Customers Claim Warranty Companies Refuse to Pay Out

[@machintelligence]

Two things warranty companies excel at: collecting premiums and denying claims.

[@timdowney6721]

Much like health insurance. Though they deny treatment.

[@sabertoothduck]

I’m calling you concerning your vehicles extended warranty

[@Serai3]

Replace "warranty" with "insurance" and you'll be equally correct.

[@craigiefconcert6493]

It makes sense. These are the only two sides of the equation they can control to make more money. Find a way to get more and find a way to give less.

[@frazzledfishing7042]

If it says they'll pay its probably BS. They don't make money by paying out for claims, just getting you to pay them IMO.

[@randolphscudder2372]

Take the payment the extended warranty company wants and put it into a savings account instead and only use it for major repairs. You'll have better odds of being able to afford a repair.

[@Thouston]

Hell as much as some of these companies charge there's a decent chance your savings for that will be able to buy you a new car before you need to even use it for a repair!

[@IHguy]

Best idea I’ve seen so far.

[@TheOnespeedbiker]

There would be no profit to the insurer if is was to the fiscal advantage of an insured to buy insurance. It only makes sense if the cost is based on a probable large liability pay out, such as auto insurance, but not in the case of most extended warranties. First the odds of using an extended warranty is low, which is why they are so profitable and second, as I mentioned elsewhere, if you make a claim you are immediately thrust into an adversarial relationship. As recommend here, you would be better off banking the premiums and if the cost of the repair is more than you saved, taking out a loan, as the payments on the loan, even with interest, would likely be less than the worthless extended warranty premiums. Further you would be able to choose how you want the repair done, as many extended warranty companies will force the mechanic to use used or inferior parts to lessen their payout.

[@schrodingerszombie2401]

I used to sell on commission for an Audio-Video retailer. I refused to sell extended warranties. They were considered 100% profit and we were given a 40% commission. This was when I learned that you are far better off to put that money in an account and save it.

[@jamescaron6465]

I do that for a lot of things including dental bills

[@zang9147]

I purchased an extended warranty on my son's guitar from Guitar Center. When the guitar electronics failed, Guitar Center told me they didn't cover it because I bought an extended warranty. The warranty company told me they didn't cover it because it was not yet past the initial (Guitar Center) warranty period. It was only a $250 guitar, so I wouldn't be suing anyone. I watched a couple of Louis Rossmann videos on soldering, then opened the guitar, found the disconnected wire, and re-soldered it.

[@noth606]

Guitar center is in the wrong in this case, the seller HAS to cover it if it was bought new and within the mandatory warranty period by law. Additional warranties have nothing to do with it. I would simply have grabbed another equivalent guitar and left them the broken one.

[@GreenAppelPie]

Extended warranties kick in after the original warranty. Period.

[@jimk8520]

Thank you for having the determination to fix it instead of throwing it away. This is exactly why a national right to repair act needs to be passed and made law. The sooner the better.

[@d.townzen1337]

Learning how to work on guitar electronics is a great skill to have. It's saved me so much money over the years. Even built my own guitar a few years ago. Glad you were able to get things working again.

[@billh.1940]

If everyone who got burned by companies ganged up on them, they would change. Just take them to small claims court. They will be overwhelmed by suits, legal fees will be over whelming . Make them pay!! Plaster this story all over net!

[@nolongeramused8135]

Extended vehicle warranties have been a scam since long before I was born. Hell, my depression-era parents warned me about them.

[@Maximara]

Same here though my depression-era parents had that view _all_ extended warranties - the issuers would find some BS reason not to honor it. Ironically the only time they did get one the company and store went out of business and so couldn't honor it.

[@eduardocruz4341]

I always had an extended warranty on all my vehicles from the car companies either included in the car payments or separately when it was allowed since my wife didn't want to pay interest on it especially if it was included in the car payment in our earlier car purchases. The last was a third party (Allstate) through the dealership. I got my money's worth from them...lol

[@jamescaron6465]

@@eduardocruz4341 you are buying your warranty from a reputable source. Warranty providers are not equal.

[@oldgysgt]

Back in the days when people fixed their TVs, my mother's aunt got "picture tube" insurance on her new color TV from the store she bought it from. She paid the insurance for over 10 years, and sure enough, her picture tube failed, and the store replaced it, HOWEVER, over the years she had paid enough money for the instance to buy 2 new complete color TV sets.

[@Maximara]

@@oldgysgt *THAT* is why these extended warranties are a waste of money. "The extended warranty offered by your credit card typically adds up to a year of additional coverage to eligible purchases. It mirrors the terms of the original manufacturer’s warranty - for example, if the original warranty covers only manufacturing defects, then the extended warranty will do the same."

[@timothyriggins]

Infinite Auto Protection in Michigan has been issued a Notice of Intended Action by the MI Attorney General. Not just for refusing to pay auto repairs but also for not refunding customers after the contracts were canceled.

[@SouthwestD313]

Nessel will fuck it up like everything else she touches

[@jacqueslefave4296]

She's s just grandstanding for her re-election. If she wins, she'll settle it for court costs and maybe an apology. Auto dealers, especially, contribute heavily to political campaigns, it's protection money.🤑💰💲🛐❤️

[@SouthwestD313]

@@jacqueslefave4296 *she

[@jacqueslefave4296]

@@SouthwestD313 Yes, I edited it accordingly. Thanks.

[@darrennew8211]

I bought a 10-year 3rd party warranty on an old video camera. I kept the card in the box with the camera. Camera failed after like 8 years, so I tried to get service, went to their web site, the number on the card wasn't even the right size for the input box. So I phoned them up, and they were like "Wow, you still have that? That's amazing!" And then they fixed the camera. But clearly they count on people who break their crap losing the paper you're required to turn in when you get service.

[@IHguy]

Years ago, the local dealer had talked my sister into buying an “extended warranty” for the used car she was buying from them. The car itself was a low mileage rental trade in from a large rental fleet. The car developed a problem where it would idle too low, and would frequently stall when you put it in gear. We took it to the dealer and the diagnosis was bad throttle position sensor. Contact warranty company and they say “that’s not a powertrain component - not covered.” The one thing the dealer did right by us was they figured out that the car was still below the mileage cutoff for the factory warranty, however, it was out of warranty by time… five days ago. They changed the date on the paperwork so they could tell the manufacturer that it was still under warranty when we dropped it off for repairs and the manufacturer covered it. I’m certain that they did this because they didn’t want to lose our business as everyone in the family had bought at least one car from them, but that day is where I learned that most of those “extended warranties” aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on.

