Classical Musicians suck at Electronic Music

Ever seen a classical pianist sit down at a synth for the first time and play it like a piano? That was probably me. So, maybe I can explain why electronic music/production is a difficult thing for most classical musicians to approach...or maybe I can't.... Let's find out....
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[@JamesonNathanJones]

The number of folks who will comment on a video without watching it is pretty surprising innit?

[@tubitubi2434]

That's what you get when you give a clickbait title to a nuanced 13 minute essay

[@JamesonNathanJones]

@@tubitubi2434 You’ve just described how this platform works

[@piotrmalewski8178]

I'm gonna only comment, that I'm not gonna watch. And this: what did you expect when you made a provocative title?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

@@piotrmalewski8178 To get more views. KZbin titles are like argumentative essay headlines. They state an opinion and then either support or disprove it.

[@piotrmalewski8178]

@@JamesonNathanJones You know, a few hundreds years ago, even popular novels had ridiculously long titles, explaining what exactly is the book about. If we're not dumb to be fooled forever, at some point I think people will get tired of flashy and confusing titles and will look for long descriptive ones. I opened this video only because I got angry when I saw but I don't feel like watching. Although perhaps there would be things in the video we could argue about, I clicked in few places, noticed that you seem to know what you're talking about and the title is merely a provocation, so I passed. But even if you needed to be corrected, I feel like I should value my time and learn new things instead of keep arguing about the old ones. So I mainly passed because you seem to be talking about things I already know.

[@PanopticMotion]

Have you noticed how many classical musicians start using those dreamy, new-age synth sounds when they get into electronic music? It's totally cool though, there's nothing wrong with that :)

[@tukoijarrett9155]

Made me think of how the CS-80 seems to take some inspiration from organs (the sliders even work like drawbars)

[@TorutheRedFox]

@@tukoijarrett9155 I mean it's in the same line of synthesizers as a synth organ Yamaha made around the same time (it's actually a direct descendant of one of them i think)

[@dbweinhaus]

Yes, and it makes me feel like I've taken for granted all the various synth textures I've absorbed from pop and dance music over the years

[@AzoSBear]

Dream Trance? I feel kinda called out though since I was a choir kid

[@AzoSBear]

Though I still do contemporary classical stuff now

[@nkronert]

"How can I activate the reverb on this organ?" "Put it in a church"

[@robertsyrett1992]

We all live in brian eno's 1979 dream world of vertically stacked asynchronous loops. It's worth acknowledging that linear composition still has a place in ambient music.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Absolutely

[@lazylazy871]

Well I live in Finland at my house.

[@xxSk8ing4christxx]

I have no clue what you said but Eno is a maestro

[@curioso....]

​@@FloatingLeaf1111 banjo? Cool, any ambient examples you'd recommend?

[@theheresiarch3740]

Parts of the Outer Wilds soundtrack get a sort of ambient banjo thing going on. Especially Space (track 4). I'll link the whole OST below. After playing the game, I can't hear those three notes on the banjo without tearing up anymore, I'm misty eyed just from going to find the link. kzbin.info/www/bejne/eWaccoiCbZVnjbM

[@Dsch28]

As a classically trained violinist going to do a degree in electronic music production this is devastating news

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Haha well if it helps, it’s a KZbin title and not a blanket truth. Just some things I struggled with when starting out personally.

[@hoi4847]

​@@JamesonNathanJones first year undergraduate pianist here! I made the tragic mistake of falling in love with modular synths just months before I started conservatoire😂 I did literally dedicate all my life to this one instrument, but any tips to survive the next few years without dropping out?

[@JamesonNathanJones]

@@hoi4847 That's definitely a personal decision you'll have to make, but I would never discourage anyone from specializing in something. I think when you go that deeply into something you learn skills that translate to everything else you will go on to do - so rather than thinking of it as wasted time, think of it as immersing yourself in something for a season. You can always learn about synths on the side and then turn your attention to it later, and since you've already developed an interest in it, you already have an advantage.

[@hoi4847]

@@JamesonNathanJones really really appreciate this Jameson🙌 and all the good work you're doing here!

[@user-bf6gz8ej4o]

I'm always kinda shocked by how foreign musical genres except for classical stuff are to classical musicians. No front btw.

[@zachary963]

There’s a video of Andrew Huang and Rob Scallion where Andrew introduces Rob (a very skilled guitarist) to his huge modular synth. Over the course of the video, Rob catches hold of this concept. He initially tries to program a chord progression into the synth, which just does not work. Once he embraced the sound design aspect that Andrew was trying to teach him, the creativity and excitement of music make just exploded. It was incredibly fun to watch.

