I Had BIG Expectations For The Surly Disc Trucker, Now I’m Disappointed...

[@Cyclingabout]

So, what's your favourite drop bar touring bike, and why? 😇 You can support my videos over on Patreon! I've had 1.3 million views on my touring videos in the last month, we're getting somewhere folks!! www.patreon.com/cyclingabout

[@BeeRich33]

MEC Cote I purchased, and changed for touring bars.

[@KowalskiVanishing_Point]

Well, seeing as I have only one drop bar bike, the 2019 Salsa Fargo Tiagra 20 speed, I guess that is my favourite. I have done a couple multi hundred kilometer tours on both rough asphalt and backroads/trail. I have a Thudbuster ST seatpost and 29 inch 2.5" Hookworm tires that have done a good job on multiple surfaces. Pros: the bike is a monster!! Pretty comfortable, easy rolling, no maintenance issues so far, lots of rack/cage options. Cons: a little heavy, and gearing could be a little lower. I plan to take it on a 600 or 700 multi surface solo trip and have no qualms- I ain't racing. In the next couple of years I'm planning a cross Canada trip. Having done several multi thousand kilometer trips on junk bikes not designed for touring it's definitely an upgrade for me.

[@no-trick-pony]

How tall are you? I am 6′4 (about 194cm) and I have lower back problems with my KTM bike. Not sure whether I am doing something wrong. I have a 60cm frame. Do you have an idea how I can find out more about this?

[@BangTheRocksTogether]

My favourite touring bike is the Kona Sutra. Why? Because I have one. It's my first drop bar bike, and my first new bike since I was a kid, so I don't have much to compare it to. If I had it to do again I'd probably get an MEC National, for the XT drivetrain. It's a bit more bike for about the same money. (Mountain Equipment Co-op, based here in Vancouver, has their own brand.)

[@ronmatthews1738]

Roberts Roughstuff. Whoever designed it really understood touring.

[@efrainfortiz]

I recent bought 56 disc truker, and I love it. It’s heavy and slow bike, but its super comfortable and stable. Its perfect for bad conditions roads and light gravel. I am 50 years old man, and Since I was a child I have owned many styles of bikes, I want bmx, mtb rigid and suspension, carbon fiber road bikes and I have enjoyed each and every one of my bikes, the purpose of the bike is to have fun, no matter what bike you have. Keep biking.

[@HitchhikerUnknown]

Hi Efrain, how was it in gravel?

[@lukepranger1145]

Hey. Just curious - how tall are you? I just ordered the 56.

[@Sergio_Loureiro]

Happy to see somebody is still making 26" wheel bicycles!

[@stevegraham3041]

26 is the way to go

[@campbellpaul]

I don't know why he says 26" tires are HTF...

[@sbsb4995]

@@stevegraham3041 much stronger for sure. and lighter.

[@mysurlytrucker7510]

I find no problem getting 26 inch tyres ,in several different widths, I also know of several people cycling the world with rim brakes, with no issues or problems stopping.

[@Sergio_Loureiro]

@@campbellpaul 26" tyres are becoming hard to find here. Here in Portugal everything 26" is gradually disappearing from bicycle shops, being it bicycles, wheels, tyres, etc.

[@Briaaanz]

As a person with size 14 feet (49 European), I hate that they shortened the chain stay length. It's getting harder and harder to find bikes where I don't get heel strikes when using panniers. So frustrating!

[@marksingleton4460]

I had one built last year starting with a disc Trucker frame and building up. I'm incredibly pleased with it, it goes anywhere I point it. It's all about knowing what you want to do with your bike, getting a great frame and building it up. Brooks B17 saddle handbuilt wheels with dynamo powering front and rear lamps, standard racks and Carradice Super C bags. I have Deore XT group set and dual platform stud/SPD pedals. Schwalbe Mondial tyres keep me upright. Mudguards (aka fenders) keep me clean and dryish. Highly recommend them. Remember with this type of bike it's purpose is smiles per miles not miles per hour. Great for camping better as an accessory to your hotel room.

[@heyjohna]

Another downside to note is that if you are using a rack in the front, the rack will interfere with rotating the lever on the front thru axle. Since they do not pivot, removing the front wheel is a more difficult and tedious process. Surly’s response is basically, just deal with it.

[@schmuhf]

I was baffled when I saw the new LHT. I mean, 1675 USD for a bike with no rack, no mudguards, no dynohub and no lights and it has the Alivio group set? That's very optimistic, to say the least.

[@smedleybutler1969]

and no kickstand mount!

[@GordoGambler]

And NO SA XL FDD dyno DRUM brake. Mine has 24,000 miles with only a bearing change at 17,000. My total load is 120 lbs LOL. Any bike without an IGH is trash anyway.

[@j.foobar1764]

@@smedleybutler1969 $15 for the kickstand plate to fit this bike. I saw one review that said it came with it but I'm not sure that's true. Worst case scenario is that for $15, problem solved. As for the lack of racks, mudguards, etc., that's a lot more $$.

[@holben27]

and yet im pretty much forced to get one as its the only sub 2000 64cm touring bike available it seems

[@ronwhite8503]

Yup, I don't know how Surly justify their prices. There are plenty of steel bikes, especially used ones, that cost less and ride just as good.

[@davidmull7263]

I've done my research and I love it. I'm buying a new one today.

[@andrewnorris5415]

The thing about Shimano groupsets - is they keep getting better. Today's Alivio is often better than yesterday's Deore.

[@seksualusis]

This, and the primary reason to go down must be prohibitive price of the top tier groupsets. They must be getting progressively expensive, also demanded in pandemic peak.

[@merlinthebikewizard4392]

This is exactly what I thought. Surly made the Disc Trucker into a standard gravel bike. Surly used to be the leader in innovation but now they are just following trends instead of making them. It is just run of the mill now.

[@gregkosinski2303]

Innovation? They have always been a cutesy brand offering strong but heavy imported bikes for too much money.

[@TateJenson]

Great comments! You mentioned how you still prefer the Kona Sutra over the Trucker. But what are the Gear Inches for the Trucker vs the Sutra for climbing?

