Don't Baton a Hatchet - A Hatchet does not need a Baton to Work - Splitting wood kindling

[@jtr109]

The simple answer is: The baton is safer than swinging an axe at your own hand.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Yes I know that line of logic, but personally I look at it like this, you can remove all the danger by not using a hatchet or ax at all, don't have a fire, or even better don't go camping, stay at home in the house. Of course that is kind of ridiculous. What I'm really trying to say in the video is, the hatchet is a tool, if you learn to use it, it can be your friend, it seems like batoning a hatchet is living in fear. Just my take of course. Everyone should do what they feel confident in doing. Thanks for your great comment!!

[@wildernessinnovation]

Another thing to consider is that if I were aiming at my hand it might not be as safe, but I'm not swinging the hatchet at my hand. If my hand were resting on the chopping block while steadying the wood to be split, that would be very hazardous, or if I were holding the wood on the top an accident would be very likely. When done how I show, it is very safe.

[@jtr109]

Wilderness Innovation, I would wager that many followers of your channel also watched the show "Alone". Remember the epidode where an otherwise capable female contestant chopped a hole in her thumb chopping kindling? Maybe you are good enough to never make a mistake. Mere mortals might be better served with a safer technique.

[@wildernessinnovation]

jtr109 you are right I suppose people today cannot do what the ancestors did. I grew up with hand tools so to me it is natural, but to someone not accustomed to working with the hands in a skilled manner, it may be too awkward to use a hatchet as it was originally designed. That said I think a machete would be better to baton than a hatchet. Thanks interesting conversation

[@jtr109]

Wilderness Innovation : With regard specifically to splitting kindling as you demonstrate in the video, you appear to have refined your technique to near surgical precision, but the price for a moment of innattention, fatigue, etc, will be high. There are safer ways to get the same results. Also, I know you are out west and the native material you are breaking down in the video appears to be fairly cooperative. I live in New York and the potential firewood material I often encounter will resist the single hatchet blow split and the hatchet will stick. Maybe it is just me, but I would rather finish the split with a baton than twist and lever my hatchet back out just to start over.

[@nowakezoneforever6021]

At first I thought you were being facetious and then I realized you’re serious. This video perfectly demonstrates how not to use a hatchet to split wood. It also perfectly demonstrates how to increase the chances of an accident with a hatchet.

[@ryngrd1]

KZbin puts the most liked comments on top. The votes are in. This technique is unsafe. This man is showing off and this video has gotten people hurt. Kids do not try this at home

[@adx442]

My counterpoint. I use the same Fiskars X7, and keep it very, very sharp. It'll shave. I saw all my kindling wood to half length with a Silky saw (out in the woods), place my hatchet, and use a 4lb, one piece oak mallet I made to strike it. I can go through burr oak in one to two strikes this way, and get the exact dimensions of the piece I want every time. It's safe, precise, and my mallet has far more mass than the head of the hatchet, and I can swing it as hard as I want ... safely. There's your physics "moment". Same effect as leveraging the weight of the head, amplified by additional weight and speed. Essentially, I'm treating it as a very sharp wedge with a safety handle, and I can process a pile of perfect kindling in a minute. When I'm making bigger pieces for the woodstove at the house, I use the same "short piece" method, but fill an old tire sitting on a big round and walk around it with a splitting axe, all the pieces stay upright and you can make a week's worth of kindling in 5 minutes. Though I've been working with firewood for more than 25 years, when I found the hatchet batoning tactic with a heavy mallet, I never looked back for safe, fast, and accurate processing. I have the skills to freehand like you are, but I stopped doing it when I found a more effective way. Safety was a benefit, but not my primary goal, I wanted my hatchet to be able to "do more". Batoning with a heavy mallet makes it behave like a much larger tool, and you can go a lot longer between sharpenings, a stropping will bring it back most of the time.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Thanks for the helpful comments !!

[@Maschine_Elf]

I found the exact same techniques as you after many hours with a hatchet, knife, saw and wedges, etc. A sharp blade and wedge shape, braced in the right place, with controlled force behind it. You dont go swinging blades around in the woods, especially if you dont have quick access to modern medical aid, one slip or bounce can take a finger or limb.

