Destiny 2: Not The Death Of Destiny, But Pain To Come

[@adamkilker879]

Kinda wild how not that long ago, destiny was at a peak and the talk was expanding into other media. Now we’re wondering if it will exist in the same form after final shape.

[@alex62965]

Its still so cringe to me how bad lightfall was, the peak players this game has had and they were all dashed against rocks because of how dog shit the expansion was. Embarrassing to play this game sometimes

[@emerald6597]

@@darkhollow2701 this is literally the same as people thinking ffxiv is over because the expansion is called endwalker. they have said 10 billion times this isnt the end of destiny and just the end of the light-dark saga. the reason it might be fucked is because of bungie executives poor business decisions

[@chelsthegameruiner8669]

​@@emerald6597Poor decisions and confirmation that executives didn't care to give players what they've been asking for

[@LateNightHalo]

I’m not sure destiny can even expand into other media outside of maybe an action-heavy anime. The characters of destiny are pretty shallow, the lore is getting increasingly written into a less interesting place and brand interest is not nearly as big as it was back in 2014-2017

[@cryengine_x]

get woke go broke!

[@AndrewOnYoutube]

I thought Prophet of Doom was the shotgun from Garden Of Salvation?

[@ryanariola2574]

It is. Good call

[@Otak646]

It is but it Also has meaning

[@johncompton4761]

I think bungie missed not introducing a new enemy race (like cabal or fallen) with the arrival of the black fleet.

[@elijahleighton1390]

Absolutely, with how much weve visited darkness themed environments the past few years it wouldve been a great addition. couldve had vow be entirely that race with rhulk at the end.

[@choerrycola7666]

The whole ‘the witness is a whole civilisation merged into one being’ was 100% to avoid making a new race. Defo to avoid the extra effort/time in making a new race

[@choerrycola7666]

The whole ‘the witness is a whole civilisation merged into one being’ was 100% to avoid making a new race. Defo to avoid the extra effort/time in making a new race

[@Sekironprime]

Easily could've been like Tormentors but a lower tier of them They don't even need major lore, could've been the Witness's recreation of former Disciples

[@xiphosmaniac]

@@Sekironprime i 100% expected baby tormentors. Kind of like the hive thralls, except the only way to one shot them is by hitting a big ol weak point in their center mass. I dont even want them to have heads....like just make them a tormentor mark with legs. Wouldve been super fucking simple.

[@TrueVanguard]

Hey hey for the record I did NOT say you were off base, I said you were fully justified in raising concerns given the context! As far as I recall, I don’t think I actually said anything contrary to you or cross!

[@CronusChronicles]

I was always taught “there is what was said, and what was heard.” Personally thought you were clear though. Lol

[@abagofT]

My thoughts entirely. Just an oddly volatile subject, and I think we all just want this game we love to succeed.

[@TwistedToast-k05]

​@fitnessandgaming Yep. Just like how all Paul said was that TV called him out in good fun, yet TV seems to have heard something more confrontational

[@CronusChronicles]

@@TwistedToast-k05 ha! Fair point

[@Samurai_J5]

The problem is Bungie higher-up executives made a dumb choice of increasing the price in monetization for very little content. They thought they can get away with it and have lower management to take the blame. And developers want to make the content over-deliver since the demand of monetization is so high that it should match what consumers/players are paying for. But, their model to not over-deliver is what forced the developers to throttle their work, ideas and creativity to resolve the issues with the player-base. The higher-ups needs to be held accountable for the greedy-ass decisions and not have their bonus-cuts. They want money? Then they should have over-deliver a bit to make it reasonable for us to spend on. We, the consumer & customers are willingly to pay for the quality of the product and compensate whenever an issue had occurred. Other live-service games did this to stay connected to the gaming community as trust is important between both parties. This has been a glaring problem for Bungie for a very long time and yet higher-up executives only care about earning revenue and bonuses in their pockets. It is common sense where if you want the customers & consumers to pay more; then you need to give something a bit more than usual. You can't cut corners and give them such little content

[@Anonymous-bk9xy]

Pro Tip: Never let marketing in charge of the product. Marketing is marketing, product is product, end of story. Bye-bye, say it no more times.

[@therealzyrix]

I think you nailed it. They took things that made up for other holes in the content (dungeons) and slapped a separate price tag on it, they kept doing this while constantly dropping the ball on the base experience each season and now it's kicking them in the butt.

[@alex62965]

At the end of the day if bungie doesn't deliver what the player base deserves then people will stop playing. And hopefully that will be a lesson to the rest of the game industry. But knowing the d2 community and how fickle we can be all is needed is just above bare minimum and everyone will sing praises.

[@Samira9129]

@@alex62965 you’re last part made me laugh cause it’s sad but true..I most probably am one of them.. 😅

[@Dhunt17]

$100 for the entire year. womp womp just say u broke

[@scoobypup01]

Bungie: “We got new stuff!” Gamers: *jump back in to play* “Where is the new stuff?” Bungie: “Eververse, all new cosmetics!”