[@outtatrex]

I was looking forward to this upgrade, a Disc Trucker with thru axle would be the perfect for me! But then came the big disappointment: This is not thru axle, this has a vertical dropout on 1 side. Surly calls this "captured thru-axles". The reason given in this video , to not choose for a real thru axle, is because of ease of removal. Hey Surly, than you could have kept the quick release dropout if that was your goal. Somehow Surly always screws up the design for thru axle, they never keep to the standard all other manufuctures use.. (One exeption is the Trek 520, which also has some dumb mix of QR and thru axle.) How on earth did the marketing guys at Surly manage to screw this up. Unbelievable ! My opinion is that if you have disc brakes on a bicycle, you must have thru axle dropouts, to prevent screaming disc when braking, and to make sure that the wheel is in the exact same position after you have removed it. 99% of 2020 bicycles with disc brakes have thru axle, exept Surly, with their own proprietary version of an axle. Also, who asked for this ? Which problem did this solve ? Anyhow..., I would need a 52 cm frame, and my only option is 26 inch wheels? I would love if Surly could make the LHT available in 28 inch wheel size (or 27.5) for the smaller frame sizes. My favorite Schwalbe tyres (Marathon Almotion) are not even made in 26 inch anymore !! And why does the 2020 LHT still have the mounts for a downtube shifter on the frame? In 2020 nobody is using downtube shifters anymore, so if you are going to "completely redesign" the bike, you could have gotten rid of that. Most other bike manufacturers have better solutions for this I think. Surly should have looked at the Kona Sutra and the new Thorn Nomad for inspiration, both are better bikes.

[@Cyclingabout]

I actually think the one-side-open dropout will become a more common specification for everything but mountain bikes. The Mavic Speed Release has been around since 2016, and from all reports, seems to be just as effective as a typical thru-axle system for ensuring the wheel is perfectly aligned. But maybe you know something I do not? I didn't realise you cannot get a 26" Almotion anymore. Damn!

[@bananasstuff3344]

wow that was an adventure in itself to read

[@alradhi.j3009]

you are the 156894214684th person to blame marketing person at surly. and you know what? they still taking black and white photo.

[@SteveFullerBikes]

The downtube shifter mounts are there in case someone wants to do a frame up build with whatever parts they want. That way, you still have a stop for the shifter cables.

[@stevegraham3041]

I use downtube shifters because there reliable and simple in every way

[@Jthe5th]

The longer headtube seems to be there only to have lower spacers but in essense the fork tube that sits in the heatube is identical, so finally it amounts to the same effective stack.

[@JeremyThompson1978]

My 2019 Disc Trucker was destroyed on a public bus bicycle rack by a hit and run driver in December 2020. I lucked into finding a brand new 2018 Disc Trucker in January 2021. The components on my new Disc Trucker are an upgrade over the 2019 Disc Trucker and lightyears ahead of the 2021. I'm so thankful for your review. It kept me from purchasing this bike.

[@milesian1]

After I stopped racing bikes and triathlons I was looking for other personal challenges and adventures. I bought my Long Haul Trucker in 2009 for a tour around Taiwan that never happened due to a devastating typhoon that hit just as I was about to set out. I switched out my flat bars for drop bars, and bar-end shifters for Shimano 105 STI shifters, and that's been my configuration ever since. Unless I'm riding with other cyclists the LHT is all the bike I will ever want or need. Disc brakes would be nice, but I'm still more than pleased with my 2009 tech.

[@gabrielgomescunha]

Those novelties is exactly what I will avoid due to the lack of compatibility and interchange. A failure in equipment will ruin your travel for who knows how long

[@themoodyteam]

Novelties?

[@Cyclingabout]

Fair enough. I've never been too worried about the weird parts on my bikes. I figure if I can find "novelty" parts that are highly unlikely to break, I should be good. It's working so far, I have only had two spoke failures since 2013... that's it!

[@gabrielgomescunha]

@@themoodyteam compared to what I use as standard. Using "old" parts saved me from stopping working when I was low on money cuz I always managed to get really cheap or even free parts to keep going. And to me "keep going" is more important than going fast or fancy

[@gabrielgomescunha]

@@themoodyteam I'm on a much smaller budget too... 😭

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

They just turned this otherwise great model into yet another fucking gravel bike, Surly really lost it during the past recent years.

[@rogervancleave8670]

Kudos for Kona. I use the Sutra LTD for bike packing and love the extra tire clearance the frame offers (up to 29 x 2.2). The thru axels are great but had to upgrade them.

[@Cyclingabout]

The Kona Sutra ticks so many boxes currently. The bike is constantly evolving too. I'm just hoping there is a rear kickstand mount on the next one!

[@DesN4IN]

Thanks Alee, I bought my Kona Sutra 2019 off your recommendation and think is a great bike, I got the last year model at a discount, it's 3X9sp but I am still very happy with the gearing. I primarily use for commuting and some beginner touring when the COVID-19 restrictions relax here. Thanks for all your videos and sharing your expertise.

[@Cyclingabout]

Cheers, I'm stoked you like your Sutra!

[@yunwang9861]

I m disappointed too, I owned LHT for 7 years. I was thinking upgrade to a disc trucker but definitely not this one

[@Cyclingabout]

Maybe the next update in another eight years? 😂

[@yunwang9861]

CYCLINGABOUT I d better choose the old model 🤣🤣🤣

[@calcagnolibero]

On a touring bike I'd like more than 47mm max tyre with fenders, especially for gravel or off road touring. Indexed bar ends with a friction option are the best solution for touring and the 12mm through axle really disappoints me. Thanks for posting this useful review, keep up with the good job.

[@LeoInterHyenaem]

How so? I've had a bar end shifter assembly bike for a couple of weeks. My fortune telling skills proved insufficient to guess a climb, even the slightest one, early enough to manage to downshift. By the time My hands could reach the shifters, I was way past the point when pedaling uphill was possible at all. That was in The Netherlands without (or as good as) luggage. Right there and then, I sought to swap the groupset for one with proper drop bar shifters / brakes.