[@MACV-Justice]

I just used a rolling pin to baton my butter knife through a stick of butter. I figured it would be the safest bet to avoid any dangerous pancake mishaps. ;-)

[@takeitoutside6049]

LOL ;)

[@davidbarnhart6228]

😂😂😂

[@vinniesdayoff3968]

Badass AJ!

[@FlippedFrog]

I love camping. Sometimes when my friends and I go camping, we split the job and I always love taking care of the wood for the campfire. I found it difficult using a tactical knive to chop a log then I bought a mini axe. This helps a lot. Thank you

[@cabinlife2347]

Safety should always be first. Batoning is good for the beginner, but knowledge of how to effectively use one's tools is a good idea too.

[@takeitoutside6049]

When my kids we little = I taught them to baton because they did not have control for a hatchet. But, as they grew, I transitioned them to a hatchet and then an axe. Good point. There are still uses for batoning when precision might be needed / or splitting extremely stubborn woods that twist and have lots of knots: exceptions to the rule and such.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Great points, thanks

[@wildernessinnovation]

Yes, baton is fine to start with, but a person should graduate to the full use of the tool, it is most effective when used as designed. Thank you.

[@BigFootWalker]

First of all today's average camper is not very experienced with an axe, so I believe that splitting wood the way you demonstrate may result in a fair number of serious cuts to the hand holding the wood. I feel better with using a "sissy stick" so as to keep the hand away from the path of the axe. Other than that, I agree with your "no batoning" argument.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Hey Big, I know what you are saying...It occurred to me how much things have changed since I was young, we never heard of batoning . When I was in 4th grade at recess we used to take out our pocket knives and see who could throw and stick the closest to the line. Try that today and a kid would be suspended, go to Juvi, and get a Psych Eval. We played army and cowboys and indians, yet never acted it out and tried to actually kill someone...It's a different world. Kids today are taught a knife is a weapon, not a tool...Sad. Thanks for the words man...

[@Spiraljam]

The mass of the ax head is still a factor in batoning, and you don’t have to swing a blade near your vulnerable and valuable hands. A smart person knows how to use all tools, even primitive pounders.

[@bigoldgrizzly]

just like me you still have all your fingers, and I cut sticks pretty much the same as you and have done since a tender age. If you are teaching a kid who cannot hit a nail with a hammer three times in a row, then tapping through with a baton is the safest way to start.

[@Trigger-ZX]

Hell yeah man, you've got me over the fear of hurting myself splitting small sticks with a hatchet. Thanks a bunch!

[@wesbodine6102]

Estwing makes a splitting hatchet that works great it kind of looks like a mini splitting maul. When the wood pieces get smaller I just tap the hatchet into the wood and whack it on the splitting log or hard ground. I just bought a Ochsenkopf Split Quick hatchet the head weighs 2.75 lbs LOL I can't wait for it to get here 😁

[@roylerroycerickson]

Great video thanks going to get myself a glove and practice any more tips. Dont hold on top or near bottom hold above half way and fairly loosely so if your hand is hit it will swing away?

[@wildernessinnovation]

So I know where the safety line of thought goes, and I'm OK with it, but here's my point. At first a person starts learning to use a tool, like a hatchet, with practice and experience he becomes more proficient and is able to do more with it. I look at using a baton on a hatchet like never taking the training wheels off a bike, at some point you have to do it, move on. A hatchet was meant to be used by itself. You don't see a carpenter batoning a hammer to drive in a nail, of course there is a danger of hitting ones thumb, but in practicality the tool works best in the way it was designed. In the end the most dangerous part of using a hatchet for splitting firewood at camp, is the drive from your house to camp. Be safe people, practice, improve your skill.

[@jtr109]

Wilderness Innovation A carpenter can and will mash his thumb with a hammer dozens of times and laugh about it later. A "woodsman" cannot afford one single fug up using the technique you demonstrate.

[@wildernessinnovation]

If a carpenter could hold the nail at 8 - 10" above the work surface, he wouldn't smash his thumb, that's the difference.

