Could Games Teach History?

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[@ykakutani]

One word: EU4 Basically paradox games are responsible for my fascination with history. Wouldn’t have majored in it without paradox

[@giovannymiranda396]

Totally agreed. EU4 is my favorite Paradox grand strategy game. Not only for the time period but for the historical accuracy and depth in gameplay. I started reading history books about the different countries that I played.

[@aita2565]

this

[@whitewolf44a]

thats three words

[@asterozo]

What do you mean its not call Constantinople

[@LHudson]

Games can teach history. How else can anyone learn why you should not pursue Lu Bu!?

[@AlriikRidesAgain]

Man, I never played video games growing up and decided to pursue Lu Bu in the playground. All I remember is awesome music and pain.

[@irrlicht321]

I have a master's degree in Chinese studies and the influence Dynasty Warriors had on my studies is embarrasingly large. I once aced an oral exam I didn't prepare for by segwaying into obscure Three Kingdoms stories and impressing my professor.

[@Vulgarth1]

@@irrlicht321 Sun Jian, the real legendary hero. He was what history conspired to pretend Guan Yu and Zhang Fei were.

[@bigdawg9743]

100% historically accurate btw.

[@adamfrisk956]

@@irrlicht321 hao hao

[@tsukikumoon2890]

I think that most people who have played games like Assassin's Creed, Dynasty Warriors, or other 'history based' games have picked up on a lot of historical events. Now some of it is stretched, you're not going to learn about the real Leonardo da Vinci talking with assassin's or anything like that, but like how Unity is helping to restore Notre Dame, there is a possibility that making a history based game could help people struggling with history subjects. I know when I was studying ancient history, I would have loved a visual representation of it instead of reading it from a book.

[@charlesboudreau5350]

I think one of my favourite features of the older AC games was the pop ups on the side as you walked past historical landmarks, and you could go "Uh, neat. What about it?" and press 1 single button and be taken to a two-three (sometimes more) paragraph detailing the thing's historical relevence. Sometimes it wasn't a place, but an event or someone. It used to flow really well.

[@paulanzel5980]

The amount of random history, economics, and geography I picked up through Railroad Tycoon 2 is quite...something.

[@WTFmomentGaming]

It's definitely true. I learned about the cold war entirely through playing Snake Eater and Peace Walker. Everyone knows about WWII, but kids my age hardly knew about the cold war when it was taught. Of course the plot was fiction, but the motives come from the real life circumstances of the cold war. I enjoy parts like in MGS3 when Snake passively mentions how the Cuban Missle Crisis was in response to American missles being stationed in Turkey in secret, and then uses that to frame the plot of the Shagohod and Sokolov's involvement. And then Peace Walker building it's plot around nuclear deterrence and M.A.D. requires you to understand these concepts for the plot to make sense. And the cassettes in that game going into insane detail about the space and arms race as a basis for expanding The Boss's backstory is awesome. I learned history much better this way, since like you said, you are being put in control of someone who's mission is based around the historical circumstances they are in, so you understand the motivations behind everything better than if you simply had a timeline of events shown to you. Awesome video.

[@felipepepe]

Not as highbrow, but Dynasty Warriors made me memorize hundreds of historical Chinese names & locations, as well as actually buy and read The Romance of the Three Kingdoms :D

[@Zivudemo]

RotTK, Samurai Warriors 2, Rome: Total War (in Italian!), Civ 1/2/4, Call of Duty 1, That History Channel Rome Strategy Game that sucked (but i loved it), Europa Universalis and Hearts of Iron 2. All of them taught me something about History. Eventually that did drove me to go into the field. I tried doing History, now I'm studying Archaeology.

[@Zivudemo]

And like you, but not in the Land of the Setting Sun. Samurai Warriors 2 had me memorize a lot about Sengoku Era Japanese History. Especially the key people in every region. Watching Kagemusha was a blast.

[@felipepepe]

@@chileanywayssso I got the Penguin Classics version, it's very distinct. There are 120 very short chapters (2-4 pages each), each giving flashes of events. For example, most battles are just given one or two paragraphs, what's important are the character's actions and consequences from each event. But there are A LOT of characters, so it's definitely easier to read if you are familiar with them from Dynasty Warriors.

[@tobiyoarcangel]

And of course, not to pursue Lü Bu

[@TheRyoux]

and as kid it taught me english as well. DW 3 had very simple lines haha

[@Kinzokugia]

"Can games teach history?" Sure, I learned a lot playing Sid Meyers Civilization. Ghandi is to be feared for his proclivity for Nuclear weapons.

[@rawovunlapin8201]

Gandhi was a war criminal who committed unforgivable atrocities; not just the people of Earth, but to all future people on the planet, for centuries to come.

[@fuzzydunlop1753]

Yeah Ghandi wasn't all he's cracked up to be.

