a game at launch. Always wait for patches and a good sale that suits you.

[@SnowyNI]

Totally agree! They are going to milk it like they did the last 1! 2K are now famous for doing it. "Spend an extra $70 and get some nations and leaders you'll never play nor want too! Go on, just buy it!".

[@John-zz6fz]

Yeah, the other major reason to wait on buying the game until it's in a package sale is that you will also get the bug fixes when you start playing the game. I'm not paying $129 to be a bug tester for 2K.

[@AvengerAtIlipa]

Studies show that 99% of gamers stop preordering games right before they would have preordered the greatest game of all time.

[@myname054]

do not pay to be QA for an unfinished product. civ 7 will need at least a year in the oven after lunch before its properly balanced and feature complete. it sucks to abstain from something you love, but hold on long enough and you will get a much higher quallity project for a significantly lower price.

[@TheGlenn8]

Games are usually MORE fun if you wait a year or two before buying them. When all the bugs are fixed and free content patches have been added. Baldur's Gate 3 is going to have 1 new sub class per class added in February. Total War Warhammer 3 has tonnes of free content including an entire second (and way better) campaign. No Man's Sky and CyberPunk 2077 aren't unplayable garbage. The Long Dark is like 3 times as big and has features like base customization now. Waiting for a while before buying a game is usually the best advice I could give any gamer. Wait at least 3 months, but if you're patient enough to wait a year or two you'll have an even better experience. You'll even be saving a good chunk of money most of the time, or can buy a bundle of with DLC at the price of the old main game. The only thing you'll be missing out on is playing it at the same time as everyone else, which usually isn't something that matters in a single player game.

[@jorgev5200]

I did the same thing a few days ago, looked at the purchase levels and realized all the extras that I will miss out if I don't give 100+$ ? very discouraging. Even though I'm eager to play the game, I'm going to hold off for a while.

[@dchevron77]

If a game already has dlc on launch, it's a good indicator to avoid it at all costs.

[@ultimate9056]

As long as the game has Denuvo i'll continue to refuse to even acknowledge it exists.

[@Rose-eb3in]

lol I’m not buying a game without the end included, I hope all civ fans become aware of this

[@MichalKaczorowski]

Just a few months ago I bought Civ VI on sale with all the add-ons. I have something to play until the second big DLC ​​Civ 7 comes out (only after second DLC did Civ 5 and Civ 6 become "complete")

[@jeremykraenzlein5975]

My understanding was that the founders edition would include two major DLCs, the Civ 7 equivalents of the Civ 6 "Rise and Fall" and "Gathering Storm" DLCs. The introductory video promised that the Founders Edition would ultimately be cheaper than buying each of these expansion packs separately after buying the base game.

[@BoogilyWoogily]

Almost certain it’s not “expansion sized” DLC that you get as part of the Founders edition. It’ll be more like the Frontier Pass with leaders and civs and smaller stuff. But it’ll still be future content, not content that’s been paywalled at launch.

[@inyobase127]

They feel confident enough to double up in price with the extra shit. Usual cut it up amd sell it to you piece meal at a premium. Its BS.

[@Zimionz]

People don't get time depreciation. What would you prefer? 10 dollars today or 100 dollars in five years? Most people would pick the first one. With the founders edition, you pay Firaxis money and won't receive the entire product till probably late next year. Meanwhile, they can reinvest the extra money or start a new project wit it, and - if they are competent - make more money than they would normally have made if everybody bought their content on release.

[@Bartokomous]

@@Zimionz Please take it Fraxis before I lose it on crypto.

[@Cashinn_Outt1754]

They said the same thing with Civilization 6 pre orders and it turned out to be a few small civilization packs. On top of that - they later had to adjust pricing because it actually wasn’t cheaper as they had advertised. I’d suggest looking that up

[@HouseOfAlastrian]

Sounds like it's going to be a while before I play Civ VII. Like you said about the current sale on Civ VI... it's only just NOW that I have been able to complete Civ VI at a price I am willing to pay. And yes... games don't suddenly become less fun just because they're old. If that were true, nobody would be playing Chess these days.

[@i_notold8500]

I have played every Civ since the first one. Always bought them several years after they came out. I Just started playing Civ VI about 9 months ago.

[@SomeGuyFromUtah]

This is no longer a day one purchase for me. Civ 6 is almost my most played game on steam, but this is pretty egregious. 130 bucks for all available release content is unheard of as far as I know (not counting cosmetics). Might pass on the whole thing if it's going to be this. Not because I couldn't afford it, but because I refuse.

[@nervosadustbolt9642]

Or, here is another take on people paying for it. Just like that old Adage states: " A fool & their money are easily parted "

[@CrowMercury]

8 civilizations paywalled. I've already hated the blatant copying of the other games but now we got to pure ridicule. The series can die here for what I care.

