2021-23 Harley Milwaukee-8 OEM Tune. Is it Too Lean?

Just like the 2017-2020 Milwaukee-Eights, the 2021, 2022 & now the 2023 were tested. Does the M8 Suffer the Same as the Twin Cam w/ a Too Lean Factory Tune? Is a Tuner needed when adding a Stage I Air Cleaner and/or Open Exhaust? ⬇️⬇️⬇️⬇️⬇️ Click Show More Below ⬇️⬇️⬇️⬇️⬇️
Since this run on the 2021 we have also put a 2022 & a 2023 on the dyno, ran it stock, then put our free flowing 828 intake on and some cobra slip-on's on with TTI's in the slip-ons.
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The 2021, 2022 and the 2023 are fine with the OEM tune with free flowing intake and exhaust, just like the 2017-2020's. By fine, I mean they do not run lean. Will they run even better with an optimized tune, Yes, but they do not run dangerously lean like the Twin Cams and Sporty Evolutions do.
💥 Link to VIDEO on 2017-2020 M8's- • Facts vs. Myths 17-20 ...
💥 Link to VIDEO Play List on Why & How to Cool Down...- • Multi-Part Series on W...
💥 Link to Info & Dyno Charts on M8 Tunes- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link to Outlaw HiFlow Performance Air Cleaners- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link To an Overview of Tuning Options- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link to Details on XiED's, ViED's, Power Vision & FP3 Tuners- www.dkcustompro...
➡️ Link to Written Report on Why & How to Cool Down Your Twin Cam and M8 Engine- www.dkcustompro...
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The DK Team

[@jackklarich7045]

Good solid info here. There are too many out there spewing mis information. D K Customs always comes thru with real numbers

[@DKCustomProducts]

Hey Jack! Thank you for the comment. Appreciate it. btw, for others reading these comments....Jack's 2017 M8 was the first M8 we put on a dyno...that was around 5 years ago!

[@jackklarich7045]

@@DKCustomProducts And it ran like a scalded dog compared to the choked down EPA tune from HD, Thanks to D K Customs

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@jackklarich7045 Yeah, no doubt the tune helped, and I think the 606 air cleaner helped even more!

[@robertgarcia9710]

Thanks bro’s 🤟🏾🙏🏽👀

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@robertgarcia9710 Glad you're liking the vids. 👍

[@davidshaw3475]

I have a 2023 FLHXSANV and I've installed Vance & Hines Slash 450 slip-ons with DK 158 TTI inserts installed in the baffles and K&N filter in the stock ventilator air breather. The bike runs strong with "no issues" with the OEM factory tune. Really appreciate your solid information guys! Its been your videos that helped me with these decisions. Thanks Kevin & Dwayne "Ride Safe"

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is great to hear that you have your ride dialed in and are happy with it. 👍😎👍 Good to know you are finding the videos useful/interesting. Appreciate your business and you comment here. 👍

[@streetglidescott6424]

It is refreshing to get actual information as opposed to a lot of hype. I can attest to the fact that the twin cams needed a tune bad. Destroyed mine on a 120 degree day in Phoenix and bought an 18 M8. Had no troubles since. Thanks for your work.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Very cool, glad your liking the videos. Sorry for your TC, glad you're liking your M8. Thank you for your kind words. 👍

[@marcom3462]

Hey guys, I just discovered your channel and I'm happy I found the answers I was looking for, finally! I own a 22 Street Bob and I just ordered my Twin Slash Slip Ons from V&H. I'm leaving the air filter as is, just putting the Slip Ons for a good sound. You have no idea how long I argued and searched online for a clear and simple answer like yours. All I wanted was to make sure I would not damage the engine. I will not remap / tune the bike, since I plan on installing more on it one slow step at the time. Can't wait to test the Twin Slash. Thanks again for both your videos covering this matter! Cheers from Canada!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for the comment, and glad the video helped you out. There is a lot of misinformation out there. Everything we publish is a result of our own testing, not repeating what other have said, not know if it really is accurate or not. Hope it is warming up for you up north! 👍😎👍

[@michaelrocole7174]

Just added the 828 on a CVO 2022 Road Glide Limited. No tune needed this bike runs like a top and perception is more HP same thing when I did my Tri-Glide last year. In fact I tried a tuner the bike ran worse. Returned the tuner went back to stock because it ran way better. I appreciated the affirmation with facts. Great products and technical guidance with real testing.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Good to hear you are enjoying our parts and the benefits on your RG! 👍 Thank you for your business, we appreciate it. Also, good to hear you're finding the videos useful!!!

[@h.wayneb3495]

Thanks for updating this information, extremely helpful to us 2021 owners. Much appreciated.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad it was helpful! Thanks for commenting! 👍

[@ronlynch7744]

Good news for M8 Owners. I know after the video you posted a while ago I put on the K&N and Vance & Hines mufflers with no negative performance issues at all. 😎👍🇨🇦

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, very good news. HD really has done us all a favor in getting their ECM working better on the M8's. Thank you for the feedback of your experience. Glad to hear you are enjoying your ride! 👍

[@garyrhode3755]

Hi, Ron - How is the Vance & Hines exhaust working out over all? and K&N filter. - Any idea what price range stock harley slip ons would cost for a 2021 S. Bob? (will keep my stock slip ons as spares) to also have original parts. great day.

[@ronlynch7744]

@@garyrhode3755 not sure the price for those……. But if you check with V&H they will Surely get it just as Fast as they can……. ☮️❤️ Life

[@ronlynch7744]

Ya……. They both are Out of this World……. Heavenly ☮️❤️ Life

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@garyrhode3755 Here's a link and make sure to use the code Save555 to get 5.55% off. www.dkcustomproducts.com/m8-softail-models-166.htm

[@Travelguy_nw]

Thanks for this info with real numbers! I just bought a 23 sg st and I absolutely despise the factory exhaust. The power it makes stock is great, I just want it to actually sound like a Harley for now.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Congrats on your New RIde! 👍😎👍 Here's a video of how we go about choosing exhaust, you may find it useful- kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmebYpeiZ72SnJY

[@kennywisemansr.2323]

Watching your video answers a few questions I had for my 21 Tri Glide M8. Installed floorboard extensions that made a big difference ! Natalie was really helpful on my comfort ride purchase....

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is great to hear. We appreciate your business, and glad you are enjoying the videos and the parts. Natalie is good people. Thanks! 👍😎👍

[@aaroncox3340]

Thanks guys. My 21 ultra has got after market slip ons and I'm getting a free flow airfilter, just received my new licence for my Powervision & first tune, so looking forward to making it run little better, but with all that said, the way it is at the moment, it runs awesome, I've done a couple of modifications, one being venting the crankcase with a non return valve, bloody hell, that made a massive difference. 👍🤘

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks man, glad you liked the video and left a comment. Good to hear you are enjoying your M8. 👍

[@Mike-hk6rw]

Too many people regurgitate old info ,good job guys!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you, appreciate the good words. Glad you are finding the videos useful/interesting. 👍

[@tjatkinson88]

My 2012 Sportster was barely ridable new. A dyno tune really improved it and woke it up.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, a tune can certainly help. This video is for the M8's that are not too lean from the factory and not that tune wouldn't fine tune it more but it is not necessary on the M8's like it is on the older Twin Cams. Thanks for commenting! MB

[@LonesomeNomad137]

What’s up Fella’s?? I recently fell in love with a 13 FLHTC in our local Harley Dealer, Freedom Road Harley. I ride a 93 FLHS after getting taken out on my 05 Super Glide(stage 4). So I told my wife about it and she said buy it. I decided that as much as I loved that bike, I finally decided NFW was I trading or selling my 93 FLHS. I came home from work a couple weeks ago and Freedom Road was at my house delivering my 2013 Electra Glide Classic. It’s completely stock and we’re headed south in 6 months, for good. I guess I’m gonna need of bunch of cooling parts. Love you guys. Peace

[@DKCustomProducts]

Wow, that had to be a surprise! Can't wait to hear of all your adventures on the road!