[@theSato]

Gandhi, not Ghandi :)

[@rawovunlapin8201]

@@theSato thx

[@blitzwaffe]

Civ player: You know I'm something of a historian myself

[@MaxwellTornado]

>No Paradox games Whew George.

[@Melcookie96]

hoi4 taught me alot more of history and geography than high school ever did. When events like the Spanish revolution and soviet purges are essential to your battle plans I tend to remember them haha

[@ThePlugMan86]

Whoa? another one? It's only been 2 days.

[@mememan9890]

Hope he keeps pumping them out at this rate.

[@ZinkyStinky]

George is a man, once he "stimulated" he will come back and make a video for us to "stimulate" over.... You know what type of stimulation I'm takin about.

[@tropicarls]

One other one could potentially have been a paid advertisement but I'm not complaining

[@soulzero22]

I hope not. Burn out is a real thing. Also having a premade backlog makes getting sick far easier. It also enables proper vacation and convention time.

[@killerexe007]

School managed to completely kill my interest in history but now, many years later I love history and am known in my circles as "the history buff" thanks only to Europa Universalis 4 and Crusader Kings 2, those games managed to revive my love of history and I have been reading history books, listening to history podcasts and watching videos about history ever since

[@antipothis]

For how silly and alternate history they get, I learned more than I expected from many of the assassin's creed games.

[@greciasoleble]

Me too specially from the first ones.

[@anonnymous1312]

Come on, Europa Universalis 4 doesnt even get a mention?

[@nicolascunha6559]

this, holy fuck.

[@ludgerhoutman4464]

And Crusader Kings 2 and Hearts of Iron 4. And their predecessors. And Imperator: Rome if anyone actually plays that.

[@qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqw]

Their games are actually being given for free to schools

[@Larry82ch]

He mentioned it indirectly with "games by Paradox", I think

[@nils0a]

He did. Listen again

[@DaelinDwin]

Kingdom Come: Deliverance is being used to teach Medieval history in the Czech University, so I'd say the answer is yes.

[@gagageiro]

No EU4 or CK2 Reference only Paradox i kinda feel like they are more important to this discussion than Civ wich is a game that doesnt really give you a lot of historical perspective

[@dasmysteryman12]

EU4 and CK2 are good games to teach history in context, in terms of how forces and people move throughout the particular time period when the game is set. Civ gives a much broader historical perspective, encompassing all of recorded human history, which gives someone who is interested in history a lot of room to learn, even though it's not focused on one period. Personally, Civ fueled my love for history more than Paradox games, and I think many other players would credit Civ for their interest in history as well. Paradox games only became more well known less than 10 years ago, while Civ was already established by the time CK2 was gaining popularity.

[@flimpeenflarmpoon1353]

@@dasmysteryman12 i learnt nothing from Civ V tbh. You dont get much context from 6 immortal rulers on a pangea where whoever's strongest in the ancient era is still the strongest in the modern era. At least in EU4 nations can actually rise and fall, have multiple rulers and successions and rebellions and independence wars etc and its on an actual globe so you know where the civs youre playing are in real life.

[@dasmysteryman12]

@@flimpeenflarmpoon1353 Like I said, in context. Civ games are more general, while Paradox games are more specific. You can learn about which civilizations and leaders are important in general history in Civ, but if you want to know how France was able to challenge the Netherlands before the Revolution you go to EU4.

[@Deshrake]

I've learnt SO much from Crusader Kings 2 that I was always oblivious about.

[@harbl99]

Teacher: "Okay class, today we're going to learn about medieval inheritance." CK2 player: "Let me tell you about f**king gavelkind."

[@arenkai]

Reminds me of a more focused Montessori method. Montessori focuses on what the kids naturally need and want to do instead of making/forcing them to do it. The theory being that if you put kids in a stimulating environment with possibilities of activities, they will take part in them on their own making the whole process of learning more involved and in the end more effective. Which is in practice what happens. It makes kids that are more capable of thinking for themselves and who have a better image of themselves because of what they achieve on their own (of course, you also have to pair that with positive reinforcing). More extremes version of the Montessori-style of teaching completely let it up to the kid. They don't want to learn how to write or read and only want to go fishing for 10years straight every day ? Let them. When they'll finally decide that they want to learn how to read, they'll do it in a month and be passionate about it. But that last method is only available to extremely rich people that can afford their kids living in a very specific environment without a lot of contact with the public world. Montessori though ? That's applicable to public schools, the only thing in its way is the archaic methods and educational system the "old guard" doesn't want to let go of even after seeing how it is failing.

[@GugSport]

So much footage from Civ and TW and none from the PDX strategy games. This should be a crime. Seriously though, you're doing yourself a disservice if you like history games and don't play those.