[@IHguy]

@Richard Cranium that was pretty much my comment at the time, which sparked the dealer looking into whether or not there was another solution to this problem because they apparently already knew they weren’t going to get anywhere arguing with the warranty company.

[@vinces8209]

It might sound petty, but I'd go back in a month or so later and seem interested in something they have on the lot and find out if they are still selling a warranty from that company, if they are flat out tell them you will never be back, vote with your wallet, if they chose to put making money off a service that's bull they don't deserve to be in business.

[@justme5384]

In Finland you can still claim warranty within a reasonable time after the warranty has ended as long as the problem began during warranty. Say you have a device that breaks down and goes out of warranty when you're away, you can then file for warranty once you get home. I think it was within a month you need to file for warranty. Best of course in this day and age would be to shoot an email to the company explaining you have a broken down device within warranty but won't be able to send it in until you get home

[@orppranator5230]

@Richard Cranium To be fair, the power train is generally used to refer to the spinning mechanical components.

[@orppranator5230]

@Richard Cranium True

[@davidrobertson5700]

I have never ever had a warranty claim honoured for anything, laptop broke, told the call centre I used it to read emails. They called it "overuse " Any warranty is bs

[@kmatch1]

My recommendation as a lifetime mechanic and shop owner was to take the price of the warranty and put it in a savings account. Never buy a warranty. If repairs are never needed keep it and add to it with the next purchase. If repairs are needed MANY times this amount will cover it. Zero hassle. Zero chance of a claim being denied.

[@robertsmith2956]

Same with medical bills. You can pay cash for major surgery every 18 months cheaper than obamacare premiums.

[@FoxTenson]

I've encountered this with Home Depot with a stove that went bad in 2 years. They sent someone out who wasn't a repairman who took pictures then said they denied my claim and the warranty was null...because there was a spider behind the stove and they said bug damage isn't covered and its neglect. Arguing and store manager raising hell got them to PARTLY pay for an actual repairman to come out and check the stove and said I'd have to pay it back if it was bug damages. Nope it was a faulty part causing a short. Repair costs were almost $800 which was basically almost the cost of a new stove. At that point there were SUPPOSED to replace it but they said no, just get it repaired and they will pay for after I send them to bill and paid for it. I'm disabled with low income so I had to scrape extra cash and sell things just to have a working stove, assuming I'd get the money back. Sent the bill and suddenly no calls from them, no responses, only voice mail box, no email responses. Store manager couldn't get them to return calls about my warranty but he could other people's. I had to borrow money from people just to keep myself fed. Months go by with no response so a legal letter got drawn up and sent to them demanding payment. They didn't respond. More got sent and threats of small claims court. No response. Tried to file and we got a response they would counter sue if I did and I'd have to travel across the country to their state to fight it. Lawyer who was helping me out said I'd have to pay legal fees in that state even if I won, plus the travel expenses, hotel fees, losing work, etc. Even if they had no case I had no recourse against them if they lost. There was literally nothing I could do because they had money and could game the system. I now avoid home depot warranties like the scum they are, I have never had an issue with lowes, yet. The store manager did try his best to help me but their warranties come from third parties despite being under their name. Scam artists all around and I wish something could be done about them. Throw the scum in jail I say and make them pay out of pocket to make their victims right again.

[@theupscriber65]

Bugs can cause electrical shorts.

[@davidroberts9099]

Call the attorney generals office in your state. Let them know your disabled and explain they threatened to sue you. They may be able to help.

[@al1383]

Home warranty companies are the worse. As a small business owner, hvac and plumbing, I use to do warranty work. Had to stop because every customer would end up getting pissed off because the warranty company didn't cover what the homeowner thought they would. I got tired of being in the middle of all the BS. Plus, the warranty companies don't pay shiiit. They expect the business to up charge the homeowner for other work to make a profit. Not worth the headache

[@Garth2011]

There are ways for contractors to work with home warranties however, in general, they are more of a pain than they are worth. Problem is, those warranty claims people think different when it comes to repairs. Once you learn how they figure out claims processing, you will succeed. They don't respond to repairs like any typical customer/client would and have their own methods for repairs and replacements. Most of the time when there are issues, its just best to ask for where it says this or that in their policies and ask them to show it to you. Most of the time they can't. I think I heard recently they won't pay for refrigerants if there are leaks but if a "covered part" failed first then the leak, its covered. Stupid stuff like that...HVAC just need to know how to build their estimates correctly to make them pay. Forget logic...use their system and they will pay most of the time. One thing though, do put all eggs in their basket if you get a lot of work from them because there will be a day that they change their "territories" or other internal changes such as employees and its likely it could take your company off their list in a matter of minutes. Always have a shop based client list.

[@kenbrown2808]

if it's age related, they say they don't cover normal wear. if it's a defect, they say they only cover normal wear. I've only ever seen one case where the warranty company was willing to pay out.

[@johniwan1]

My 1992 Chevy S10 Blazer had a transmission failure while driving on a highway and it caused a fire in the engine compartment. I saved the vehicle by dumping one of those giant orange drink coolers full of water on the engine. My extended warranty covered the transmission failure and paid for a new one, but DIDN'T cover fires or the damage done by the failed part! Still cost me another $4k for the rewire and other bits that got fried. The only thing those third party warranties are good for is making money for the dealer.

[@robertkeefer1552]

From now on if I get these warranty calls, I'll tell them "Let me talk to Steve Lehto and I'll get back to you"

[@robertsmith2956]

I used to have sequential numbers. As soon as I hang up, the other line rings. Oh THANK GOD, I changed my mind when I hung up on you. then hang up again.

[@rodgersrcaviation2785]

As a 24 yr automotive technician I. An honestly say. All of the extended warranties are garbage.

[@eric3215]

I looked into Car Shield once. They were really pressuring me to sign up during the phone call. I asked if they could send me a written copy of the warranty and they said no. It was their ‘policy’ to sign customers up on the first phone call. I hung up.

[@Le_Comte_de_Monte_Felin]

$110/month for an 'extended warranty'?!?!? WTF? Put $100/month in the bank for repairs, spend the other $10/mo on pizza and call it a day! Vehicle breaks down - you order pizza & pull money from savings to fix it while you watch ball-games in your shorts.

