Could This ELECTRIC Plane CHANGE Float Planes Forever?

Air travel is responsible for a massive amount of pollution around the world, but for communities split by lakes and other large bodies of water, float planes are still the quickest way to get around. And while electric airplanes for long haul flights are still very much a pipe dream, for short-haul and arterial routes where float planes might spend minutes rather than hours in the air, electric propulsion is a viable way to keep communities connected without causing huge emissions.
And that's where the eBeaver from Harbour Air comes in. Powered by a motor from Magnix, it's the first prototype float plane developed by Harbour Air as it plans to electrify all of its small float planes.
We got to chat to Erika Holtz at Everything Electric - and witness the plane taking off for ourselves (and of course, we took our cameras so you could see too!)
----
00:00 - Introduction
02:27 - Introduction to the eBeaver - Fleet hopes
03:03 - Technical Specs
03:50 - eBeaver's primary service routes
05:00 - Maintenence schedule
06:08 - Plans for electirfication of the entire fleet
06:59 - Why the eBeaver is viable commercially
07:47 - Differences to the beaver ICE
08:51 - Pilot certification
09:56 - What's noticiable about this prototype
11:23 - Charging
12:55 - Can you help?
13:37 - This is a Harbour Air Led Project
14:11 - Oshkosh - and future adventures
14:38 - Thanks - give Turbo a hug!
14:58 - Take Off
16:38 - Thanks, and Goodbye!
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Links:
Find out more about the eBeaver program at: harbourair.com/ebeaver-specs/
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---
Presenter, Script, Audio: Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield
Camera, Editor, Colorist: Michael Horton
Art and Animation: Erin Carlie
Producer: Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield
© Transport Evolved LLC, 2024
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[@flavoie]

Yay! 🎉 Two of my favorite things: Beaver float planes and electric drive🎉 Lower maintenance is a big plus!!! Great info and interview!

[@barriewebster7406]

It’s so thrilling to see you feature Harbour Air’s EV venture on your channel. Harbour Air is essential to meet our transportation needs on the BC south coast and is incredibly useful for getting to and from Victoria and Vancouver. The Otter and Twin Otter are the backbone of this service. When they are eventually converted, not only will the travel be emissions-free, the folks who live on the waterfront next to the designated YWH runways in Victoria will be spared the associated fuel odours as the planes take off.

[@BillCarlson]

I love this!! Erika was clearly super knowledgeable and passionate about the electrification of air transport. Can't wait to take an electric flight one day. :)

[@AdrianoCasemiro]

Transport evolved Indeed! All I can say is that this is the best source of information for transport electrification. And yes, I am an aviation nerd. Great job, Nikki.

[@HarbourAirSeaplanes]

Thank you for stopping by to visit our all-electric eBeaver and connecting with our brilliant engineer, Erika Holtz! We look forward to buzzing the skies again very soon!

[@mobiusone3923]

Being an aviation nerd, I find this incredibly facinating. It makes sense for SHORT HAUL trips in smaller planes. Especially vs the old school radial engines. The PT6 turboprop will be hard to beat, but this system has some potential. Cool video!! (Interview with Turbo and HRH soon?!)

[@transportevolved]

We wish- we LOVE turbo. pretty sure HRH would, too - Nikki

[@capnkirk5528]

I've been following Harbour Air for several years. De Havilland Canada has (I believe) a real opportunity to electrify some of the world's most iconic aircraft using the trail being blazed here. Given a small, "green" and relatively low-cost, LOW-NOISE solution I strongly suspect there would be a LOT of demand. Air travel is ripe for disruption, and unlike cars it is not likely to be "more of the same" since airports are already capacity-constrained around the world. A lot of the rush is for EVTOLs, but an electric version of any of a number of original DHC aircraft (i.e. DASH 7) COULD have a shorter path to certification as electric since it would be mostly a powerplant change.

[@MarcoNierop]

Harbor Air is working on this for many years already, 10 December 2019 the first e-Beaver flight took place. I was a bit surprised they do not have the charging issue sorted out better, with only one 60Kw charger and a clumsy mobile charger. Here in The Netherlands we see more and more electric boats, and fast chargers appear in several harbors around the country.

[@ChuckvdL]

@@MarcoNierop with a lot of testing you’re taking a fair bit of time between test flights, so there’s ample time to charge at a rate like 60KW. That might take 2 hours or more (how big was their pack?) The need for faster charging comes when you need faster turnaround.

[@patreekotime4578]

I think the main issue is that onboard fast chargers add significant weight and take up space. There is apparently some work being done on routing charging through the motor of some EVs to eliminate the need for an on board charger, but its experiemental afaik.