[@Szrama1123]

Actually Paradox games got quite 'memey' in recent years. The starting conditions are historical but the stuff they have been adding past few years is riddiculous and way closer to Civilisation approach. Confederate USA from HoI4, minority expulsion from EU4 and fucking sorcery in Crusader Kings 2 to name a just a few elements.

[@thepleasantpuffin]

@@Szrama1123 But you have to admit, playing on an actual map of the Earth with interactive maps showing ruling Dynastys, popular religions, and cultures teaches you a lot more history than Civ does. CK2 even has a button on the character screen which will bring you to the character's Wikipedia page, if it exists.

[@GugSport]

@@Szrama1123 still though, comparing even the most memey PDX game to Civ is almost cowardice. When have you ever learned about the 30 years war or colonization, or about Charlemagne, Otto the great, crusades and jihads, Norman invasions and 100 years war in Civ? Even in HoI4 the memey alt just scenarios are 100% optional, you can still guide your nation through the exact beats of WW2 if you so desire.

[@sabotabby_]

@@Szrama1123 While I do agree that hoi4 has become quite memey with it's alternate history scenarios, I dove head first into the historical context of euiv and hoi4, because before those games, I never knew what a "30 years war" or a "Spanish Civil War" was. So for me personally, they deserve a good amount of credit. When I first colonized America in euiv and committed horrible acts of genocide, I was motivated to look into the context because I had rarely heard of these things.

[@MajoraZ]

As somebody interested in Mesoamerican history, I have very mixed feelings them and EUIV speffically. I appreciate that they have more then just the Aztec Empire and the Maya, such as also having the Republic of Tlaxcala, the Kingdom of Colmia, the Purepecha Empire, etc; but the fact that in the base game they all had the same tech level as North and south American tribes, and a LOWER tech level then a lot of African tribes and cheifdoms is inexcusable; and even after all the ptches and exansions they still need to "reform" to access a lot of basic mechanics that, even historically IRL, they were already doing: These were formal governments with judicial systems, schools, bureaucratic insutitons for tax and religious officials, etc.

[@seprithlicastia463]

When I first went to Washington, D.C., I had no trouble navigating the metro tunnels -- to the amazement of my guide, who had been there before and still got lost. Why? Because I had been playing Fallout 3 for years and had the in-game metro map memorized. Like that professor said, our interests drive us. The problem with this "in-game learning" is that a lot of stuff is inaccurate, though.

[@willbailey413]

I agree with you.

[@greciasoleble]

Its funny how Age of empires made me love history when i was a kid, and now historians are becoming gamers thanks to the historical RTS games. Great video georgie 👌

[@Walterdecarvalh0100]

How could you not talk about EU4, CK2 and HOI4??

[@greysky1252]

Probably because not everyone can memorize all these DAMN VIDEOGAME ACRONYMS!

[@zheldor651]

Surely you mean Vicky 2, not the new age paradox memestry.

[@Walterdecarvalh0100]

@@zheldor651 HEY! At least I didn't say Imperator.

[@racoonknux49]

Paradox Interactive fans: *The Expert*

[@OsKuukkeli]

Ah yes, Dis Mierse's Civilziation VI. One of the more popular 4x games out there.

[@luckluster]

Seriously tho Civ 6 is so much better now after Gathering Storm updates. Only wish SB would make a video about it again whenever the third major expansion will come out.

[@heycidskyja4668]

It's popular. And it's not very good.

[@bonbondurjdr6553]

@@heycidskyja4668 thank you.

[@OsKuukkeli]

@@heycidskyja4668 I haven't played civ since IV. I tried V but it changed quite a lot, and I couldn't be arsed to learn all new mechanics.

[@MideoKuze]

fyi: Rome didn't "fall" in a single conquest. The empire slowly lost its power as peoples migrated internally (largely due to pressure from the Huns), displacing one another and breaking off (thoroughly Latinized) provinces, and its political system decayed due to neglect and opportunism. The gradual erosion of (Western) Rome's central control was punctuated by several sackings of the city of Rome, eventually leading to the deposition of the last emperor, followed by a long sputtering out of the vestiges of the (Western) Roman state over the next 200 years. Eastern Rome, that other half, kept going for about a thousand years after the documented fall of Rome, when it was slowly eroded, too, by internal pressures, invasions from various surrounding territories (*coughs* crusades *coughs*) and finally conquered by a different empire, the Ottoman Empire, which *also*, little-known fact, claimed to be Roman. At this point in time the Pope was already appointing Holy Roman emperors (none of whom presided over Rome but, then, neither did the Eastern Roman emperors, except Justinian, briefly). Arguably, it's only very recently that people have stopped claiming to be Roman emperors, although that title probably stopped meaning much of anything shortly after the Ottoman conquest of Constantinople and the Holy Roman decision to elect emperors by the votes of an assembly of feudal lords and also have Holy Roman emperors without the assent of the Pope (whose position, itself, was radically changed from the historical Pontifex Maximus by that time).