[@robertsmith2956]

Cash doesn't' even care if your ex drove it off the pier on purpose.

[@linuxgurugamer]

Why am I not surprised? I get 1-3 calls every day from robocallers about extended warranties. I usually ask them why I need a warranty since I don't own a car.

[@pauls5745]

it's a lot of fun messing with telemarketers if you have time to waste. let them do their pitch ask a couple questions, then ask the hard questions and watch them squirm and hem about haha

[@SeanBZA]

I just reply I have an 02 Cadillac, and if they will cover it, and when they ask the details i tell them it is a 1902 model, mostly original, and still has the original wooden wheels, but no electrics other than magneto ignition, and the headlights are acetylene lamps converted to run off kerosene.

[@radicalrick9587]

*I wouldn't be surprised if they told you, because it's required(never mind the fact that you don't own a car).* 🤣

[@darrennew8211]

@@SeanBZA I tell them I'm driving a Toyota Volt.

[@GreenAppelPie]

This has been going on for 10+ years and CarShield has a 1.37/5 Star review and a grade of F from BBB. I have yet to understand why a government consumer protection entity hasn't stepped up and done their job.

[@pauls5745]

i remember seeing their commercial and was happy that it seemed they would cover my '98 Pontiac despite high miles. then i poured over the warranty and see it looks good on the surface but details buried in it basically declare they won't repair anything other than a headlight it seems

[@leadpoisoning717]

FTC moves at the speed of molasses when acting on behalf of consumers

[@timdowney6721]

Think “Citizens United” which opened the floodgates for corporate bribes of politicians.

[@joealbert7773]

When I was a service manager at a dealership I got involved with these extended warranty companies. Typically it was for a long time customer on a old car they had or a customer who bought a used car from us and purchased one of these warranties. The first couple of times I spent a lot of time jumping through all the hoops the warranty company put me through. I did refuse to install used parts they were going to provide. They also always wanted a discount on parts and labor. I finally told customers that I would perform the repairs, bill them (the customer) and let the customer deal with their warranty company.

[@andyking9673]

At my shop I quit dealing with the warranty companies many years ago---they are a scam. One of the biggest was in my city 30 years ago---the owner had to flee to some island and has never been heard from again

[@mikeworkman3593]

We did the same at are dealer. They made our manager jump through hoops, her finally told the customers that they had to fight them for money.

[@EngageYourFrontalLobe]

If (& only if) the Customer purchased the extended warranty from the dealership, then the dealership should be the ones to deal w/ the warranty company.

[@joealbert7773]

True, if we sold it, I had to deal with. However, I convinced the general manager to quit selling anything but Chrysler extended warranties; we were a Dodge dealership. That solved a big headache. @@EngageYourFrontalLobe

[@TheStevehuff]

I bought an extended warranty or a service contract on a used car I bought years ago at Budget Car Sales. I had to put in a claim on the warranty and I had issues getting the warranty company to pay for my vehicle to get fixed. They gave me all sorts of excuses and they even blamed the mechanic for not getting proper authorization to begin the work on my vehicle. So I called my state attorney or what ever government agency in my state regulates extended warranties in my state and I explained the situation to them and they were able to help me get my car fixed and get the warranty company to pay for it. Because after that phone call. I got a call from the warranty company telling me that they were going to authorize payment for my car to be fixed.

[@corssecurity]

Had a friend got one of those calls and said sure I'd love to discuss a package. Everything the salesman was selling he said he was interested in. So the call gets to the details. Ok what is the make and model of your car. He answers 65 Buick.

[@gottago9824]

same with my 72 land cruiser. LOL

[@v6turbo231]

I told one I drove a trabant. Didn’t phase them till I told them it was older than 2008. Lost interest real quick

[@robertsmith2956]

I WANT to drive drunk, just to watch them try to hook those breathalyzer disablers to my 69 beetle. LOL

[@tigerman99515]

Worse still are the Home Warranty companies. I had one on a rental property I owned and I had a property manager managing the property. The property manager highly recommended I get that warranty. Over the 7 years I owned the property, we had 3 claims for which they paid nothing. Garage door, bad washing machine and water leakage - got nothing. The real scam was everytime they was a minor repair (curtain rod breaks, leaking faucet, etc), the warranty company was notified by the manager, the repair was made, we got charged for a 'deductible' AND the property manager got a cut! Unbelievable.

[@_PatrickO]

lolwut? Home warranties are for homes you purchased, not rentals. Your property manager scammed you hard. It was his job to get quotes and go with reasonable bids. He used the warranty company as a "service" to call random repair companies without any price vetting. He doubly screwed you so he could do less work.

[@darrennew8211]

@@_PatrickO "On a rental property I owned." He was the landlord. I had a similar situation. Air conditioner went out. "Sorry, it'll be a week in the middle of August in Arizona before we can fix it, and it's legally required you fix it tomorrow."

[@onlythewise1]

corruption is a way of life in a bad system like America .

[@darrennew8211]

@@onlythewise1 Sadly, it didn't used to be.

[@jblyon2]

@@darrennew8211 I have friends in AZ with a home warranty. It was nearly a week in the middle of summer, and that was only after a friend who was a VP at Carrier called a colleague in a similar position at the warranty company!

[@jwilkers1]

As a technician/ service advisor we've started having customers pay and then seek reimbursement from their warranty company because the company will waste unbillable time on the phone only to deny the claim. I had one customer who paid over $300/month have claims denied. It is a scam plain and simple.

[@lawrencearnemann3923]

My 84 year old mother in law was tricked into this. We all chipped in for a new car 2 years ago. After she had some health issues, we took over her bills and discovered this charge. Car has under 3k miles

[@alfavulcan4518]

Yep. Took my at the time 91 year old father in law to get his last new car. Hardly ever drove but just wanted to be able to. The salesman started talking about 10 yr, 100k mile extended warranties when I just started laughing

[@hollafront47]

Warranties are often regulated by your state department of insurance. If they are violating policy terms, you can go to the DOI to help force a resolution. The other option, get a lawyer, sue them for bad faith claims handling, get your contractual money alongside punitive damages.

[@frotoe9289]

The warranty companies tell you in big bold letters THIS IS NOT INSURANCE!!!!! They are scared to death of state insurance regulators. I don't know if they meet the legal definition of insurance, but it sure feels like it to me.