[@howardthompson3737]

Thanks guys.. I have a 21 Harley trike.. I do have headers, slip on and a high flow intake.. I’m getting ready to install the hi flow intake, without installing everything else I have.. I do have a tuner also. I was so concerned when I didn’t see a tune specifically for intake only. Now I know the truth. You guys are the real deal. I appreciate the channel so much. I recently installed the oil filter relocation kit. Loving it.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad to hear you are finding the videos useful. Thank you for the kind words, and for your business, we appreciate it. 👍😎👍

[@dariensmith2833]

I want to say you have a new subscriber (me) and I wanted to say thank you - as I have read almost all of these comments and you guys always reply in a very professional manner ALL the time even when asked the same questions over and over. Thank you gentlemen!!!!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Wow, thank you! 👍 We appreciate your kind words, and glad you are finding the videos useful.

[@FrensTimmerpens]

I had pinging with my 2021 Ultra! In 4th and 5th gear full trottle at 4000rpm> Now open exhaust and a modified intake. I let do the “DON” tuning and is running better at low revs. And exellerates faster. No pinging anymore

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you got rid of the pinging! Here is a report we done on the M8 with dyno charts you may find interesting- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@MyDyerMaker]

Thanks for the honest information. My 2020 LRS is about the only bike I haven't considered getting an aftermarket tuner for. I regularly get 50 mpg and the bike has plenty of power for me. Also, I just received your external breather kit to eliminate the blow-by in the throttle body.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Good to hear you are enjoying your 2020 LRS. Thank you for the comment, and for your business. I believe you will be well pleased with the External Breather System. Enjoy your ride! 👍

[@georgeparker7108]

Thanks for the information on the m8's.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, glad you found it useful. 👍

[@jimmya2860]

Always a good time here!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you like the video! Here is another video you may find interesting - kzbin.info/www/bejne/Zmqrd6VrqMyFi8k

[@bigal9052]

I haven't purchased a lot from DK but they always answer your messages about their products

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you, appreciate the kind words. 👍

[@MadMexism]

Love these videos guys. Keep up the great content.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, glad you are enjoying! 👍

[@mdoehrman]

Thanks for saving me some money, I appreciate it greatly. Now, I guess I will spend that extra money on your website on the shiny stuff, what a shame.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad to help! 👍

[@slicklowriderHD]

I watched your video and took your advice. Big radius Vance and Hines with the large volume air breather and no tune. Installed my self and test run was awesome. Thanks so much. 2021 M8 114 lowrider S. No tune runs awesome 😎

[@DKCustomProducts]

Nice work! Glad to hear you are enjoying your ride!

[@slicklowriderHD]

@@DKCustomProducts I ordered everything from you that you told me I needed to put my brake and blinker on my axel. Thanks

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@slicklowriderHD Awesome, we appreciate your business & support man!

[@slicklowriderHD]

@@DKCustomProducts I will send you a picture before and after. You can use it if you want. I've not been a mechanic for thirty so if I can take y'all's advice and make improvements by myself.....all of your viewers should know....I guarantee they can too.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@slicklowriderHD Thank you. Send them to [e-mail] and put attention Kevin in the subject line.

[@Stuntex]

Super interesting! Do you guys think that the OEM ECU can correctly adjust the AFR if the condition changes? It works great in your case, and the adjustment range of the OEM ECU is enough. But would it be enough if altitude, temperature, and humidity increase? The VE table should remain the same, and calculations would have inaccuracy. Sorry for my misunderstanding.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Check out this video- kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqfFhZ6Iq6uUbpI It explains how the ECM adjust for all the factors you listed.

[@Stuntex]

@@DKCustomProducts Please, explain time 4:25 about EPA for close-loop and performance for open loop. You told in the video that OEM O2 sensor is a "switch" sensor. Does it mean, that OEM O2 sensor is adjusted for EPA regulation, not for optimum AFR? Also, please, comment: 20% of ECM adjustment rang is enough for the high-flow air filter in any condition for M8 engine (but not for any engine), right? But, for example, a big bore kit eats too much air, so the amount of fuel should be more than stock+20% in some conditions, so tuning the map is required, right? Interesting to know what is 20% compared to the engine's mod and condition changing. How many percents of fuel should ECM add if there is a temperature below zero and pressure above normal outside, for example.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@Stuntex Thanks for watching and for your questions. I am not understanding what specifically you are asking about regarding the 4:25 mark in the ECM video. The o2 sensor is not adjusted to EPA regs. It does send a signal to the ECM, and then the OEM map, or table, will adjust the AFR to keep it in EPA regs. Regarding ECM ability to adjust for ambient temp, humidity, altitude...on a stock bike, or a bike with free flowing air cleaner and/or free flowing exhaust, it can adjust. The minute you go to higher compression, or a cam, or any other engine mods, you will aboslutely need a tune. The ECM does NOT automatically adjust for that. Here is what we use to adjust the tune in those circumstances- www.dkcustomproducts.com/dynojet-power-vision-flash-tuner-w-auto-tune-dk-pv-cmp-pkg.htm

[@joshyakel7943]

I have a 2021 if I decat take baffles out and high air intake cleaner what will it effect?

[@Roadglide911]

Just found this one. I have a 2021 FLTRK with slip on TABs with zombie baffles. I was going to go to a high flow air filter but didn’t want to go through the hunting a tune/tuner.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not need a new tune for your 2021 FLTRK. The M8's do run great from the factory, and still run great after upgrading to a free flowing exhaust and High Flow Air Cleaner. Getting an after market tune would maximize the performance, but is not necessary. You can see a written report we've done at this link - www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm You can see a video about our Air Cleaners at this link - kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWnIoIWeeMeofpo Thank you for commenting! MB

[@Roadglide911]

Thanks for the response.

[@d.sandell2555]

Very good to know. A lot of us are just one part at a time so the tuner upgrade is normally the last thing you buy and I like to ride my bike until that point in time.. looking forward to 2022 information thanks

[@DKCustomProducts]

Since this run on the 2021 we have also put a 2022 on the dyno, ran it stock, then put our free flowing 828 intake on and some cobra slip-on's on with TTI's in the slip-ons. Somehow we never got around to publishing that. Not sure why...guess we have just been so busy it slipped thru the cracks. Gonna have to dig up the footage, edit it, and publish it. The 2021 and the 2022 are fine with the OEM tune with free flowing intake and exhaust, just like the 2017-2020's. By fine, I mean they do not run lean. Will they run even better with an optimized tune, Yes, but they do not run dangerously lean like the Twin Cams and Sporty Evolutions do. 👍😎👍

[@1986devildog]

Thx for the guidance guys. I just bought a 828 from you for my 2021 RGL should be delivered tomorrow! My bike already has a stage 1 using SE tuner and Rienhart slip ons so good to know nothing else necessary. I do want to protect my warranty.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, and we appreciate your business. I believe you will be well pleased with the 828 and the EBS with it. Enjoy your ride! 👍

[@roadking2054]

You guys give information with the proof. Thank you

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you! Glad you are finding the videos useful/interesting! 👍

[@eddiealvarez5493]

That's Right Harley Rider's, Kevin & Dwayne keep it coming 👊

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you are enjoying the videos. Thank you for the comment. 👍

[@phillipmckeownakalucifer.6689]

Thank god you guys are making my life better.... I have the s n s up sweep pipes available at harley. Ill get put on now yall. Thank you so much for the courage to get them installed without a tune. Buuuuuuuut does it void warrantee.

