Combat Overhaul Mod TAKEN DOWN!

[@serp4276]

If you still have the mods subscribed, you should make a private copy of it and install it locally to not corrupt your savegame (better also make a BACKUP of your Savegame first!), just in case they really get deleted from the mod browser (currently they are hidden as far as I know). The mod_io subscription folder is by default located under "Users/Public/" (youtube does not allow to post a link and mod_io with a dot is considered a link -.-). Copy the mods from ac3s to your windows user "\Documents\Anno 1800\mods" folder (or mods folder within Anno game directory) to install them locally. And no, it is unlikely that a modder will reupload ac3s work in its whole, since this would be indeed not ok. Just in case someone wants to read how all of this started (in german, no drama, just the development of the mod that caused it), its still on the Anno Modding Discord Channel in "allgemein deutsch" from (tomh2024 - 22.05.2024 12:25) (again link not allowed..). In short and my point of view: nothing from his code was taken, all done by myself, but still tom2024 credited him at the modpage, which made it look like he took his code/idea without permission. This codeline was even mentioned in modding discord by user "tethik - 14.08.2021 22:31" before CO included that value, so it was not even "found" by Ac3s initially. But even if it would, I still can not understand this heavy overreaction, also with deleting all his helpful posts in the modding discord... Few possible alternatives I'm aware of (feel free to add more): - My mods are not the same experience, but Ac3s and I worked together for many things, while his CO focused more on "extreme", while I tried to stay closer to vanilla and I do not add new ships sadly. So many of my mods are at least making AI/Pirates/combat harder. (search for "Serp" in the mod browser) - Warehouse loading ramps 2x: I also had a mod before him to increase loading ramps a bit: "Viable Warehouses Upgrades" (and no, he did not ask me for permission to also change these vanilla values :D =P). - Bright Harvest Nerf was also based on a mod from me (again without asking me ;) ), so I could upload my version, if needed. - Multiplayer Gamespeed change mod is a collaboration between ac3s, Taludas and me, so 2/3 of the "code belongs to us" , so I or Taludas will surely reupload it. - Old World Cathedral is a model from Anno 1404 extracted by Fishboss. I think Ac3s made a few adjustments to the graphic that will be lost now, but overall one can include it in other mods with Fishboss permission. - Disable Autosave on Quit is 100% my code, so I can upload it if someone needs it (I did not think anyone could need it, so I did not upload it myself initially) - Decrease notification time: It reduces the time for notifications which require your input, so it was never useful for me. I instead made a mod that reduces the time for notification which do not require your input: "shorter notification time" (it was already work back than to make ac3s aware, that my mod was not a copy of his mod and targeting completely different notifications :D) - School New world: not sure if he had his own graphic, but for sure a modder will upload a replacement for this, based on vanilla code, not ac3s code. - Increase Passive Attractivness: "Attractiveness Rebalancing [Spice it up]" may be an alternative, although I don't know the difference in code (since I do not have ac3s code).

[@redrey92]

Thank you very much for your caring insights (no pun intended. I followed your instructions to the letter).

[@trivialehochschulebielefel3962]

I think it's a bit absurd that some mod creators are so fervently against people "stealing ideas" or very small code snippets, while they are making (most of the time) unauthorized changes to someone elses software themselves.

[@aleksejkrpan]

Call me a naive fuzzy flower, but the last place I expected this kind of bullshit drama is a city-builder community -.-

[@tomh-tldr]

I just wanna be perfectly clear about this, no code was ever taken out of an existing mod. Serp wrote the code for me. I found the line in question via search on the mod discord; it had been posted there years ago by tethik and had been confirmed as working by a message someone else left as feedback to the Combat Overhaul mod. So that is how I knew Serp's approach was correct before even testing it. And because of this, I originally even credited Ac3s. Unfortunately my phrasing lead him to believe I took the idea to make this mod from his mod description and the code from his mod. Both is incorrect. I explained all details to Ac3s privately but what I could not do was go back in time to ask him for permission before uploading a mod with Serp's code. 🤷‍♂

[@attaboy8422]

Too big of an Ego, too little control over his own emotions and apparently it sounds like a lack or maturity & logic. If all you wrote is true as is than you did what you could and you didnt do anything wrong. I dont know the guy but i think he needs to grow up a little.

