Did the Fallout TV show BREAK the lore? Shady Sands, New Vegas, ghouls & more

[@MunkeyDong]

I enjoyed the irony of getting frustrated when mentioning people had forgotten that you can nuke shady sands in NV. You can't, you can nuke a major road between nevada and the ncr

[@TripleSLeague]

You get to choose the factions you use the nukes..."plural"... on. Ulysses says "There's more" when referring to them, a supply of nukes just sitting underground. When nuking any target you only see it hit "ONE" location, because this was all they had within the exploration range of the main character in new vegas, the insinuation is that you nuke "Many" targets. The finally optional quest is called "the apocalypse" It's not called that because you nuke three small targets in a small state. It's called that because every major city is nuked again.

[@jitgaming9633]

@@TripleSLeague When talking to ulysses he literally says he is going to "kill" the NCR by cutting them off from the mojave and letting them bleed. nowhere does he say that the nukes are targeted at Shady sands or any other major city.

[@monkeybudge]

Lore, Lore never changes

[@TripleSLeague]

Nice.

[@mortagon1451]

The Legion and NCR did not consist of "millions" of people. In Fallout 2 the rough estimate of the total population of NCR, as shown on a holotape found in the game, is around 700.000 and according to the devs this is an exagerrated number. At the time of NV, if using average population growth as a guide, you could estimate that NCR may have grown to about twice that population , although consisting mostly of civilians spread throughout several settlements, and we know their military forces and resources were stretched thin. While there are no concrete numbers of the Legion it was certainly not in the millions. Most estimates I have seen ranges from beteen 5000-20000 fighting men for each side.

[@elvisibra]

Forget average population growth. In this world, is way below average. It is slow and best they can hope is to be steady and slow, instead of unsteady.

[@mortagon1451]

@@elvisibra good point

[@TripleSLeague]

ncr had over 700,000 people by 2241, just when they were hitting the restoration of services and rebuilding new structures. In all records this is a boom of population era. With no substantial wars to note the next 40 years would have seen a tripeling of the population at a minimum. This IS why they were thirsty for more expansion. The legion on the other hand was as big (and bigger counting slave and nonslave, but subjugated cities/population.) So yes. Unless population levels suddenly and without any reason just stopped growing we would see large populations here.

[@elvisibra]

@@TripleSLeague from 700K to how many in 40yrs? Counting all that died, and shorter life span overall? Not many more, for sure. Lucky if grew by 100K.

[@mortagon1451]

@@TripleSLeague I'm going by numbers from what I've seen speculated in the fandom, but there has never been an official number apart from the 700.000 mention AFAIK. I do think we need to keep in mind the conditions of the wasteland. There are a lot of disease, radiation poisoning, dangerous creatures and lawlessness and conflict, and not everyone live in large settlements. Also, while you could argue it's a game engine limitation, the amount of people encountered in the games would make it appear that the world is very sparsely populated.

[@thelastlostcause4148]

I suppose the NCR being nuked doesn't _technically_ retcon anything, seeing as how it happened sometime post-NV and before the end of 2281 (when NV is set). But it does render the broader original storyline of 1/2/NV kind of irrelevant now, in my opinion. All of the original storylines are either dead or have been significantly rewritten/reimagined. I think the show marks the full and final Bethesda "coup" of the series' theme and intention away from Interplay/Obsidian, for lack of a better word. Part of me rather conspiratorially believes that this route was decided upon by Todd Howard as some sort of revenge for all those years of New Vegas being treated like a cult classic, while his own work was consistently trounced as being weaker than what Interplay/Obsidian put out there. So he just nuked the NCR as we knew it out of the future of the franchise. The legacy of pre-Bethesda lore is no longer an obstacle in any way. In summary, the lore of this franchise is what attracted me to it in the first place. But as someone who still considers himself a fan, I have grown to consider the lore one of its weaker elements, FO4 onwards. Bethesda should have stuck to the east coast or other unexplored areas, rather than taking on Interplay/Obsidian's storylines for the sake of the show. The average Amazon Prime subscriber for whom this show is made probably doesn't care about the background lore anyway, so it's kind of a shame that said lore was altered so significantly, at the expense of those who do care🤷‍♂️ That said, the show was very well made and was quite the spectacle to watch. That power armor though!

[@Silverhks]

I agree that the Interplay lore seems to have been written out. Mostly I think it happened to remove any doubt as to who owned the lore. By basing anything that happens on 3&4 Bethesda has removed any future IP concerns. Many franchises from the 80/90s have very fractured IP structures and this nearly cleans it up for them.

[@mortagon1451]

Todd Howard has come out and said the nuke happened after NV so my guess is that the date on the blackboard is just a production mistake. The relocation of SS is harder to explain though.

[@TripleSLeague]

@@mortagon1451 Yeah thats my main issue. I do suspect that the issue was the funding.

[@TripleSLeague]

@@Silverhks I dunno, they have said they like the lore and games. We would need to see where this goes in the future with the next few games or season 2.

[@TripleSLeague]

Lore issues are there. They need to do a new version of the falloutbible and stick with it, keep most of the old stuff and refine more of the stories and content.

[@JonBonZombie]

WHO CARES ITS A SHOW... ON TV,,, Want Lore. play the games..lol

[@Angel-Otk]

Because the creators said it was connected to the games, obviously. If you don’t wanna be challenged intellectually go watch SpongeBob…

[@stereotoned]

Says the man who first clicked on the video, and then left a comment...

[@TripleSLeague]

TV and shows are def the media of the past. Interactive stories such as games are the future. Just need the transitionary products to move smoothly IMHO.