Comic Book Tropes that need to stop! (Podcast)

[@ultimate_lance]

The trope of aging kids as fast as possible so they can leave the book

[@komickid833]

*cough* Bendis *cough*

[@WannabeWryter]

Poor Jonathan Kent 😢

[@gregcourtney751]

@@komickid833 and then have a strawman for complaining fans in one of your last superman issues.

[@samkaranja5709]

Here's one - one of the big two, usually marvel goes "hey, so I see you got a real popular book right now. I see you're doing a new arc... Well we're gonna turn that arc into an event even if there isn't enough for an event."

[@WhiteRaven696]

Oh, god. They just did that with Trial of Magneto. It was just supposed to be an arc in X-Factor. But they cancelled the book and made it into an event. For no reason.

[@samkaranja5709]

@@WhiteRaven696 I feel like I can almost 100% guarantee that X live/X deaths is just a Wolverine/X-force arc turned into an event

[@WhiteRaven696]

@@samkaranja5709 I haven’t even read it yet, but I can very much guarantee it.

[@steviemacc2745]

AXIS LITERALLY MADE REMENDER LEAVE MARVEL🤣

[@gregcourtney751]

Does flashpoint count? Thats how it always read to me: a flash storyline they used an excusr to reboot.

[@benjaminloudly]

Comic book specific tropes or just ideas ran into the ground at this point. 1. 25:08 Batman being one of top 3 smartest people on Earth in DC but getting out smarted by random rogues. How the hell is he smart enough have contingencies for stopping Justice League members but not for stopping identity theft (basically Joker War)? 2. Lifting Mjolnir being a big deal. 3. Anything involving symbiotes in Marvel.

[@kt83976]

In terms of tropes, comics really are soap operas with less pregnancy storylines.

[@blackwingdragon1]

To be fair, Spider-Man has an almost equal amount of pregnancy storylines to most soap operas lol.

[@notsosmartguy6254]

One that bugs me is breaking up perfectly good couples cause the writer wanted to write something else. Like when Karolina and Julie powers broke in runaways so Nico and Karolina could be a thing.

[@MWhaleK]

Or Spider-man and Mary Jane.

[@polarknight5376]

Just make polycules. It worked for The Three Stooges.

[@foxhound9780]

Batman being psychology abusive or manipulative to the bat-family or other heroes but then when they call him out the writer has to frame it like he's was I'n the right all along cause having him try to fix a flaw with himself is less interesting I guess?

[@strawboyhawkins3]

The secret sibling trope is easily the worst

[@WhiteRaven696]

It is. But I love the idea of Teresa Parker, so I can forgive it some times.

[@edmaldonado8207]

The moment I see "Death of" in the title of a Marvel or DC comic I immediately don't care.

[@TheCosmicFailure]

It is hard to care when the character comes back less than a yr later.

[@alexandrefrauches132]

One trope that seriously needs to stop is comic book companies killing off character with no build up, contributes nothing to the story and it happened just so they can take these characters as "hostage", playing with the fans expectations that they might bring them back or not unless they keep reading the books. Heroes in Crisis is great exemple of this, where the kill many character and let the fans in that state were we don't know if they will come back or not.

[@NewPhoneWhoThis52]

Death in comics are really an eye roll for me .

[@koushikraja331]

Finally, someone spoke about the deathstroke/ghostmaker/abyss thing. I miss calculator. He was a really cool birds of prey villain and is a cool mirror version for oracle and could be the connecting thread for the supervillain community....man I miss those days.

[@batvader9511]

Controversy becoming character. Example Avengers #213 Hank Pym hitting Janet while in the midst of a mental breakdown and not being able to move past it. It was brought back up in the HackTron story after Secret Wars. He was STILL getting crap over it, even though there are literal former assassins on the Avengers, but he slapped his wife once and he's worse than Thanos?