[@IIAc3sII]

@@attaboy8422 I suggest you look up Combat Overhaul, follow the link to my google site, then click on the link "I too have my limits", because so far all you heard was hear-say and doom from others without even seeing the other side of the coin and what really happened that instigated all of this.

[@IIAc3sII]

​@@attaboy8422 its a flat out lie what tomh says, he specifically looked for Combat Overhaul to know if it was possible and done before, found what he needed, then fully knowing he could not use the same code and was even told to only use it personally, to which he then replied "I have reworked it", he (or rather Serp) then reformulated the code differently, yet have the exact same outcome ingame, to then upload as hes own mod. Normally you would talk to another mod author before doing something like that, its common decency. Its all shown in screenshots if you would just look up "Combat Overhaul" and follow the links I provide, and the only reason tomh is parading around copy pasting the same "no code from CO was used" is because he changed/re-created it, based on the knowledge from another mod that did it long before, as all documented in hes own conversation. Aka, hes a copy-cat, that did not even bother to talk about it, even though I was right next door to him on the same server. These screenshots are visible in miniature (on the bottom) for 5 minutes on this video that Take made, yet not once did Taka even bother to show them, I can only wonder why he left out the proof and instead twisted the entire narrative to fit his own representation instead of just showing the screenshots.

[@judekw6034]

To give some context: The "code" which they argued about was a single line that if set to zero would stop the AI from buying shares of the player's islands. The line was no original code by Ac3s but by BlueByte and the value 0 the only value with that outcome. The other modder asked someone for help to achieve this, who correctly informed the former of that line. Not that Ac3s has any formal or informal copyright to code with a certain function from the original game in the first place; also how should any modder know of all the changes other mods make to the game (especially in cases the "mod" in question is a change to a single digit in a single line of code). I think his reaction was ridiculous from the start and spiraled into more and more drama. I'm sorry for the outcome as he was a good modder for sure and I hate to see potential go, but to blame the other modders for that decision is very odd.

[@Zivers]

To make it more clear what kind of person he is, I will add. I spent a week doing translations for this mod at night after my work. And even then I noticed that the author simply recieve the translation from me and waved his hand, without noting my participation anywhere. In the same way, several other translators also did not even write in the readme that we helped in the translation, simply out of gratitude. But now he is selling it. I'm amazed at people like this.

[@Jake.13]

Lol sounds like he’s a little baby. Hopefully a grown up will just make the same mod

[@nickpapadopoulos9978]

So the mod author is a petty control freak

[@IIAc3sII]

And yet here you are, just like so many others, throwing out insults to the person who spend 3 years creating it and giving it to everyone to enjoy. Its clear who the petty control freaks really are.

[@nickpapadopoulos9978]

@@IIAc3sII did you not watch the video?

[@IIAc3sII]

@@nickpapadopoulos9978 This video that is a misinterpretation of what really happened where Taka doesn't even read my words, nor even show the 3 screenshots I showed as proof, but instead gives hes own narration on what I said. Yeah, I watched it. I also watched all the comments from "grateful users that got 3 years of work for free", its very telling and shows how users such as yourself are greedy to the point of only wanting the mod, without an ounce of consideration towards the person behind the mod, going so far as to throw insults just because the mod was hidden for a few days. And people such as Taka jumping on it to generate drama with titles like "MOD DELETED" since that is what fuels hes viewership on youtube, an easy quick buck for him. Here is an idea, why don't you start making mods, and I will steal pieces of your mod, whether it may be code or ideas, so I can then upload them as my own, to then call you a petty control freak if you dare to object. But don't worry, I will then say "no code from your mod was used" as I reformulate it so it looks a bit different... Though I doubt you even understand what I'm saying, chances are you never made any decent mods, so you do not understand the learning curve and insane amount of time and energy it requires, so of course its easy for you to then judge since from your perspective its a freebie mod that fell out of the sky, while for me it was a hard journey that took me 3 years and burned me out several times. Only reason I even kept updating the mod and make it better was for the community, for users such as yourself, perhaps I shouldn't have. So have a good day sir, ignorance is bliss, and thank you for your appreciation and gratitude.