[@MarcoNierop]

@@ChuckvdL Yeah, that is true, but in all these years you would expect they would have thought about this a little more and develop some solutions.

[@ChuckvdL]

@@MarcoNierop in a rapidly moving environment it doesn’t make sense to solve problems until just before you need to. It saves wasted work due to requirements and technology constantly changing. After all, if you can’t make the plane fly like you want, you’re not going to be worried about charging it. Waiting allowed more time for other charging solutions to emerge.

[@ChuckvdL]

@@patreekotime4578 E-GMP architecture (Hyundai Kia Genesis) electric cars already use the rear motor and inverter to step up the voltage of older lower voltage DC fast chargers. It’s beyond experimental and in production for close to three years. It’s also likely patented, so unless others opt to license the tech….. onboard L2 chargers are relatively light, nearly all production EV’s have them but are usually capable of 20KW at best. DC charging equipment is always entirely external, (beyond what some 800v cars use to step up voltage of older DC chargers). Unfortunately onboard gear to step up DC is power limited, the E-GMP approach only supports up to 100KW, and most others like lucid can barely handle half that. So that’s not a potential solution here. Despite the words they used, if their concern is over the DC output voltage, it’s not Level2 which merely supplies 240VAC (or 208 in commercial/industrial buildings) to onboard equipment of the vehicle. They must be talking about DC fast charging equipment to directly charge at 800v

[@FordGT40MkIV]

I lived in the San Juan Islands in the 80s and 90s and took Harbor Air to/from Seattle now and then. The Beaver is a great plane and theirs are very well maintained (I think they were made in the 40s). So glad they are making this investment. Thanks for the great story.

[@MrChris20912]

Love seeing the progress in electric flight! Though it was also interesting to briefly hear about the port side charging network needs.

[@gusbarber00]

This was great I loved it. No one else at the show thought to do a story on the EBeaver that I know of. I have been following this story for a long time so it was nice to have the update. It also made me chuckle the thought of Nikki hugging the mascot lol.

[@pfunk768]

Not to mention most propeller planes still use LEADED fuel, including harbour air

[@martinutr]

Really?!? I didn’t know that leaded fuel was still being used. I am old enough to remember when it was banned. There were some complainers(probably parents of today’s oil company sympathizers) but the ban stayed. I thought it was gone everywhere.

[@brianb-p6586]

​​@@martinutrlead was banned only in on-road motor vehicles. Some motorsports and most aviation still use leaded, because they are irresponsible and selfish.

[@cageordie]

That is now banned in California. Manufacturers of fantastically expensive 1950s engines are going to have to get with the 1980s and spend a few dollars on hardened valve seats.

[@brianb-p6586]

@@cageordie that's good news in California... but it doesn't take effect until 2031.

[@alsavage1]

@@cageordie I would have thought all aero ICE would have aluminum alloy heads, which would have valve seat inserts anyway. Valve seat recession is a thing on cast iron heads, but on aluminum heads?

[@leebiggs2844]

I'm sure Kenmore Air here in Puget Sound is following this closely as they operate Beavers to Victoria, Vancouver, and the San Juan islands as well.

[@triplec8375]

Another excellent video! Kudos to Harbor Air, Magnix and, of course, Nikki. The bulk of humanity worldwide lives in or very near a coastal community. There is a huge market potential for providing cost-effective and convenient transportation between coastal cities and between islands for places as diverse as Hawai'i, Scandinavia, Southeast U.S., , the Philippines, and the Mediterranean basin. While float planes work well in certain geographies, the much larger opportunity will likely be for new aircraft such as the Jekta PHA-ZE 100 which will be amphibious and the Regent Viceroy sea glider which is a wing-in-ground-effect vehicle. Both can be built as pure electric or hydrogen hybrid.

[@louisjov]

Float and Bush planes are ubiquitous here in Alaska. I would love to see a discussion on these in more remote places

[@MarkSpohr]

I recently flew in a (very old) Beaver from Key West to Dry Tortugas National Park. This would be a great route for an electric Beaver. Short flight, low altitude (saw lots of turtles, etc.)

[@Russwig]

255... Neat! Complete and efficient. Can't wait for the utilized design of this tech. Keep Evolving!

[@cageordie]

Listen carefully, what she actually telling you is they have an increase of 13%in cruise power. She didn't mention that reducing from 62% to 42%came with increasing engine power from 450hp to 750hp.

[@alsavage1]

@@cageordie That's not my take-away. With no openings in the fairing needed for air intake, cooling, or exhaust, the aero of the front is probably quite a bit better than with the ICE. And Ms. Holtz mentioned that they've kept the power of the motor to a similar level as the ICE, so while the performance curve of the motor is better, it's not using a lot more energy to get there.

