Debunking this NEW morel mushroom myth

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Thank you for this video. I want to correct some of your speculation, especially around the death of my husband Peter. First, I have been working with MT DPHHS, the FDA, and the CDC for the past 14 months. Our remaining morels were DNA tested by the CDC and were found to be true morels of the genus morchella. Therefore the hydrazine toxin, not the gyrometrin toxin from false morels that metabolizes in the body to a component used in jet fuel, is beginning to be suspected of building up in the body over time. There is research from Europe, where they have been eating mushrooms longer, that supports this theory, and more research is being done here. These agencies are interested in my husband's case because there were no underlying conditions per his autopsy report. The CDC conducted a second autopsy and agreed with the medical examiner's conclusion of "acute necrotizing gastritis from the consumption of foraged morels." Autopsy results from one of the restaurant fatalities was "acute gastritis" as well. You are correct that this type of reaction is rare. A research study out of Turkey, where 294 people had adverse reactions to true morels included 2 fatalities. Everyone agrees that more research is needed. But, the 1% or 2% fatality risk is important to emphasize. The risk of dying from the flu is less than 0.01%, but look at the precautions taken. More of our remaining morels, which were dried to crispness and stored in sealed pint jars with no evidence of bacteriological or mold contamination, will be used in an upcoming research study. So, again, thank you for your video, which stresses important facts about identifying and cooking morels. Eating in moderation should also be stressed. One of the two MDs who were on the trip with my husband and I are continuing to extensively research this topic. Each person needs to decide for themselves if the risk of consuming morels is worth it. If you are one of the 1% or 2%, it is 100% fatal for you, even though rare.

[@VAinWI]

Thanks for sharing.

[@FeralForaging]

First, again, I want to say that I am truly sorry for your loss. I think we are on the same side in that we both want more research to be done to understand these cases of morel toxicity better. I am going to pin your comment so people can see it and my response. Thank you for adding clarification. As I said in the video, I never really suspected that false morels were to blame. I am working on a companion article for this and will be sure to add the new information you’ve presented. There are a couple of points you make that need further discussion. First, you emphasize a "hydrazine toxin" in morels. As was presented in the video, there is no evidence to support the content of hydrazine or any of its derivative chemicals in morels. We can't just start stating this as fact; it will only add confusion and make getting to the bottom of this more difficult. I personally think it is improbable that morels do contain any hydrazine chemicals. This is a group of chemicals that we have known about since the late 1800s. It would be strange that they would be discovered in the less frequently consumed Gyromitra but somehow have eluded discovery in the far more common Morchella. The only evidence that we have suggests the opposite, that morels do not contain hydrazine. You also reference the degree to which the morels your husband ate were dried. It has been observed that drying greatly reduces hydrazine chemicals in false morels, so I also wouldn’t suspect it in your husband’s case in particular. Believe me, if hydrazines are ever to be found, I will be among the first to share that with everyone. I just don’t think that day is ever going to come. I am most frustrated with the mycologist, who I really think should have known better. Her claims were based on speculation and incorrect information on the bioaccumulation of hydrazine chemicals. I don't think I understand where this 1-2% fatality risk percentage is being calculated. Certainly thousands, tens of thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands of people consume morel mushrooms every single year. If that were fatal to 1-2% of people, it would mean thousands of deaths, which is not the case. I do agree that morels, like all things, should be consumed in moderation, but the bioaccumulation claim is not supported by any evidence. Without knowing the exact toxins involved in these cases, I don't know if it would be possible to prove the bioaccumulation angle. I think it would be very difficult to isolate the possibility of bioaccumulation from the fact that people consuming more morel mushrooms is just more possible encounters with toxic effects. I cannot say what happened to your husband. I wish we did know. One day, I truly hope we all will.

[@objective_psychology]

Imagine if people reacted the same way any time someone had an unexpected reaction to a cultivated food. There would be literally nothing considered safe. Absurd 🤦‍♂️

[@AFMR0420]

Panera bread energy drinks were literally an over dose in a cup and people were drinking them until they died, so they made sure to advertise that their soup is “now clean.” Absurdity is the name of the game. But I’ll never eat Panera bread again, because what drug dealer sells an overdose on purpose, and do I trust that same company to make me food they think advertising as now being clean isn’t admitting that it was dirty? They beat chipotle for food poisoning related deaths that year.

[@batzzz2044]

They are super duper duper scary you guys......I will take it upon myself to pick them all so everyone is safe........