[@roycsinclair]

I'm on the Do Not Call list. Therefore ANY of those calls I receive are in violation of the law so entering into a financial relationship with anyone who is that willing to break the law would be a very bad idea because it's obvious that the calling company has questionable ethics.

[@glennstiller7616]

I had a service plan from a third party and they had a clause that they could use used parts at their discretion. Trans went out and they had no problem having the trans shop replace it with a USED transmission. OK, didn't even make it off the hoist, used part was no good. Wrecking yard sent another under their warranty, also no good. 5 transmissions later had one that worked. Warranty company had to pay all the labor for r&r of all the transmissions. Shop owner just shook his head and told me they ended up paying more in labor plus a used transmission than it would have cost to just put in a rebuilt off the shelf. 🤣

[@shawbros]

Well, at least they weeded those bad transmissions out of the pipeline.

[@FORTRAN4ever]

I was looking at the GM manufacturer's service contract. There was a exclusion for replacing seals and gaskets such that replacing a covered component that requires removal and installation of a replacement component involves replacing a seal or gasket. I can see why that limitation is included in the contract as I have experienced faulty factory installed seals and gaskets in GM vehicles. I bought a new GM truck a couple of decades ago and Included with the purchase a new GM truck was the new vehicle protection plan (GMPP) which just about covered everything . By the way, that option went away at the same time when GM declared bankruptcy. With a few miles left on the service contract, I took the vehicle to an independent mechanic and he found a laundry list of issues that needed attention including a leaky rear main engine seal. I drove the truck to my local Chevrolet dealer and left it there. I got a free rental car and per the servicec contract and when the tell allocated to use the rental expired, the dealer continued paying for the rental car. It was in the shop for at least three weeks.. I was allowed into the shop and saw the mechanic begin work on replacing the rear main engine seal. He did not look like a happy camper. I assumed he was also replacing the oil pan gasket as well. The cost of the service contract paid for itself several time over. By the way. he deductable was $50 for each shop visit.

[@napalmstickylikeglue]

I got one of those extended warranties for one of my commercial vehicles. Specifically shopped for a company that would cover my vehicle. Made sure they knew it was a commercial vehicle. When it came to getting them to cover a repair, they lied and claimed I never told them it was commercial. I tried to cancel it and they tried to make me go to a notary and send them inform to cancel it. Had to have my attorney send a letter to them threating legal action if they charged me a monthly payment again. Never heard from them again. Someone needs to start going after these companies.

[@kgroombr]

I purchased an extended warranty from the dealership I purchased my new car from. They basically told me that it will cover everything like the original factory warranty except wear and tear items. I recently took my car in for a repair under the extended warranty and was concerned when them told me that the warranty company had to approve of the repair. They did approve it, but it is concerning that the company can just say "no". Had I known that they could just say "no" for any reason I would have thought twice about the extended warranty.

[@badge315]

I maintain that any warranty that you have to purchase is not actually a warranty, but rather an insurance policy.

[@scottr2706]

And you are wrong. It is neither a warranty nor an insurance policy. It is an extended service contract with considerable small print.

[@Raven0047]

My mom had a lot of trouble with that company. They called pitching home insurance and mom told them no. Later I noticed they had been withdrawing $300 per month from her bank account. I called and disputed it. Shield said that my moms bank authorized it after my mom told them she wasn’t interested. I was able to recover some of the money but not all.

[@nzobrist6525]

I had a friend who worked for one of those extended warranty companies inspecting the cars. He would recommend the repairs and the warranty company would deny the claim.

[@radicalrick9587]

*I've gotten in the mail and seen ads from Car Sheild promising you the world. You know, too good to be true. I just throw it in the shredder.*

[@jocrp6]

I was a tech at a repair shop when BMW came in needing a water pump, Girl had just bought car, was used, Think she had car 2 days, warranty company say's it was a preexisting condition and would not cover it.

[@praegaming4040]

I've been dealing with a "home warranty" company for my parents, them refusing a repair that they did not review correctly and went silent when I told them if they didn't complete the repair as their contracted to. I've since had the repair completed, and confirmed their findings incorrect, and have gone to arbitration after two months of attempts to resolve prior. So, a ~$500 repair has now cost them a couple thousand dollars with my filing.

[@shorttimer874]

Quite a few decades ago there was a transmission shop, part of a well known national brand that advertised free inspections, but am guessing a franchise, that I would tow the occasional car out of with the transmission in pieces in a box. Customers would tell me that while the inspection was free, reassembly afterwards was not.

[@Orchardman53]

Same problem here in the UK. I had a manufacturer extended warranty from Audi on a low mileage car for "named parts". When a problem arose with the named component the insurers claimed "wear and tear" and they refused to pay. From Audi's point of view a very poor decision because I've since refused to buy any car from the VAG group such as Audi. It has cost them, and the local dealership, a lot of money.

[@lmr691]

great info, I see car shield ads A LOT and wondered if company was really fulfilling warranty promises.Glad to hear this video!thank you for bringing attention for consumers.

[@pauls5745]

car shield is notable because they are the biggest, but if you look up reviews, 100's of sad tales from buyers who got shafted by ridiculous exclusions in the contract that are often vague enough to allow a bad actor to exploit

[@jamesgeorge4874]

Better off putting what you would spend on a warranty, in a savings account, that you also deposit $10 a week in, then use that money to properly maintain your vehicle.

[@robertsmith2956]

Well at least we got that question answered. Needed an engine AND a transmission. Who does that? Well not car shield LOL Last time I needed a transmission, I bought one at junk yard for $225. As a bonus, the speed sensor is way out of whack, so I now get 12 miles to the tank of gas. So I am ready for democrats mileage tax. and thanks to the manufacturer refusing to release the programming info, it will never read right.

[@jamesgeorge4874]

@@robertsmith2956 you got the wrong transmission. A sensor either works, or does not. Especially a 4T65E trans, there are several different final drive, and transfer ratios.

[@robertsmith2956]

@@jamesgeorge4874 No it was the pickup sensor. computer needs to be reprogrammed. That they mounted it from the inside of transmission told me they don't want the right one swapped. Stupid since it has a cover over it, but you can't remove it without breaking open the case.. rpm's still where they belong when driving.

[@EvrttGrn]

I ran into this issue on my last financed vehicle from a dealership where they required me to finance a 3rd party warranty into the price and when I had an issue, it was denied because I didn't have the oil changed and routine services done at one of "their approved" service centers. The closest one was about a 2 hour drive one way.

[@karlrovey]

The "approved" service center requirement is generally illegal.

