Do Vitality Need Changes?

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[@jonasba2764]

I feel like it's so weird to have flameZ in these anchor positions when it seems like he can't even sit still for 5 minutes. Put him in some active positions and I guarantee he will play much better

[@xlgapelsin6173]

Flamez is a human aimbot and should be used as a pretty aggro player IMO

[@christor2907]

Mezi tends to second site anchor, Flames is the more active site anchor. He seems like an ADHD player, but then he isn't actually a selfless player who will entry at the expense of his stats. Vitality kind of lack that IMO. Only Apex will jump around a corner to make space for his tm8s and I don't even rate Apex at all. But they need a player with Flamez quality to actually do more of that type of entry play on T side. They are so bad on T side it is unbelievable. Zywoo entries half the time. Sphinx and Flamez both I find are quite greedy with playing passive, protecting their lives in situations where they need to take space. Sphinx especially.

[@inferno_au]

@@christor2907 >They are so bad on T side it is unbelievable. I mean, Hawka literally shows in the video that it's CT side which is Vitality's issue, not T side.

[@christor2907]

@@inferno_au Thats statistically because Zywoo entries so much on T, he is able to be selectively active to get picks. When he can't do that as much on CT, with such a passive set of tm8s then apex throwing his life away half the time, CT becomes a retake simulator. I think if Zywoo wasnt finding the entries, their T would be worse than their CT. The eye test to me makes their T entries totally reliant on set plays and Zywoo because players like Sphinx and Flamez lack taking initiative when space is presented. That just translates to CT side also when you need info.

[@thchiefe]

@@christor2907you mustn’t watch many vitality games then. Flamez is generally entrying right behind apex or Mezii. Been so many games (Anubis is one) where Flamez just single handedly wins the game for them on t side alone with his entries

[@xjamiec]

Spinx needs to step up way more in big games, he frags out in groups etc but has little impact when it matters. Watching him on inferno against G2 was painful

[@ballertheking1038]

good point actually.

[@stayhome4626]

Yeah , he's a ghost in the playoffs .

[@poorman9259]

💯

[@richardzheng231]

With apex, I believe he likes to play in high information positions. Those do happen to be star positions, but the fact that he can gain a lot of information to make calls with is a trade off they seem to be fine with, even if he isn’t a top level fragger

[@D0rlisok]

FlameZ’s CT positions dont fit his playstyle… he should be more rotator-y than anchor-y

[@raze_303]

Yeah but apex takes them all unfortunately

[@deekayy3222]

that's true, i think even apex discussed this but i don't think that will change

[@ballertheking1038]

Mezzi did an interview on the desk after the Spirit win and said he changed his mindset from "trying to delay" to "how do i get a kill" and it helped his stats, so maybe that revelation makes a difference.

[@realtomo29]

That’s a good quip. I really believe in Mezii’s potential, I think he could be a star support player like Xyp3x or even Perfecto as he showed in Dallas and the Blast Final

[@volify_]

right on time considering results and the talk of this on popular podcasts lately. keep on the grind brotha, big things ahead.

[@RobCooper-Bachatador]

Important to note that using relatuve statistics, Liquid's CT side is quite good. Its their T side that is costing them. Hence the IGL is under pressure.

[@crazygamerbp]

If he can repeat that finals performance he most definitely deserves to stay

[@mati4181]

I think mezzi has got some stardom in him.

[@realtomo29]

Great video, you can really see whenever Apex pops off in the star position on ct side, they is very little chance for the other teams but this is a very inconsistent occurrence

[@LeafaR11]

I was listening to Talking Counter Spunj suggested switching some of Spinx and Flamez CT positions. Thoughts on that? I think it might push them further in the longrun

[@GTheGecko]

Great video as always! I think before making roster changes, Apex should give up most of his roles on CT side, as you said, and give more freedom to flamez and Mezii. As another commenter mentioned, it seems like apex has to micromanage his players more than other igls on CT. On that talking counter episode they mentioned how Vitality is lacking experience. However, I think mezii has shown before that he can be a great fragger, so giving him and Flamez more space makes sense. If Flamez and Mezii still look uncomfortable in their decisions after a few months, then replace one of them. Because they have the right pieces to win trophies right now. But the main point as you mentioned is that apex needs to give up his roles in CT.

[@AL0129]

Whats the website he used for analysis of stats in specific map positions?

[@wppa1495]

ApEX talked a lot about this in a french interview, I will sum up his point : Vitality is extremely inconsistent in communication and « mood » on TeamSpeak and sometimes it’s hard for him because his teammates aren’t communicating as much as he wants them to. Also, he needs these positions to make calls and can have some decent games when he doesn’t have to micromanage as much his teammates (he talked about pushing Zywoo to play more aggressive, especially with AWP). For example someone said he should play B-Anchor Mirage, like wtf ? You don’t see nothing all round long and are supposed to call ??? Finally he talked about mezii and the fact he expects him to do better as he is fragging in scrims.