[@jtr109]

Wilderness Innovation: I'm not following you. Your hand is not 8-10" from the edge of your hatchet when you are chopping small kindling in this video. Less than an inch is more like it. Small margin for error. Maybe "experts" like you never miss, but for mere mortals, batonning actually does get the other hand 8-10" away from the falling axe blade. If the wood gets split either way, why not give yourself some wiggle room?

[@wildernessinnovation]

So what I'm trying to say is that in order for the hatchet to chop my finger, it has to chop against something, it my finger is on top of the wood to be chopped, or if my fingers are resting on or close to the chopping block they could be chopped. On the other hand if my fingers are in the air (steadying the side of the wood to be split) the hatchet does not have anything to chop against, so there is little danger. In the "replay" clips in the video I'm trying to show how the hatchet just brushes my fingers away if I happen to touch them at all. Bottom line is if a person cannot get to where they can split simple kindling using a hatchet without using a baton, what they should do is use a sturdy knife and a baton. A knife and a baton are much more effective than a hatchet and a baton...thanks for the conversation !! Hope this helps to explain.

[@jtr109]

Wilderness Innovation: Got it. I assume your hatchet isn't all that sharp. I have the same hatchet you use in the video, in different colors, and it is a razor. Even a light brush against a fingertip would mean losing flesh. When you do that fine chopping...well, maybe I lack your level of mastery , but I would never attempt that. Good chat, man. Always enjoy your vids.

[@richardharrington3501]

Wow that made me nervous. Obviously takes years of practice, impressive but I wouldn’t wanna see anybody without your experience attempt this. You’d get blood all over the perfectly good firewood haha

[@wildernessinnovation]

Haha...a person can safely learn, use gloves, hold the wood near the top but not on top and you're good.

[@Just_Chuck_It]

Batoning is a safe way to learn and build skills. As the student gains confidence, skill, and accuracy, then standard hatchet use can be introduced. When I am teaching (usually kids) I always start with batoning. You can stop the process and show how the wood slips with different tools. But if all you do is tell people to chop with an axe and they don't have the confidence then it will result in either hesitant skill building or worse a serious injury.

[@MrAvidOutdoorsman]

I agree with jtr, there are times for both methods, say you wanna more precisely cut piece for building etc.

[@wildernessinnovation]

absolutely, for notching, fitting, etc.

[@unitytira4954]

Thank you so much for sharing this video 😊

[@wildernessinnovation]

You are welcome glad you found it useful..

[@sundogforgebydml1050]

Simple answer(s). I only have a smaller axe but need to process larger wood. Can't carry a full axe so i use a tomahawk or belt axe and folding saw. We don't have nice straight grained wood where I am. It's a force multiplier, basically, without carrying all that extra weight of a large axe. Hike in light, hit harder using weight of baton found in location, drop that weight when hiking out. I don't know, makes sense to me...

[@wildernessinnovation]

I can understand that, in that you have a purpose or a reason why you do it that way. I don't have a problem really with how anyone splits wood, my issue is that is what all the courses are teaching nowadays, rather than proper axemanship. These tools are made the way they are to be effective and efficient, folks should learn the skill to use them that way, then if they adapt at times to baton when needed, fine, at least they would have the confidence and the hatchet would feel comfortable in their hands. Thanks for your comments !! Perry

[@sundogforgebydml1050]

@@wildernessinnovation cheers Perry, that makes perfect sense to me. I agree that a tool should be learnt and used the way it was intended in the first instance. Battoning is not the 'go to' for me either. Thank you for your reply.

[@eqlzr2]

When I was a kid in the midwest about 65 years ago, after one of our common heavy-duty windstorms, my grandma had a whole bunch of big limbs laying around in her yard. My grandpa was a cross-country truck driver and was away a week or more at a time, so my dad asked me if I would help grandma cut up and dispose of the debris. I said sure, and he said I could use his Estwing hatchet that he knew I was capable with from previous experience. I was probably 9 years old and, looking back, I was almost as capable as any experienced adult in using that tool. I knew all the secrets to safe cutting, and I did the whole job in a couple days without getting a single scratch. I still use a hatchet for splitting kindling for my fireplace, but I also know how fast someone can get into trouble with one. I also don't hesitate to use safer methods of splitting kindling, one of which is batoning with a hatchet! ;-) It ain't no regular hatchet though. It's one of those made specifically for batoning, and it's called a Japanese Nata. Fine useful tool, and great for batoning. Weighs less, is less cumbersome, and easier to control safely than a regular hatchet, IMHO.