[@johnvance5118]

Gary numan still writes every single song on piano first and then translates it into the industrial sound he gets. I love your videos recently. Keep up the good work. I really appreciate it.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks John 🙏

[@JonathanKillstring]

Gary Numan is an absolute legend :)

[@mk1st]

Just saw him in Milwaukee, great show.

[@gladtobeangry]

Vince Clarke (Depeche Mode, Erasure, Yazoo) said in an interview he writes all of his songs on acoustic guitar. He said something about the sound design getting in the way of the melodies and harmonies while writing. That stuff comes in later when he's doing arrangement and production. Seems like a sensible approach. There also is this female synthesist I can't remember the name of, who spent her entire career playing only the Arp 2600. When asked why she stuck to just one synth she stated that she felt like she was still learning the Arp every time she played it. In other words, she treated her synth like a classical musician would treat their acoustic instrument, perfecting her mastery of it through a lifetime of experience. Incidentally, I have no classical background, but my introduction to playing a musical instrument was on an old electronic organ at the age of 6, and I think my love and my understanding for messing with different timbres began there, so your comments about how the organ helped you understand synths resonated with me a lot.

[@solarlarvae]

@@gladtobeangry I think you are referring to Eliane Radigue and her ARP 2500, an amazing artist kzbin.info/www/bejne/opTcZpmCmKamh7M

[@noisemodule]

get this: I am classically trained in...analogue modular synthesis, composition, 21st c. music history, and theory by a composer who was a contemporary of Schoenberg. (I'm also a certified audio engineer who studied "capital-S" Soundscape, but that's another conversation) ...however many of the excellent points you make, I too have struggled with, despite my training. in fact, the points you bring up about timbre, complexity, pacing, and space remind me of discourse which was part of my early training in synthesis - such as the early debate between the RDF studios in Paris and the Elektronich school at the WDR in Köln, surrounding recorded sound objects and "purely" electronic sounds, respectively; or the primacy of onset transients, attack phase characteristics, and sympathetic physical resonances in determining the difference between real life instruments, Soundmarks, ambient environmental keynote sounds, or whatever noise you can (literally) imagine. what makes a pizz'ed violin string sound different from plucked acoustic guitar string, or an emergency vehicle siren distinct from a train whistle or car horn, etc. while the purpose was not explicitly to instruct a 'how to' guide to designing synthetic applications of their real-world acoustic counterparts, the exploration of topics like the acoustic properties of wave propagation physics did help me to view sound design as integral to advanced synthesis techniques and vice versa. it makes sense - after all, in real-world acoustics timbre is inextricably linked to pitch, and vice versa, for just one example, and because the synthesizer's signal must eventually be transduced into the same pressure differentials in the medium of atmosphere in order to be heard, the same thing should be true of such so-called 'synthesized' voices.

[@patriciaoudart1508]

🙏💚🧡 j'adhère totalement. Je n'ai pas de formation mais c'est agréable d'entendre parler avec passion experte, de ce que moi même je recherche comme création!👍

[@alexlokanin3312]

That's so cool

[@JewTubeUsername]

Schoenberg? Whatever you're involved in must be pretty degenerate non music then.

[@GianmarioScotti]

The music starting at 9:47 is so stunningly beautiful, I went immediately looking for it. And I found it! You are very talented.

[@garygimmestad4272]

Your video resonated with me on many levels. I’m also a classically trained pianist whose career was sidetracked due to arthritis. I could play at a lower technical level in more improvisatory settings. I love jazz but the physical limitations also became profound in that world as well. Arthritis interfered not only with velocity but also with rhythmic articulation. But, still, I’ve had a fun and mostly satisfying career in theater, music directing, arranging and composing, and other musical pursuits. Now in my 70s, I’m drawn to synthesis where limited keyboard technique is not a barrier, and a wildly wide world of sound is available. I haven’t gone Euro but I have a couple of semi-modular Moogs that I love, a Typhon, access to a Microfreak, plus a bunch of software synths. Finally to my point: I struggle with finding my ‘voice’ in synth world partly because of the structure and limitations of sequencing. I’m not drawn to EDM in any serious way. Endless pattern repetition with a 4-on-the-floor kick can actually be fun, but I have other interests. The story you tell about synthesizing (pun intended) your classical bent with sound design encourages me to continue with similar ideas I’ve been experimenting with - writing linearly and contrapuntally and, in my case, incorporating some of the harmonic language of jazz, of Bartok and Prokofiev, of Messiaen’s scales of limited transposition, of Ravel and Debussy, etc. I’ve realized a few turned on Bach pieces which was fun and instructive, but, of course, I want to create my own path. - as you are doing. Thank you for the insight and inspiration! Cheers.

[@vsevolodalipov4375]

The background music while he speaks is magnificent, I like how it demonstrates what he's talking about a lot of the time. It's so nice.

