Does OVER-PROOFING Sourdough Make It More Sour?

In this video I push the limits of sourdough bread proofing to see if it will increase the sour taste of my bread. Get a 10% discount on all kitchen and home goods products from Kooi Housewares with my link: collabs.shop/fbptsl. Thank you to Kooi Housewares for sponsoring this video.

[@GrantBakes]

Get a 10% discount on all kitchen and home goods products at Kooi Housewares using my link: kooihousewares.com/GRANTBAKES10. Edit: Looks like the Dough Whisk got wiped out of stock 😅 You can get the same one on Amazon here: amzn.to/3TNT8a7 (Both links are affiliate links.)

[@DrewKroft]

I've been baking bread for decades, and I love flavor - a lot of flavor! My approach begins with starter and an extended proof (over proof), to the point of the dough nearly breaking down - almost becoming all starter. I work in a bit more sugar, water, salt and flour. The added flour provides more structure, the sugar more fuel, the salt slowing yeast overgrowth. I pinch off portions to freeze as needed for later. So, my "starters" are much larger portions - these contributing more fermentation products; balanced with fresh flour for structure and a teaspoon of sugar to reinvigorate the lift.

[@chuckbatson595]

Fascinating results, thank you for sharing! Definitely going to try a long fridge proof with my next loaf. Thanks for all your efforts in the Quest for Sourness.

[@deborahkennedy2003]

In my experience, the longer I leave it in the fridge is what gives it more tang, that’s assuming a normal starter rise time and a normal bulk fermentation time. I would be curious to see if extending all three fermentation stages, as this video shows, makes a difference in the sourness I already get by extra long fridge fermentation. Great video as always!

[@GrantBakes]

Thank you! The cold fermentation definitely seems to play a big factor so far.

[@paulsalverda1246]

The temperature of the fridge matters, too. Mine was too cold so I upped it to the highest available setting and it helped the tang. I’d like to try a long cool, maybe 45 to 50 F, proof. I’ve also had some success using only 5% starter as less starter means longer fermentation.

[@susanabdallah8020]

Thanks, Grant. Bravo. You did it.

[@andrewmapachito6499]

Great stuff! I’ve also found that lowering the hydration can give you more proofing time, which you showed is what makes the bread more sour. The gluten/dough strength degrades from fermentation AND water. My most sour bakes were from recipes with about 50 to 60% hydration

[@GrantBakes]

Great insight! Thanks for sharing.

[@markgeyer1]

Great video as always, Grant. Have you done any tests on increasing the amount of declining starter, as in, more than the typical bakers percentage (20%)? Say to ~30-40%? That’s A LOT of starter, which I think would alter fermentation times, BUT would it taste sour? No idea. The base thought of it is… if more acidity is used would it taste more tangy 🤷‍♂️

[@GrantBakes]

I tested the large amount of starter theory in the first video of this series. At least for me and the way I tested it, it didn't produce extra sour bread. But, the theory makes sense to me, especially if the large amount of starter is very acidic.

[@zanequible8874]

I've tried increasing the amount of levain, which theoreticallly increases the amount of starter, which did not result in greater sourness.

[@johnsonrobbins]

WOOT! You did it. So excited over here. This has me draw the conclusion that adding some 20% or so wheat to the recipe expedites the fermentation. This is why I’m getting those results a little bit faster but 🎉.

[@GrantBakes]

Thanks for sharing!

[@johnsonrobbins]

@@GrantBakes would be super interesting to see a side by side with the citric acid loaf to compare the taste and which you prefer

[@GrantBakes]

@@johnsonrobbins True, that would be a good comparison. I can tell you with almost 100% certainty that I preferred the real sourdough loaf.

[@johnsonrobbins]

@@GrantBakes I ran a parallel experiment and let my dough cold proof 36 hours as compared to my standard 24. It was maybe a bit more sour but the taste was definitely more complex, can’t explain it but I really like it. I hate waiting the extra time but I’m thinking it’s going to have to be part of the new process for me. Thanks again for sharing for all our benefits

[@jonnitastubbs3263]

This was really informative for me. Not the tang you wanted but you fulfilled my question as to how long is too long for fermentation. Now I know I can leave my 1st rise longer than I have been. Yah!!!

[@truthreignsfacts4997]

I use organic whole rye flour for my starter. Definitely gives a really good sourdough flavor. Makes sense, because it’s a whole grain, that the yeast and bacteria feed off of.

[@klet7333]

Great video thank you. Were do u get the air tight seals for your bowls?

[@GrantBakes]

Hi! I got these from Kooi Housewares. Here’s my affiliate link: www.kooihousewares.com/products/lilypad-lid-11?variant=39495296909347. You can use the code GRANTBAKES10 at checkout to get 10% off.

[@klet7333]

@@GrantBakes thank you!!! Enjoying watching your videos. Keep them coming

[@dianamansour7323]

Grant, I’ve been using a starter that is 100% rye flour & that is what gets my bread more sour. Each time I make bread the starter gets more sour. I also use your 80% hydration recipe but add whole wheat flour & ground flax seeds. Sometimes sunflower & sesame seeds. I never have the same ratio of the different flours or seeds but I make sure all flours add up to 450grams.

