Commander Pet Peeves | EDHRECast 220

[@mfitkin]

My pet peeve is a Disorganized battlefield. Like if it’s way out of whack. Or if you don’t resolve your triggers out loud or in at least somewhat of the correct order. I just want to know what’s going on and it can be hard, especially on spelltable

[@ApexZer0]

My one boys like this he only half taps his.mana I've seen him a few times not cast stuff he might of had mana for because he can't remember which lands are tapped

[@IneptCardCollector]

I really need this as a new player. The verbal repetition and confirmation of the correct way to say what's going on is crucial with so many weird interactions.

[@amphilochusofmallus5070]

​@@ApexZer0lol I have two somewhat regular pods where in each pod, there's at one person who's bad about this. One I'm pretty sure does it to cheat extra plays in late game, as he is they type to pay for multiple things at once, and just tell you what the overall CMC is. He's been caught "accidentally" using lands twice in a turn a couple times. The other one, she just forgets that it matters to other people and will happily slow down and explain everything and clarify her board if asked. The difference between why their boards get so messy has a major impact on the rest of the pods. The first example, for whatever reason, the pod is playing less and less. The latter, I'm looking forward to playing with her and that pod tomorrow

[@pattycake520]

I hate it when a player doesn't tap their permanents a recognizeable 90 degrees. Even a full 45 is acceptable, but a friend of mine likes to tap items like 10°. It's a little difficult to have to memorize which cards he was touching on his turns because he refuses to tap properly. I'm proud to say I am good at remembering those things though.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Most people that tap 10⁰ or so I've ran into do it because they can't count very well and to avoid thinking more they keep their lands and permanents where they can keep track of them.

[@pattycake520]

@@kingfuzzy2 That doesn't make any sense. If someone is having difficulty keeping track of which creatures and lands they've used, then it only strengthens the reason they should tap the permanents more idenfiably.

[@Atmatan]

Wizards changed the rules so tapping lands improperly is a disqual. Make your players change as the game does.

[@brandontankersley8107]

​@pattycake5202 it definitely sounds like the person in question could be a little sus in their board state. Maybe they're innocent, but it could easily be a trick they use to catch opponents not traking what they have open.

[@michaelpatalano9884]

My biggest pet peeve is that you guys only do one of these a week😭

[@pattycake520]

I relate to the distracted player immediately. When we're all at my mother's house playing edh, my brother will usually also literally walk away from the table to play a video game on the TV in the next room between his turns.

[@marcoottina654]

It seems disregarding the time and attention of the others and a selfish acting. If I would see a friend of mine, or similar, acting like that, I surely invite him to reflect on how he seems to perceive us (we are not just a bunch of puppets to play with: we are people with both feelings and precious time that we want to dedicate to others, so I don't want both of them to be de-valued)

[@pattycake520]

@@marcoottina654 I agree. My original comment was sarcasm, as I find it extremely annoying when he returns to his turn and has to ask "What did I miss?". Perhaps he wouldn't have missed it if he was involved in the game the whole round. Through experience, I've learned calling out this behavior doesn't actually change the behavior. A selfish person doesn't stop being selfish because someone calls them selfish, they just double down and decide the small amount of time they were sharing is no longer worth sharing. In this example, it would likely mean they no longer want to play.

[@ethanwiggen3567]

As some one who enjoys interactive games, my pet peeve is people who get salty over single target removal/counterspells. Part of edh for me is trying to execute my game plan but also defending myself from other people's, gotta have an offense and a defense.

[@Garl_Vinland]

Which is why I put hexproof and shroud on all my stuff. Your proclivity to run removal makes my pillow fort strategy relevant.

[@theautisticguitarist7560]

You know what's the funniest counter for single target exile/destruction? Sac to phyrexian/dementia/ashnod's altar.

[@chaseclosed3771]

I think a pet peeve that bothers me is when someone complains and focuses on a colors weakness’s, rather than find a colors strengthens and playing into that. I feel the color identity exists to bring out personality to your decks, so show off your colors!

[@felipeguidolin1055]

My biggest pet peeve is other players trying to play my turn for me... You don't know my strategy, you don't know my hand, you don't know what I consider to be a threat or not. Stop trying to tell me how I should play.

[@ApexZer0]

I'm this player I do it so it takes the heat off my stuff

[@schwarzertee7586]

have you tried playing faster? usually that happens to people who think 5 minutes, then play a land and that's that and have absolutely no instant responses for the rest of the turn cycle.

[@xilch0]

I completely understand that frustration. I've been playing for over 11 years now and tend to know what my plan is. And people who talk to me like they assume I don't have a plan bother me. But I know it happens because I play dumb to catch people unguarded. On the alternate side of this. I tend to not comment or question what others are doing. Unless I know they are a newer player, and I can help them get more milage out of their play. Such as advising on someone's sequences to get more landfall triggers.

[@Morrodin182]

Damn you must hate my Glissa / Mindslaver deck :p ... I will play your turn every turn *evil grin*

[@rosewarrior706]

Mine is: you should play this commander instead of that commander it's better, as they complain about getting destroyed as they complain I play high synergy cards as they complain when I target them as they keep removing my crap even when I'm not even close to the biggest threat, it's like ya I'm gonna swords to plows your 2/2 bear while the other guy has a 80/80 locust of mana

[@pixelbomb97]

In response to the archenemy conversation: I think being a DM has prepared me to be the villain and actively encourage the rest of the table to remove my threats and band together to kill me.

[@sirmoth3955]

I never thought about it like that, but I am definitely in this comment. I usually have "stronger" decks than the rest of my playgroup that pull out ahead early, but I rarely win because I become the arch enemy and praise them for beating my threats. DM energy full stop. 😂

[@EllingOftedal]

Fellow DM here, I don't encourage them killing me. But rather when I don't actively play I view it from the position of the active player and would try to objectively view the game.

