Curious Kwikset Kwestions (I bet you'll learn something!)

[@Corinth1311]

"This, among other reasons, is why we drink." This, among other reasons, is why we're all happily watching half an hour on Kwikset.

[@myrkurvr]

You respect our time but we respect your long explanation your talks are worth the time thanks for providing a uncut version I'll gladly watch both.

[@William_Borgeson]

Definitely learned a lot more about Kwikset than I knew coming into the video. Those pins explain a lot, never realized they were odd but it does make sense. I've raked a few of them open just using light tension but didn't find them challenging. The Smartkey line has been a bear, not one open sadly. Originally I was shying away from the Lishi tools, felt like I was cheating (I enjoy locksport, SPPing, etc), but could see a definite need for these tools for these types of keyways. Yes the super expensive scope that records is cool, but common man 75 bucks is a no brainer. Thanks Dev for keeping it real and engaging, any day I learn something new is a day worth living.

[@DeviantOllam]

Thanks for enjoying! Glad you made it through what is a rather long video.

[@jeffbrownstain]

You've had a lot of videos talking about these picks but seeing one in action up close and personal makes me want to immediately buy one.

[@user-md3is4dq2d]

I use them on automotive locks everyday, and they’re fantastic for lost key situations. And of course, you can skip the reach tool.

[@Loverest123]

Extremely informative. Thank you so much.

[@NothingPicksLocks]

Great job on the video. I think it is really neat that kwikset did this with the Titan and I think their reasoning was that you can use the Titan and interchange it with the standard kw1 cylinders in the same system. On my front door I have a 6-pin Titan in the knob but then a smart key gen 3 as my deadbolt both using the same key.

[@benjaminshropshire2900]

I wonder if that's also the reason for the long undercut: when acting as a KW1 locate off the top, when acting as a Titan/KW11, locate off the bottom.

[@NothingPicksLocks]

@@benjaminshropshire2900 yes that is exactly right. It is basically a dual shoulder stop. Top shoulder for 5 pin bottom shoulder for 6pin

[@alexandrezani]

That was fun! I would love to see something on identifying keyways... I find that manufacturers make so many similar keyways that I can never tell them apart.

[@error.418]

same

[@brianvandenburgh2200]

Great video... been locksmithing for years and you "schooled me", there is always something to learn! Love it!

[@karisnkatiesdad]

In reference to the Titan 6th pin position discussed at 5:20-6:00, yes, they were hard to punch, so this is why I believe KwikSet included a set of 1-7 depth keys in their re-keying kits for Titan locks. These could be used to create the needed |_/ cut on a wheel grinder duplicator for the pin position closest to the bow.

[@brucegraham6197]

Extremely informative. I have tried to use the Lishi KW5 on the Kwikset Smartlocks, but I cannot get the tool to fit into some of the locks I tried. I have no idea why the tool won’t fit into the key way and there is very little information online about it (other than people saying that it doesn’t fit). Specifically, it doesn’t fit into the Smart Padlock.

[@QazNotQuaz]

i had no idea those code panels had such good locks on them, actually! still relatively new to lockpicking, so it's really cool to learn about all this stuff

[@erg0centric]

Before Bluetooth I had a remote control titan lock, the type that was available before electronic keypad locks. Easy to see the red locked indicator LED from the top of the stairs.

[@theRockLobstaaa]

"I bet you'll learn something!" As if I don't learn something with every one of your videos!

[@DeviantOllam]

👍😁👍

[@johncage5368]

Nice detailed explanations as always. 👍 Extra brownie points for the Morpheus remark. 😉... Can't wait for the KW 4.12 with 7 pins ... 😉 Spoiler alert to everyone out there producing stuff: Have a consistent easy to understand naming scheme for your products. If potential buyers don't get it without a degree in your company history they go look elsewhere.

[@DeviantOllam]

hah... it's like surround sound. 5.1 means you have 6 speakers, right? =)

[@RealRickCox]

Any time I find a lock without a key, I love trying to find it's vulnerabilities. I've asked my local thrift shops to hold any locks they get without keys for me so I can get practice locks. There's something oddly therapeutic about laying in bed and connecting to what is happening mechanically inside a lock.

[@3nertia]

That was beautiful; thank you

[@tim8505]

Why do I love this videos so much?! Have never seen a ks key in my life.... (Europe) Still... keep up the videos I love them!

[@DeviantOllam]

Wow, I didn't realize they had such limited market penetration over there. I know Schlage is pretty global.