[@cjohnson3836]

DT can run, officially, up to 53mm. And that's overkill for touring. You're asking for a bikepacking mountainbike, at this point. On the type of terrain you are using drops with bar ends, anything over 47mm is completely overkill. And the type of terrain that you'd need tires that large, get a flat bar and a simple 1x.

[@calcagnolibero]

c johnson 53 without fenders, 47 with fenders (which for me are necessary on any touring bike) and it’s better to have the possibility to fit wider tires when needed or desired.

[@cjohnson3836]

@@calcagnolibero Surly makes that bike, its called an Ogre.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

The thru axle made this frame an instant no, they turned into a fashion novelty, people touring all over the world will be far far better off with qr as they're still the dominant standard and will be so for many years to come, Surly have lost it, seems like different people are running the company now.

[@sircrackien]

I see the 160mm rotor max highly limiting. they should have made the non-adapter position 160 and let the adapter take it to 180mm. There is no way I would tour on less than 180mm rotors as bigger rider.

[@peterbaskind9872]

The implication that GRX might be a more appropriate drivetrain is certainly valid. But I wonder if hydro brakes on a touring bike is the best idea. Simplicity rules. That’s why my new touring build uses Paul Klampers.

[@atexnik]

I'm not sure, swapping the 26 chainring with 22 will not cause issues with Sora shifter. I guess, the 26 is the lowest you can use, otherwise Surly would install the 44-32-22 version right out of the box. It just doesn't work smoothly with Sora shifter, which you can't swap with an MTB FD, because the latter would not work woth integrated road shifter due to mismatch of pulling ratio.

[@belverticale]

The Alivio rear is good...it doesn't have a clutch but the shifting is precise and the spring is strong. Moreover, the Alivio crankset is definitely an upgrade over the previous Disc Trucker as it's a two-piece crankset with the external Hollowtech bottom bracket...so much better than the FSA three piece crank and BB that this bike previously came with. I built my Disc Trucker frame up with latest Alivio 3 x 9 and Gevenalle shifters, which are terrific...you should do a video on them...great alternative to bar-end shifters

[@Cyclingabout]

I'd like to spend more time with the Gevenalle shifters. The last time I used them, the shifters were called Retroshift!

[@belverticale]

@@Cyclingabout They're a great option. When you first see a photo of them they look like a nightmare to use but when you actually use them and work out the best finger movements it all makes sense. Plus you can choose long or short pull brake options with Gevenalle, not just short pull as you must use with STI levers. This means you can use mountain bike mechanical disc brakes which means more and cheaper options (Tektro Aquila - just 40 bucks plus rotors and just as good as Spyres in my view).

[@oilcanracer6388]

I had to get rid of my surly trucker. It was fine without a load. But fully loaded it was a crazy soft noodle. Dangerous at speed cause it would throw you off your bike from wobbling. That and the fact that all surly will rust out from the inside after a while. Learned this from personal experience. Soft cheap steel is good comfort for a unloaded bike, but not for heavy touring. It wags it's tail too much. The new geometry tells us that it's not made for touring. Shorter rear chainstay so your heels now hit the panniers, no cantilever brake options and not enough room for wider tires. This is a commuter not a touring bike.

[@Cyclingabout]

Yeah, I had to be careful not to load the front up too much or I had a speed wobble too... 👎🏻

[@yooperventures2830]

Interesting. I've ridden my LHT fully loaded (front and rear panniers, handlebar bag) and never had a wobble. 35 mph downhill and it is still fine. I'm careful to load the bags evenly or maybe I'm just lucky.

[@toddwalsh3332]

Yooper Cyclist yea I am lucky too ! Whew . I would hate speed wobble ! I love my disc trucker and I pack heavy ! Can’t live without those luxury items. 🍀

[@weldonyoung1013]

Well, on my 3-year old Disc Trucker using the front rack is not an option, because with the 2cm longer stem the steering makes the front end too twitchy.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

I've noticed it too i tried a disc trucker once i noticed it would fishtail a bit, but my Surly Pugsley which i have been touring across Scandinavia and Europe feels a lot stiffer, i don't know if the tubing is thicker or if the diameter is the same but is certainly is stiffer that's for sure, and with that much more robust fork makes a huge different being front loaded, man they should never have killed the Pugs it is a tank of a bike basically a fat touring rig that absolutely delivers doing so, Surly have made so many mistakes these recent years.

[@mattrg320]

interesting changes as I've heard that the previous versions of the Disc Trucker, aside from having disc brakes, are basically no different from the LHT?

[@TandyTerrison]

You didn't even mention the glaring thru axle issue. When you find yourself in middle america with a busted rear 26 inch thru axle wheel, you're pretty much SOL. Also the TRP brakes flex so much more than the BB7 that the improvements that you gain by dual pistons are almost entirely negated by the lack of stiffness.

[@Cyclingabout]

I mentioned that I don't think thru axles are a big deal. Hubs are unlikely to fail, it's usually the spokes and rims - so you can simply get a new wheel build wherever you are. There are heaps of people travelling with 12x148 Boost hubs and 177/197mm hub fat bikes! The BB7s are also good brakes, I've got them on two different bikes. I just prefer the TRPs because the pad wear is more even, and they seem to require less tinkering.

[@GordoGambler]

How the hell would they flex?? LOL Mine stops on a dime every time. Minimum 243 lbs GVW.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

Yeah good luck trying to source a 26 inch thru axle wheel, what the fuck did Surly think of, this will end up as one of their biggest failures...

[@ehounshell]

I think the groupset issue is not so significant. The hierarchy is to a great extent just a matter of (a) how many gears and (b) mechanical vs. hydraulic brakes. If you wanna stick with mechanical disc brakes for maximum repairability/flexibility, that limits your options for a build.

[@kennethcolbert2921]

I think they mess up my self.I'm happy to have the older Disc Trucker.

[@CrazyCranker]

I always just buy the frame of choice and build it myself, or with the help of a local bike shop. I've been doing it like that since I was a young buck.

