CPM Magna Cut -a new stainless steel on the market how does it compare to S45VN, Vanax, and 3V?

[@KnifeNinjaEDC]

I love steel nerdery like this. Magnacut will be my next sourced knife. Just got a Vanax fixed blade and although expensive, it absolutely fulfills my blade needs. Thanks for the well put together video.

[@BennyCFD]

Why not get a Tungsten Carbide knife..........I've not priced a Magnacut knife but I'm sure a Tungsten Carbide might be a few dollars less.

[@rogersiples3335]

Thanks for the explanation. Can't wait to buy a fixed blade in CPM Magnacut.

[@Tanalark99]

I have a Creely blade of the CPM-3V and absolutely LOVE it. It is razor sharp from the forge and was so sharp, in fact, that it effortlessly penetrated the (very well-made) leather sheath that came with it when my wife tried to put it away. A Kydex sheath would be a really welcome offering from the Creely forge.

[@emarr3720]

Kydex won’t save you. I just received my Benchmade Meatcrafter & it so sharp & slicey that the 1st time I tried to sheathed it went thru kydex like it wasn’t even there. If I’d been grasping instead of pinching the sheath it would have gone thru my hand!! It’s ruined, so the knife lives on my magnetic knife holder in the kitchen.

[@gravytrainoutdoors]

I’m definitely looking forward to getting a blade in magnacut and putting it through its paces.

[@kevinbreese5739]

I just purchased a LionSteel M4 in Magnacut. They did it in 62 Rc. Can't wait to try it out! It should go nicely with my Creely Vanax Mako once I get it. :)

[@tristanvigouroux6320]

Let us know what you think about this blade cause I received exactly the same knife last week and I'm desappointed... Here is the experience I described to Lionsteel company: " I doubt it to be 62HRC hardness but if it is, Magnacut would offer better results if the heat treat would be around 63/64HRC. Indeed Magnacut is basically tougher than M390 but with less good edge retention. Pretty easy to get thin sharp edge with leather strop the edge retention is objectively not good. From super sharp (managed to curl part of a hair) to not shaving at all just after some carton cuts. Sharp it again and just after making fruits salad on a plastic board the knife isn't sharp anymore... I would love to compare it with the M390 version but can't pay for another knife to try it... Maybe something got wrong during the process of this serie...don't know. But I certainly know that from a knife I thought to be my favourite one it gonna end to be the one I'm not really using to not be desappointed each time of use."

[@Creelyblades]

@@tristanvigouroux6320 you may want to give it a few good sharpening’s, sometimes manufactures heat up the edge when they sharpen, and a few hand sharpening’s, will get past that

[@tacticalcenter8658]

Stainless 4v sounds good. I like 4v but the only 4v I have is the st. Nick's spyderco shaman in 4v. The blade is coated so it doesn't have any visual rust issues. I only used the knife for a few weeks at work but haven't used it since. I'll have to check to see if the edge has oxidation, likely not.

[@tacticalcenter8658]

@Strangely Brown I'm assuming your chipping is due to burnt edges. Sharpen several times past the burnt edge and then tell me how well it is, I bet you it chips much less if at all. But yeah 3v has better toughness, delta 3v being even better (proprietary 3v heat treatment from Carothers improving all aspects of 3v).

[@gaberoo9099]

Of course am waiting for your magnacut pieces as well (and AEB-L).

[@barrybueler3356]

Sounds like a sexy my favorite stainless steel for yrs now is AEB-L good stain resistance good edge retention and easy to sharpen and fairly tough especially for a stainless steel. I would love to see more companies would use it or maybe RWL-34 and I see alout of companies switching from cpm154 to s30v which is an upgrade on paper but I wish they would stick to cpm154 even 154cm,vg10 14c28n,N690,ATS-34,CTS-xhp and I’d love to see more knives in LC200N great performance and almost %100 rust proof great for butchering the kitchen, fishing harvesting game or just for edc plus it’s a great steel for those rainy days when outdoors.

[@dimmacommunication]

I'm still extremely amazed by AEB-L, very surprised nobody uses it 😅😔

[@totallyrandomstuffandrevie9609]

I've got a Bradford guardian 3.5 in nitro v . Pretty much the same. 130.00 on amazon.

[@willieboy3011]

Good video. No knife steel has it all. Ultimately, the primary task dictates the steel. If I am slashing and chopping in the woods, I prefer 8670 05 5160. In the kitchen high hardness steels work better and in corrosive areas like salt water LC200N.

[@gaberoo9099]

Can't wait to see what you come up with 14C28N.