[@Ralesk]

@@DeviantOllam Can't say I've seen Schlage either, at least in my neck of the woods it's all yale keyway eurocylinders and dimple locks, old Elzett stuff were yale style too But well, that's the wrong side of the iron curtain so that might be the reason :D

[@aziztcf]

Same here, it's Abloy all the way.

[@tim8505]

@@DeviantOllam I think schlage is not so Common too

[@kevinkoepke8311]

You're right, I did learn something. Thanks DEV!

[@KeyLord42]

Just to add a little something, regarding that bottom cut on a Titan. For at least some of the locks, it's used for a control key to remove the cylinder. I believe it only had one depth, just as long as it had a deep cut. It was their attempt at an interchangeable core.

[@erggml1887]

I used to have one of those Titan locks. I am happy to say I learned a bit more about it. Thank you.

[@brxtmp106]

Thanks, I think you just explained why our second group of keys cut for our building’s kwikset smart key locks failed. Width of cuts! I’ll be checking that for sure since on first exam they all seemed cut identically.

[@FriedPi-mc5yt]

I bought the KW5 and got your set of spacers. Good to know I made the right choice.

[@doorandlocktips]

Hear me out I come up with a modified KW5 key to work in a six pin application and a five pin application. Here’s how I did it which I did not show in the video. I cut the first depth to a # 7 depth and use the number seven pin on that first depth and then I cut the original bitting of the building on the next five cuts on that same KW5 key, which makes it possible to not have to change the existing cylinders at all, hear me out hopefully you’re following me so far I modified the KW5 key by grinding the angles on the tip so that they go into a five pin cylinder plug all the way in with ease. All I did was grind the tip angles so that they clear the length of the five pin plug and not grind away the six depth closest to the tip just coming up to the front of that depth. This makes it possible to be able to use the KW5 key in my deadbolt and in the existing cylinders in the building and I love that retro key, it’s a nickel key and it looks cool my deadbolts pic proof due to the fact that the KW5 Lishi pic will not clear the seventh pin depth, but throws it up in the sheer line due to the fact that Lishi didn’t figure for a #7 pin depth view my video and then think about what I said it should make sense. If not, give me a phone call I think you can find out how to do that. kzbin.info/www/bejne/n3nEZ51_m6uLkKM 16:06

[@decafkitkat3892]

your videos are always entertaining and informative and its amazing how you find the time to respond to personal emails among your job and video recording schedule. I myself am saving up to afford attending one of your classes.

[@jordanmiles7712]

Thanks for doing these videos. That seemingly random fact or observation really sticks in my head and have found useful in other situations. I guess just reminding me to look at the other sides of the box 😊

[@BobY52944]

I recognize those softening rings from our sheep tack.

[@62Cristoforo]

Ouch!

[@gcflower99]

Always entertaining!! @20:43: "This allows you to use the pullout method." I almost choked on my coffee.

[@zonderafspraak]

Just bought a house and it had an old titan in the front door. Glad I hadn't thrown it away yet, going to add it to my collection now, thanks ;)

[@Sl0oMo0-y1t]

I basically learn something new with all your videos. Kw5 is very nice to have

[@DADeathinacan]

Well, I need to watch the extended version when I have time. Not sure why I need to, but I need to

[@DeviantOllam]

Happy to have you check it out, not because the views matter to me, but because you can laugh at more of my bad jokes that way. :-)

[@danareed1656]

great info! i just got a few lishis and this was one of them the kw5

[@andrewhaskell4841]

The house I grew up in had Kwikset Titan keys with the full "Titan" bow on it. Neat to know a bit more about them.

[@chrism4008]

I just got my spacers last weekend! 🤣🤣 oh, and they work fantastically well too, btw. Thanks fam

[@joshuaDstarks]

I actually did learn something here. The distinct bitting of kwikset keys, the rocking side-to-side in addition to the actual main placement, is exactly why my work keys, seemingly similar to others, must not be working at all. It’ll go in alright, but won’t turn a single bit. So…thanks!

[@asailijhijr]

1:42 Yeah, I think I remember seeing one of those in L. A. Noire!

[@mlebrooks]

Most of this is way over my head but I still am enchanted.

[@curtishoffmann6956]

"Mister Owl. Can you insert a KW1 in a Kwikset Titan?" "The world may never know."