[@burprobrox9134]

I’m still happy with 5, once the “all everything” edition of 6 is out I will buy that and play it until the 7 everything is out. By that time I will be lucky if I’m able to still play as I will likely be into a nursing home 😂

[@arielbemeliahu8619]

Literally nothing wrong with 5, 6 doesnt add anything interesting that 5 doesnt have

[@commanderwyn]

@@arielbemeliahu8619 wrong answer. 6 is great and does shit differently than 5 lol

[@arielbemeliahu8619]

@@commanderwyn cool beans. Im just stating an opinion. I wasnt fond of the mechanics added to 6 myself.

[@Cashinn_Outt1754]

Civ 6 all everything is out already. It’s called the anthology edition

[@vladprus4019]

I think the biggest red flag is that the only natural follow-up to one of the base-game acient civs (Missisipi) is locked behind pre-order bonus.... (Shawnee) Also Japan: there is Meiji Japan (modern) with Himiko as leader (she's ancient). It feels rather incomplete with a a gaping hole that fure sure will be filled with paid content. Or putting Charlemagne as a leader in game with no Franks or HRE civ...

[@wickedlysyckk]

Lemme tell ya . . . I started playing late, but as somebody who got the platinum edition of Civ 6 in 2021 through Humble Choice, and the New Frontier Pass for $10.00 with their coupon a few weeks later, I will attest to waiting for price drops. I got everything for less than half of what the expansion pass cost at the time.

[@jawsofwar]

The milking is getting out of control

[@usernametaken5619]

2K: But the cows like it! They defend getting milked all the time! Civ 8 will be sold one DLC civ at a time and the cows/sheep will love us for it! And all the 2K stockholders say AMEN!

[@thomasposton1261]

Wait, so we don't get all of the leaders and nations that they have announced just with the base game?!

[@TheSaxyGamer]

The ones that have been announced are included in the base game, with the exception of Tecumseh and the Shawnee, which you can get through pre-order. The DLC leaders/civs have not been announced yet.

[@Potitius-w2m]

In the immortal words of Tim Curry: "When you're a professional pirate"

[@Ramotttholl]

so basically Day 1 DLC again. personally if the other stages are even better worked out i have no isseu stopping an age early because i dont like the Ease of use of Nukes and Giant warmachina anyways. though still if they're gonna add it later id say atleast bring it in an expansion that ads other stuff in the game aswell.

[@Nerdchacho]

It's interesting that the conversations about paywall and early DLC as a business model is now a conversation to be had every-where.. For example, over at Planet Coaster 2 (that's my fam), that launch was an absolute mess because of a day 1 DLC, a pre-purchase bonus and a DLC released 4 weeks after the main game. It's not a good look. What they're doing here is trying to make a passive subscription model where sub models otherwise don't work. They want all the benefit of a monthly milking without actually doing that. And while gamers are still allowing companies to do that, companies will do it. The trend has been clear since the 90s too... expansions were good, but along game digital delivery and the DLC.. then came games releasing early as EA, then in-app purchases / loot boxes, then came the pre-release bonuses and now we have the game, a DLC, pre-release (deluxe) and an almost instant second DLC. It's a grotesque trend that we, as gamers, have allowed.

[@kitsune303]

Its like airlines - get you on the plane then charge you for any and everything. I'm good with playing C6 and I hope they don't kill it off. C7 looks like a lot of frosting and not much cake.

[@jan7392]

if a game entertains me for 1000 hours or more then i would pay 130 or 200 or 300$ for it. but what really annoys me: unfinished products! unfinished products that get finished by alot of small and payed steps over many years! i will wait some years too for a complete edition ;)

[@msmith42001]

I just got civ 6 in 2023. I got the base game and 2 expansions for maybe $40 in the summer sale.

[@nicoium6698]

We all hate 2K for this, but will still stuff them with money because of a lack of competition. I hope many people will wait for discount at least to send a message at launch.

[@TRH2243]

Just want to express my sincere gratitude for your honesty here. First time watcher, but it's clear you're not a shill like many others on the platform. Liked and subbed. :D

[@rodh1404]

One big thing in the Civ team's favor (so far) is that they do bundle their DLC after a while and give it a big discount. This makes it very financially viable for someone to buy into the full Civ experience a few years after the initial release. If you look at MANY other games with lots of DLC, they don't do this.

[@justicegambino4207]

It only makes makes sense though that if they’re gonna divide the game into ages that they’d sell ages as additional dlc. But also isn’t this better than having to buy a DLC to obtain crucial game system mechanics like in the past? I’m not trying to be a shill but, it’s private company. Unless you guys wanna nationalize the gaming industry, you’re just gonna have to deal with paying for games-and sometimes you’re gonna think they’re too expensive. If they are, then don’t buy them. Simple.

[@usernametaken5619]

Or...stay with me here...buy your games from indie companies that actually love games and want to give their fellow gamers the best experience possible for their dollars! Radical concept I know. The shareholders of 2K do not approve this message!