[@soujimura4839]

Especially compared to Tony and all the crap he did with the civil war, the Illuminati, and Norman Osborn

[@paulg.4812]

Maybe too niche to actually be a trope, but trying to force a popular character to be a loner. Mostly thinking with Batman/Wolverine and under some writers, Spider-Man. Writers like to portray the character as being a loner despite them constantly crossing over with other characters and being on at least one major super team. It's fine for them to start as a loner, but acknowledge when that changes. It especially gets annoying when said character has to "learn" the value of relying on others for like the 1,000th time, despite them clearly knowing how to work with teams/ask for help already.

[@komickid833]

If sal saw this he’d have a conniption

[@rachitmittal448]

I think writer sometimes don't understand "Loner". They just equate with someone who can't work in team.

[@komickid833]

@@rachitmittal448 This is also the case

[@PharaohDom]

Last I saw Blue Devil was in Justice League Dark. If I recall he was the hero and sort of Ruler of the mystical realm that you can travel to with the sword Detective Chimp has.

[@komickid833]

Justice league dark is what they called shadow pact because shadow pact couldn’t sell a book

[@superluigiac]

While he's still with us, please dedicate an episode to George Perez, since i feel he is not really talked about lately, besides his illness...

[@ericrobins5188]

I found it weird that in superior Spider-Man, in 2 seconds of talking to Superior Spider-Man Norman Osborn as the Green goblin knew that wasn't Peter behind the mask. 2 seconds!

[@WhiteRaven696]

Ooh, and for the second-to-last question about Harley Quinn and Deathstroke, if they ever want to retcon away the affair with Terra, they should rip off the Teen Titans cartoon. Being the father figure to an emotionally unstable girl just to betray her after she has no one? Still makes him a monster, but doesn't make him a predator.

[@TheCosmicFailure]

Totally agree. I love Deathstroke mostly due to his 2 most recent runs of Tony Daniel and Christopher Priest but it's hard to ignore what he did to Terra. At least Priest insinuates they never had sex and that he just used her infatuation to his advantage.

[@PharaohDom]

I used to think about the Tim reveal the same way as you, Sal. Watching a Comic Drake video on it and seeing actual bi readers discuss it and their reading of his history, especially his relationship with Connor, squared the circle with me.

[@TheCosmicFailure]

I agree with Sal regarding Joker. He doesn't need to be involved in 2-3 arcs every yr. I'm fine with 1 and he just disappears. I'm fine with an occasional dialogue from characters wondering where he is.

[@jasondaniel8861]

Was that '90s Spider-Man comic you were reading Round Robin: A Sidekick's Revenge? That was one of the first full story arcs I ever bought myself as a kid so it'll always have special place in my heart. I didn't know who any of the other characters were at the time, but there were a lot of superheroes on those covers and I was elated when I found out that the little thrift shop that I bought them in actually had all six parts available. It managed to get me interested in Nova and Moonknight. I actually just bought the digital collection at comixology at the end of this year and have been meaning to reread it. Also Darkhawk was in there and Darkhawk looked super cool so that was also exciting to me as a kid.

[@MrFaceNumeroUno]

I read it issue by issue as a young fella and loved it. Great characters

[@GRUBNICK98]

The only comic book that I subscribed too was Amazing Spider-Man and the first issue that I got was the final issue of Round Robin: A Sidekick’s Revenge. I also picked up the rest of it later down the line. It gives me the warm and fuzzies as well. How about doing this for an episode of Back Issues? It features Moonknight!!!

[@kliqadamblack]

One of my favorite Spider-Man stories. I recognized it immediately when Sal described it. Someone said it was the first Red Hood/Winter Soldier style story. Good times.

[@MrFaceNumeroUno]

@@kliqadamblack oh yeah! But everyone forgets that. Like my Dad always said there's nothing new under the sun lol

[@jasondaniel8861]

@@kliqadamblack yeah I read it many times growing up. It never really thought to make that connection though. I just remember it being a lot of fun. I definitely need to go back and reread it and see how it holds up for me.

[@leirycpanizales5254]

Skyhigh is surprising good. I like it a lot too.

[@iandaly]

Constant new #1s. And all of Marvel's "Point" issues (#700.1, #18.MU, #5.HU, #9.INH, etc).

