Crom: A Look at Conan's Dark God

[@northoftherockies]

I think the fact that Conan doesn't pray to Crom is also an indication that Conan is aware, on some level, that Crom as a symbol of strength is an externalized manifestation of his own self. Crom exists primarily as a lesson to young Cimmerians that the strength they inherited from their ancestral fathers is all they need to make their own way in life, to overcome challenges and achieve greatness. Crom as a divine symbol serves as a reminder of one's own power rather than as a savior in times of hardship. To ask him for more than what he already gave you at birth would show a lack of gratitude and an acknowledgment of personal weakness, thus the twofold curse of "doom and death".

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, I believe you're right about that. His invocations of Crom in certain situations are probably his way of reminding himself of this as much serving as a curse. Among the Cimmerians, it likely serves as a type of challenge as well, effectively: "Prove yourself!"

[@madmarduk1936]

Yeah, the only times I can think of that he called on Crom were when he faced the supernatural or thought he saw Crom’s hand in something.

[@riftvallance2087]

Can't remember which story but I remember A line that was something to the effect that there is no point in praying to Crom because praying is weakness and crom despises weakness.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@riftvallance2087 Yeah, Conan remarks that Crom will "send dooms" when someone asks his aid.

[@northoftherockies]

@@riftvallance2087 From "The Tower of the Elephant" - "His gods were simple and understandable. Crom was their chief, and he lived on a great mountain, whence he sent forth dooms and death. It was useless to call on Crom, because he was a gloomy, savage god, and he hated weaklings. But he gave a man courage at birth, and the will and might to kill his enemies, which, in the Cimmerian's mind, was all any god should be expected to do."

[@ronniemaclaine5234]

Conan the philosopher. Now that would be an interesting book.

[@varanid9]

Crom Cruach is a pagan god of Ireland, certainly the inspiration for Crom, considering how Howard based his cultures on real ones living in, apparently, roughly the same areas as his fictional iterations.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, he was very proud of his Irish ancestry, and spent a great deal of time researching this sort of material. In fact, that's how he first got in touch with Lovecraft, I believe. He wrote a letter to Weird Tales complimenting Lovecraft on his use of certain Celtic references.

[@lonestar6709]

Funny that... I just finished "The Horned God" yesterday. Crom Cruach being one of Slaine's main adversities in the novel.

[@rorschach1985ify]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Kinda funny since Lovecraft was known for being racist against Irish immigrants in his stories.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@rorschach1985ify I plan to read more of Howard's correspondence with Lovecraft. I know Lovecraft's views changed over time, and he seemed to become more tolerant. It would be interesting to see how much of this they may have discussed behind the scenes.

[@dexocube]

From what I can tell in the books I've read about Irish mythology, the worship of Crom Cruach appears to be a cult, put down at some point.

[@abrahemsamander3967]

This has to be the best reading of the “I am content” speech I’ve ever heard.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks very much! I appreciate the feedback on it! I love doing this kind of thing.

[@quackenbush723]

My dad introduced me and my brother to Howard's tales when I was young. I introduced my boys. Now, we have long discussions about pointless stories that mean the world to us all. This gives us another jumping off point for more pointless talks. In thanks, you have my subscription sir.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

In my opinion, any discussion you enjoy is by no means pointless. Thanks for the subscription!

[@quackenbush723]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive pointless in the grand scheme of things, priceless to us. You're welcome, glad your video popped up.

[@aquarius5719]

I instead jumped from the movies that are not accurate to the lore of Howard, to the Monolith edition board game of Conan. And from there I tried to find out more about Howard's tales

[@matthewbittenbender9191]

The impression that I got from the Arnold Schwarzenegger movie was that He encountered Crom's corpse in that hidden hall he stumbled upon while running from wolves after being freed from the fighting pits. He showed reverence when he took Crom's sword. And just prior to his final battle with Thulsa Doom, he prayed to Crom pretty much denouncing him if he didn't offer assistance. Doom's god gave him powers and Conan suffered great personal losses to that point. Clearly he was exposed fo many dieties and beliefs in his travels but by giving Crom an ultimatum before that final battle and stating he'd find victory even without him, he might've caught his attention OR he might've just been God-like himself. Valeria (Bêlit in the books) shows up like a Valkyrie shield maiden when he looks to be near defeat. He finds victory tho we never know if Crom ever does really help. But it's safe to say that Howard chose to have Conan rise to a demigod status, like Hercules, and rival or overshadow his own god. It's not often discussed, but there are factions of early Christianity where it is believed that all humans have a "spark of the divine" meaning that we all have a piece of God in us. Further, there are many ancient myths where gods were not immortal and humans are sometimes challenged to defy and even defeat them. I'd suggest that that is the basis for Conan's god.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yeah, it's unclear whether Crom answers Conan or Valeria simply breaks the bonds of death somehow and returns to aid him (as Belite promised she would). I believe there's a story in pastiche Conan (maybe a comic) where Crom intervenes on Conan's behalf when Conan is about to die an unworthy death; but this is the only time we see that happen. In the movie, when Conan finds that cave with the dead warriors, he says "Crom," but the soundtrack calls that scene "Atlantean Sword," so I'm not sure what to make of it.