[@NeoLithiumCat]

Thank you!

[@FlymanMS]

Love your enthusiastic narration of the ad.

[@johnarmstrong5533]

In the span of just one month, there's been videos on what's good about media literacy and historical literacy. This is the most ethical games journalism I've ever seen.

[@luckluster]

My favorite video from you so far. As both a fan of Civ series and history, the series definitely made my journey up to college more enjoyable and easier.

[@tavrincallas3218]

George, I'm currently writing a thesis about history in videogames for my masters degree in languages and this video popped right at the perfect time. I love you and your channel

[@Highmelon]

I always enjoy your content my dude! Keep it up.

[@twistedoperator4422]

Fallout New Vegas Critical Closeup

[@welkindragoon]

This would be a dream come true

[@AstroBilly777]

What I wouldn't do for that vid

[@Sorrelhas]

Like a fella once said, ain't that a kick in the head

[@LightningbrotherG]

Look up Noah-Caldwell Gervais' videos about FO:NV

[@mahmoudqaddura692]

My god I'm glad I found this channel, amazing work!

[@Jamesssssssssssssss]

Yay! More videos !!! I love your channel

[@Belmoon]

This was super interesting! I remember looking into my college's gamedev side and found there were a lot of projects being done for this purpose, recreating historical places and museums in virtual contexts.

[@michelottens6083]

Oooh thank you for promoting the History Respawned channel a bit. Those guys deserve a bigger audience!

[@saliem99]

Great video! This sums up why I like historical games perfectly.

[@petrcasar8516]

No mention of Paradox games ?

[@thewraithwriter22]

That ad transition was a lot smoother than last time. Good George

[@100billionsubscriberswithn4]

Last time I was this early, George was obsessed with floating noodles.

[@Draconicrose]

(17:00) I was honestly blown away by how freaking cool that is! Seeing a depiction of our best approximation of the real thing next to the ruins it's like...wow I don't even have the words.

[@elbitxo5945]

Thank you for discovering me History Respawned. What an amazing podcast, I'm devouring the episodes like crazy.

[@ericvargas5362]

i'm definetly learning more in AC origins discovery tour than in my history class in the subject

[@ag1443]

excellent work George, thank you so much

[@gemis8]

Another excellent video Bunny Hop. I am so glad that I was a metal gear solid fan so that I stumbled upon your channel. 😁

[@Thebabybadass101]

A new bunnyhop video on my birthday, thanks George !

[@Joy_ffa1bd]

happy birthday

[@kiloalphahotel5354]

Thanks for the vid. Always great.

[@magicswordz]

Though you did mention it, I do wish that you made direct reference showing of a Paradox game like Crusader Kings II or Europa. I think they are a lot better at showing history than Civ. Though I do understand that, that would take a considerable amount of time to get into and are much more niche games than Civ.

[@MajoraZ]

As somebody interested in Mesoamerican history, I have very mixed feelings about EUIV: I appreciate that they have more then just the Aztec Empire and the Maya, such as also having the Republic of Tlaxcala, the Kingdom of Colmia, the Purepecha Empire, etc; but the fact that in the base game they all had the same tech level as North and south American tribes, and a LOWER tech level then a lot of African tribes and cheifdoms is inexcusable; and even after all the ptches and exansions they still need to "reform" to access a lot of basic mechanics that, even historically IRL, they were already doing: These were formal governments with judicial systems, schools, bureaucratic insutitons for tax and religious officials, etc.

[@feudela4357]

MajoraZ fair enough, but I’m sure me and most people see strategy games as a hook for history rather than actual facts. I wouldn’t have even known places like that in Mesoamerica would have existed unless I saw them as players on the board.

[@MajoraZ]

@@feudela4357 Sure, but therin is the broader issue, that culturally we don't really give a shit about Precolumbian history or bother to teach people about it, and historical videogames are just carrying that mistake along with them.

[@Amaror2]

@@MajoraZ We get it, dude. Stop spamming this as response to every comment mentioning paradox games.

[@CarrotConsumer]

@@MajoraZ Ancient Rome had all those too. It's not exactly cutting edge.

[@DiabeetusPrime]

I have, according to Steam, 1200 hours in Europa Universalis IV, and easily twice that many hours reading up on all the historical states and events referenced in the game.

[@PatrickTCAPIreland]

Age of Empires 2 👌 it may not be 100% accurate but it’s a good start

[@kcechoxzar]

me learned me much english playing in that

[@Nod_Lucario]

That game actually got me into history in the first place.

[@dimitriosdrossidis9633]

I love this Game to death

[@shukterhousejive]

If you've ever wondered how the meso-american civilizations fell, just pick Spain and fast-castle into conquistadors

[@Maxislithium]

Tangential learning is all about those good starts.