[@DKCustomProducts]

On 2017+ models, anything you do to the power plant has the potential to void the OEM warranty. We suggest you get a real warranty (see vid below) and do what you want to your own bike. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pmm4ZYupfd51q8k

[@01Lightning]

Good info.....Thanks!! Any news on a 23 Softail LowRiderST, I added a set of V&H slip-on's with cats. Would like to cool it off before summer heat hits.

[@DKCustomProducts]

The tune is not too lean on your 23 Softail LowRiderST. If you are trying to cool your bike off here is a video on the subject that you may find useful/interesting- kzbin.info/www/bejne/pWS3ZKx3bqd-rac Here is a written report we've made on the subject as well - www.dkcustomproducts.com/why-how-to-cool-down-the-twin-cam-engine-part-i-dk-cl-tc-dn-1.htm Thank you for commenting! MB

[@01Lightning]

@DKCustomProducts Again Thank you for your videos. I watched the video on 10 cooling tips this morning 😁 Funny you mentioned the Jim's fan as I have one sitting in the garage from my 130" RoadGlide. I just got too old to wrestle a 1k bike. The LowRider "feels" 500 lbs lighter 😂😂 Waiting on my SS check and then will order a set of your wings for the Softail platform

[@DKCustomProducts]

Awesome! Yeah a Softail is certainly lighter. Feel free to contact us with any questions; [e-mail] 662-252-8828 Thanks for commenting! 😎 MB

[@billflixtone6684]

Thanks for all the great videos. I just bought a 2022 114. Unless I have missed something, your charts are results from stock bikes, why are they not on a bike with a free flowing air cleaner and exhaust. I mean, how do you know they will be ok after stage one without a tune?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Congrats on your new ride! 👍 We covered the free flowing A/C & exhaust in the following video link and following report link kzbin.info/www/bejne/l4i6XqGqbJKZsKM www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm The above shows AFR charts with OEM and with free flowing intake and exhaust. btw, I ran my M8 TG with the stock tune and free flowing intake and exhaust for close to 10K miles. All good.

[@normanmatura6769]

Short answer no I've got a 2020 road glide special a 114 with screaming eagle air cleaner and bassini road rage two into one no two the bike runs just fine I put over 20 3,000 miles on it no issues other than the compensator failed

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching and for your comment. Good to hear you're enjoying your ride! 👍

[@donalddavis7160]

Just saw this video. After I watched it I immediately subscribed. lol I noticed during the vid you were referring to a 114. I have a CVO road glide limited and want to change the exhaust to a D&D 2-1 exhaust. Do you think I will be able to install that exhaust with no tune? Thank you in advance

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, you will. We have put a CVO 117 on and gotten the same results as with the 107 and 114. The OEM tune is good for up to a free flowing intake and exhaust.

[@donalddavis7160]

@@DKCustomProducts Thank you and I really appreciate your response

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@donalddavis7160 You're welcome man, thanks for watching our videos!

[@JACampbell30]

Great video as always guys. I’ve been shopping with you guys for about 8 years now and I trust your honest reviews and answers. Very “by bikers for bikers” type of stuff. I finally let go of my ‘12 Sporty and bought a bone stock ‘21 Sport Glide and am excited to start upgrading it. I just received your high flow 606 air cleaner with EBS & catch can. I’ve also purchased a Sawicki Speed 2-in-to-1 shorty full exhaust system. I have yet to install either of them. The market seems so flooded with after market tuners that it’s so confusing to me. I called a local dynotune shop and was surprised by the about $800-$1000 price tag!! Is an aftermarket tuner “good enough” for a full exhaust & high flow upgrade or would you recommend a professional dynotune? I think further down the road I’ll do a performance cam upgrade and stop at that stage. Do these after market tuners grow with the upgrades? If I buy one now for the exhaust & air cleaner will I have to take it to get professionally dynotuned when I get the cams upgraded? Is it even worth saving $400-$500 by doing an aftermarket tuner or should I just trust the professionals and go that route from the start? If I do purchase an after market tuner, I think I’ve settled on the Power Vision 3 (for Harleys 2021-2022). It seems like it gives the most options compared to others and I’ve not read/watched a lot of good reviews on the newer Bluetooth enabled ones coming out now. Any thought or help is appreciated. Keep up the excellent work guys! 🤙🏼👊🏼👍🏼

[@DKCustomProducts]

Congratulations on the New Ride!!! 👍😎👍 Thank you for your business, we do appreciate it! You do not need a tune to install that exhaust and air cleaner. Unlike the Sportys and Twin Cams, the M8's do not run too lean from the factory, and they will keep their acceptable AFR even with the installation of free flowing intake and exhaust. That said, they will run a little better with a good tune. Here is a report showing the above info- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm If you want to have it run the best, and if you are looking at possibly doing a cam upgrade, the only two good options are the: FP4....but depending on which cam you choose, it may or may not be supported OR The Power Vision. It will accommodate any change you want to make to it. Here is a link to both of them- www.dkcustomproducts.com/efi-tuners-c74-316.htm The Power Vision 3 is still not fully developed, some folks use it with no issues, others are still having issues. The Power Vision at the above link is what we like best and use, and it definitely has more capability than the PV 3. Regarding having it dynotuned, here is a video with the pros and cons- kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6SleX5jf95qjc0

[@JACampbell30]

@@DKCustomProducts You guys absolutely rock! Best unbiased customer support out there! Thank you for the knowledge, videos, and links. You have a customer for life. Ride safe. 👍🏼🤙🏼🇺🇸

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@JACampbell30 Hey thanks man! We really appreciate the kind words & your business! Thank you for watching our channel, glad you find the videos useful! 👍🏼

[@davidschonewolf4083]

This info makes me happy being I traded in my 19 Road King Special for a 21 Road Glide Special!!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Cool, glad you found it helpful. Thank you for the comment. 👍

[@paulsmale5436]

Unfortunately for us in the United Kingdom and EU we have x4 O2 Sensors. Any kind of after market pipe fitted will require deletion of the downstream O2 Sensors fitted in the silencers. O2 Eliminators will not cure this and the bike will still throw trouble codes. This will still require the purchase of either a V&H FP4 or Dynojets PV4, though have heard of tuners having Direct Access Hardware that can perform the same process. I would note these new tunes by V&H/Dynojet retain and use the upstream O2 sensors only editing the performance end of the map. Startup/tickover and cruising is still controlled by the sensors and deleting them is no longer an option on the M8 harley. The bike will not run if try to delete the upstream O2 sensors by way of O2 Eliminators. Only a fully created Dyno Tune will allow the deletion of the upstream O2 sensors stopping the bike from running first closed loop then open loop (please excuse if thats the other way around) If indeed as you say the M8 does not run weak then why does the bike stumble around 20 -30mph? for us thats cruising between traffic control cameras (average speed cameras) I noticed this same issue with my twin cam along with excessive popping and banging (Harley map) V&H FP3 cured both the popping and banging and the slow speed stumble at the expense of a small amount of takeoff performance. I would say the M8 still runs weak during startup and cruising and that it only runs stoic when under harder acceleration at the edited performance end of the map.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for your comment. We have no experience with UK or EU models. You mention that it stumbles at low speeds (20-30 mph), that is an indication that it is too lean. Twin Cams did that here in the USA also, as well as 2007 and later Sportster...all because of being tuned too lean from the factory. That is Not the case with M8's here in the USA...and as seen in the AFR charts, they are not too lean from the factory, like the Twin Cam or EFI Sportsters. Unfortunately it sounds like it is the case for the M8's with the EU emission standards. I have seen quite a few posts like this in the different forums. I cannot attest to the accuracy of them, because we do not have access to a EU Harley, but it may be of some help to you. "I very recently bought a new 21 Softail Standard (M8) Euro 5 bike and the Dynojet PV-3B. I talked to Dynojet UK and they sent me tunes for it with the V&H Shortshots Staggered fitted. That exhaust uses the upstream O2 sensor, but not the downstream ones, hence all the questions. The tunes they sent me switch the downstream O2 sensor inputs off, so no error codes." Thank you for sharing. and please come back and share what you end up doing to solve the problem. KP

[@Hisfatnova]

Awesome video, I took delivery of my new 2023 Road King Special w/M8 114CI, I intent to install Tab 4.5 Bam slip ons w/zombie baffles. Also a K&N air filter element into the stock air cleaner. Will I need a tune or will I be okay?