[@nickpapadopoulos9978]

@@IIAc3sII screenshots, eh? Would you show me those screenshots of yours then, if possible!

[@IIAc3sII]

@@nickpapadopoulos9978 screenshots are on mod page, just follow the rabbit hole Also my previous comments seem to get deleted, I should know better by now to not use youtube comments for extended conversations.

[@Alphapara]

Mod authors and dramatically overinflated egos, name a more iconic duo. Honestly the mod isn't good enough to have this much of a complex.

[@DigitalHoneyGaming]

JFC, what a baby.

[@waltblackadar4690]

Exactly. Butthurt baby.

[@dimasdwiki6146]

Really? What a shame. I'm glad i install all of my Anno 1800 mods manually so the mod is still there.

[@fluffytom82]

That took a long time. His presence is the only reason I'm not active on the Anno Discord. His behaviour previously got him banned (with several profiles even) from KZbin, Reddit and Nexus. He is extremely arrogant and impolite. Me fit one, I'm happy the modding community finally sees him for what he really is. The worshipping of him on Discord while I knew what kind of person he is, really missed me off.

[@adriankoch964]

People will just recreate his stuff in no time and this kid will be forgotten. If he thinks that RDR2 community is gonna be less toxic, good luck!

[@TheClem9779]

I can understand the frustration of your code being used without credit, but this is so petty it is childish... EDIT: Also this is why I download the mod files directly on my PC

[@tomh-tldr]

No code of his was used. See my comment above.

[@RC41591Shadow]

I used to do that, but I got tired of trouble shooting +80 mod folders after the game updates... I have greatly appreciated Mod IO for stabilizing and automatically pushing mod author updates.

[@NYCamper62]

Well I saved & have been using the latest version so if it turns out to be the last version - whatever. BTW - I do appreciate the work that was done to & with the overhaul mod, I really do. I also, for my own purposes, I've edited some of the code for my personal liking. No way am I the only one just stop. But I wouldn't release that either. Been doing that kinda jazz since the days of IRC. Just figured drama, Ken's & Karen's wouldn't drop the loop. Guess I was wrong.

[@brosonly3389]

crazy how some details were left out

[@TakaYouTube]

Part of that is on me and misunderstanding part of the situation when I was told about it a few days ago. However I did pin some more details about it for those interested.

[@IIAc3sII]

Yup, especially the screenshots that are visible in miniature (on the bottom) for 5 minutes on this video that Take made, yet not once did Taka even bother to show them, I can only wonder why he left out the proof and instead twisted the entire narrative to fit his own representation instead of just showing the screenshots.

[@brosonly3389]

@@IIAc3sII they probably going after you bc of political views lol

[@lishiping84]

OMG, I feel like in different game modding communities, rules and customs are different. Many years ago, this kind of similar situations happened a lot in the Mount and Blade 1 modding community, most people usually blamed the sub-mod author...

[@jammiedodger7040]

The overhaul mod is still downloadable now.

[@TakaYouTube]

He brought it back but it's a facade... the version on mod.io is basically half broken. You have to follow a third party link in the description and donate to him to get an updated version.

[@jammiedodger7040]

@@TakaKZbin So actually better using original download if you have it?

[@BanjoGate]

Are there any mods out there that nuke the AI difficulty? I've always wanted to play with the 3 star AIs for their dialogue and quests, but I don't want to have to deal with building fast and competing with them for resources. I can recall that when I added Hunt with the AI Harbor mod (after a long time getting to investors), she never really did anything but settle one single island and never progressed.

