Comparing Orchestral Sample Libraries | Part Two (Debussy)

[@CraigRodmellMusic]

As I commented on the previous video, it is perfectly possible to have multiple solo instruments in BBCSO. I do it all the time. All you need to do is have instances of the same solo instrument on more than one track. I also use this technique to get divisi strings. Again, a nice side-by-side comparison.

[@VivaswanSriHarsha]

Synchron series had slow attack, not sure why. Around 2:53 or 2:54 I found the Flute? had a jump in dynamic level. From 3:00 it sounded like flowing, around 3:24 I felt like the Strings swells were a little artificial, more at 3:28. Sounded so beautiful after 3:41. Simply put, Cinematic, than pure Classical-ish. From 4:01 it sounded like just passable. Not good, not bad but a little weak side. It sounded good at 4:23 but then the material ends very soon after that. The BBC SO Pro’s beginning was well, it sounded like it had no attack. If it did, I think it wasn’t much pronounced, in terms of clarity. And then between 5:17 and 5:20, I think, the winds shorts sounded as if they were chopped to make fit in the piece. The overall sounding was good. The winds had definition most of the piece. Particularly at & after 6:24, it was beautiful. It had clarity & very expressive. Btw, the harp was beyond beautiful. Fitted very well in the mix. Love the tone, had clarity thruout. The SSO started, weirdly, as if it’s a chamber orchestra. Don’t know why but then I felt like the flute (or Clarinet on higher register ?) between 7:28 & 7:35 or something had minor phasing issue but May be I am wrong. The the crescendo from 8:02 or 8:04 ? to 8:10 or 8:12 was seamless. At 8:20 or 8:21 I found out it dropped pretty suddenly, compared to BBC SO Pro, which wasn’t like that. The Strings after 8:58 I think, sounded artificial & I think anyone can easily recognize that. Not my fav overall. The Berlin Series started pretty good actually. The crescendo was just fine but the right after the crescendo, at 10:40 or 10:41, I felt it didn’t sound as flowing as the BBC SO Pro, to me. Then it went good, actually nice than I thought it would do. To my surprise, this is kinda close to the BBC SO Pro. Overall, I love BBCSO Pro than the two but the Berlin Series can come closer, considering this piece. Thanks a lot for your time & the work. Vivasswan Sriharsha

[@PaoloTramannoni-o1l]

One of the things to consider is that the default VSL settings, for their preset, have the reverb set to quite short and dry. If you still have the original project, you could try replacing it with the Lush mix preset, at least for the strings. It makes much difference. VSL strings also have a very fast attack, so either choosing the soft attack patch, or slightly slowing it with the Attack slider could help.

[@Tomanut]

I would've loved to compare it to the Cinematic Studio Series. Many People say, they are the best orchestral Sample Library and i've heard great demos.

[@PerchHunter]

Whats going on ? :) Alex we need more fantastic (like this two you did already) comparing videos. I think would be awesome to finally go to some film music or before that maybe try some jazz/musical many options here. We need more ;)

[@2plmdLv]

Great video! What do you think of UVI Orchestral Suite ?

[@PeterHarket]

To get a muted horn sound, you should definitely check out sordina by librewave.

[@AlexHeppelmann]

I was under the impression that this was designed for close microphone positions only? Are there video/audio demonstrations of this on orchestral brass that work well on distant / room mics?

[@tylerpedraja6049]

@@AlexHeppelmann Orchestral Tools has an expansion to berlin brass with stopped horns. You can hear an example in my Adventures of Tin Tin mockup.

[@AlexHeppelmann]

@@tylerpedraja6049 I have the stopped horns from OT, but that library doesn't include con sordino horns (straight mutes)

[@tylerpedraja6049]

@@AlexHeppelmann ah gotcha. I can recommend Aaron Venture brass as an alternative. :-)

[@AlexHeppelmann]

@@tylerpedraja6049 I'm also looking at sample modeling brass as an option

[@kwameryan]

Well done Alex! A very interesting comparison using a well chosen excerpt to show overall tone, cohesion, legato strings and note repetitions. It’s audible that you‘re most comfortable programming the Berlin Series, but I think what you‘ve presented is fair and mostly representative. I use Duality Strings a lot for its tone and wealth of articulations, but I don‘t use its legato for anything slow and soaring because that’s not one of its strengths. For slow legato I use the sustains and overlap just enough to create the kind of sustained legato a good string section would deliver. It can sound fantastic. Ironically the best sounding violinata comes from Berlin Strings - the only major symphonic strings library I don’t own. May have to fix that this BF….😊

[@AlexHeppelmann]

Thanks! Berlin and VSL were definitely easier for me on this one -- I think it really just depends on the type of music.

[@TomMAF4]

Thanks! Would have loved Cinematic studio included too

[@AlexHeppelmann]

I don't own the woodwinds from them, and I have too many libraries as it is!