[@exxy9931]

Everworse*

[@Voxelsan]

So true

[@ujaku_]

I think you and Cross are being realistic about this. TV is a nice dude, but also clearly an optimist. I don't think we can justifiably look at the Destiny situation with an optimistic perspective right now all things considered. 2018 was a year of optimism for Destiny, 2023 is a year of pure concern

[@TzrcWolf_]

Majority of his video was taken as a joke I believe. I don’t think anyone believes Destiny isn’t in a bad state right now besides one guy who said the game is F2P and started calling anyone entitled for waiting a said F2P game to be F2P. Anyway, moving back to the main point, TV did say a lot of things that aligned with the community opinion, it’s just the severity and amount of hope people contain that differs.

[@pestyoverlord]

TV is delusional, bro has been grinning while playing the trash pvp on console for a decade 💀

[@reamoinmcdonachadh9519]

So Bungie (as a Studio/Developer) is discovering the perils of overspend/overproduction in the same way that the Movie Studios did. It lead to the consolidation and restructuring of the Movie Industry, which never recovered itself 'back' to it's "glory days". Times had changed, people's tastes had changed, the economy had changed and the means of consumption had changed. Bungie will have to adjust accordingly. Ramp back on quantity, ramp up on quality. And above all roll back, or at temporize the price of stuff in the Store, stop being egregious price gougers.

[@Perq1]

I was under the impression the high burn rate was all of bungie, not just Destiny. They were spending so much money because they were making 5 games while only making money from one.

[@simonh7954]

You nailed it. I actually for the first time in many years uninstalled it! The last thing I purchased was Lightfall. have lost all interest tired of mundane tasks. In the past, I always knew I was coming back this time I knew that I was not.

[@John_II]

That feeling right there, is why I quit at the end of Beyond Light. Never played Witch Queen, never played Lightfall, because there was a huge spike in the quantity of content but a huge drop in the quality. The last mission of Season of the Lost dropped with only one week to go in the season and it dropped bugged. There was no mission for the ritual weapons it was just reset your Vanguard/Gambit/Crucible Ranks twice to get the weapon and the skin. That right there was emblematic of the way was D2 was going. Don't think, just grind. Don't ever stop playing because then you might miss something! I burnt out. I never got the ritual weapons in Season of the Lost because I was never going to reset all three ranks twice... and I love ritual weapons - they come master-worked and do cool stuff. Remember when getting a new exotic was doing The Whisper? or Zero Hour? or Cayde's Stash? Remember when we could just play the story at our leisure instead it being time-gated week-by-week? I missed those days and I realized they were never coming back. Quit Destiny 2 almost two years ago, and I've never played since. (I pop onto KZbin once in a while to see what's going on and frankly, I'm glad I left when I did... I actually wish I left at the end of Shadowkeep.

[@myp3tmonster]

I'm firmly in the D3 or bust camp now, i don't think anything they can realistically add to D2 will be enough to get me playing as regular as i used to.

[@Dietghostscp2107]

Agreed. Final Shape is for the friends I've made along the way. Beyond that. I don't see a future without D3.

[@Scripzure]

same here.

[@NathanShepard]

I have recently come to that thought as well.

[@Spike2276]

I've been on this boat since Beyond Light

[@johnsmithson4479]

What would D3 do that is different, aside from some performance stuff?

[@Cumbernumb]

Completely agree with u on it already being obvious Final Shape won’t be as transformative or massive as an expansion like Forsaken and Taken King. No new enemy race, no new darkness subclass, hell not even a new reskin of an existing enemy race, no new weapon type, no big game changing feature like crafting, no big new quality of life feature like loadouts, hell I have zero faith we’ll get more than two strikes at launch and pvp maps will obviously release multiple seasons after the expansions launch even with the new strike team that was affected by the layoffs. These r the types of content that can’t be added with a few months delay. It would have to be delayed by a year to get half of these things in probably.

[@emmaholley560]

as a new recently new player to the game (like started 2 weeks ago), the biggest turn off for the game is amount of sunset things such as activities, story and gear. feels like i cant get the full experience so i honestly think a full fresh game would be the best path for getting new players and returning players who havent played for a while

[@oxsila]

Destiny 3 is a great idea in theory, but the reality is it would just be a slightly prettier Destiny 2 where we spend the next 5 years getting reskinned weapons and content back into the game because people miss the old content

[@djdewitt]

To your point Paul, I play Destiny for the story because the live service gameplay model can't evolve gameplay fast enough compared to numbered releases. I'm exciting for Marathon to give me a fundamentally new type of gameplay (hopefully!) and I'm exciting for The Final Shape to finish off the narrative that keeps me buying expansions. But frankly the Episodes as described right now I'm treating as "take a break from Destiny during the Episodes and come back for the next expansion or a Destiny 3, which I'd prefer"

[@swissshstyle]

The people that wanna go down with the sinking ship that is Destiny 2,are part of the problem imo

[@dkat1108]

Well said. "Pain to come" this next season is going to last forever, 7 months wow ! I could be pushing up daisies by then.

