They Did Him Dirty - Nurgle vs Empire & Dwarfs // Total War: WARHAMMER 3

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[@DrRipper19]

"They Did Him Dirty" me: oh no, they screwed up Tamurkhan... "They did him dirty by releasing him alongside other really cool stuff that is good at killing him" me: oh hell yeah

[@bubbasbigblast8563]

*Officer:* "Welcome to Customs, ma'am. May I have your full name, please?" *Elspeth:* "Elspeth Von Draken." *Customs Officer:* "Do you have anything to declare today?" *Elspeth:* "My pet dragon." *Customs Officer:* "..right. Any other items you need to declare?" *Elspeth:* "My emotional support scythe." *Customs Officer:* "..I'm..going to need to see all your documentation for the dragon and scythe." *Nemesis Crown:* "You hearing this $@#&, Elspeth?" *Elspeth:* "Not now, Crown."

[@-nav-398]

Slightly disappointed you didn't say the landship has a 'boatload of HP.'

[@shiggydiggy6847]

I kinda wish nurgle got something in the DLC that wasn't vulnerable to ranged and kiting in general like most of their faction has been.

[@DrRipper19]

Haha I love how the Land Ship doesn't cause terror, presumably because it's so ridiculous Whenever I see something overtuned like the dragon laser, I hope that CA just makes it extra expensive until they're able to take a proper look at rebalancing.

[@DALKurumiTokisaki]

I would rather just see the Carmine dragon mount be quite expensive rather than a nerf to the Breath. The thing is firing a concentrated beam of Shyish Death Magic so of course it's gonna hit like a truck.

[@rubric-eo5yj]

@@DALKurumiTokisaki they should remove it's homing ability though

[@giantent763]

It would be cool if it didn't cause terror by default but if there were some condition to activate it causing terror or fear. Maybe throw a black flag on it.

[@brago900]

It is a breath exclusive to Elspeth's mount, it can be allowed to have a little extra punch compared to the rest of the breaths.

[@woodlands_]

Kinda wish all breath attacks were that accurate tbh. Dragons should be smart enough to know how to aim at moving targets.

[@worstprofessor895]

KZbin comments pre-release: YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, DAHV! KZbin comments two days after release: Yeah, that shit is broken.

[@DahvPlays]

All part of the fun lmao

[@frankehfightaz]

OP or not that laser blast looks so cool

[@rubz1390]

"Unkillable" toad dragon lol.

[@AnRaksha]

Gentleman Jenkins needs his army roster to include at least three of these. Need to have landship battles with the necrofex

[@matthiasdecker6877]

So the only difference between carmine dragon and moon/black dragon on tabletop was it got a disgustingly powerful breath make sense to do some serious damage, probably should lose the homing though

[@R3GARnator]

Grandpa Nurgle likes it dirty.

[@PenguinWithInternetAccess]

Poor Carmine Dragon having to carry such a big saddle 😢

[@valnir1944]

I don't think I've ever seen such a lopsided battle

[@frankehfightaz]

Toad Dragon gotta be one of my favourite monsters, animations are so good

[@KartarNighthawk]

I mean, isn't it just a somewhat modified Jabberslythe?

[@brago900]

@@KartarNighthawk No, the toad dragon reuses the skeleton of the Dread Saurian.

[@frankehfightaz]

@@KartarNighthawk functionally it is similar to the jabberslythe, shame we didn’t get them instead of cygors from the beast man hero

[@emultra759]

The Slayer tag (WS cannot be reduced) is pretty cool. Poison, various magic debuffs, Wounded status etc. will have no effect on their weapon strength.

[@wile123456]

Lore of life getting a visual upgrqaqade is nice. It's great they update the old lore of magics over time. Even if it's just one per update and it goes slow, eventually every lore will be fabelous, so thanks to whoever, or whatever team, is set on overhauling the vfx

[@kalashydra9016]

3:40 the moment the battle ended lol

[@ravenhunter2157]

Love your vids keep the great work up!

[@ulatuleth8693]

That Dragon Toad should have been jumping in between the gunners I think.

[@liamcullen3035]

The toad-dragon looks sooo amazing! Its animations are fantastic!

[@juanbarbosasiguenza5883]

The marines model of the landshio shloud be used for the sartosa pirates

[@M0DIDDLY]

I'm fine with the Landship and Thunderbarge being these huge damage dealing machines that kill anything around them, but I still don't think either should have a big speed ability that just gets them out of trouble if they misplay them into enemies

[@karatekan2182]

Just increase the speed of the Thunderbarge to like 50, increase cost to 3200 and lock afterburner behind a tech in SP so you can’t use it in MP and it’s probably fine. Landship is too cheap. I get they wanted it to be lesser than the Steam tank, but the damage output is insane for the cost. 2000 would be more than fair.