[@jblyon2]

@@karlrovey These warranty companies don't give a crap about what is generally illegal. They have more than enough customers who don't know any better to offset any costs incurred due to illegal activity. The penalties for companies when they do illegal things are usually a small fraction of the profit they made from said illegal activity.

[@beakt]

We've bought four new Subarus, and got the extended warranty through Subaru for 10 years covering almost everything for like $1,000. It's been worth it. I think we got a shorter term this last purchase, and my wife had her 2019 car in for service at the dealership the other day, and the service writer said "You're warranty is almost expired." Then he went through the car and found everything that seemed worn, and put in orders to replace it for free. So, I suppose this is a counter to the expected horror stories! It occurred to me to type this when Steve said not to get the warranty, but if you do, get it from the car manufacturer itself, and I agree with that.

[@jblyon2]

Even then there are manufacturer warranties that don't cover much at all. If you get a comprehensive one though they will honor it. When I was young and stupid I bought an extended manufacturer warranty on a car. It covered a replacement radio and engine computer (which was later recalled for the same issue) without issue. Still both of those weren't enough to make the cost of the warranty worth it, especially since a few months later I would have been refunded for the ECU replacement had I needed to pay out of pocket.

[@GenderSkins]

35 years ago, I was working in a tire dealership and we had a guy come in to have his car repaired due to an issue with the transmission, which he had coverage on the car through his insurance company. The insurance company I think was Alstate which I maybe wrong on, but the insurance company refused to pay for the repairs due to the guy having oversized tires on his car which I think was actually a Pickup. So I had a talk with the shop manager about it and how I disagreed with the insurance companies assessment about what caused this barring in the guys transmission to fail, due to my own experience working on cars and selling tires while employed with a full service gasoline station. My shop manager had a talk with the insurance company about how they had a mechanic that disagreed with their assessment on what caused the transmission to fail, due to their mechanic's knowledge of how duel wheels on a half ton truck would cause the wheel barrings to fail before the transmission failure and that the guys slightly oversized wheels which was the same as what I had on my truck did not cause such a failure in an older truck. The insurance company ended up paying for the transmission replacement, because the tire dealership which did automotive repair could prove such a failure would not happen, due to a truck owned by an employee having a truck with the exact same tires did not have that failure in their half ton truck after 4 years.

[@darrellanderson7934]

As a mechanic, by trade, I've witnessed this very issue more often than not when dealing with extended warranty companies. I, myself have taken apart an engine to it's bare bones to figure out what went wrong with it due to the promise from said warranty company that the shop would get paid for the labor, which was roughly around $3,500 for disassembly of a diesel engine. Turns out that the oil pump went bad and didn't push oil to the top of the engine and barely to the crankshaft. But, as you stated, because it was an oil delivery system failure, the warranty company not only refused to pay to fix or replace the engine with a salvaged engine with a good warranty, (the latter being the cheaper of the 2 options), but also refused to pay for the labor of diagnosis. It's been such a long time since then that I don't remember what company it was, but my boss and myself have learned a valuable lesson when it comes to these companies

[@margretrosenberg420]

I saw those television ads and asked my mechanic whether I should get the extended warranty. My mechanic told me to forget it, that these companies that advertise on TV always find some way to avoid paying out.

[@spartan114m]

Lessons from my dad. Read everything entirely and ask hard questions before signing anything. Oh and take a few days to think on it. Served me very well.

[@pauls5745]

those auto warranty co's have clauses in the contract that basically eliminate anything you would typically repair on a car with lots miles on it. they purposely weasel out of 2/3 of claims

[@colt4667]

2/3 ??? Are you kidding? How about 99,999 out of 100,000 !!

[@Al-yf7tm]

People should know better, but these companies need to be shut down.

[@kennethbowden4129]

I still mess with them when they happen to call me which is extremely rare any more. I start by trying to get a warranty for my 1984 Jeep, but rarely get past 19-- before they tell me its too old. Then I try my older daily driver, a 1999 Nissan at which point they start getting upset and ask me if I have anything newer and I tell them no even though I do. They hang up and don't call back.

[@teekay_1]

It's surprising people keep making the payments to the vendor of the extended warranty after they refuse to fix it. Seriously, if you want to buy an extended warranty, ONLY buy one from the manufacturer. They're cheaper, they're more comprehensive, and the dealer takes care of it. Dealerships, ironically don't like carrying the manufacturer's extended warranty because there's not much margin in them. In that case there are dealerships that sell them online. And they generally sell them 30% or more off MSRP. I have experience with Chrysler and Honda extended warranties, and yes, generally they don't pay for themselves, but they make the car a lot easier to sell privately, since you can get them for up to six years, and the warranty transfers to the new owner.

[@elmateo77]

Don't pay for an extended warranty for anything, from anyone. Ever.

[@robertsmith2956]

If you drop them before you get your check your really screwed. Had to pay premiums for two months after I had no house till I cashed the check.

[@calbob750]

Additional Mopar warranty exclusions in the factory Max Care Warranty. “Wear and Tear” “Design Defects”.

[@duaneb193]

When I bought my used 2015 Nissan Juke, the dealership was pitching their extended warranty for "only" $4,500, good for 7 years. I refused of course, and all of a sudden they could make me a one time deal and the warranty would only be $2,200, and this was the best price they have ever offered. Yeah, right. I refused again, and yet another "closer" came in to pitch the fantastic deal they were offering me, and now the price was down to $900, which I again refused. Tell me that they don't have a huge, huge markup when it can go from $4500 to $900 for the same thing. I walked out the door with no extended warranty from them and put the money into the bank where it belonged. The other thing that many people miss is that they LOVE to tack this onto your car payments so you are "only paying $22 a month", but they seem to forget to tell you that by the time you've paid off your loan, that so called good deal has cost you several thousand dollars.

[@HH-ru4bj]

I remember those repair insurance scams from back when I still watched TV. The thing is you have two reasons to promote a warranty as a dealer/manufacturer, customer confidence, then use that confidence for a surcharge hoping you dont lose money from them using it. If they are not your customers and this is a third party deal, then they have no interest in retaining you as a customer so it's a scam.

[@Rocketboy991]

You would be better off taking that $110 a month and putting in a special savings account . And at the same time taking proper care of it.

[@finkelmana]

I drove by a Kia dealership recently and they are now offering 20 year/200,000 mile warranties. I didnt look deep into that, but that is deeply compelling. If its legit, my next car might be a Kia.