[@CFilmer]

I know this sounds heavy, but I think a strategy game would be really good in explaining why it took so long for slavery being abolished.

[@dojokonojo]

Victoria 2 has a slavery mechanic

[@DarthBaki92]

I really liked the discovery mode of AC Origin. It's just interesting to hear about ancient civilization while running through the Areas in game and having some modern photos of it for reference. Can't wait for it in Odessey!

[@DensetsuVII]

Two episodes in two days!? Call 911, George is on FIRE! Edit: A fine video - though I lament the lack of inclusion of the Paradox games, which I feel have always imparted something fundamental about geopolitics in history that other games haven't quite captured for me. Maybe a follow-up is in order?

[@kvnrthr1589]

Excellent points about how games highlight contingency, and the assumptions designers make showing up in their models. Historical board games are another interesting space. It's more accessible for designers who don't have the resources/skills to code and as a result the designers are of more varied backgrounds. Here it is standard to have multiple page designer notes explaining clearly how their interpretation of history affects the game mechanics.

[@theSato]

5:45 "continegency" oof

[@Eiensakura]

Shogun and Medieval Total War was how I got into Japanese and European history.

[@hopelessent.1700]

The crusades and Teutonic Order expansions were the reasons why I love the crusades.

[@HadesWTF]

The Total War games are really great for learning history. Three Kingdoms is also great, even though we lack proof that period was actually real.

[@Kydino]

@@HadesWTF what do you mean. We had multiple proofs of the events there, the games even have a records of the three kingdoms mode where it references the first historical manuscript about that Era. Sure "Romance of the three kingdoms" might have been fake but the period did happen.

[@Neoyoshi-FFXIV]

I always feel just a little bit wiser after watching a Super Bunnyhop video.

[@miguelinop]

TBH total war pro-war economy only makes quite the sense in the Rome and Shogun settings of their games. Kinda with Medieval too.

[@tudordumitrescu8707]

Not even a passing mention of ck2 eu4 vic2 or hoi4... Ur a casual george

[@justderp5713]

Tudor 1270 Totally.

[@tonyantonio2]

I have learned a bunch of history from EU4 events to just looking stuff on my own and wondering how accurate the game is (in a lot of ways not, but it makes the game more fun), plus it also excellent in teaching geography without me feeling like I was memorizing stuff on purpose. The only thing historical about Civ games is that you get a little bio on the country you are playing as and discover technology in a very narrow path, and guess what, Civ games fail in teaching colonization (though in a way I think EU4 failed due to how easy it is to keep colonies late game)

[@Eliel20117]

more like EU2-Vic1-HoI2

[@tomc.7243]

@@tonyantonio2 I learnt so much geography from Eu4 and Vic2 it's not even funny. I thought I was having fun and conquering stuff but actually Paradox made me learn the names of german regions, small indian states or south east asian kingdoms, the sneaky fucks.

[@ludgerhoutman4464]

@@tomc.7243 I actually know balkan geography now (no small task) thanks to my strange love for yugoslavia in hoi4.

[@milannikolic8731]

Great vid! You got yourself a new like and subscriber. Ty

[@AaronPM55]

12:55 , I think this is an extremely solid point. When I played video games I was extremely immersed and wanted to see how this immersion came about. This led to me learning about to fundamental programming concepts and got me an almost full ride to my university where I'm doing undergraduate research on satellites systems. If I didn't play Minecraft, wow, and Civ in middle school I don't think I would of fostered the same interest. I think video games do an excellent fostering interesting through entertainment.

[@AaronPM55]

@Dan Nguyen there's a reason why I still have my mother look over all my papers and proposals.

[@willbailey413]

