Creating a Character Rig - Part 22: Basic Twist Arm (Advanced)

[@HiddenForbidden2]

Man, am I Glad I rewatched this part. I had not noticed until now that by not following the new IK Handle Guidelines in the description of this video, that the shoulders of the rig would snap 180 degrees when rotated anywhere from 90 degrees and beyond.

[@NicholasTan092]

GAWD! Sometimes your tutorials make me tear my hair out, "do this twist your arm! Now repeat the same thing for the forearm" After the rig is done "Oh by the way look we reused the previous joint but we didn't tell you until you skinned everything!"

[@jakanddaxterps5302]

Jajajajaj me exacto the same men!

[@continuouscurve]

Hi, At 04:25 you state the importance of only moving the pivot point in the x axis. How is this possible on a Mac please? I hold down 'D' to move the pivot point usually, but I don't see a way to make it do this in object space, so that I only move it along the joint's x axis. Thanks for any help.

[@bradymacaraig6638]

Hello! I am really learning a lot from your series, but I am encountering an on going issue; the 180 degree flip. Rotating the wrist in the Y past 90 degrees causes the twist joints to flip 180 degrees. I have tried every combination of the spline handle's up axis and changed the up vectors respectively, but nothing seems to mitigate this issue. If your wondering, the arm is set up on a perfect plane and has 0 rotational value on all joints. The orientation also matches that of the video which has me stumped as to why the twist does not behave. Please help... and thank you for your comprehensive series.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

I'm assuming you tried the suggestion at 11:55 and 12:22? At the very least, different combinations of up axis and up vectors should cause flipping to occur at different rotations - the key is to find the one that is the least impactful for common posing. If you're getting the same flipping no matter what up vectors you're choosing then it sounds like something is structurally wrong, or something else is going on.

[@Masa-oq1wt]

10:11 I don't understand well to set the local rotation axis. Part 3's comments said that as long as the movement works correctly, it is not really important. Nevertheless, could you let me know if there are any criteria and reasons to specify directions? Thank you always for the good video.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Setting the LRAs determines which direction (positive / negative) and axis (x, y, z) will rotate the object in specific directions. Typically for control objects, you want this to be consistent between all your controls (so for example, rotating in X will rotate things like the head, hands, feet, hip, etc all in the same way). For the underlying features (like this twist arm) it's less important since users will never directly interact with them.

[@Masa-oq1wt]

@@Autodesk_Maya That's what happened! Thank you for your detailed explanation. Thank you so much!!!!

[@The7UPBuddy]

Hi, I'm coming back after listening through part 27 where we finish the arm rig to see if my question would be answered but I'm still confused about the correction you noted at 12:22 of this part; I did the parent constraint instead of point with the leftUpperArm_result_JNT and the leftArm_start_bind_JNT and gave it's handle a positive Y with both the up vectors 010. Everything works well, but when I rotate the leftUpperArm_FK_CTRL, the twisting in the upper arm section doesn't twist, which makes sense because the rotations also being constrained but what would we do for the upper arm segmentation to twist as it does if I do the point constraint instead with positive Z and both up vectors 001? I didn't find any other annotations regarding this note. My question would then be, why would we chose the parent constrain if we lose the ''twistability'' of the upper arm? Or is this note intended *only* to those experiencing problematic joint flipping? I'm used to doing translation based clavicles/shoulders with point constrains and I'm intrigued about the parent constrain alternative.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Actually if you rotate the upper arm control the arm section should twist, even with the altered settings. The note is just suggesting new values for the existing leftUpperArm_HDL. As you stated, it was really only meant to help people who are experiencing joint flipping (a common problem that's difficult to completely get rid of due to the under-the-hood mathematics involved).

[@The7UPBuddy]

Ok thank you, I'll stay with the point constrain an eventually look into it deeper to find out if I did something wrong with the parent constrain.

[@eliog5220]

Hi, The course is missing to do the ik fk arm, there is a gap between course 21 and 22, please upload the course to do the ik fk arm

[@canijomadrid]

I think there's no a chapter in between You have to built the arm basing on the leg concepts

[@ChyrosNX7]

Regarding annotation @12:22, is it possible that we can find one good UpAxis/UpVector value that can accommodate all realistic arm poses without having to change them it back and forth for different poses? One weird flipped joint rotation I had was when I tried to do an salute position via full arm FK. I was able to fix by following the annotation. But I'm hoping it won't flip on other realistic arm poses.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Unfortunately it's heavily dependent on the arm motions you plan to use. The two mentioned in this video should cover the majority of them, but again, because of the underlying math involved, there's unfortunately no "one size fits all" solution.

[@DoraKage]

Hi ~ Even with the solution proposed in the annotation - there are still flipping issues that occur. Seems like changing up the twist control axes and up vectors isn't an end all solution. Does this mean that animators just need to avoid certain rotational angles in order to avoid these pitfalls? and the we as riggers just need to pick the solution where it a flip is least likely to occur?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Joint flipping is unfortunately not 100% solvable (it's just how the math works under the hood in 3D development). As you said, you really just want to set it up to avoid the situation as much as possible.

[@AL985]

for the correction that updates the values, do i redo the steps at 8:10 but for the result joints instead? or what's good?

[@heathermcd484]

I've having a problem with the right arm. The geo doesn't rotate quite properly after I've done the whole advanced twist control thing. The geo that rotates the funniest is the last segment geo on the upper arm segment joint. It rotates far more than the rest of them, but the rest do rotate quite a bit themselves. I've compared mine to your full mirrored rig and I can't see what I'm doing wrong. The rotation axes is positive Z when rotating the arm down. I know that on the right side, instead of positive Z, it's negative Z in the advanced twist controls. I even tried the suggestion at 12:22. In both negative and positive Y. So I'm a little confused.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Did you try a combination of Up Axis: Positive Y, and Up Vectors (0, -1, 0) for the right side?

[@heathermcd484]

Maya Learning Channel Yeah. In both Objection Rotation Up (Start/End) and Objection Rotation Up (just trying any way to see if it'd work), and it throws the arm geo backwards. I've tried both positive Z and Y and negative Z and Y. Whenever I click the handle, this appears: //Warning: Some items cannot be rotated in the 3D view. Does that help in anyway? Thanks for your time.

[@heathermcd484]

Maya Learning Channel Oh. One more question, and I just thought of it: Would it work if I duplicated special in the input graph for just the segmented arm and did everything else from scratch? I know from the mirroring vid, it said it wouldn't work for everything, especially the IK stuff if my memory is correct. But what about just for the segmented arm? Would that create a weird problem?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yes, you can duplicate special the segmented arm since you don't need to manage the positive/negative rotations directly.

[@dranoshots]

to anyone having trouble with the right arm advanced twist settings : since the axes are inverted, you need to make sure everything is in negative. Forward Axis: Negative X Up Axis: Negative Y Up Vector: 0,-1,0 Up Vector 2:0,-1,0 (in maya 2018)

[@DanielaMaria1998]

Thank you so much! What a life saver

[@Merkygloom]

Thanks!

[@lynchsd3]

When you demonstrated how the segmented arm would bend with multiple control vertices it made me wonder, do you have any intentions of showing how to create a more surreal ribbon or noodle-like arm rig? I'm just curious because I can see a lot of scenarios where that could be useful.

[@shivpip]

kindly have a look at my problem tinypic.com/view.php?pic=xencia&s=8 i have followed the instructions at 12:22 still things are not working as they are suppose to.......as i twist the shoulder control hands start working weird.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Someone else actually asked for this type of "bendy" arm as well. We may consider looking into this as an addendum for later.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Files used: areadownloads.autodesk.com/wdm/maya/bendyupperarm.mb

[@kathydiamond6064]

@@Autodesk_Maya will this file be available again?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Kathy Li I pinged the people in charge of managing the server. I’ll let you know when it becomes available again.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Sorry I forgot to mention, but the server was fixed a couple of days ago!

