Does Your Spec Suck In PvE In The War Within?

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[@luckdrivenluu6429]

Warriors arent allowed to be anything over mid tier

[@tyrgannusgaming6657]

Seem to be doing quite fine in race to world first though

[@jimmyodinson9841]

We'll survive. We always do. Personally I'd rather Warriors weren't the "flavour of the month" class with ppl rolling just because it's doing well.

[@colonelbbq]

@@tyrgannusgaming6657 that is a massive cop out answer, because there is a world of difference between those people and normal players, and it is disingenuous to imply otherwise.

[@Guitarman5705]

@@tyrgannusgaming6657 compared to dk quad stacking? warriors have caught 4 nerfs in as many hotfixes and now that people are getting their 4 set people are gonna be so far ahead of fury in every instance going forward because our tier set bonus is hot asshole.

[@doctorferdinand1003]

@@colonelbbq Isn't it fair to say warriors are performing even better in lower tier content? With utility not being as important, and a greater focus on damage. My warrior consistently does the most damage out of all of my classes. Sad I started playing him prot now though

[@Iautocorrect]

"Does your spec suck" Don't care im having fun.

[@marsmech]

Im playing a spellslinger frost mage I don't care if I'm top dps I'm having fun also.

[@LalaDepala_00]

Been ele shaman for years now. Don't really care how well it does

[@KingMickeyMouseOoO]

It’s NOT about being the top spec! It’s about survival…..and as a tank, I have noticed a serious decline in survivability! ❤

[@Tribalpotato]

The problem with warrior nerfs in general is the fact that warriors, both specs, are PURE DPS, and have little to non-utility to bring especially in M+ groups, you nerf damage, you directly nerfed every other aspect of the spec, including how fun it is to play double so for PVP. While warriors have some utility for PVP, PVE is totally different story, Rally really is not that good, especially for 5 player groups, and this is sad part its not like warrior had no utility in the past,pve disarm, banners, armor reduction, enemy damage reduction, party damage increase, was all tools warriors had in MOP every single one gradually taken away from the class and given to others since that point. If you design class to be only damage dealer, it should do that, properly not compete with classes that have 10 times the utility. Paladins, Shamans, Mages, classes with a lot of very good utility, should not be close to damage to lets say Warrior or Destruction warlock. Just see how much more usable Retribution Paladin is in M+ compared to warriors for example. Basically, if all classes should be balanced in DPS, classes also should be balanced in utility they can bring. Blizzard seems to have very conflicting, and inconsistent balancing philosophy, wow is long past the point where damage was everything that mattered, especially with the introduction of M+, they also tend to react to more of a whining class communities like mages (poster child) and druids(somehow still considered hard to play) more, compared to others like warlocks and warriors that tend to whine and cry a lot less.

[@cabal426]

This a pretty spot on comment. Warriors are among my favorite classes to play but more offten then not I end up not playing them much over the course of an expansion due very limited utility for PvE group content. It is very noticeable in M+ and delve content when lose those useful non damage abilities. Like you said if you bring little to no utility you better bring big damage.

[@L3FT2BURN]

I remember when warriors were called "banner bitches" in MoP. So safe to say people did not like that kind of utility.

[@Tribalpotato]

@@cabal426 I do not agree on delves per say, I think fury especially may be best spec to do delves on, high aoe, high survivability and if you go for Thane hero talent you can go defense stance and tank everything in delves without any issue. If anything, warriors do have high survivability, however that is often overlooked by the community that actually focuses on speed running content. You can make a good argument that simply bringing a warrior into the group will increase your groups' survivability by a lot, however that is only really noticeable in the extreme high end where people pay attention to every detail.

[@estebanslavidastic4382]

As someone who has hopped on Druid, blizzard is not pampering them. Warriors were objectively overturned. That’s a fact. Druids have been pretty under tuned so far

[@shellgaming6727]

Am I only only one who disagrees with the ""no utility" argument? Rally, Battle Shout, AOE fear, (I'd argue even heroic leap is kind of utility for some things). Not saying there aren't better choices in some instances, but its not like you get absolutely nothing from bringing a warrior.

[@ElitenOfficial]

shouldn't you look at 99% and mythic instead of 95% and heroic.