[@UnreasonableOpinions]

I get bored of politics and don’t really play them, and will spend all the interaction and attacks I have whether or not it’s technically needed, so I am going to end up someone’s target every game. That’s why I like to play decks that EARN the title. Not necessarily strong ones, but ones that can become a big problem very quickly - like Ramses assassins, which is not a very potent deck but can suddenly go from trivial to existential threat. I would prefer to die first doing a tremendous amount of disruption on the way than to sit about playing slow politics until the clearly-strongest deck wins again.

[@bobby45825]

BIG agree on the threat assessment/archenemy section. Holy shit is that THEEEEEE biggest issue with my group. Politics gets a little TOO abused in avoiding that title.

[@TedMattos]

A pet peeve I have is when a player plays a spell and proceeds with the card's ETB not giving somebody a chance to respond. "Okay, so I'll play sad golemn." He then picks up his deck to start searching for his land. Granted, it may be VERY rare somebody counters a sad golemn, but at least just PAUSE to see if there are any response. Maybe I'm being too picky. :)

[@ApexZer0]

This is very meta dependent I feel. Like in my meta we don't play alot of counter magic unless it's a control deck so no ones countering your ramp if no one has the control deck

[@yohnazo]

I think that if other players are moving too fast in a game, it's fine to ask players to slow down and leave small pauses between plays. I find usually if playing interaction you need to be super focused and quick at making descisions, so you can jump in with a response, that can be a very tiring way to play though, so asking others to slow down a bit is fine too.

[@Ultinuc]

My friend will do that or he'll go to combat and immediately declare his attackers and I'm like. Dude. I wanted to do a thing before you declared your attacks

[@Ketoinvestor]

Players using Islands can be annoying, we know this about ourselves. But we serve a role and we often don’t get the 3-seconds of space needed to simply say, “I’m going to think about responding to the card you just played.” One (out of many) appropriate things we all can do when Islands are untapped is to play spells by saying, “I’m going to attempt to cast such-and-such. Is there any response” instead of rushing into the next piece of your crushing, game-winning combo 😂

[@UnreasonableOpinions]

For default plays with little weight it’s fair enough to roll on unless someone says ‘go back’, but it’s common courtesy to check for responses on huge moves - Don’t assume you resolve your Living Death unopposed. Particularly, once you go through a combo that will go infinite, or as you lay out a known instant-win combo, outright ask if people have responses because it can make a big difference when in the steps they respond. Especially if you are removing players at different stages and someone may want to let others die before shutting it down.

[@DCII]

My pet peeve. My current main group are all family and friends that are all in daily or near daily contact with each other and are all 20+ years younger than me. Consequently they often engage in conversations that revolve around their lives while on their turns. This often turns a 2 hour game into a 3 hour game which can and does often lead to no second game that night or a shortened game because someone has to leave. I mean I understand we're all gathering together to have fun and enjoy each other's company, but seriously I came to have fun playing the game. And I'm not saying you can't talk about other stuff, I literally love all these people. I want to know everything about all of them, but I'm there to have fun playing this game we've all spent hours and hours building these decks. You can still talk about that stuff just not on your turn or to the person who's turn it is. I mean plus the not paying attention to the game.

[@aaroncorsini6165]

I hate it when people take long turns without doing stuff so when theres gonna be another 45 minutes of me doing nothing I'll distract myself otherwise it's not bearable

[@lazysynergy]

I built a krark sakashima deck and boy did I dismantle that after a couple of games

[@kismetsoul4593]

I personally love Goad. I have a goad deck built myself that I play from time to time (Kitt Kanto). It really helps in games where all people seem to want to do is play solo and just build up massive stall boards. It doesn't stop play and actually forces interaction.

[@selkokieli843]

I love goad too. I always strive to make attacks so I don't mind it at all but many players I know despise it! It's a bit of a loss of agency and uncomfortable situation. I agree with the crew here, it's best in moderation. Kardur would make it stale very fast for me too.

[@MEver316]

Goad is great until someone is killing Kardur and reviving him every turn. Technically Kardur is a goad like effect than actually goading though. I know I'm being pedantic but it does change things. If I cast disrupt decorum and then on their turn someone casts a creature with haste in their first main phase, it can attack me or even not attack at all because it came in after the goad effect. With Kardur though, in the same situation, it does have to attack someone other than me. It isn't the creatures that are goaded, but the players who are forced to attack with everything they have. Or tl:dr Goad is great, Kardur is hell. Source: my brother's Kardur deck...

[@Demotros]

A flip side when people don’t say they are the threat is that you don’t always know what’s in their hand or deck. Someone getting a a few strong pieces onto a board can look threatening when they have no follow through. I was playing Bane the other week, and people were creating this shadow boogeyman where I was pulling all these combo pieces when they killed my creatures and they opted for cars draw instead of cheating things into play… I pulled straight lands, and since I could only play a land per turn I have a full grip of cards. Which ALSO scared them. I was seen as a threat with a 2/2 chupacabra and my commander on the board and 3 islands, 2 plains, a swamp and a Bojuka Bog in my hand.

[@vengray8055]

Card draw is scary and how did they know you had no follow through? Did you show them the your hand? If not then yeah good move on the person part putting cards in your hand because that is a powerful effect.

[@HomeCookinMTG]

My biggest pet peeve is people who wait until the last minute to do something that doesn't matter, and take up time for no reason. I get it with certain things you want to wait till the last minute so you have all of the information you need, but bro it's turn one just crack your evolving wilds, don't wait until the last person's end step before your turn.

[@screwthisin]

I think one way to do this is crack it or cast an instant tutor on someone else's turn like the next player's turn but say that I am going to cast it on the last player's turn so you can say that you can change your search aat any time. However if you have a must draw on triggers before the turn that you search.

[@HomeCookinMTG]

@@screwthisin yeah like I said I'm talking about in situations where it literally doesn't matter, like turn one evolving wilds and not cracking it until the very last minute there's no point you're just eating up everybody's time for no reason

[@selkokieli843]

@@screwthisin This is so good. At this point I always search my lands right away for the next turn, sometimes I need to shuffle them back but ends up saving time on average!