[@stephengreen3566]

You might need the warranty, as most of their direct injection engines have been randomly bursting into flames leaving their customers scrambling to get out of their fully fire engulfed cars. LOL

[@robertroney6998]

I got lucky. Bought a extended warranty from uproar(now Olive bought out). Nonetheless I've had a new long block/transmission/and water pump as well as the rear rotors and pads. What's hilarious is I read all the contracts before looking at a company and they had theirs written so poorly and basically like they "cover everything" $48 a month forever or until 120k miles. Funny is the company that bought them would cost me close to $360 a month and it doesn't even cover what uproar did. Guess I'm lucky.

[@ianbelletti6241]

I automatically consider it fraudulent when they represent themselves as working for "Dealer Warrantee Services". Especially when they're calling while I'm on the no call registry.

[@simplywonderful449]

I consider ANYONE calling to sell something fraudulent when they have an Indian accent. Even Indian friends of mine realize that their countrymen are famous (or infamous) for scamming people on extended warranties for vehicles.

[@TheRealScooterGuy]

@@simplywonderful449 -- I don't even answer the call when the number isn't in my contact list. My friends know to text first if they are going to call from an unfamiliar number, or to leave a message if they cannot do this.

[@scottr2706]

I consider it fraudulent them moment I see or hear the communication from these crooks. I have stopped watching anything which includes Ice-T or Chris Berman as a result of their commercials for CarShield.

[@tonithomas6143]

My dad wanted to get that kind of warranty. I thought it was a scam. I called my mechanic to get his opinion. Scam city. I bought a used car last year. When it came time to add all of those extras, I declined everything. I kept telling the guy that I have someone to do that for me. Or that coming to this location is not convenient for me. I ticked him off real good. What really got him was that I already had my financing set up. I came back with a cashier’s check in hand.

[@TheMrgoodtool]

I have warned off all my friends and family for a long time, to not fall for these scams.

[@ipdfs1]

I guess I had good luck with Axiom. It was a third party that I bought from a dealership at the time I purchased my used vehicle. I had issues getting the car company to take the 3rd party payments. I had to pay for any services up front and ask for reimbursement afterwards from the 3rd party warranty. It actually worked out well for me in that I got paid back for 2 somewhat expensive repairs. At the end of the day I think I pretty much broke even (cost of repairs were about the cost of the product). At the end of the day, even though it all worked out, I'm not sure I really saved any $$. At the same time I didn't have catastrophic Engine failure either.

[@ergoone1098]

It's a very good idea to avoid any product or service offered to you by a telemarketer, robocalker, or text- or email spammer. A product sold using methods that make it extremely difficult to know who is behind it and what their reputation is -- tends to be a bad product or service, if not an outright fraud.

[@darrennew8211]

My answer is "Yeah, I'm totally going to buy insurance from someone who spoofs their phone number. A great way to build a brand for a company that requires your trust is to transparently lie to your potential customers before you even talk to them."

[@byronknight4449]

I don't even answer calls from numbers I don't recognize anymore, but I may or may not have, in the past, suggested to warranty scammers that their Mom's extended warranty had expired too and that I was on the way to trade her in for a newer model.

[@matticus2274]

I work at an independent shop. Whenever a customer asks if CarShield is a good warranty, I immediately convince them not to get it. They don't cover anything. I have never once had them cover a single issue with any vehicle that was brought in with that warranty. I have, however, worked with some excellent warranty companies before. Toco, CarMax, and Century have been awesome. But never CarShield or Performance First. They keep you on hold for an hour just to deny a claim.

[@thepoliticalstartrek]

I tell them the car is at the bottom of a lake with a body in it. Credit Unions are offering them as part of your loan ans it is pretty good.

[@bigkoppa5816]

Hundo under the front wheels of the turbine car. 2

[@earlrissel4454]

I had "Car Sheild" for about a year than my fuel pump went south. They say you can use any repair facility. Car Shield bickered with the repair shop about the fuel pump cost. After this I dropped Car Shield because my repair shop is very reasonable in cost.

[@pault4513]

I worked at a heavy duty truck dealership for 27 years best warranty story I remember was customer waving his paper work yelling at service writer saying I got warranty when the service writer reply’s was Im sorry sir what you have is a warranty brochure I do have to say good customers received more customer policy ( where we didnt charge the customer for a non warranty issue for repeat customers who brought us their vehicles for us to maintain them on regular basis

[@MrJeepsrule]

Everyone who works in a auto shop tries to steer customers away from places like car warranty companies like car shield because of the reason

[@dolphcrane6420]

I worked the front of a repair place for several years, it got so bad we told customers we did not accept warranties anymore.

[@brucebauer8133]

I once started a Carshield policy. I didn't get to see the terms and conditions until after I sent in the first premium. The T & C were so bad, they were obviously composed to deny all claims. The next day I called in and cancelled the policy. Received my refund and never looked back!

[@bobdyar1033]

Before I went out on leave, my company cut ties with Carshield as they would say tear it apart and we'll pay (say)$1000. Then when the time came for the bill to be settled they would say we never authorized that amount. The most would be (say)$500. Also they would try to get out of paying what was in the contract that they were advertise to cover.

[@frotoe9289]

I had an epic battle with the new car paperwork lady fending off her hard sell on an extended non-manufacturer's warranty. She delivers a long speech and says "$2000". "NO". She tells me how vital it is to have this--that the manufacturer's warranty doesn't cover everything and really REALLY needs to be enhanced with this. I ask "so when the salesman said this was the best warranty in the business, and I'd have absolutely nothing to worry about for the duration--that everything was covered--he was lying?" BOY did she back pedal hard. And the price came down. And 10 minutes later came down more. She was down to $1200 and still wouldn't take no for an answer. I finally asked her to print the full contract and I'd take it home and read it. I did read it. It basically says they don't have to pay nuthin' they don't want to. Like, there's a clause in there that says if the car is ever driven off pavement, the warranty is void. Live on a rural unpaved road? Bzzzzt. Visit a friend on a rural unpaved road? Bzzzt. Take your spiffy 4WD SUV on an unpaved road? Bzzzt. Have an unpaved driveway? Bzzzt. There are just way too many horror stories of refused repairs, LONG delayed repairs, repairs made using substandard parts, etc. And keep in mind, the companies offering extended warranties and all forms of insurance MAKE MONEY. That means, outside of things where there exists predatory pricing like health care, it's not cost-effective on average. For every $100 you put in, they will be paying out like $70 (dunno what the overhead and profit is IRL). For some things, it makes sense--you pay $150/mo for home insurance because the cost of catastrophe is ruinous. But we got by for 100 years without extended warranties and never knew we needed them, until suddenly the late night TV ads and Ice-T are telling us we can't live without 'em.

