The FUTURE Of Green Ammonia: Is THORIUM The Answer?

[@philipkudrna5643]

I have been following Copenhagen Atomics for some time now and it seems that they are making serious progress and that this is not only CGI stuff in some nice presentations. I wish them all the best and I hope they can contribute to a cleaner environment in the future!

[@chapter4travels]

"they are making serious progress" How do you know? They sound very positive in their presentations but I haven't seen anything real...yet. Maybe you have and I've missed it.

[@philipkudrna5643]

@@chapter4travels I don‘t have any special knowledge, but at least their gradual approach to the topic seems realistic and not utterly over-optimistic - and in their recent videos, it seems they are really working on real stuff, not just CGI: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oaiviaudrrqqbdE Can we be sure, it‘s not fake? Of course not. But at least their timelines seem realistic and they can also provide for collaborations with other renowned firms (that will most likely also have done their due diligence before entering into the collab). It‘s a pitty that they have to go to Malaysia to get gov support and can‘t get some in Europe!

[@andershansen4884]

@@chapter4travels The first reactor, built in 2022, is dedicated to water testing and allows them to test pumps, sensors, construction methods, operation, and software. After resolving initial issues, they developed a similar reactor for testing non-radioactive salt, utilizing a salt called FLiNaK. This FLiNaK test reactor, constructed in 2023, provided valuable insights for the design of the first thorium salt reactor, set to be tested in 2024. This was the status back in June. They are not done, but they have built something real. Several times, and they are iterating.

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

@andershansen4884 that is quite correct! Happy to see that someone reads our newsletters ;) Next step in 2024 will be building and testing the subcritical prototype reactor, using throium and LEU and then in 2025 have criticality test of a 1MW prototype reactor.

[@anders21karlsson]

I really hope you will succeed making a fully functional reactor using Thorium, molten salt and nuclear waste. @@CopenhagenAtomics

[@davidef4162]

You are definetly the most seriuos and committed company in this field and deserve a lot of success! I wish you all the best!

[@beautifulgirl219]

I wish Copenhagen Atomics all the success in the world. The Earth needs tens of thousands of their reactors all over the world, in countless applications. I pray it happens, and soon. :)

[@MotivationKing-hm5no]

Couldn’t agree more! 🎉

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

We are working tirelessly to make it happen asap! :)

[@taavetmalkov3295]

wish you great breakthroughs!@@CopenhagenAtomics

[@iseedrunkpeople00]

What is standing in your way? I love this. I hope it works out just like you describe

[@chapter4travels]

There are so many forces working against a viable replacement for fossil fuels. The FF industry is not even the biggest.

[@ManuelBTC21]

A beautiful aspect of this is the possibility for jurisdictional arbitrage. By producing a marketable commodity, you are no longer reliant on a coincidence between a nuclear friendly jurisdiction and a population in need of energy. Instead you can find a nuclear friendly jurisdiction and transport the energy to wherever it is needed.

[@johnkutsch7609]

Nuclear Process Heat - it is the ONLY answer - The ONLY Answer - there is NO OTHER option

[@arxaaron]

Wonderful to see this kind of international technology collaboration with LFTR nuclear energy at the core or the solutions.

[@ulfwestberg2027]

This is a game changer, All the best to the pioneering companies involved.👍

[@robfer5370]

Oh yeah!!! Let's GOO!!! Thorium power baby!!!!

[@HenrikRClausen]

Why is there disturbing 'music' mixed into the excellent narration?

[@alderbottomoutdoors9794]

I love thorium! I want a personal reactor. I work at petroleum refinery and this is the future.

[@nolan4339]

As long as the ammonia synthesis technology can be made to be able to adequately ramp with power input, then I think intermittent renewables are likely to be cheaper than nuclear when they get properly paired together, especially once the new electrolytic conversion techniques are more fully fleshed out. But feel free to compete and prove me wrong.

[@scipioafricanus2]

one correction: CO2 emissions are not a problem as they do NOT cause climate change yet increase plant growth.

[@davehalliday9399]

Is it an accurate statement to say, Corrosivity is directly related to salt purity? And what is the purity of the salt Copenhagen Atomics produces?

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

Hi! Yes that is an accurate statement. It is less than 20 ppm oxides and metals

[@offroadsnake]

not only that, maybe can build syntetic helium 3 too.. in the future

[@hermannkorner3212]

Hydrogen is indispendable for a carbonfree future. To make it with wind and solar means perpetual ramping up and down, which kills any device over time. Electrolysers are very expensive and completely unaffordable when not used round the clock. There is no doubt nuclear is the ideal source for 24/7 operation . Wouldn't it be even better though to use high temperature elektrolysis combined with a high temperature reactor? The electrical efficiency is much higher, and the steady heat from the reactor means a long life for the elektrolyser, even when ramped to compensate grid fluctuations. These stacks can even operate in reverse mode to produce additional power from locally stored hydrogen to help in a "Dunkelflaute" with no wind and no sunshine.

[@haldir108]

What a nice advertisement. I'm just not quite sure what i'm supposed to be buying. Best of luck though.

[@JinaSolo]

@4:40 - What about putting a reactor onto the ships so that they can make their own fuel?

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

The reactors create more energy that a ship would need. Therefore, it wouldn't be as economically viable as you would have to run on lower production. In addition, there is the question of regulations and insurance.