[@mushroomwonderland1]

Great video, thanks for the shout out. I learned a lot from your video, You went way down that rabbit hole and I appreciate it!

[@FeralForaging]

Thanks! I enjoyed your video as well and learned from it also.

[@jennystiglet1231]

I didn't know about these unfortunate events but I'm glad you shared your wisdom with us. I'm going to share your video.

[@YarrowPressburg]

Moved to the Pacific Northwest a few years ago. Morels grow in my raised beds and pots maybe because I add burnt wood to my soil. I do not see them in the forest. The morels look really creepy,did not know what they were till this spring. Thank you for all the helpful information.

[@BlueJadeU]

Eat those things. They're so yummy. You have a treasure right in your own backyard.

[@danieldeanharrison]

That’s dope I wish they grew like that for me.

[@kynaston1474]

Man, I ate fried morels for decades then one day they almost killed me. I was so sick. Stomach cramps, diarrhea, I can't stress just how bad the cramps were. This honestly checks out for me. I'm now sensitive to ALL mushrooms. This was an annual ritual for me and I assure you without a doubt that they were cooked thoroughly and cleaned properly. I did it the same way every year from my teens into my thirties exactly the way my father taught me.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Thank you for posting this. It is remarkably similar to my husband's story and supports the hypothesis that is being explored by the CDC, FDA, and other research exploring the possibility that the hydrazine toxins in true morel mushrooms can build up in the body over time. Yes, a fatal reaction like my husband's is rare, and I'm glad that you survived your reaction. Research is difficult on this topic, because each morel contains a different amount of toxin, which can usually be cooked out to "safe" levels, and because each person's body reacts differently to these toxins. My husband ate morels for years without issues until his last meal that killed him. No one knows how long he cooked the morels, although he was experienced at gathering, preserving, and cooking the mushrooms.

[@pattheplanter]

As both of them were affected, the likelihood of allergy is negligible. Both of them developing allergies to morels at the same time seems unlikely. The fact that the morels had been home-dried seems more likely to be the problem. They had been stored for 21 months before use. The fungal and bacterial microbiota associated with morels is very diverse. It includes such notoriously toxic genera as Aspergillus and Trichothecium. If any of those were given a chance to grow, either by the original drying being insufficient or by getting moist during storage, they could easily develop lethal quantities of toxins. Many of those toxins will resist cooking. Oral exposure to trichothecene mycotoxins can cause vomiting and diarrhoea with gastric and intestinal lesions. I would recommend never using passive drying with mushrooms. Get them totally dry as soon as possible. A fan blowing up through or across the top of fungi on a hammock of muslin is my favoured way. I used to have a dehumidifier in a bodged-up cabinet that dried a kilo of mushrooms to a crispy, powderable state in 6 hours. The tastiest dried mushrooms I have eaten. If you have gathered a lot of mushrooms it can be tempting to pile them too close together when drying, in an abundant morel season, for example. It can also be tempting to think they are probably dry when crisp to the touch on the outside, rather than testing all the biggest ones for any flexibility.

[@pattheplanter]

I have read further and I think it might not be the preservation. Trichothecium is a mycoparasite of living, growing fungi. If it had attacked only one of the morels, it might be difficult to detect. The stock in the rice dish would have some of the toxin but one morel would still have the most. Mycoparasites of wild fungi do not seem to have been studied often, except as biocontrol for spoilage and plant disease fungi. There are a wide range of mycoparasitic fungi that produce a wide range of toxins. Fusarium, Trichoderma and Trichothecium are all widespread genera that are mushroom parasites and produce trichothecene toxins.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Thank you for this analysis. I will share it with the agencies and researchers who are continuing to look at my husband's case and our remaining dried mushrooms. I don't know if tests exist for identification of the contaminants that you mention, but I will look into it. One of the disturbing things about my husband's case was the rapidity of the fatal result, less than 12 hours after consumption.

[@pattheplanter]

@@ColleenHunter-f6r From what I read, there are tests but the quantities of the chemicals involved are tiny. It may be easier for them to detect the DNA of any invasive organisms. I hope forensics can find some explanation for you. I am sorry for your loss.

[@studporkchop]

@@ColleenHunter-f6r my only thought is are you absolutely sure every mushroom gathered was a morel. I am not a expert of mushrooms but there may be some that are toxic but look alike.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

@@studporkchop The FDA did DNA testing of our remaining morels from this harvest. They were all true morels. Although there is no way of knowing if the consumed morels were all true morels, it is likely that they were, based on the DNA testing of the substantial amount of morels from this harvest.