[@DKCustomProducts]

It will not need a tune for those upgrades for it to still be safe/not too lean. You will get more power out of that change if you use some Thunder Torque Inserts in the exhaust, along with an External Breather System for your A/C. Links below- www.dkcustomproducts.com/thunder-torque-inserts-c57-334.htm www.dkcustomproducts.com/all-twin-cam-engines-c76-312.htm

[@monchgupit]

thanks for this video. Now feel more confident that I can put a full exhaust without the engine throwing a fault/check engine.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you liked the video. Thank you for watching and commenting. 👍

[@jimbolen3599]

Another great video

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, glad you are enjoying the videos. 👍

[@harryhowell5644]

I had a 17 ultra 107. It always felt a little out of tune to me. After a stage 2 full exhaust, wide band tuner, cam, lifters and cuffs etc. It ran much better. I now have a 21 roadglide limited and it runs so much smoother than my 17 did. I don't really feel the need to do anything to this bike as it is basically stock.it is the 114 however.

[@ericjames7680]

Thanks for posting. I was so worried with all the DK videos talking about running lean and having heat issues and in one video talks about after some thousands of miles will not pass a leak down test and want to leave my Street Glide stock, mufflers and all too. I wrote to DOC HARLEY and discussed it with him and he says many of his customers have 100,000 miles on stock motors so with your comment and his I will just leave things alone and just ride the damn thing. 😎

[@DKCustomProducts]

Great to hear you are enjoying your ride. Thanks for your comment. 👍

[@DKCustomProducts]

Just because it will not pass a leak down test does not mean it will not run and take you down the road for 100K+ miles. We have never said the engines will melt, blow up, etc. We have said, and it is absolutely true, excessive heat will reduce power real time via HD retarding timing in an effort to cool it down (see video of that happening below) AND it will cause accelerated wear. This accelerated wear will NOT cause it to quit running (in most circumstances) but it will, in All circumstances gradually reduce power and fuel economy. For some, there is also the issue of being uncomfortable from all the radiated heat...this affects everyone differently, and some are not bothered at all. Video showing how Harley reduces power when the temps get even a little bit hot- kzbin.info/www/bejne/a4Hbe2uGq8iJqsU There are thousands that are perfectly happy with their bikes running hot. They keep running and do not bother the rider at all, and if they are not looking for max power...they do not miss anything at all as the engine slowly goes out of round (BUT keeps running).

[@vernonboy1]

Thank you! You make it easy and simple to understand. With a 21 RG Limited if I add some Rheinhart 4-inch pipes and hi-flow A/C, do I need to tune?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you like the video! No, you do not need a tune for your 2021 RG Limited if you change to a free flowing exhaust and Hiflow Air Cleaner. Here is a link to a written report on the subject that you may find helpful- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm Thanks for commenting! 😎 MB

[@vernonboy1]

@@DKCustomProductsBrilliant, thank you.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You are most welcome!!! 👍😎👍 MB

[@shanehazelton8754]

This was very informative thank you Just ordered a bootlegger 2into1 for my 22'lowrider st and im not sure if I can wait on the tune

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you found the video useful. We cannot say for sure because we have not had a 2022 on the Dyno yet to check the AFR. A tune is not needed on the 2017-2021 M8's. We have tested those. We hope to have a 2022 on the Dyno next month.

[@robertgarcia9710]

Thanks for the info you guys rock….best video 🤟🏾

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching! Good to hear that you are finding the videos useful! 👍

[@p.u.s.h.532]

Good info. Just to clarify, on my 2021 Heritage 107 with doing slip on and your AC, should I even bother with the SE tuner? I don’t want to void the warranty.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, you will be fine with the OEM tune and those mods. 👍

[@danielkingsley4858]

Hey I’ve got a 2023 street Bob 114 im doing the 2-1 cobra el diablo pipes. Just wondering your thoughts on tune if you have done a 23 yet ? I don’t care for the extra power I mainly want to get rid of the noiseless exhaust lol. Look forward to your reply. Thanks 🤘🏻

[@DKCustomProducts]

OEM tune is fine with that exhaust set up. There is a report that you can see at the following link. M8's from 2017 thru 2023 ('24's not here yet) do NOT run too lean like the Twin Cams. www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@donavonsmith3394]

I have a 2023 street glide special, factory open style air filter, if I were to do cobra slip ons with a catless header, would it still be safe afr range for the engine? Thanks in advance, great videos !

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not need a tune for your M8. The M8's do run great from the factory, and still run great after upgrading to a free flowing exhaust and HiFlow Air Cleaner. Getting an after market tune would maximize the performance, but is not necessary. You can see a written report we've done at this link - www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm You can see more about exhaust at this link - www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm Thank you for commenting! MB

[@jhacker5165]

Data is solid, but doesn't tuning also help keeping the cylinder cooler especially with that rear cylinder shutdown? Hence the better performance?

[@DKCustomProducts]

This video is showing that the factory tune is a good tune, not too lean. The better performance, (and there are more dyno charts at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm ) are more a result of timing improvements that AFR, as you can see in the AFR charts at the above link. Temperatures do not change a whole lot between a bad tune and a great tune, and even less between a good tune and a great tune. You can see in the report at the link below, that, while every advantage you can get in achieving optimum operating temps, that the difference between a bad tune and a great tune is only in the 10-15 F range on a Twin Cam. It is less on M8's, since they do not have a bad tune...in the 5 F neighborhood. www.dkcustomproducts.com/why-how-to-cool-down-your-twin-cam-engine-part-ii-dk-cl-tc-dn-2.htm Always feel free to contact us with any questions; [e-mail] 662-252-8828 Thank you for commenting! KP

[@Jar8_biker]

Good video guys. I have one question I recently installed cobra slips-on on a street bob 114 2023 with no tune and a Screamin' Eagle High-Flo K&N Air Filter Element, but I noticed a little bit increase on gas it’s possible that I need to tune it? And I want to install a Bassani 2-1 exhaust soon but I have warranty and to avoid it I going to tune with the SE tuner. Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you

[@DKCustomProducts]

If you are getting poor gas milage it is possible you need a tune. The SE tuner isn't going to give you the best tune, but it may help get back a little bit of your gas milage. You may also try installing the TTI's it will give you some more low-mid range torque. You can see more about the TTI's at this link - www.dkcustomproducts.com/thunder-torque-inserts-158-model-family-dk-tti-158.htm Here is a written report on Exhaust that you may find interesting/useful - www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm Thank you for commenting! MB

[@gamebreak81]

Thanks guys this is good information. Btw the sporty speedo relocation is awsome love dk products.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you like the video and the products! Thank you for commenting and for your business! 😎 MB

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you found the video informative! Thank you for commenting and for your business! MB

[@Reneluis04]

Great info. I’ve got a 22 road glide st. Running slip ons no tune runs great. I’d like to go to a 2 into 1 shorty like the bassani road rage and keep the stock air cleaner. Based on your info I’m assuming this would be no problem. You guys think this set up is good to go for a 22 117.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not need a tune to install that exhaust. Unlike the Sportys and Twin Cams, the M8's do not run too lean from the factory, and they will keep their acceptable AFR even with the installation of free flowing intake and exhaust. That said, they will run a little better with a good tune. Here is a report showing the above info- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm Thanks for commenting!

[@Reneluis04]

Great info. I’m not really concerned with making more power but I don’t want to loose power. With stock air cleaner and full exhaust do you think my numbers would stay around the same? I remember you guys demonstrating how just an air cleaner without tune will actually give you a power bump but I couldn’t find info on just exhaust with stock AC.