[@PatenaudePhilippe]

Hello guys, I have a question regarding the UpperArm twistting. You see when I am done with the tutorial everything works perfectly but when you rotate the leftUpperArm_FK_CTRL the arm just rotate normally the twists segment are just going for the ride with no offset. To fix this you need to select the leftArm_start_bind_JNT and rotate it on the X Axis so the twistty segments rotate with an offset like its supposed to. I was wondering is they're a way to fix this and more importantly why is it doing this? Thank you so much

[@ionutstef2120]

Hi! How should the options be set for the Right Arm?.. I've tried with NegativeZ and -1. If I rotate the Mid Bind Joint, the UpperArm twists correctly, but if I rotate the Start_bind_JNT, first two segments rotates correctly, and the last 2, in the oposite direction. Same with End_bind_JNT and Mid_bind_JNT for the ForeArm...

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Check out the scene file included with Part 32 to see what values we went with.

[@ionutstef2120]

Thank you! I've checked it and used the same values. The difference is that in my Joints hierarchy, rightUpperArm_seg1_JNT and rightUpperArm_seg5_JNT have the Joint Orient Values 0 - 0 - 0 and 0 - 0 - 0. These joints in the scene file included, the values are 0 - 0 - 180 and 180 - 0 - 0... I think this might be the problem, I'll try setting the values to those values.. I hope it is okay. This was the reason! Thank you!

[@JoshuaMock231]

I was having the same issue as many others with the right arm twisting in the wrong direction. Some of the responses were a little confusing or vague, so I thought it would be helpful to let everyone know what I did to solve it. After I mirrored the segmented arm joint chains, I turned on their LRA visibility and noticed it was opposite from the Emma rig because of it being mirrored. With the right UpperArm and ForeArm chains selected, I opened the Skeleton > Orient Joint option menu and set the Primary Axis to X, Secondary Axis to Y, and Secondary Axis World Orientation to -Y. This sent the joint's X axis down the length of the bone, with the Z axis pointing forward, and Y axis pointing down. After creating the twist controls as shown in the video, I was able to get proper rotations which matched what the left arm was doing. I hope this helps.

[@deepakkumar-zy6qu]

Sir, i have made a twist rig with strech for hand which is not tottaly straight .After making that when i skinned it with the geometry the geometry is streching in weird way .Why is that happening?Please help.thank u.

[@jucamovi1992]

Hi, I'm following this tutorial but I'm working with a different character. So, I have to do the arm by watching the part 15 to 18 again?

[@adirectorroth]

I know it's been a while that the correction's been up, but the "closest Z" solution didn't seem to work for me. The problem seems to negate (at the upperArm) when I switch the UpAxis to ClosestY (thereby eliminating any sudden flipping issues at the extremes) and positive Y to the objects' UpVector. Seems to work just as well, but due to my lack of knowledge on the math behind it, I cannot foresee the problems that might occur later in the production! I would be grateful if you could enlighten me on the subject. Thank you!

[@shmagiggywokka]

Hiya, tutorial is quite in depth, that's for sure. However I'm having some problems post-mirror. I cannot get the rightForeArm to twist properly; it is always twisted a little directly after enabling twist controls in the HDL's attributes, unlike the left which does not change. I have tried many things that I thought would fix the problem, including using negative Z at 0,0,-1 for both Up vectors and swapping around the world up objects. For now I've manually rotated the rightARM_end_bind_JNT into the right position and it seems to work, not sure if the rig will break later. It's driving me insane. Any advice?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+shmagiggywokka Are you sure all the LRAs are properly lined upon the right arm and its segmented joints? They may have come out of alignment at some point.

[@Doc_Animator_N]

I found a problem in my right arm rig. For some odd reason, when I twist the arm rig, from the mid_bind_JNT, the rightArm_end_bind_JNT was rotating along with it. I erased the parentConstraint and redid it with the rightHand_result_JNT, to make sure I got it right, but the error still occurred. Now I think I might've done something wrong with the rightForeArm_CRV or the rightForeArm_HDL.

[@morin6661]

Hi, Thanks again for tutorials. I have a question. My bones have y as forward axis and z as up axis. I am choosing y as forward axis and --ve z as up axis . I am also filling up vector fields with -1. I am not getting correct twist with those values. Are these right settings for my setup?

[@MartenZander]

The character I am rigging is modeled in an A-pose. When creating Joints and doing the joint orient, my local rotation axes doesn't seem to be as intuitiv as the ones from a T-Pose. Will this cause any trouble down the line? Am I well advised if I set up my rig in a T-Pose and bind the character later on from a bind pose? Also, since my character is mostly hard surface I don't have the requirement to make my arms twist. Can I skip this part without having any problems later on? Thanks in Advance.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

I generally recommend T-Pose over A-Pose, but it's not "wrong" to do it in A-Pose. As you said, I just find everything more intuitive that way. And no, the arm twist is not a requirement (you can rig the arms just like the legs if you prefer).

[@MartenZander]

@@Autodesk_Maya Thank you very much for your reply! I continued working on my rig with local rotation axes calculated from my A-Pose. This lead to very strange rotations and the pole vector constraitn as well as the elbow snapping functionality were not working as expected. I messed around for a pretty long time now and the best method I found so far to fix that is: 1.) Create the arm's bone chain on a horizontal line 2.) Calculate proper local rotation axes 3.) Use the first joint's local rotation to rotate the whole arm into a-pose and than freeze its transformations. This way I prevent good local rotation axes and still match my required pose. For further adjustments on the joint placing, I only rotated the joints rather than moving them in pivot mode, because that would break the local rotation axes I calculated earlier. I am too unexperienced in rigging and maya at all to sell this as a perfect solution, but it worked out for me, so maybe it will be helpful for others running into the same issue.

[@lizoozil]

My English is not good, please forgive me! Your teaching helped me learn a lot! Thank you so much! But I have a question, at the time 3:55. Why the need to separate multiple arm joints. But the joints of the leg is not?Only a single? thanks~

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The leg is much less likely to twist this way. It wouldn't be wrong to follow this workflow for the leg as well, but it'd be unlikely that you'd use it very often.

[@lizoozil]

Maya Learning Channel Thank your answer! I still have some questions! I do not understand! Why the place needs more twisted joints, because it easily "Paint Skin Weight"? What the benefits of multi-joint and two joints?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Character rigging always falls to real life human anatomy. In real life, the shoulder joint is different from the hip joint in its ability to rotate. Try rotating just your forearm, then your upper arm - you'll find you can do so quite independently. However, it's much more difficult to do this with your leg because of the way the real life joints are arranged (the hip has limited range of motion, the knee bone gets in the way). This is the reason we don't need so many points of articulation in the leg.

[@lizoozil]

Pls forgive my fool! I have a question, If I have completed all Rigging step. And then start "bind skin",So I bind skin to arm "result joint" chain or "Segmented joint" chain ?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Segmented chain since you want to preserve the twist.