[@reperfan4]

At that point you're narrowing down the sample size too much I feel. Going down that small is literally only like quad-digit numbered sample size, which when reduced down to the spec level you might even be getting some that have less than 100 representatives. And at that point we're better off talking about the individual players rather than saying their performance is indicative of any wider trends like game balance.

[@ElitenOfficial]

@@reperfan4 fair enough ty for answering :)

[@Ecliptor.]

Isn't that overall damage graph useless because it counts trash damage as well?

[@ObserverDoel]

Bro don't even mention Jira, everyone who knows what that is has PTSD.

[@天使霜]

Man i think they just need to make MORE content. Screw trying to make m+ perfect (its terrible who wants to just run dungeons forever, be a man and get into a raid) make a boss rush style thing, add new stuff to that awakening machine, make a new mage tower, create more open world things that bring players together for group content like more advanced world bosses instead of these easy to solo rare mobs. It's just crazy to be satisfied with 1 raid a week (even in a more advanced patch no one runs old raids thats why s4 of dragonflight had rotating high ilvl raids to help people do older content and get some of those interesting items at an appropriate ilvl.) M+ which most people dont want to do especially healers, and delves which the m+ community thinks are terrible??? Even though a single delve has more effort, new mechanics, and interesting gameplay than every m+ affix combined... Tl:dr need more variety in content. It will easily bring some of the more niche specs and playstyles that don't work in m+ and raids back into popularity and playability.

[@Kohmuh]

"You're going to buff our ST since you nerfed our AOE... Right blizz? Right... Blizz...?"

[@kurykirin6281]

As a ret with nothing but purple, orange and pink logs in a completely average guild, no one comes close to me except our shadow priest occasionally.

[@bloodroz]

Week 2 Boss Damage fury warrior is dead last for dps specs. Only ahead of the support dragon. And there is still another incoming AOE nerf in sight.

[@williamreid8299]

I'm really surprised you haven't covered the greatest Raid ever in WoW - the wiped guild banks in August which Blizzard are now refusing to restore claiming they can't. Is it just the little guys who are going to be left hanging while well-known streamers have got all their stuff back? In the old days Blizzard used to restore items which were stolen by hackers from backups - do they not do backups now ? They clearly didn't analyse the change properly. They clearly didn't test the change properly - and now the damage is done they are refusing to make good. How can there be so little coverage of this?

[@Zenrikku77]

I love how when ever Affliction's doing really good blizzard needs to immediatly have to buff the hell out of the other two spec to complet with it then later will nerf affliction to the ground because they cant figure how to tune it. Affliction is become extremely broken, or unplayible.

[@arnoldchand4144]

rip both dps specs for druids lmao

[@deenman23]

boomie doing well

[@KNByam]

And healing. I haven't seen one resto druid in any raid yet.

[@thunder9236]

Balance is insane in aoe. I main feral and typically outdps my group. Wild stalker is really good

[@7sevin7]

It is absolutely ridiculous that specs that are not even DPS focused are out damaging pure DPS specs. Why is DESTRUCTION WARLOCK at the bottom of this chart? This is a Blizzard problem. It is absolutely insane that my completely DPS focused spec is all the way at the bottom. If it was full of other useful mechanics, like buffs, kicks, ECT. If would make sense. But if you only do one thing, and you suck at it. That's a problem.

[@doppey33]

If you go up the percentile into mythic raids not heroic then Destro and fire mage are right at the top.

[@7sevin7]

@@doppey33 good looking out, I didn't notice that.

[@llhandj1654]

Yes please. Buff Destro…… 😂

[@jorandar1]

Im so sick of fire mage not getting any love.

[@MegaMonsterPlayer]

chill buddy they ve been on top for 3 expansions in a row they will come back for sure

[@estebanslavidastic4382]

Bro what? I don’t understand mages. Never has any class been so consistently overpowered, yet has such a whiny, woe-is-me community. Mage has two specs that are S tier in all forms of contet

[@Ecliptor.]

You could pick the other 2 specs that are good in the mean time. Not many classes can do that.