First off, as a graduate student studying U.S History, I enjoyed the video and you made a few really good points, for example video games do help illustrate the concept of contingency, and do provide a sense of immersion in the period being portrayed. However, I feel that historical games make the portrayed too familiar and perhaps makes the player feel that decisions made in the game, i.e decisions made with gameplay in mind with a 21st century mindset, correspond with the decisions that historical actors may have made. In an article entitled "Historical Thinking and Other Unnatural Acts" historian Sam Wineburg makes the argument that in history there is "tension between the familiar and the strange." This the idea that while looking at the past gives the opportunity to place ourselves in a broader historical context (i.e see our selves in the past) we also need to understand that people in the past made decisions based on the cultural values and historical contexts of the period that may seem utterly foreign to someone in the 21st century. To use an example from my own when I was kid I played a strategy game called Imperialism II (released in 1999 by Frog City Software) the game itself was set in the colonial period (1492-1800's) where you played as a major colonial power such as Spain, England or the Dutch and lead your chosen country to discover the Americas and use its resources to develop your own economy and military until you became strong enough to dominate your neighbors in the "Old World." While this primary gameplay loop does establish the overall theme of era, it also obscures the cultural and religious reasoning behind some of the choices made during the periods such as Europeans' belief of their own superiority over the "uncivilized" Native Americans and the idea that it was the duty of Christian nations to convert the "pagan" New World. All of these concerns are completely ignored in favor of military and economic ones, even then European ideas concerning warfare and larger economic trends during the periods such as Mercantilism and Bullionism are not addressed. This of course is not including the problems that many historical games have when it comes to sanitizing history by not including things like slavery, or the horrors of Colonial regimes in the games. Therefore, I was not really making choices based on real concerns of the time, but rather as a kid in the early 2000's trying to win a game. While I admit including all of this would be a tall order for any video game developer, I still argue that unless a game can truly capture the idea that you are playing in an era that has its own concerns, customs, and its own "zeitgeist." So in conclusion while games are good for giving us a glimpse of what the past may of looked and sounded like, they may not provide a clear picture of what it was really like to be someone during this period. Also I encourage everyone who reads this look up Sam Wineburg's article, it explains the point that I am trying to make here better that I can, I also recommend reading "The Historian's Craft" by Marc Bloch which makes some interesting arguments concerning the problems historians face representing and understanding the past.

[@willbailey413]

Sidenote: I will also admit that historical games are a good starting point in getting people interested in History, and getting them familiar with the broad strokes of the period that may lead them into further researching the period.

[@willbailey413]

Also apologizes for the massive wall of text. I am really interested in this subject and have been thinking about it for a long while.

[@GabrielKnightz]

I can unequivocally admit to the fact that i not only learned but had my interest ignited about history from the Assassin's Creed franchise (upto Unity) than anything academic. It really is by far, practically the closest thing we have to time travel; it's one thing to passively read about in on a page looking at pictures altered by time and quite another stand infront of (on top of) a renaissance architecture in it's prime and just let the world wash over you.

[@GabrielKnightz]

ps: It doesn't have to places in history either, projects like "Titanic: Honor and glory UE4 Demo" let's you have an experience if you think about it there is no alternative for, no human can ever experience again with near photo-realistic graphics and freedom that only a game world can provide. Apply that to the Hindenburg, the ancient wonders of the world, battle grounds where NPCS reenact a war (and so on) and it essentially becomes teaching aid like nothing else.

[@shermansherman3630]

The Metal Gear series and the character backgrounds made me interested enough in global conflicts that I started reading up on them.

[@Kydino]

They're surprisingly good at their portrayal of pmcs and the African conflict of the cold war side in mgsv. All we needed was a mission in Rhodesia and we would've been set.

[@shermansherman3630]

Great response. I also enjoyed the history of the Russian/Afghan war as well

[@BigBoss-sm9xj]

As well as the Central American conflicts and history!

[@shermansherman3630]

Yes! Peace Walker definitely made me interested in the Central America wars.

[@KarolaTea]

Just here to appreciate the background music. Also great video!

[@a.j.4076]

09:08 - Yep, you got me there George. :)

[@billyb580]

Brief point on fall of Rome. It's the current line in the historiography that Barbarians did not destroy the Roman Empire, rather that the Empires bureaucracy did. And they weren't invasions, more migrations. I'd have a look at Guy Halsall's "The Barbarian Migrations" for an up to date overview on the period and the debates.

[@MCCanaryVideos]

I still think my favorite example of players engaging in a situation of history rather than historic narrative is my time playing Red Orchestra, which simulates what World War II felt like while still feeling like a fun game without losing the contextualization of how not fun the experience is. It was sobering the various death events that happen when you play in that game. The player will experience both slower death sequences where sometimes your playing avatar states a brief internal monologue that you don't want to die before blacking out, and inversely, suddenly and inexplicably dying from a mortar shell or well placed shot, both framing how different people experienced that war, primarily through the eyes of its very victims. I think it's a great way to frame how that conflict felt, and simulates what World War II was like, without trying to run a 1 for 1 simulation that would be just completely unfun. It's good, and I think simulated histories especially in reference to war and wartime games where players are pitted against each other can still be educational on the experiences of what those times may have been like, what it was like to be a part of either side of a conflict, and who fought in those wars, since the reality is the people that did fight and die in those wars were no different the player themselves in a relatable sense. I hope games like Red Orchestra can still be received well for these reason amongst others for historians and history enthusiasts as a simulation of what a period of time was like from a more secularized view of the humans involved in a conflict, rather than a narrative of "good versus bad". To me, historical games focused on education work best when they place the player in a situation of history, rather than a narrative as a kind of historical visitor trying to live an experience that is different because it happened in a time of history different from the player's contemporary view of the world.