[@TakaYouTube]

I don't think so but I am sure someone in the modding community could make that happen!

[@serp4276]

Anyone feel free to use my "Everyone Hard AI" mod as base and do the opposite (make everyone 1 Star AI). But since this would be a very obvious and big use of my work (not only a single line), please mention me in the description and maybe also link to my Hard AI mod.

[@8wayz2shine]

I do not know whether I should be happy or saddened that this drama is taking place in the Anno community. On one side having more people making submods points to a growing and healthy modding community, with different ideas and approaches. Everyone wants that. But then you have different people with their own character coming online, which always results in some misunderstandings, one way or another. Hopefully they will just shake hands and agree to include mentions under each of their mods.

[@timdavison4675]

One of the reasons I manually install mods *shrugs*

[@donaldmeulemans6458]

Thanks for the , absolut unpartial, information on this. Much appreciated, as always!

[@attaboy8422]

When your ego is why you do things. I hear this kind of thing and i instantly know he didnt do it for the community, he did it to be "somebody" or show how great he is. Sure i heard the mod is great but this is something you do for people no matter if some small other modder takes a part of your code. You shouldnt let your emotions control you and instead focus on how many people really love your mod, thats why you most do it right? to make the game better and reach its potential? Its open source isnt it? So he knew people could do that, just make your peace with it. Probably got mad because he didnt come up with the idea for that submod or some other small ego crap. Taking his whole mod down and punishing all the players because of his way too big ego just shows that he needs to grow a backbone and grow up emotionally in many ways.

[@IIAc3sII]

Submod was wrong word of me, its literally a standalone mod that had been in CO for 2 years. They extracted it, reformulated the code purely to make it different from mine, even though it does the exact same thing ingame, in order to upload it. This is also why you see that tomh2024 guy parading all over this comment section saying "no code from CO was used", because he changed it, and the thing that pushed me over the edge was that none of them, while talking about me and CO in order to achieve this, even had the decency to have a talk with me about it. Regardless, I made CO for myself and then kept maintaining it 2 years after I even stopped playing Anno, all for the community, only to receive this kind of nonsense in return, not only from modders, but from users as well, as seen clearly from the endless hostility in this comment section.

[@stuka80]

i understand he's annoyed that someone used his work without crediting or asking him for permission, but honestly i feel he overreacted big time, he's acting like a kid throwing a tantrum.

[@tomh-tldr]

No code of his was used. See my comment above.

[@Scyths1]

I don't use mods for Anno 1800, never have and probably never will so this will not affect me, but couldn't other people who've already downloaded the mod just put it back on the website ? Does he actually have ownership of the code or parts of the code or is it free use because he doesn't own the rights to Anno 1800 ?

[@yannick4895]

idk about the owning part, he probably doesnt have any rights to his code, but there are certainly people who still have said code, including me

[@CarterElkins]

So far, according to the way the laws are interpreted by the courts, he has no ownership of his code. That said, anyone re-uploading the mod would need to keep the mod maintained, so that's a factor for consideration.

[@CavalierRoy]

Techniqually if he wrote the code himself then yes that belongs to him, and the moment its made available to the public its almost impossible to police those rights. However it is still throned upon by modders for using anyone elses work in less permission was granted by the author themselves. As for unoutherized changes to the game, the dev's made the game moddable so in all fairness he already has those rights to make any changes to the coding, textures etc he so wishes in less files are locked without access given by the dev's in which case is in breach of any terms and conditions the dev's have as far as modding goes. In short though, this is becoming more of an issue these day's as for joining other discord to upvote a mod to over rule the negative votes is something i feel is totally wrong and any modder doing this should be ashamed of themselves.

[@tomh-tldr]

No code of his was used. See my comment above.

[@CavalierRoy]

@@tomh-tldr Then you have done nothing wrong.