[@matthewbittenbender9191]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive interesting. It's quite possible (maybe more likely) that the king in that hidden hall was just Conan's first big treasure trove which he saw more as a gift from Crom and not actually his God of steel. Conan showing reverence in that scene made it seem to me that the corpse was more than just an ancient king. How the scene plays out is that he takes the sword and as Conan is appraising it the camera comes back in hard on the dead king, back to Conan, and then the king's hand appears to move, undead like, until his entire body collapses and startles Conan out of his intoxocated reverie over the sword to stone sober when the corpse collapses on the floor. He seems to have realized that he was shown favor and is humbled, but I saw it as his realization that Crom was the corpse. Maybe I'm wrong on both accounts, the movie is based on the books, but not exact and it's been a long time since I read them.

[@mikegrossberg8624]

@@matthewbittenbender9191 I suspect that Conan saying "CROM!" is not so much INVOKING him as saying something like "JESUS H CHRIST!" when you encounter something startling. OR, maybe, "OH SHIT!"

[@jlworrad]

Receiving a get well card that invokes Crom is one step away from being cursed!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Absolutely!

[@fistovuzi]

says on the front "GET WELL!" open it up it says "or not. i don't give a shit"

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@fistovuzi LOL! Indeed.

[@fistovuzi]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive there was a video game released a few years back called Conan:Exiles and being a Howard fan i gave it a go. i was always struck by how lore-friendly the game was, their l"ore-master" was very good (his name is Joel Bylos). anyway, as part of this game you may choose patron gods, Mitra, Set, Ymir, etc and there is a whole system of devotion with benefits up to and including calling giant avatars of the gods for war and combat. if you choose Crom you get none of it, he has no altars, no system of worship. nothing. he is, in effect, the "gag" choice. but touching on what you were saying about the Cimmerian "afterlife". the Cimmerians you encounter in the game congregate in a very gloomy, foggy, depressing part of the "map". this is because they all believe they are dead, so they settled the place that resembled their conception of the afterlife. you likewise find the other Hyborian races settling in lore friendly "biomes", the Darfari in the desert, pirates on the coast, etc. Joel is currently working as lead creative director on an upcoming game based on Frank Herbert's Dune and i am hoping to see the attention to detail i saw in the Conan game.

[@ChatarraCrow]

The Pool of the Black One was intense to say the least. That was probably one of my favorites.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, the action is almost non-stop in that story.

[@isawamoose]

10:43 definitely Odin vibes, lots of beware what you wish for, god of death, he's called the grim one, etc etc

[@thepubliclibrarian2834]

Great analysis. Most people just see him as a lug head hero, but your connecting him to Howard's outlook and that transfering and being personified in Conan is a great explanation of the character and what he and his world represented.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! Yes, there's more to these stories than a lot of people appreciate from surface-level readings.

[@BullGooseTV]

you gotta do more readings man, that intro was amazing

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks! I'm glad you liked it. I try to do those for most of my videos.

[@matthewwalker5504]

Great video man ! I love Robert E Howard work.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@matthewwalker5504 I'm glad you enjoyed it. Thanks for watching!

[@matthewwalker5504]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive ya man a totally underappreciated writer. What did you think of that movie Solomon Kane.

[@soakedbearrd]

That intro monologue was good.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[@philarmstrong3765]

Thanks for a thoghtful and well-crafted evaluation of Conan's relegiosity. I've recently re-visited Howard's Conan, and I have to say I found it a lot more engaging at 15 than I do at 65.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'm glad you enjoyed it. I didn't start reading Conan until I was older (in my 30s). Howard's work varies widely in quality. Yes, it's pulp, but some of it has real excellence (his intro to The Phoenix on the Sword is truly amazing). As for the lesser efforts, well, I once told someone that those works are like reading something written by a 12-year-old boy who has just discovered girls and weight-lifting. 😄 Thanks for commenting!

[@philarmstrong3765]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Haha, well said! I'm sure you already know about it, but give "The Whole Wide World' w/ Vincent D'Onofrio a look if you haven't already. REH was born in Peaster, TX, about 20 minutes from where I live. -Cheers!-

[@dexocube]

@@philarmstrong3765 Good film that. He was a lonely old soul. So was Lovecraft, and it definitely coloured their philosophies, unfortunately.

[@Talent1533]

Looking forward to future deep dives into Howard’s lore!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@Pardu84]

great video, I've become a big fan of the Conan stories lately. Conans ponderings on the god's of other lands in tower of the Elephant is some of my favorite prose written by Howard.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

The Tower of the Elephant is hands-down some of Howard's best writing. It's thought-provoking on several levels.

[@nosotrosloslobosestamosreg4115]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Specially that part about the lack of manners in "civilized" people...

[@Wolf-bz6kq]

I believe Crom is Howard's interpretation of nietzschein ideals, the monologue in the beginning (from the Queen of the Black Coast) screams nietzschein ideals of self-empowerment and will to power

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's a good observation. For one thing, he sees no alternatives. As he said to Lovecraft, he didn't believe in any coming "superman" who would right the world's wrongs.