[@nycwen]

Really great video! Thank you for making this!

[@jeil5676]

Your mention of morels possibly containing hydrazine like compounds reminds me of a study I was shown in which a surprising number of mushrooms actually contain amatoxins, including boletes and I think it was edulis. There were others on the list I forget and I no longer have access to the list, but it was interesting.

[@cezarcatalin1406]

1.) Can you grow Morels at home in a controlled environment to ensure safety? 2.) If some mushrooms are grown at home using clean substrates, which ones are safe to consume raw or undercooked and which ones must be thoroughly cooked? 3.) Which mushrooms need further special preparation techniques besides cooking? (leeching, lye washing, acid washing, etc)

[@hongotopiadada7574]

1. No, Morels are Mycorrhizal so they can't be grown sterile. But they are also grown in green houses like vegetables. 2. That list would take a lot of time to make. But your always better of cooking them, not just for the taste and nutrients. 3. non of the *edibles* I know of.

[@OrionAon]

Really great coverage Jesse! This topic brings up an interesting disucssion about what we consider a deadly mushroom species. Gyromitra esculenta gets lumped into the deadly category by some resources, but its eaten regularly in some parts of the world. Should morels get the same treatment now? Or maybe that should only be reserved for the species that are always deadly toxic like the Galerina and Amanita species. 🤔

[@FeralForaging]

I would say the latter! We don't call chicken deadly, despite its capacity to be so if consumed raw, so to me, the same should apply to wild foods as well. I'll be expanding upon this in my upcoming pokeweed video too!

[@OrionAon]

@@FeralForaging I agree!! Looking forward to the pokeweed video! That's a plant we don't get out here!

[@potterylady44]

I really appreciate your channel❤❤❤.

[@_mycotroph]

Thanks for your hard work, King I figured you'd go into detail on the fact he ate precooked packaged rice, which carries its own host of deadly food poisoning risks. Cooked rice when stored improperly could have been the culprit for the canoe guy

[@garyv2498]

Was any sort of toxicology report done on the man who died? The obituary seems to be speculation. For all anyone knows, he didn't wash his hands after accidentally touching some poo. Then he handled the food, or it's a camping scenario so the contamination spread because they weren't as cautious as one would be in a home kitchen. Because he cooked wild mushrooms everyone leaps to the conclusion that the mushrooms were the source of the toxin. Maybe he added some ingredient he found while on their trip and misidentified it. Then neglected to mention it to anyone.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Yes, full autopsies were done, including toxicology. Both the state medical examiner and the CDC completed autopsies on my husband, reaching the same conclusion of "acute necrotzing gastritis from consuming foraged morels." He was an experienced outdoorsman and was meticulous about hygiene on wilderness trips. Your speculation is unfounded.

[@pamelasmith7740]

What toxin or toxins were present? I am very sorry for the loss of your husband. I commend you for stepping up to provide what information you have available to you. Thank you for your courage.

[@伏見猿比古-k8c]

But is it actually caused by the mushrooms OR improperly store/expired/ or contaminated ready rice?

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

The Ready Rice was brand new and consumed on the first night of the trip. So likelihood of this being the culprit is low. Two autopsies were done, by the Utah Medical Examiner and by the CDC, and both concluded that it was morel mushroom poisoning.

[@morgotha42]

In all my life I had never heard Morels being dangerous. I also have never tried to eat them raw. I truly believe they were eating the false morel!

[@iraadams7459]

I love morels. My family has been eating them for several generations. No problems at all.

[@chaqillenikita748]

Very interesting! I hope people continue to safely and considerately forage, as it is beneficial in so many ways 😊.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Please read my previous response to your speculations about my husband's death. I am bringing awareness to the rare 1% to 2% chance of a fatal reaction, and the rapidity of my husband's death, less than 12 hours after consumption. Each person must assess their risk tolerance, but I would respectfully ask that you retitle your video. This is not about villifying wild foods or making ridiculous claims, but rather about the life of an expert outdoorsman that was taken far too soon, after only 69 years, and a situation that state and federal agencies all agree that merits further scientific research.

[@CricketsBay]

I am sorry for your loss. I hope the researchers find answers for you.

[@DaimyoD0]

Yeah TBF I'd say this comment warrants pinning. I think OP is maybe reacting to what he perceives to be unscientific fear mongering from people outside of the community; I'm sure he would regret saying anything to invalidate your story. I'm sorry for your loss.

[@DaimyoD0]

I suspect this comment is genuine, so hopefully replies will boost its visibility.