[@wilfriedschuler3796]

The process energy for ammonia is 10 KWh/kg. If you burn it you can obtain 5,2 KWh/kg. This means you are losing and wasting energy with such undertakings.

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

This particular project is for using ammonia as fertilizer

[@wilfriedschuler3796]

@@CopenhagenAtomics As I can see, you know the field. Ammonia for Energy is lunacy.

[@chapter4travels]

Is thorium the answer? No, the underlying technology is the answer, thorium is just one of the possible fuels and probably not as good as uranium. Also if you can make ammonia economically, then you can also make synthetic liquid fuels as well. Diesel and jet fuel come to mind.

[@MrRolnicek]

Yes but you might as well make them out of ammonia. The Sabatier process is a known way to make synthetic fuels but it has never been used at a scale large enough to drive optimization and improvement. Haber Bach process is apparently very difficult to optimize (although there's apparently a recent breakthrough) but that's mostly because it's very efficient as is even for it's huge scale deployment for fertilizer production. And at that point you might as well use ammonia because of the concentrations. There's plenty of nitrogen around but Co2 is much less concentrated in the atmosphere.

[@robfer5370]

Thorium is better then Uranium!! For sooo many reasons.

[@chapter4travels]

@@robfer5370 Simply not true. To utilize thorium you need a breeder reactor, for uranium, you don't. Once through MSRs are much simpler and cheaper than breeders and being cheaper than coal/natural gas is all that matters right now.

[@LFTRnow]

I would suggest thorium is better long-term. Getting it started up takes some effort, such as a "starter" in the reactor, once going though, it breeds its own fuel from the neutrons created in the reactor. It converts Th232 to U233 which fissions, giving more energy and neutrons, and breeding more Th232 as a result. You won't beat that fuel cost, even though uranium (even enriched) is fairly cheap. Another good one to consider is breeding U238 - as there's loads of DU around as a result of enriching fuel.

[@chapter4travels]

@@LFTRnow Even in a breeder uranium is still better. As you stated thorium converts to U233 which is weapons-grade and can easily be removed as such. Breeding u238 doesn't have that problem. We have billions of years worth of uranium without mining, so I see no advantage whatsoever to thorium.

[@thewiseperson8748]

Thorium fission power used to make Ammonia does not make economic sense. Intermittent renewables are a much cheaper and efficient way to generate Ammonia.

[@Feinrizulwur]

As a step on the way from carbon energy, YES. But a MSR at high temperatureres can produce hydrogen with heat in a process called thermochemistry. Nothing new. BTW. Water in a reactor is a bad idea. At the same manner water can dissociate in O2 and H2 in an accident.

[@seaplaneguy1]

Electro Ethanol is the ideal fuel, NOT Ammonia. Ethanol can be used in houses, cars, airplane, boats, trackhoes, grid without the problems of Electro Ammonia, propane, gasoline, Diesel or JET. New Engine type captures the CO2 in the secondary cycle of the combined cycle with no extra costs and uses the CO2 in the cycles and for fuel making in a building. The CO2 can also be returned to the nuclear power plant via stations with a refund deposit, thus saving the CO2 capture costs. NET solar thermal should be 3 cents/kwh for fuel. A Thorium plant will need to be around that same cost, perhaps 4-5 max. The thorium is put at peak of the day and fuel is made to balance grid. Thorium = gird + fuel making. No gas, no coal, no Diesel, no wind, no solar PV needed. Just Thorium + fuel making.

[@mineralaccess7070]

Hail Copenhagen Atomics

[@jjamespacbell]

The LCOE of wind and solar is far lower than nuclear so how does spending vast sums to develop thorium nuclear reactors work out less than using wind and solar which are available now? A carbon tax to the production of the CO2 in producing ammonia would change the cost equation but only by increasing the cost of ammonia and then an increase in the cost of food production.

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

The LCoA from wind and solar is approximatly 3x higher than coal or natural gas. This is simply due to the intrinsic properties of wind ans solar being intermittent energy sources, as such you would need vast amounts of wind mills and solar panels combined with storage facilities which drives up the LCoA, which in turn drives up prices of food. Therefore, it is relevant to develop methods for producing green ammonia close to the price of grey ammonia.

[@patrickmckowen2999]

👍

[@testthewest123]

I wonder why you want to run big ships on ammonia, instead of use your small modular reactors.

[@mauritsdolmans746]

I would guess: regulation applicable, which may be different per harbour, and cost efficiency of using the ammonia as fuel rather than a nuclear reactor

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

As @mauritsdolmans746 rightfully say, currently the biggest hurdle is regulation. Therefore, we are currently more focused on getting regulatory approval for land or site usage, as reactors can then be used for co-producing in several applications.

[@PaulHigginbothamSr]

The Atomic ammonia MUST be cost competitive with fossil fuel ammonia. Then even China will board the ship.

[@rickstan6595]

Just tell me when I got your theory when I mean are you advertising are you looking for more investors what's the deal. I'm sure anybody would be on board with the pie-in-the-sky that you talking about let's hear let's see it let's put it into action.

[@CopenhagenAtomics]

We are not looking for investors for the project that is being presented in this video. We the six companies in the project are the investors and the ones putting it into action.

[@richardgieser6122]

I would appreciate if you could sell me plans to build a small scale unit of approx 1,000kwh/month for my home use and what materials such as thorium that I would need to buy from you or elsewhere.

[@Greenammonianews]

Pattern Energy is building a $4b green ammonia facility in Newfoundland Canada. Real people are putting in real dollars.