[@Duck_Dodgers]

It's translated to overman unfortunately it was mis translated as superman the first time by Kaufman he went back and changed. Unfortunately fools still see it as superman if you read thus spoke Zarathustra superman doesn't even fit in the story or the philosophy

[@Wolf-bz6kq]

@@Duck_Dodgers I am aware of this but it's good to know when somebody else acknowledges it, considering how many KZbin channels popped up preaching nietzsche but keeps saying superman instead of overman

[@caesarmendez6782]

Your Gen-X? I'm a Boomer, growing-up in the '60's & the '70's & somehow missing all the "fun-stuff" of those decades. I grew up in NYC & still live here so I remember that we had 3 independently owned stations along with the Big Three that were headquartered here in Manhattan. I remember the independent kiddie shows & cartoons that played on the tv. I also remember being introduced to the character of Conan via Marvel comics adaptation of the Howard creation. I became obsessed with Howard's writings (as well with the Witch World series by Andre Norton). I used to wonder if Howard hadn't committed suicide he might of created a literate universe to rival J.R.R. Tolkien's works. Well maybe.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yep, I'm Gen X (born in '73). I miss the days of local, independent stations with the kids' shows and other aspects of local color (including cheesy commercials - lol). From what I've seen, it looks like Howard was moving more toward writing westerns, although I do think that, given enough time, he would have circled back around to Conan and his times. He definitely had the imaginary scope to give Tolkien some competition.

[@seal7144]

This is a great video! I don’t get many opportunities to hear other people’s interpretations of the Conan stories.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[@ghosttankcommander5397]

Thanks for the Conan lore and Robert e Howard lore, your channel is underrated thanks for the uploads!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! I appreciate the feedback.

[@shukarion6677]

I came across this video while playing Conan Exiles, and as a long time Conan fan I really enjoyed it. I watched the Conan movies as a teenager, and bought a lot of Conan comics in the '80s. In the '90 I read the complete works of Robert E. Howard. in the 2008 I played Age of Conan, and since 2018 I have played Conan Exiles :-D

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'm glad you enjoyed it! I wish I'd gotten into the stories when I was younger.

[@michaellyons5208]

I grew up and still live in the Baltimore DC area and in the same era and remember watching his programs on channel 20 as well as Captain Chesapeake on channel 45 in Baltimore. Excellent content by the way

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!! It was fun interviewing him. BTW, Channel 45 had its own horror host: "Ghost Host," who came on Saturdays as well. That was the same guy who played Captain Chesapeake.

[@michaellyons5208]

​@@TheAtlanteanArchiveI missed out on that one lol

[@ricardorios492]

Sword and sorcery and heavy metal YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[@chrisbricky7331]

Wow and very well done and said. Thanks for doing all this work and then being able to explain it so well. Chris

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'm glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for leaving a comment.

[@English_MoFo]

Damn I love the first Conan movie 🍿

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yeah, it was great. I love the scene where Conan first meets Akiro, the wizard, who immediately tries to psych him out. Then they burst out laughing at each other. Great stuff.

[@English_MoFo]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive “Crom laughs at your four winds!”

[@English_MoFo]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive 2nd best movie score ever after Star Wars 77 👍🏻

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@English_MoFo It's awesome.

[@SEKreiver]

Good job! You've obviously put some research and thought into this. Quick note: Novalyne Price and Norris Chambers both attested that REH pronounced it 'CO-nun', NOT 'Co-NAN'. Milius and Ahnuldt popularised the second version. Howard had studied Irish Gaelic. On top of that, he was a big fan of Arthur Conan Doyle. People around the world knew how to pronounce the name--including older members of my family--until Milius pissed in the well. The thing about QotBC is that it doesn't really jibe with the other yarns, Crom-wise. Conan spent the previous five yarns yelling out 'Crom!' every other page. Suddenly, Crom is He Who Must Not Be Named. After QotBC, business as usual. I suppose it's best to look upon every utterance as an actual curse and not an invocation of divine aid. According to Celtic scholar, Peter Beresford Ellis, 'Crom' was still uttered as a curse/expletive in Ireland until the early 20th century. Crom Sunday in Ireland is the first Sunday in August. Croagh Patrick in Galway used to be called 'Croagh Crom'. Everybody brings up 'Crom Cruach' and Magh Slecht, but 'Crom Dubh' (Dark Crom') seems to have been the Crom Irish peasants swore by. Conan calls him 'Dark Crom' more than once, so Howard seems aware of that title. There is also "Crom and his dark brood". Howard's "Hyborian Names and Countries" lists six Cimmerian deities beside Crom. You can add to that Lir and Manannan mac Lir. Eight in total. There are hints in a couple of yarns that the Cimmerians did have priests and oracles. They probably carried out rituals to those other gods. Such worship probably ameliorated things a bit. Conan had a good, if basic, moral sense as early as TTotE. Conan later mentioned that Cimmerians would help fellow tribesmen if they were starving. All in all, the Cimmerian religion appears to be more complex than a quick glance would indicate.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you for the feedback! That's fascinating info. Whenever Howard took an interest in something, he dove into it almost obsessively, so these are definitely details that I could see him ferreting out and building into his world. I do think it likely that Howard meant for Conan's usage of "Crom" to be a curse, although, among the Cimmerians themselves, I could see it being invoked as a challenge along the lines of "Prove yourself." It would be interesting to know prompted Howard to build a theology discussion into QotBC. Conan does some musing in TPotS and talks about Cimmerian beliefs a bit, but the discussion with Belite does stand out. Thanks again! That is great info, and I'll make note of it.

[@danielburns4483]

loving this format. so comfy and what a fun bit of introspection. thank you! looking forward to watching more and more.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! I'm glad you're enjoying it!

[@redwawst3258]

Great segment. Thank you. 🎩🌂

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'm glad you enjoyed it!

[@LeRoySlim]

Great content - Please fix / increase the VOLUME.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'll work on that. Thank you.