[@alanhsu4087]

Hi @Maya Learning Channel ! I have some questions about this part. What is the reason for making the segment Joints instead of using Insert Joints function on the Result Joints? It looks like the segment joints are the Result Joints for the twist job. And another question, I realized that while the foreArm and Hand Joints twist like expected, the upperArm Joint doesn't twist but rather rotate as if the advanced twisting control isn't turn on unless I parent constraint the foreArm Joint. Is it because the Spline Curve only have 2 Splines? but if so then how does the foreArm Joint twist as expected without the parent constraint? I really like the tutorials, and I just have some parts I don't understand. Thank you!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The reason we create the segment joints is that we want the result arm to drive the twist on them, and also because the FK and IK arms need to be exact copies of the driver. If we didn't do it this way, our FK and IK arms would have to have segments on them too, which causes a performance hit as well as introducing some possible variability that we'd prefer to avoid. For the second question, I'm not sure I understand entirely, but have you tried comparing your rig to the one included in the description? the upper arm should twist just like the forearm.

[@alanhsu4087]

Hi @@Autodesk_Maya Thanks for the reply ! So I guess the result arm is kind of like a in-between driver for FK / IK to the segments arm since is better to have the driver be the exact copy. And about the second question, my Left Arm start bind joint wasn't twisting like the mid bind or end bind joint unless I parent constrained and point constrained them to the result joint first. However, I just solve the problem because I did not unparent the mid and end bind joints from the start bind joint, therefore rotating the start bind joint rotates the mid bind joint. Again thanks for the reply ! I really like this channel and will continue to learn the rest of the videos !

[@mojangindustry4087]

maya learning channel, I am doing the right arm, and rebuilding it from scratch instead of mirroring. When I orient the joints, do I do it like: z y y or......

[@Diamondjet96]

Mojang Industry I know it’s been two years, but since I haven’t seen an answer yet. I have it as: X Y Y When you orient the joints make sure that the y is point down and z is pointing back.

[@AL985]

Maya Learning Channel what are the leftUpperArm_result_JNT options in the orient join options?

[@IndikaRatnayake]

Hi, I am trying to setup the twist on my right arm using mirrored joints from the left. I tried several setting for the spline handle up axis and up vector but couldn't find a solution. Could you please help me. Thank you.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Indika Ratnayake Did you try comparing your file to the finished scene file provided in part 32? Specifically, look at how your right-arm joint LRA's and Advanced Twist Control settings compares to it.

[@IndikaRatnayake]

+Maya Learning Channel Thank you for replying. My x axis on the segment joints were going in the opposite direction since I was using mirrored joints. After re orienting the segment joints and setting up the twist controls again it worked. Thanks again.

[@TheAnimationHipster]

hiya, so I noticed this around the time that I parent constrained the bind joints. It appears my result skeleton is going through abnormal rotations when rotating the FK Skeleton. The IK/FK Blend attribute has been set to 0 exactly for FK Mode, and all fk joints have been put into the blenders properly. However, when I rotate the fk shoulder, hand, forearm, etc, on more than one axis it causes the result skeleton to rotate in an arc around the fk skeleton, then once it reaches the FK Skeleton, it overshoots and proceeds to continue. I went to a previous file and noticed that this issue was present from when I connected them through the node editor and blend colors nodes. Is there an alternative origin to this issue?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

A couple of things to check: 1.) Do the FK, IK, and result arms have the exact same Local Rotation Axes? 2.) Does Maya display any warnings about "cyclical dependencies" when you perform those rotations? The warnings would appear at the bottom of the application or in the Script Editor.

[@TheAnimationHipster]

@@Autodesk_Maya They are matching in their rotation axes, but it's saying nothing about cyclical dependencies. I may just re-start the arms since that seems like it might be the preferable option.

[@MauriceSeow]

Hi Maya Learning CHannel, managed to get the twist working. But the Forearm's Geos wont follow the joints when rotating in Y and Z axis, only follows in X which is the twist direction. What might be the mistake i made? I have already parented the mesh to the respective segment joints. Thanks

[@Autodesk_Maya]

I'd check that the segment joints are properly constrained to the bind joints, and the bind joints constrained to the result arm.

[@MrAkumaRex]

Hey I was already at the skinning stage but after spending a long time trying to fight a candy wrapping effect on the left elbow that occurred as soon as I rotated the forearm control to 90 or greater on the Y-Axis, I went back to my proxy rig to search for the cause and noticed that on hitting the 90 degrees on the y axis on the forearm the upperarm seg4 joint was getting a rotate X value of 180. Just this joint. This did not happen on the right arm however. What could cause this and is there a way to fix this without rebuilding the entire arm?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

I'd double check the Advanced Twist Control values on that arm. Also check out the updated Advanced Twist values in the video description.

[@stuff3862]

Should we rotate the final forearm twist joint to match the rotation angle of the wrist/hand joint?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Stuff3 At a neutral position they should already match (0,0,0).

[@andrewarkwright622]

Having trouble with the joint orientation, the video says it's set to y in the secondary axis world orientation but shows the y to be pointing down and the only way i can get my joints to do that is by setting the secondary axis world orientation to z... What is the primary axis, secondary axis and secondary axis world orientation meant to be set at, please?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Actually check out the note in the video description for updated values. You can ignore what's in the video.

[@PartigradeCannon]

Do you think it would be a big deal if I made a set of twists, similar to the default twists, parented under the upper arm and forearm, that use the rotation/translation of the forearm and hand, instead of the advanced twist controls? The advanced twist controls tend to suffer from a lot of wonky behaviour that a manual arm twist would likely avoid.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Not a big deal at all, but would those work automatically when the arm is turned or would you have to pose them manually? The latter would be really difficult to work with.

[@PartigradeCannon]

Basically, have a multiplyDivide node set to 0.25 of the relevant rotate and plug them into the middle 3/last 4 arm segs joints rotate (since they are parented, they will move their children the appropriate amount)

[@Autodesk_Maya]

That can certainly work. It might work a bit slower with all the extra math nodes, but functionally should be fine.

[@PartigradeCannon]

Technically, you only need one math node, since we're using a joint chain (so seg2 will move 0.25, seg3 will move 0.25 in addition to the 0.25 set by seg1 for a total of 0.5, seg3 will move 0.25 in addition to the 0.5 of segs 1 and 2 for a total of 0.75). If you want to be extra fancy, you can also plug in an option to limit the degree of the arm twists.

[@PartigradeCannon]

On the one hand, the upper arm will twist improperly when the elbow is moved up and down, moving in its entirety instead of just the twist bones. On the other, I had that problem already, so it's not really any different than my previous setup

[@hains92]

And, as i understand the up vector of twist control is always point behind the character right? Any rule for this? And in case we rig some kind of quadrupped creatures, their up vectors still point out?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yes, that's right.

[@hains92]

Maya Learning Channel thank you

[@proxyproxy3951]

Working on the right arm. The arm twist works but when rotating along the y and z axis in FK, the segmented mesh doesn't follow. I feel like I've missed or stuffed something.

[@proxyproxy3951]

I was getting double transforms with the segmented jnts. I ended up redoing them and it now follows.

[@Alice444V]

If we parented the bind joints to the main result joints, and then skinned the hand to the results joints, the hand is still not skinned to the segmented joints that twist with the Ik...I don't get how it worked with you there, how do the hand pieces rotate while they're not attached to the segmented joints?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Are you talking about the hand or the arm? You skin the arm to the segment joints, whereas you skin everything else to the result joints (arms are a special case).

[@Alice444V]

sorry the arm*. what I actually meant was how did you connect the segmented joints to the FK arm joints movements, when I rotated the FK arm the segmented joints didn't follow along even though I parented the bind joints to the result joints. However when I reopened the saved file I was surprised it worked properly. Maybe it needed a refresh. Thanks for your feedback*

[@DoraKage]

hey, I've always looked at this specific tutorial series as sort of my bible benchmark for rigging, so i come back here for refreshing my studies every now and then, But I just checked the output file of ~ lesson 22 (and 32) When you go to FK mode and rotate the forearm in Y past 90 degrees, the last two segments on the bicep chain flip. why is this? (im guessing its something to do with the twist controls of the ik handle?)