[@eyvindjr]

I am also a classical musician who bought Ableton Live and started working with sound design fairly late. I can absolutely relate to your problems, but as a brass player, we actually have more control over attack, decay vibrato and sound color than on keyed instruments. Working with synths has actually introduced another approach to what the a trombone does and wants to achieve in different contexts!

[@moderncannibal9708]

You can't measure passion. You are a great mind and you are so great to get to know. Have you ever played something you never played before and it moved you to tears, or joy, or a color? Imagine the first humans who discovered around a fire the sound of the universe. They had no rules. Love what you are doing. Thanks.

[@ackzz]

Producing sounds from a synth is truly an art on it’s own, it’s like sculpting clay, you keep shaping it till your pleased with the results. Producing a song from all the different synth sounds is skill on a whole different level, there may aspects and levels of complexity you will need to learn\master from experimenting as you go along or watching video tutorials. Good Luck on your music journey - cheers!

[@GabeChurray]

Great video, Jameson! I often have my piano students play their pieces on keyboards using different sounds, and then ask them to try and explain how they might change their playing to better fit the different timbres

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I love that!

[@oldunclemick]

That must make it so much fun for them Gabe. Expanding their thinking - teaching music, not just piano.

[@GabeChurray]

@@oldunclemick it’s a great gateway to composition and even other considerations for keyboard playing. Like Jameson says in the video, organ, even though it has a keyboard it’s a completely different mindset than piano, or Rhodes, or Clavinet, or synth etc etc.

[@beetheimmortal]

I sometimes do this too. I really like playing Bach pieces using synthwave synths and sounds, just for my own entertainment

[@itsWHOM]

As a former music student, I have felt so much of what you have so eloquently put into words. Also, the music in this is brilliant. You are a god damn genius.

[@deltavoltmusic]

this is so crazy to me. as a synthwave artist with no classical training, i thought it would be like cake for a classically trained musician. i had no idea how demanding sound design is. glad have that skill in my pocket 😅

[@user-tp1qq7yo9k]

as an advanced electronic music producer, i promise we could never be angry for you playing classical pieces on synths ahahah, it is a whole honor to have you guys interested in our world!!!! often we get too much hate from everyone because electronic music "is not real music", but classical composers getting interested on it, is such a beautiful thing happening to the music world itself. much love!!

[@davidleary5639]

Hats off to you Jameson.Instead of reeling back into the Classical world = real music ,you've learned about the differences and now see the virtues of both .

[@JayM928]

I really love making music, but I can't play any instrument without a decent amount of pain -- something like arthritis from a young age. Discovering electronic music now in my 40s has been a blessing. I can't tell you how amazing it is to be able to play music without the physical dexterity that is usually required. I can push notes around on a piano roll and play with the synth, and take my time with it. I've had the challenge (and joy) of tackling the first thing in my life that seems to have no beginning or end. Academically, I wanted to maybe get some degree. Professionally, maybe there's some salary, some company, some accolade a person can have as a goal -- heck, maybe a solid retirement decades later. Athletes usually have discrete goals as well. Music production is the first thing I've ever done that has no obvious milestone for success; no long term goal. That is, I have no aspirations of fame and fortune like some of the kids have. I just do it because I love it. It's not my day job. It's not the thing that pays the bills. Even if I were to strive for a long term goal with music, what would it be? If learning an instrument, I assume a goal could be to play a particular piece well. For producing your own music, without a goal relating to how your work is received by others (popularity)... Well, I haven't thought of one yet... Anyway, it's a nebulous thing, and hearing what it's like from you and others in the comments that have approached it from the opposite side, where you have all this physical dexterity and muscle memory, and not to mention education generally with music, it is very interesting.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

If you love it, the thing itself is its own reward. Cheers :)

[@moth5799]

Set the goal of making a piece that *you're* happy with. Listening to others and their feedback is important but at the end of the day it's about making something you enjoy and that you can be proud of.

[@rexcellencemagee6729]

I wish every single person in my life that feels I’m wasting my time and money on what I love to do would watch this awesome insightful video you just created! Thank you!!!

[@earlgrey2130]

How can you be "wasting" your time and money, if its a thing you love? Isn't that the goal of said investment?

[@rexcellencemagee6729]

@@earlgrey2130 you’d sure think so, wouldn’t you? Some in my family feel I wasted my classical background I think mainly when I grew my hair long and started an eighties metal band! Lol, back then metal was classical so I thought it was an advantage, nowadays there’s no future in it, but my own enjoyment!

[@bobbygoestoabyss6624]

I can relate to that. Have heard phrases my whole live. Something like:"Don't you just wan't to do real work" I absolutely hate this narrow mindset. For some people music seem to be a acoustic stimulus.... and that's it. They aren't able to understand the beauty of it. because it is nothing you can hold in your hand. I have to deal with heavy depressions and i can tell. For me, making music is not waste of time..... It keeps me alive...