[@davidpenlington2753]

Great to hear people who know what their talking about.

[@TinkerTry]

Great work here! I filmed a similar video at Harbour Air the same day as you, and Erika was just fantastic to everybody. It was fun to see your professional video equipment, and this final result looks great, and I learned stuff I forgot to ask during my time with Harbour Air. It's a longshot, but I'm reaching out to some folks I know in the EV charging business and see what I can come up with, including engineers who got the Pipistrel electric airplane charging from a Ford F-150 Lightning.

[@nefrojas]

This is so way extra super cool.

[@DaveRead-u5u]

Wow - excellent video Nikki. That company is impressive and we hope a lot of charging and aeronautical engineers see this and are motivated. Again, great video (much better than an Air BNB one :).

[@markallan9528]

Awesome interview and learned so much. Seems like some of these companies have been on their own. Hope their partnership/teaming works through the changes as soon as possible and their ev planes are off and flying! Please keep following their progress.

[@irnbrukidsm]

Absolutely brilliant informative video which demonstrates a new future

[@oOCentralSunOo]

It's amazing what one small company can do

[@gryzman]

Used to live in Vancouver , briefly - miss the place and walks

[@stevewausa]

This was fascinating, appreciate the update.

[@pingnick]

It seems like Nio style battery switching technology should be aggressively pursued in aviation though water fleets different challenges perhaps?🔋🤯

[@pingnick]

Wild that I saw somewhere an a350 is OVER AN HOUR to fully fuel!? so potentially for small planes ~instant battery switching very alluring?

[@matthewbaynham6286]

They should put the batteries in the floats. When you fast charge you need battery cooling, which will be easy to design in if the floats are in ice cold water.

[@stvrob6320]

Putting all that weight in the floats could lower the center of gravity and alter the handling characteristics of the aircraft significantly. This would probably affect its certification. Best to change as little as possible in this regard.

[@alsavage1]

You realize you have to _heat_ Li-Ion batteries if they're too cold? Too cold = below around 50°F. It takes a lot of energy to keep the batteries warm; cooling them is energy cheap but adds complexity that warming doesn't.

[@matthewbaynham6286]

@@alsavage1 when you're not using the aircraft you can wheel it up on land. You wouldn't want the underside of the floats to have any growth, because that would slow you down in the water.

[@martinutr]

For remote communities hopefully a solar and/or wind electric source coupled with a storage battery would make plane fuel possibly right by the dock.

[@KevinZucht]

Not this first beaver that Craig has electrified, years ago he took a 1/4 scale beaver that hung in his office for years.....electrified it with a brushless motor and lithium batteries....thus planting the seed.

[@olebloom1641]

Fun and informative episode.

[@midtoad]

I have flown on both single and to an engine aircraft out of that same harbour many times. Can't wait till I'm able to do it in an electric airplane! By the way, as a licensed pilot, I could not help but notice that the pilot didn't need to waste any time, warming up the engine and checking the magneto's. It was simply fired up and head out. That means less time spent on the trip for passengers, another clear win.

[@timscarman4599]

Pity about the music at the end, really wanted to hear the electric powered propeller sound, esp. once in the air…. Please re-upload without music masking the plane, that’d be awesome…. Good vid btw.

[@transportevolved]

As our editor noted - we can't. We'd get a copyright take-down. There was music playing from nearby the docks, and that would potentially result in a take-down notice.

[@djw1779]

Fabulous. Though I wish she’d asked about noise.

[@HermannKerr]

The Beaver is one the great bush planes. I have been following this project nearly from day one.

[@showme360]

My short term answer to the charging system is to use a shipping container on a barge with chargers onboard this can have a rotating second barge which is being charged up itself ready for use. I would also consider a third float under the plane, which provides battery power for taxi and to achieve take off speed. At the point when take off is ready, and third float detaches once the aircraft is ready to lift off from the water, the third float then returns by is own small propeller to the docks ready for the second aircraft or charging.

[@christopherdahle9985]

That'd probably work. The barges might be docked at floating PV installations even. But for efficient scheduled short haul and charter turnaround, operations, you'd probably just want a simple DCFC at the end of the dock where you deplane the passengers, not hard to do, just expensive for a company busy prototyping an airplane while others are working on the charging problem. By the time Harbor Air has an STC for this modification, I suspect there will be significant improvements in energy density and charging speed, not to mention in capacity for building and installing charging infrastructure. The capabilities of this airplane in 2027 will likely be far beyond what we see here, and charging might look completely different. Think of how the range and capability of automotive EVs have expanded in just the past 5 years and even in the last 2. I expect the EV world of 2029 to be far beyond what we see today.