[@KartarNighthawk]

The barge's afterburn needs to burn a lot more HP to be balanced. The Landship bothers me less because at least it can't turn when running.

[@emultra759]

The Kirov airship in Red Alert 3 has a speed boost with self drain as well, though there it really melts away the HP fast. It's only worth using if the enemy has serious anti-air on the way that would destroy it before it can get in range. Anything that bypasses a unit's balancing weakness should be costly and/or risky.

[@Ancient_Hoplite]

Can see Gelt being useful against Tamurkhan, stripping off all that armour and handgunners and arty having a field day.

[@Mr.Anderson__]

The toad dragon seems very underwhelming compared to the center pieces everyone else got.

[@pattenni]

Just noticed and not sure if it's new or not but what's the green icon on the health bar indicating? Healing I'm assuming.

[@DahvPlays]

Yep on mouseover it gives you the healcap as a real number, shows healing rate, etc

[@Saw7th]

Missile ressistance on the Toad Dragons and the mount for Tahm, should be increased. Up against 2 faction with high range power. They should have minimum 40-50% mildly said.

[@joeyawiki3315]

Can we give those resistance to Blood thirster and Keeper of secret too

[@wile123456]

After the DLC releases, please do a battle with SCM marienburg mod using the new landship!

[@Gibson7Clans]

I love that you can do Ramming speed ability of the land ship. To aid it in charge bonus stat. You can literally do ramming speed in to other constructs and giant monsters. As a true navy captain should in every movie. 😆

[@redsalamander9999]

Clearly, the Slayer Pirates are still capable of bringing down huge monsters and standing shoulder to shoulder with their fellow slayers. Just not with their melee weapons...

[@jordy4054]

I still think nurgle needs a bit more love. If they could fix the rotflys getting stuck constantly I mean id at least take that. Then id be more comfortable bringing them into battles. Which would help balance nurgle out a fair bit in multiplayer I feel

[@Gelwain]

I don't know whether you're creaming yourself, @Dahv, for having your empire fetish scratched rightly with this massive update, or feeling annoyed that there's no room for your beloved pistoleers with all this new stuff you have the play with!

[@DahvPlays]

Elspeth's campaign mechanics produce the strongest ever pistoliers so it's all aces

[@borgCube100]

Have Empire State-Troops got a visual update? Their shields look a lot beefier and cooler than I remember? Like they look more solid, compared to the more wooden and flimsy looking ones. Might just be stupid ofc x

[@Arhatu]

CA hates Nurgle but Nurgle loves all.

[@Ratt611]

Empire going to work on tamur 😮

[@gunnerjensen5998]

So my initial thoughts are that the empire updates are mostly fine. They'll need some tweaks but nothing insane. The dwarves however will likely need some serious adjustments. That daemon slayer ability line is just insane. Buff after buff. Slayer pirates need a pretty serious nerf. I'd get the AP value bumped down a bit and might also look to halve the missile distance. Make it where they need to be in a precarious situation in order to use that missile fire. Slayers shouldn't shy away from a fight. Not shown in this battle but the barge also needs a massive nerf overall.

[@darkomihajlovski3135]

Eslphet needs serious nerfs and empire infantry need a cost increase it's way too easy to defend their range with so many bodies Dwarfs are fine honestly beside how broken the thundebarge is all their other units are fairly balanced do to how squishy they are even the pirates will get destroyed by basic archers

[@gunnerjensen5998]

​@@darkomihajlovski3135 I can get behind Elsphet getting a nerf, but for the most part I view their infantry as very average across the board for melee and ranged. The infantry won't melt away but won't run you over. The ranged doesn't instantly delete you but will hurt if not taken care of. I'm fine with that balance. I'm not super familiar with the lore but in my head I think of slayers as primarily melee based infantry. To me this was CA giving the dwarfs super free company troops. The dwarfs unlike the empire will absolutely hold their ground and now have a unit that can delete whatever is in front of it.

[@arn1345]

@@darkomihajlovski3135 lmao nerf empire's mediocre ass infantry. i want whatever you're smoking.