[@fxrdan]

Great video but I have one question. I have a 2021 Road Glide 107 California model. Are the California models the same as on your charts or are they even leaner ? I bought the 7 year extended HD warranty (with tire/wheel) for a whooping $4200 so I do not want to mess up the warranty. The only California Screamin Eagle ecm is a dealer install only flash for the Stage 2 Torque. There is no Stage 1 ecm available for California 2021 models. I would like to get more air in but I am worried the California models may be leaner than the 49 state models.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Cali puts people in a bit of a bind. Your map is the same. You do not need a tune to do free flowing intake and exhaust. I would also consider getting a refund on that HD warranty. You can get a much better one than that for less $. See video here- kzbin.info/www/bejne/o5zXe4KcfKeMgKc Now, when you go above a Stage I (free flowing intake and exhaust) you will either be crippled by the HD warranty and going with a CARB approved tune, or you can get the better warranty, and put some money in your pocket, and then use a Power Vision or a FP4 for a good tune. See link them there- www.dkcustomproducts.com/efi-tuners-c74-317.htm

[@WrongDuWin]

Good info. I have a 2020 SG with v&h pcx header and slips on’s. Air cleaner coming soon but meanwhile you say my bike is fine without tune?

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not need a tune to install a free flowing exhaust and free flowing air cleaner. Unlike the Sportys and Twin Cams, the M8's do not run too lean from the factory, and they will keep their acceptable AFR even with the installation of free flowing intake and exhaust. That said, they will run a little better with a good tune. Here is a report showing the above info- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm Thanks for your comment!

[@WrongDuWin]

@@DKCustomProducts thx for your time and knowledge, brought the bike with bad o2 sensor (running RICH) since replaced and code cleared I’m riding to see the adjustment for the sake of my gas mileage

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@WrongDuWin Yeah, if it was running rich, you should see an improvement in mpg. Here is a video of a few things you can do to improve your power even more AND your mpg at the same time. kzbin.info/www/bejne/oKKleJusj7yCr8k

[@jacevandenberg3918]

I have a 21 Street Bob with a Arlen Ness airfilter, Rhine heart racing big shot exhaust..but now I got a maximum tuner cause of more upgrades to come..stage 3..no dyno needed

[@DKCustomProducts]

Very cool, sounds like you are getting your bike set up how you want it. Question and Suggestion- What is a "maximum tuner"? Before going to a Stage III, it is very beneficial to have a good foundation so that you can get the most out of your Stage III upgrade. Here is a video where we talk about this- kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXyYqWaimLapgLc If you get your foundation set up well, you will be amazed how much better your Stage II or Stage III performs.

[@jamaicanjjason]

Thanks for putting out so much quality content. I have a 2022 RGST with the 117 engine. I would like to install a 2 into 1 D&D full exhaust. Would the “no tune is required” apply to this setup. Thanks again

[@DKCustomProducts]

We have tested '17-'21's. We have not tested '22's. Most folks have reported that the '22's are the same as the '21's, but until we get one on the dyno to check the AFR's we cannot give any advice on them.

[@jamaicanjjason]

Okay. Thanks again, much appreciated

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@jamaicanjjason Ride Free!

[@tomhinders9559]

Hi Guys sorry if repeat question ,, Just bought a 2021 tg with cobra exhaust , according to your video you are saying I can add the Chrome Speed Fin Complete HiFlow 828 Air Cleaner Milwaukee-Eight and be ok with out a tune? And is there anything else I need with the complete system? BTW added your floorboard ext. and air fins they are great. Thanks guys

[@DKCustomProducts]

You can absolutely run the stock tune with your cobra exhaust and the 828 intake. The M8's are Not lean from the factory like the Twin Cams and Sportsters. When you order the 828, you will have a choice of which External Breather System you want with it. The Cobra's will give you more power if you add some Thunder Torque Insert™ to them. With those changes, you will run stronger, and you will not be too lean. Very good to hear you are liking those mods you got. Thank you for your business, it is appreciated. Always feel free to email or call with any questions: [e-mail] 662-252-8828 KP

[@jimmin9802]

My 2017 m8 107 touring and my 2020 softail m8 107 can get one of your intakes and the tti and no tune required? You guys are making my wallet cry!

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is correct, no tune needed when using one of our intakes and TTI's. 👍

[@HitekRednec]

Thank you, thank you, thank you for this information!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad it was helpful!

[@elvisman8721]

Have the same CVO air cleaner you took off. You completely missed the breather bolt & tubes removal which is what I was wanting to see.😒 What if any performance improvement do you have now?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Not sure which air cleaners or video you are referencing. Here is a video that shows the breather bolts and tubes being removed. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gaXFlYKli7N_b8k And here is another one- kzbin.info/www/bejne/hmbOopajZbGrZ9E The next video we're releasing on 2-8-22 is of a comparison between the stock air cleaner and the 828 Air Cleaner. It shows about a 9% increase in HP and Torque, just for that change, nothing else.

[@edwinhoekstra8014]

Hi Kevin and Dwayne. It would be interesting to see for you and your customers what happens to the AFR when adding a free flowing exhaust AND AC to the stock M8. I think most people start with an aftermarket exhaust or slip ons to add some sound. The next step would be a (DKcustoms) free flowing AC. If a tune is needed for that, that could be a reason not to buy the AC or wait until both mods are within budget.

[@DKCustomProducts]

We did test the AFR after adding a free flowing air cleaner and exhaust. There are more videos coming, but you can see a written Report and dyno charts at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@larrystanford8315]

I didn't see where the 2021 M8 was tested with the oem factory tune, high flow a.c. and high flow slipon mufflers at the same time. Keep up the good work!!

[@davidhelmuth6654]

I’m on a 2019 road glide. Been think about doing slip ons and a intake, but was told that it will need a tune. Want to do a cat delete as well. Guess that will call for a tune?

[@MRGS48]

I did a full stage one with defatted head pipes from V&H with a pair of Cobra slip ons without an air filter since the 114 has a high airflow one and a tune. The bike first off cooled down and runs smoother like the first day after like 6K miles… Tune is required only if you add more air into the engine bud.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You are good to do a free flowing intake and exhaust, as well as deleting the cat. No Tune is needed. The bike will run better than it does now. The AFR will adjust. As stated in the video, it will run even better with a tune, but it is not going to hurt it with the OEM tune. Here is a video that explains how the ECM adapts- kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqfFhZ6Iq6uUbpI And here is another video with more info on the M8's - kzbin.info/www/bejne/l4i6XqGqbJKZsKM

[@robuc67]

So is the 2022 Roadglide 114 air filter considered a high flow filter? Love your content I have learned a lot already.