[@CarterElkins]

Developers do not relinquish any rights by making it easy for people to mod their work (or even encouraging it). Making the game moddable does not give the legal right to modders to make changes. In fact, in many cases developers have the right to implement mods they like directly into their game, with or without the permission of the modder (though to be fair, they usually do get permission as a courtesy). So while it's a little bit of a gray area currently, most likely this modder has no legal rights to his work whatsoever. Even if he did write code totally from scratch (not likely), it's code written to apply to the framework of Ubisoft's game, so it would probably still not be protected, if they decided to sue for some reason. So far courts heavily favor developers when situations regarding copyright and modding end up in court. Either way, he would certainly have no legal protection against other modders making submods from his.

[@TheAtomicANetwork]

Looks like CO is back online

[@Tibroxen]

Why are mod authors such divas, jesus.

[@ojngasdovnwdsifnweij]

mod author meltdowns are always hilarious. someone else will fill the modding demand, and when the author grows up they can come back.

[@FrakkinGaiusBaltar]

Spill that tea gamer

[@hantorfolezproductions4402]

What's stopping anyone who had the code downloaded from just reuploading it now that he threw his tantrum and left? It's a mod. It isn't like anyone has legal ownership over mod to a game's code they didn't make, or am I somehow mistaken?

[@TakaYouTube]

There's nothing stopping anyone from re-uploading the mod if he completely takes it down and deletes it from the database... But stuff like that is really looked down upon in the modding community and if there were bugs or anything outstanding that he had not fixed and needed to be worked on, it would be slim pickings on finding anyone to help with it.

[@hantorfolezproductions4402]

@TakaKZbin thanks for the insight. I haven't gotten into Anno mods yet as the vanilla game and DLCs has kept me well engaged for several hundred hours of gameplay just fine, but combat overhaul was one of the ones on my radar. Sad to see it go over something seemingly so petty

[@jakobharder]

You do have ownership of newly created assets and code, thus copies without permissions are not accepted. In fact, there are quite a few popular but broken mods out there where the author stopped supporting - and no one else can continue. The debate is never about if theft is OK, but whether a configuration value or an idea is unique enough to claim ownership.

[@valiarianthorson7582]

It's a bit sad Ac3s iding and goin to remove (or is removed) the Combat Overhaul mod I really Loved that mod alot *sadface* those mods made it more fun and intersting to play and so

[@chaostheory6283]

TLDR = Mod author is a big baby.

[@RC41591Shadow]

Thankfully I never used his combat overhaul mod. I am going to miss the extra ships though...

[@pohrerhub]

thank god I dowloaded the mod yesterday 😅

[@generalkidd3832]

This is not gonna affect Nivarias Anno gameplay right?

[@danielduncan6806]

Hahahahaha! They can both take a hike. I won't miss them. I don't care about the drama. But when people get like this... Well, I am an adult, and I ain't got no time for the children.

[@alexmikedis9609]

to be fair you should credit the modder youre using code from its just common courtesy

[@zerotheliger]

all he did was change a base game numerical value from a 1 to a 0 thats not stealing code.

[@ashes82]

Is this the same Ac3s mod author that basically did the exact same thing in the Skyrim community like five years ago? Threw a big hissy fit, harassed numerous groups, and got banned on Nexus. LOL

[@TakaYouTube]

Same person yes

[@alexkid1]

Aren't modding stealing code for the original game? I'm genuinely curious.

[@drendelous]

oh then there is no need to donate to him now

[@HeiseSays]

Aren’t mod authors entire creations based on someone else’s work?

[@lisekiilstofte5619]

Yes. That's why these things are always stupid and just hypocritical of mod authors when they go all in drama queen.

[@1mvn]

How silly.. sounds like some self esteem insecurities… too bad because I was excited about this mod

[@simoncodrington]

God what a weirdo, people need to get thicker skin when it comes to this stuff.

[@agatenby41]

sounds like he needs to grow a set, i'm a former modder myself, but not for anno, i always, as a rule asked permission, where possible, and if i couldnt get ahold of them for whatever reason, i would just credit them, and ask them to contact me if they needed to. while the smaller modder should have asked permission to use it, there is no need to spit the dummy,.. so sh happens, you accept, deal with it and move on.