[@lennymclean.]

If you want a durable, reliable drivetrain then you'll be just fine with a deore, or alivio, or acera derailleur, an 8 speed 11-32 cassette and a 22-34-44 triple chainring. That way you can use a standard geared-bike chain and some £11 friction shifters, which will never ever cause you shifting problems, so long as your limiters are setup correctly. The idea of touring on a 10speed cassette and chain with indexed STI brifters sounds like a recipe for disaster; I wore out a 10speed tiagra drivetrain in under 15 months of daily cycling, whereas my 1 X 8speed commuter flat-barred road bike, with a basic friction shifter has seen 14miles a day for the past 2 years and neither the chain is stretched very much nor the teeth of the cassette are particularly worn. The chainring will go first and that will be when I replace the lot, but then again that's coming in at £15+£18+13+£6 so just under 50 for a 1 3/32ths chain and all new cogs (including derailleur guide wheels). Stick with 8 speed if you don't like spending lots on drivetrain parts.

[@stevegraham3041]

The thorn nomad was nice proper tank of a bike

[@JensMHA]

I have been twiddeling my thumbs about getting a Disc trucker frame set in 62 cm, down a size from my 64 cm LHT, which at 204 cm tall I find to be somewhat on the large side. Looking at the visuals here, it is hardly recognizable as a member of the Trucker family. :O

[@ChrisLorensson]

Hey Alee... worth noting that the Salsa Marrakesh (you used my picture for the one at 6:10) does not officially support 650b wheels nor 2.6” tires... that was just my trial and error. But it DOES work with a little edge nob rubbing only at lower pressures in the top of the rear triangle.

[@Cyclingabout]

That's your bike on the Salsa website? Sweet! I used those pictures as an example of just how much clearance the frames have, even if it is not endorsed by either manufacturer. Tyres exceeding 2.0" are very common on both the Sutra and Marrakesh!

[@ChrisLorensson]

Yeah it’s mine. Still running those tires but have changed up the cockpit quite a bit since then. Yes I truly appreciate the generous clearance on the Marrakesh!

[@TrizmMcwafflecone]

@Chris lorenson, what is that top tube bag? Im looking for something like that for my marrakesh.

[@ChrisLorensson]

​@@TrizmMcwafflecone It's the Revelate Gas Tank: www.revelatedesigns.com/index.cfm/store.catalog/cockpit/GasTank I liked it, but ended up switching it to their "Mag-Tank", which is MUCH easier to open/close while riding (as long as you don't need as much weatherproof-ness).

[@TrizmMcwafflecone]

@@ChrisLorensson thanks for responding, i am liking the mag tank too.

[@evyschiers1520]

I've bought an LHT and a disc trucker, I've been a fan for over a decade. That is until the 2020 "upgrade" came out. The geometry changes made to the 42 cm frame have made the bike unrideable for people under 5'3". A standover height of 721.5 mm is ridiculously high and I still puzzle over the thinking behind the stack/ reach geometry. The frame certainly works for the normal mid-range height people, but for the people on the short side of the spectrum, this bike is no longer an option. Pitty. It seems Surly has gone the same way as all the other major makers of touring bikes Trek, Fuji, Kona, Cannondale, and more by not offering a tourer for people under 5'3". The only 26" wheeled dedicated touring bike I've found on the market as of today is the Co-Motion Pangea. Thank you Co-Mo! The upgrade for the Surly LHT in my short statured opinion is a fall on your face failure.

[@Cyclingabout]

I keep a list of low standover bikes on my website if you'd like to see more: www.cyclingabout.com/list-of-touring-bikes-for-smaller-cyclists/

[@j.foobar1764]

From a business perspective, shortening the chain stay length a bit, including a more gravel-esque handlebar, increasing the tire clearance, and switching to STIs makes no small amount of sense. Let's be honest. How many people who own touring bikes actually ride loaded tours more than occasionally? By creating a bike that is more nimble and a more viable non-touring road ride and/or commuter option while maintaining its touring bona fides and general comfort, they are trying to push this bike out of its niche a bit (and substantially increase model sales, naturally). Of course, the history of beloved niche products that become less beloved when companies compromise what made them so beloved to begin with in the interest of chasing larger sales numbers is long and notorious. Did Surly do that here? I guess time will tell. As for the other options you often tout, they are not really an option for us taller riders (as you know and acknowledge in the comments below). I am tall enough personally that options like the Sutra and the Marrakesh are no longer options. That limits my more mainstream choices (brands that are actually commonly sold in U.S. bike shops) to the Trek 520, the Fuji and the Surly for the most part. Too bad. I am probably about to buy a new touring bike and was leaning towards the Salsa until I saw their sizing chart.

[@jsaintclair1]

@foobar: check out the SOMA Saga frameset, which comes with the longest steerer on the market. SOMA only sells framesets, so you'll have to build it up, but custom builds are the best, and the cheapest! I've never met an off the shelf touring bike that would satisfy me, especially one with drop bars. Crazy bar or Denham bar is the only way to go!

[@jsaintclair1]

....and the SOMA Saga comes with a kickstand mounting plate, perfect for a Pletscher twin kickstand.

[@nickwf70]

I think they should carry on making the old model but capable of running disc or rim brakes like the troll. Let's see which is most popular new or old. I like some aspects of the new model but it's supposed to be future proof why not 27.5 wheels and why not 180 front discs? Great it's stiffer but stupid shorter chainstays. My old lht is still one of my best bikes, goes well, handles fine for everyday use just wish it had discs in the winter.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

I could live with the changes on geometry, biggest turn off is the adoption of thru axles, that is strictly speaking a stupid move, the qr standard is still and will be the most common standard around the world, specially in less developing nations, i'll stick with my old Pugsley & long haul trucker.

[@jdcm65]

Thanks for this video. I have a Dawes Karakum and I changed out the 32-spoke for 36 and the cassette from 11-32 to 12-36. I am looking into changing the crankset to decrease the size of the granny gear. Lots of mountain climbing with heavy gear. Any suggestions?