[@tonywalker6745]

Very interesting..thanks for the information 👍😃

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching! 👍

[@colefrost223]

Man idk, you ever put a rinehart full system with 4.5 kromework mufflers on a 2020? Driviablity is ok but wide open needs a lot of work if you want to launch from a light. I think the cleaner/exhaust combo is something to be considered. 17 thru 21’s

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, every good step improve performance/reliability/stability incrementally. Here is a video you may find interesting- kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXyYqWaimLapgLc

[@teapotwood2817]

just came across this video. can I ask you, have a 2023 M8 107 would this be ok with stock map or the improved map from Dynojet with V&H slash cuts with pcx? would like to keep stock intake at the present time and the most important thing to me is not damaging the engine thank you for your time appreciated 👍

[@DKCustomProducts]

That would be fine. The bike will maintain a healthy AFR and tune overall but to be clear, you will not see peak performance from modifying the exhaust (or air cleaner) until the bike is tuned. Here is a link to a report we've done on the M8's that you may find useful/interesting - www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm Thanks for commenting! MB

[@Frenchy5117]

I've been to several dealers that had the 2021 models with a high flow intake and telling customers no tune needed when changing the slip-ons

[@MRGS48]

Yup that’s true. The engine is tuned to allow that 10% of tolerance with just the slip ons.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching and for your comment. 👍 Good to know that some dealerships are aware of the changes made to the ECM on the M8's.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You may find this video interesting- kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqfFhZ6Iq6uUbpI

[@noonespecial1217]

Thanks for the videos as always guys! Any word on the 22s as of late? I own a 2022 M8 softail 114 Street Bob and have a Rebuffini open air intake (already installed on the bike)- no tune. I also have a Feuling anti-reversion 2 into 1 exhaust (not installed/waiting for a tuner). I’d like to throw on the intake and exhaust together while I’m waiting on a tune. Can the stock ECM calibration keep the bike while cruising highway at stoichiometric or slightly higher- say 15 to 1 under closed loop, “AND” in the 12:50s with the OEM narrowband O2 sensors while in WOT (open loop) ‘WITH’ the performance exhaust and intake?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Since this run on the 2021 we have also put a 2022 on the dyno, ran it stock, then put our free flowing 828 intake on and some cobra slip-on's on with TTI's in the slip-ons. Somehow we never got around to publishing that. Not sure why...guess we have just been so busy it slipped thru the cracks. Gonna have to dig up the footage, edit it, and publish it. The 2021 and the 2022 are fine with the OEM tune with free flowing intake and exhaust, just like the 2017-2020's. By fine, I mean they do not run lean. Will they run even better with an optimized tune, Yes, but they do not run dangerously lean like the Twin Cams and Sporty Evolutions do. Thanks for your comment and glad you are finding the videos useful/interesting. 👍😎👍

[@noonespecial1217]

@@DKCustomProducts I will be awaiting the publishing- Thank you!

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@noonespecial1217 Cool deal, thanks for watching man!

[@edbrubaker4516]

Thanx guys. I just subscribed to your channel after watching this video. I have a 2018 FLSB 107 M8 Sport Glide that I’m considering doing a stage I upgrade on. After searching on line for an answer as to if it’s okay to upgrade the exhaust and air cleaner first and remap later, I finally found a clear answer here. Preferring to do things piecemeal, I want to go with Screaming Eagle on both air cleaner and exhaust, and the remap later using a Vance & Hines FP3 tuner. Also leaving open the option of a future cam upgrade as well, something like a Zippers Red Shift 468 for instance. Any feedback/advice from anyone is much appreciated.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Hi Ed, thanks for watching, and good to hear you're liking the videos. We would suggest a different air cleaner. Reasons are in the videos linked below. If you do go with a SE air cleaner, then using an External Breather System with it will be very advantageous. Here is a video of why- kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5enlnmQl9GAmc0 2 Video Links on the differences between mediocre air cleaners and true performance A/C's. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXyYqWaimLapgLc kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWnIoIWeeMeofpo Here is a video of what we recommend- kzbin.info/www/bejne/roGaqKuNhtKGl5o Regarding exhaust, it is a big subject, and so many folks end up trying 2, 3, 4 or more different exhausts before they get what the want...or just get tired of looking. Here is a video we made on that subject- kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmebYpeiZ72SnJY

[@bradlozano2571]

If i ever decide buy a Bike with a M8 i will only spend the money on Slipons and a K@N filter and run that way knowing the stock tune is just fine that way til the warranty is up and then i could spend the money with a aftermarket cam stage 2 setup and tune...👍😎

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching and for your comment. A couple of thoughts- Even changing the Slipons and to a K&N filter will "void" the HD warranty according to most dealerships. There is a way around that, allowing you to do what you want with Your bike with no warranty concerns. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pmm4ZYupfd51q8k Here is a video about how you can do an exceptional Stage I that will out-perform the majority of Stage II's. Then after you have the great Stage I, if you decide to put a Stage II on top of that, it will get even More power increase. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXyYqWaimLapgLc

[@bradlozano2571]

@@DKCustomProducts Yes your right...Thats why you keep the Orginal parts and change them back before you bring it in for a warranty issue...

[@johnvandenheuvel4547]

Do we have an outcome on the 22 models? I ordered mine and should have it in a week. Do I need to plan on a tuner?

[@DKCustomProducts]

We do not know. We have not gotten our hands on a 2022 yet. We have been told that there were no changes between the 2021 and 2022, and if that is the case, then no tuner is needed. HOWEVER, until we test it ourselves, we cannot say with 100% certainty.

[@johnvandenheuvel4547]

@@DKCustomProducts right on, thanks for getting back to me. I really appreciate all you do, the channel is packed with great information that's based on proven facts and that's a hard thing to find. Keep it up! I look forward to ordering some of your products for my 2022, perhaps I'll do some videos on it.

[@shidoshii1474]

So your saying slip on mufflers AND air cleaner/breathers for a 21 m8 no tune needed am I hearing this correct.?

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not need a tune to install free flowing exhaust and air cleaner. Unlike the Sportys and Twin Cams, the M8's do not run too lean from the factory, and they will keep their acceptable AFR even with the installation of free flowing intake and exhaust. That said, they will run a little better with a good tune. Here is a report showing the above info- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@shidoshii1474]

You just made my day thank you so much for this information.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad to help! Ride Safe 😎

[@albodoin]

I would suggest to at least install a stage 1 map from a screaming eagle tuner, maybe it’s not the best out there but your bike will ride a lot better and I mean you will notice the difference.

[@DKCustomProducts]

We have never found that to be the case with an M8. Glad it was for you.

[@2kanchoo]

With the cost of a new bike an extra 1k for tuner and tuning is more than worth the cost for piece of mind imo. I might trust this to ride the bike to the tuner after installing the parts but no way in hell I’d just leave it, especially if you do lots of WOT pulls and aggressive riding.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You may find this video interesting, it goes over what you should know before you let anyone touch your bike on a dyno- kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6SleX5jf95qjc0 Far too many times we have seen "great tuners" "Master Techs" and "xyz fancy label" do really mediocre to bad dyno tunes. A computer is much more reliable than a human, and better too, 98% of the time.

[@2kanchoo]

@@DKCustomProducts finding a trustworthy tuner is like 90% of the entire aftermarket part battle. I agree. I’m going through your entire channels catalogue of videos right now. Thanks for putting out such good information! Edit: I’ll probably try a canned/ auto tune tune first. I’m sure the tech has come a long way. My experience with car auto tune is no good at all and canned tunes being decent but needing tweaking.

[@darrindoerres1472]

I own a 2021 Ultra Limited CVO 117 and I want to install Vance and Hines Powerduels head pipes with Vance and Hines Torquer 450s. I was told that it will require a tuner and a tune on the dyno. What you are saying is that neither is required? I don’t want to interfere with the factory and extended warranty. Any information would be appreciated. Note, I wish to change the exhaust system do to heat. Thank you.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching and for commenting. 👍 I understand your questions and concerns. You do Not need a tune when doing the exhaust upgrade you are contemplating. Will it run better with a good tune? Yes. Will it damage it by running the OEM tune? No. What will cause a drop in power, and accelerated wear and tear, is letting the engine run hot. With the change in exhaust you will lower Felt Heat from the exhaust, but it will not lower the engine heat by much. The engine heat is what is detrimental. Here are a few links that you may find useful- Regarding getting a better warranty for less than you can get refunded on your extended warranty. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pmm4ZYupfd51q8k btw, no matter what your dealership tells you, the Power Duals and the Torquers are part of what "voids" your OEM warranty. Regarding dyno tunes- kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6SleX5jf95qjc0 We have a series of Videos on Why and How To Cool Down Your Twin Cam and M8 Engines...we also address actual heat and felt heat. Video Link- kzbin.info/aero/PLb3bvZgbH92_3s-2vv63QggFJ3nteFd_C Written Report Link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/why-how-to-cool-down-the-twin-cam-engine-part-i-dk-cl-tc-dn-1.htm

[@ut1004bp]

Ok, so this is analysis of a 2021 with no mods, its helpful, but I would have like to seen the data with the free flow air filter, and better yet, also with a exhaust mod too..