[@John_II]

Haven't been to your channel in a while - congratulations on over 95K subscribers and 2+ years of content!

[@AleksandrStrizhevskiy]

I like your takes on video games and thoughtful commentary on the industry. But I don't play Destiny. I wish you would make more content on other topics. Also, any chance you'll appear on the Friend per Second podcast soon?

[@KlaelDemon]

My thought, and hope, is that Episodes will be a way of delivering on more content variety, and updates/overhauls to the core systems of the game. The seasonal model has delivered more and more quantity of content over the years, but has failed to create any meaningful innovation, and hence why a lot of players feel that it's beyond stale. I think their resources need to be substantially reallocated in "what" they are making. I've been playing a lot of World of Warcraft: Dragonflight this year, dipping back in as a long time player. While I haven't agreed with all of the story decisions, this expansion's overhaul to so much of the core WoW experience, and delivery on quality of life, has reinvigorated my enjoyment of WoW in a way that I haven't had in years. And the response from a lot of the player base has been similar, Dragonflight really pulled WoW out of the very really spiral it was in during Shadowlands, and has put it on a good path. We joke all the time that a "Season of the Quality of Life Updates" or a "Seasonal of the Core Playlists" wouldn't work, but I think something like Dragonflight really shows it can. And that's my hope for what they do with Episodes.

[@cordovalark5295]

Bungie worked on Halo for around a decade then decided to leave MS, and the Halo IP behind and those that stayed behind formed 343 and that eventually led to the death of Halo. Guess what turns 10 next year... Destiny. Bungie burned through $1.2 BILLION dollars in just over a year and it sure as shit wasn't spent on Destiny. Doesn't matter how many puff pieces Paul Tassi keeps putting out for Bungie, or how many videos Datto puts out making excuses for Bungie to use. Players are no longer playing, and it is a chore. Lightfall was beyond stupid. Now the question is will Sony have a studio take the Destiny IP over, or they just allow it to rot on the vine. Which it is doing now even though Bungie is still not done with it.

[@red_menace1829]

Look ive said it before and ill say it again, as someone whos played destiny since 2014...I literally do not care at all what Bungie does to the story or even DLC, it wont bring me back, it wont reunite my love of the franchise, and why? Because this happens every time, game falls off..they make an absolute banger and then it goes RIGHT BACK to the same bullshit like before, it ALWAYS happens, Bungie and the fans get comfortable and we do a whole merry go round of the same shit.. Not to mention, im just tired of how they tell stories, its the same episodic garbled mess, it never progesses or goes anywhere significant, it simply is outdated and boring, every story beat has lead to the same paths and outcomes.. Im tired, im done, im not wasting anymore time or money on this game, and I certainly hope many more wake up and move into better shit. Enough is enough

[@StrangeChickandPuppo]

It wouldn't delete itself while ppl were watching; it would stay up through however long they had the tab open; some people could still have it open conceivably. In general (with some exceptions) when you browse the web, it stores the info on your own machine, so you're actually browsing local files on your machine. YT pre-loads videos partially nowadays, so it's possb to watch what you had downloaded so far, and just went swirly-loading at the time it was deleted.

[@snarferyasmr3739]

For any real upswing post "final shape" they need to say soon "this is the next saga...." it could be a year plus out, but the player base needs to be told "this isnt THE END"

[@radtacular2218]

To that effect, maybe content creators and Twitter personalities/accounts could cool it a bit on gleefully emphasizing that Season 23 is the LAST season of Destiny 2. I'm seeing it all over the place, like people can't help making the tongue-in-cheek clickbait reference. But in reality there is likely some portion of the population that sees that and, perhaps combined with all the bad news lately, thinks "oh wow, I guess the game is shutting down and Final Shape is the finale; oh well, guess it's not worth getting into." I mean look at how many people responded to last week's TWAB by tweeting things like "did you forget you were supposed to tell us about the Stasis changes, this is the *last* TWAB before the next season, LIARS!" when the TWAB clearly stated there's another one this week and they'll preview S23 in that one. There is clearly a segment of the population that aren't reading things or thinking critically; I feel like repeatedly stating S23 is the "last" season of Destiny 2 (while technically true) will have negative consequences.

[@snarferyasmr3739]

@@radtacular2218 agreed, bungie would be smart to keep reminding people of the post- final shape "episodes" at the least.

[@KurtQuad]

The problem is that if you stepped away from Destiny for a good length of time it's just confusing as hell to get back in.

[@LunaJLane]

I am seriously burned out on the grinding and reskinned content that we keep getting in place of anything creative. The kind of content Bungie is putting out is very boring and does not interest me in any way so there will be nothing that will ever bring me back to playing Destiny 2 unless there is a massive shift in content delivery that finally gives us amazing content. I don't see that this will happen with the bean counters running things.