[@u686st7]

And the equally obnoxious Chris Berman

[@robertsmith2956]

Well they did let the cat out of the bag once. "If I wasn't a mechanic, I would buy car shield" Why would you not want to get paid to fix your own car? It must really be bad.

[@scottr2706]

The amusing thing is you actually spend time discussing this with the F&I manager. I simply say a firm no and the discussion stops. The last time I bought, at a BMW dealer, the sales person handed me a tablet after we had agreed on the sale. The tablet was nothing more than a series of questions intended to guide the F&I manager as to how to construct his presentation to me. It included questions such as : How many miles do you drive each year? Answer: no more than 8,000. How long to you plan on keeping the vehicle? Answer: no more than 4 years (the period of the BMW warranty) Do you garage you vehicle? Answer: yes. I answered each question in consideration of the products I knew the F&I manager would like to sell me. When I got to the F&I manager, he actually said "Well, there is no product you seem to need. So the only thing I would suggest is a pre-paid maintenance plan." I responded with "BMW provides free normal maintenance for four years, no thanks." I was out of the F&I office in less than 20 minutes.

[@jeepien]

But Steve... Dealers can make a great profit on the manufacturer's warranty. When I bought my 2020 Prius (heaven forbid) Prime Limited, they offered a 7-year extended Toyota® warranty for a one-time price of $2700. Normally I never get extended warranties, but this was a hi-tech ride with lots of things that could break, so I considered it. But by the time we were done haggling the price had shrunk to $900. And I'm sure they were still making a profit at that price. I don't know how much they had to pay Toyota, but apparently they got to keep whatever they could get beyond that.

[@david124cherrington5]

I got my extended warranty through my credit union. When the car got totaled, I got my premium back since I never made a claim.

[@julietteoscaralphanovember2223]

I always thought those calls were just scams, so I just hung up all the time. But I fought with dealerships and car companies about their warranties and won every time but it was so aggravating.

[@snoykster2216]

When I purchased my used vehicle, I ended up buying Allstate Extended Car Warranty and they actually fulfilled the claim. After a year or so of ownership of the vehicle, there was an issue with the engine. I had a valve that would stick when the engine was cold. The place I took it to, never heard of Allstate Extended Warranty but willing to work with them. Allstate asked for a tear down, paid for it. Asked for pictures and video of what the technician found, dealership took the pictures and video. After a few days, the dealership got the green light and did the repair. A day or two after that, I had the vehicle back. I had to pay for fluids and a few other things. The tear down and most of the repair was handled by Allstate. I was impressed. I probably was one of few that actually got the claim work done. After seeing the comments, I was probably very lucky.

[@davidturk6170]

“Some of you may have gotten a phone call”. Understatement of the year!

[@MuzixMaker]

ALL of us have gotten MANY phone calls.

[@coldnnh6983]

Like you said never buy one off tv or a phone call, ever. I purchased a extended warranty many years ago in Florida for my 05 super duty pos and was issued through mercury insurance and was unbelievable in a good way. The truck service manager could not believe how fast they paid, within hrs and I was there often. When I got rid of it I got the same for my 06 Cummins I bought new before it hit 100,000 miles it needed a few things and they paid within hrs again. I was told since it was an insurance company it was more regulated and was obligated to pay under different rules, unfortunately they no longer offer it.

[@ShadeAssault]

Hey Steve, just an observation. You might want to point out to the non-car people what kind of parts are "lubricated". Don't have to go in-depth, but a lot of people probably don't realize something as simple as a door hinge has lubricant in it. Thanks for the great content, I learn a lot from your videos!

[@nicholasvinen]

It's really important to lubricate the muffler bearings too. Otherwise it could cause a catastrophic loss of blinker fluid.

[@johnemerson1363]

About 25 years ago I bought a home owner service contract that covered the major home appliances such as air conditioning. I had air conditioner coils in the attic and the design of the coils turned out to chronic leakers. They can't be repaired so they had to be replaced. First time, no problem. Second time, about four years later, they replaced the coils and then advised us that further coverage is cancelled. When I built my new home in New Jersey, I did not buy any warranties.

[@matthewspaccarelli5007]

They always have an exclusion for corrosion or rust. I used to work with choice home warranty and 2-10 home buyers warranty. I used to do AC work. I once had a client who had two air conditioners side by side. One of them was low and refrigerant and the estimate was under $300. The other unit had a blown compressor in the unit needed to be replaced. They approve the $300 repair, and denied the replacement stating "lack of maintenance". How can you approve one and deny the other when they are side by side? I asked them that question and they did not have an answer. I told the client to sue them. The client opted to pay me instead to do the job. I felt horrible, but if the client won't stand up to them and I told him I would back him in court. What else can I do?

[@colt4667]

How do you "maintain" an AC compressor?

[@matthewspaccarelli5007]

@@colt4667 Good question, one can argue that if you keep the system clean the pressures will be lower therefore maintaining the compressor. If the system is never serviced and the coils get clogged pressures increase in the system causing excessive wear on the compressor. This was not the case in the unit I was referring to

[@robertsmith2956]

@@colt4667 Whole house surge suppressor??? LOL I'm learning to do sonic soldering to fix a 4 ton unit that leaks between the aluminum coil and the copper line. My AC compressor is only $600, and HOURS of labor taking everything apart to replace it,.

[@andrewforte]

As soon as one of my local repair shops hears Carshield, a $200 service charge is added to deal with their BS.

[@sammydwm]

Bought a slightly used car and when we financed it our bank practically forced us to purchase an extended warranty with the loan. Less than 2 years later we had an issue and neither of the shops we use, one of which is a dealer for the brand of the car we bought, refused to even start work using the extended warranty since they had seen so many refused claims from them.

[@meligoth]

Wait til they find out that's how private health insurance operates.

[@robertsmith2956]

There is no such think as medical privacy when you must hand your info over to a third party to maybe pay.

[@scottr2706]

Wrong. Real insurance companies actually pay out claims.