[@vjm3]

This kinda makes sense, because at first I thought the fact Conan calls out "CROM" was him asking for Crom's help. As you explained this, I then realized Conan isn't calling out for Crom's help, but rather he was CURSING Crom for sending him whatever compelled him to yell out Crom in the first place. One other thing I take in to account is the stories of Conan tend to (for the most part) be self-contained in that there's barely any continuity between them. This is because it was explicitly stated by fans that when you read Conan books (or his amazing stories in "Savage Sword of Conan"), you should treat them more like mythical legends told by random acquaintances around a campfire, and not literal! So embellishments, like a man with an elephant's head forced to sit on a throne, sound absurd, because in actuality they probably are just the wild drunken imaginations of traveling regular people. IF a real Conan existed in those worlds, no doubt he's a strong warrior and respected person (even king), but they're probably extreme embellishments of what he really is. I find that absolutely fascinating.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks for the reply! You have some good thoughts on this. I think it's usually a curse on Conan's part, although, when used among the Cimmerians themselves, it might have amounted to a challenge along the lines of "Prove yourself," since they believed that Crom empowered one at birth.

[@doctorlolchicken7478]

I always saw Conan as being a hero styled on Irish legendary figures like Cu Chulainn. Crom is very much an Irish deity, both literally and in style.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, Howard was very much into that kind of lore.

[@tossr4716]

Great subject brother. By Crom, the god of merciless steel. Love it.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@kallianpublico7517]

How much different is Conan from the Greek and Roman heroes depicted in Plutarch? The world they lived in was more criminal than civilized. Yet they were taught civility being Noble born or having good teachers. It seems Conan's adventures in the North were formative of his outlook, but where did he receive his knowledge of letters and skills, not to mention his rough code? There's a story worth telling, because Conan recognizes good from evil. How if he was just a slayer?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's something I wish Howard had written more about: what Conan's life was like in Cimmeria and how he eventually chose to leave. As you say, he's far from being an ignorant savage, and he has a code of honor. In The Tower of Elephant, he actually feels shame at the evil that men are capable of. Thanks for the comment!

[@mikegrossberg8624]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Conan does indeed have a code of honor, which he will NEVER compromise. It may be nothing recognizable to others, but it IS there, and he always lives by it.

[@oscarwildin9803]

Great video 👍

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@covahredro8370]

My nephew when he was a bub used to call is few years older sister Crom and would say it with same reverence as Arnold did in the Conan movie. Even when we tried to get him to say her actual name, he kept calling her Crom. In later years it slowly became Shrom a mix of her name and Crom. Funny thing is I don't believe he ever got to watch Conan, especially as a baby. But he did really look up to her, she could reach and get things for him and translate his baby babble to get what he wanted.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's a great story. It sounds like she was a bit more helpful than Howard's Crom!

[@covahredro8370]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Yeah she certainly was until she got older, but by then he was calling her by her actually name. It a fond memory, especially when his Nana would have him repeat all our name back one after the other. But everytime time he got to her name it was Crom.

[@AngusJo]

I can only recommend the comic series "The Cimmerian" from Ablaze Publishing to all Robert E. Howard fans. This is very close to the original material and wonderfully presented. Ablaze also has a "Belit & Valeria" series that deals with Crom. Also very interesting. Though not as well written as the Cimmerian.

[@dexocube]

Interesting. The Conan stories should be entering the public domain in a few years right?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@dexocube As far as I know, all of Howard's Conan stories are in the public domain.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks for that! I hadn't heard of it.

[@TheBrothersHyborian]

While I disagree that Conan is an avatar of sorts for Howard, I must say that the notion that Cimmeria reflects the inner-pain and is a land that has links to Howard's own outlook on life is a fascinant idee. If anything I'd argue Kull was much more of a self-insert than Conan, though with that said there are still differences. This was a great examination of Crom a deity who is not entirely without some measure of merit as a god, as bestowing men and women with courage and inner-strength is no small thing. Likely Howard thought this to be a great gift.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yeah, it's basically the power to make something of oneself, and the freedom to do it without constraint. From what I've read of his thoughts on these things, Howard felt that the structure of civilization was stifling to the individual. Thanks for commenting!

[@TheBrothersHyborian]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Very much true, on all accounts, you've really put in a lot of thought into this am very impressed. And maybe Howard had a point to an extent, there must be a balance between the barbarian and civilisation.

[@igodreamer7096]

Great video, Atlantean man. Keep up the good work! ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@AnonymousAlcoholic772]

Crom! You had me at Crom.

[@michaelsmyth3935]

The very act of calling on Crom for aid is seen as a punishable offense...by Crom.

[@darrenrenna]

Fantastic video---you found a great topic to explore. have you read Howard's James Allison series? It echos the theme of a modern man remembering his ancestoral past lives from an archaic & forgotten age. Cheer!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@darrenrenna Actually, that's one I haven't read. Thanks for putting me onto that. I'll check it out!

[@darrenrenna]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Just came across these stories recently, I got the feeling that these are stories written well before Conan with Howard still fleshing out his Hyborian Age.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@darrenrenna Yes, writers often have core ideas in mind for a long time before they figure out just the right way to frame them in a story.

[@darrenrenna]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Yes, often makes for great reading to get into the early iterations of a great author's ideas. Like looking at the first sketches from a great artist.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@darrenrenna That's a great way to put it.