[@ariisaac5111]

Yes, @TE, I love this too and wish you would do more in-depth interviews like this in various electrification technology areas that are on the cutting transition edge. I've got one question though, at 7:27 what does the lady mean by 8 minute cruise versus 30 minute cruise regarding the 40% power versus 60% Max power. Is that longer duration time at steady speed altitude? TIA.

[@brianb-p6586]

To keep a stock Beaver flying at cruise speed requires 62% of the radial engine's power; that's 279 HP or 208 kW. To keep this converted Beaver flying at cruise speed requires 61% of the electric engine's power; assuming that she is referring to the 450 HP limit configured for this motor (not the maximum power the motor is capable of) that's 185 HP or 138 kW. So much of the battery capacity was needed for reserve that their first calculations left enough for only 8 minutes of cruise, but now that they realize that they need less power to fly there is enough energy for 33 minutes of cruise. Yes, "cruise" is time at steady speed and altitude.

[@SmoochyRoo]

I can definitely see them purchasing a few Joby EVTOLs with floats, Joby flew theirs on hydrogen fuel cells for 500+ miles recently

[@michaelsmithers4900]

Only issue I see there is the continued reliance on fossil fuel…

[@jamesphillips2285]

Why drown out the prop noise with music?

[@timscarman4599]

Just commented exactly on that. What were they thinking…. did ask for a re-upload so we could hear the electric powered propellor sound, esp once airborne.

[@jamesphillips2285]

@@timscarman4599 "Nikki - Today at 9:11 AM As we’ve said multiple times, there was rights protected music playing on the dock. [9:11 AM] I’m sorry   [9:11 AM] I would love to have shared it, but that could have got us in trouble too."

[@ResidentNetizen]

A very impressive report!

[@enzoticus6378]

A great interview. Considering the large and relatively flat surface of the wing the Aperta light weight solar system would be a great boon the these planes.

[@michaelsmithers4900]

That’s a great idea, I wonder if there would be a significant weight penalty? Definitely some good surface area!

[@robertbetancourt1386]

The beaver from 1937 is the original air frame.

[@brianb-p6586]

The first eBeaver (registration C-FJOS) is the only one flying; it has a single-core magni500 EPS (Electric Propulsion System) as mentioned at 3:20. The second eBeaver (C-FIFQ) is under construction, and expected to first fly around he end of 2024; it has a dual-core magni650, not for more power, but for more redundancy because Harbour Air found that they could not meet certification standards (regarding failure modes) for commercial operation with the original unit.

[@chasl3645]

Maybe putting golf ball dimples on the bottom of the pontoons on the plane would break up surface tension and help it go through the water easier taking less power to get airborne.

[@Pottery4Life]

Thank you.

[@NeilBlanchard]

Excellent! I'll bet the eBeaver is a lot quieter? Slight correction for Erika Holtz - it's an electric *motor* - though later in the interview, she got it right.

[@MarcoNierop]

Not really, the sound of the propeller is overwhelming the sound of the radial or turbo engine, so the electric drive train doesn't really make it quieter.. Maybe only a littlebit during taxi.

[@NeilBlanchard]

@@MarcoNierop so the engine noise or vibration and exhaust noise are not present - but it's no quieter? I am skeptical...

[@stvrob6320]

The propeller itself is what causes most of the noise.

[@NeilBlanchard]

@@stvrob6320 yes, but sound pressure level is cumulative, and thousands of explosions per minute are not quiet.

[@erikaholtz785]

To be certified under FAR Part 33 as an Aircraft Engine the electric motor with inverters is defined as an engine. It has been a difficult transition to that verbiage.

[@VitalStatistics-t7t]

Great video!

[@michaelsmithers4900]

Awesome content! Nice to see what’s going on in another realm of transportation. I do wonder how many sacrifices are being made to get through certification more easily. It’s like and EV built on top of an ICE platform vs. on a dedicated platform…

[@ChuckvdL]

@@michaelsmithers4900 that’s a good question. I’m sure there’s some compromises, but I expect a lot depends on how much of the ICE infrastructure like fuel tanks still remains in place as dead weight. Or if the tanks are removed and replaced with an equal weight in batteries (because that’s where the weight was designed to be) It’s not like there’s a transmission/exhaust tunnel on a prop plane.

[@patreekotime4578]

I'm not sure "sacrifices" is the right word here. There are actually great advantages to using an established plane with well understood flight characteristics and mechanicals, from the perspective of the pilots, mechanics, and regulators, etc. It also likely dramatically lowers the cost of entry compared to having new planes manufactured, and ensures that classic airframes will remain flying in the future.