[@oxsila]

It seems for the most part, campaigns and raids carry an expansion Witch Queen as an expansion only really added crafting. Which many people argue was to the detriment of the game. The patrol zone is super lackluster. The activities like Wellspring are so repetitive and boring. But the campaign and the raid's were great. So people view it as a great expansion.

[@DJ_Dermo07]

I am one of those players who are quitting the game after Final Shape. I will still be keeping up with the world of destiny and it's story but through YT as I love this universe Bungie have made but I can support them monetarily anymore after all that's happened(talking about the suits not the people on the floor putting all the love and care into the game)

[@Drewbertttt]

Yall remember how Bungie was looking to expand the Destiny franchise into other media? Maybe a Destiny TV show or short series? The future was looking bright. Now we’re wondering if Destiny is even going to continue.

[@Acolyte_501st]

Content creators can really affect community sentiment, they should remember with great power comes great responsibility..

[@TACKO3D]

they usually have a trailer in the Game Awards. Could we get confirmation on the delay in a game awards trailer?

[@baldalicious]

It's called a rock and a hard place. Bungie needs more money to produce more content. Players want more content but are p-d because they feel they're being gouged. They'll play but won't pay. There's no satisfying solution to this for all parties. It's not our job to make Bungie profitable. I'm not gonna spend just because Bungie needs more money. The only true, viable solution is a Destiny 3 which most observers agree, won't happen.

[@tomekk.1889]

Bungie was fine before they decided to make like 4 games at the same time. Complete mismanagement and foolishness

[@taiidaniblues7792]

@@tomekk.1889 I don't think they were fine. They may have made some great expansions, but they considered that "over-delivery." They did not want to spend as much money as they did on say Forsaken. The reality, I think, is that Destiny's format may be financially incompatible with constant content releases. It may just cost too much to make this much hand-crafted content that they want players to participate in 52 weeks of the year. Games like Fortnite are much easier to develop seasonal content for, because most of the content is made by the players interacting with each other. Epic just needs to create the playground, skins, and some new weapons. In Destiny EVERYTHING has to be hand crafted. New environments, new story, new dialogue written, new voice acting sessions, new weapons designed and balanced, new supers, etc... It may just be that this type of game is not suited to have such a blitz of content releases to be the kind live service they envisioned. We may have loved some expansions/seasons and held them up as great, but I don't think Bungie thought that was sustainable. They clearly wanted to spend less and have us spend more.

[@bloodmoonangel8925]

You forget the stubborn Bungie higher-ups who always deny the devs from changing the game in a positive way in accordance to player feedback

[@NathanShepard]

Subscription.

[@jimmyjab8090]

@@taiidaniblues7792What are you basing that on? Because bungie has been growing VERY fast they have been making a lot of money from destiny for a very long time as was revealed when Microsoft was considering buying them before the Sony deal they are making a lot of money but they also have a high burn rate, undoubtedly trying to grow that fast and also develop multiple games has played a major role in their current financial problems.

[@EmeraldForester777]

Bungie needs to return to the D1 story mission format, add modifiers and scores so you can compete with friends, and maybe mission specific rewards to encourage replaying. that kinda format could keep me entertained in between content updates.

[@slickusaf78]

Does anyone know if bungie utilizes an outside company to find and fix bugs? I ask because it seams as though each season continues to carry over game breaking bugs without even a check from bungie... respawning glitches, suicide finishers, tower/vault bugs.. they just stay with the game, some from even before WQ.

[@Hardrive2677]

The long season will give me time to finally hit rank 11. I’m gonna make this last year of Destiny worth it somehow. Whatever comes next might be terrible but I’ll still remember the fun I had with this franchise. Bungie will never redeem themselves but I will always love Destiny. It’s been a fun decade. I’ll look back on it fondly.

[@slickusaf78]

"Prophets of doom"? Na, just reading the writing on the wall.. we see it too.

[@PatrickWaddingham]

I've played Destiny 2 for about 6 weeks now. The story is pretty neat, but I had no problem not "finishing" Season 22 content, and I was OK learning random bits and pieces as I did previous content via quests, strikes, and general bumbling curiosity. I've noticed that Destiny doesn't ask for much money. The seasons last forever, the Halloween event didn't feel like it was offering anything worthwhile, and I bought some silver for a cosmetic. I mean, how much more am I suppose to spend on this?

[@xiphosmaniac]

thats reasonable. The problem is the whale community that buys every fucking cosmetic bungie pumps out the second they get put in the store. Every single one. Bungie isnt asking for much money from you, because you arent the player they are trying to communicate with. They are asking money from the whales with all the ridiculous cash shop items literally every patch, with no scraps or bones to throw to the 99% of the playerbase to earn. I saw someone say this, and it rings true. "Nothing hurts more than asking where someone got their drip, and the answer is the cash shop." (in regards to another game.). I think how you do it/did it is the way to go.