[@jeremykern7806]

Thank you for highlighting Robert. He must have been a beautiful human being. 😢

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I agree. He felt like he was out of his proper place and time, and this left him troubled, but his quality really shines through his work. He was a man who felt and thought deeply.

[@voxcasttonowhereofficial]

Finally, a Conan lore channel 🥹

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I'll be covering a lot of different ground, but I'm fascinated by the way Howard wrote his worldview into his tales.

[@CountingHouse]

I consider Crom to have been a living cheiftan of the Cimmerians as remote from Conan as Conan is to us. He was a victim of the body transference of the great race of Yiff in the Lovecraft tale The Shadow out of Time. His insights and knowledge of all history and future would have made him appear as God and to me explains his grim outlook.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's an interesting idea. Thanks for that. I'll have to go back and re-read The Shadow out of Time. It's been a while.

[@CountingHouse]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Very welcome, I would be very keen to see what you think, even if you think I am out of my tree :D

[@erictomdavidfries6756]

Crom as a Yithian host, fascinating how you combined the mythos. I believe Howard and Lovecraft would have been pleased.

[@CountingHouse]

I have an idea for a short story

[@3rdedk]

Great video, really enjoyed it, thought-provoking; making me wonder if Conan might be Crom's ideal follower, living life to the fullest and grabbing it by the horns with what Crom gave him, not moping around all his life in one place pretty much waiting to die...if Crom cared about that sort of thing, anyway

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it! I agree that Conan is pretty much Crom's ideal follower. In some ways, I'd say he's Howard's ideal man.

[@ishclayton8667]

By Crom!

[@kmoov90]

Crom sounds like a rejected and forgotten strawberry jam that was never invited to the family gathering.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

😄

[@andrewmckeown6786]

In case someone has never heard, David Gimmel writes amazing stories. Hes called greatest writer of heroic fantasy

[@nosotrosloslobosestamosreg4115]

I've just discovered your channel... and subscribed.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@nosotrosloslobosestamosreg4115 Thank you!

[@nosotrosloslobosestamosreg4115]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive You have very good material here, and just like my favourite poitician nce said, we'll follow your career with interest.

[@machinegunblues7]

Just found your channel and I really like your analysis. Subscribed and looking forward to more!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you! I'm glad you're enjoying it. Let me know if there's any specific content you'd like to see in the future.

[@WarDogMadness]

I think Robert got the name from the Celtic god Crom Cruach from Ireland. really wish howard had lived longer the endless stories we could have got

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, you're probably right about the origin of the name. Howard studied Celtic history and lore.

[@twitchew]

thanks for making this! Is it too trite to suggest that Crom seems like a very direct analog to his own father being distant and you asked for help at your own peril. it makes the work and writing he did about dealing with life as it was and taking joy in life and the moments all the more powerful to be honest.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's certainly a possibility. Even theologians have noted that people often derive their idea of God in part from their relationships with their fathers.

[@alanschaub147]

I suggest a video on Elric of Melniboné. Michael Moorcock wrote that character to be the opposite of Conan in every way. I think you and your audience might find it interesting.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's one I hadn't heard of before. Thanks for the recommendation. I'll check it out.

[@DarkVeghetta]

I second a dive into the lore of Elric of Melniboné. A fascinating anti-hero and one not often talked about, yet he has quite a number of long-time fans, a fairly solid body of work, and some more modern characters very likely have taken inspiration from him, notably Geralt of Rivia (i.e. the Witcher).

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@DarkVeghetta I'll definitely be taking a look at Elric.

[@DarkVeghetta]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Looking forward to it.

[@dexocube]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Elric is brilliant. Moorcock just published a new volume a few months ago.

[@alanschaub147]

Fantastic!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@Damienx247]

There is a bleak irony in this, considering in Phoenix on the Sword among a few other novels that Conan seems to be of interests of Mithra, seeing as the spirit of one of his priests blesses Conan's sword to banish a demon.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yeah, Howard never really developed an internally consistent lore.

[@Sarke2]

Great analysis.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@toomieornot2me436]

The 10 CROMmandments: 1- Smite all those who would doubt in Crom! 2- No temples does Crom require. Through your sword, they shall fear and know Crom! 3- Curse Crom's name, and thou shall be smited by Crom! 4- Recognoze the nights of crescent moons and starlit skies and think on Crom! 5- If thy father and mother recognize Crom, you and they are of Crom! 6- It is better to smite ones enemies than to be smited by Crom! 7- Thou shall taketh pleasure in thy woman, and in thy neighbor's woman if it pleases Crom! 8- If thy needeth a seond camel, taketh another camel for Crom! 9- Tongues of silver often live on to speak of Crom! 10- Lands do not grow in size without spilling the blood of one's enemies...for Crom!

[@majorgrubert5887]

I never knew how fricken cool Conan is! I saw the movies when growing up and thought they were cheesy but! Now I know otherwise having read some stories

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Howard built a lot more into them than most people suspect, largely (I believe) because they're quick to dismiss pulp writers.