[@DoraKage]

I found a sort of workaround in one of my old notes on this topic - as an alternative to turning on the advanced twist controls in the IKH's attributes, (in the node editor)you can link the appropriate rotation axis to the roll input, and do the same for the twist, except that you will need to subtract the end joint to the start joints rotation

[@Autodesk_Maya]

@@DoraKage Did you try the corrected Advanced Twist values in the video description?

[@thanoszag6563]

Hi, very nice tutorials! I have a question. For the forearm, we use xzy rotate order and for the hand zyx. But If for the hand, the least used move is at the y-axis, shouldn't be better to have a yzx rotate order? I just try to figure out why you choose zyx. i would appriciate if you could explain so to understand better how to decide about the rotate order. Thank you.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Honestly, it just depends how you expect your character to move. Always choose the rotate order you feel is most appropriate.

[@TheWatermelon93]

Hi, I'm just curious about A-poses. I've read the other comments on here about bending the joints and then resetting them ones the geo is parented, but I've set up my joints according to the A-pose shape. I ran into some issues with the twist settings for the forearm and managed to work around it by changing the Up Vector values. Im just wondering if setting things up this way is going to lead to issues further through the tutorial? I'd love to find out while I havent done too much work on the arms. Thanks! =)

[@Autodesk_Maya]

It won't cause any problems. The whole point of the twist values is to get the arms twisting just right for your particular rig.

[@MegaJdavis15]

To Maya Learning: I downloaded this rig to figure out what rotate axis to use for my own character rig. The upper arm is xyz, the forearm is xyz, and the hand FK controller is zyx correct? However when I applied the rotate axis to my own character the forearm and rotate the x,y,z axis all at once the left forearm segment joint arm moves/rotates away from the result arm joints. What do I do to solve this?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Odd, I just downloaded the file and see them as XYZ, XZY, ZYX. I'm also seeing consistent rotations when rotating all three controls simultaneously.

[@temitopefalade2054]

Please sir, I thoroughly followed all your steps, and I was doing the same exact steps for both my character's right arm and left arm at the same time. But when I got to the enabling of the left arm twist, using the Positive z as my up vector 1 and 2, the left arm twist correctly just like yours. But when I got to the right arm to do the exact same thing, the right arm wasn't twisting like the left arm. Mind you, when I created the left arm joints, I used the same orientations as your example. When I wanted to create the right arm joint, I used the mirror joint command. So, I don't know whether the orientation has anything to do with the right arm not twisting like the left arm. Please sir, I need your help. Thanks for the great tutorial.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Did you mirror the joints using the settings as shown in part 32?

[@MegaJdavis15]

Using Autodesk MAYA 2015, when starting out: with the arm result Joints in the orient joint options. What are the primary axis, the secondary axis, and the secondary axis world orientation? Also is the secondary axis world orientation a negative or positive value?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

X is primary, Y is secondary, -Y is the Secondary Axis World Orientation. If you open the example file and select the joint, you can see this via the multi-colored axis that appears within the joint.

[@ikansumpit]

Hi, i'm working on the right arm twist on my own rig now. I just can't set the advanced twist control, even though I have changed the Up Axis to -Z, also the Up Vectors to -1. When I download your fully mirrored rig from lesson 32, apparently your segment_joints have different local axis than your basic Result, FK, IK joints ( my local axis are the same with these joints, mirrored from the left arm). How do you set the local axis on those segment joints?

[@ikansumpit]

Ah, got it! I thought the x axis is still facing towards the shoulder meanwhile the z is facing the front cam.. which actually the x faces towards the hand. It's just the opposite of the Result joints then, done with Orient Joint Tool.

[@Spaghetti775]

If there are problems in mirroring the twist system, is it a solution to pre-rotate the bind joints to the desired position, like with the mirrored hand group? Since we don't have to affect them directly.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

CellDevises You could do that, but later down the pipeline you'd have to make sure you skin bind in that same position as well. It's not preferable, but I don't see why it wouldn't work.

[@emummy]

Is there anything different I need to consider about the local rotation axis when rigging the rightArm? I think I'm missing something that is not scaling the arm segments in part 23 after I've connect the nodes.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Have you looked at part 32 on Mirroring? There are a number of tips there. Generally speaking, the local rotation axes of the arm joints should point in the opposite direction of those on your left arm (so positive X runs towards the shoulder rather than the hand. Try comparing yours to the finished scene file we provide in part 32 to see how they line up.

[@hodagamal6484]

i wanna ask for something , how use these segments between the main joints of arm to bend them as a cartoony arm , just add controllers for them or how ?!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Funny enough, I actually did make a proof of concept for this years ago, which you can find here: areadownloads.autodesk.com/wdm/maya/bendyupperarm.mb

[@SquircularKnights]

My character has a suit of armour on, which is divided in solid segments for the upper arm and forearm, with the elbow joint covered in a flexible material. Should I divide the elbow into two segments, or leave it as it is for the twist? Thanks

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The segmented joints are mainly setup for skinned rigs. If you have a solid plate representing each part of the arm then you can probably just have a single bone for the upper and forearm.

[@SquircularKnights]

Thanks. Skipped it. :)

[@katrellmaiden9993]

Does the process change if the arms are at a downward 45 degree angle as opposed to at a T poses' 90 degrees? My models arms point downwards and at the point where I create the segmented arms' IK handles I get a slight rotation on the joints, usually .002 or something similar.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

It won't change anything, but in general you probably don't want this to be the 0 position for your FK controls. My suggestion would be to do something similar to what you did when you straightened the foot.

[@katrellmaiden9993]

Maya Learning Channel So when it's time to bind the uncut model to the finished skeleton, would I rotate the result skeleton to fit the model's pose, bind the model, then zero the result skeleton so it lines up with all of the other joints? Or is there a video in this tutorial that goes over binding the un-altered model to the finished skeleton that I've missed? Thank you for your time

[@Autodesk_Maya]

You are correct.

[@Spaghetti775]

I'm still having issues, and I'd be really grateful for any more guidance. The main problem is that the segment joints rotate in the opposite direction to the bind joints, when the bind joints are directly manipulated. I have tried every combination of positive X and Y as the up vector, I've tried setting the bind joints' scale X to -1, I've tried grouping each bind joint to itself and setting the group scale to -1, I've tried completely reconstructing the arm with new joints, to make sure nothing has been mirrored from the other side, and it's still happening. The other problem is the way that the twist behaves - instead of reducing the rotation of one end as it travels down the chain to the other, it seems to be amplifying it - I rotate the shoulder start bind joint 30 degrees along X, and the end segment joint moves 360 (in the wrong direction). Moving the mid bind joint seems to work better - it at least spreads out the rotations towards the shoulder, but the end segment joint still rotates at least twice as much as the bind joint (in the wrong direction). This tutorial series has been a lifeline for me, and this is the one problem I can't seem to overcome. Any help you can give is greatly appreciated.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

CellDevises First off, are you rotating in Gimbal mode? Because that's going to make a big difference. Second, have you absolutely made sure that the bind joints are exact copies of their corresponding joints in the segmented arm? That is, that the LRA's are identical? Have you compared your own setup to the one provided in the download files in part 32? Not just that the joints exist in the right hierarchy / dependencies, but that they are all oriented the same way?