[@DKCustomProducts]

Wow, I thought this video had the 2021 with free flowing intake and exhaust in it. Just watched it and saw that it didn't. Since this run on the 2021 we have also put a 2022 on the dyno, ran it stock, then put our free flowing 828 intake on and some cobra slip-on's on with TTI's in the slip-ons. Somehow we never got around to publishing that. Not sure why...guess we have just been so busy it slipped thru the cracks. Gonna have to dig up the footage, edit it, and publish it. The 2021 and the 2022 are fine with the OEM tune with free flowing intake and exhaust, just like the 2017-2020's. By fine, I mean they do not run lean. Will they run even better with an optimized tune, Yes, but they do not run dangerously lean like the Twin Cams and Sporty Evolutions do. Thanks for bringing that to our attention. 👍😎👍

[@ut1004bp]

@@DKCustomProducts No problem, thanks for doing this for us, we do appreciate the effort.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@ut1004bp You're welcome, we're glad to help fellow riders. Thanks for watching!

[@ericjames7680]

The only problem I see if you decide to install lets just say ''mufflers'' and go with NO tuner and at a latter point have an engine problem, Harley may void your warranty so the $300.00 or so for a Screaming Eagle tuner may save you many dollars?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, you bring up a good subject. Yes, that is a possibility. However, most slip-ons are not EPA approved, so even with an SE tuner it would still be the same risk. Two better choices- 1. Put the stock mufflers back on before taking it in, should it ever need warranty work. 2. Get a real Warranty that will cover you so that you can do anything you want to Your bike. See link below on a video about that- kzbin.info/www/bejne/pmm4ZYupfd51q8k

[@zyonsdream]

I noticed you were testing an M8 bagger. Does this also apply to Softail models?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, we also have done testing on M8 Softails and gotten the same results. 👍

[@robbyclark6915]

Are you any closer at all with a vied for the M8s? Or is it even something that will benefit a M8 engine?

[@DKCustomProducts]

We have not gotten the M8 ViED anywhere near completion, and since the tune is pretty good from the factory, it is not a pressing priority.

[@jakewright3060]

I’m still confused as to whether or not you are saying that you do not need a tune if you add a complete exhaust and intake? You say no tune if intake or exhaust does that mean a tune is required if you do both?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Sorry we were not clear. Tune is fine with free flowing intake and exhaust both installed.

[@grantgossett1645]

I have a '23 RG Limited and if I am understanding this correctly, a tune should not be needed to do a stage 1 ( air cleaner and slip on mufflers) provided the head pipe isn't changed. Is that correct?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes that is right you can add a free flowing Air Cleaner and free flowing exhaust without needing a tune. Here is a report on the M8 that you may find helpful - www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@HD-on2eg]

What about 2022 117 bikes sold in California? Are the California bikes leaner than ones sold in other states?

[@DKCustomProducts]

The difference between California and 49 state bikes is the fuel evap system. The bike is identical in every other way. This used to be the only difference. There may be other differences now. I cannot say. Cali is like a different world to the rest of the country. We have not shipped tuner or exhaust to Cali for many years now.

[@bajarvcouple]

I bet your already putting a test list together for this years Dyno runs.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yep! 👍

[@huntermorrison9256]

What about 2 into 1 and cat-less headers? Need a tune? Or just slip ons are okay?

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not have to have a tune if you are just changing to a free flowing exhaust or adding slip ons. A tune will give you the most out of your bike, but it is not necessary. we have done many runs with and then without the cat, it does not make a difference in the AFR...video on cat at the bottom below. kzbin.info/www/bejne/oaSWanqtl5iBmqs Thank you for commenting! 👍

[@huntermorrison9256]

So you would consider a 2 into 1. For example, like a d&d Billet Cat. To be a free flowing exhaust that won't hurt me to install with no tuner ? I am considering modifying my stock Road glide st exhaust, removing the secondary pipe, capping the Crossover and making it a 2 into 1. Thanks for the reply guys! Love your videos

[@AdventureMan-kx3dr]

I believe mine is way too lean I have my auto tuner and I have my full exhaust and air intake on the way. Hopefully the auto tuner will keep me in good performance no matter what conditions I’m riding in

[@jakewright3060]

What tuner did you get and how has it worked?

[@AdventureMan-kx3dr]

@@jakewright3060 screamin eagle auto tuner with the broad spectrum o2 sensors has worked fantastic. On colder mornings it use to lean out and spit and has weird power ranges. And in rainy conditions it use to spit and spudder and suck the fuel tank dry quickly That auto tuner adjust itself based off conditions on the fly and I’ve never had issues since it was installed

[@Supremebean303]

So, I don’t necessarily need a tune with a high flow intake and two into one exhaust? I rode about 200 miles yesterday and can tell it’s running okay but a tune could help. Plan on it just expensive😅 mines a 18’ street Bob m8

[@DKCustomProducts]

The M8 is not like the Sporty or Twin Cam. It is not too lean from the factory. It can also adjust for the free flowing intake and exhaust, without going so lean it is dangerous or damaging to the engine. Will it run even better if you tune it? Yes, but no damage is being done by not tuning it. Here is a report on the subject- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm Here is a video about the ECM (explaining how it adjusts) that you may find interesting/useful- kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqfFhZ6Iq6uUbpI The least expensive way to get a tune on an M8 is at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/v-h-fuelpak-fp4-efi-flash-tuner-w-auto-tune-for-stage-i-ii-s-dk-vh-fp4.htm Before doing a dyno tune, check out this video- kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6SleX5jf95qjc0

[@Supremebean303]

@@DKCustomProducts you’re Awesome subbed

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@Supremebean303 Good deal man, we appreciate that! Ride safe!

[@Nitro5454]

So are you saying I can change both the air filter and put on a header exhaust without a tuner? My 2021 117 smells rich, just like my 16 twin cam did with a stage 2 kit.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, that is correct.

[@jasongarner8604]

So I have a 2022 tri glide and I have added cobra slip on exhaust and I want to add cobra headers with a screaming eagle breather. Are you saying I can do all this with out doing a tune. I dont want to spend money on a tuner that I don’t really need

[@DKCustomProducts]

You will not need a tune. Will it run a little better with a good tune? Yes, But a tune is not needed to keep the AFR in a safe range for the engine. It will NOT be too lean. 👍

[@smitt1970]

So I have a 2021 limited, had SE air filter and paid for the tuner and slip on exhaust, so what your day is that I could add full header with the stage 1 tune on my bike and I will be fine to run like this? My warranty is over next January, and was going to wait till then to get a different tuner, but it’s not needed? Thanks for the heads up. Bike runs good, and mileage is good, but this bike will need to last me and I always take care of my bike. Thanks!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Hopefully the tune they used is as good or better than the stock tune. If so, you are good on a full header set up. For ongoing coverage, you may find this video useful- kzbin.info/www/bejne/pmm4ZYupfd51q8k

[@Steve-ec6ed]

I have a 2013 Heritage with a slip on and I just ordered the screaming eagle high performance filter(havent installed yet). I assume I will need a tune? How bad is it to ride the bike without the tune? Like can I at least ride it to dealer or def not and trailer it?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for watching and for your comment. 👍 If you are running the stock tune on your 2013, it is already far too lean for its own good. If you still have the stock exhaust on it, adding a SE filter will not change much. Unfortunately, the SE filter swap does not do much in the way of performance increase. Here are a couple of videos you may find interesting- kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWnIoIWeeMeofpo kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXyYqWaimLapgLc kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6SleX5jf95qjc0

[@kevinreynolds5068]

Have you had a chance to dyno the new 121 VVT stock and with free flowing exhaust and filter?