[@breyor1]

Just because you don’t understand doesn’t mean it’s pointless. They are leaving the max amount of time to make a decision. Maybe they took the time to consider whether they want a higher chance of drawing a land or not. Maybe they are considering getting a swamp or an island because their turn 2 play was changed by someone else’s play.

[@HomeCookinMTG]

@@breyor1 it was a casual game with nothing real at stake. Go touch grass.

[@primeascendant797]

I don't mind finicky decks or combo decks, but I want to see exactly the interactions/synergies/etc going on, mana payments, and more. In my experience, intentionally or unintentionally, players with these kinds of decks tend to not keep track of things very well, and tend to play faster than they should. In fact, they often just don't have the mana or other resources to pull off whatever they're trying to do. Casual or not, if we're going to watch someone play solitaire for 15 minutes, I'm a stickler for honesty. Assuming they do have their win or nutso interaction, being walked through it will also give me an idea of where I can interact in the synergy chain to stop them, in future games. Could give me ideas for my own decks too.

[@markbn89]

My biggest pet peeve is past game memory. When someone is considered the arch enemy when someone else is about to go off and win the game

[@IneptCardCollector]

First game I ever played at my LGS two players in the pod talked about some tiff they had before like five different times during our game. They weren't even friends so it wasn't jovial. There was bad blood between them LMAO. It was uncomfortable since the other two of us were like "So Uh.... I'll tap my land...."

[@jben6]

That is how I was taught to play multiplayer games of any sort. "Remember when you won Axis and Allies last year? Because of that, I am targeting you in this Magic game."

[@Damn_Cat]

I had a recent game that featured three of the pet peeves you listed: the archenemy wouldn't admit they were the archenemy (despite me sitting on a quarter of my starting life total because of the archenemy, and being completely at the mercy of their next 1-2 turns of combat, I was labelled the archenemy by them and the other players just agreed because I was doing slightly better than they were at building a board presence to try to defend myself), the archenemy made a deal with the other two players that he wouldn't attack them with his massive unblockable creatures, and that he'd focus down on me if the other players didn't attack him (he had single-handedly already knocked me down to a quarter of my life total, himself hadn't lost a single point of life or resource the entire game, and had been bullying everyone else at the table for the games duration), and one of the other players was almost completely absent as they were trading with another person outside the game the entire time (they had no idea what was going on in game - they spent their turns passing, then saying "wait sorry I forgot to play land for turn" and passing again). Of course, I was first to lose, very shortly after the mistake of a deal was agreed upon by the other players that were behind in the game, and consequently the archenemy won by taking those two out with the same strategy. It was painful to watch, but I sat through and observed it because it was a learning experience that taught me what happens when I get frantically frustrated at the kind of situation I was put in when I was still in the game. Maybe I could have at least turned the other player who wasn't absent onto the archenemy had I just been more calm.

[@vengray8055]

Sounds like you learned some things so not a waste. Yes you're more likely to be listened to if you're calm. If you sound agitated or salty people can shut that down and not listen to ituch easier. Be calm and explain logically what you see at the table and what is happening as you see it. Freaking out will never help. Sounds like the guy did you a favor though. You basically had a 3 player game anyway.

[@vengray8055]

If the players still don't listen after the explaining then just let it happen as you predicted.

[@marnixw8724]

49:00 I recently played a boros ramp/landfall deck that blew my mind (and we got absolutely destroyed).. It revolved mostly around using the graveyard with fetches and crucible of worlds, but also recurring lands with sun titan, emeria shepherd, sevinnes reclamation etc, retriggering landfall with a personal pet card ruin ghost,. and winning with the landfall token makers like nesting dragon, retreat to emeria, felidar retreat. It was pure joy to see all those cool interactions.

[@shiranui498]

There is a player in my LGS who likes to comment on everyone's play like "Hmm, why are you casting that? Interesting." or "I wouldn't do that if I were you." It always grinds my gears cuz it makes me doubt my own play. Sometimes I wish I can tell him if he would rather play my deck instead.

[@augustobs24]

My pet peeve is the fallacy of hitting the player with most life points for no other reason. You don’t have enough information to know who you should attack based on Life Points. -Some decks use their HP as a resource more than others and so I’d attack them as a rule no matter if another player is at 40. -Gaining 1 life off of a tapped land should not make you the target of an attack all of a sudden. Vice versa if you shocked or fetched a land. -If there is a Bloodchief ascension or a similar effect, then you should not hit anybody else at the board so you don’t give a free win. It is the laziest form of playing the game and I don’t play twice in pods that do this.

[@maxc9191]

My pod has a player who will often wipe the board seemingly without a plan to come back and it gets a little annoying. We had a game last ~2.5 hours last week because they kept destroying/exiling everything, including their own board. They didn’t win, and as far as I could tell, they just had board wipes in hand and mana to play them. I go back and forth on whether it’s a salt-worthy play style. On the one hand, don’t keep dragging the game out just because you drew board wipes and don’t have anything else to do on a turn. Ties into respecting people’s time. But on the other hand, there’s always the chance of drawing into or already having something that enables a comeback. They don’t win games often so the latter doesn’t seem to be the case. I’ve just started loading my decks up with more protection and answers than most people probably need in their metas lol.

[@duncanquinn4103]

Absolutely loved this weeks intro! Great conversation as always.

[@NightOfCrystals]

My biggest pet peeve is what I term “80% players” - people who want to be perceived as casual, friendly players, but they are secretly spiky. They build their decks to seem innocuous enough, but are ultimately running card synergies that are frustrating to play against and cause loss of agency - often this is Bant flicker decks where they cannot be wrathed, or decks running an unusually high density of counter spells for a deck that isn’t pure control. This type of player will often even disclose that their deck is a slightly higher power level, but not how powerful the deck truly is (say a 6 at a table of 5s, which is really a 7) but the reason this bothers me so much is because this kind of player is trying to have the best of all worlds and the downside of none: to be perceived as a friendly casual player but also to have a disproportionately high win rate. There’s something about this closely curated form of dishonesty that really gets to me. If they want to pay strong 7s and 8s, do that, but don’t lock or blow out people playing precons/3-5s.