[@DeviantOllam]

Heh, see the extended version. 😉

[@silvermages2]

Always fun seeing a mention of Lockmasters. Rip Mark

[@theekidd2053]

Wow thanks again I learned a lot!!! I had no idea there was that much to kwickset

[@carllewis2207]

Very interesting video. Thanks for sharing!

[@ssprinklep9107]

You've done it again! Thanks!

[@thomashendricks4470]

Excellent content Dev. Thanks for the info.

[@desert_jin6281]

I follow you and LPL. Even as a trained mechanic, I understand about 60% of what's said and shown. Maybe it's that puddle of water (Atlantic Ocean) well, watering down the lessons. But it's still fascinating !

[@PaulFisher]

I’m not particularly into lockpicking but as a former Hardware Store Guy I have cut my fair share of KW1s and even the occasional KW5, and it was cool to learn even more about the internals of these locks.

[@libertarian1637]

We use Titans for years and still run over a 1/2 dozen KW5’s. I miss widespread 6 pin Kwiksets. Its nice to know the Lishi KW5 will work on Titans as I still have some in the shop. There were years of Titan and KW5 series installed on businesses as they were rated at ANSI grade 1. Both Titan and KW5 were about the only Kwiksets that could have any kind of security for master keying given the 6th chamber, though Schlage is a much better system regarding mastering, when you want the ability to make easy copies. In apartment keying we love Kwikset as everyone has the ability to copy them; though we’ve switch to smart key Kwiksets due to re-keying speed; I’m not a big fan as they’re much easier for tenants to change themselves, and they aren’t nearly as secure as traditional pins. With traditionally pinned Kwiksets we’d always thread in grub screws to make re-keying easier as well a adding a little security.

[@georgeblair7129]

KW5 is used in the Abus padlocks and some pool gate latches. Titan keys were done that way to be backwards compatible with the regular locks. You left out the control key on the smart key deadbolts with the second control cylinder.

[@fooplinger]

Excellent video, lots of good info

[@AsmodeusMictian]

That note though.....got me laughing within 30 seconds of the start of the video :D

[@LuckYeti]

Great video as always, sir!

[@derekbroestler7687]

I do a LOT of work on Kwiksets, and we have a LOT of old ones where I live, so I didn't learn much BUT it was entertaining as always, a lot more than I expected from a video about Kwikset.... ESPECIALLY going into keyway nomenclature... Dev.... "So KW5 is a six pin, KW6 is a five pin, and this is at least part of the reason why we drink..." Me.... "Can youtube add an "upload gif" function, because if ANY statement has ever needed the "Thor screaming YES!!!" gif.... THIS IS THE STATEMENT....

[@derekbroestler7687]

You get into locksmithing and it's like "OK.... There's two BASIC systems of nomenclature, you've got your ILCO which is hard to remember, and your Curtis which is easy to remember but sometimes makes no sense.... ALSO.... Most lock manufacturers have their own nomenclature that's completely different from BOTH.... AND the part numbers for manufacturer made keys are a completely different thing.... Then if you're asking a residential customer over the phone for any markings on the key you'll also have OTHER companies that may or may NOT, use either of those, AND, depending on what company their hardware store gets their blanks from, may be completely different than all of the above, and sometimes mixes them... Then you've got Axxess / Hillman, where it's just a number...This is assuming your customer will even SEE the marking.... if it's even there, because there are companies that don't even mark their key blanks... So google and Ilco cross reference is your friend.... ANNNDDDD to make it even more fun, since there's a lot of letters and numbers involved in both key blank nomenclature AND large masterkey systems, if you choose to go into industrial, ESPECIALLY one far away that doesn't like to bring you out unless they absolutely need to..... You'll EVENTUALLY find yourself on the phone with some EHS or Security employee, explaining that for cylinder number 341, they need to cut an ABC34 key on an F blank but if they don't have any F blanks in stock they can also use either a J or K blank, or at worst case an L blank... AND FSM be praised if they remembered to mark the keyway letter on the box of blanks after the last time they finished one....... Because otherwise you have to explain that they're looking for a box marked as 35-056-F, 35-056-J, 35-056-K, or 35-056-L.... And at that point.... you can sometimes.... not always, but sometimes.... if you listen VERY CLOSELY.... actually HEAR their brain melting... While YOUR eyes involuntarily travel from the bottle of hootch on your shelf, to the clock, and then back....

[@Jason_Singe]

I'm so glad you didn't change the 'c' in 'curious' to a 'k'.

[@TT3Dxyz]

I also see the ILCO "S" prefix used for a shortened key blank such as in the case of the S1000V compared to the 1000V

[@MorningStarChrist]

Security through obscurity in key form!