[@18ccase]

Ive been playing feral for a while now. It sucks so bad this expac my guild is having me raid tank so i dont get dropped for our mythic team Once we start that. Our buttons are high risk, but not high reward. You have to play perfect during tigers fury, beserk, convoke window to even match what the median dps is overall for most other specs. One good fix would be buffing the crap outa tigers fury to add the reward to the high risk portion. Or give us a 5% overall and 10% ferocious bite buff.... Somehow my resto druid healer had ferocious bites doubling my feral bite numbers so something might just be bugged

[@edgyguy7084]

Thanks to u guys I gave up on giving a crap about my green/blue/purple heroic logs... If the boss dies, it dies. Am I up there with fellow DD's on detail? Yes? Then I'm good, cause most people that do heroic, without boosts, are already a minority...

[@raescp]

Resto Druid isn’t great rn but I will always play it, I just love it. I wish the hero talents were more impactful, and the mere thought of doing M+ gives me a panic attack, but raid healing is wonderful

[@TheoryTheoryTheoryTheory]

Resto druid. I feel like I am doing twice the amount of work for like 75% of the reward compared to other healers. And don't even talk about trying to do ANY dps too while healing. I don't think it has ever felt worse.

[@mikebroessler6]

There will always be a low and a high... stop thinking this way think about fun. Please enjoy yourself thats wat its all about. THE BEST PLAYERS also play "bad spec" just enjoy.

[@CosmicCleric]

Not an elite end-gamer by far, but I was really going to enjoy playing Warrior for the first time. And then The God Blzzard smiled down upon me. I f'ing hate charts.

[@Zutang777]

Melee are losers in a lot of this. The ANTI melee mechanics are freaking insane in delves, dungeons and raids. You give my talents that require a combat cadence and conditional talents so much that these anti melee mechanics are making it super inconsistent to do damage.

[@jimmyodinson9841]

Aaaaaaarrrrggghhh!!! Stop saying triage. I'm getting triggered flashbacks to the twatty quest in Theramore 😂😂😂😂

[@TheAstraios]

Hahaha what do you mean Enhance buffed? They took Witch doctor talent that reduces wolf cd by 2 per maelstrom spent and reduced it to 1 second. They added some flat damage to try offset some of the nerf that was in that talent change but it was still overall a nerf.

[@jimmyodinson9841]

It's always the same when they see the best class (warrior 😘) doing well. They kick it down but we're still gonna smash our way through it. 😂

[@snivels]

I feel that none of the specs in the game feel good. I can't explain it but I'd I could say there is "friction" when playing them

[@thunder9236]

The nerfs werent really needed. It sucks that a lot of classes need buffs. I dont like constant nerfs.

[@MyHogs]

If people die early in an pull it is going to make their DPS look a lot lower than it is.

[@felixforschner2572]

honstly nerfig is generally a bad idea. just make everyone else stronger so no one get hit with the nerf hammer

[@dirtnap9641]

Our raids do not reflect this. Ele sham and both DK specs are pumping

[@arnoldchand4144]

somebody said 25% damage boost to 0 damage is still 0 lol. Rip living bomb fire mages

[@MrTyler7070]

The enhance rng isnt from dre its from eleblast lightningbolt resets and msw refunds

[@Aldor623]

No matter what happens, im gonna play Fire mage.

[@KNByam]

I have yet to see a resto druid.

[@piotrjeske4599]

Any seson where beastmaster hunter isn't the best dps in pve sucks.

[@MrSlaughterrific]

Just what we need. The easiest thing in the game performing the best. Why even learn anything

[@Sarge714]

The one thing I noticed different from DragonFlight is in Normal Dungons the healers can't keep up with the healing required. I am dieing a lot more in WW. A lot of times being oneshot. I'm not having as much fun in WW Dungons because of this.

[@bootnscoot5265]

For me it's the unkillable tanks that run from end to end pulling everything at the expense of everybody else.

[@Sarge714]

@@bootnscoot5265 Unkilliable tanks that do 1 dps because of the tank dps nerf. I've been trying to level my tanks and outside Dungons its so frustrating. Attack bad guy, hour later I have them down to 99% health. :-) I finally said this is insane and switched them all over to DPS just to level them to 80 in a timely manner that is not measured in the speed Sedimentary Rock is formed.