[@denver-gi7ot]

Don't worry about people's opinions. Some people will never understand. As long as you want to, keep going.

[@tiderider]

Your life. Your time. Your money. Your smiles. Enjoy them.

[@mybachhertzbaud3074]

Isao Tomita got me completely into classical music. Still love to revoice classic Midis through my synths.😁🎵🎹🎶Play On

[@mournblade1066]

Isoa Tomita did AMAZING realizations of classical music on the synthesizer.

[@heartycoffee4754]

the synth patch at 4:29 sounded so beautiful and haunting, i love synths like that

[@disklamer]

There was the composer, and the director, and the performer, and then there was the DAW and it made us all audio gods.

[@jukeboxfandango]

This is an interesting take, rather than saying "this is the way" or "that is the way" to say "they're two different ways to achieve two different things". I had a classical background, threw most of my theory out the window after grade school and became a pedal player, and eventually moved on to synths. The best way to look at a synth from a piano perspective is that it is essentially a piano, but one that someone said "wouldn't it be neat if it could do this?" over and over again to the point where you need a manual and a history lesson just to understand WHY it makes the sounds that it does, and then only BEGIN to understand how to make it sound the way you want. I know I'm not alone in having set a patch that makes no sound, and then having taken 5 minutes trying to figure out which knob or fader is causing the issue. As a lover of the classics and the synths I think that Ravel's Bolero would be an amazing song to marry the two styles. It's basically a sequence being patched to different instruments each time around while adding to the rhythm channel bit by bit.

[@Kung_Fu_Jesus]

Superb advice. It’s taken me almost 2 decades to detach myself from my classical training and fully immerse myself in electron composition.

[@prosperlost4046]

I'd like to be the first to make an ionic comment, but I'm positive that will be taken negatively.

[@wetpaperbag1346]

Your insight and approach is incredibly great. I'd say an artist who combines classical piano training with electronic music is Haywyre. He writes absolutely beautiful piano pieces alongside complex, layered electronic textures. Musicians sometimes get too focused on trying to emulate XYZ instead of first playing what sounds or feels good to them, then stretching a bit outside their comfort zone until they find something novel and beautiful.

[@i-never-look-at-replies-lol]

Kinda weird since my first musical passion was Classical as a young child and I feel like it laid the foundation for being able to appreciate artists like Autechre and more experimental sounds. I could understand from a skill standpoint and thinking of using solely a piano to fill up all the space, which might create a vacuum for creativity when it comes to filling out electronic music given that sound design can take you further than arrangement, but one of the reasons I gravitated towards Classical music was it's structure i.e. they're movements full of dynamics, not "songs" or "tracks" and i preferred that energy over more formulaic radio music. But I do notice sitting at the keyboard for me there's very little actual playing and more hen picking or playing a single vote to achieve that "sound" than prove something compositionally. Or like I can sit there at a synth and "compose" something...but it's there's so much going on it just doesn't sound good with anything else. And there's unstructured music I make in movements too, but without the chops. I kinda look at myself as the whole orchestra, not just one instrument. Like you're the conductor telling what sections to play & when; pianists are used to being in the spotlight, playing through the entire time. So I could understand that mindset too. I dunno, I usually relegate any sort of actual piano playing & practice to days I'm bored or don't feel like working on a project. I've basically given up on trying to add any sort of real "playing" in my music and just save that for other times

[@patrickp9624]

In the middle of the video I picked up my guitar (im not at all trained at it), put together some delays and reverbs and "played" for an hour or two. And your video made me do that instead of going to bed. thanks

[@CatFish107]

I'd imagine that Suzanne Ciani has grappled with these same struggles. I think she approached it with hard shifts in focus, synths, then piano, now back to synths.

[@kjeltpieper2194]

This was realy inspiring! And tanks for the Ebook

[@stefanherzog]

I love your recent videos as they bring AFAIK a unique angle to synth KZbin (synthclassicaltube? classicalsynthstube?)! Please more of this!

[@Flahtort]

5:05 Your voive on top of the synth on the moment you say: "Here" it's just magical.

[@Johnnysimz]

Very glad I've stumbled on your channel! The video itself was also revealing for me as I'm jumping into synthesis myself from a more formal pianistic backgroung. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the subject!

[@PBVideo1962]

An inspiring video with great depth and warmth. Subscribed. Helped me overcome a particularly bad period of option overwhelm. Thank you.

[@andy-simmons]

Man, your content has been so good lately! Great stuff.

[@dawid_dahl]

So happy I got recommended this video. I have sense I will listen a lot to your music from now on. Thank you. 🙏🏻

[@martyp7401]

Really insightful and nicely articulated. Thanks for this, it resonated with me in a most harmonious way.