[@stephrobert3163]

hi, I am trying to catch my own rig up to speed with this video (ie. creating all of the IK/FK and result joint chains and their controls) I have set up the FK joint chain following parts 10, 11 and 12 again however when I moved onto the IK controls in part 13 I noticed your rig's IK arm doesn't work (or have anything in the scene) but does have a control and the IK/FK switch works for the visibility of the controls. Do I need to follow part 13 and create IK controls and the IK Handle the same way as the leg or start now on this video? Just need some clarification on what I need to do to my rig and how many more parts I need to go back to in order to continue with this video, thanks!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

That's right, you'll need to have a functional basic IK/FK arm with switch control, just like the leg (as completed in part 13). Just don't worry about the stretch controls just yet since that's handled in a later video. If you want to be really sure, download the demo file in the description to see what the starting point is.

[@stephrobert3163]

​@@Autodesk_Maya I have downloaded it and found that the IK control doesn't work or have an IK handle in your scene which is why I'm a little confused. Following part 13 the IK handle moves the arm in the wrong direction, however when watching this video you move onto IK spline handles further on so I'm unsure what is correct to do

[@Autodesk_Maya]

@@stephrobert3163 Actually sorry I just checked - you just need to have the IK arm joints (no handles yet) and set them up with an IK/FK switch.

[@MrKenken1515]

Hi, I've been following this tutorial and I haven't seen a snag till this one. After I parent constrained the result joints to its respective bind joints, problem arise. When I rotate my forearm FK control and my my hand FK control, everything works fine but whenever I rotate my upper arm FK control, the forearm won't rotate with the upper arm. It will rotate on its own axis but won't follow the rotation of the upper arm.

[@MrKenken1515]

I've rechecked everything from smooth bind skin to its proper naming and I still have no clue what went wrong.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Kendrick Mendoza Seems like a parenting issue to me or a possible double transform. I would double check to see if the lower FK joints are turning the correct way when manipulating the upper FK joint, and likewise for the result joints.

[@Sachounay]

Hi! Got a problem with arm twists. When i rotate the Arm_Mid_Bind_JNT, my twist works but in a negative rotation. Then when a rotate my Arm_Start_Bind_JNT, same thing but this time the rotation is multiplied by two. What this problem can be due to? Thanks

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Sounds like the Local Rotation Axes of the segment joints or the spline's Twist attributes aren't aligned correctly. Please double check them compared to the file we've provided.

[@Deepsingh-uv8wv]

i did same everything , but after rotating the forearm when it cross 90 degree two segment joints flipped ! why it is happening

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Check out the corrected Twist values in the description below.

[@RalphManis]

Rebuilding the Right result arm joint chain, how do you get the rightHand_end_result_JNT orientations to be like Emma's? The only way I can get it the same is by setting it to World and then rotating it 180 degrees on the X axis and then freezing the Rotate X but I'm pretty sure that freezing the joint is not a good idea.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Generally, the last joint in a chain can have any orientation and it won't matter. However, if you really want the joint to be consistent with the others, you can put another temporary joint after it in the chain, then orient them all, and delete the extra joint after.

[@RalphManis]

That's what I did but I could not get the last joint to match Emma's. So, was I right about freezing the transforms being a bad idea?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

@@RalphManis Yes, don't freeze them.

[@alexvlair9290]

Hi again, this might be a stupid question but I have to ask since no one else has asked. Did you create the twist joints primarily so that we can divide up the proxy geo and see the twist in action? Or is this also important if we're skinning a modeling directly to the joints? I understand they may help to add a twist effect, but I can't imagine why you wouldn't just edit the skin weights to achieve the same result when twisting the ik spline. Thanks!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

It's actually important (though not strictly necessary) for skinning too, just because all those extra relative skinning points give you finer control over the look of the arm twist. Yes, you could do it with skin weights, but that will automatically assume the skin turns on a somewhat even gradient across the entire upper / lower arm, which is not always the case. Again, this isn't necessary for the legs because legs don't tend to twist so much.

[@alexvlair9290]

Thank you so much for the quick reply!!

[@guyfawkesthemall]

Hi, I am looking for help here. I ve almost completed my character rigging based on this wonderfull tutorial. However, i am having trouble to complete my right arm because when i try to do a joint orient on my FK bones maya just crashes... i think it is because of the parented (-r -s) curves on it because when i delete them, joint orient works fine. Is there a way to apply a joint orient on FK joints without any maya crashes ?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+gégé lili Anytime Maya crashes it's definitely a difficult situation to debug. I'd try maybe deleting the parented curves, then orienting the joints by themselves, then re-parenting or even re-creating those curves and parenting them again.

[@hagarafenomanjato]

I've followed part 10-13 and before i begin this tuto but i have leftarm_hdl parented to leftarm_ctrl for IK control. In the beginning of this course, leftarm_ctrl haven't any parented handle, why ?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Ah sorry, that will be taken care of in the next video.

[@adamting8212]

Hello, I did everything up to this point. However I made the "positive" rotation of the arm point upwards, is there a way to change this without restarting? Or do i have to do it to alll of the joints individually??

[@Autodesk_Maya]

You should be fine, but you may need to adjust some future values to compensate relative to this video series.

[@mastro3d]

Hi. Another problem: when bent torso forward or backward and the arm is in FK mode, the upper arm _seg joints perform a rotation on their X axis. This is not goog because the shouder geometry "chokes" losing volume.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Alessandro Melis Ah, apologies! You've found a bug in the rig. Actually to fix this, you'll need to create an orient constraint between the leftUpperArm_result_JNT and the leftArm_start_bind_JNT. I've added an annotation to the video with the suggested correction.

[@mastro3d]

+Maya Learning Channel Bugs aside, in all honesty, I think that this system is not efficient and not stable, as well as making frustrating sessions of animation: When flex the forearm or lower arm to the torso or the torso bends forward, always occur unwanted rotations difficult to control. I think it would be appropriate to consider an alternative solution as quickly as possible.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Alessandro Melis So given all the complaints I've had over this bug, I ended up going back to the drawing board on this and came up with a modified solution which I believe should work. The problem has to do with the fact that the reference for the twist is on the exact same axis as the curve its twisting. To change that, try creating three locators named leftArm_start_aim_LOC, leftArm_mid_aim_LOC, and leftArm_end_aim_LOC. Move them each a few units directly above their respective bind joints, then snap their pivots to those bind joints (so that if you rotate the locator it will orbit around its bind joint). Now go back to your Advanced Twist controls and use these locators as the World Up Objects for the appropriate IK handles (you may need to tweak the Up Axis and Up Vectors to match). Finally, don't forget to parent constrain these locators to their respective bind joints. Now you should be able to avoid flipping in all but the most extreme scenarios. For reference, here's a version of the rig with the fix: areadownloads.autodesk.com/wdm/maya/htm_chr_character_rigging_arm_twist_fix.zip

[@maciejstepniewski1970]

why wouldn't we bind the ik curve directly to the segment joints instead of the new bind joints? I assume it would cause some problems but can't figure it out myself.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The segment joints are skinned to the curve, but the bind joints are needed to actually drive the curve. You shouldn't use the segment joints because that would cause a cyclical dependency (the segment joints would drive the curve that in turn drive the segment joints).

[@maciejstepniewski1970]

Right. Logic. Thank you for quick answer, you're awesome.

[@maikymadnesskreation8646]

It will be great if you make a tutorial adding a ribbon spline to the arm

[@reniferZiolo]

Hello, I wonder if in order for the spline ik to work properly,do the arm bones have to be aligned perfectly or is it fine if there is a bent (like 35,40 degrees) between the arm and forearm. I'm lookinf for the reasons why my attempt was a failure. Thanks in advance!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

There can be a bend between the lower and upper arm, but for the actual spline yes the joints need to be straight (also the curve should only have two CVs). If you have more than that, it's likely your twist arm will also bend which is not desirable.

[@reniferZiolo]

Maya Learning Channel thanks. This is exactly what happened!