[@Ephesians617]

Great video and topic. I think that I remember the original article also stated that the man who passed away used some morels that he had foraged from 2022, not sure if his method of preservation was off or that maybe his mushrooms had just gotten old, but maybe he also preserved a bad one or two mushrooms without knowing it. One more point that I never heard the news speak of is... how do we not know that the uncle bens mushroom rice that the two men had consumed could have had some rotten mushrooms in it as well... As you have covered, there's just too many variables to land on only "one big maybe" as they have done with this story.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

These are interesting thoughts, which we also thought about. We did not air my husband's story until a year after his death, because we were working with state and federal agencies to try to get as much information as possible. The remaining morels from this 2022 harvest were DNA tested by the FDA and were all true morels. The Uncle Ben's rice risotto has not been recalled, although that doesn't guarantee that those ingredients could be safely combined with the foraged morels. Interestingly, one researcher has found that the arsenic naturally present in rice can enhance the toxic effects of morel mushrooms. People do agree that more research needs to be done. The NIH is funding research in this area, and my remaining dried morels have been contributed to this research effort.

[@rquest3059]

Thanks for the information, but if I can't grow it in my garden from seed packets, I'm not going to eat it. Except for berries and apples and fiddle head ferns. OK, maybe I forage a little bit. 🤔

[@ravvaktheannihilator69]

Me, my friends and my family have ate hundreds of morels without problems. But I always thoroughly cook them and clean them prior to cooking.

[@mysticthecatninja]

Thanks for the video

[@phluphfy69]

So glad to know this will never be a problem for me because I simply do not have the money to eat Morels and they don’t grow naturally in my area 😂

[@Solarpunk_SciFi]

The first time (since childhood with parents that I barely remember) I picked morels, aka accidentally found a little bit in a forest without looking for them and brought home, I forgot them in the fridge for a bit, and they were quite dry when I eventually remembered them, so I just put a little bit of water on them and microwaved for a few minutes. Quite a bit later, I'm looking through something and find the fun fact they're poisonous. Kinda scared, I could've sworn we used to pick them many years ago! Research more. They're only not dangerous when cooked really well or... Dried. And some ppl still say ADHD isn't a superpower, smh smh!

[@johnstevenns5830]

Did you just create a Reddit account? I'm just making sure it was actually you that replied to my wild strawberry comment 😁

[@FeralForaging]

Haha, yes that was indeed me!

[@danieldeanharrison]

K good. I usual inhale the whole morel plate during Christmas time. (If we can; we pick them in the spring, boil them for 20-30 mins and then freeze them till Christmas. It’s like a delicacy for our family, but we then pan fry them with onions and sauté them).

[@Liedaho]

One bite of Morel makes me feel lousy. I will be avoiding them.

[@DaimyoD0]

I found out about this from a content creator called Brew. ("How Eating Sushi Killed 2 People, And It Wasn't The Fish") I like his videos overall, but he has a bad habit of drawing conclusions on things he has zero professional experience with, specifically medical cases where people have died. I often try to express constructive criticism in the comments but, obviously, that rarely reaches the creator on KZbin. His video on the raw morel deaths was no exception; he equivocated on why the morels were dangerous, and then even used a picture of a morel as the generic mushroom icon in an infographic of deaths associated with mushroom foraging (even though we all know that those will largely be associated with Amanita species and misidentification).

[@FeralForaging]

Yeah, a big reason I needed to make the video was just to add a voice to all this noise that is based on facts and not sensation.

[@capndrake2507]

Early crew! Sounds like another great video

[@chaosopher23]

Maybe there is a microbial agent on the mushroom that creates the gyromitrin?

[@CricketsBay]

False morels (a common lookalike) contain the gyromitrin. Real morels do not.

[@chaosopher23]

@@CricketsBay Yes - which is why I am wondering if a microbial agent is doing it and we don't know about it. Microbes create just about everything else, why not gyromitrin? It would certainly be worth an investigation.

[@DaimyoD0]

@@CricketsBay 5:34 I mean, part of this video was discussing the hypothetical possibility that true morels could contain other unidentified hydrazinic compounds similar to gyromitrin when raw, but that they decompose and evaporate during cooking. So even if the specific compound in question isn't gyromitrin, speculating on a symbiotic biosynthesis isn't ridiculous, if unfounded.

[@FeralForaging]

I don't know what symbiotic biosynthesis means in this context, but to add clarity to the subject of hydrazines and morels, I think it is highly unlikely that Morchella contain hydrazine or any hydrazine derivative.