[@okgut2033]

About deals my pet peeves would be if someone make deals that last longer then one turn. Cause that means at least two turns dont do something against someone that could become a problem depending ofc on how you make the deal. Each round things changes alot, so dont do deals that last long!

[@razzledazzle7863]

Ok gut

[@NightOfCrystals]

While it’s a big generalization, I think deals are usually bad. Other players are making them to advantage themselves. If it works out for you, great, but very very often they don’t.

[@wymanbartlett4648]

Personal EDH Pet Peeve: Making a game decision by rolling a die (such as who to attack), and then tries to deflect consequences by blaming the dice. Dude, the dice were your method of decision making - but it was still your decision to make, and the consequences are yours to own.

[@breyor1]

This is a multi-layered peeve for me. First, as you said it’s a distancing tactic. Second, it robs the table of understanding treat assessment, when a wild card exists anyone can suddenly move up or down wildly for no reason other the that player rolling die. It’s used by players who don’t u sweat and why it’s annoying/a peeve and get defensive, similar to mana weavers.

[@Karnikula]

my biggest pet peeve is battle field organisation and library shuffling. (do it properly) On the other hand all my green decks end up with 20+ lands that I fail to organize while trying to play fast at the same time.

[@breyor1]

I scan the field a lot, and I hate it when a piece is up far left/right towards the outside edge of play. I keep things like exile up there, where it’s “removed from game) instead sometimes enchantments are hanging out by themselves on an otherwise tightly cluttered board lol.

[@valladaresRey]

Mine is when other players play theft decks and are super rough with my cards…

[@JSBozick]

I’ll be that guy and say that infinite combos are one of my biggest pet peeves. I get that many of them happened accidentally over the years, but it’s odd to me that essentially breaking the game is not only widely accepted but seemingly encouraged by certain reprints and new cards with huge combo potential. Combos can be really difficult to interact with unless you build your decks a certain way, and I find that makes them not fun to play against.

[@diggerdog9205]

I see where you're coming from I'd like to add that if you disrupt the combo they have to sit there and do nothing the rest of the game a lot of times because their deck usually can't do anything else 👍

[@JSBozick]

@@diggerdog9205 that might be true, but often you need multiple pieces of removal and/or counterspells in your hand, because you know they sure do.

[@NightOfCrystals]

I hear this but I think it depends. A two card infinite combo that is tutored for consistently is 100x worse than a 4 or 5-card+ infinite combo that can be stopped at many different points/is drawn into naturally.

[@JSBozick]

@@NightOfCrystals I completely agree with this. I don’t think I’d really have a problem with anything that requires that many pieces, I just haven’t encountered those sorts of decks in the wild.

[@NightOfCrystals]

@@JSBozick cool, thanks. I recently played against someone who had a 9-card infinite combo in their deck - at that point, they’ll almost never assemble it so it’s not really an issue. I think the tutoring for one card to infinitely combo with a commander is the real issue. The whole loss of agency thing that makes the game feel like a waste of time.

[@jyomi7506]

One that I have is people conceding before the game is really over. I don't mean "let me play with infinite mana for an hour" I mean there's still a full table in the game, I'm attacking them down to

[@NightOfCrystals]

Yeah premature scooping is a bummer. It’s often less emotionally mature people rage quitting or making assumptions about what can and can’t happen like you’re saying.

[@bladetb3934]

My biggest pet peeve is random people commenting on the game. And by random people I mean non players. I totally get dipping in and asking someone what has been happening if you are curious. But actively telling people they should remove this or that or commenting on why are you playing this or that.

[@EDHRECast]

This is a really good one! Quarterbacking in game AND out of game can definitely be irksome!

[@Ultinuc]

The thing I hate most about commander night at my LGS. There's this one dude in particular who always wants to comment and it's really annoying

[@returnoftheduelist9790]

Top 3 pet peeves for me in mtg: 1.) ppl who pubstomp and have no care for power discrepancy/disrespect others time for enjoyment/run fast mana and dockside in casual and ruin games. 2.) ppl who dont pay attention then stop the game/distract from the game/on their phone/try to tell you how to play your turn. 3.) ppl who dont read cards/take 10 min turns/combo off each game/slow play to add nothing to advance the game. Basically i just want fun, casual, immersive, edh where everyone does something to add to the game and the game actually lasts more than 6 or 7 turns. Also playing more cards that dont see play over staples is one of my goals when deck building and appreciate others who do so too.

[@Tuss36]

THANK you for saying that bit about Boros. I really don't get why folks were calling out the colour pair as if any other non-green one was any different in regards to ramp. Heck, outside of dorks, you can pretty much ramp just as fast as green from mana rocks.

[@rainbowzgaming5375]

One pet peeve of mine is when you talk about power level and someone straight up lies about it. Very recently played a game where the rest of the pod was around a 2 6’s and 1 7 power and someone brought out a “precon” and related it was just a precon with a “few extra cards.” It ended up being a well upgraded version of it with 25 swapped out “power cards” for the deck. It was at least an 8. The game ended up taking almost an hour and a half but was a clear victory for them through the whole game. It was a straight waste of time and was not fun. Love the discussions and the videos! It’s a pleasure to listen to and I enjoy the various topics and different views.

[@jben6]

My biggest pet peeves are mostly my own actions: I keep bad hands; I shuffle poorly so mana screw and floods are semi-common; between turns I often lay my hand down so miss opportunities for instants - chiefly countermagic; I build poorly - I refuse cards based on art and cost, as well as proxies, so my decks are falling behind the rest of the groups; when it's not my turn, it's time to pee or grab food/drink. BUT I know all these things, which helps mitigate them for me. They make for bad games for others though, because curb-stomping isn't fun for the stomper or the stompee. Pet peeves caused by other players boil down to mismatched decks in the pod. Initial conversations can help, but definitions are subjective outside of being honest about how a deck likely wins and at what turn it can do so if left alone - topics opponents, especially randoms, are unlikely to share.