[@hagarafenomanjato]

Hi, i'm in maya 2017 and don't have "cut faces tools". Wich tools is better to have vertical cut, please ? thks

[@Autodesk_Maya]

You'll want to use the Multi-Cut Tool in "Slice Mode".

[@dominicawester3041]

When you rename the bind joints and leftUpperArm_end_bind_JNT becomes leftArm_mid_bind_JNT, what happens to the former joint you used as the start bind joint for the forearm (leftForeArm_start_bind_JNT). Does it get deleted? I cannot find it in your outliner anymore.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

We actually never created it. Instead, we re-used the "leftUpperArm_end_bind_JNT" (10:56) to make sure the arm always twists together (which is the reason we renamed them).

[@gabrielromano9096]

I tried to do this for the right arm, but the arm twists in the opposite direction and it doesn't twist on the rightArm_mid_bind_JNT, I dowloaded your files and put the right directions, negative Z and closest Z, so what do you think it could be? Another thing that is weird is that when I unparent the last segmented joint it created a transform group, when I try to unparent it from that group it creates another one, my only solution was freezing the group's transformations and then I can unparent the joint.

[@gabrielromano9096]

Nevermind, I think I managed to solve it, I deleted the joints I mirrored and did it again, the local rotation axis are different than the mirrored version, but the rotation is still positive when going down and forward, and now everything twists as it should. I still have one question though, will the difference in rotation axis affect my rig when I connect it to the shoulder and hand?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

They actually should be different from left side to right side, so you should be good to go!

[@gabrielromano9096]

I didn't have any huge problems with that, just with the orient constrain with the torso, but I fixed that by rotating the locator. I thought I was done with the rigging, but I might have to redo the arms and the left leg because the fk controls don't follow the result joints when I rotate the torso, and I must have skipped some stuff with the ik in the right arm and left leg, because it works fine for the left arm and right leg, but if you know what could have caused the fk not following it would help me a lot, so I would pay even more attention when I redo those steps.

[@gabrielromano9096]

I just redid both arms, and what seem to have fixed it is something that was supposed to be wrong, I didn't parent constrain the leftArm_start_bind_JNT, I used point constrain, and it worked perfectly.

[@dudemd4873]

Maya learning channel, for some reason my 'insert joints' tool isn't working. When I click drag on the arm joint, Maya doesn't acknowledge me. Please help.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Hmm, I haven't run into that issue before. Is the arm joint on a locked or reference Display Layer? That would prevent you from clicking it. If you just create two random joints, does the insert tool work on those?

[@morin6661]

Hi. I am trying understand this concept for right hand. How do you decide if axis is positive or negative. I duplicated the joints of right hand and made twist joints as you did for left hand. I completed the whole set up. When I rotate the wrist, it rotates in the opposite direction.

[@morin6661]

I have character in A pose.

[@morin6661]

Nevermind..I figured it out, I was not changing the aim axis to negative X. Now it works as it is supposed to :D Thanks!!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Have you checked out part 32? Basically, the joints still use X as their primary axis (along the bone), but running in the opposite direction. So on the right side, the positive direction is from the hand to the shoulder.

[@morin6661]

hand to shoulder? it means negative X, right? I was having some flipping issues on elbow twist. I followed the last advice in the suggested tutorial and it is solved.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yup, that's right. In other words, they will run the opposite direction as the left arm.

[@chillndill]

I have an issue where only on the right side if I rotate the R_EndBind_joint or R_StartBind_joint it rotates R_Seg5_joint as well and even in the opposite direction than where R_EndBind_joint is going

[@chillndill]

I guess the main issue is when I rotate R_StartBind_joint it should not be rotating R_Seg5_joint

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Can you double check the joints' local rotation axes to make sure they're all lined up? If so, then you may need to alter the Advanced Twist Control values for that IK Spline.

[@Gwyv3rn]

i have a question, in order to get my mesh to the point where your arm is in this tutorial, i have been going back through the leg tutorials, starting with tutorial 10, at what point can i stop rewatching the leg tutorials, and start this tutorial?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Viewing parts 10-13 should cover all the shared concepts.

[@Gwyv3rn]

Thank you

[@ryanr4361]

Hi, when I use the insert joint tool it is moving all child joints in my bind chain.. never seen this happen.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Hmm that does seem unusual. I can't reproduce it on my end (especially since the Insert Joint tool doesn't have any options). I would just try deleting your prefs and restarting Maya.

[@ryanr4361]

I figured out the problem, It seems I forgot to duplicate my bind chain. probably has something to do with the connections to the xform values. thanks for the reply!

[@mojangindustry4087]

I figured out you weren't duplicating you joint chain before I even finished reading your question

[@hains92]

Is there any rule behind choosing rotation order for joints? I still dont get why each joint should have that order :-?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The general rule is that you want to be able to pose various parts of the body in the most common ways when the Rotate Tool is set to Gimbal mode. Certain rotation orders won't allow you to do this, and different controls have different requirements (a torso doesn't commonly twist the same way as a foot for example) so that's why it changes per body part.

[@hains92]

Maya Learning Channel well as an animator I prefer using local mode which allows me to rotate all 3 axis at the same time. It's faster. In the past I thought that we should setup the rotation like the-secondly-often-used-axis - the-hardly-used-axis - the-most-used-axis. I think my rule fits well with your idea of rotation order for the arm here, but with the spines it doesn't

[@Autodesk_Maya]

The problem with using modes other than Gimbal is that eventually a rotate controller will "flip" from 360 to 0, which may cause popping in your animations (I cover this back in the first video of this series). Gimbal mode guarantees that this won't happen (but it also limits your range of motion).

[@hains92]

Maya Learning Channel yeah I know that's gimbal lock error. I still got to use Euler filter to fix it when it happens. But anyway I really hope I can find some other way than gimbal mode rotation cuz it's a pain animating that way, it just too tedious. So basically caused by my animating method is different from how you do, these rotation order setup may work well with you but not with me right?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yes, if you're using different settings / techniques, then it's possible that you'll need to use different rotation orders. The ones shown here are tuned for gimbal rotations.

[@LieutenantJim]

Thanks for a great series thus far. I am working with my own character but using the steps in this series. The torso/head/legs came out great (I did the right concurrently with the left and the behavior is correct). However I am not having such great luck with the arms. The left arm works just fine, but for some reason, the twist works in the WRONG direction! All the joint rotations are as you suggest (I followed the mirroring instructions from part 32), and I have positive rotations on all the joints (I compared the orientation to the full rig in part 32). I also tried both settings for the advanced twist control. I even tried unchecking "inherits transform" on all the geometry. Again, the arm bends properly at the elbow, but the twist goes in the opposite direction (ie turn the control clockwise, the twist goes counter-clockwise). Any suggestions? Did I miss anything in the previous comments (which I re-read several times)? Thanks in advance and keep up the good work!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Any chance you can post your rig here: forums.autodesk.com/t5/maya-animation-and-rigging/bd-p/area-b42 so that I and other power users can get a look at it?

[@LieutenantJim]

@@Autodesk_Maya I posted it over at the Autodesk forum and will also provide the youTube link here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/g3rCqZauYqp5b8k Let me know if this is helpful or if there's something more I can post to make it easier for you! Thanks again!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

@@LieutenantJim Someone actually managed to answer your question on AREA before I could even get to it! = )

[@LieutenantJim]

With the help of the MLC crew, I was able to figure this out. The problem was that my right twisty arm would rotate in the wrong direction. I created an entirely new right arm skeleton with the X axis oriented toward the hand (I mirrored the left arm joints, point snapped a new right arm, oriented it to get positive rotations, &c). I duplicated as per the tutorial, but I found that the segmented upper and forearms rotated negatively, even though they were duplicates of the result arm. I re-oriented the secondary axis in the orient tool, and lo and behold, it worked! Be sure to re-orient BEFORE creating the bind joints). Advanced twist settings are as per the tutorial (I used the Positive Y settings as per the note above). Now BOTH arms twist properly. Hell, it took a week but perseverance (and the help of those rocket science geniuses at the MLC) paid off! On to part 23...