[@uncleiroh2844]

just split thewood on its side you dont need to hold or baton it.

[@CapDanAddams]

Batoning is extremely useful when the wood is wet. I only baton for breaking the big piece down if ever. Of course it makes more sense to not do so with the split pieces to make smaller pieces.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Good comment, thanks.

[@takeitoutside6049]

Right tool for the right job. Some people use a screw driver for a chisel = I never get that either. Learn how to use the right tool for the right job = Use proper safety equipment while you are learning (like you demonstrated with using gloves and proper hand placement on the handle and the wood / or lay the wood flat on the stump) = Practice to become proficient. Always be alert and careful, never careless. The right tool will make the work less fatiguing and go faster, saving calories / energy in the long run. People often don't carry the "right tool" because they think that it isn't convenient (too heavy), when it only adds a few extra ounces. They need to think in terms of energy per work load and not "ounces saved on pack load" ~ matt (the cowboy viking)

[@MACV-Justice]

It's all about safety! Safety, safety, safety! I can't stress this enough. I've taken the stance to baton everything because it makes so much sense. For example, I've batoned my ice cream scoop through some very hard Rocky Road ice cream; I've batoned my lawn mower through my lawn; and last night I batoned my truck into the garage. Yes, batoning is the essence of safety. I just don't buy into the whole "right tool for the right job" way of thinking. I'd much rather use the wrong tool and just baton it into submission in order to stay safe.

[@takeitoutside6049]

LOL

[@wildernessinnovation]

Right on man!!

[@MACV-Justice]

Haha! I'll have to try that tomorrow on my way into work. :-D

[@wildernessinnovation]

Nice, love it, haha.

[@steventure85]

Your hatchet skills are impressive. Well done sir.

[@MACV-Justice]

No kidding! Jedi Hatchet Master! The Force is strong with Perry. Cool demonstration! I've never seen someone process kindling with a hatchet that quick and efficient. Before I could say, "Bear Grylls enjoys drinking elephant poo-poo water and his own pee", Perry had already processed enough kindling to supply an entire aboriginal village. I need me some of those hatchet skills!!!

[@steventure85]

Allen Jensen Haha well said.

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

it's impressive but that wood is perfectly dried and aged - not what you're gonna find just camping

[@TrollinCrazyRussian]

I sometime need to baton the hatchet to split the wood in more controlled manner avoiding hatchet edge hitting rocky ground and damaging the edge. I never thought I had to baton hatchet as woodland guy but in desert wood are dried hard they behave differently batoning is needed to avoid accidentally over driving hatchet into rocky ground after few delicate careful light strikes that failed.

[@squirrelavengerr31]

This guy's right hand was praying to Jesus while his left hand was chopping wood ;) I agree 100% that using something to hammer the hatchet is pointless. I have seen people use a hammer, which can damage the hatchet itself. Me personally, i would chop my hand off if I did it this way. I prefer to lay the log down, bring the hatchet down, and then bring the log AND the hatchet down towards the wood stump. It's not as fast as he's doing it, but safer.

[@DecideOutside]

All I have to say is how impressed at your skill at splitting wood. I would be missing fingers if I tried that.

[@0z33y]

Axe is for chopping, knife is for cutting, agree with you all the way , never understand someone buying a £200.00 knife to hit it with a hammer , to do the job a £5.00 axe would do …

[@wildernessinnovation]

Exactly - Perry

[@jeffreygstewart]

If you are using a traditional axe with a wood handle, you can cause the eye of the axe head to deform, by pounding on the back of the head. The metal on an axe head is not all tempered the same. The body of the axe head is softer than the edge. This can cause your axe head to loosen on the handle, and create an undetected safety hazard, until the head flies off. This is why batoning an axe, is generally considered an abuse of the tool.