[@christianvanmater3233]

I haven't watched yet, but here are a few things I'm tired of. Not sure is these are all exactly "tropes." - Constant relaunches/renumberings (How many Amazing Spider-Man #1's are there?) - Not allowing characters to age/evolve over time. I want to see Peter Parker start a family, grow old, and die. Let stories end. - Events/tie-ins disrupting other stories. I shouldn't have to read Infinite Secret Crisis War II to understand what's going on in Hawkeye. - Suddenly aging characters up. Let Jon Kent be a kid, damn it!

[@middle_pickup]

I loved your soap box on limits of the market, Sal. Every market has a limit, but common belief is otherwise. This is one of the fundamental lies of the modern age.

[@Draliseth]

Having Chris from Comic Tropes on would be kinda rad? Also, I think you're on point Sal, regarding art from adversity. It's part of the reason I wish Superhero movies weren't the blockbusters they are. I *wish* I could have seen a 90's Spidey flick. Imagine how they'd have to sell you on webslinging in an era where CGI couldn't cut it? It's part of the reason I want a Detective Comics Batman show. Really, more of a live action adaptation of the Timm series. Even though they were doing a cartoon, where *ANYTHING* is possible, they kept it more grounded than anything else - even the Nolan films. John Wick was a low budget movie. It's turned into a bit of a franchise monster, production wise. The small stakes, intimate locations, and intense action is what made it great. Now they're cranking that dial up on EVERYTHING, story, stakes, locations, etc. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. 'Nuff said.

[@gageboan3961]

I'm 7 minutes in, but im sick of writers at marvel making villians completely inept. Hydra goons are all idiots and no longer a threat at all just foder

[@TheMelMan]

0:16 ComicPops that need to stop is funnier than it should be 😂😂😂

[@devilsadvocateproductions]

Cheering at Sal going off on the industry and laughing at quickly transitioning to a donation.

[@CasualClassroom]

Sal, I’m an aspiring comic book KZbin channel, you and your wife is one of my big inspirations since my girlfriend has encouraged my channel so much, this is a lot of information on me that you didn’t ask for, but I’m drunk, so thank you sal

[@CptCrash21]

Cary Grant wasn't gay. This rumor has been addressed and debunked by people who knew him including his own daughter in a book she wrote about her father. It's possible he did experiment in his younger years, but he was most definitely a ladies' man.

[@leirycpanizales5254]

That Alternate Skyhigh story could have been the story of My Hero Academia. But like Skyhigh he got the most powerful quirk and all his data gathering and analysis skills took a backseat to punching really hard.

[@keybladelovers]

My most hated one is "WERE THE SAME YOU AND I HERO" When they never work for it

[@Syntherus]

I think those "move the car George" moments can be used properly as long as they're extremely brief and used for random goons. Just to remind you that they're just regular people under their silly masks.

[@alejandrovalenzuela7994]

I love this conversations, co grats on your 100k

[@seand7042]

Dammit the theme song was in my head! Then Sal immediately squashed anything I could do with it

[@HelFrostKara]

The thing that comes to mind for me (tho it's usually more a thing live action adaptations but I have seen in comics) is in both Marvel and DC stuff it is well established that all sorts of magic, mythologies and weird science stuff exists and characters being skeptical. "the dragon was a metaphor right???" "wolverine don't believe in no vampires!!" it's also not ambiguous to readers. Oh also universal power dampening collars or whatever. Narratively it is too convinient and they just feel silly. People's powers come from a myriad of sources how is it gonna get them all? And if the power is biological, how does it know not to like disable a lung or something?

[@TheHairopia]

Well the trope goes along with the make a new character or doppelganger and they use him for a hot second then the new writer makes them vanish *cough cough (evil Captain America and evil Reed Richards) cough cough. Felt like they are like hey guys it's a shiny nickel. Nope never mind. Didn't hate the characters but I wish we never had them.

[@komickid833]

At least the maker shows up from time to time nobodies seen evil captain America since the end of secret empire

[@joshheralal8758]

Death in comics should stop for a bit.