[@Siarawaszympanemjest]

I am looking for a frame for a long expedition tour, but shorter chainstays and thru axles on this Surly tell me to go looking somewhere else. At the moment my first choice would be Spa Cycles Wayfarer. I considered Thorn Nomad MkIII, but all the gimmicks I won't use (eccentric bb, splittable right seatstay) inflate the price too much, so I guess it'll be the Spa.

[@marksingleton4460]

I'd be interested how the Wayfarer is riding. It was on the list.

[@vincentaurelius2390]

I wonder how many sales they lost on this model not having the 700c wheel available on the 54 cm frame.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

In my opinion the best touring bike ever made is the 2012 / 2014 Surly Pugsley, it's the pretty much the disc trucker only more durable and versatile, not come across a better touring bike to date, I can't fathom how Surly abandoned their best model, people are asking for them, now all they have of their fat line up is the trail bikes which are eh, you no longer have that great hub / crank compatibility, you no longer have that ability to literally put a spare 135mm rear wheel in the front which was absolutely genius. Surly should have stuck with their guns and kept what works instead of trying to do what ever other manufacturer is doing, instead they should focus on their strengths, there are very few manufacturers that offer great touring / bike packing rigs out of the box.

[@stuartperry8141]

I believe in kickstands on any bike , I do not ride fast enough to worry about the extra weight on my road bikes and the functionality of being able to park your bike on any flat surface is great.

[@Cyclingabout]

Right on. I've broken the bolts on a kickstand before and it was a rough month of touring without it!

[@joramvandervorst7715]

I don’t know where all the coment on the downgrade for the groupset came from, but Surly never uses a full groupset, it’s allways a mix of what they thought worked best. 3x9 Alivio with it’s steel chainrings is wearing out a lot slower then aluminium ones...and cheaper to replace!

[@campbellpaul]

I think the Alivio groupset is best for a user-friendly bike

[@cjohnson3836]

People look at name alone. Modern iterations have gone up in quality. Current Alivio has hyperglide and shadow tech, steel cassette and crank/chainring. The only thing its missing vs Deore is a clutch derailleur, which is unnecessary for a disc trucker.

[@jameslopez958]

I have the Surly ECR and I have only changed tires and Pedals.The bike came with Moloko Bars which I like very much! Thanks for sharing this information 😁. Peace ✌️ and Love 💕 from Tucson Arizona Desert 🏜️

[@tigerone2353]

Nice. Your right about bar end shifters..they are great on touring bikes.

[@doomedtolinger2213]

super thanks for the considerate summary at 0.49, ended up watching the vid regardless. Great job on da review... A Soma Saga rider

[@Cyclingabout]

Glad it was helpful!

[@djkenny1202]

I bought the 520 Disc before it got the sporty aluminum fork and lost bar end shifters. Sometimes prior gens are just better. I would like the higher stack, but it’s never been it’s Thing. I’m experiencing. Has Metropolis bars and an extender. I may try no extender.. but I like the bars high…

[@amitkumar-wj8gn]

get the frame and build it up. I would prefer downtube shifters or thumb shifters for utter reliability. That said, I think now The Bridge Club is Surly's best touring bike given how versatile it can be when it comes to builds. That bike with a MTB 2*11 set up and Alee Bars would be the pick for me.

[@Cyclingabout]

The Bridge Club is still my touring pick from the lineup! Would be so damn good with a 2X11 drivetrain and Denham Bars. 😎

[@amitkumar-wj8gn]

@@Cyclingabout yup...I have all the components in my head, now just need to arrange the money. lol. :D

[@Cyclingabout]

Hehe... you still have two kidneys, right? 😂

[@amitkumar-wj8gn]

@@Cyclingabout have you seen the latest kidney prices? Not good enough, I tell you. Need about three to sell. :)

[@Cyclingabout]

@@amitkumar-wj8gn 😂

[@Edwerdman]

I'm probably the only one here who likes old road bikes for a road trip which are low tech easy to find parts and maintenance which simple tools.

[@xbmarx]

I always preferred the Troll anyway (or Ogre for bigger wheels). I may be the only person left who prefers 26" wheels though. :(

[@toddwalsh3332]

Scott my wife wants to swap her disc trucker for a troll because of the top tube height. I did not realize they are hard to order.

[@CallMeDr.T.]

Thank you. Excellent review. You offer so many details and comparisons. Nice.

[@johndoes2434]

You can always go with the 29 wheel because it's also 700c 27in Wheels may not always be around June 29th or taking over and they're too small for 29 lamberti's going to $29 because 700c will work on them

[@PRH123]

4 years later and 26 inch wheels are still everywhere :)

[@sbsb4995]

I'd choose the 26" wheels, and rim brakes if possible. For easier, and cheaper maintenance.

[@jsaintclair1]

What's cheap about rims being worn out by your rim brakes? There's no way I'm ever going use rim brakes on my Velocity Atlas or Cliffhanger rims!

[@seitenryu6844]

Typical adjustments are easier, but long term maintenance isn't cheaper. Riding on muddy roads will wear your rims out quickly.

[@secretdaisy6484]

Good review! I was glad to hear you say the Kona Sutra is a great deal because I have a new 2019 one in a box that arrived the first week of the zombie 🧟 viral apocalypse & is still sitting there. The plan is to ride it coast to coast pulling a Bob Yak trailer when it's safe. Then the following year I plan a lengthy tour of Scandinavia on a Koga World Traveler like yours. Not sure about panniers or trailer for that adventure. Depends on if I take a dog 🐶 along. Thanks for all your videos & tech info. Be safe & keep on pedaling. 👍☮️🌞🦠😷🚲

[@bentolinmaddox9806]

It’s been save for ages now. I hope you’ve gone. If I had to know how this was going to play out, I would have left as soon as if started and just pedalled my way across the country

[@granularSodacan]

How tall are you? I'm 6'8" or around 203 cms with a 103cm inseam. Previous iterations of the trucker series of bikes were too small for me but this might do the trick. I'd be swapping the drop bars for flat bars with the little aero bar extensions anyway so the shifter issue is moot as I'm sure I could just mount "bar-cons" on the aero bar ends like a triathlon bike. I am cautiously optimistic 🙂

[@ucanskixc568]

Thanks for your straight up review of this Surly. Your comments were spot on, and I think someone missed the boat for 2021. Well done.