[@jtr109]

Jeffrey Stewart A valid concern, but I think that would take a hell of a lot of batonning. Think of how many old axes you've seen with the poll mushroomed over from being stuck with a steel hammer, yet the eye is still intact and handle still in place. So yeah, it is possible to ddeform the eye, but in practical use, unlikely. Incidentally, the hatchet he uses in this video has no eye, so that potential problem is not a factor here.

[@wildernessinnovation]

You are correct, sir !!

[@jeffreygstewart]

Hi JTR, on most older axes, the poll isn't tempered like the edge, so it's softer. What you might be seeing is from the poll being used to drive metal stakes. That will cause mushrooming of the poll. Because of the way the handle transfers energy to the head, it doesn't stress the eye in the same way as pounding on the back.

[@jtr109]

Jeffrey Stewart: Yeah, I know that axes tend to be tempered differently at different parts of the head. And I know that batonning applies forces to the eye that are different from the impact forces of a conventional axe impact. So I agree, deforming the eye through batonning is a risk, but I think it is small. I have restored lots of abused axes. Even with obvious abuse, I see lots of handles and handle stubs that are still tight as a banjo string. So, yeah, it is something to keep in mind if one opts to baton an axe, but I think the risk of a damaged tool is preferable to the greater risk of a severed thumb or finger.

[@macspud28]

A proper hatchet is made to be both as a cutting and hammering tool.

[@blueyedblonde1956]

Batoning with a knife I hv seen but batoning with a hatchet or axe I hv not lol. U tell 2 people and they tell 2 people & so on. Saw a man the other day using a cross cut saw to cut with the grain lol rip saws and cross cut saws r very different blades and hv their purposes just like axes, hatchets and knives. Research, and my father taught me wel it's a personal right to choose loll. Btw as to splitting wood, or batoning it's been around since the 1920. An ad in marble magazine or catalogue states knives (full tang) were general purpose knifes capable of processing wood!! Liked your video Speak out!! Noone will agree on this subject anymore then about politics or religion. Respect your opinion..so go for it!

[@wildernessinnovation]

Lee Edwards thanks for the excellent comments. The world has changed since my younger days, some for the better and some makes no sense at all.

[@blueyedblonde1956]

@@wildernessinnovation yes I agree the world has changed alot since our younger simpler days, sad, but we do the best we can and I try to learn something new everyday. New to bushcrafting but hv fallen in love with it. Wish I had of found this 40 yrs ago but better late then never. 😉. Ontario lady born and raised. Take care and thx

[@zerekderosiers2635]

See I see comments on a product online saying the a certain axe sucked cuz it breaks after the first use My thought is how was the person chopping he must chopped the wrong way with the axe to break

[@ChallengeTheNarrative]

A SMALL hatchet won't slice through a lot of logs unless they're about 1.5 diameter max or there abouts of the hatchet head width, because there's not enough weight or leverage. Neither will batoning a knife do that. Indeed batoning a cut log is a waste of energy, time, plus it's fiddly, indeed that's what the hatchet if for.

[@wildernessinnovation]

I use a saw for cutting logs as that is the most effective, I use a hatchet for limbing small stuff and for splitting. Often I don't split at all, just depends on the wood supply in the area. Thanks for the comments.

[@shadowx8405]

LOL... I love it! I feel your frustration! I’m in! Sub’d. 🤙

[@wildernessinnovation]

Thanks for the sub! Have a great day

[@despawningenemy420]

This is the part I came here for 3:01 thank you :)

[@martinerhard8447]

Hatchets for wood splitting are nonesense in the first place. To split bigger logs you should use a proper axe. To split finer stuff that you need to hold batoning with a knife is the best and safest solution. You are right now splitting easy to split wood and you don't seem fatigued or tired at all.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Martin Erhard hatchets are made for small chopping and for splitting of small wood. Sadly as time has passed the skills to use a hatchet for splitting have not been developed as they used to be. Not that many years ago you rarely heard of batoning a knife nowadays no one knows how to use a hatchet. A hatchet is not for all occasions, all tools have their range of use. You would not want to use an axe for really small things, nor would it be ideal to use a hatchet on large wood or wood with lots of knots in it. For splitting large wood I like to use an axe or even better, one of my splitting mauls. Thanks for your comments.