[@michaelsmithers4900]

@@patreekotime4578It’s been proven out in automotive over and over again that designing a drive train to fit in an existing space is not as good as a purpose built vehicle designed around a drivetrain. The advantages you mentioned are real but will constrain the drive train design.

[@patreekotime4578]

@@michaelsmithers4900 Not sure how this could be any more obvious... but this isn't a car. It is also not mass production. These are 80 year old proven airframes servicing the same routes they've been doing for decades and with this electric conversion will hopefully be doing for another 40 years. It does not get any more environmentally friendly than not throwing away something that is perfectly useable just because it's old. No need to reinvent the wheel. You seem to want to make this as complicated, as resource intensive, and as expensive as possible... for what? Some slim margins of idealized efficiency? Heck, they've already DErated the motor. This isn't about ideals. It's about the real world. About being good enough to do the job.

[@BudahOfBirmingham]

Great information, I’d like to know if it’s quieter than gas and running costs lower

[@brianb-p6586]

It is significantly quieter. Operating costs depend on the price of electricity, and amortized cost of battery replacement.

[@robertweekley5926]

I know they Fly from Vancouver Harbour, to various Points West, but maybe they could offer Flights to Chilliwack, and Langley, in the eBeaver?! It would be a nice "Local Entrance" to the world of Electric Flight, easily fit within the Capabilities, and, especially if they have 2 of them certified, it would work well!

[@grantralston4805]

Great video, all new info to me.

[@brianb-p6586]

At 5:03 as original piston DHC-2 Beavers are mentioned the video cuts to images of DHC-3 Otters which have been converted to turboprops.

[@stvrob6320]

How does propeller pitch control work? I would guess that since an electric motor can develop nearly max torque at any speed, the need for constant speed prop systems could be eliminated or at least greatly simplified.

[@waynesimpson2074]

Yes, I was also thinking along the lines of magnified torque roll from throttle application? Great to hear these women talking about Beavers, I love them so does Harrison Ford.

[@AerialWaviator]

Propeller pitch is typically controlled hydraulically. Changing pitch is less about managing torque, and more to do with ensuring the blades (really just smaller wings) operated at the most efficient angle. Just as the main wing will not be very efficient if was twisted vertical relative to forward speed, similar with the blades. At low speed they are flat and increase pitch as speed increases. Operating at closer to ideal pitch also reduces noise.

[@stvrob6320]

@@AerialWaviator Yes that is true, but since it is easy to spin the prop of an electric motor at most any speed while still developing the required torque, (something an internal combustion engine is not good at), the need for variable pitch is much less compelling for an electric motor drive.

[@AerialWaviator]

@@stvrob6320 Spinning a propeller at any speed (RPM) is not the issue, it all about aerodynamics and producing the most thrust for a particular power setting. There's a reason the eBeaver has a verbal pitch propeller, and per video will be on the final approved architecture. Pilot watching, will understand why too.

[@brianb-p6586]

​@stvrob6maximum torque is certainly not available at "any speed" in an electric motor.

[@danielmadar9938]

Thanks

[@bmobert]

I didn't think of charging infrastructure for float planes. Nor that the very well might want to share their infrastructure with electric boats, tugs and the like. Fascinating! Thank you. The Beaver is, of course, iconic. But one of the things that always bugged me about float planes is the floats. I understand why they're designed that shape. And it's tried, tested and true tech. But it's also inefficient in the water and inefficient in the air. I've always wondered why float planes.didn't use retractable hydrofoil on more hydrodynamic pontoons. Is it just momentum and complexity? Or is there a practical, physics reason?

[@JF-xx9yn]

Wonderful! So good to see :)

[@thomasfriedmann8522]

E beaver is just so nice.

[@mrxmry3264]

funny, when i saw the thumbnail, i thought this was a fully charged video. and then nikki appeared on the screen.

[@Petethehun]

Along with ever improving battery technology, I suspect swapping batteries in and out of planes would be a possible future option.

[@kotgc7987]

Make fluffy beaver happier with a gentle warm touch of sun on those beaver wings, sitting in the sun all day = ~10 kWh of free solar power...digital is the way.

[@brianb-p6586]

10 kWh is enough for about 4 minutes of flight time in this aircraft.

[@buzzofftoxicblog791]

❤😊 I'm looking forward to an all. transport is sustainably, renewably fuelled and zero emission... it'd be nice to see the wings covered in solar panels and the top of the fuselage... 😊 and it would be nice to see new ground up electric planes.. 🎉😊 👍 🌍 ❤️

[@andyroid7339]

Great video Nikki! Just a thought - why have retractable floats not a thing yet? Surely the extra mass of the retractor mechanism would outweigh the energy used in overcoming the drag of large 'unhidden' proportion (I envisage that the floats would tuck into the body, exposed on one side only and still be streamlined) of the float and supports? Any engineers there who could enlighten me please?