[@rechelieu]

@@xiphosmaniac In Destiny 1, those Psion hunter capes were obtainable in the strikes. In Destiny 2, you most likely would have to pay for them. Eff Destiny 2. It's a cash grab for real. Nothing to play for unless you are stupid and pay for it at Eververse. The games has become a joke.

[@jonathanedwardgibson]

I’d like them to dust-off and invigorate old D1 send-off Iron Triumph armor and weapons during this extended Summer Vacation we are marching through.

[@jrockz133t]

My POV is, yes the game is in a bad state, player sentiment is low, numbers are low. But its the end of the 3rd season of the year, this year has been insane for gaming and the options are great the last few months, and the next few months are gonna slow down in games so live service games like D2 may succeed

[@kaantoa795]

there is no reason to keep playing after final shape and they’re already doing poorly.

[@nucklehead718]

I’m about to start dealing copium because y’all are addicted to it. Anyway most of the comments like this are bias and whit knights. Bungie aren’t the only ones responsible for the game being how it is but it’s also you white knights being bias and dishonest that also contributed to the state of destiny. One of those you made your bed now lay in it situations. When ppl were fed up with the bs years ago and were calling Bungie out about it, y’all said no it’s fine. Even told those ppl to leave n play a different game. But even after all the evidence y’all still can’t be honest with yourselves and face the truth. Paul is one of these people too. We thought it was Actovision… remember? Now let’s look at it like this from D1-D2 there’s been 2.5 good expansions out of HOW MANY? Those 2.5 being The Taken King, Forsaken, and Witch Queen for the .5. That’s it.

[@jrockz133t]

@@nucklehead718 I've been hyper critical on destiny for a while now, but I've also been here for over 10 years now in this community I've been here through the worst and best. I recognize the trends, the rise and falls. I'm a loyal DSR Joker watcher since Warmind. This year isn't 100% because Lightfall failed, or community backlash or overmonitization. This year is loaded with games. This year, inflation is up, so spending is dropping. Hell, spending will probably still be down from 2020s peak for a while. Do I think next season will be better? Yes, not amazing but better. Not a lot of great games are coming Q4 or Q1 next year

[@ilaril]

If next season is going to be six months, I won't return from my hiatus. I haven't played in little over a month and been enjoying The Division 2. Every week I log in to check the shaders at the store, but that's it. I will log in next Tuesday to see what the next season is, but I have a feeling that this is the end of Destiny 2 for me. Even as great as this season was story-wise, it felt way too long.

[@RyanVecchi]

Same. I've been playing since forsaken. Stopped playing in August due to health problems. The break made me appreciate not playing. I get to the character screen and ask "why i am playing?" lol

[@chrisborges7344]

Mtx prices are too high compared to the amount of content we get to play. Who the hell wants to pay $15 for cosmetics that get boring fast, and to only run them for a few activities?

[@JohnSmith-uf3yn]

Rip pvp in s23, FORCING CHECKMATE DOWN EVERY ONES THROATS, removing regular control???? Earn your shotty + never get supers??? Destiny 2 vanilla? Trash bungie. Boycott pvp until they change this back to normal.

[@linkfain1]

I have to agree with the idea of going from seasons to episodes not being that big of a change. Think about it, Seasons are 3 months long but how long is the actual story of the season? About 6-7 weeks depending on what they release. Then it's weeks of nothing until GMs with maybe a raid or dungeon thrown in early, then weeks of nothing until the annual event (dawning, Halloween, etc.), and then more weeks of nothing until the season ends. The change to episodes (imo) won't shake up that formula. I think it's going to be a few more weekly fetch quests (go here, listen to this convo for lore, see you next week) and then we're back on the same schedule as seasons for everything else, but with another month of waiting on top of the normal 3 months. They can say episodes will dive deeper into the stories than they could do with seasons.... but the seasons are 3 months and the story is 6 weeks... so it's not like "Oh we just couldn't fit all this story into the seasonal model so this is better". It's going to be the same thing with maybe a few more fetch quests and lazy inkblot cutscenes and an additional month waiting. That's about it.

[@StrangerX9]

Glad you got your audio fixed

[@tonycGAMES]

Holidays are coming; casuals may want to play. Difficulty Levels and Loot is a good start to address.

[@JJ-gk5tn]

Bungie has to clarify what happens after final shape otherwise people will not Invest in d2 anymore me included In fact I will only buy final shape if destiny goes on otherwise I'm out And yes I am a die hard d1 beta player

[@StrangeChickandPuppo]

To me, the long-term Destiny 2 would be largely automated, which I think should have been done with Destiny 1. My idea is to (a) have the maximum power level increase by 2-3 digits each reset, meaning people will come back to grind out the max light. 2. Have more periodic events like Iron Banner. Maybe have Iron Banner every 2nd week of the month, but do other events like it, such as SRL, or something Infinite Forest related, and cycle in/out seasonal events just like Dawning, Crimson, Guardian Games, etc. They don't have to innovate every time, but new skins/etc would be cool and something to look forward to. 3. Reboot the ship and sparrow seller. In D1 we had a random roll of ships and sparrows to buy, and for some reason it still exists with Cryptarch but they don't seem to be random. Make it a place we can watch out for if a rare ship is available for that reset. 4. Return Iron Banner to power-relevant, so that there is a reason to grind max light again.. I think even without a major story narrative, just these things will build a consistent and long-term D2.