[@majorgrubert5887]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive I like the cosmic sci fi horrors and how it’s placed in ancient times… like Lovecraft and idk Heavy Metal! Mashed together! It’s just really cool! If I were to begin reading Howard’s work what would or should check out first?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@majorgrubert5887 The Phoenix on the Sword was the first Conan story. After that, I think it goes: The Frost Giant's Daughter, The God in the Bowl, The Tower of the Elephant, and The Scarlet Citadel. In my opinion, The Tower of the Elephant would be best to read after The Phoenix on the Sword, and then The Scarlet Citadel. These are some of Howard's finest efforts, and certainly among the best Conan stories. This is the first in a three-volume collection that has all of Howard's Conan stories in order (I believe they're all in the public domain, so you don't have to buy the books to read them. The Amazon description info will give you the order of the stories, though). The Coming of Conan the Cimmerian: The Original Adventures of the Greatest Sword and Sorcery Hero of All Time! a.co/d/5KprcpY

[@tonyb7615]

In a harsh climate full of war, I always assumed crom was almost a fertility god of a sort. By empowering a woman to bring a child to full term, it was a defiance of nature that his worship would ward off presumably high infant mortality rates. And so his gift was the health of the mother and the baby. Maybe moreso for cimmarians for their natural born endurance that they weren't cursed with that when maybe the neighboring countries were. Like maybe over in aesgard, the young folk that werent figured to be warriors would end up as slaves, and they wouldnt overwhelm cimmeria with sheer numbers because not everone was a born warrior. Add high infant mortality, maybe a high mortality rate for mothers, and its like real life vikings from 15 centuries ago for aesgardians and most anywhere else. Cimmeria always felt like sparta to me, where everyone was a fierce warrior 1st and that was why they didnt build magnificent cities. Then if you head south it was full of civilization and opulence and their gods reflect that.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

That's an interesting angle, and may well explain why Conan said that Crom gave strength at birth. I hadn't considered the possibility that he was specifically a fertility god, but it makes sense for the reasons you suggest. It also helps to explain the contrast with the gods of the southern nations, where life was easier. Good thoughts! Thank you!

[@tonyb7615]

@TheAtlanteanArchive well maybe not a full blown fertility god but maybe an evolution from one. Cimmereia is on the fringes of habitable hyborea. I pictured crom sitting on his mountain like a husband that goes and bangs on stuff in a garage to get away from the constant pestering of his family. He did the things now let him have his me time. He gave you what you needed to survive and if you didn't equip yourself correctly it ain't on him. And cimmerian women being much more on an equal footing to the running of the village and everyday life, instead of being pampered or subjugated like most everywhere else, was also croms gift. The tools to survive were given. In a place where mere survival was harshest, the very things conan discovers and hates in humanity and civilization are only possible due to "1st world problems". When the southern countries have life so easily, they need to find ways to muck it up. Like in the matrix when Anderson explains to morpheus about creating a utopia for humanity and humanity rejecting it because it's in our nature to put ourselves into as much strife as possible at almost every turn.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@tonyb7615 It's certainly a recurring theme in science-fiction. In one episode of Star Trek, Kirk says that man was meant to scratch and claw his way along, that he wasn't meant for paradise. Just about every sci-fi story I've ever read or watched where humanity is enjoying some sort of golden age also depicts man as lapsing into apathy and even regressing.

[@caesarmendez6782]

Well thanks for this video. Cimmerian-September is long over, so is October Lovecraft-Ober?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

So far, it's Fall-Behind-Ober, as I haven't gotten the videos done that I wanted to do! Real life intrudes again, unfortunately. A Lovecraft emphasis month would be fun, though!

[@temmy9]

the warhammer god Khorne was directly inspired by Crom

[@jackwilliamson1929]

Finns book on REH is a good one. Robert died way too young, and probably some of his hopelessness stemmed from living in Abilene. If he had just moved to Austin, things might have been different. He certainly produced some great stories, maybe even some of the best the world will ever see right up there with Beowulf. I hope somewhere he's enjoying the success he's earned.

[@longtsun8286]

Well said.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@JohnMinehan-lx9ts]

Howard was raised as a Protestant, and his ancestors were probably Presbyterian and Catholic. The Scots and the Irish tend to have a strong and fatalistic faith in G-d, who gives you Grace . . . or not.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yes, Calvinistic determinism.

[@prophetofbeans6781]

CROM-mandments 10/10

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

😄

[@jamespfp]

13:40 -- RE: Crom v. the 23rd Psalm; I think the 20th century has done a disservice to most people who think about things like organized religion because it modernized the use of language even more than the King James version of the Bible 400 years prior to it. To wit: the word "Blessing" does not mean something which is universally Good at all times and places and for all people. In French, "blesse" means a Wound; see also the Old Testament story of Jacob wrestling with the angels, in which he is simultaneously the winner but also permanently wounded. Crom, if anything, seems to be described as something more akin to the modern idea of a blind watchmaker who is also capricious at times, if only because it is ambivalent towards the humans who continue to bother him.

[@jamespfp]

^^ To put it another way, Crom can be in no way construed as being like a Shepherd, and that's the symbolic linkage for the rod and the staff. To put it another way, the business of a shepherd is to Domesticate a flock; and Crom does not necessarily care for domestication. See also: Habituation.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@jamespfp I appreciate your thoughts here. In line with that, the "rod and staff" imagery associated with the shepherd can involve treatment of the sheep that may seem harsh ("tough love" in the modern parlance). The psalmist writes in appreciation of it anyway, for he deems it to be for his good. Crom lacks any such instincts or motivations.

[@sargonixofur1234]

No god helped Howard with his struggles. And is Cimmeria so different to the empty plains of Texas (although a lot colder)? Crom is a personification of an indifferent universe in which only the strong (Howard) can survive and strive. And like Conan, Howard ultimately succumbed to his doom and became a legend. RIP Robert E Howard, what could you have created with another 30 years?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I would so love to know what an older, more mature and experienced Howard would have written, and how he would have reflected on his earlier efforts.