[@-trmxzer0-235]

Looking at the edge retention chart it just proves to me how impressive S30V can be with a higher Rockwell. Crazy how it continues to get overshadowed by tons of steels that really shouldn't, It's been proven time and time again its not chippy (despite claims by people using burned factory edges) it's pretty tough decently stainless and it holds an edge significantly longer than the steels that were supposed to replace it (S35VN & S45VN) and its much more affordable. So why not just treat it better?

[@Creelyblades]

I think the limitations of S 30 are more in the corrosion resistance and toughness areas, but it does have better edge retention then many give it credit for.

[@BuffaloNickel9]

I agree wholeheartedly with the original poster. The main quality I'm looking for is Edge retention, and not to be complete crap in the other two categories of the three-legged stool I just need Edge retention with okay corrosion and toughness. s30v I've always loved and now I know why after looking at these charts. s60v also looks mighty fine for what I'm after. after recently purchasing and inkosi in s45vn I'm kind of disappointed in the Edge retention aspect after looking at these charts. Haven't been disappointed with its Edge retention in person I'm just referring to what I saw on these charts... If they could just get me a s30v with a high Rockwell I'd be more than happy. even in s60v i would be happy.. others seem to be more worried about corrosion resistance and toughness than me..I don't chop with my blades that's for sure and I don't stick them in lemon juice saltwater or get them wet ...whatever I use them for, they are wiped pretty much immediately after..

[@jesseryan4053]

I have personally had much better experiences with s45vn than s30v. My s30v blades are older spyderco’s (at least 10 years) so maybe their heat treat is better now, I don’t know. And I have had very good luck with a Sebenza 21 in s35vn, but that had completely different geometry so not really an apples to apples comparison. I’m very curious to try Maxamet, and thinking of getting a para3 with that steel. It seems like it’s biggest downfall is lack of corrosion resistance but I don’t really care about that. You guys have any experience with maxamet?

[@andyjonathan2486]

@@jesseryan4053 Having used maxamet in the manix2 LW, and PM2 in s30v, they are apples and oranges. The biggest standout for maxamet was the seemingly endless edge retention, but would take an entire afternoon to grind a secondary bevel on and finish at 12k grit. It’s a Ferrari of a blade steel and a very specific tool that I keep a thin coat of olive oil on it at all times. Also maxamet is terrible as a food prep kitchen blade, and terrible salt water fishing knife. This is where I’d take S30V hands down over maxamet for everyday usages.

[@jesseryan4053]

@@andyjonathan2486 you’re going to burnish and fatigue the edge. Not to mention with stuff like maxamet, your stones will almost never be flat and always dished out, making it further difficult to get a good edge. Get a DMT stone. I use literally just the 1200 side of a dmt double sided plate and then a few home made strops with diamond compound, and I can whittle hair after sharpening for 3 minutes.

[@MFD00MTR33]

As a fan of Vanax(any nitrogen steel really, just need to get some Vancron to complete my collection), Aeb-l, 4V, Cruwear and Elmax MagnaCut sounds like a steel I would enjoy quite a lot. It would need a proper heat treat and ground in the 5 to 10 thou range and I'd be all over it.

[@knifevideochannel4657]

We'll see how it actually plays out INDEPENDENTLY from Larrins own testing and data! When respected people in the community post their opinions/testing that aren't commercially connected (Designer, Knife Companies, Etc) to the product, We'll know if it lives up to the hype. Thanks for video

[@c62west]

Thank you for the great information. I look forward to my 1st magnacut knife.

[@dimmacommunication]

Very nice video, very well done. The schemes were easy to read 👍

[@kevinmc1111]

Thanks, Gary. Exciting stuff. Unless, I missed it in the video, Larrin should be given credit for the charts and other images.

[@Creelyblades]

in the first seconds of the video, Larrin is credited

[@Uberragen21]

I can't wait to get my hands on a knife made with Magnacut. I bet the prices will be pretty high for the foreseeable future.

[@bobhabsolute4995]

I dream of an Hudson Bay knife in Magna Cut. I totally agree with you about AEBL, it is a great steel but, unfortunately, not very available. I hope Magna Cut will be easily available and reach is full commercial potential.

[@Creelyblades]

AEBL is not too hard to get, but not many production companies use it. Magna Cut will be a little hard to get until late summer. I got a sheet of the first small smelt, the second smelt will be available around later in the summer. The Hudson Bay pattern is cool, but that would be a big (expensive) piece of steel

[@michaels3429]

Still lovin my mako. And I still want solid orange scales, I'd take solid yellow ( far second). If I can contact you about it let me know.