[@crabbypatty10fefrefe]

But… what does Evie think?

[@oc3891]

"...run the raid for more shaders." Listen i understand the sentence but don't you ever dare say those kind of things out loud again giving me the PTSD that follows remembering how systems were back then jfc those were tedious times 😅.

[@msteele0]

I think it's fine for Destiny 2 to end after the Final Shape year of content. All games need to end at some point. It's not like when new content ends we won't be allowed to continue playing it.

[@alexv.beaulieu2527]

Wow! I'm not sure if you said "EverWORST" instead of "EverVERSE", but I LOVE IT😂

[@Viflo]

Allright, I'm back with another Destiny video

[@dredgen0268]

So TrueVanguard/Paul Tassi 1v1 when?

[@exxy9931]

I have NEVER heard burn rate be discussed as much (or at all) in any other MMO/MMO-lite/MMO-esque game I have ever played than I have while I have spent time on Destiny. How are they having such an issue with it? What are they spending that money on when they're trying not to over-deliver?

[@kristophershephard7359]

I think the final shape will rock actually and I'm down for a delay if they can really give us the product that the developers want to give to the fans. Also I think a break in destiny would do people nicely to come back fired up. The episodes should be solid as well. As for marathon bungies track record of taking what's ok and utterly creating a mountain for the competition. Look at Halo and Destiny. Ten years is about right for bungie to create and deliver. Marathon if it's bungies view of the dark zones in the division will be insane. There is nothing in this world more adrenaline pumping and dumping than trying to get your gear out or some of the AI combatants. Bungie is going to struggle a bit but once again reinvent the wheel with a rocket.

[@Hamiltron_]

Audio sounds great today btw.

[@BrightPage174]

1 strike, 1 activity, the usual weekly chores as seasonal missions, some dialogue and a handful of books nobody reads. The raid is an outlier. Bungie has set the bar so low that seeing even one extra activity is enough to party over. Genuinely don't understand how it can take their entire budget and manpower to make more of the same things they've been making for the past 3 years

[@zTheBigFishz]

Why do we care about the internal financial health of this company? Either they produce content that one is willing to buy or not.

[@John_II]

Unpopular opinion, I miss the Warmind era. I know people love to hate those expansions, but I think when combined with the Red War, COO, and Warmind, we had a complete game and a cohesive story/intro to D2. Sure we didn't have random rolls and seasons, but at least you could get all the things. If I have one regret it's not doing enough Escalation Protocol and missing my Wayfarer Title - which now I can never get. I miss being able to stay on track to raid regularly - I have plenty of Leviathan and EOW clears - and having the more boring loadouts let me do that. Since Forsaken raiding got decidedly more hardcore and the weekly and seasonal grind got out of control. I have only one clear of Last Wish (I did it near the end of Forsaken, right before Shadowkeep). I know the community voted for seasonal content but there was something about not having to play every week, but you could choose to play every week. You played because it was fun, not because of FOMO. I loved The Whisper and Zero Hour, and finding all the trinkets on Mars... this game used to have secrets worth finding.

[@Forcer69]

Look on the bright side. The worst Destiny gets the more they’re forced to make something good. Then we repeat the cycle again, and again, and again, and again, again, and again, and again :(

[@naiko8412]

And again and again and again and again

[@RedShadowOfSaturn]

Almost like it's not that bright a bright side, 😔

[@b0mberman]

Or they just stop supporting this game.

[@nationharris]

For me, after Final Shape and the episodes that follow it then need to stick D2 into maintenance mode and proceed with Destiny 3. I love Destiny, I'm not a super hardcore raid guy with a clan full of friends, but I play the game and I truly love it. I've been playing D2 since launch. I argue they need a D3 because the game is so stale, so so stale. The core playlists are dull, the seasonal activities are boring chores and checklists to complete. "Go here, listen to that, kill these" and it's the same thing EVERY season - it's mind numbing. The game is a bloated convoluted mess. They need to rethink the monetisation of the game and yearly expansions. They need a slick onboarding process for new players. I find it harder and harder to play every season now. I love the game, I don't want to stop playing it but what positives are there about it anymore.

[@lanceseaman88]

Should go back to an expansion a year with no time gated content. At the half way point they could do an "April" update or a 30th anniversary thing or even something like a normal season. We do not need constant content all year contrary to what Bungie's wallet might think or a D2 addict.

[@UpstartApollo9]

Fishing is the only thing I do now in Destiny.

[@als1668]

Bungie's silence about what's to come after the final shape seems like they are just seeing how things will go. Underpromise and deliver

[@MrLongshotbob]

It is a pain to come, should I see a doctor?