[@martinerhard8447]

@@wildernessinnovation Because they are made for something doesn't mean they are the best tool for that. It's not even about the skill. Use a hatchet for splitting in a survival situation. You are hungry, fatigued maybe dizzy, maybe its dark ... Good luck not hitting your hand. Batoning with a hatchet has its uses. You are pretty much using the hatchet as a splitting wedge with a handel.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Martin Erhard I get your point and I know most people are not going to be comfortable splitting with a hatchet, a knife and baton work well so that’s fine. I’m old school and I’ve split with a hatchet since the 1960’s. It’s so effective I can’t make myself go to knife and baton. Now it I have just a few pieces of short stuff like for my fireplace at the cabin I’ll Baton my knife with the wood on the hearth. Thanks so much for your comments!!

[@michaelallen9571]

You definitely know how to handle that tool no doubt but I also feel that you are using your tool to loosely. I get that rhythm is very important when splitting wood but you are extremely close to risking permanent damage just to make a point about a tool. I get that a tool should be used for what it was made for but it should also be used safely and I don't see that with your technique. But anyways I wish I could split my kindling that fast lol and like you said years of practice will make that happen but don't be naive and think that little hatchet cares if it cuts through wood or bone

[@wildernessinnovation]

michael allen thank you for your comments, I still stand by my thoughts on this, but I understand your concerns. Enjoy the outdoors all you can.

[@michaelallen9571]

@@wildernessinnovation absolutely, I appreciate your response and love your poncho videos. Looks like you made an already very versatile piece of equipment better in every way.

[@foxsaint1051]

maybe for in camp.. what about being cold and tired in a survival situation.. then battening is your friend...

[@wildernessinnovation]

I virtually never baton a hatchet or an axe, I camp weekly year round all weather. I have learned over the years to do what I do, it is natural and safe, I would feel less safe using a baton. People can and should do what they feel comfortable with. My point is that a hatchet is designed to be used by itself and not use a baton, it is far more effective this way. If a person is in a survival situation they will burn more calories if they are less effective, which could be detrimental. Thanks - Perry

[@bighill5680]

I'd rather batton and be safe than find myself in the ER for stitches !

[@wildernessinnovation]

Sure, everyone can choose their comfort and skill level. It used to be that hatchets and axes were commonly used by most people many times a week, now it's just on the occasional camping trip.

[@dumbmonkeylove5381]

Yea its safe im 14 i was splitting wood with a hatchet butbim just gonna find a splitting axe instead

[@wildernessinnovation]

Cxdered GamingYT Estwing makes a nice short handled splitting maul it’s about $28.

[@kenb.3998]

This guy smoked his hand at least 3 times in this video alone. Lol.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Really, still have all my fingers, no cuts, bruises or injuries. My holding hand is never in a position where it is between the axe and the splitting log.

[@ourtechwriter]

Batoning is simply safer; use a machete, without getting your hand and fingers too close. Not everyone has enough manual dexterity to time the hits and holding device.

[@kidbach]

I was gonna axe you can I baton with a hatchet, but I see you've addressed that topic. ;-)

[@wildernessinnovation]

:)

[@UmarRosyad]

holy shit that's some skill im scared haha

[@wildernessinnovation]

Hahaha….

[@ColtSievers1000]

Well when your old and your cutting a small bit of timber to start your fire and the stick isn't even then I would suggest that older person rest the axe on the timber and to use a lump hammer or some kind of tool with a bit of Wight as old People especially old women they intend hitting there fingers or doing them selves harm . So is times when an bit of timber needs to batoned . Sorry bud is times it needs to be

[@wildernessinnovation]

People can do what they need to do, I'm just pointing out that this is the most effective way to do it, it is something good to learn. Thanks for the comment !!

[@wildernessinnovation]

Once again I don’t encourage someone new to hatchets to go all out, I mention it is a skill that you learn over time. The goal should be to own the hatchet.