[@darkomihajlovski3135]

@@gunnerjensen5998 empires infantry quality isnt the problem it's the amount of them you get while still having a strong range and cav force, the new steam tank and barge are gona be brutal againts malee factions cause you have to use large units to kill them but the empire can throw so many bodies to protect them while still having a good amount of cav and range to support them their ither gona not kill them and lose or kill them and then not have enough to finish off the empires remaining units, Theres no rule for slayer weponry they just go with double axes to honour their God the dwarf legendary lord is a slayer who invented the thundebarge and these a slayer pirates there not your standard slayer also iron drake torpedoes and rangers with throwing axes exist so it's not like it's the dwarfs first short range high ap unit

[@darkomihajlovski3135]

@@arn1345 their numbers are the problem not their combat performance empire infantry is almost as big of a swarm as bretonias while being more cost effective, there getting more expensive or the barge and tank are gona get nerfed back to being niche your not getting both

[@Matt-ln7lb]

Honestly, I think Tamurkhan on his toad dragon is just too expensive. He's as expensive as Ku'gath, maybe even a bit more (with typical kit; Toadurkhan is 3300, Ku'gath is in a similar range), definitely isn't as strong for blob fighting, and he isn't your caster, so you need to spend another 1000 or so on that. I can't think of any match up where you could ever justify him in a competitive sense. Even vs factions that can focus fire a big monster lord effectively, Ku'gath is likely to perform better, and vs factions that can't (like VC), Ku'gath is just stronger, so there's no real place Toadurkhan. Sure, he's more mobile than Ku'gath, so he can sort of pick fights and dive the backline, where Ku'gath can't, but you get 1000 more funds in units + Nurgling summons with Ku'gath, which you can use to compromise missile units anyway. Ku'gath also has ~3000/25% more HP and 10 more armour than mounted Tammy, not to mention the physical resist and +14 melee defense making him more resistant in melee. On top of that, being an anti-infantry monster means that he's not particularly good vs the typical anti-monster options of the non-missile factions. VC, Chaos, Ogres, other chaos factions, Beastmen, lizardmen, etc... all have anti-large monsters/mostrous units that they're likely to bring to help deal with the potential big monster lord from Nurgle. On foot, Tamurkhan is fine - he's anti-large, still reasonably fast, still hits hard, and has plenty of HP with a smaller body, and costs 1300 less. There are plenty of match ups where that'll do well, especially as Nurgle kind of struggles for anti-large - Rot Knights are cool, but they aren't particularly good vs anti-large monsters and such; Plague Ogre GWs are better at that, but still probably aren't enough. The RoR Plague Drones and exalted plague bearers are decent options, but still have their own issues as anti-monster tech - the former being very expensive, and the latter being slow, short-ranged, and also expensive. Having an anti-large SE lord with over 8000 HP is a solid option. Vs Dwarfs, I think the choice will either be the Nurgle Chaos Lord on rot beast, or a Sorcerer lord as before. Probably the same vs empire - cav/warhound overload with maybe some tech (exalted plaguebearers and/or the RoR plague drones) to answer the land ship will probably be the way to play vs empire. The Chaos Lord giving nearby units -40% WS (Poison + Icon + paragon; disregarding poison, and assuming it's already active because all Nurgle units have it, the other two combined are a ~30% effective damage reduction) is pretty great for both single entity brawls and for supporting your line, and with 71 melee defense and high armour, he's a tank, and still dishes out very solid damage with 540 (390AP) WS; it's unlikely he'll be bad in any match up. Tamurkhan (on foot) might have some teeth vs empire, but I think the chaos lord/sorcerer lord still probably make more sense.

[@Manlikepegasus]

You fully missed what seemed like a pestigor charge on the back line in the first replay. I dont think you noticed it happening, cause you fully ignored it during the replay. Poor pestigors just wanted some screen time.

[@commandoX94]

You cant just run Tamurkhan right in front of 3 pirates to give them a perfect firing conclave and keep him there long enough for them to discharge all 6 of their volleys, then complain that they did him dirty, cmon now

[@rubric-eo5yj]

why the hell does elspeth have a homing breath attack? no other dragon mount has that

[@DahvPlays]

Raisins

[@Eclipsed_Embers]

apparently the main thing that made Elspeth's Carmine Dragon special on tabletop compared to Moon Dragons and Black Dragons was that it got a stupidly powerful breath attack. that's probably what they were trying to represent.

[@jamescooke7243]

i saw some guys saying it was better to put him in without the toad dragon. hes still considered large but much harder to hit than the giant toad

[@sethjk8871]

I havent played with it obviously but that is a common trend even with other nurgle lords, the speed boost often isn't worth the extra missile vunerability

[@DahvPlays]

Yeah and he's surprisingly cheap on foot

[@Eclipsed_Embers]

also, whether he's on Bubebolos or not completely changes his battlefield role. when he's mounted he's anti infantry and when he's on foot he's anti-large.

[@emultra759]

Basically only use the toad dragon in matchups where LM would use dread saurian?

[@zeggsy0554]

Do the anti large and anti infantry Slayers need to have the same Symbol? CA plz....

[@joshmilner4864]

I highly doubt the dronglongs are better then a OP zeplin. They did look crazy in this batttle tho. Agree that Nurgles best unit is more then likely the rot beasts and Empire is landship.