[@kivori3438]

One of the top problems i see is consistency, they seem to go from top team even strat wise to top 100 going forward just with individualities (especially “zywoo go kill” meme)

[@stayhome4626]

You hit the nail on the head . The fastest way to workshop right now is to give flamez the more active CT positions with Apex guiding and supporting him . If they opt to change players , the only guaranteed significant upgrade I can see without messing with the roles is Jimphat for mezii otherwise some players have to make comprises for the likes of Twistzz , Frozen or Nertz . By the why, why do you think Zywoo's CT sides are not up there with donk and monesy ? What is he doing wrong ?

[@thchiefe]

Usually he’s playing those spots with apex who can be a liability in those star positions

[@kivori3438]

Zywoo isnt on the same positions as monesy or donk tbh

[@xlgapelsin6173]

Spunj,Moses and YNK talked about vitality on talking counter and it seems like Apex kinda has to make things happen because his players don't take the initiative. Someone like Flamez should take initiative and play outside on Nuke instead of Apex but that can't happen because Apex needs to do something since the rest of the team wont

[@bagel5748]

pretty sure flameZ used to play star positions before he joined vitality, so why not just swap apex and his roles?

[@cristianonacort1217]

I think this team is destined to be better at T sides considering the players they have, at the end of last year mezii showed a good level as a T, flamez best side has always been the T side and ZywOo being a hybrid also helps that... I agree that Apex should concede the best spots to his players, but I feel like he feels more in control playing in those positions and changing that is gonna hurt his calling, which has been great so far!

[@inferno_au]

As an Australian, I have to advertise my boi jks as a replacement for mezii if CT is an issue for Vitality. You could throw jks in with his default CT positions, and shift Vitality around so that flameZ starts taking more aggressive CT positions, and apEX takes any positions left over. Using Mirage as an example: move apEX from connector to mezii's old position of B-anchor, move flameZ to connector (which would fit his playstyle better), and move jks into flameZ's old position of A-anchor (which is a position he is already brilliant at).

[@KindriEvans]

so remove an entry/support player for a star lurker player on the T side? you fix one issue and create another one

[@inferno_au]

@@KindriEvans I was more thinking for their T-side that Vitality would want a Magisk replacement rather than a mezii replacement. Magisk used to be the aggressive-lurker to counter Spinx's passive-lurk. jks used to be an aggressive-lurker to counter Liazz's passive-lurking during the 100 Thieves/Renegades days. And jks has shown some interest in going back to his old role. It's not perfect (no roster move is) but I think if you get flameZ to entry a bit more and apEX to support, it could probably work out well. Though as always, I could be wrong.

[@poorman9259]

Replace spinx don’t be stupid

[@psyched91]

How is the nose doing Hawka? :)

[@lmgo5960]

How many star riflers do these guys need to win? A low maintenance support play would go nuts. Give Zywoo, Flamez and Spinx should have the heaviest loads to carry with 2 IGL/support players. JKS would be a great pick up

[@thanakornkhumon7365]

Role swap some positions might be better, since I see no problem in this roster that much.

[@MisbehavingChild]

I'm backing mezzi over flamez, flamez should go col, cut grim

[@user-fc8xw4fi5v]

Damn dude idk what the fix is but my boys apEX and Zywoo better start winning again soon or I'll be demolished 😭

[@justbasic314]

No Danes, no win games….

[@emaadkhan7049]

get in twistzz then you have a consistent tournament winning team and cut either sphinx or flamez or mezii

[@owenchapman7478]

I know a lot of people will laugh at this but it would be interesting to think about. Lets say they get a star rifler. What about s1mple? It would be one of the most toxic teams and I think ZywOo would burst into tears every game but if vitalitys pockets were deep enough, falchons performance was a fluke and s1mple could handle a team not being built around him I think it would be fun to watch. But honestly, I think mezii should be given more time as he played amazing in Dallas when flamez, spinx and zywoo were sleeping.

[@barnkhan]

they switched coaches and players, give them some time to settle

[@baptistev9630]

apex don't want to show his real rating (0.80) so he plays star positions and rush first against ecos

[@deekayy3222]

warra win vs Iceland that is for England brev!

[@jR0xas]

Vitality players are all a coin flip. They all either play well or completely ghost. I don't even know how they would fix this. Spinx playoffs ghost with 0 impact, flamez, mezii and zywoo either play well or ghost. How is apex meant to call when he doesn't know if his team mates will show up or not? I think apex plays better position because he doesn't trust his team mates to give info.

[@klyrj2011]

Apex had been a tilting maulding drag on the team, only winning when Zywoo goes god mode. I think Apex needs to go

[@victorjiang5827]

Bot vitality 😂

[@zettour.]

In a year: Thank you XTQZZZ. Welcome r0nic.