[@tomm7029]

The ‘skill’ you are referring to is simply ‘risk taking’. As far as your ‘techinique’ goes, it is entirely dependant on the wood being dry and straight and splittable with minimal effort. Often wood doesn’t cooperate in this way, increasing the dangers of the already risky method you are using. Your video is irresponsible to say the least.

[@antoniofornes7192]

safety first

[@wildernessinnovation]

Yup I’m all about it, never an injury in over 50 years.

[@angel-rising208]

Hatchets are for kindlin..buuuut I didunt seeyou split a log ...wich most people baton ..wiiiich you also done to split the log ? ...never seen any woodsman baton kindlin ..just saying

[@wildernessinnovation]

Angel-Rising I don’t baton anything other than if I have a knife and not a hatchet. A hatchet does not need a baton. The hatchet head has the mass or weight needed to split or chop therefore a baton is not needed. I see videos and photos all over the place of people batoning kindling. I see them baton both hatchets and axes which I find ridiculous for the most part. I don’t generally baton a hatchet to split a log. I hit the log hard with the hatchet maybe a couple of hits if needed.

[@1xayekim]

Can you do it this way? Of course! Should you ? Probably not. There are safer and even more effecient techniques than playing Russian Roulette with your fingers. A similar way to this technique is to block your wood you are splitting for kindling. If the wood is not big enough to stand upright get a big piece of wood and put it next to it and just use it for support instead of your very useful hand. If you want to get fancy for your at home kindling splitting station just drill two pieces of 2x4 wide enough for your splitting into a chopping block and you have support right there and you can just zip right through it. The other option is to lay the wood down and strike it gently then lift it and pop it back down, again no where near your fingers and its split. The other other option is to dig a small divot into the ground and use that to place your kindling and use that as a support that will also keep your hands in tact. As my fictional non existent grand pappy use to say "Your skills will remain and your fingers too!"

[@wildernessinnovation]

Done the way I do it is the most efficient way to split wood with a hatchet, it is the way a hatchet was intended to be used. The suggestions you offer are not really what I was getting at in the video, which was the use of a baton to strike a hatchet. What you are talking about is ways to steady the wood without holding in the hands, which is fine to do for someone who has not yet learned the full skill of using a hatchet. Of course you don't ever have to master hatchet use because you can get by in the ways you suggest as well as other similar ideas. For me l have been doing this all my life, having carefully learned it in my youth. Although it may look dangerous it is actually quite safe. I don't hold the wood in any way that allows my fingers to be in a path between the hatchet and the wood, so that means no holding on the top and no holding at the bottom near the chopping block. I like to lightly hold on the side near the top and to use my elbow as a pivot point. In order for my fingers to be chopped they would need to be against the chopping block, since my arm is pivoting at the elbow, any downward movement swings my hand away to the side. Thanks for the comments !!

[@lakrabid]

And for those who criticize his methods ask yourself if he has all his fingers. Looks to me like he does. Hhhmmm

[@kidda74]

Holding it at the same time as hitting, sod that! 😯

[@lakrabid]

Why can't people make a simple wedge with wood to baton with? Or better carry a machete to baton with. Now that is a very useful tool to carry👍

[@wildernessinnovation]

I you are going to baton for splitting wood, I would suggest a machete, or sturdy knife with a long enough blade to work with. Batoning a hatchet means you have to overcome all the weight of the hatchet head with your baton. Use something lighter and actually easier to handle for that purpose, a knife of some sort. This will be much more efficient.

[@martinerhard8447]

Machetes are long but lack the proper edge geometry to be good at batoning. They are too thin. But of course also depends on the machete.

[@MundusTransit]

Why add unnecessary risk

[@chrispark7933]

Live the call out to near miss. I'm 35 and think the 30yr Olds are the last gen to have that freedom feeling before everything was all safety. Its common sense don't grab the piece just hold it enough so it stands very freely. You death grip it yeah you'll get injured for sure

[@subtheraccoon5115]

Sir you have balls of steel. Unfortunately I love keeping a razor edge on my tools and I already have a dozen scars on my hands from being stupid. So unfortunately I don't think I'll swing my Axe at my hands

[@wildernessinnovation]

Sub The Raccoon I don’t chop with this hatchet I only split kindling therefor it is sharp but not shaving sharp. Splitting wood with a baton is a three or four step process whereas letting the hatchet do the work is a one or two step process. My chopping tools of course need to be very sharp because I need to cut through the grain. Thanks for the comments.