[@firstjohn3123]

The CATRA chart shows just how good S30V CAN be with a good heat treat. It took years for makers to learn how to do it right. Gets a bit brittle over 61Rc...(IMO) If Magnacut works as good as (or better) than CPM Cruwear, there will be a lot of very happy people.

[@terrybodenhorn3508]

Excellent video, great and very useful charts. Thank you.

[@ryewaldman2214]

Awesome, would you take an order for a mako in magnacut??

[@Creelyblades]

soon

[@MFD00MTR33]

I'd love to try it out. From everything I've seen it sounds like my dream steel.

[@dimmacommunication]

@@Creelyblades Wich stainless steels would you suggest for kitchen knives ? considering everybody thinks about japanese steels when thinking about them ,would like to know about the american side

[@slywolfe]

@@dimmacommunication lc200n I think ideal

[@kevinfitz3721]

Been looking forward to this

[@gregbellach8239]

thanks , good video

[@uckBayNguyen]

Technically informative.

[@HliasAvramidis]

the question is, when will we get it here in Greece? which is hard to find American steels. and at what price per kilo?

[@palerider7171]

All this is great but I haven’t heard anyone address the other 3 legs: Availability, Affordability and Consistency. Any information of the 1st 2, noting there hasn’t been enough time to collect data on the last one yet?

[@Creelyblades]

That’s sort of a different conversation, but it it is a CPM steel and there is a pretty established track record on those 3 matters.

[@christianbureau6732]

Great video

[@daw162]

toughness and shallower angles only work if the steel has the potential for high hardness and still retaining appropriate toughness. If you have something super tough that has OK toughness at "high hardness", but 60 is high hardness for it, it'll suck wind compared to something that holds together well at 64 hardness.

[@dimmacommunication]

Do you have a toughness table for other steels like for axes , billhook etc ?

[@Creelyblades]

Not specific to Axes, but axes high quality axes usually use something along the lines of 5160. Low alloy high carbon steels run in the 40s hrc.

[@dimmacommunication]

Where could I find the chart at 7:00 ?

[@Creelyblades]

Hey Andrea, I don’t really give that chart out it’s just a reference I use as a teaching tool and it’s made up of other peoples information by and large that I curate

[@BennyCFD]

You know at the end of the day 1095 will satisfy over 90% of your cuttings tasks like cutting a piece of rope, a piece of leather, cardboard, Stuff like this. For the price you could get a Tungsten Carbide blade. Stays sharp for almost ever. The only down side it's hard to sharpen

[@Creelyblades]

There is no doubt 1095 is a perfectly serviceable steel, and would probably work for almost 100% of your actual cutting needs. When a steel like Magnacut (and many others) comes along however, it’ll hold an edge almost thrice as long, it’s a tougher, more durable steel than 1095, and if you happen to work in an environment where it’s wet or corrosion is an issue having a steel that is very stainless is very helpful. In the end, it’s a value judgment, but newer steals are substantially better performers than 1095. It’s kind of like saying a 1991 Honda Civic is perfectly functional to get me back-and-forth to work each day, but a 2022 Acura would be a lot nicer, but a lot more expensive.

[@tariqkamil7853]

Thank u

[@timrodriguez1]

🤠👍

[@Ecreely_Real]

IM here too

[@mityjoeyoung8855]

Im hearing and seeing some concerns with Magna cut. Very bad edge retention and blades snapping.

[@mityjoeyoung8855]

I think it's a gimic just to sell more knives. 14c, aeb-L, elmax, 20cv is more than enough. I think I'm onto these knife makers. They need to sell knives. What better way than to come up with a new steel. No need for it. It's like a pitch to sell more steel to sell more knives. I seen a Magna cut blade snap and I've heard of some Magna cut owners having to sharpen their knives 3 times per day. It looks like this steel might not be that good.

[@Creelyblades]

Honestly, this is a pretty cynical view of a group of folks who are passionate about their craft. So you think knife makers design and manufacture new steels? Interesting. Magnacut has good edge holding, better than 14c or Aebl, not as good as 20cv. As for someone sharpening 3 time a day, that same person would be sharpening AEBL 7 times a day and 20cv 2 times a day. Most knife makers I know stick to a couple alloys. I am actually a little different than many as I intentionally use many different steels.

[@mityjoeyoung8855]

@@Creelyblades it's just the business. That's the way business and marketing works. It's a steel pretty much the same as many others in its class .

[@mityjoeyoung8855]

It's just business Gary

[@mityjoeyoung8855]

@@Creelyblades for what the knives we carry are used for 14c is just fine.