[@31.8mm]

that feeling when u got TA with misaligned fork blade and bad warranty claim experience

[@Cyclingabout]

I don't think Surly have a history with this?

[@31.8mm]

@@Cyclingabout my cc, and one of my friend's ogre and stagy had a misaligned fork, he also told me that he spot another surly with this problem other than his and mine, that's as far as i remember, hard to feel, but easy to see, mine got checked at store more than year ago, cant be fixed, no following news came from warehouse nor warranty guys since then, sold my cc already, fyi, it's taiwan made.

[@brendonoid6133]

@@31.8mm I'm not sure there are many bikes on market that aren't made in Taiwan other than the Chinese ones? It's bascially the best Bicycle manufacturer in the world unless you are buying handbuilt customs.

[@Cyclingabout]

Good to know, thanks!

[@conanfa18]

Is the 700c x 50mm possible without fenders? Also, is this bike compatible with Rolhoff or Alfine hub drive?

[@jambonsambo]

Having ridden the old and the new do you reckon the new one is closer to an allrounder and more responsive / playful with the new geom? I am looking for a strong bike with a low BB for tipping around in the countryside , groceries and the occasional tour

[@Cyclingabout]

The only change that will affect the handling is the chainstays that have come in 10mm. It's probably not enough of a change to notice. The Midnight Special will be much more playful in comparison.

[@cycletouringoz5760]

Build the marquee up over a number of years and theeeeen, cheap it up.. Never was a fan. Shortening the wheelbase is an odd option also. Totally agree Re : Tubing diameter. Such a competitive market that, unless the bike shops suck complete novices in, sales will, as I believe they should given the downspeccig, suffer considerably. I almost fell over when you mentioned a Thorn Bicycle 😂

[@christopherpackart]

Would newer gravel bikes be sufficient for touring like the Giant ToughRoad SLR GX 1?

[@chrisfloyd7316]

I love how you explain what things are as you bring up argument points

[@BeeRich33]

36 spoke loss is a deal breaker. The top issue I have on my current non-36 tourer.

[@Cyclingabout]

Most of the press bikes I've seen are rolling on 32h wheels, but one media outlet has some 36h wheels. Given the Surly website is saying 36h, it might just be a handful of bikes that were out of spec... let's see.

[@j.foobar1764]

Every piece of press on this as well as the company's own website says the bike comes with 36 spoke wheels. I think it is a non-issue.

[@HansensUniverseT-A]

The disc trucker is just another gravel bike, it's no longer the staple for touring.

[@d9918]

My Trek 920 does have a built in kick stand mount and I never guessed how much I would use it.

[@AllRound81]

Hi, thank you for the effort. I have a question about the marathon Almotion. Would you say the 50-622 make more sense than the heavier 55-622, would the difference be noticeable , heavier to ride ? I could not finde exact information in the forums. Thank you !

[@Cyclingabout]

I don't think you'd notice the difference between 50 and 55mm tyres unless you were on a rough dirt road. If you ride mostly smooth surfaces go 50mm, if it's a mix of surface types, definitely go 55mm.

[@AllRound81]

CYCLINGABOUT Thank you for the reply ! I will go with the 50’s .

[@green_building]

Nice honest review 👍👍 anyways i have a plan to do my 1000km touring, based on your experience i will buy Kona Sutra, my height 177cm what size should i choose ? Thanks in advance 🙏😉

[@richardnelson4976]

Unfortunately 3 of us that purchased these in 2022 had to return the bikes for front end wobble. We worked with Surly for 6 plus months to resolve it with our bicycle shops before they asked to have them sent back. I rode a 54, the other two 62 and 64

[@MD_il_microcanale]

salve, in che senso oscillazione dell'avantreno? Nel senso che quando lasci le mani dal manubrio questo inizia a vibrare?

[@richardnelson4976]

@@MD_il_microcanale It would Vibrate at 12 mph with a electric bicycle dampener installed on the head, before installing the dampener it would do it at starting out and got worse the more speed you picked up. 22 lbs split between two panniers in front and dead center of the front axle. I moved stuff around from the front to the back. I started out first with every thing evenly spread out between all for bags with an additional 8 lbs more on the back rack, then ended up moving all of it to the rear to get the least amount of wobble. At higher speeds then 12 mph felt like the front was going to rip apart so we had to ride the brakes all the way down the hills. All three of us had the same issues. To take your hands of it would go either way.

[@MD_il_microcanale]

@@richardnelson4976 io ho la vecchia LHT con ruote da 26 pollici e freni cantilever, ho notato questo fenomeno quando ho cambiato le gomme, passando da delle michelin alle schwalbe, forse è un problema simile al mio. Spero che nel 2024 abbiano risolto il problema del forcellino della forcella anteriore, che col disco tende a muoversi dopo una frenata vigorosa. Vedendo questo video ci sono rimasto davvero male e sono molto perplesso dalla brutta piega che ha preso questa azienda. Spero davvero che tornino a fare bici come un tempo

[@richardnelson4976]

@@MD_il_microcanaleI tried 3 different tires and sizes, still had the problem. I found my replacement for it, picked up a brand new Trek 520 Grando and packed it up to the max of 275 LBS and no problems with it so far. Normally I ride with 65 to 85 lbs of gear based on availability of food and water

[@MD_il_microcanale]

@@richardnelson4976 mi dispiace che esistano anche questi problemi. Fortunatamente nel mio caso è di piccolissima entità che ho risolto inserendo un piccolo pezzetto di sughero sul tirante del cantilever che struscia leggermente sulla calotta fissa della serie sterzo! Amo il mio telaio & forcella surly (comprati nel 2017 e montati nel 2018 con pezzi che avevo già). Credo che sia il primo modello della LHT, ancora non c'erano i foderi del carro ridotti ed i forcellini con l'asse passante... Io ci ho costruito una MTB vecchio stile, che uso su ogni tipo di terreno. Spero davvero che in Surly ci ripensino su certe scelte che stanno facendo e che tornino a fare telai come un tempo senza seguire le mode o le altre case. Ho avuto vari tipi di MTB ed ad un certo punto della mia vita ciclistica ho visto che non mi divertivo più come quando avevo la MTB rigida. Odio dover revisionare la forcella, l'ammortizzatore, i freni idraulici a disco. Io voglio solo sentire se le gomme sono gonfie e partire.