[@christopherdahle9985]

The design you imagine would be totally cool! Unfortunately, engineers must think in terms of requirements and constraints if they want to feed their families. The big constraint in developing the airplane you suggest is the cost of development relative to the possible efficiency of that design and the market demand. Floatplanes are simple and durable. Beavers have been flying profitably and reliably for 70 years. A successful retrofit to electric power will probably keep many of them flying past the 100-year mark. But it doesn't take a lot of them, converted to floatplanes to perform the demands of this mission. Developing a completely new airplane along the lines you suggest would be an expensive undertaking to meet a limited market. What Harbor Air is doing is piggybacking on many very exciting developments from multiple industries. They are of course doing a lot of development themselves, but much of what they are doing incorporates off the shelf components, including the existing DeHavilland Beaver itself, an aircraft already well capable of the air taxi service it will perform when electrified. Similar efforts are underway for the comparable Caravan and Kodiak (Cessna and Pilatus respectively) utility airplanes. All will benefit from rapidly growing developments in automotive EVs, an industry that dwarfs the tiny, but totally exhilarating world of general aircraft. Design of a new floatplane for this mission certainly is possible, especially with CAD, CAM, and advanced materials now available, but development would require a long lead time and barrels full of money. The mission these airplanes serve is important, but very small relative to the cost of certifying a new airplane to meet it.

[@alsavage1]

Float planes run really slow, compared to your typical jet. Drag that would be profitably removed or relocated on a commercial plane that runs 550 MPH is nearly insignificant on a plane that runs "only" 160 MPH.

[@stevey_z]

This is such a cool vehicle and video❤

[@thomasfriedmann8522]

E twin otter would be cool.

[@rbdogwood]

excellent

[@rklein]

I would imagine taking off from the water surface would be a huge drag.

[@joebullwinkle5099]

Do you get any re-gen during the descent?

[@mrtriathlondude]

@@joebullwinkle5099 technically you could, but it's more efficient to just glide than to Regen, since gliding is already a form of converting potential to kinetic energy

[@doug1olson]

Very cool!

[@peterjaniceforan3080]

Hopefully in my lifetime 🙏

[@ThalassTKynn]

I suppose the Beaver is a lower category aircraft, so their AMEs have an M1 license in Canada, so while TC probably won't require a whole type course for the e-beaver they should definitely have the same level of training as a turbo beaver would require. More so, really, since this will be their first electric aircraft. The maintenance course they did in college doesn't cover much in the way of traction motors. As a former avionics guy who now does the mechanical side I do worry about the idea of my fellow grease monkeys working on these. Come to think of it it'd probably be better to give the propulsion system to the E license category on electric aircraft 🤣 I am so damn envious of the people who get to work on this project! I gave up suggesting this kind of project to my employer years ago, before I changed to maintenance :(

[@finecutpost]

This video could use a good edit. There is much repetition that could be removed without loss of content. It's a great subject and really interesting but it could be so much better with a snappier edit. Mt 2c worth.

[@flyingpuck15]

I hate to be a downer, IMO we NEED the next level of battery technology to make E-Aviation viable. When you have a runaway lithium fire on an airplane, you can’t just pull over on the side of the road and jump out. Charging times are too long and charging at remote sites that don’t have superchargers won’t work so you need to have enough energy on board to go out and back. I think there is a viable application for electric aviation, and that would be training teaching new pilots. You’re taking off and landing at the same airport. training flights can be about an hour long, and you can have swappable batteries.

[@moenaguib2947]

Iron Phosphate technology is already here, and it's not as prone to fire.

[@flyingpuck15]

@@moenaguib2947I’m not sure, but i think this chemistry has a lower energy density.

[@chrisbailey5055]

6:58 glad she mentioned hydrogen...fuell cell technology makes a lot of sense for fixed wing aircraft....and combustible hydrogen is coming as well.

[@DugganSean]

@@chrisbailey5055 there's a few kinks to be worked out with combustible hydrogen.. Unless you have a link to some new engine i can read about, but I've yet to see anything that makes me think it's ever going to be be better than current gas engines and ev with battery.

[@chrisbailey5055]

@@DugganSean can't post links here, but I can on the discord if you are on the TE discord

[@brianb-p6586]

"Combustible hydrogen"? Hydrogen is always combustible. Use of hydrogen as a combustion fuel exists, and due to both inefficiency and exhaust emissions (of oxides of nitrogen) is only seriously considered where fuel cells are too heavy.