[@XragebootsX]

My biggest pet peeve is people apologizing for the cards they put in their own deck, doing the thing they put them in there for. Like a friend of mine put Emrakul in his deck since he planned on ramping out and casting huge Eldrazi to close out games. But when he cast Emrakul and took my turn for me, all he did was apologize for taking my turn and for any bad thing he did to my board. Like bro, you knew what that card was going to do when you cast it. The worst part is that he ruined his own night because of it and I had no issue with my turn being controlled since I was the obvious Archenemy at the time

[@richardlarson6198]

I once built a coin flip deck that was supplemented with chaos cards. My play group would do a dumbmander night where we would build unconventional silly decks. I don't remember the names of the cards, but my deck put the game in the worst state with the chaos cards. 1. When a player cast a spell, they discarded that spell and cast a top deck (basically random spell). 2. Hive Mind - I think. Every body got copy of that random spell. 3. Grip of Chaos - Targets of spells were chosen randomly. We played it through, and got out of a loop with a board wipe that relied on winning a coin flip. It makes a good story, but it was so unfun after just a round at the table. Game played it self and all decisions were taken away. I took all of those card out of the deck after that.

[@EDZ1LLA]

I've only just started the pod so I apologise if they cover this in the episode BUT for me the biggest annoyance in commander is people not putting things in the top row creatures, middle row artifacts/enchantments, bottom row lands layout. Stuff like people throwing mana rocks into the bottom row with their lands really irks me. Like, I totally follow the logic but the amount of times I'm blowing up artifacts and pick something only to find out that a player had a Sol Ring I could've exploded or infinite hand size that I could've removed. It is very frustrating and I feel like a real pedant asking people to separate their mana rocks and lands. Even just a separate blob of mana rocks on that bottom row is enough, just enough that when I look at your board I can see it and it isn't stacked/hidden behind a load of land cards. Same with enchantment creatures moving them from top to middle or middle to top when they become/stop being creatures. I totally understand when you have more creatures than space and get that sometimes you don't have a choice but to spill over but at least make it clear. Keeping a board tidy/organised isn't just for your ease, its also so everyone else can see what's on your board and it frustrates me when people don't account for that. That was a bit of a rant, apparently this really bothers me aha!

[@zacharywilliams1116]

The last person that said "get good" in response to me and my group wanting to play casual, I busted out my cEDH Urza, Lord High Artificer deck and beat him 3 different times all between turns 0-3. He wanted to play casual for the rest of the night after that.

[@dreyfus37_65]

The people I play with (myself included) are often prone to feeling bad for teaming up against the biggest threat. So whenever I feel myself becoming that threat, I always announce it. Like “okay guys, I’ve just become the biggest threat at the table and if you don’t do something about it, I’m winning in x turns. Please do something about it”. Just to let them know I don’t care if they stop me, but if they don’t, they are on a clock

[@ordinarystrawstraw555]

Why do you even bother playing a PvP game? Why don't you guys just go play a Co-Op board game/card game?

[@eklaff13]

One of my biggest pet peeves is kind of an inversion of the archenemy. I don’t like it when a player is ganged up on simply because they are seen as a “better” player. Just because someone has been playing for a longer time, they don’t always have great games. Kicking them while they’re down or ganging up on them when they are just doing fine (no where near running away in as an archenemy) or even poorly that game feels bad.

[@danielscott9960]

With being honest about the threat I will be semi honest. I will point out my scariest piece when someone is looking around the table with removal but I will also point out the worst thing the other players have as equally valid targets. They then get defensive which inflates how much of a problem that thing is so they normally don't pick my thing out of the 2 options presented.

[@jaysalvadoriiisalvosa1625]

"Boros is bad at ramp" feels like a fun band name.

[@johnjessop9456]

We Are MONOWHITE CARD DRAW and we're here to make you...Disappointed.

[@sawderf741]

@@johnjessop9456 "You're a saaaaad golem, you're my one and only friend"

[@reeces.8777]

The last commander game day I had with friends, I tried a new way of managing Smothering Tithe by saying during their turn when they drew their card, "I'm making a treasure unless you pay to stop me." It felt less annoying than asking, "did you pay...", and my friends liked that approach much better.

[@holdyourfire74]

I don't really play much stax, but I do play a Thantis, the Warweaver (all creatures attack every turn) with a ton of goad spells and effects. I always warn everyone that that's what the deck does. Usually I'll go in as the arch-enemy at turn 1, but it's still usually a fun game. Up front honesty is key in a casual game. My LGS does have a couple of players that play competitive formats and go into casual Commander games with a hyper-competitive attitude even when playing lower power decks. I do actively try to win most games, but I'm happy if my decks just play as designed. The competitive guys don't understand not being ruthless at all times. I try to avoid those pods, but sometimes I can't if I want to play.

[@ColorwaveCraftsCo]

I love Thantis. Most people don’t remember that card or don’t care for that playstyle but I think it’s fun

[@holdyourfire74]

I know. My games with it either end with me getting killed first and everyone else going back to their strategies, or we all have fun just going at it. I prefer the second way, but it's fun being the archenemy sometimes too.

[@remembertobreathe66]

12:45 >>Trying

[@launchpadmcquack24]

I remember watching a game recently where by turn 6 or 7 one player had doubling season, Nissa who shakes the world, 35ish lands from the Nissa ult, and 6 (really good) cards left in hand; he was INSISTENT that he wasn't the archenemy when everyone else was still developing. I wasn't even playing that game but I got peeved regardless lol

[@AidyJames]

Being honest with yourself and your playgroup is really important. I'd been noticing that people really didn't like it when my Mishra, Eminent One deck won with Gonti's Aether Heart. They'd always told me that they were okay with it, but their body language seemed to say the opposite. I recently came back from a few months' break, during which I'd upgraded my deck. It quickly became apparent that my deck was pulling off the Aether Heart win much quicker and much more consistently. This time, I asked everyone to be 100% honest with me: is this combo a little too much, and does it feel bad when I win this way? Most said yes - it's too easy, it's anticlimactic, and it ends so many games on the spot when they're just starting to kick off, around turn 4 or 5. The deck runs the Aetherflux Reservoir combo, but that at least feels like a proper conclusion to the game!