[@charliecarrot]

Awesome video! This is a journey I've been on as someone who's spent most of my life studying classical piano and just recently getting into the world of synthesizers. So many possibilities with timbre and sound shaping.

[@neuzethmusic131]

This was such an awesome video ❤ I learnt a lot! Thank you!

[@nicolesoukalova]

Hi. Thank you so much for this video and your arguments. You speak from my soul. Thx.

[@Kenshearer]

Great video, thank you for the insight!

[@synth-hjorne]

Great points. I like your ideas on combining classical composition techniques with electronic sound design.

[@AzamisBox]

stumbled upon this video and i felt like it was god sent keep it up man love the way you break stuff down

[@karlsaintlucy]

I'm also a classically trained pianist and vocalist, and I can't believe that I'm only now getting into synthesizers at 35. Even just learning the parts of a synth and how they all work together to make sounds is totally changing the way I hear and write music, to say nothing of the really cool results I'm getting from just playing around on a MicroFreak. It took me a few weeks to feel confident enough to try to make some of my own patches, but now that I've started to, I'm really excited about what I'll be able to do with practice. Another big barrier for me at first was the way I was approaching the synth keyboard as I would the piano's, which is just a totally different beast. I feel like I've learned a lot just from watching other synthesists play and gaining some intuition around how my hands and fingers will have to work to get the results I want.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

That’s awesome! Yeah the way the sound influences how you play (or don’t play) has been fascinating for me as well.

[@karlsaintlucy]

@@JamesonNathanJones one thing I’m also encountering in my (symphonic) work is that I’m great at texture and density, but I have a really hard time balancing different parts of the frequency spectrum. Like, I seem to have a much better intuition for how to fill the top end than the bottom end. And often when I mix my own work, whether it’s symphonic or electronic, I find that they always end up being very treble-heavy. It’s striking me how little ear training I’ve gotten around the elements of studio recording production, and synthesis is helping me to develop more of an ear for those things. I’ve been going through Syntorial, which I really enjoy. I wonder if you also notice that classical musicians have difficulty when transitioning from primarily live performance to studio production-it’s honestly been really humbling to learn how much help my ears have needed 😂

[@JamesonNathanJones]

@@karlsaintlucy I certainly struggled with mixing/production early on. It’s typically not something a classical performer has to think about. It’s more similar to orchestration, but there’s still a new world of terminology and sensibilities to learn. I think, as with anything, it’s normal to struggle when you’re just starting something new.

[@oldunclemick]

​@@karlsaintlucy Don't worry, it's a struggle we all have. Keep the low end clean and you won't go wrong. Just bear in mind that it's the presence frequencies (mid frequencies) of the bass sounds that count in the mix and the amount of low end energy is managed using EQ. Well-balanced mids are key to translatability of a mix between listening environments. Sparkly highs and deep lows are the icing, not the cake.

[@oldunclemick]

​@@karlsaintlucy the thing I like about the MicroFreak is that the "keyboard" encourages experimentation in a way that a regular keyboard doesn't.

[@Composer1992]

I'm also a pianist who plays organ, and I've played with software synths a bit. I loved the sound of the examples you put in here and it got me wanting to try making some more electronic music!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Go for it!

[@JayTemple]

I asked this in my own thread, but I imagine your perspective will be informative: Between the piano and the organ, how much did your skill and training in the first one you learned transfer to the second? Was it as jarring as what we see with the keyboard?

[@rodrigolaporte274]

What an awesome and insightful video!!! I love the concepts explored here. I don't have musical background, just picked up stuff along the way, so I have the opposite problem, I need to be very aware of not having my creations to rely too much on sounds and not having an interesting melody, need to find the balance

[@GrouchyGander]

Dude! The electronic examples you've shown are right up my alley of music! Gave me mad me-bumps~ Gonna rifle through your stuff, see ya in a bit!

[@Qwiv]

Thanks for the insight. Nice video production as well.

[@jooh4450]

Thanks so much. Super informative and interesting!

[@patriciaoudart1508]

👍🙏💚🧡 I did not studied music, so what I do is melodies, and soundscapes or linear type pieces. I start on an idea and uses, Nature sounds I register, classic Fatar 88 controller and I'm actually going to modular, to multiplie my palet of initial music. I use mostly midi tracks and music is by pleasure not by obligation to produce for others. As I was young, at Four to Ten years old I loved to open the totally detune piano there was at my grandma's home, so I learned harmonics, more than notes, but openig the piano and listenig this world was my grand pleasure. Fifteen years ago, I brought an old piano I have totally retuned, and as old synths were on the market at low price, I found a Korg M1, a Juno 6, and a SH2000, and slowly I began to build my proper musical world. I don't want to fall in technological trapp. I play Recorder bass and Clarinet sib, love church organs, for their long modulation, Tangerine dreams at begining, mixing sounds from Nature, classic instruments, and technological analogical music, but no particular rhythmic than a bird singing can produce, or men at work in the fields. So, my rules are simple , I need a palet and I play around few ideas, begining to go together . I like your linear approach.