[@TheDakattack3000]

My favorite history learning moment in games was Devil May Cry. When I read the background and concept of the game, I noticed Dante, Vergil and Bea-Trish were apart of the Divine Comedy. Whole the games themselves don't follow the story at all, I went into a huge Italian phase (alongside playing AC2) where I wanted to learn everything. I even bought The Divine Comedy and was one of the coolest reads ever for me. Add to that the demons and where they come from culturally in all the games and I was in the zone.

[@osnisida]

Total War, Crusader Kings, Europa Universalis. Yes, history can be learnt from vidya.

[@harbl99]

The Sierra city builders? Caesar, Pharoah, Emperor: Rise of the Middle Kingdom (not you Zeus, sit down).

[@FrightNFight]

You talking about AP courses and the art history vids on skillshare made me want to make this comment. To those of y'all that are still in high school, if your school offers AP history courses, take them. Especially AP Art History or U.S history, these courses usually go into a good deal more detail than honors equivalents and most of the time the best teachers at your school are the ones doing AP. My school was a smaller kind of underfunded one but I learned so so much in these classes and graduated HS with a year and a half of college credits in total.

[@DasGuntLord01]

Civ? Total War? [Laughs in Paradoxian Map Starer]

[@passion9thedrunkotaku646]

Truly interesting stuff

[@Fanciable]

TWO UPLOADS IN A WEEK? Bless

[@ralphbollig2999]

What was great while I was in grade school was that the assassins creed games were semi going along with the classes we had, it was great to have a pirate game while also learning about said pirates in class. 10/10 was great

[@mrbigglezworth42]

Interestingly, I learned a fair deal about the Holy Roman Empire via Total Warhammer and the Empire, who are heavily inspired by the fancy pants Germans. It also got me into learning quite a bit about other European nations/ city-states around that period that inspired Tilea and Mirigliano as well. The Skaven taught me that rats of unusual size are incredibly dangerous.

[@MajoraZ]

I think games have a huge potential to teach history, and i'm especially interested in seeing stuff like 3d recreations of cities for VR, etc. But I also think that games as historical tools suffer from a lot of the same problems historical education does, which is where huge swaths of history is ignorred or skipped over. example, people are only really taught about the Aztec and Inca Empires as examples of historical states in the Precolumbian americas, and even then it's more or less a footnote just to transition into talking about Spanish colnizational of the americas; even though both Empire's regions have dozens of other major civilizations and hundreds of specific political states going back thousands of years. Likewise, in games, any sort of Precolumbian setting is rare, and even in strategy games, you rarely see anything beyond the Aztec, Maya, and Inca, and in games like EUIV, are basically treated as barely more complex as tribes, even trhough historically, say, the Aztec had cities as big as Paris and Constantinople, circles of philsophers and poets, formal legal and judicial systems, etc. "Diversity" and "inclusivity" is a big debate and topic in gaming right now, but I think that trying to include more historical and cultural settings and influences beyond the standard European and Japanese would be something even the people who normally roll their eyes at diversity efforts would be a fan of, since it's actively something that gives gamers unique and underultiized aeshetics, themes, etc. From a "Games for history" perspective, making sure we explore a wider variety of historical periods and make sure we are depicting them accurately (IE Aztec's in huge cities, with the buildings in clean white stucco with painted accents, with bustling markets; not as tribes in huts around decript pyramids) is all the more important.

[@Shootkicksass]

What a wonderful video!

[@zmdumpbox2340]

I remember mildly losing my shit when my family and I went to Florence and Venice (Italy) for a family vacation, because I was checking out all the landmarks I visited in Assassin's Creed 2. Also, all the Dynasty Warriors games helped educate me on context behind all these Chinese shrines of some long-bearded warrior dude in green with a badass halberd I keep seeing at all my family friends' businesses (Guan Gong, i.e. Guan Yu). Ultimately, history is stories, and so are video games. Hooray, stories.

[@mechcannon]

This is the fastest uploads I've seen from this channel

[@dominiccenteno1233]

Played Age of Empires 2 and 3 when I was a kid along with Call of Duty 1 and 2. Supplemented by my father allowing us to watch movies and shows like Band of Brothers, Saving Private Ryan, Braveheart etc. Made me to who I am today, a history nerd who got the interest at an early age by playing video games.

[@SirSmite]

You can learn a lot playing the HoI games. Other than learning of the events that happened prior and during the war, I went the extra mile of making sure army groups and the armies under them are commanded by the right general, during the right year, with the right divisions, on the right theater, etc. A lot of surfing online in the middle of playing, let me tell you. I'm big on historical accuracy. Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to oversee Heeresgruppe B's push into middle America.

[@condor7435]

14:02 we need more humor like this

[@Magus4D]

Okay, it wasn't until about the 7 minute mark but after all the civ talk I am so happy Paradox got a shoutout too

[@sagnik2693]

Yep, I learnt about the Great Athiest Muslim Papal States from EUIV.