[@SpringvisualTk]

Excited about the KW5 lishi spacers!

[@CeeKayz0rz]

Deev has forgotten more about physical security than 99% of people will ever know... What I wouldn't do to just follow him around for like a week...

[@ImGumbyDangit]

Thx, now onto the unedited version. 🤣

[@Ralesk]

Apropos of the Titan key: would it be better or worse to think of it (in relation to the KW1 and KW5) with the *flat* side shoulder aligned, as opposed to the tooth-side shoulder aligned with the other keys? After all it interacts with its lock like that, the fat tooth-side shoulder just goes into the plug. That makes it match up with the KW5 pin positions if I'm thinking correctly. Wonder what's stopping a KW5 from going all the way in into a KW11 hole though - I get why it won't work the other way, because of the fat shoulder on the KW11 key that the Titan has a receptacle for but no standard Kwikset plug otherwise does.

[@DeviantOllam]

I thought about that. It's almost like that, but almost not. If you align all the keys based on the underside of their shoulders, the Titan and the KW5 still don't quite line up the same way.

[@philipnewby6343]

It was nice to learn something new.

[@odinslockllc]

Awesome video. Thanks for sharing!

[@russej02]

another interesting thing. If you want to a make a kwikset lock lishi proof you just insert a 7 cut and the lishi will overset it just by sticking the tool in making the lock un-lishi-able

[@jessthemullet]

We had a commercial glass door that had a knockoff kwikset key in the mortise lock. The part that makes me think they were a knockoff, aside from the terrible tolerances, was that the chamfer around the bottom of the key pins were about half the size as real kwiksets. With a very high-low bitting from the factory, it was a stiff, miserable thing to fight for months. It was so stiff and prone to grabbing the key, that it kind of wallered out the top of the keyway. As soon as the warranty was up, or as far as that company would warranty their work, anyways, I swapped it out for a decent lock that's much, much easier to deal with. I saved it, just so I could show everybody how terrible the lock was, and why it was so hard to deal with. If you want the lock, or pictures of it, as a cautionary tale of how something like one key pin can make a lock damn near unusable, drop me a line and I'll send it to ya.

[@cameronrich2536]

Learned more than I'll admit

[@AaronEB]

Are those bump-softening rings, uh, castration bands? I go on lots of "wtf is this object (and where can I buy it)" dives and thought I'd seen them somewhere.

[@DeviantOllam]

they are, indeed. but, much as rape seed oil is sold as "canola" this was a rebranding that seemed advisable. =)

[@AaronEB]

@@DeviantOllam hahaha, yeah, good call!

[@gozzendk]

Thanks for the video 🔑

[@DeviantOllam]

You bet 😁👍

[@gregiep]

Just started the video. I’m dropping a thumbs up for “Kwestions.”

[@DeviantOllam]

at first the title was Kurious Kwikset Kwestions but folk pointed out that the initials were... not good 😂

[@RookieLock]

Learned a lot, thanks Dev!

[@clusumruptor]

Yes, please, may I have a spacing adapter?!?

[@chrisdwalter]

I love your videos. I recently ordered the decoding camera and then tried to make a 7 cut on smart key core and found out that it won't work. Would love to hear if anyone lese has had luck with a 7 cut on smart key. I then used the decoder to figure out what the lock did and it appeared to have made a completely random bitting. Love your videos and all your work.

[@DeviantOllam]

the Smart Key system shouldn't ever support a 7 cut depth, to my knowledge. unless maybe the Gen 3 somehow does? i'd not heard of that.

[@carolinafrog4365]

Very eye opening!!

[@PickSmith122]

I don’t know if you said this or not but I don’t think I heard this. The titan key had a backwards capability. You can pin the key to the five pin locks. Cuts 2-6 corresponds to the KW1 spacing and cuts. They did this so you could upgrade the deadbolts and use your knobs with the same keys. ✌🏻🌶

[@bragucci]

So, on a HPC Blitz machine what card # would I use to code cut a KW1 key, 5 pin?

[@vaderjo]

Danm, I was just hoping last night that you would have a follow up to your Schlage video!

[@DeviantOllam]

I plan to do smaller more digestible videos the rest of this week about this topic highlighting the specific tools and attacks.