[@andrewsparkes6275]

18:06 Ahhh so this episode was actually just an excuse for an intervention...

[@90kalos1]

My pet peeve is when players concede in a way that gives another player an advantage. It's polite to concede at sorcery speed

[@yohnazo]

One of my pet peeves is not really with any type of player, just the game in general. To do things properly, after every little play you should go round the table in priority order all confirming whether or not you have a response, can you imagine how tedious that would be? Yet, as you pointed out in one of your other casts, priority order is really important. Usually player's do the opposite of that and the pace of a game can be too fast. Even if I've thought about what I want to do in response to other things, I feel like if I blink, or think about my strategy for a second, I've missed something that I might want to respond to, I've just learned I have to be really on it. Though if things are moving too fast I know I can always ask people to slow down. Leaving a small pause after a play is probably a good middle-ground.

[@grevedanko]

My pet peeve is that people tend to believe that you cant do anything about power creep. It is possible to tune down your decks. It is possible to run your pet 3 mana rock instead of Arcane Signet.

[@kingfuzzy2]

If you have a 4 Mana commander it is actually correct to runs 3 Mana rock, dork or ramp spell over a 0-2 Mana one

[@soleo2783]

​@@kingfuzzy2 how? If you play a 3 mana rock next turn after land drop you have 5 mana, not 4

[@kingfuzzy2]

@@soleo2783 without a land drop it's better also fits the curve more

[@soleo2783]

@@kingfuzzy2 with 3 lands and a 3 mana rock you get your commander on turn 4, with a 2 mana rock and 3 lands you get it on turn 3. I don't know how that fits the curve more.

[@kingfuzzy2]

@@soleo2783 try limited and you'll understand.

[@rainmaker709]

On the note of not respecting others time: One of the things that our group does is if one player is playing at a much higher power level than the rest is, when they win we say "Congrats. You win." and then continue playing the game without them. As in, life totals are whatever they were before their massive attack for lethal on everyone was, or before their infinite combo on turn five went off, or whatever other silly thing they did. We will then just continue playing with the three of us for "second". If they have 0 respect for our time then we have 0 respect for theirs. If they have to sit around for 45 more minutes twiddling their thumbs while the rest of us have fun then so be it. The lesson gets learned very quickly.

[@Hijunk71]

we do that to someone will just say play for 2nd place

[@luckyknowsbest7866]

Those dad jokes keep me coming back and now even commenting 👍 love yall

[@k8tinator1]

Played a game last week, where one player got decently ahead with Miirym and could have killed a player with 2 Scourge of Valkas triggering but instead killed off creatures so the gsme could go on longer. Nothing inherently wrong with enjoying the game, but man we couldve played 2 games if he just killed one of the players that turn and swung at the others. Not super frustrating, I just dont get to play as much and wanted to try new decks.

[@ten-ka433]

The pet peeve I have for magic is when a player makes an irrational move without any forethought. Using removal on a commander because "You can bring it back", or targeting someone when theres a larger threat. Yes, youre free to assess threats the way you want to, but when im screwed over, just because you can, even when theres something better you can do, then my fun in the games been killed.

[@mightyone3737]

The Background Hardy Outlander seems potentially really good in an OG Multani deck with tons of Trample anthems, nothing would be quite as funny as having that Background out (yeah, it'll be in the 99) alongside Pathbreaker Ibex or maybe Overwhelming Stampede, Multani starting at 20 Power is going to be pretty absurd if you can give another creature so much power. The 'power level' thing is awkward, because there is a lot of subjectivity in those ratings, and up to a point your Commander can be weak and your 99 can have enough synergy/power to get by with something like the Piper played solo, but I think most such decks want two or three colours, but these are fun skill polishing decks to build IMHO. My point btw is that I have some decks that are designed to 'fly under the radar' to a high degree, playing objectively weak Commanders yet having enough raw power/synergy in the 99 to make the decks surprisingly hard to deal with. One of them runs quite a few wipes/big removal effects, as well as Chaos type effects, a bit of land destruction (hate on Azorius, but especially Blue decks using counters), but it's also loaded down with chaff cards that are high in flavour, and the Commander is not one anyone would think is pushed, it's one of the weakest ever printed, so my solution at this point is to make sure I mention that the deck features some salty stuff, but isn't overly powerful in any traditional sense, so it's appropriate for a mid-power or Casual game. I probably should make a small sideboard incase I need to board out certain cards (Omen of Fire could be funny the first two times, and get less amusing the 3rd time to the Azorius player).

[@IneptCardCollector]

29:13 my man 🤝 31:10 that's actually a tenet of good script writing. Don't info dump on the audience via exposition from a side character. Just ask those little questions between characters that elude to a backstory. Have a character pause when someone else says something poignant. They don't even have to reply, but the audience knows that character is holding back, which tells you more about them than some ham fisted dialogue spelling it out for the audience.

[@dragade101]

@6:59 just untap your permeants and take an extra turn quietly. Bringing out the binder is giving your opponent a free timewalk IMO

[@nathanmarcinek2073]

We've played a game of "everyone pick your most annoying deck". Kambal, Consul of Allocation vs Ruric Thar, the Unbowed vs Zo-Zu the Punisher vs Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker. It was a blast because we had the expectation it would be a nightmare of a game.

[@GrinningFeline]

I LOVE to play the heel

[@Crypt4l]

17:10 I built a Derevi nostalgia deck with no cards newer then 2014 and deliberately no stacksy or combo cards. It still wins by tapping down all opponent's lands each run...