[@adamhispl]

My wife and I got a novated lease on a pre-owned W166 Mercedes (ML 350 Bluetec) and wisely decided to get a warranty through the lease. A week or two into driving the vehicle there were issues with the HVAC system, I think it cost the warranty company $2500 to replace the electrical components that were faulty but we got a working HVAC system out of it! Just sold it after paying the lease out, next car will be a new car under manufacturer's warranty.

[@Stettafire]

I bought a laptop years ago, it died within a month. The shop said cus it had been updated via windows update the warranty was invalid (FYI in my country your warranty is with the retailer not with the manufacturer)

[@v6turbo231]

When we bought our 2012 Nissan Rogue (never, ever again. You can have any and all CVT’s… they are JUNK), when we bought the gap insurance, it came bundled with an extended warranty. Never had to use it, and honestly didn’t realize it was included in the gap. I only discovered it looking over the paperwork from where we purchased it. The a/c went out in the car two years after we bought it and the warranty was already expired at that point. I do my own work on my cars, covering the parts and labor myself. I often get an agent for one of these warranty calls online so I can tell them I don’t need them, I am my car’s warranty. When I’m not telling them I drive a lada or trabant.

[@brianhalley6184]

Steve, dealer warranties are becoming problems now, too. I have a Ford and their extended warranty will cover service but it has to be done with a certain range of the mileage of the service. I took my car in with over 96K to get the 100K service done because I was going to be heading to AZ. The trip to AZ and back, plus extra mileage would put me over 100K by a couple 1000. They were saying they system wouldn't allow. When I said I would take them to court over it the dealer took care of it and would have to write it off.

[@letstakeagander4599]

Im a technician atca chrysler dodge jeep dealer. Mopar maxicare is the best. They used to offer a lifetime maxicare. I have it on my 2013 chrysler 300 awd. It has paid for itself several times over. I also recommend Compass and Protective.

[@ghostrider-be9ek]

"extended warranty? How can I lose!!!"

[@spdergod]

I have a mechanic friend, same issue with warranty companies. Also stopped dealing with them. I had one of these extended warranties. They did honor my trans, but thankfully I had a shop that was willing to fight for me. They wanted to do a flush that I had to pay for so it ended up costing me some. After the flush I made it about a mile to the thing started puking fluid. They did end up covering it.

[@dc100dc100]

Rule of thumb. If the list of exclusions is longer than the statement of service, you know they’ve spend a huge amount of money and time trying to figure out how to take advantage of you .

[@craigg4925]

way back in the 80s I bought a van and warranty from a used car dealer, the dealer told me how the warranty company worked, and he was right. every clam I made and there was a few, I told the mechanic be sure to use the word "failed" every time you talk to the warranty company, and it worked, I had the front-end alignment and he said I needed a ball joint and 2 tie rod ends, it was covered under the warranty he just told them all ball joints and tie rods end had failed, they paid for all of it, the same with the AC the condenser and a hose had small leaks they did not cover hoses but paid for the condenser and dryer and the mechanic said they never pay for the dryer as it does not fail it just has to be replaced for the system to work. so, I wonder how many of these companies still work this way, it could be all about the words the mechanic is using, like the main bearing has spun, versus main bearings has felled. these little loopholes are in the contracts. I have a warranty on my used Harley-Davidson it's from the dealer but it's an aftermarket one and it's supposed to cover everything but tires, belts and brakes, I have not had to use it so I'm not sure how good it is, but people have said it's good, so I hope it is if I ever need it. I blame the damn lawyers they are out to get us. most of them anyway. and how many people can get a lawyer to look over contracts for us. I don't have that kind of money, and if you do, I'm betting you don't need aftermarket warranties.

[@andrewsnow7386]

In line with your video on RVs, I think this should have gotten a "Don't buy an extended warranty" title. :)

[@JK-co8og]

Normally I would pass on extended service contract (buy Toyotas) but wife wanted a Subaru Outback after our Sienna was totaled. 2012 known for CVT issues and head gaskets. Got one from YAA for around $1800 (4yr/48k) . Paid for itself already on $7700 trans replacement. (Paid the diff for the factory reman rather than the used that the warranty company wanted to use).

[@Shawn_Welsh]

Couldn't agree more! Don't buy them, I'm a mechanic at an independent shop and we no longer accept any of these warranties. There's the cost of the time spent on the phone, when you do have a claim they should be paying they start trying to dictate cost saying they only pay $XX/hour labor rate which is always way lower than our labor rate. So then we have to bill the customer the difference in cost of the repair. And on top of that it can be well over a month and many more phone calls before we finally get a check. So we said no more. What I think is even worse is that dealerships are trying to pedal these garbage warranties onto people that are buying a brand new car. I just had a relative buying a brand new work truck at dealership out of state and he called me because they were trying to push one of these on him.

[@DisleyDavid]

In 1983 I attempted to claim on a new car extended warranty for a failed engine. I was told to wait for approval to get the work done. This was never given. The insurer was a subdivision of the finance company who provided the hire purchase to purchase the car. I advised them of the cost of the repairs but due to their lack of response I ended up paying the £500 bill myself. I took out a bank loan (at a cheaper rate than the car loan) and paid off the hire purchase minus the repair cost. I never heard anything further from the insurer. No lawyers were involved.

[@AeroGuy07]

Car shield tried to sell me a warranty on my work van. I was a courier and could drive 100 miles or 500 miles in the course of a day. As soon as the agent heard that they said they couldn't cover me and hung up.

[@redcatxb125]

Work at a shop. Car Shield has been the worst offender in terms of not covering work

[@MountainFisher]

I saw how much they charge for extended warranties and did like my older brother did for his 18 wheeler. I set $75 for maintenance and repairs since before the warranty ran out. My 13 year old low mileage Tacoma pickup is worth $4000 more than I paid for it. Money is still there and except for tires and oil changes I only pay for gas, which is plenty.

[@jeromethiel4323]

The part that pisses me off so much, is that these "companies" prey on the economically disadvantaged. I would never buy one of these warranties, simply because i can afford to just scrap the car and buy another one. But if you are struggling financially, you might need to keep that 8-10 year old car running. And the thinking is "the extended warranty is cheaper than a car payment." But this only works if the warranty company actually pays. If they don't, the poor person cannot sue, they just have to take it. It's a shitty business model, and nobody should patronize them.

[@EnthalpyAndEntropy]

That's a scary proposition, poor people unable to sue. Piss off enough people and someone is going to shoot you.