[@navox933]

Pound for pound value maybe

[@looming_]

@@navox933multiplayer is all about cost efficiency.

[@willfrancescofini]

@@looming_^ Midnight Marauders great album

[@looming_]

@@willfrancescofini man of culture

[@sonnydarko6910]

No pestigors.... this makes me sad 😢😢

[@wile123456]

Toad dragon is the big loser this DLC, but good thing the lord can be on foot and be better that way

[@Hovardov]

Very nice!

[@looming_]

Embargo ended today right

[@Eclipsed_Embers]

I'm pretty sure they can post everything except their actual reviews at this point (though let's face it, with the exception of Legend (who often seems very vague about how he feels about stuff unless it's a video dedicated to that) the content creators always seem to make their opinions pretty obvious long before they're allowed to do a proper review) I think the reviews are supposed to be allowed starting on the 29th

[@Mrz-bq2yb]

Large monsters should have a sizable missile resist. Low tier missile units shouldn't be deleting monstrosities like toad dragons and dread saurians.

[@calebbarnhouse496]

I do think they need helped, but the real issue is the low teir missiles, not the higher teir missiles, really what needs to change is how accurate they are, low accuracy units are just to accurate when shooting

[@eumaies]

looks awesome

[@rubz1390]

Bile trolls seem to trolls seem to be exactly the same as river trolls. Is there anything that makes them special?

[@kubka4]

Technically they're the opposite of river trolls, although achieving similar thing. River trolls lower MA meanwhile Bile trolls lower MD. So one makes the other units to do less dmg, meanwhile the other makes the units around take more dmg.

[@rubz1390]

@@kubka4 still seems lame. Didn't CA say they would have a aura that reduces MD and armor at well...

[@kubka4]

@@rubz1390 not sure about that...

[@flosko]

@@rubz1390 They do have that i think, at least looking at the blog

[@DahvPlays]

MD debuffs (and MA buffs) are great for nurgle because they have low average attack

[@paulverhoven3549]

1 match. He do what he can. Literally charges with 1 unit rot knights against 2 units empire cavalry and lord. Also running around with tod dragon not even attacking free company and 2 flying units just die stupid. Second match with same scenario. 3 units of enemy gun units just stand and shoot your lord to the death. Normal players dont play matches like this. Whats why you use flying or fast moving units, to occupy enemy ranged units when your forces crush enemy front line. That was a not smart play in both matches and you know all things need to do, just dont do it. Sorry for my english

[@willfrancescofini]

Dahv should not have used this replay. At that point you play another match, maybe put the more competitive player on the less competitive faction. I’m not even gonna watch the last 75% of this video, looking for decent Nurgle replays lol

[@charlie6327]

No doubt Okoii was having fun, cackling throughout. If you want more replays Turin has some at the end of his recent big stream

[@Matt-vw2bs]

I like how you do only multiplayer, but really an extremely small amount of the player base "plays" multiplayer battles and honestly they should never balance with it in mind because this portion of the game is irrelevant plus Temerkan get crazy missile resist in the campaign which is all that matters.

[@Eclipsed_Embers]

also, just in terms of thematic matchups it makes perfect sense for Nuln and Malakai to get the tools they need to counter Tamurkhan this entire DLC is themed around the battle where Tamurkhan finally lost and died, of course the other 2 factions would get stuff that beats him. looking at what each faction got I think CA has done a really good job at making Tamurkhan's faction an absolutely insane threat whilst making sure that Nuln and Malakai are able to beat him when he finally comes for them

[@calebbarnhouse496]

They should do some balance with MP in mind, namely, MP cost, and restrictions, however no unit's stats should be touched for MP balance unless you plan on keeping that stat change seperate to MP

[@rubz1390]

These games are still very much ranged focused. The engine itself was made for ranged combat.

[@CW11721]

As somebody who likes gunpowder, I see this as an absolute win

[@rubz1390]

@@CW11721 pity Warhammer art makes it look melee combat is the focus

[@mrfrost6211]

.......how is this a legitimate complaint? First shadows of change sucked and everyone complains now this?

[@ian2372]

I left warhammer 3 after the chaos dwarves dlc debacle. I've been thinking about coming back just to play Nurgle again. I hate how they price the new DLC though. PS, dwarves OP. Nerf!

[@Eclipsed_Embers]

"They did him dirty by releasing him alongside other really cool stuff that is good at killing him" I mean... canonically speaking they released him alongside the factions that he went up against, lost to, and died to. it kinda makes sense that Nuln's (and Malakai's) side of the DLC gets all the tools it needs to put a stop to him because that's exactly what Nuln did in the story.

[@jibbanibba2000]

This game needs a sex update