[@kingfuzzy2]

Chulane is the same

[@donaldtaylor724]

Re: Archenemy, I have a Child of Alara deck that makes me the archenemy at my LGS when I bring it out. I accept it as part of playing the deck, and have taken this into account when adding/cutting cards.

[@DutchSnake]

When opponent has the tools to win on the spot, but just extends the game leaving the rest of the table suffer for a few turns.

[@jacobdavis9424]

I play a lot of combat tricks, so when I attack multiple people and one player does their math before all blockers are declared everywhere. I basically have to reveal I was going to do a trick by saying "hold on I need to see how everything is declared" or something like that.

[@kendallstauffer689]

About commander reputations, my friend and I have Najeela and Kenrith respectively and both have made or are planning to make budget decks for them, having no idea that just seeing them in the command zone strikes fear into everyone in the pod. XD I was just thinking I would make a couple warriors

[@marnixw8724]

We have an Italian dude at my LGS who ticks all the boxes. Always distracted by his phone (but complaining when people don't pay attention to his plays), making hateful personal comments, spiteful plays, gets salty/feels targeted when his good plays get stopped, complaining about expensive cards or luck winning instead of deckbuilding/skill, not announcing what he's doing, hiding his cards so that maybe his threats are missed, no sympathy with newer players, and my personal favorite: storming off for 45 minutes and then not winning

[@codyryan1027]

Those puns were clean as a thistle

[@screwthisin]

I wonder if Matt's middle name is Herb!

[@zachevans2220]

I bet his neighbor’s name is Rosemary

[@screwthisin]

It's about thyme we ask him!

[@rosewarrior706]

A person i used to play with hates high synergy decks, so any tribal deck, oh also disruption based decks, oh and decks that go face early, oh and drain decks, and aristocrats, and combo decks... As they play over powered custom cards and uncards

[@Sp0rkXNinja]

My two biggest pet peeves in EDH after playing over a decade are: The player who takes too long turns/dont know how to play there deck. (Unless this is your first playthrough) The second is the Stax player who scoops because their bored or the get stax piece/combos countered or destroyed.

[@eoin5169]

My pet peeve is I'm new at the game and can't find people in my area to play with with any degree of reliability so I don't have the experience to develop (or even cause lmao) legitimate pet peeves 😭

[@DaedricSheep]

is there not a game store nearby worth going to?

[@eoin5169]

@@DaedricSheep too small of a population to reliably get numbers, so things are quietly cancelled or fizzle because of no-shows, and if or when enough people get together for a pod, those people may not agree on what format they want to play. I have played a total of four games of (paper) commander in two years and not once was it with a group of 4 people :(

[@DaedricSheep]

@@eoin5169 aw that sucks, I'm sorry

[@dominicsandoval2214]

That is really sad, I understand, I don't have a play group either. Sometimes trying to find new stores to go to helps with finding new people

[@StrifeTrinity]

Finally someone else who genuinely uses "persnicity" and "strife" in casual conversation. Ty

[@zackkelley2940]

Indubitably.^^

[@dragonman979]

I have 2 pet peeve’s 1) people who do not tap mana correctly ie tapping a command tower to pay mana that a basic could have been tapped for. And 2) people who roll a dice for decisions, if you are going to do things that force you to make a choice, then make the choice and live with the consequences, especially if that choice causes a different player to win.

[@ApexZer0]

What's wrong with using a die roll to make a choice?

[@dragonman979]

@@ApexZer0 actions have consequences is the crux of the issue. when a player makes a die roll for a decision they are placing themselves in a situation where if the dice rolls correctly (aka making the correct decision by pure accident) then they are rewarded for doing so, but if the dice roll incorrectly than they have a scapegoat of blaming random chance instead of realizing that they made an incorrect decision. magic is an incredibly complicated game and commander more so than other formats, so self improvement is harder to realize with the amount of variance that is inherent to our format. adding additional variance, that also alleviates responsibility, is very obnoxious. Additionally it also sucks being on the receiving end of a die roll when trying to make logical decisions. example choosing not to drop a big bomb of a card onto that table so that you don't end up as arch enemy only to have a random 1/3 chance attack heading your way when you were keeping a low profile.

[@badley91]

Green is so good that I consider it "easy mode" so I purposely build n play decks that don't have green in it as a challenge and I mean when u can do green things with non green decks, it's a satisfying feeling.

[@LPchief]

29:50 nice duscussion guys and definitly agree with matt there

[@vexhia6792]

Sometimes when I’m in the lead in a game and someone asks, “what’s the problem on the board?” I deflect unintentionally because I’m afraid of what another player has on their board, and that emotional reaction makes me feel like opponent’s boards are more threatening than mine.

[@vexhia6792]

Or maybe I know what another person’s deck is capable of and I know they might be able to make a comeback at any time, so I’m chewing my nails feeling threatened by an opponent that might not even have anything on the board

[@54m0h7]

My biggest peeve is when people don't respect your time. It goes beyond the gameplay, deals or decisions made in the game, and it's disrespectful on a more personal level. I once had a game with 1 guy that was pretty new and another guy that is really nice, but then half way through the game they both get up and go to the store counter and the nice guy is showing him cards that would be good for him to get. I get you're being nice and all, but wait until the game is over.

[@Frank-py3hk]

Dana sporting the Detroit Tigers hat! Woo-hoo!

[@kcb73mgb1]

in reference to the survival of the fittest is it bad for me to play them? I have two from my childhood so I don't see anything wrong with it.

[@brandonstevens4513]

Massive pet peeve. When someone only plays 1 color or 1 type of deck in a playgroup. Reasons: 1. It makes it feel like that style of deck is solved for the group and people don't want to see it across the table, so it ruins deck creative opportunities for people wanting to try it. 2. If forces others to always play the same cards and have the same play patterns. I get when people like having a red in every deck or you love having 10 counter spells, or infect in every deck, but if you have 10 aggro decks and nothing else, I'm forced to play the same way every game and it gets very old.