[@cccpkingu]

Finding someone to repair a rim isn't as convenient as getting a new wheel. You can't run inserts when you have a through-axle frame, but you can run a QR axle with inserts on a through-axle wheel. For touring remote areas that is better.

[@ME-hm7zm]

Ever considered a video on expectations for replacement parts / service in developing regions?

[@Cyclingabout]

Probably not a specific video, but I will try to weave my experience with sourcing replacement parts into my videos.

[@esemeropuescomono8092]

Un gusto conocerte ! En el ocote! Aguascalientes México, saludos!,,, y buenas rutas!

[@somewhere0verthere]

Way late but if anyone hasn't reccomended it yet, the velo orange, Copenhagen kickstand solves that leaning problem. It's a doubble leg mid monouted kickstand that I've had on my disc trucker since I built it.

[@atexnik]

3:20 Central kickstand is still not the best option, since it interferes with the crank. So, you can't just turn the cranks backwards while lubing the chain, when the bike is standing on the kickstand. Thus, the best option so far is the rear and optionally front kickstand or a front wheel locker. Unfortunately, very few manufacturers understand this, which is really annoying, as it seriously limits the choice. Kudos to Koga, Trek, Marin and other manufacturers who pay attention to this important detail.

[@atexnik]

@Milan depends on the actual load.

[@joramvandervorst7715]

When i check the website of Surly btw. I find the wheels to be 36 spoke types, not 32. So no downgrade in strength there.

[@Cyclingabout]

I counted the spokes on multiple press bikes. They're all 32, so I think the website is incorrect.

[@joramvandervorst7715]

CYCLINGABOUT shame if that is correct for the production model, they do talk about 36 spokes in their introduction vid, so we can ask them?

[@joramvandervorst7715]

I checked the original Surly vid and at 3:00 the lady says ‘36 spoke wheels’ so it’s confuuuusing 😝

[@Cyclingabout]

Yeah, I don't get why they haven't changed the specs. Perhaps the press bikes are pre-production, but until I have proof, I'll leave my information as it is.

[@Cyclingabout]

Just double checked, it looks like the Bikepacking .com guys got 36 spokes! This gives me hope.

[@derekthompson4561]

I have ridden bikes for more than 60 years and now found the Recumbent trike is so much more fun to ride and the aerodynamics are much better than a bicycle now its no looking back if the bike lanes were wider I would be riding a quad cycle.

[@co7013]

The even more upright position is a no no for me. As is a kick stand. A touring bike (for me) should be as sporty as possible while being able to carry the necessary load without budging. For me my Crossbike (Rocky Mountain Solo CX) is the perfect sporty touring bike. Fun, fast and sturdy enough to carry the stuff I need. Bar end shifters (3x9) are a must! And I upgraded the bike to these samen TRP Spyres with 160mm rotors as are on the Surly. Haven't yet tried them out on any downhills with weight on the bike.

[@nathanaelshumsky2977]

Yea the 36 spoke thing is weird. I've seen 36h rims on The Surly disc trucker in some stores but then in some stores noticed 32h. Weird 🧐

[@Jthe5th]

Also in 2020 they have no replaceable derailleur hanger

[@robertschmidt4408]

Ouch. That's a deal breaker.

[@Cyclingabout]

They have never had a replaceable derailleur hanger. In fact, Surly have almost never fitted replaceable derailleur hangers on their bikes.

[@Jthe5th]

@@Cyclingabout what does it matter what they did before, they launched a new version with new features

[@Cyclingabout]

@@Jthe5th Cmon, you really think a couple of decades of building bikes means nothing???

[@Jthe5th]

I cannot wish for replaceable derailleur hanger just because they never had it before? They claim in their video that new standards appeared in the mean time and they are going ahead.

[@andrifsig]

The lack of a kick stand is a non issue with touring bikes. Just get a click stand instead and issue is resolved. Also I think its kind of a cool one man organisation to support.

[@Cyclingabout]

I've got one, but it's nowhere near as convenient to the stand I'm currently using. I can get off my bike and deploy my stand in about a second. 😎

[@2WheelsGood.01]

Too much weight, I'll pass on the stand hah.

[@albertbatfinder5240]

A stand is essential, IMHO. Rode 2 years without one thinking “Naah I can manage”, then borrowed a bike with a stand and instantly remembered the convenience I’d be missing. Just because a bike doesn’t have mounts, doesn’t mean you can’t have a rear kick stand. I don’t have mounts on my Trek 520. Presume you could fit one to this Surly? As for Click-Stand, yeah, OK, but it’s another “thing” to manage, and it’s pretty irksome for a busy city footpath.

[@Cyclingabout]

250 grams is worth the convenience a few times over!

[@mickeytaylor1499]

Question can you put flag bars on a Sutra? How might it handle? Thx

[@alradhi.j3009]

big skewer handle looks macho when detailing. thru axle makes any steel bike looks even better.

[@myheartbelong2oi]

I know nothing about touring bikes, but why have the bar end shifters? Does it have something to do with carrying bar bags etc?

[@Cyclingabout]

It's just the most simple form of shifting. The integrated shifters used to be quite unreliable (I was having problems as recently as 2013 Shimano Ultegra). These days, it's hard to find integrated shifters that match the cable-pull ratio of mountain bike derailleurs (to achieve off-road or touring gear ratios).

[@myheartbelong2oi]

@@Cyclingabout ahhh fair fair. That makes alot of sense, thanks.