[@chrisbailey5055]

@@brianb-p6586 yeah that is the term used in aviation when you are not talking fuel cells, and yeah commercial passenger service is exactly where you will see it.... In around 15-20 years.

[@brianb-p6586]

@@chrisbailey5055 The term for use of hydrogen as a fuel for engines (rather than in fuel cells) is "hydrogen combustion", not "combustible hydrogen"... according to Airbus, and everyone else.

[@rklein]

Also, what are the advantages to the passengers choosing to ride the electric versus gas planes?

[@alsavage1]

A lot quieter? Around 20 dB quieter at cruise speed.

[@willburk]

Why can't they find a charger? Aren't there several car manufacturers installing 800V chargers in their cars?!? Also, pretty sure with a tweak or two they can just use two 400V chargers in series.

[@ChuckvdL]

Onboard AC chargers in EV’s are typically limited power because most homes don’t have >60amp circuits. Above 20KW is very rare. It’s enough to fully recharge overnight, on a typical residential 240v circuit (9-12KW). But not to full recharge in an hour or two. Charging above that is typically DC. Level1 = 120VAC input Level2= 240VAC input

[@willburk]

@@ChuckvdL I thought they said they were having trouble finding a Level 2 charger that could do 800V. Maybe I need to watch again.

[@willburk]

@@ChuckvdLI was right, check 12:20. They're looking for a Level 2 charger that'll go up to 800V.

[@ChuckvdL]

@@willburk with most 800v electric vehicles the level 1&2 “charger” is onboard, and what most people call a charger is EVSE that just provides 120/240vac to the vehicle. In this case they really are talking about the charger, not just EVSE. They might have to look at something designed for a 800v car. The majority of what’s out there in the retrofit market is designed for under 750 or under. But even lucid, who has one of the best, has a max Level2 acceptance rate of 19KW. Since they are talking about DC voltages, but also saying “level2” but WAY higher than typical L2 power levels I don’t know what to think.. those are normally orthogonal terms

[@ChuckvdL]

@@willburk oh also, the way most 800v cars deal with older DC chargers that don’t support >500VDC is to have internal systems to step up the voltage. Lucid uses their wonder box, but it’s limited to 50KW. E-GMP cars use the rear motor in conjunction with their inverter to step up the voltage, but that’s limited to 100KW. (vs a typical peak 240KW charging rate on a proper fully NEVI compliant charger). Without their motor the E-GMP approach wouldn’t be usable here, and the lucid technology doesn’t improve on the 60KW they already have. I think the same is true for Porsche, so no help to be had trying to borrow auto-EV tech.

[@lewevans2413]

6:58 For the record. All people watching this are nerds. All nerds are aircraft nerds.

[@Coyotehello]

Terrible decision from Harbour Air to discontinue the route between Vancouver-Salt Spring-Maple Bay. Destroying the communities that have supported Harbour Air for over 30 years is, to stay polite, disappointing. With a 14 day notice. I hope they will reverse that decision. That being said I am hoping to be trying this electric plane as soon as possible!

[@Vikingj72]

When powering a vehicle with an electric power plant, it is a "MOTOR" not an engine. Gas powered vehicles have "ENGINES" and electric powered have "MOTORS".

[@transportevolved]

Are you feeling better?

[@stvrob6320]

Both are correct.

[@erikaholtz785]

To be certified under FAR Part 33 as an Aircraft Engine the electric motor with inverters is defined as an engine.

[@transportevolved]

Thank you! regulations are important! ❤️

[@ChuckvdL]

Definitions 1&3 work. I don’t think regulators care about #2 engine /ĕn′jĭn/ noun * A machine that converts energy into mechanical force or motion. * Such a machine distinguished from an electric, spring-driven, or hydraulic motor by its use of a fuel. * A mechanical appliance, instrument, or tool. "engines of war." The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition

[@scottstormcarter9603]

So important in Alaska, will Canada dominate electric float planes?

[@Pottery4Life]

OK. Maybe I'm messed up, and I'm glad they are making progress, but I could swear they should be MUCH farther along than this. Perhaps they are just really underfunded in this aspect, but I thought they were flying this prototype a couple two or three years ago. Maybe more??? Only have minimal charging infrastructure? I mean, not even a dock side plug-in at ONE of their destinations??? I forget which channel featured them, maybe FC, but Harbour Air seemed ALL IN on electrification at that time. I don't mean to be disparaging, I'm just puzzled.

[@AlRoderick]

Aircraft development is a long cycle.

[@llaughridge]

Just because some channel overhyped the state of the prototype several years ago, doesn't mean it isn't exactly on-schedule.

[@douggarson50]

I saw another video on the E Beaver and the Engineer said they lost some momentum due to Covid.