[@philipbyrnes7501]

What shiny head?, boy, did I learn a lot, thanks mate from here Down Under in Australia

[@StevesLockPicking]

Very nice, good information, thank you

[@lunstee]

One more tidbit I didn't see in the video or comments; Keys for Titan locks originally had a very large bow, similar to the KW10 key, but larger. Duplicates of the original style key were/are sold as KW9. The only difference between it and KW10/KW11 is the bow.

[@andymarsh2011]

I key 6 pin Kwikset locks 5 days a week. I master key them and builder key them as well. Also, smartkeys can't be keyed to the 7 pin. And, Kwikset recently came out with Schlage smartkeys cylinders

[@iggymac3473]

Thank bud great info

[@DeviantOllam]

You're most welcome 😁👍

[@Alan_Hans__]

It would be cool to see that bump key and the cutaway lock in slow motion.

[@mattvaughanblack6555]

Where did that tool roll come from? I've been looking for for something like that for ever.

[@Tomeye29]

What vice are you using buddy? Many Thanks

[@adonoghuea02]

You've talked about forensic analysis of picked locks before, and it got me curious, does the Lishi leave any identifiable marks that would let you know someone used one, and let you know the lock has been decoded?

[@karenstein8261]

No more than any other lock pick. That’s all a Lishi tool is- an indexing pick. The marks on the tool make it easier to know exactly where the pick is.

[@didnotwantthis]

@@karenstein8261 It does have characteristic marks. Regular picks leave marks all over the pins where, as you mentioned, the lishi is more precise and consistent.

[@DeviantOllam]

I have a video about that. Is here on this channel. But the thumbnail is sort of a strange looking thumbnail, so you might not have seen it. It effectively, as others have said, it does leave small tool marks and they do tend to look like picking marks. The thing about them, if the Lishi tool is used properly, is that the tool marks left behind are uniquely specifically centered perfectly near the tips of all the pins. So it's almost like either someone was very very precise and had great dexterity with a manual pick, only hitting the very spots desired, or you can possibly infer that someone may have used a Lishi. I don't think there's any meaningful way to make a determination as to whether such an attacker was performing decoding or merely just attempting to open the lock.

[@RubberBanned]

I wish Kwikset still made stuff in their 1176 keyway, that would be neat, at least it's paracentric.

[@CeeKayz0rz]

25:17 - looks like he made a crude Lishi pick... :)

[@liamworthington5863]

Question: is there a Leshi tool out there that that can fit into any American locks... universal kind of way?.

[@securetechlocksmithco.7383]

Thanks for the info.

[@4L3K]

God damn i would love that lishi tool

[@DeviantOllam]

sign up for the give-away list and cross your fingers =)

[@4L3K]

@@DeviantOllam I am on that list for quite a while i think. Crossing my fingers anyway.

[@josephstein6949]

That squared off first cut on a titan key was a bitch. But the history of the KW5 and the KW6 was definitely new school to me. Thanks for the history lesson.

[@theredonionlockpicking7179]

I've done this lishi attack on the 2nd model of the smartkey but it doesn't work as well on the 3rd design.

[@diapysik]

Good call on that C.

[@russej02]

hey man I just watched this video. thanks for linking mine! I also have a second channel called Bored Lock Picker. I'm a locksmith I have over 100 videos on there of various lishi picks in actions.

[@thomasw.6945]

niiice kw infos, thanks Ollam..

[@LyfestyleHobby]

Learned a lot actually, thanks for making this video, do you have an estimate for when your Schlage key guides will be back in stock as well as an ETA for the KW set? Have been trying to snag a Schlage set for a while but never seem to get lucky.

[@docwil2541]

I'll be damn, you got me. I did learn a couple new things. I'm looking forward to killing a couple of Scotch's with you at some point.

[@bstrickler]

Since the Lishi doesn't work with 3rd generation Shartkey, does the SmartDecoder still work?

[@joblessalex]

Ever messed with the Titans? Have a feeling there's a good bypass hiding somewhere.

[@johnrehwinkel7241]

I spent a little while trying to read the text on the bottom of your glass, hoping it was a secret message! Hope to have a drink with you one day!

[@BryanTHackett]

Great video bro!👍

[@Macsprojects]

So the kw5 will open all of kwikset, does that mean sc4 will do the same? And the AM5? With your space adapter of course

[@aberobinson1]

There are still Titan locks used by apartment complexes because that's what they were built with back in the 90s

[@curley6531]

i learned several things thank you dev 👍🔑🔒

[@DeviantOllam]

My pleasure 👍

[@patertuus8]

C'mon Deviant! You totally don't suck! Keep up the good fight.