[@Persy55]

Question for the community: In my playgroup we have one player that always forgets his triggers and remembers them after a turn or two. Most of the time if it's not a massive advantage (ex: he forgot to draw a card) or something along those lines we let him do it but when it's something more meaningful we tell him too bad. This is one of my biggest pet peeve in my playgroup and I'm not the only one thinking like this. What would you guys do in this situation? We try to help him by telling him some of his triggers but he still misses alot. (He's not a new player and has been playing for a year or 2)

[@Persy55]

His decks are rograk Arden equipment, Wilhet zombie tribal.

[@ncuco]

Yeah, i built a dimir deck that would return permanents to owner's hand and then discard them. I pullled it apart, because no one enjoyed being blocked from playing 🤐

[@sayntfuu]

Hey it's not my fault the blue player took 27 minutes for his 3rd round turn and I got lost in a movie in the mean time. 10 minutes doesn't even cover his untap, upkeep, and draw. My pet peeves: Mill decks, stax decks, blue decks et al

[@zumszum]

Sometimes bad deals are also done because not every one knows each commander and each card from the history of magic so accessing strategic value of ones action isn`t easy. Hate it when people bitch and moan about stax and counterspells and what not but all their deck do is put a two piece combo on the field and win. 'It`s only fun when my combo goes off, not when yours'

[@tjeffrey3465]

When people don’t think about their turn during others turns/ someone plays Sensei’s Divining Top in a casual game. I think i’d rather do my taxes

[@Wiwwia]

My pet peeve is players who base their entire strategy around one thing, then get irrationally angry when that one thing get's stopped, thus stopping them from winning the game everyone else is trying to win. Crazy, It's like we want to play magic, and magic is a game of interaction.

[@brendans1983]

My peeve is kinda odd, considering the channel I'm posting it on, but I can't stand seeing a commander and I can guess 90% of the cards in it before the game even starts. I use EDHREC to compare my builds to the average deck. Nothing makes me more satisfied than knowing my decks are extremely different from the norm and still perform at high levels of consistency... that's what she said.

[@selkokieli843]

Kudos on finding your (many) niches! Try not to let that feeling of superiority diminish your or others enjoyment 😌 I've had many different phases of building decks, cookie cutter and highly personalised. Each felt like the right way for me at the time.

[@brendans1983]

@@selkokieli843 I'm a dad, so I just see everyone's individual potential being wasted on copying people 🤣 "if Billy jumped off a cliff..."

[@selkokieli843]

@@brendans1983 the most important purpose a child has is to be a disappointment to their parents 😂

[@brendans1983]

@@selkokieli843 that laugh emoji was aimed at my own comment too, not as a condescending thing to your comment. I probably placed it incorrectly

[@selkokieli843]

@@brendans1983 I got it, no worries 😊

[@Carolyn510]

100 percent with Dana on dumb deals. Happens all the time and just bunges up the game.

[@richardjohnson8991]

I built Slogurk when that card came out and it was very much a "oops sorry about that". I put together walk the aeons turns combo two games and the third game I had a 23/23 Slogurk smacking people to death

[@frankiesantos1050]

When someone taps one of my cards with their fingernail I wanna punch them in the face.

[@brendans1983]

Just touching my card makes me savage. My playgroup knows it too, if you wanna steal my shit or use it, then it's right here on my playmat. And that's where it's going to stay 🖕

[@Fogshaper]

My #1 is stacking all your lands into one pile. Makes me feel like you're actively trying to cheat with how many lands you (don't) have.

[@andrewfornes5320]

Can we get another unsung commander episode? I'd love to hear you guy's input on Circu, Dimir Lobotomist. (My fav commander)

[@dapperghastmeowregard]

Fortunately it doesn't come up much because my friends and I are adults, but I hate people who try to concede as a game action. Like, you didn't find some secret tech dude, you just walked off with an entire bowl of free samples.

[@coleluecke7668]

Had a game with me along for the ride most game. With 3 players left I wanted the Voltron player that was winning the game compared to the token generator. Little did the token generator know I had Memnarch (SP)

[@BloodKaez]

The archenemy attitude is funny to me, as I actively joked about it at my last commander game. I was playing my "new" (never tested) yarok deck, kept a pretty explosive start (though missing my green mana). I played a liliana, waker of the dead turn 2 (two black and sol ring) and managed to ult her on turn 5. My opponents did slow me down but it was relatively early still and I had a baleful strix I was ready to sacrifce to get that emblem :P. I ended up doing some sick plays like casting a torgaar, getting it countered and then bringing it back for free (emblem) and with haste. Or wiping the board with a free massacre girl :P. Actually the deck played well even if I just had a bunch of free triggers :P. Never actually did get Yarok out and the one time I tried it got countered.... shit I should have sent it to the graveyard instead of the command zone lol. I was miles ahead of the others at the table and even being focused it still took a bit to take me out. Then a realized after the game I needed more enchant removal, put a woodfall primus and a rec sage in to help with that.

[@kyleellis1825]

I build a deck and play it until it succesfully goes off once or maybe twice if it was really fun. Then I either give it to someone, or I take it apart and make a new one. I've never gotten grief for any of my mean decks, because everyone knows it's only going to be a problem once from me. The also know I hate using the same cards in every single card just because it's a staple in that colour, so the decks are usually a bit under powered.

[@andrewp979]

For me, it's when people are very far ahead and won't end the game. Not necessarily that they CANT end the game; they aren't going for it. I understand that sometimes waiting can bless risky, but it also means playing another 5-20 minutes of a game that's already lost.

[@TheMusicMan1105]

My pet peeve: When people have the win and they hold it for an in response moment to take away someone else doing something cool at the table

[@jasonsteavens158]

Is Dana from Michigan? I see the Detroit Tigers hat... If so if you are in the Lansing/Jackson/Mason/Charlotte neck of the woods let's meet up for some games!