[@douggarson50]

@@AlRoderick Yes and there are at least two additional complications. One is they can't take full advantage of new developments in battery technology. They need to pick a technology and take it thru the certification process which means the aircraft they certify may have a battery technology that is several generations behind the latest generation. Second they certifying a whole new power system which for example has no existing standards for "fuel" reserve etc. So I suspect in some cases they have to wait for the authorities to decide on new rules or perhaps propose to the authorities what the new rules should be and wait for them to accept them as opposed to just designing something based on existing rules and demonstrating that they meet the rules. This was discussed on another video about the E Beaver by another channel.

[@ashtaroth1975]

I'm having deja vu, 5 years ago they were also in the prototype phase and it's still not available?

[@Pottery4Life]

I have the same feeling. My guess would be funding.

[@brianb-p6586]

​@@Pottery4Lifegood guess, but the time has been spent dealing with regulations, proving reliability, and waiting for a usable battery.

[@johnpalmer5131]

I would think a range extender ICE add-on option (say in the floats pontoons) would really make this more viable.

[@michaelsmithers4900]

@@johnpalmer5131 adding more weight? It already has range extenders, wings.

[@alsavage1]

Did you see the tech specs @3:17 ? They have a range extended version planned. It'll go 75 minutes instead of 60, but at the expense of reduced payload of 280 lbs. You could double the range, but then only the pilot could fly ;) It's a weight/range trade-off.

[@JHDundrum]

🙂

[@chasl3645]

Put the batteries in the wings.

[@brianb-p6586]

Did you think that this did not occur to them? Do you realize that there is no usable space in the wings? The stock Beaver fuel tanks are in the belly, not in the wings.

[@brianb-p6586]

The back seat is full of "gubbins"... how British.

[@AdrianMcDaid]

Why cant the batteries go in the skies or af lease some of then

[@fonkenful]

Centre of gravity, aerodynamics, perhaps?

[@AdrianMcDaid]

@@fonkenful just curious.

[@fonkenful]

@@AdrianMcDaid To be clear, that was just supposition on my part.

[@brianb-p6586]

Did you mean in the "skis", which are actually floats? That would be a mass distribution issue, but the big problem is the weight of the battery, not the volume which it occupies.

[@peterjaniceforan3080]

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿😋

[@222INFINITY]

Our future electric world all comes down to battery advancements and hydrogen, we're getting close!!!!!!!

[@cageordie]

Hydrogen is not an energy source, it's more like a bad battery that is great at escaping if you leave it stored for long. Look at how the hydrogen car experiments have failed.

[@cageordie]

Someone is playing fast and loose with numbers here. Sounds like marketing. 62% of 450 is 279, 42% of 750hp is 315. So they reduced percentage cruise power but increased actual cruise power by 13%.At cruise a Beaver burns 22-28 gallons per hour. So 30 minutes to Victoria burns less than 15 gallons. So that's 90 pounds of fuel. What do the batteries weigh? The 750hp Magni 500 is 300 pounds, which is a lot better than the 640lb, 450hp Wasp Junior. With the belly tanks only, no tip tanks, a Beaver has 3 hours of fuel. How long do the batteries last. 300hp for 30 minutes is about 111kWh. That's more than an 1100 pound Tesla 3 battery can hold. So now we've gone from a 730 pound engine and fuel combination to 1400 pounds. So what's the useful load? I guess this explains the need for 750hp and the increase in cruise power. For comparison the 578hp PT6A-6 turbine conversion is lighter, 275 pounds, than the electric motor. But I guess the electric Beaver works on short routes. Even with the weight penalty. Oh, 156kWh? So near 2,000 pounds? The original load capacity. It's going to be tough making this practical.

[@spiritzweispirit1st638]

Beautiful AirCraft' Tho Why isn't anyone putting two balanced 'Nacels'_ Somewhere either side on the Craft 'With Air Driven Propped Chargers inside⚡?!

[@jimsouthlondon7061]

I thought the babe in the Yellow shirt was actually Nikki and I thought she had lost a load of weight . Yep she was nice 😉

[@AerialWaviator]

An exceptional presentation. Other than avoiding weather, the reason jets need to fly high is they require the colder air aloft (-30 to -40º) to increase their efficiency. Jet engines operating in warm air near the surface are very inefficient, as they need to consume so much more low density air to get the oxygen they require. Since electric motors are not dependent on oxygen, they produce the same power regardless of altitude.

[@CC-iq2pe]

To help getting more environmentally friendly the hydraulic systems would benefit by using electric actuators instead.

[@brianb-p6586]

Sure, but that would be an unnecessary change which would make certification for commercial operation more difficult, costly, and time-consuming.