[@sargonixofur1234]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive I agree, I always think it is such a shame that both Howard and his pal Lovecraft died in the ways they did, and well before their respective times. Within a year of each other too. Both deserved to see more recognition in their lifetimes and to experience a little of the legacy they helped create. But maybe their demons made them what they were as writers?

[@rustyshackleford9588]

While I like the comparison to the eye of Sauron, I also know he was once and angel. I don’t believe KZbin fell. It crawled up out of something he expelled.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

LOL! Yes, I think it was a demon spawn.

[@JohnBrett715]

Cimmerians in general are described as crying out the name of Crom like an epithet or curse, never in reverence.

[@aquarius5719]

Robert Howard seem to have taken names of lost civilizations and made a mashup. It is like hearing about the Bermuda triangle and Eiffel tower and randomly create a land where the tower watches ships disappear. This is the level of mashup Conan stories has.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Howard, Lovecraft, and Clark Ashton Smith did a lot of research and adapted what they found in the creation of their worlds.

[@aquarius5719]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive Indeed theosophy offers a rich world of fiction with Helena Petrona Blavatsky's The Secret Doctrine (TSD). TSD is supposed to be "spiritual archeology" and it mentions one primitive race of humans, the lemurs, who lived in the lost continent of Lemuria located between Madagascar an India. Indeed in Madagascar and India there are some animals called lemurs. Probably Blavatsky thought that it would be cool to imagine a lost continent as the bridge between both, and since these were remote lands in 19th century, and sea bottom was a mystery, then no one would fact check her. But then Alfred Wegener proposed the theory of continental drift which brought lots of resistance from scientists. After all it would render papers obsolete,band who was this Wegener, a simple meteorologist in Iceland to propose something expert geologists did not propose. After WWII when sea bottom was mapped in low resolution (one pixel is more than 3 miles wide) which we have today, it became evident Wegener was right. Under continental drift, India, once attached to Madagascar, moved to its current position. It means no lost continent. Also, there is a lack of interest of theosophy to visit Richat structure, a place in Mauritania that fits all the descriptions of Plato. 23 miles wide concentric circles, salt shows it had sea from water, mountains in the north, an opening to the sea in the south, and stones made of 3 colors that locals use to build houses today. You can see it in Google Earth. There is not such huge structure under the sea in the Atlantic or Mediterranean sea. Even with 3+ miles resolution you should see at least a blurry patch of these circles but no. There is nothing like that in sea bottom maps. Richat structure even shows signs of water flow in the sand and the wavy dunes you see in the bottom of a water flow. These dunes are miles wide, suggesting a truly cataclysmic water flow. TSD had its chance to find something science could not. Instead it went the path of fiction, and the universe loves to prove humans wrong. I understand followers of theosophy. TSD is such dense reading with unfamiliar jargon and names organized in a timeline of spirits and physical manifestations that outshines LOTR. But facts prove it is fiction. It would be cool to think that ancient ones buried pyramids to protect them from the evil corruption of pagan Turanian mobs that defiled sculptures and wall inscriptions to add sexual themes, and devastated civilizations. Probably franchises like Star Wars got inspired too by adding the Yuuzan Vong, the world enders civilization. But to be honest they seem too underpowered and primitive to face powerful Jedis. I understand why people want TSD to be historical. It is a great fiction book.

[@TheStrayHALOMAN]

He's really similar to Molag Bal from the elder scrolls.

[@dexocube]

I've got that exact same edition of Conan the Conqueror the video opened with. They'll have to prise it from my cold dead hands I tell ye.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Yeah, I would definitely hold on to that!

[@JustSomeGoy]

Crom is my favorite man made God.

[@Lowlandlord]

I have always loved that quote, about life and it's contents being illusionary, the concept of reality being relative to one's self! Interesting in relation to Einstein's Special Theory of Relativity, which was pretty contemporary, and stuff like Buddhism or the Matrix. It's also interesting that he may have based some of Crom off of the Irish god Cromm Cruach, who has some similarities, maybe. Limited verifiable knowledge on the god, less 100 years ago and more speculation probably? Howard's Cimmerians were apparently influenced to some degree by the real Cimmerians, who were thought to be a Celtic people at the time (in reality they were probably some branch of Iranian people, like the Sarmatians and Scythians they lived near). The algorithm suggested this other video on Cromm while I was watching this, not sure about the accuracy, but parts are probably not too dissimilar from what Howard would have had access to during his lifetime. Maybe an interesting perspective. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aXu8eZ97ja9orac

[@KirksCountDownsM]

BRO THE BEGINING BACKGROUND MUSIC PLEASE

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@KirksCountDownsM 🔻 "Miguel Johnson - A New Dawn" is under a Creative Commons (CC BY 3.0) license. / migueljohnson migueljohnson....​ Music promoted by BreakingCopyright: • 🌑 Dark (Royalty Free Music) - "A NEW ... 🔺

[@amelialonelyfart8848]

Interestingly, some real-world religions for people who live in similarly desolate, harsh lands have gods not too disimilar to Crom. I've read that the Itelmens, a Siberian people, have a god who doesn't seem to 'have a cult', he created the world... but he did a shitty job at it, which is why life in Siberia sucks. His wife on the other hand is more respected.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Interesting! I'll look that up.