[@pjohns92]

That was a pretty honest look at the process from your point of view. Looking forward to seeing what you put out in the future

[@karlklee9418]

One of the best and unique synth channel. Some of my thoughts are similar to yours but not so well articulated. Please continue with your journey and take us with you! ❤

[@samborn7120]

Really appreciate the in-depth perspective. Always remember to consider limitations and what you may bring in from them.

[@hi-gi1zz]

i’m so happy the youtube algorithm decided to throw you on my homepage, I was just about running dry for interesting ambient pieces to listen to and now i’ve been introduced to a whole new level of auditory beauty

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks so much!

[@samueltiradovillaescusa2325]

I am a classical pianist and I you nailed some of my questions with great answers. I love your videos and your thoughts! Thanks!!

[@obscenemachinery]

Loved it! Subscribed and looking forward to your other videos, thanks :)

[@18nomah]

What a wonderfully well thought out video.

[@vraalten]

Great video on a essential subject! I love the contemplation and questions that follow. I do recognise where you are coming from. As a composer and sound designer myself, I do think that the silence is as important as the sound. Just like a painter needs the blank canvas as the background, we do need silence as background. And this video also ties nicely with your recent video on composing sparsely without completely filling every moment with notes. Anyway, keep up the great and inspiring work! 👏👏👏

[@themusicalcat5412]

I currently am still going through classical music training, but ever since Ive been getting into synths I've had this problem, and this video has really helped realise what I've been stuck on and what I should be doing. Thanks so much for making the video

[@GooseTronics]

great video, ive been a producer for a decade now but have no classical training... never really thought about this... its interesting to see how training different instruments translate over to making electronic music.

[@ergo-dust]

Really enjoying your thoughtful reflective videos of composition. I'm in the camp of very happy composing for instruments that always sound like themselves making a very difficult transition to those that might not! Will all be worth it though... probably :)

[@jontrout2010]

What a fantastic breakdown of electronic composition. Im studying electronic music at conservatory and have spent the last 3 years trying to wrap my head around what you explain here in mere minutes.

[@stateazure]

Always interesting, Jameson, thanks for sharing your thoughts! Also, from someone who is practicing and trying to improve their piano playing and theory, I appreciate these and other recent videos. Great stuff!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks so much!

[@matthewkinne7662]

The most amazing part of this video is that you have an iridium that works. I'm envious. I spent a lot of time on learning it before purchase only to end up crushed time and again. Volume spikes, weird popping sounds, and issues with the sequencer - it crushes me every time I see one that's functional. Anyway, thanks for what you do, much respect for your professionalism in skill and knowledge.

[@Zebselcabron]

It's the first time i see content from this channel pop up in my feeds...it feels kinda weird because i watch a lot of synths and electronic music content. Great content and subscribed 👏! Looking from different perspectives when approaching music is something i like to do aswell 😂

[@yushee1324]

thats a very interesting video, makes me think, thank you so much! keep goin

[@muralist_]

You are actually the first who I ever see explaining this 'problem' on a very logical and understandable level in just one video. Especially the link between being classically educated, being a composer and then struggling with that other thing that no one ever mentions: the craftsmanship of sound design. In the past exactly that has been a burden to me. Getting the knowledge on sound design, because to me - being a composer, with a fully developed classical schooled background - it was the only wall I was constantly running against when trying to record compositions in the digital world. This constantly trying to find the best ways how to translate that what I heard in my mind into the right fitting sounds. Absolutely very well done, how you define that issue in this video!

[@end-quote]

happy I found this channel, beautiful music

[@ernestbuckley8671]

I got my first synth in 2015, a Prophet 6... when I first sat down with it, I had absolutely no idea what I was doing. Then when I started to figure it out, I got frustrated because I was approaching it as a classically trained pianist. Fast forward a couple of years and I no longer approach it as a pianist. I look at it as a noise-sound machine. I know how to program it now and design my own sounds but I no longer approach it a pianist. If I need something in the production but I`m not sure exactly what, I sit down and start to fool around with it. Most of the time I create sounds that on their own kind of suck but in the context of the song, those sounds serve a specific role. It definitely was a challenge to get to this point but I also know, I can program that synth to create a beautiful sound that can stand on its own now. Then in 2021, I got the Matriarch... I`m still trying to figure it out but now I actually enjoy the process because I understand synthesis alot more than I did 8 years ago. There is also something fun about not knowing exactly what you`re doing. In that process of exploration, we sometimes create something that is so far beyond anything we could ever get on a traditional instrument. Thats the beauty of synthesizer. I see synths as their own unique sound machines now. They could be extensions of traditional instruments but its best to approach them with beginners mind.