[@chaosopher23]

@@FeralForaging I know that. I'm wondering if there is a possible microbial agent involved that can make a morel... immorel? Much like yeast can make apple juice a bit more fun?

[@auroraprs9133]

Can we get tested ? Maybe there is an allergy to mushrooms? I bought recently a bread with some type of wild mushroom in it my head started to feel so painful I didnt eat the rest but i think some people allergic to mushrooms

[@therongjr]

How much is Big Morel paying you to make this video? 😂

[@averykempf9164]

😂

[@kilianp9213]

Trend surfing pays these days

[@handlesshouldntdefaulttonames]

The key takeaway is: everything is a gamble, enjoy as much of life as you possibly can and if a stupid mushroom takes you out, then that's life.

[@KarasuFantomclaw]

this reminds me of the people who confused destroying angels for an edible mushroom that looks similar

[@KarasuFantomclaw]

okay not quite but still reminded me of that situation lol

[@jennyl.3742]

The answer is no. ( I mean, idk...) I am alive. I've eaten RIDICULOUS AMOUNTS in my lifetime. My aunt Sandy made them for me back when I was just a fart in my momma's butt. True story. We would eat like 30-40 at a sitting. She'd be like, "You 2 girls ( my cousin and i) stop eating all the mushrooms and leave some for Bob ( Bob is my uncle)."

[@rquest3059]

"A fart in your mommas butt?" I truly have never heard that before. 😳

[@eightcoins4401]

Why does the sound disapear 3 minutes in?

[@Ronin--vo1cn]

Why is no one looking into the fuel source of the camper? Being a small cooking pot maybe it concentrated the chemicals

[@chaosopher23]

Hydrazines: very unstable: cannot accumulate.

[@Pooch1953]

I don't want to sound like an idiot, but one thing that came to my mind in the death on the canoe trip. Were Morels automatically blamed because they were wild foraged mushrooms? Is it possible that the packaged Uncle Ben's Risotto with mushrooms may have been the cause, is it possible the mushrooms in the mix already ( I am assuming it contained mushrooms because of the name) could have been the culprit? It just seems to me there was more food in that dish than just the Morels. Maybe I am just way off base, Still, a very good video and very informative. Thank you.

[@CricketsBay]

Prepared, stored rice can have a host of toxins develope in it which are toxic. There's a type of deadly food poisoning called "cold rice syndrome" because it's so common.

[@carebeary111]

It's actually totally true. All you morel foragers that have been doing it for years should totally stop. In fact, let me know where you usually find them so that I can avoid the area too 😉👍

[@Wowdude.]

This is total bs. I've eaten POUNDS of morels and never got sick all of my life

[@Luis-qr8gc]

So no eating raw psilocybe cubensis either?

[@Tracy-wr7mj]

they arent that great to me ..i like the king oyster..or grey oysters...

[@mr.silverware8512]

Yknow, a few years back there was some talk/research done that hydrazines are im shitake and button mushrooms and the like, so the question is if its new research or new propaganda? Personally i think the lack of clarity of the matter is what really sells it, the fact that confusion is made regarding the topic would scare people away, but thats j a theory, A MUSHROOM THEORY

[@carlbecklehimer1898]

I thought it was common knowledge not to eat morels raw.

[@Ephesians617]

Could the men have consumed some alcohol, namly Beer. I know from personal experience, years ago, that these two do not mix well AT ALL !

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

No alcohol was consumed. We were aware of the ties between the intensification of gastrointestinal issues by combining morels and alcohol...

[@grahamnorris7315]

I would never eat them raw. Also, don't breath the fumes when cooking.

[@FeralForaging]

This is under the assumption that morels contain hydrazinic compounds which there is no evidence of.

[@ColleenHunter-f6r]

Yes, this is a good point. The autopsy on my husband done by the CDC showed lung damage from the cooking fumes. Clearly the effects of hydrazine toxins need more research, as there seems to be disagreement on this issue. It is good that this is generating a lot of discussion. My husband would be the first who would not discourage foraging, since he really enjoyed it. However, I just want people to be aware that there is a risk, although fatalities are rare. People need good information to be able to make informed decisions...

[@miraclo3]

If you're scared to eat morels just tell me where you found them and I will go and test every single one for you. And by test I mean eat... :D

[@AFMR0420]

He ate sushi in a land locked state at a place called “Dave’s”. He basically begged to die. And it still doesn’t mean it was the mushrooms.

[@1ntwndrboy198]

I wouldn't buy any from china.

[@lordsams]

It all lies