[@CosmicCleric]

@@Sarge714 "Unkilliable tanks that do 1 dps because of the tank dps nerf. I've been trying to level my tanks and outside Dungons its so frustrating. Attack bad guy, hour later I have them down to 99% health. :-)" Yeahhh, no. I'm literally second monitoring this video while playing my Prot Pally doing world quests, and things die fast enough. Actual combat time is about x2 what it is for DPS for most mobs. I'm doing 8 delves just fine as well with Brann set to DPS. I get you're salty about not being gods any more, but the trinity has to be maintained, and exaggerating does not help the health of the game.

[@Sarge714]

@@CosmicCleric I used Remix to create on of each type of tank, 6 in all. Warrior and Paladin do the most DPS, the others not so much.

[@staycold682]

@@CosmicCleric agreed, plus as prot warrior the amount of times I am top DPS in big pulls is often enough

6:34 ret was also nerved twice once in prepatch and at least once recently. Further ret profits from progress raids where people die, later its not as good. PTR includes more nerves so far (DPS talents in Paladin talents removed without a replacement, 1min wings removed).

[@LetsPLay7745]

The clasesss are so fked up, mages are tanks, hunters are self healers, paladin tank dies to pets... Back in the day every class had the uniq usefull thing. How cloth are more armored then plate? How the f you farm pvp gear in pve?... And so on... Wow is a fking salad now

[@Hauke-ph5ui]

14:30 Well....alt levelling feels slow when compared to levelling an alt in MoP Remix^^

[@Pandanubex]

I JUST level 4 characters in cata classic and level a warrior in the tbc timewalk, still fastest than the hell experience that is leveling alts in cata

[@Hauke-ph5ui]

@@Pandanubex I actually always liked levelling chars - that's why I have 59 chars (only 7 are at 80 right now, but all of the other 52 are somewhere between 71 and 78 ^^ and will reach 80 eventually). Levelling in the TWW dungeons is almost as fast btw - the xp bonus for completing the dungeon is smaller, but that is made up for by the mops being worth 10 times as many XP.

[@Pandanubex]

@@Hauke-ph5ui i dont mind leveling but in cata the track between 80-85 its a hell path like so slow i have like other 3 chars in 80 just dont want to level because of that, woulnd mind a system like cromi to level in other exp

[@KingMickeyMouseOoO]

YES!!! ❤

[@Chopingo2]

In my opinion. This is the only thing i have hate the most about this expansion, the constant and neverending tunning, one month within. Changing the meta every week. This makes me wanna wait a month to play the game for the next time, so everything is polished.

[@EmpyreanDreamer]

To be fair seeing constant tuning and reworks this early is a very big improvement. It's far better than being on a weak or badly designed class for months before you even hear about the possibility of changes. Everything is polished (aside from the specs they blatantly fucked up on like shadow) you just have the illusion that it isn't because we're seeing so many tweaks. Believe it or not balance is always this shit on release, but the level of attention they're giving it is so much better than normal. If its so important for you to be "meta" then honestly its probably not the right genre for you, though with that said its not like getting crazy gear on alts isn't easy af this expansion.

[@ShadowsOfThePast]

Tbh tuning is never fully polished. I also like the fact they tweak classes asap instead of having to wait 6months for .1 patch to get sh*t done so in my book it's an improvement over previous style. What I don't like however is classes radically changing in patches or even between expansions because imo it sucks to have to relearn the class you have been playing for like 18 years every so often. I understand some classes are broken and need a rework but sometimes it feels they redo classes just to make it "fresh".

[@Ermak]

Play what you want instead of being a Meta slave.

[@stcosyem]

I see it as a good thing… that means you don’t have to be a slave to meta and can just play what you want instead of what some computer algorithm says

[@ShadowsOfThePast]

There's always going to be a meta because it's impossible to achieve a perfect balance unless they normalize gear/classes so that skill is the only varying factor. Edit: and also being a slave to the meta is as much of a thing as the person wants it to be. No one forces one to obey it. Maybe if you're the 0.01% then you kind of have no choice but the rest should just play what they feel like and also build groups without thinking if the class is meta or not.

[@wreckerjb]

Bruh

[@Pandanubex]

2:19 HUH

[@Yumaax]

So should I move over to fire now lol

[@arnoldchand4144]

its still terrible by a considerable margin

[@KasperG87]

SKill issue - *clap clap clap clap* PREACH!

[@CoversIncorporated]

As a shadow priest, all I want is to cast vampiric touch while moving and/or mind sear back 🥲