[@shacolin6546]

I already only buy it when its on sale. My third world pocket doesn't allow me to do otherwise. Besides, I can't afford the hardware to run the most recent releases, of which Civ 7 is included, so its not like I'm in a rush to begin with. The strategy is waiting for a big sale, 70%+, depending on how much I'll have to wait, I don't buy it unless its 80% or 90%, then I'll play it once I get an upgrade, which happens when my setup becomes so old it starts malfunctioning. I brought a second hand setup back in 2014, used it until 2020 where it could barely turn up. In 2020 I brought a new one. It is going for its fifth year now. It is alive and well going into its fifth year, and since the second hand one lasted me 6 years, I expect this one I brought new to last more than that. Not to mention this one is from a chinese brand, so it will probably last a lot longer.

[@JavierSalcedoC]

Who would have expected for Civ 7 to become the real civ killer

[@de6212]

I agree. If you can wait, you should wait years until it's actually cheap. But really the first sales will not be until December 2025 probably and you will save maybe 20 bucks on those first sales. So, if just one night you stay in playing the game rather than going out to a bar, a movie, or just driving around. then you've really made up for those 20 bucks.

[@azimuthclark462]

When I heard civilization 7 was coming out I was ready to spend the $130 and buy the whole shebang. Then I started seeing what the games about and Harriet Tubman was the nail in the coffin.

[@egs06]

I also bet better American leaders will be locked behind dlc. There’s no way America only gets Ben Franklin and Harriet Tubman (two important people but still not anywhere near the most impactful Americans in history) when every other civ game has had Washington, Roosevelt, Lincoln, etc.; there will probably be a president or two behind a paywall, which is unfortunate

[@lpdragon1180]

Additional content should be prohibited for purchase for a year after Lounch of a game, to disencurage companies to hold back on features that make a game more fun to play right from the getgo. Additional content should be an addition not the missing piece right from the start. If Civ 7 starts without any DLCs and gets new stuff after a year than it would mean for the executives that they need to make a game actually good for that people care after a year about the DLCs. Governements would have that power the people or in this case players just need to encurage them to take action.

[@Therealtek1]

It was a great era of gaming. All good things comes to an end

[@altemzwo8390]

The other question to ask is do I really need everything? I mean, I've played most of the games in the series, but usually just a hand full of leaders/civs per game. Maybe just resist the fomo, and focus on whether whats in the base game is interresting enough. It would suck a bit if there's a specific leader, civ or wonder in the expansions that I really like, but by and large, 25 leaders and 30 civs doesn't sound like they really skimped out on the base game at first glance.

[@JJAB91]

Between this and the missing features, the gameplay changes within the game and cultural changes within the company Civ 7 went from my most hyped game to barely being interested so fast it's absurd. Its now something I'll wait 5 years for and maybe pick it up on sale if I am still interested.

[@midnightstudio3742]

I will probably buy the base game for $70 when it comes out because I really do like civilization. That being said I'll probably wait on buying the DLC until they're on a sale or until at least a large DLC comes out like Gathering storm where it justifies its price offering a large amount of new civilizations leaders and updated content and mechanics I'm not paying $130 just for some leader packs and music

[@JJAB91]

This also isn't surprising. Take Two killed Kerbal Space Program 2, now that the corpse is growing cold it's time for a new game to kill.

[@ruas4721]

I dont mind DLCs, but this is clearly cut content and should be in the base game. Thats a terrible practice and should be punished by not buying this.

[@dutyfreeadventures5924]

Will be getting it at launch because it vomes out the week before my birthday, but I'm not going to be bringing for extra leaders and civs until I've played through all the existing ones. chances are I'll fall off/exhaust myself before even getting around to playing the new content and will wait until there's a sale on the dlc to draw me back in

[@Wolffjord]

I am an old timer of the Civ franchise, starting from the very first one and religiously played until IV (I was also very active in the modding community). Things changed with V with a complete change of creative team and the dramatic change in gameplay: the first entry in the franchise that I didn't buy as soon as it came out. CiV started slow with DLC but I can see they went down hard on them now: as long as there are "whales" willing to pay for it, the publisher is right to milk the product as much as they can. Hopefully a lot of that money goes to the developers too and not only into the bank. Personally, I will wait until the game is bug free, gameplay issues fixed, and finally on sale at a sane price.

[@rixihop]

and we will get: *The Right To Rule Collection contains 6 DLCs, all of which will be available on or by September 2025 (subject to change). Each DLC will be delivered automatically in-game on release.

[@Cashinn_Outt1754]

Dude Firaxis is even stealing Humankind DLC names? WTH

[@morbid333]

"you get none of that." How many civilisations are in the base game though? I don't remember buying any DLC for 5 or 6.

[@Sheepy19801]

Boycott a game that doubles the price but gives half the content.

[@HiLoMusic]

Where do you see it removing 'half the content' ?