[@DKCustomProducts]

No we have not had a chance to dyno the 121 VVT yet. Devin (the D in DK) has a 121 VVT, but we have not had the opportunity to dyno yet. Thank you for commenting! MB

[@kevinreynolds5068]

@@DKCustomProducts Thanks for the reply! Has Devin changed the exhaust and filter on his 121, or is something he won’t do until he can get it on the dyno?

[@DKCustomProducts]

He has already installed our External Breather System, Air Cleaner, Pipes and installed thunder Torque inserts into the pipes. He still has all of his OEM parts so we can reinstall them if/when we get to do dyno test, but he wanted to get the bike Externally breathing and to get rid of the hot box Air Cleaner ASAP! MB

[@randycurl866]

Ok so i put a no cat headers on my 2021 Road glide special. I haven't done the air yet. So I shouldn't worry about it damaging the engine without having a tune? Just trying to do a little at a time.

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is correct. No damage will occur with no cat headers and a HiFlow intake because of the tune. Will it run better with a good tune? Yes. But it will not be too lean without one.

[@randycurl866]

@@DKCustomProducts Thanks for the reply. You guy's are great!

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@randycurl866 We appreciate it, man. Ride safe!

[@kylesaraceni8948]

Hi guys, so I did an install of an S&S Sidewinder 2-1 on a 2021 Road Glide Special (114 stock M8). I added the Smart Tune Pro with wide band O2 sensors and plugged in the Pro Street Tuner and the software told me it was flagged as a California bike and no tunes were allowed (not even from genuine HD components!). I later discovered CARB has yet to approve the tunes for the Pro Street Tuner for 2021 bikes. I have not changed the stock air cleaner. Your video here implies that I should be safe running the S&S exhaust without a Stage 1 tune until CARB approves the tunes for 2021 CA bikes?? (I have moved out of state, CA emissions rules don’t apply to me anymore).

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yep, crazy stuff happening out in Cali with CARB.

[@JSpool1]

So I have a 2021 fxbbs 114 with cobra slip ons. Been wanting to add a k&n filter to my bike since the bike comes with a open air intake from factory. You saying I’ll be good without a tune? I don’t mind tuning my bike but SE has no tunes for my bike as of yet. Which sucks….

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is correct, you are good to go with the OEM tune. Will it run better with an SE tune? Maybe, maybe not. Will it run better with a good aftermarket tune, yes, but it will not damage it to run with the OEM tune. Here is a link where you can get a tune right now that will help it run a little better. www.dkcustomproducts.com/dynojet-power-vision-flash-tuner-w-auto-tune-dk-pv-cmp-pkg.htm

[@JSpool1]

@@DKCustomProducts thanks for the intel and tune suggestion. Unfortunately bike has 4yr warranty I’m not trying to burn lol, so can’t do pv3 even though that would be my first choice over SE

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@JSpool1 Not trying to talk you into anything, but it may be helpful for you to know that if you purchased an extended warranty, you can cancel it at anytime and get a pro-rated refund. If it was given to you (not listed as a separate charge in your sales agreement) then there is no refund to be had.

[@edlangford5987]

I also want to remove the catalytic converter so will that need anything more than a stock tune

[@DKCustomProducts]

You do not.

[@GuiltySiNz]

Any Update on the 22' M8? can they also Run and Air cleaner with Slips ons with stock headpipe with Cat? Thx

[@DKCustomProducts]

With Slip-ons & AC the AFR stays the same. The M8 ECM does a good job of adjusting to them. We also had a 22 on a Dyno just a few months ago month or so ago. Put a High Flow Air Cleaner and slip-ons on it and it was good at OEM tune. Have not done a video on it yet. All the M8's will run a little better with a great tune, but none of them are in the dangerous lean area with free flowing A/C and/or exhaust. Here's a link to a Report, with charts, that you may find interesting- www.dkcustomproducts.com/milwaukee-eight-dyno-charts-other-interesting-info-dk-m8-rpt.htm

[@garyrhode3755]

I have a 2021 Street Bob - what slip on exhaust do you suggest i go with for my bike and probably will stay with the stock air filter Ventilator Air Cleaner. A slip on exhaust is the only thing i want to change - for a free er flowing exhaust. Thanks. - Gary

[@DKCustomProducts]

Everyone's ear is different. I personally would modify the stock slip-ons (see video below) or get some Twin Slash slip-ons and put the TTI's in them. Here is a link to a video we made on how to pick out the right exhaust the first time- kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmebYpeiZ72SnJY kzbin.info/www/bejne/qoCwemavd9-Sb9k www.dkcustomproducts.com/m8-softail-models-166.htm

[@garyrhode3755]

@@DKCustomProducts It"s possible i may consider in future to remove baffles from stock exhaust system and install Thunder Torque Inserts and i probably still can retain the stock heat shields on the dual exhaust pipes (i like the style of the stock exhaust) or will do my best to decide on a Slip On system...(may be at bike week in daytona to get some best ideas) Is the cat on stock baffles? What TTI number would be best with the Stock 114 engine... Street Bob? Will be keeping the 114 engine totally stock, other than exhaust and probably a high flo air filter - thanks for video links! :)

[@TheKyleHelm]

Have you done the 2022 yet? I cant find the video if so!

[@DKCustomProducts]

The only 22 we got our hands on was a 117, bone stock. The AFR's were good on it, the same as the 21's.

[@TheKyleHelm]

@@DKCustomProducts well perfect. I have the 117 on my LRST w/ high flow intake. Thank you for your reply. Plan on tuning anyway soon but comforting knowing Im not hurting it. I put VH 2 into 1 high output exhaust on it and it runs impeccable. But its always been in the back of my mind about needing immediate tune or not!

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@TheKyleHelm That worked out nicely. Enjoy your ride, and when you get a chance, make sure you have an External Breather System on that puppy. Here's a video of them- kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5enlnmQl9GAmc0

[@jasongarner8604]

Well I add slip on cobras and a screaming eagle breather on my 2022 tri glide and now it’s throwing too lean codes

[@DKCustomProducts]

Likely a intake or exhaust leak. We have done countless 2017 thru 2023 bikes and Trikes with free flowing intakes and exhaust and never had a too lean code. Many of them have been on the dyno where we monitored the AFR with wide band sensors, and they were not too lean with the stock tune. Might even be the plastic intake with a crack or leak of some sort. Give it a test with some carb cleaner or other spray to see where it is leaking.

[@jasongarner8604]

It was my fault loose screws on breather tighten up and all is good

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@jasongarner8604 Glad you got it figured out man!

[@jasongarner8604]

If I remove the converter from exhaust will it still be ok with no tune

[@davidcook3101]

For off road purposes only…. Say a road king M8 107 header was de-catted and slip-on installed. Would a tune be needed?

[@DKCustomProducts]

If it is a 2017-2021 there is no tune needed to do that. It is recommended to install TTI's so that you do not lose power. Below are a couple of videos on the subject- kzbin.info/www/bejne/pqOZq2NmnLFoj8k kzbin.info/www/bejne/mGPQf2qij5Z2gtk

[@davidcook3101]

@@DKCustomProducts Thanks for the info. Your channel is top notch. I’ve learned more here about Harley than anywhere else.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@davidcook3101 Glad to know we're helping fellow riders! We appreciate your support!

[@JFROMM454]

Does this apply to just slip ons OR an air cleaner? Or is it saying you can use both and not necessarily need a tune?

[@DKCustomProducts]

You can do both A/C and exhaust.

[@jimmys6996]

So I can add Tab 2-1-2 head pipe (no cat) and their bam sticks with zombie baffles and I won't need a tune?

[@DKCustomProducts]

If you have a 2017-2021 M8, that is correct.