[@VictorYepello]

Interesting results and I will try the 48 hour cold proofing. My question to you is what if you made your usual loaf with normal bench rest and final proof then the 48 hour cold nap.... ? Would it be as sour?

[@doraharrison1642]

interesting test and comments. I'm waiting for written instructions to give this a try. Thank You Grant, your like me... very persistent...lol

[@RJMelendez82]

Do you let loaf warm to room temperature after taking out of the fridge from you 48 hour proof??? Or does it go from fridge to oven?

[@MaryLou84]

I use a dry starter that I keep in the fridge and feed only when I’m at the last 10-20g. This starter is already pretty sour and smells like beer. For the bread I’m mixing whole wheat with all purpose flour and, if I let it in the fridge overnight for the last rise, it definitely gets pretty sour.

[@WarButler]

Since switching to a higher protein flour I've noticed my loaves are less sour. Maybe this is because the extra protein means that the window for optimal proofing is widened. But perhaps you could try using a blend of flours that add up to a slightly lower total protein content.

[@johnsweeney619]

Do the exact same process but use 100% whole wheat. I use yecora rojo grain that I freshly mill. It has a very high gluten content and works great! Every time it comes out very sour

[@mrgreenbudz37]

I will try a longer proofing in the fridge also.

[@CathySchramer]

What if I don’t have banner on Banton anytime, I use tea towels, it always sticks to it

[@kimberlyburns1188]

What’s surprised me is how soft the loaf was. do you think create softness?

[@ihus9950]

Interesting Grant 👍🏻

[@GrantBakes]

Thanks!

[@LS5511]

Do you put the lid on or is it a jarred?

[@GrantBakes]

For the starter? I usually put the lid on at all times. My jar let’s excess gas release from the lid if it builds up.

[@silvermoon3486]

Can you put the recipe under more on your video so we can print it please 😊❤👍🏼

[@bobcatmania]

Back in the days when I did sourdough, I used beer instead of water to feed the starter... eventually the starter made very sour dough

[@Rexyspride]

I'm not sure if I'm imagining it but I find that my 100% wholewheat sourdough tastes a bit more sour to me. Might be worth a test?

[@GrantBakes]

There's probably something to that!

[@mattymattffs]

Just let your starter go bad, like for a long time. Leave it on the counter for a week or two after a feed. Fridge it. Let it keep going. You'll get more sour. Using more starter also gets it more sour.

[@onlyinparadise4613]

I said something similar to this on his first quest. His 👂 doesn’t work apparently 🤣

[@GrantBakes]

Oh, I hear just fine :) Who says I'm not working on this as we speak? Haha. Thank you both for sharing.

[@onlyinparadise4613]

@@GrantBakes I’m just giving you a hard time! A kick in the ass to move you along 🦵🏻, I mean for the bread 😁

[@alexjimenez7688]

Love from acero Cruz ❤

[@GrantBakes]

¡Muchas gracias!

[@joannestretch]

if you want more sour -less starter, can be unfed for a longer period of fermentation -less salt 1% instead of 2% -the longer the better, more sour, in cold retard, at 72 hrs nice and sour, longer even more pronounced like 120hrs -ambient temperature the colder it is the more sour for it will take longer to ferment -the older the starter, the more sour, new starter is not great to get more sour u have to give it time to mature -some dark rye and/or whole wheat in the starter and dough will help with more sour -feeding the starter once mature not necessarily everyday, skip a day once or twice a week, but dont let it get acidic that will not be great for the gluten formation in the dough -use very cold water in the dough for bread, will prolong the fermentation time (although this is temporary for fermentation brings on heat)

[@haroldscudder2202]

If you want it more sour try adding a half a teaspoon of citric acid😂❤

[@haroldscudder2202]

Also stir in the hooch the liquid on top for more sour❤

[@GrantBakes]

I’ve done that!

[@AveMaria1918]

Why did you add an extra 25 grams of water?

[@GrantBakes]

I've been using a 75% hydration dough for these sourness tests, which is 25 more grams of water than my normal recipe at 70% hydration.

[@AveMaria1918]

I see. Thanks. I only use your recipe and method. So I got a little panicked when I heard you say 325 mg of water! 😂.

[@GrantBakes]

@@AveMaria1918 Haha I get it. It’s ok though, I use both 😊

[@yaminalabidi7514]

👍🎩❤️

[@stevedavidson8802]

There’s nobody at home if that’s going to go through those procedures to make sourdough bread if you ever look at the list of chemicals and ingredients in commercial bread baking, you’ll know why their bread is sour right off the bat

[@GrantBakes]

I assume you’re referring to citric acid and other additives?

[@pbk4k]

Hey @grantbakes I’m quite a newbie at sourdough bread but my friend who has been baking for years (and my mentor) does not over proof her sour dough bread but most always does an extra long cold proof. Her bread is always very pleasantly extra sour. She has left it as long (and maybe longer) as 72 hours to proof. How ‘bout that for an experiment? ❤ 1:36

[@Shelmerdine745]

Yeah, no way you’re actually using that dough whisk. Sell out

[@GrantBakes]

Oh yes I am 😊

[@Shelmerdine745]

@@GrantBakes Well, you’re making a mistake, then. It wasn’t made for mixing bread doughs and you’re just making it harder for yourself.