[@TheCosmicFailure]

They shouldn't stop. But if they committ to killing someone they should stay dead for more than a year. They also need to make sure that if they bring them back then they need to have a plan for that character.

[@ishaanallidina4488]

Two comic book tropes I need to go away are breaking up superhero marriages because editorial thinks that a superhero being married makes them too old like Joe Quesada breaking up Spider Man and Mary Jane's marriage because spidey being married made him unrelatable and having clones of the hero running around!

[@The_GeekLeak]

Move the car George I’m pretty sure is a trope for taking up page estate to kinda stall story progression but not stop the narrative

[@middle_pickup]

Haven't watched this show in a minute, but just wanted to say the audio sounds excellent-especially Sal's.

[@Joe-jj3fg]

I hate the secret sibling trope more than anything

[@timgonzales2891]

I immediately stop reading if it's "character loses their powers for this arc, finds out they're more than their powers". I'm good. I read superheroes to be super. Not to lose their powers

[@WhiteRaven696]

Regarding the question about Bobby and Tim and their LGBT status, I think the original poster meant their prior relationships tend to be ignored once they come out. Which I think is a bit unfair. Bobby and Kitty did have a bonding moment where they talked about their relationship. And Tim is apparently going to sit down and talk with Stephanie soon.

[@anthonyencinias287]

Overexposure. Putting a popular character on every team and appear in every book. I'm not talking about just villains but the heroes. Stop putting Wolverine on every team and appear in every book. I know he has a healing factor but even he needs to get some sleep. That's coming from a huge Wolverine fan. I can only afford to get so many books and I like other characters.

[@TubezThe1]

Companies leaving extremely significant characters out of event. I think this might just be cause I want to see Blue Marvel and Spectrum in a book because there is so much they could be using them for. Just imagine a story story where they are taking care of these ridiculously powerful threats to the planet or the universe. Ultron showed back up and Spectrum scrambles his code, while BM writes a code to get rid of him for a while. Super Skrull is heading towards earth but these two intercept him and send him away. Hell just a day in the life, something.

[@chuckjamm]

The Naruto Phenonmen: The village idiot who is the most powerful person on the planet

[@seand7042]

Naruto was never an idiot though...a novice and class clown sure but he's never just been outright stupid

[@benjaminloudly]

That's more of a shonen jump/manga trope than anything else but agreed.

[@cybercop0083]

It‘s actually like that in out village. We have the town doofus, who is unstoppable, because he doesn‘t know his own strength.

[@drigodamus]

Anything media, art, tech, if it’s been around long enough it becomes a trope of itself and I believe comics are at that point. That’s why we see nothing but deconstructions and reboots.

[@pro16m]

I have 2 specific ones for Mavel and DC each: enough of the whole "Sandman minus Sandman" books. Give Daniel his due of a series just like Morpheus, whether it's breaking the bank to get Gaiman on board or a protégé of his that fits Neil's narrative and is a part of the DC Universe. For Marvel, C-Listers getting a little bump and are then gone. (i.e.: Cloud Nine and Gauntlet from Civil War era.) How is great characters like Songbird and Armor not given a mini series or a bigger spot on the Avengers and X-men respectfully?

[@daelen.cclark]

When it comes to event titles; make war no more. I also think Tim’s just experimenting.

[@GreekJR2]

1:15:55 a lot of gay people came out later in life. The idea that they're "changed" is rediculous.

[@debbys-abqnm4537]

Trope? Female hero (or "hera") has plenty of time to make her hair beautiful and put on just the right amount of make up, and of course wear nearly no clothing at all (which did work in one ancient Batman comic wherein the Boy Wonder learned the advantage of Batgirl wearing flimsy clothing). Nearly all the male heroes (or "heroes") wear completely form (body) fitting costumes and have a tremendous amount of musculature on their near Hulk-like bodies. When do they visit a restroom? Do they have time even to eat? It's all kinda boring. _Astro City_ has done clothing much better in all respects.

[@94evangelion]

Death should stop be a revolving door. What is the point of killing them off in the 1st place if you're gonna revive them. & Don't undo deaths that feels like a definite end to the character. CoughNormanOsbornCoughBarryallen.