[@budakbaongsiah]

You mean the Arabic Bengal Empire led by an Italian that worships Jupiter from CK2.

[@willbailey413]

Take notes this will be on the test.

[@thefalloutwiki]

I learned a ton about WWI from this 90s PC game Titanic: Adventure out of time, I can still remember all the facts today almost 30 years later

[@JCDentonCZ]

Europa Barbarorum is a great historical mod that can definitely help in teaching history. Myself, Age of Empires 1 awoke me as a kid to history.

[@HadesWTF]

Double George in one week? It really is my birthday.

[@archfxt3619]

Idk why , but i like this kind of vids you did

[@evanelang]

CoD WaW got me into military history when I was really young. Resulted in a full fledged love of history as I went the High School-College so I'd say it at least can spark a desire to learn

[@octillus]

Was that the ancient theatre in Plovdiv?

[@choo_choo_]

Haven't watched the video yet, but yes (to a degree). Games can absolutely supplement the learning process in tandem with traditional learning (e.g. a class). Speaking from experience here. I was taking an American History class in college, ironically around the time Assassin's Creed 3 had come out so I was playing that at the time. I found I tended to remember the events and people easier in the class because "I was there" while playing the games. I ended up acing the final exam mostly because I associated these events with my own experiences. Obviously a fair bit of learning in class was important as well, otherwise there'd be nothing to associate anything to. It's more that remembering things done in the game helped me remember the details I've learned about in class. You wouldn't be able to pass a history class just from playing a video game. Learning about something from the viewpoint of an observer, I've found I've had less success remembering it, but viewing it from the perspective of "your own" experiences, I have found that I definitely remember it. Which I guess makes sense. There's a big difference between hearing something and doing something. AC2 helped me pass Art History as well, at least as far as architecture is concerned (ended up replaying it around the time we were going over the reniassance), so do what you will with that information. That's not to say that the AC games are perfect examples of history or that they're super incredible games, but they do put enough thought into what they're representing in a given time period and base it off actual events. That's why I think they work decently enough as a form of virtual tourism. At least the earlier ones anyway.

[@imperatoraugustus9970]

Crusader kings 2 and Europa Universalis 4 both led me into reading into history from all over the world. They made me realize how little I really knew, that school had taught me hardly anything on the subject. It actually had a major impact on my development as a person.

[@SpsTamiya]

I remember my first time I went to Firenze / Florence , and had a weird sense of dejavu until I remembered I climbed all the places people are queuing to get into, in AC2

[@militaryman2121]

Paradox grand strategies have taught me so much about history it’s insane. I’ve always been a history buff and if you’re like me you should seriously consider playing games like hearts of iron, Victoria, Europa universalis, and any other paradox game

[@TheRedKing247]

I absolutely believe that history games have value in teaching history. I think one of the moments that really sold me on this was in the game Kingdom Come: Deliverance, where because of me playing the world, I realized that... people are just people, no matter what time it is. It's very easy to get into this state where you think that because the technology and culture is so different that it's impossible to imagine how the life of a medieval peasant would be and we'd be nothing alike, but the truth is that people are people and even though there's no internet or phones or telegraphs yet, people still communicated and worked and lived together in ways very reminiscent of our own, in spite of all the darkness and death at those times. We might live different lives than them, but they're still people, people who can love and hate as much as a human being can.

[@justderp5713]

MORE!!!!

[@darkghor6372]

Medieval 2 Total War was my gateway drug for European history, then world history. We sometimes forget that these eras actually occurred and weren’t just funny costumes we put people in for movies, and when you’re reminded it really is magical.

[@Suprentus]

I'm surprised Kingdom Come Deliverance didn't come up once in this video.

[@Joy_ffa1bd]

it was made by nazis, and super bunnyhop leans left. hard to figure out why he didnt mention it.

[@GreedAndSelfishness]

@@Joy_ffa1bd Youre right, I forgot George is a leftist fool.

[@michelottens6083]

Also a lot of medievalist fetishism is white nazi-like men projecting into the past those 19th century history and science ideas that have long since proven false and poorly executed, but which they keep clinging on to, for white supremacist comfort, and under some significant institutional inertia.

[@slothfulcobra]

Anything that gets you interested in a subject can wind up teaching you at least tangentially. Paradox has driven me through wikipedia articles, but even more it has taught me so much geography. Never knew what Transoxania was before

[@thebigbrzezinski3201]

Uncharted Waters on the SNES put a hunger me for history and economics in me that I still love to indulge. I remember looking up a world map in an encyclopedia and using it to navigate with the in-game sextant. I suppose that experience is also why I don't mind cheating in single player games or mechanical spoilers.

[@exodosthesoulbanish]

I've learnt a bunch of stuff about the three kingdoms era and warring states thanks to the warriors series.