[@abrahemsamander3967]

That’s fascinating. Kinda combines the sky father creator with the Mother Earth goddess. Sky father is a deadbeat, but mother is loved.

[@dragonchaserkev]

Check out my audio version of the first Conan story, Phoenix on the Sword, it has a pretty stellar voice cast.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Sounds good. Do you have a link?

[@taffy9966]

Ok so attempting to start reading the Conan books in order but google keeps telling me different books are the first book,any idea which is the actual first Conan book to start with? Thanks

[@mikegrossberg8624]

You might have to be more specific about WHICH "first book" you're looking for. Is it the first book by publication date, or the first in Conan's TIMELINE?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

The Del Ray books have them in order, I believe. Check out volume one here: a.co/d/40i7eKR

[@taffy9966]

@@mikegrossberg8624 first in timeline that tells Conan saga from the beginning thanks

[@aquarius5719]

If they make a bad Red Sonja movie, Crom will come for them.😂😂😂

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

My apologies for the late reply here but I never received notification of your comment. Oh, it's probably inevitable at some point! Good movies are the exception these days. I almost immediately expect things to be bad.

[@Noonien96-nx6yj]

Do a reading of Red Nails.

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

I can try to do that sometime.

[@AtZero138]

CROM!!!

[@alanschaub147]

Crommandments! 😂

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

😄

[@mikegrossberg8624]

I honestly don't know whether I read it somewhere, or it came out of my OWN imagination, but in a story I wrote, with a Conanesque protagonist, when HE'S questioned about whether he prays to HIS tutelary deity, he says "A WISE man calls on the gods only TWICE; with his FIRST breath, and his LAST!"

[@NotMyGumDropButtons.444]

Also CROM laughs at your four winds

[@jasonsantos3037]

Crom is the most interesting God in Robert E Howard's work He is the type of God to tell you do it that's your problem and you do it yourself and why he sees prayers as a sign of weakness.

[@4everseekingwisdom690]

What about Mitra?

[@thomaszonkowski2115]

What book did the intro verse come from?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

It's from Robert E Howard's Conan story "Queen of the Black Coast."

[@greg61377]

helping yah out with sub, plus i like conan

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thank you!

[@Magneticlaw]

"The illusion is real to me," - tough luck, Matrix dweebs.

[@gregoryl.levitre9759]

As with any Author- there are bits of the Authors in their characters, but Mr. Howard created Conan to be specifically something he could write for a paycheck as an ongoing pulp series, so there are only small bits of him in Conan (and the other characters of The Hyborian Age) and his developmental choices were made to be purposely over-the-top to satisfy Readers of the pulp medium, so I do not think there is much Howard in Conan and what is there is certainly exaggerated. Also- Howard didn't have a gloomy outlook in real life, he saw how gloomy the real world truly is and he saw monsters with immense power preying on normal people. The real world is a dystopian world in which powers that are unknown to many people on the planet are warring around the normal people. Mr. Lovecraft also understood this, as did Mr. Tolkien.

[@natmanprime4295]

the way he writes, i bet robert howard is as white as snow. and that little monologue at the beginning is exactly the kind of philosophy that philosophers love to flirt with. and it seems he wasnt a man who had his "barbarian" way with many women either, only one girlfriend apparently. conan is how robert E. Howard wishes he was, the total opposite. confident and strong tanned barbarian, not a pasty agnostic writer.

[@natmanprime4295]

its projection, he's projecting his unconscious values onto the enemies of conan

[@violenceislife1987]

🔥

[@differous01]

The creator of Sumer, Enki, also created Enki-du, the Wild Man, to struggle against "the powers of organised civilization" [7:35]: Gilgamesh. If Enkidu = Made by Enki, then Conan = Howard-du. Where "God is dead! ... What sacred games must we invent? Must we not become gods to appear worthy of the task?"

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Nietzsche, from "The Gay Science." His Parable of the Madman.

[@HellbirdIV]

I'm just going to leave a comment for the algorithm to reward you for the pun "Ten Crommandments".

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@HellbirdIV LOL. Thank you!

[@caseybranton812]

What is crom all about

[@rayramos8435]

Wasn't there a Bulgar king named Crom as well?

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

This is all I could find on that: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krum?wprov=sfla1

[@rayramos8435]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive awesome thanks! When I was reading Byzantine Roman history I came across that name and immediately thought of Conan!

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@@rayramos8435 Yep, it's very similar!

[@matcheer9909]

Say Crom like Homer Simpson ?

[@carlkim2577]

Didn't Conan call upon crom for free will in one story? And it worked. He was freed of the binding spell and killed the sorcerer.

[@daneyraju8433]

Crom is the personification of agnosticism....i knews Robert was agnostic by his alter ego conan...conans believes are Roberts believes... Even i who was born in india had dreams of mediaeval knights battle... I felt home in Europe... Thing is i think i can understand robert because we have some similarities regarding the outlook of life...

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

Thanks for the feedback. Yes, Robert E. Howard's philosophy comes through clearly in his Conan tales, among others. He felt like a man out of time.

[@daneyraju8433]

@@TheAtlanteanArchive same with me...also my parents were married late and had children late,so I'm really out of time... Means my father's friends have kids who are in their 45s.. Am 28😂😂so I really out of time

[@TheAtlanteanArchive]

@daneyraju8433 Yeah, that's quite a gap. In junior high, I knew a girl whose oldest brother was older than her stepmom.

[@31minutesago]

Crom don't give AF