[@Creelyblades]

@@mityjoeyoung8855 14c28n is a very good steel, basically it’s an upgraded AEB-L (13c26). To say that steels are basically perform all the same is objectively false. There are empirical measurements of the steels performance in different areas. For instance compared to 14 C 28N, Magnacut has substantially better edge retaining properties, similar toughness, and superior corrosion resistance. It is without question a better performing steel, it is not the same thing. One might argue that the differences are overblown, and for many use cases that may well be true. As a for instance I make blades in a steel called Rex 121, it will hold an edge perhaps 7 times longer than 14 C 28N, but it has low toughness and virtually no corrosion resistance. I am one of only a handful of knife makers that regularly make knives in it, but in your mind I suppose it’s the same as 14C28n. I also don’t think it’s as simple as one steel is better than another steel, different steels have different strengths and weaknesses and it’s about the appropriate steel for the appropriate job. To suggest that knife makers are selling knives in premium steels at premium prices when they perform no better than cheap steels is to suggest that they are diss honest for the sake of profit. I’m not sure you realize how offensive that sounds. And by the way I did notice that you changed your original comment where you suggested it was knife makers producing these steels for the sake of profit.

[@daniusb123456]

Rad

[@dieselphiend]

Just bought a 23" billet of this stuff. Mostly because it's the only way I can afford it.

[@notme3686]

People use edge retention interchangeablely with wear resistance making the discussion very hard. Edge retention is a combination of several factors. Wear resistance is a stand alone factor. Edge retention is the same as apex stability. Toughness, wear resistance, geometry, and stain resistance all factor in "edge retention" but most people are stupid and say wear resistance alone means edge retention

[@Creelyblades]

We can get into an existential conversation about how higher toughness will allow for better geometry which will result in higher real world edge retention. The whole point of a CATRA test is to show how the abrasion resistance of the steel will directly affect edge retention. To suggest that abrasion resistance is some sort of term that is completely divorced from edge retention would be to misleading. I would go out on a limb and say abrasion resistance in most cases is the top predictor of the edge retention potential of a steel. I feel like this conversation has a lot to do with nitpicking terminology. The point of my video is to try to communicate the benefits of new steel technology.

[@notme3686]

@@Creelyblades There's a reason why a guy like larrin Thomas came up with a steel like magnacut. It tries to maximize all of the characteristics that lead to high edge retention. CATRA gives only one insight into edge retention and that's wear resistance. It doesn't factor in any other characteristics that knives need to retain an edge.

[@Creelyblades]

@@notme3686 Larrin did not design the steel to be ultimate edge retention. Rex 121 has triple the edge retention. There is a distinction between edge retention and wear resistance, but they are highly related matters and to nitpick and go on about it is just unproductive.

[@notme3686]

@@Creelyblades And you just proved my original point. Rex 121 has higher wear resistance than 15V, but 15V has higher edge retention. Stop using these phrases incorrectly. It makes having a discussion hard when someone keeps using a term incorrectly. If I kept saying toughness instead of wear resistance you'd probably try to correct me, too.

[@notme3686]

@@Creelyblades Oh, and yeah, he did try to create the steel with the best edge retention, including stain resistance

[@notme3686]

What does edge holding mean and how can it be quantified? It's a nonsense term if you say I want to compare toughness with edge holding. Wtf.

[@Creelyblades]

Edge holding as it relates the number of cuts in a CATRA test. It’s a broadly acccepted scientific test to quantify edge holding, And a notch C test to determine toughness. Both quantifiable and repeatable tests, the results were mathematically adjusted to fit into this graph (and that is annotated on the graph). Not really sure what your issue is, I suspect a steel you love did not perform as well as you had hoped.

[@notme3686]

@@Creelyblades Edge holding as it relates to CATRA would mean nothing more than wear resistance/geometry and anyone that is familiar with steels should know that. Toughness in regards to edge retention currently has no place in CATRA testing.

[@BennyCFD]

I know what you mean.....How's this for edge retention. kzbin.info/www/bejne/r4G8m4WKf9Kdisk&ab_channel=Cedric%26AdaGearandOutdoors

[@Creelyblades]

@@notme3686 I mention two tests. You only seem to address one because you’re probably not familiar with the other. Read my reply a little more closely.

[@mlwarrior]

Who else stopped watching immediately after he said "I have some on the way". You're a knife maker. Nobody cares unless you have made a knife with it.

[@Creelyblades]

Probably very few people, because the video was made right after the steel was announced and made available. At this point I’ve made a few hundred blades in magnacut and the information in this video still holds true.

[@mlwarrior]

@@Creelyblades @Gary Creely I appreciate that, and that you've brought the information to your audience. But when a knife maker says "How does it compare to XYZ..", we click on the video to see a hands on comparison. Perhaps I am biased because I've already seen all this information on knofesteelnerd's blog.