[@lorenzoantiga1463]

Hi, I have very strange body sizes. I'm looking for a trek 520 or another touring bike but I'm not sure for the size. My height is 182 and my inseam is 92 (very big). What do you suggest? For Trek 520 height I'm in 57 (56 cm top tube), for inseam in the bigger one

[@Cyclingabout]

It's best to get sized up from a bicycle shop, as inseam and height are not enough information alone to make an accurate judgement. But usually you would size up if you have long legs for your height, as larger bikes have a taller front end height to match. You can then reduce the reach to the handlebar by reducing the stem length.

[@ykb946]

Love that Bike!

[@vickaiser]

Can you give some advice on compatibility with a belt drive and Rohloff drivetrain on the disc trucker? Will it work? Love your videos

[@Cyclingabout]

There is no Rohloff/belt drive compatible frame in Surly's lineup.

[@vickaiser]

@@Cyclingabout the veer split belt won’t work?

[@stevemullin1195]

Can you put butterfly bars on the disk trucker

[@andrewnorris5415]

Nice bike. I find using a SRAM 9-speed shifter with an SLX 10 speed rear mech works well for reliable adjustment-free shifting. I also use a full outer cable.

[@tristandesade8635]

Not only disappointing, but also still ugly. Many functional better looking touring bikes around. On the flip side, it's so ugly it's unlikely it'll get stolen.

[@tuco0x]

What bicycle has all your favorite components out-of-the-box? Perhaps some exists for a select few. And anyone serious about their bicycle either puts one together themself or replaces parts anyway, I'd say. Therefore, any pros/cons of the model should be restricted to the frame and not the components on the frame because that all depends on who built/sold the bicycle.

[@Cyclingabout]

The KOGA WorldTraveller I ride comes with all of my favourite components out of the box. The only thing I've changed from stock is the seatpost, saddle and grips.

[@jambonsambo]

agreed i never judge a bike by the stock components , the stock parts are just the answer to an economics problem for a profit making company

[@PRH123]

That’s how we were doing it still in the 90’s, most serious riders would buy a frame, and a groupset separately, and build it up according to one’s own tastes.

[@horaciodedona3912]

I own a raleigh sojurn. It's 10 years old, It is like a truck but unbreakable. heavy but dependable.

[@yiezhe]

Hi, can I know whether I can put a 700c to the 26" framebfir the 2021 disk trucker?

[@Cyclingabout]

nope

[@yiezhe]

@@Cyclingabout thanks.

[@RollingExistence]

Totally insane not to be 3x10 with bar ends for this price. Surly making weird calls but still building good cheap frames as always. Last two surlys I've bought as a frameset.

[@Cyclingabout]

The frame set is definitely the go here. 👍🏻

[@frankbob_3548]

A lot of Marin bikes have a kick stand mount, including the Four Corners. Similar style to the Trek 520. Great content btw. Cheers.

[@frankbob_3548]

...except the Marin has a KSA-40 mount, instead of KSA-18 as found on Treks.

[@Cyclingabout]

I actually never noticed the mount on the Marin because it's usually hidden by the quick release. Great to know, thanks!

[@alankoslowski9473]

Nice review, and I agree the Sutra is a better bike. I might build up a Sutra frame with a Bafang mid-drive motor. While I understand your points about kickstands, you seem a bit overly obsessed with them. I'm very much a minimalist, so while they're handy to me they aren't essential.

[@Cyclingabout]

I just think that given it's such an easy feature to incorporate into a frame, why would you not at least give your customers the option?! Then I can fit one, and you can save 250 grams.

[@abhinavsixfaces]

I kinda think that 160mm rotors are too small for heavy touring. I find that 180 is the minimum and I use metal pads and thick discs with downhill TRP brakes.

[@nickwf70]

Yeah ridiculous, big hills, heavy load, 160 utterly useless. 180 as min.

[@AnonymousPhucker]

I tried to find your oats and lentils breakfast/lunch recipe seen on some video but didnt find it ? Could you please point me to the video ?

[@Cyclingabout]

It's in my Trans Ecuador video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/o2qwimiNedyVnZI

[@SnootchieBootchies27]

I love Surly frames, but their parts spec is always way off the mark for me. Thus, I just get frames.

[@andreashoppe1969]

If I had to choose between a trek 520, a surly DT and a kona sutra, what would be the best and why? I am 6.4ft tall and I saw that kona sutra doesn't have a frame larger than 58 ... why kona, why trek, why surly? Thanks

[@Cyclingabout]

In my "best touring bikes for 2020" video I ended up picking the Sutra because it is $200-$300 cheaper than the others but comes with the best components of the lot, including a 30-speed Deore drivetrain, a 20″ climbing gear, TRP cable disc brakes, a rear rack, fenders and a Brooks B17 saddle. It’ll also clear 29×2.2″ tyres without fenders if you plan to do any off-roading. The sizing number is a bit weird with the Kona. The 58cm works out to be the equivalent of a 60cm Surly, and about halfway between a 60cm and 63cm Trek 520.

[@wahyuaryo6680]

plz i need answer how about geometry this bike? its more better than the old one or worst? th for the answer

[@Cyclingabout]

It's pretty much the same, but perhaps a bit better for taller people, a bit worse for shorter people.

[@Metal-Possum]

Americans touring bikes seem slow to adopt 650b wheelsets too it seems? Commonplace in Europe since the dark ages of cycling!

[@Cyclingabout]

Most touring manufacturers have switched to 27.5/650B or 700C! It's really just Surly...

Wouldn't a 27.5 wheel on the smaller sizes of exacerbated the higher stand over height of the new geometry?

[@cjohnson3836]

Yes. And privileged white guys tramping through East Africa isn't enough of a customer base to keep a business afloat. So, they're trying to reach a wider target with 26 and 700.

[@Cyclingabout]

They would need to re-design the frame around the new wheel size. But it's very possible, there are smaller touring bikes (in terms of standover) in my list that use both 27.5" and 700C wheels.

[@AydinProductionsLtd]

Looks like a fail from a company that should know better. Im someone that buys bikes and build them up to my specs. That way I'm satisfied with everything.