[@TomMAF4]

@@AlexHeppelmann Ah that's unfortunate, the WWs are awesome! Amazing tone imo. Fair enough though ofc

[@winknotes]

Interesting comparison. For this one I'd say Berlin sounds best imo but VSL Synchron is a close second. I also like the sound quality of SSO but the other two were a little clearer I think. Nice example.

[@AlexHeppelmann]

Thanks!

[@JanKleinSwormink]

Great work Alex! Suggestion, why not compare this with a noteperformer and a real orchestra recording?

[@tintoLoreto]

Thanks for doing all this work. IMHO, Berlin kicked the other ones out of the water.

[@hittjett]

Berlin, BBCSO, SSO, VSL--in that order. The two Spitfires were close, though. I liked different things about each of them. VSL was a distant 4th for me. Berlin won this by a country mile IMO.

[@AlexHeppelmann]

Thanks, Jett. I should try mocking up one of your works at some point!

[@hittjett]

@@AlexHeppelmann Well that sounds perfectly frightening!!😂 I might eventually bounce a couple of movements off of you over on VI-Control that you can think about futzing with, but I’m a ways from that at present. It’s hay season, and other than surfing a few videos while sitting around in the tractor, I’m far removed from music at the moment.

[@mr_don_key]

@hittjett: Berlin sounded less alive though (and synchron, nope, to robotic/static sounding). SSO and BBC SO however both win in my book for "alive" sounding, instead of midi/notation playback alike (machine). Though it needs some work in balances here and there.. (some part of SSO is better than BBC, and some part of BBC are better than SSO, ideally you mixed them together for their best parts)

[@amotkram99]

I crave for the day that we cannot tell the difference vs live orchestra. They all sound...virtual😞 As I am sure many have, I have spent days/weeks sometimes on a small part just to see if I can get it close to live sounding. Nope. I mean some individuals or small group can get somewhat close but all sections always sounds synthy 😞

[@joshuanirmal9068]

Agreed 💯 We aren't there yet. Let's hope that we will get there before our lives end on this Earth.

[@AlexHeppelmann]

You may get your wish with AI generative instruments very soon!

[@elektronlp6315]

​@@AlexHeppelmann hey 👋 I had this question in my mind a lot...didnt expect or plan to ask here but now that you mentioned it...Id love to hear your opinion on if the ai is a danger for someone who wants to become a composer (For Film and TV). Thanks for the time it took you to read this and Id love to hear what you got to say about that 😄 Have a good one

[@mmaybrown]

The thing about it is, virtual instruments won't be able to ever replicate real ever. There's just too many variables that make live musicians sound the way they do. When you remove even one of these factors the instruments will sound fake.

[@amotkram99]

@@mmaybrown Yes current tech of VST cannot get there, but waiting for some innovations that will retire VST tech.

[@cyrilcalmes4208]

Hi, did you make any mixing ?

[@AlexHeppelmann]

very little (EQ, light compression), i try to balance / mix as I go with CC1 and CC11

[@cyrilcalmes4208]

@@AlexHeppelmann Thank you Alex.

[@cyrilcalmes4208]

Do you use any special compressor or is it a stock compressor from your DAW ?

[@AlexHeppelmann]

I like the Fabfilter compressor, but stock compressors work just as well!

[@cyrilcalmes4208]

@@AlexHeppelmann ok. Thanks for your answers and your kindness

[@sekritskworl-sekrit_studios]

What happened to the "Prime Library" examples (which I am currently shopping in consideration for)?

[@HR_Racc]

I don’t know the pricing of VSL, but the fact that SSO sounds like it does for that price range is just mind blowing. Berlin has the best sound overall but that should be a given for that price. If you want to do something interesting, maybe an excerpt from Beethoven 3rd symphony for the next comparison?

[@hittjett]

This is it exactly. When you can buy SSO so cheap and get this sound, why would you buy anything else?

[@naturalbornweakness]

From my perspective as a piano player, VSL is the best at expressing phrases. The Berlin Series is not good at expressing phrases.

[@rich_hickey]

Synchron Duality Strings are just a blurry mess. All the detail of the strings is smeared away with the blending gimmick. It sounds like a mellotron. Would much have preferred Synchron Strings Pro here.

[@Noctarilfate]

VSL sounded much worse than the others in my opinion. I think BBC sounded best here, with Berlin coming in 2nd.

[@wesleycolemanmusic]

Your videos are great, but I don't find any of these convincing.

[@CatrinaDaimonLee]

oh boy, what can i say that wont be offensive? first gut reaction: they all dont sound good. probably just needs greater expression added to the midi file, who knows? timbrally they sound ok, i cant get past the stiffness - i am culpable of that error too...listen to my 'Sequoia' track on my channel, I am actually reworking it to make it sound more natural and organic! Lots and lots and lots of work!