[@someoneelse7287]

Audio sounds fine on my end. Good video.

[@scorpiokiller5937]

Why are some content creators saying that TFS will be delayed?? I honestly think it won't be. It would be so stupid to say it's coming out February and then delay it last minute.

[@RED-yx8pp]

The thing I can't figure out is how D2 gets record highs with Lightfall and STILL miss projections by 45%

[@UTxTheArchangel]

If Destiny's issue is player spending isn't matching the amount of content being pushed out, then slow down. In MMOs there is a term for moments of the game where there isn't really new content releasing. Folks just play for the sake of playing, waiting for new content, but doing so patiently until something drops. Other players use this time in particular to try other games. Destiny and its community need to get to a place where this is ok.

[@redfiend8746]

Problem there is that doesn't mesh with gutting everything but the main expansion (and a handful of Vanguard content) with every new expansion.

[@ado_fritos]

That's kinda how D1 operated. We had expansions, and then were feed random things like holiday events and things like April mini DLCs. With rose tinted glasses, I'm not sure if it was better than what we have with the seasonal model, but at least we filled in the gap ourselves knowing that the next drop would be quality.

[@Spike2276]

The problem is that Bungie only has D2 to rely on for cash, any time they aren't putting out conent they don't get to make money

[@jormungandr4690]

The problem is there is nothing to do in D2, the only replayable content the game has is crucible. Also this is a live service game, if no one plays it, it dies if no one plays it they cant keep the studio open. This is not like WoW where Blizzard has other games if WoW is doghsit and no one plays it.

[@hippo1985]

I'll be honest Paul, I gave up on TV's video after like the 8th bible reference, just made me leave without hearing his actual response.

[@paul_tassi]

I was the hand of god in the analogy so I liked it

[@hippo1985]

I do have to point out though, the Steam version of Destiny 2 didn't exist until Forsaken, the first year was exclusive to the Battle net client, it didn't exist on steam. I remember this because most of my clan (including myself) rejoiced as we no longer needed the Battle net launcher.

[@RedShadowOfSaturn]

I'm a pretty hardline agnostic and the bible references didn't bother me nearly as much as the thought that "it only takes one more viral video or moment to get Destiny on track," which frankly, at this point, 10 years into the franchise's life, the IMMENSE amount of drama and problems that have shadowed it all these years...THAT came off, to me, like delusion. There is enough pretty hard evidence at this point that Destiny is in pretty serious trouble. I understand people having unwavering faith in it, but the reality is...MOST, if not ALL, of Bungie's heavy hitter creatives have either quit, been fired, been laid off, or are working on other non-Destiny projects that NEED their full attention. Much like BioWare, who hoped for the "BioWare Magic" to kick in and save Anthem...the heart and soul that FUELED that BioWare Magic were long gone, and the magic had no fuel left.

[@archon9383]

It was a stretch, because TV didn't really have much to say otherwise. He didn't even push back against the doomsaying with any actual reasons, I think he just came up with a title he thought was cool and then ran with it.

[@underscore_5450]

Personally, the fact that Bungie still hasn't officially announced the delay nor quelled the rumors about it kinda kills any and all faith I still had in the studio. Bungie knows how close the community is with some of their employees. To go through with those layoffs and then go completely radio silent regarding the future of D2 is just insane to me when we were just talking about transparency. If we're less than 3 months out from the launch of the final expansion and we don't even know if its delayed or not, I don't exactly have a lot of trust for the future of the franchise. Bungie needed to get their shit together 6 months ago. Hell, 6 YEARS ago. I'm done giving Bungie the benefit of the doubt and holding out hope for fixes. The suits at the top have made it pretty clear that players like me aren't the priority so I'll take my time and money elsewhere.

[@MildsandThatYac]

Being too hard on bungie? How many times does bungie need to cock slap the community for them to wake up? In the wise words of Madara Uchiha: “ Wake up to reality”

[@jmaj922]

If anything I'd love for bungie to go back to evergreen content that we can do whenever we want and remove fomo and to break open the content vault and finally merge d1 and d2 into one game. Will it be big, yes. However, there a plenty of games that are already much larger and making a vendor for the seasonal content with newest stuff at the front would be nice and maybe once you collect all the weapon patterns and have the armor for ornaments for a season it phases that season out of the vendor slot for you. It might be a lot to do, but I feel like that and dialing back eververse to a sweet spot of profitable, but not overbearing will do a lot of good.

[@stainedroof5217]

Paul, my groups nickname for you is "chicken little." CL for short. Somtimes I worry you're going to end up on a corner in NYC with nothing but a crazed look and an end is nigh sigh.😂 Love ya man!

[@EmeraldForester777]

people probably don't realize how expensive it is to develop a title like Destiny 2. i know it's really hard to afford games but with the rapid expansion of the game the development costs have to increase drastically. i think the key to making a game like destiny work isn't to keep making new content but to increase replayability. i really don't think bungie deserves such harsh criticism especially because the community has been pressuring them for new content but is unwilling to pay for it which makes no sense.