[@michaelpeer7232]

Watching this a year later, and once again Doc Ock has a big plan for Spiderman in an upcoming story… the cycle continues

[@jonahmaple8840]

Crazy how Alan Moore fit all of these worst ones

[@jasondaniel8861]

I agree with that point about the young heroes not needing to superhuman to be special. I love My Hero Academia, but I thought that was going to be the premise and I was really disappointed to begin with when deku gets powers like three episodes in. I think it would have been way cooler to have a kid who loves heroes and is knowledgeable but can't get powers become a Great hero among a whole bunch of powerful people like a young Batman like Sal was saying.

[@jasondaniel8861]

I feel like the whole you too can be a hero speech was much more moving before the powers and was immediately cheapened when he not only immediately got powers but was given the chance to be the most powerful hero of all time pretty much instantly. Once again, still love the show.

[@paulg.4812]

That was my exact same experience with the show. Really feels like such a missed moment because it felt like the whole entire point of the first episode was showing that Deku responded like a hero despite not having any powers, only for him to then get what is basically one of the top powers in the universe/how the only way he can be the best hero in the world is mastering said power, and he's the only one that can actually save the world because he has powers.

[@famousthaneus9810]

Y’all don’t watch enough Shonen anime if you didn’t think Deku was gunna get powers. I agree it was a missed opportunity, but it’s also something they’ve handled really well if you ask me. He got powers, but he wasn’t OP off rip. Having him learn to use/control them while also still having him showcase his hero knowledge & utilize it in battle was something they could’ve easily tossed to the wayside

[@jasondaniel8861]

@@famousthaneus9810 I've watched plenty of Shonen anime but that doesn't mean I can't hope it's subverts my expectations every once in a while. I completely agree that they've done a great job with it since then and like I said in my initial post I love the show it's probably my favorite anime right now. And I'm only watching the anime not reading the manga but it seems like we may get some of what I wanted to explore through All Might anyway at this point. The show is awesome as it is, but back when I was watching the third episode I was still disappointed at the shift in direction like I said above, and I can't help but wonder what could have been in that alternate version of the story.

[@shadowanderson2004]

I manly thought that Bobby should be bi not gay as Emma frost has read his mind and saw him thinking about her.

[@jonsmith9838]

trashman sounds like vulture from the first Tom Holland Spiderman

[@timmeyer9191]

I miss 80s comics.

[@famousthaneus9810]

On the subject of Tim Drake, I distinctly remember the writer tweeting that she was trying to explore him questioning his sexuality, but everyone else ran with him being concretely bisexual and never saw the tweet again. It's interesting because the whole thing was handled in a really weird/rushed way, but I think telling a story where the character is questioning whether they are or aren't something would've very much been worth telling.

[@galvatron3323]

Comics are built on tropes really its just a matter of the quality of the execution and payoff whether or not you accept it at the end of the day....in saying that Clones!! Enough already also Batman having some sort of evil sibling uncle cousin etc.

[@That_One_Guy-.]

33:43 What are you talking about? People shat on Tony for years after civil war, he was not "quickly forgiven".

[@PharaohDom]

Convenient incompetence

[@jrthe3rd821]

Comic Drake has a good video explaining why it makes sense that Tim Drake is Bisexual

[@kman1084]

Marvel, everyone and their mother does not need to get space j**zed. Stop symbioting everyone and everything.

[@Qwerty-jy9mj]

Turning characters gay. It's now trite and expected.

[@dusktiger112]

Making a change to character and making everything about a that change and makes the character boring.

[@sterling9314]

“There is no evidence in Tim’s history” Sal, buddy. He’s a kid. Did you expect him to walk up to Batman’s house at like 8 years old and say “hi I’m Tim Drake and I’m bisexual”?

[@comicpopreturns]

I don't think anybody suggested that at all.

[@noaholson9047]

The #1 thing for me (⛔️fair Warning ⛔️ ) 1 2 3 QUIET REPLACING ALREADY ESTABLISHED CHARACTERS WITH GENDER RACE BENT VERSIONS OF THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!