[@PeglegPride]

Amazing tutorial. However I am experiencing an issue with the root controller. When I move or rotate the rig root controller the segment joints in the right arm move independently from the rest of the rig hierarchy. The twist joints work perfectly in accordance to all other controllers. It's only an issue with the root. I have isolated the problem to the bind joints. By removing them the joint chain follows the root controller as intended, however the twist functionality obviously doesn't work. I've tried with mirrored segment joints and making new ones from scratch. Still the same issue. Any ideas?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

This is expected, as we do not cover global transforms in this movie. We'd advise you follow along with the tutorial at least up to part 27, which is where the arm is finished.

[@PeglegPride]

Maya Learning Channel Thank you so much for your reply! I had forgotten to remove the inherit transforms on the two EP curves in the right arm.

[@cookie_blue89]

does the joint orientation changes from legs to arms? my values are X as prim Y as secondary and +X as world....

[@Autodesk_Maya]

We mention in the movie that you want X as primary with whatever secondary gives you the most appropriate rotations (so in this case, you want a positive rotation when her arms come down to her sides).

[@vitglohorta1207]

c mon :D I realy made the part 10-18 to the arm and now i see that nothing are there in here just the FK/IK/Result joints . the elbow are also not there . Well everything what there was ,aslo the suggestion that was in the video after i made the fore twist arm finished and after this ,all my smooth bind was broken .

[@jakanddaxterps5302]

Wow men so many work for nothing!

[@maikymadnesskreation8646]

How can I add spline ribbon to this twist arm?

[@mastro3d]

Hi, I have a problem. When the forearm is bent to more than 90 degrees, the _seg_jnt near the elbow rotate on the X axis by 180 degrees. How can I fix this? Thanks.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Alessandro Melis Do the fix in the annotation at 12:22

[@mastro3d]

+Maya Learning ChanneOk, now it works well. Thank you. (Y)

[@mastro3d]

+Maya Learning Channel With the solution at 12:22, when I bend the forearm all is ok, but when the lower arm flex to the torso, the twist jnt flip. I think that this system is not efficient and not stable.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Alessandro Melis So given all the complaints I've had over this bug, I ended up going back to the drawing board on this and came up with a modified solution which I believe should work. The problem has to do with the fact that the reference for the twist is on the exact same axis as the curve its twisting. To change that, try creating three locators named leftArm_start_aim_LOC, leftArm_mid_aim_LOC, and leftArm_end_aim_LOC. Move them each a few units directly above their respective bind joints, then snap their pivots to those bind joints (so that if you rotate the locator it will orbit around its bind joint). Now go back to your Advanced Twist controls and use these locators as the World Up Objects for the appropriate IK handles (you may need to tweak the Up Axis and Up Vectors to match). Finally, don't forget to parent constrain these locators to their respective bind joints. Now you should be able to avoid flipping in all but the most extreme scenarios. For reference, here's a version of the rig with the fix: areadownloads.autodesk.com/wdm/maya/htm_chr_character_rigging_arm_twist_fix.zip

[@mastro3d]

+Maya Learning Channel When opening the file, Maya returns an error message (data loss). Can you save the file in ma format? Thank you very much for the support.

[@PartigradeCannon]

Should the Twist Value Type be start/end or total?

[@sebastianaugustyniak2162]

Hello! Could someone describe the first steps that were not in the movie? Please, a have a problem with this.. I'm losing hope..

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Check out part 10 - 13 in this tutorial for the leg, then apply the same principles to the arm. kzbin.info/www/bejne/rXXcZ3qHn7WjppI

[@sebastianaugustyniak2162]

Thanks! Im going to work!. Im polish student, there are no tutorial in polish language. Thanks!

[@heathermcd484]

Hey, I've got a quick question. Do you think I'd be able to sneak in the "noodle arm" ability without messing this process too much? Do you have any advice on that? Thanks!!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Heather McD I believe I answered that question somewhere in the comments below (or possibly in another movie). You can sneak a noodle arm rig in there, and the process I suggested was to add additional bind joints skinned to the curve driving the segmented arm. You can then parent these under a locator and use that as a control to move them around (which will in-turn bend the arm). I have an example file you can find here: areadownloads.autodesk.com/wdm/maya/bendyupperarm.mb

[@heathermcd484]

Maya Learning Channel Oh, okay. Well, thanks for the quick reply! And thanks for the advice and the link. I'll certainly try it.

[@heathermcd484]

Maya Learning Channel I want to put in two bendy joints in the upper arm. What would the settings be when you skin it? I tried moving the middle two after skinning it and they moved as if they were just standalone joints. Is that right?

[@diogosimoes1031]

Heather McD I tried to do the same in my rig and that happened too. Did you found out what it was?

[@JettzCG]

Hey man, I have a problem with my upper arm's seg Joints. When I twist the arms FK control the whole seg (geo) twists as much as the rest of the arm, any tips? And thanks for the Tuts my dude

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Is it only with the FK control or the IK control too? It could be that the skinning of the curve to the bind joints isn't correct (if the skinning is fully weighted towards one joint or the other, the entire arm would turn at the same rate). Try re-skinning the curve.

[@JettzCG]

It's just the FK control, I re-band the skin multiple times and played around with the settings while doing so, still no luck

[@Autodesk_Maya]

If the IK control is working properly then it won't be the skinning. Did you parent / parent constrain the seg arm to the FK controls by accident? Are the bind joints properly parent constrained to the result joints? I think what's happening is that the entire segment arm joint chain is somehow under the FK hand joint, so when you're rotating the FK hand, it's actually rotating the entire segment arm's local space.

[@JettzCG]

My bad for not saying but the fore arm and hand FK controls twist the arm correctly, it's the upper arm control that twists the whole the upper arm seg joints equally instead of the ones closer to the shoulder twisting less

[@JettzCG]

At 11:55 point constraining the bind joint to the result joint instead of parent constraining fixed the issue for me, are there any drawbacks to doing this though? I see the description says the annotations are suggestions after all. But regardless, thanks for the help my man!

[@Selcatys]

Should we create a BlendColors Node for the hand_End bone ?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yup.

[@Selcatys]

Thanks ! I have another issue, at the end you say that if we rotate in FK or IK mode the arm should twist, while rotating the upperArm_FK the arm only rotate as it did before we segmented it, for the foreArm it twists the upperArm part and for the Hand it twists the foreArm-hand part of the arm, do you know what can cause that problem ?

[@Selcatys]

Actually the only non twisting part is the upperArm_FK which should drive the upperARm segments

[@Selcatys]

Found the solution, its because of the parent constraint I used, the upper part of the arm doesnt twist with it but with a point constraint as you did in the video it works !

[@TheNinthElement]

Whenever I rotate my FK hand joint, the forearm rotates along with it: i.imgur.com/SkrsRoJ.png I'm not sure if parenting the result joints to the bind joints causes this problem. I've redone this tutorial 3 times now and meticulously followed every step but this problem persists. Please help!

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Hmm, to clarify: did you parent or parent constrain them? It should be a constraint. And it should be parent constraining the bind joint to the result joint, not the other way around. Judging from the image, it looks like the leftForearm_CRV is rotating with the leftHAND_FK control, which it shouldn't be.