[@tomh-tldr]

No code was ever taken out of his mod. See my comment from earlier.

[@dangdangsuperundefeatable3087]

Hey Could anyone get me a copy of the combat overhaul mod? Big appreciated

[@TheAtomicANetwork]

luckily i back up all the mods i use so even if he deletes it all, i still have most of my most used mods. However... this is such an overreaction. Even big gaming company's sometimes steal code snippets from other games and work that into their own code... Hell if you do a tutorial on YT u basicly do that to in some way! If u make good stuff, people will use it. Thats a fact. If people make an add-on for your mod, endorse it. I can understand that you want to be credited in it or something but this tantrum is a bit off.

[@Varrenor]

Imagine that u make one of the most popular, and the best mods for great game and screw entire community because u are cry baby and just show middle finger to everyone who just fall in love with your work. I mean, after a month nobody will even remember that great work, instead "remember that kido from discord drama?" Such a waste of potential and another hero of drama-content

[@VeggehGaming]

Well that is very disappointing. While I don't disagree with the initial flag-point as it's a mark of respect to credit the original authors if you're forking another project and creating your own, it feels like a series of overreactions has taken place since. In open-source development, you can only have so much control and recognise that you're going to have to give some up, depending on the license you operate under. It seems like Ac3s wanted more control than what he'd otherwise get, other modders have disagreed with his stance, and now takes it out on the whole community instead. He probably wasn't a pariah like he seems to claim he was then, but with this move he will be now... What a shame and such a waste...

[@tomh-tldr]

No code of his was used. See my comment above.

[@VeggehGaming]

@@tomh-tldr Thanks for the clarification. Looks like he's *really* overreacted to a non-issue then.

[@Kvs-vf9nt]

Damn,the guy sounds like a child. Hopefully a grown up makes the mods next. Damn 🤦‍♂️

[@samixz]

Man this kind of behaviour is hilarious

[@Abbittibbi]

Drama time...

[@greglikesYouTube]

I'll be honest, seems childish on all accounts. Why be bothered by what other modder's make off of your mod, especially if your mod is still required? I've seen plenty of times where a submod gets absorbed by the main mod because "it's a good idea" and "makes it more accessible" to others. Sounds like kids just getting fussy sharing the same sandbox.

[@CarterElkins]

I'm surprised this guy achieved such success in modding while totally misunderstanding the nature of modding. Submods are a fact of life for any healthy modding community, and I've never seen a modder so egotistical as to demand ownership of all submods lol. As a modder, he has no ownership of his work, and has no right to demand that submods bend the knee to him. Asking permission is a courtesy, sure, but they're under no obligation to do that either. Removing his mod makes him look like he's "taking his ball and going home," and completely undercuts his guilt trip about how much he cares for the community.

[@NatalieBall-mw5nz]

Code is a funny one, there has been a long history of sharing code, changing code, using code. As a coder myself I can say the general rule of thumb is you don't start with a blank page, you take code that is already in the world and change it to your needs. Now, should they have acknowledged that they borrowed a line of code? It probably would have been a good idea and it also depends on what that code is doing but at the end of the day a modder must remember that they themselves have borrowed a very large code themselves. Ether way throwing a tantrum and going home with your ball general doesn't win you many favors on the internet.

[@aseanrocks]

*laughs in Stellaris mods*

[@DCCxSunGlade]

My first question is; does he use other mods and inspiration from others??? If so then he has no right to complain. As a modder myself I have no problem with people using my code, ideas etc to make other mods… maybe they’ll make something I didn’t think of and make the game more fun for all of us!

[@onimikozero6161]

wow.. just wow... i wantet to play a game with my favoirte mods and now i have to see this. Thats so childish and emberessing.

[@hansmuller7859]

drama queen

[@FortuneZer0]

It was a damn curteousy request. How can people be so lazy?

[@tomh-tldr]

No code was taken out of his mod. See my comment from earlier.