[@valdie6614]

Damn, super well explained information in this video. Good job man!

[@jeanrogerlamoot7632]

Amazed to hear you drop Trent's name an inspiration to us all. Thanks

[@TheMcShay]

Amazing video and beautiful music!

[@__vidarr]

Great valuable insights, thanks!

[@TheGoggers]

You're the best creator i've found in a long while! I think your composition is absolutely breathtaking and you've inspired me deeply to go and figure out what keeps a song moving and interesting. As a fellow classical musician myself, I struggle mostly with fluidness when it comes to composing non-classical music but you've cleared out some of the clouds for me and for that i am grateful, so thank you for doing what you do and keep on creating!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks so much! Glad it was helpful :)

[@neonjams]

I like your search on new sounds, the journey from classical instruments like the organ/ piano to new territory combining it with synthesis. Also the knowledge on theory is pretty inspiring. I also came from an organ background and later on the bass and now also totally into synthesis. But the only thing I can do is test and improvise. But also growing in it. Nice movies, cheers from Holland

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thanks Rene! The experimentation process is a tremendous amount of fun. Happy exploring!

[@manuelgonzales6483]

🤯 Love your channel ❤️

[@EELMO]

Beautiful video, humble mindset! Greetings from Brazil

[@slimyelow]

When I am composing I rarely have any passion for synth timbre. When I am arranging I want perfect patches and I want them asap. However when I a noodling on a patch or building one from dirt I never intend to use it for anything ever.

[@marco1941]

Second of your videos watched. Nice, you got my sub. I’m interested in finding out more about your channel. Sounds pretty promising. Have a good day.

[@slimyelow]

This channel is a treasure trove since I've also studied composition for decades while at the same time producing electronica. I have never found an outlet where folks discuss these topics as a combo and certainly not on a level as passionate as I ponder about them.

[@nebula0697]

I think your (stunning) synth-based compositions in some cases reveal your classical training, because of the coherence. I'd be interested to see you make a short groove-based non-ambient track with drums and without reverb, just for kicks. Maybe there's already material like that on the channel, I haven't listened to it all.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

I think there are a couple tracks on my last album that venture into that territory, though there are still some ambient elements: Turning and Roots maybe.

[@jamiestewart1644]

Superb video and after years of of building and tinkering with modular and synths from a sound design perspective, just what I've been looking for. I'll never be 'classically' trained but I feel a real need for some theory and structure. Thanks

[@janbo8331]

Excellent presentation. I'm not a composer, a musician nor a sound engineer and many of the concepts discussed were new to me. You have a very nice pace and you use language very concisely, making your thought process easy to follow. Now, I'll go have a listen to some of your pieces. Perhaps the algorithm is onto something here.

[@Timetraveller2208]

That was a really very interesting video. Subbed!

[@Hart8]

I love your videos. Very helpful and useful

[@belleepoque4597]

Great video. It has already been stated in the comments, but in my own way I struggle with this too. I love traditional counterpoint, voiceleading, harmony, form, etc... but also a deep love of industrial/noise, experimental electronic, etc... and my own journey involves integrating these things. You have given a lot to ponder. Thanks!

[@Imposibilitron]

Although I was expecting to see Beethoven played on a synthesizer, I'm not disappointed that I got something different in return. Great video, probably the best explanation I've seen of the differences between the classical approach to music and sound design.

[@SKySWiM]