[@TheNinthElement]

I parent constrained them exactly as shown in the video where the bind joints are parented to the non-segmented result joints. The results still give me the same problem. I've redone my blend color nodes as well but to no avail. This problem exists for both FK and IK joints whenever I switch between them and rotate. The upperarm and forearm joints work perfectly fine.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Hmm, have you tried downloading the included scene file? Try comparing the node hierarchies and seeing if there's any differences.

[@TheNinthElement]

What I've figured out is that the end bind joint of the arm being parent constrained to the hand result joint is causing the problem. However, the dilemna I have now is that deleting the parent constraint removes the twisting ability of the end bind joint. I have no idea how this problem came about.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

It might be your skin settings for the leftForeArm_CRV. If all the influence on the curve was weighted to just the end_bind_JNT, that would cause it to follow its rotation 100% which appears to be what you're seeing. Try this: Ctrl + select both the mid_bind_JNT and leftForeARM_CRV then (in the Rigging menu set) go to Skin > Edit Influences > Add Influence. Now try bending the wrist again. Does that fix it?

[@hagarafenomanjato]

I'll start at the beginning, will i combine arm_geo and hand_geo ?

[@dudemd4873]

No, you want the arm geo not only a separate object from the hand geo, but you want the arm geo split in two: UpperArm geo, and ForArm geo.

[@gamerwhogames2081]

Whenever I try to twist the forearm, the upperArm geometry disappears. What should I do?

[@gamerwhogames2081]

+Ocelott|SheDoesStuff I looked back, and now I see that it's the entire UpperArm segment joint that's disappearing from the scene. It's translated somewhere, but I can't find it. What should I do about this?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Ocelott|SheDoesStuff Sounds like you have a double-transform happening. You may have parented the segment joints incorrectly, or you may have used the wrong type of skinning when setting up the spline.

[@gamerwhogames2081]

okay

[@gamerwhogames2081]

I tried to reskin the curves, but the problem still exists. And I don't think it's a double-transformation, otherwise, the joint would be rotating double, but it's actually translating somewhere in world space. Any other suggestions?

[@gamerwhogames2081]

Goodness. Now it's even worse. I recreated the whole arm and now BOTH segment joints are disappearing! I don't know what on earth could be the problem. And to make matters stranger, whenever I try to find the object in the workspace by pressing F, the camera translates so that I can see my entire character, but no segmented joints are in sight at all. What should I do?

[@mojangindustry4087]

so I repeat videos 10 - 18 with the arm, then come back to this movie?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

You mean repeat 10-18 for the right leg? Yes. Or you can do the entire left side and then do the entire right side. It's really up to you. Note that part 32 has some important notes about mirroring though.

[@mojangindustry4087]

No, I mean in this video you seemed to have a jump start on the left arm. I am doing this rig on my own character, and I was wondering how far you went on the left arm?

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Ohhh, sorry I misunderstood. Actually you only need to do parts 10-13 with the arm, then you'll be ready to start this tutorial.

[@mojangindustry4087]

Thanks!

[@hagarafenomanjato]

10-13 with stretching ? I saw stretching tuto on video part 23.

[@gopinathmani7163]

"parent -r -s" script is not working for arm FK ctrl, Plz help me??

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Did you make the sure the Script Editor was set to "MEL" and not "Python"? Are you receiving an error?

[@gopinathmani7163]

thanks for the reply. yeah, it is in "MEL" in fact, it works for torso but not for arm. To be clear when I apply the script it comes in the hierarchy but the orientation is not working :(

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Oh, it sounds like you just forgot to Freeze Transforms on the original before using the parent command.

[@gopinathmani7163]

I did FT before using parent command and I also created new joints and tried, it shows the same problem! For your information I'm using 2017 version.

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Hmm, that's definitely unusual. In the worst case, you can just go to component mode, select the curve's CVs, and use the Move / Rotate tools to move it back into position without affecting the joint.

[@alkeaschocogrey3162]

this way did not work for my right arm，but work for my Left arm. When i twist the bind upperArmStart bind jnt for Right arm,her whole jnt will follow a line

[@Autodesk_Maya]

I would try re-skinning the IK Spline Curve. If the entire arm is turning at once, it means all the joints have the same amount of influence.

[@meganlentin1055]

Hello, when I bend my IK or FK arm past 95-ish degrees I get a strange twisting in the upper arm. Do you know how I could fix this? imgur.com/a/Lvc8V

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Try the alternate twist settings in the annotation at 12:22. (Up Axis: Positive Y, Up Axis: 0, 1, 0)

[@JayKumar-hb8bx]

Sir, I have followed steps of leftUpperArm twist for leftForeArm twist. But how my selection of leftUpperArm_end_bind_JNT is different from yours, I have attached the image for reference. Aside to that, before starting basic arm setup what are the steps to be replicated from part (10 -13). I have added image for your reference: i345.photobucket.com/albums/p389/jay_k1890/selection%20error_zpsegccipsr.png Thanks in advance

[@Autodesk_Maya]

That just looks like a parenting problem. Try comparing yours to the included scene file and make sure the node hierarchy matches. As for your second question, you should be replicating all the steps from parts 10-13 (just on the arms).

[@JayKumar-hb8bx]

ok thank you sir

[@catsnorkel]

None of this works if you have modified your local rotation axes, the twists get all messed up and the bones rotate to different directions

[@Autodesk_Maya]

Yes. but if the LRAs are consistent between all the arm joints, then you can still accomplish this with modified values. if the LRAs are all different then you're right, it's pretty much impossible (but then, that's the point of LRAs to begin with).

[@ROCKCHRISTMASCARROLS]

Hi I have been following your tutorial up to this point with ease and managed to sort out much of the problems i've been having but I cant solve this one i.imgur.com/XpTe7Hw.jpg my fore arm geometry does not want to follow the joints for some reason.

[@ROCKCHRISTMASCARROLS]

The way I fixed it is I parented the control to the leftForeArm_CRV and set it rotation point but I don't weather that will do for future parts of this great tutorial

[@joelqrq]

How should I rig and orient my character hand as it is A-posed. Image: imgur.com/4V2g7VJ

[@Autodesk_Maya]

+Joel Quey The same principle as the foot applies. We recommend positioning the bones in a standard T-Pose, then rotating them down to fit the A-Pose. Once the geometry is split/parented or skinned, you can return to the T-Pose again at all 0 values.

[@joelqrq]

+Maya Learning Channel Thanks for the solution. :)

[@levinnaangelita7432]

Hi, what if my model is in A-posed, and her arms are slightly bend forward like this www.imgpaste.net/image/JMRkq show i edit the mesh manually? what would you recommend? thanks before :)

[@Autodesk_Maya]

You can use the same technique you did for the feet (remember they were angled outward and we corrected them without changing the model).

[@levinnaangelita7432]

ohh i see, thank you so much :)

[@austinbroder662]

I'm just seeing this now, can you refer me to where you talk about the feet? I'm rigging a character in A pose and it's causing some trouble

[@Autodesk_Maya]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/rXXcZ3qHn7WjppIm12s

[@sandipmajumder117]

when i complited fk and ik joints with using blendcolors then i try to move my ik bone with controler then the hand settings ctrl rotate with the ik bones.have a look ok this. imgur.com/a/xkumY

[@aydinbadrian16]

1- In which view, we should start to create arm joints chain? top view or front view? is it important at all? 2- Please check the screenshot and tell me How to fix IK HDL direction for arm? pasteboard.co/HoFScgA.png Thank you

[@Autodesk_Maya]

1 - top view is probably the best, though it doesn't matter all that much. 2 - that will be fixed once you do the elbow later on.

[@pabletesoy]

Yes, I whish!