[@Hoboski]

Already let’s see who will react to this one

[@MrZuriax]

Wake up Guardians, the Tassinator has uploaded the new hotness.

[@roost5932]

New season in a week, we bouta get our quarterly dopamine hit lessgoo

[@johnz7104]

ANTHEM has 500k unique players logging on daily..........

[@aldomartin2992]

They need to sell more in eververse, thats really their only way out. To get people in, they need to make the game more mainstream. Out of all the people ive met, ive met one or two people that have heard of the game. The only way i see to make this game more mainstream is with a pvp overhaul. Obviously add more fun emotes too, let me hit the griddy on Rhulk after i take him out

[@dvnwllms]

They can keep huffing the cyclical player count copium until they pass out, but the reality is already out there: they were on the verge of going under if Sony hadn't purchased them. This is not even close to the same thing as before. And True Vanguard's pretty easy if one dlc is enough to reinstall faith, knowing that the higher ups have been actively blocking good will efforts. Those people are still there & there's no sign that those attitudes have changed, so hell no, a "still got it" DLC is not enough.

[@ghostingyou1218]

Maybe if they slash the prices in eververse, they'd make more money on MTX that they need.

[@hylianglitchmobber7570]

9:29 exactly this. Bungie has already shown their hand and it's not impressive. We've seen the what Final Shape has to offer and nothing there seems substantial in any way

[@shinkenrock]

I honestly think the missions for the seasons should be free. I have a bunch of friends that don't buy the season and when they arrive at the next expansion they are so lost.

[@justifano7046]

Without the buyout from Sony bungie might not even exist. No way in hell will they give those for free

[@redactedredacted8107]

The Tass Master has spoken!

[@ErnieOporto]

Do t forget that they are still running the content for other seasons from this year.

[@tambulee]

The audio is OK on this 👌

[@Deeked]

When 30% of the budget goes towards story, lore, and cinematics, you end up in the state were in. Thank you

[@itshadouken]

And yet… Microsoft was still super pissed when they got turned down by Bungie… again…

[@joshuahensley9395]

I am not even going to bother with the final shape after lightfall the experience was so bad it soured me on ever going back

[@RH1812]

If Final Shape is simply a Halo style campaign which ends the saga I’m fine. Then theTraveller transports the last city to another galaxy…

[@flyingparkinglot1530]

I hate Bungie right now but those Witcher collab ornaments…ugh…they need the money, but it would be a huge community sentiment if it was free…oh god the decisions…

[@heartofquartz4909]

the destiny of destiny

[@liquidrufus]

Paul "Garden of Salvation Shotgun" Tassi

[@Nuck-Fo0bZz]

I happen to be one of those plays that have been playing destiny non-stop for the last 10 years period after the final shapes conclusion I'm out. I'm out, I'm out, I'm out

[@xslonk]

Controversial opinion here...but I don't think the game can ever be good until they completely undo the sunset. From their perspective, it's literally a mountain of unused assets. And from the customer perspective, we PAID for goods that are being withheld from us. Fix. That. First.

[@martyk656]

Absolutely. It's not controversial at all in the real world. It's an opinion held by everyone I know that has quit the game. Dozens of people and not one that thinks taking away content they purchased is anything less than criminal. Thing is, they are happily playing other games and moved on. They do hate Bungie utterly and completely and will be very hard to ever get fooled again into buying a Bungie product. They're why Bungie is in a free fall. It's only the addicts still playing that are willing to bend over and take it all that are apologists for Bungie's deplorable behavior.

[@cyberius6]

Destiny will "live" for at least 1 more year. The game can be "dying", and yet never actually die. Anyway - it's not happening any time soon.

[@Shorkshire]

It sucks that Bungie is brutally slaying destiny before they even got to capitalize on novels, TV shows, other media. Ugh....

[@kalemregier]

Purely anecdotal but for me, I’m burned out. 9 years is a long time to play a game consistently. If whatever comes after TFS isn’t a jump like Destiny was from Halo, I’ll be taking a years long break.

[@Clay_333]

I don't care about the story. I want a fun game. I know the story is important for many, but I won't continue to play a game that isn't fun just to see the story. I can't put my finger on what it is, but the more quality of life updates we get the less fun the game becomes. It all just feels like copy paste reskins of a past season. Destiny was at it's most fun in Warmind and the whole year of Forsaken. The week before Forsaken dropped where we could grind raids for 400 power gear and had just gotten special weapons back was the most fun I have ever had in a game. I know that feeling wouldn't last forever, but it just seems like there was a point around Beyond Light where every season I had less and less fun. I wish Destiny 2 would have ended at the end of year 3 and had a couple of year break and had Destiny 3 launch. Breaks in the game would keep things fresh. Bungie is at a point now where they have poured so much time and money into D2 that it's hard for them to realize it's dying and let it go.

[@michaelleffel4012]

You can’t fix destiny with more destiny