Interesting to hear your own saga of bridging the gap from classical piano to synth playing/composing. I can only partially relate to your struggle. Even though I started with classical piano taugh to me at age 5 by my grandfather (who played in the Boston Symph), I was exposed to a lot of orchestra and jazz music on the radio. Probably the single thing that helped me bridge the gap to synths (in hindsight) was starting to play trombone in the 7th grade. Playing a brass wind instrument intuitively gave me a general understanding of ADSR and high pass filter functions of synths, because music for trombone varied enough to give me real-life experiences with such things. Fiddling a lot on my high school friend's electronic organ also filled a few gaps for me. The pop synth song, "Popcorn," really opened my eyes (and ears) to possibilities that went beyond "real" instrument's ability to produce sound. And because of peer pressure in the 8th grade, I was more and more was getting over my aversion to pop music, because here and there, I heard a very well-crafted song, some of them being enhanced by early synths. I was very intrigued with Nights in White Satan by the Moody Blues, not just for its classical music ending (which is what initially attracted me), but with the haunting lo-fil violin sound, which turned out to be made by a Mellotron, which was the equivalent of an analog (non-digital) sampler. Like many classical synth lovers, I enjoyed Walter/Wendy Carlos Swiched-On Bach and all of Tomita's stuff. But I was blown away by Keith Emerson of ELP, who was taking synths into a realm that went beyond classical, beyond jazz, and into a wonderful new genre of progressive rock. Arguably, Chick Correa's Return to Forever was also an important and (in my opinion) the only true fusion of rock and jazz, which nicely included synths as something that held that genre together. During college, thanks to a job I had as a sound engineer at a theme park, being constantly indunated by a another engineer's obsesson with 80's music, I finally "got it," and started to see new ways to use synths. Groups like Devo, Yello, Art of Noise, Depeche Mode, ended up being major influences for me initially. By the 80's, I also started to run into a growing number of synth HATERS. Trained musicians hated them, because they say synths as taking their jobs (it did in many ways). Possibly more interesting (and defintetely more irririating to me), where NON-musicians, especially those who went to high school BEFORE the 80's, thought of synths as "CHEATING." They would say, "those are not REAL instruments," and often would say it takes "NO TALENT" to play one of them. In their mind, synths only required you to hold down one note for an entire song. 80's music, and the growing electronic music set of genres tended to produce more modal (and/or mono-chordal) music, so in a small sense, their criticism was correct. But as you pointed out in your video, one can argue that much of the work done to create synth music involves the PROGRAMMNING of the synth. Thanks to great increases in music technology, especially in the digital realm, aspects of synth programming has jumped far beyond synths, but have become integrated with a vast array of software algorithm apps that can take sounds of not only the synths, but each and every track of a song, and be able to "re-synthezie" all the sounds into just about anything else you want to make it, which is only limited to the abilities of the user to use these apps to manipulate the sounds. Because of all this music technology, it has created a kind of music genre that I have not really heard people talk about directly. I call it "EAR CANDY" music. This is not meant to sound derogatory. What I mean by it, is to listen to what I consider to be cutting-edge electronic music that shows off a lot of heavy creative editing work, but also includes a good amount of great song-crafting, which I think provides a kind of emotional basis of the song (similar to all older genres seem to try to do). "Ear candy" in music has been around for a long time. When the celeste was invented, there was a race between different composers to use that in their music. I think Tchaikovsky won it, when he used it in his Nutcraker music. I have greatly enjoyed and continue to enjoy my journey with synths and all its related music technology. But one irony, that at least as a composer, I have found that after treading through numerous genres in my songs, I seem to more and more infuse my original classical music influences into them, albeit, I always try to tweak something in the songs to go places that my composer heros of the past have not gone before. Please forgive me for being so verbose. And if possible, take it as a compliment. Your video triggered a lot of thinking, and I greatly appreciated that.

[@InstrumentManiac]

Fascinating video. I always kind of assumed a pianist's skill would be a 1:1 transfer but it was interesting to hear your experience and challenges adapting to the synth. All Things Fade is a beautiful piece, it really does capture that chorale sound really well!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thank you!

[@EK-gr9gd]

Great lecture!

[@noelvox]

Fast becoming my favourite YT and your videos seem as timely as when I discovered your channel (if you can say that that within a month or so ago). I started as a singer (always will be) then a guitarist, then synths and finally and more recently concentrating on piano, not so much to be a pianist (that ship has sailed) but to improve my keyboard skills (the attack of a note, the decay etc feels no less real than a synth but is more an extension of the player, not unlike a guitar) but on the way I wished I had the opportunity to play piano a long time ago. It is such a fantastic compositional tool and is quick to let you know your compositional limits, ones that can't be covered by sound design, it makes no more or less than synths or any other instrument and is not without its own limitations of course but it is an incredible tool to express the melodies one can hear in their head or instinctively want to reach for and the transferrable skills can be a great short cut on other instruments.

[@maxricemusic656]

Fantastic video. I went to Point Blank Electronic Music School, and I totally see what your saying. I got into music playing guitar, but now sound design and synths are by far my main musical tool. I love classical music by the way, and have a lot to learn from it so you just got another subscriber!

[@Station2Station-du2gh]

Thanks Nathan, as a pianist myself (classical training for 8 years in my younger years) who now has too much synth and modular gear, keep up the good work and the informative videos.

[@altogethernow]

I’m really enjoying your channel.

[@PianistErikOsterberg]

Great video. Also, I really appreciated the last piece, "all things fade"

[@chukah9484]

Your perspective has been great - as an electronic musician that has begun taking piano lessons so I can get more classically trained.

[@photographyguru2135]

So good! Thank you for talking about this, and for working to bring something truly remarkable to the table in a sea of copycats, and boring music!!!

[@subspeciez]

New subscriber, I loved the video. I really enjoy the composition of the music you create!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Thank you, Scotty!