[@VJLasorsa]

become proficient with whatever tool you choose.... always be safe.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Exactly !! Thank you

[@theWZZA]

You can totally baton a hatchet if you want to. Nothing wrong with doing that. Can't say I'm a fan of holding the wood with your off hand, either. Let's see you do that without gloves.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Yeah for sure you can, I see a lot people batoning a full fledged woodsman’s axe. There’s even a very popular survival school that teaches using a baton on a forest axe. What I am demonstrating is using the hatchet in the way it was originally designed. You don’t need a weighted head if using a baton, in fact it would be much better to have the lightest head possible for baton work, because the baton has to overcome the stationary mass of the hatchet head before it can even do anything. I’m not generally going to do that without gloves, although I do it a fair amount, it’s likely in some of my videos. I’m not creating a show here, there’s nothing spectacular about it. My hand is out of the way, never on top, never near the bottom, the swing of my arm carries my hand away from the splitting area if bumped. My swing is always controlled, never all out force. Like a lot of things it’s skill that takes time to learn, or a baton can be used, and not much learning is needed. You are a baton person, I’m not much for it, and both are ok. Thanks for your comment..

[@theWZZA]

@@wildernessinnovation 1) I am not a baton person. I am just against people who say "your way is wrong, my way is right." That is the way it comes off in your video. 2) The inertia of the hatchet is not significant because the baton is as heavy or heavier in most cases. Also, the back of a hatchet offers more contact area to the baton, so energy transfer of more efficient. As in, you are wasting less energy chewing up the baton with the spine or swedge of your knife. 3) You can make kindling with a hatchet that does not require your hand to be in or near the path of the bit.

[@spiced4725]

WOW! I cant believe your telling people to wear light deerskin gloves to use a hatchet in this way, while you wear blade safety/anti cut gloves. Someone will do this, as to your advice, permanently damage their hand and sue. When sale prices go big, I'll support your legal fees. Unbelievable!

[@wildernessinnovation]

The Deerskin gloves or pigskin gloves would be better than the cotton/poly gloves I had on, I do not use cut resistant gloves. In the video I tell people to practice carefully on straight grained wood, like anything a person has to learn the skill. I'm not selling any hatchets or cutting tools on this video. All I'm saying is learn to use the tool properly, hatchets were not designed intending to baton them. If a person wants to baton they should baton a sturdy knife, that would be more effective than batoning a hatchet. For a baton to work it has to have enough mass to apply enough energy to cause the blade to split the wood. When batoning a hatchet, you lose most of the force because the heavy head of the hatchet is at rest so the baton has to overcome that resting weight and cause it then to move with enough force to split the wood effectively. If a person cannot use a hatchet safely without baton, they should leave the hatchet at home, there is no point bringing it. Thank you for your comments, they are certainly welcome.

[@mfavia620]

Thanks Perry for the demo. You’re definitely a man who uses his tools. I’ll leave the wood splitting for you when we set out for the woods Thanks again and ATB Mike

[@raikey2176]

That's not safe.

[@wildernessinnovation]

It's a learned skill and for me it is very safe - the way I hold the wood, how my arm pivots and the way I use the hatchet, combined with years of experience make this a safe and effective way to split down wood. Thanks for the comment and concern.

[@uvclips4815]

That one grandfather that tells you this

[@wildernessinnovation]

Sure - - if going to only use baton, don't take a hatchet at all, use a sturdy knife and a baton.

[@nonya5475]

Save a hatchet, destroy a hand. Insanity.

[@William_Asston]

ive never seen such skillful confidence in someone. To be honest though, its generally safer to take a few seconds more per split and baton with a knife rather than doing this, especially if the hatchet is really sharp. I appreciate the video, though. Demonstrating how you held the wood to avoid smashing your hand is very interesting.

[@wildernessinnovation]

I used to say that perhaps it is safer to baton, but I'm not so sure. There is nothing holding the wood, I have seen some really awkward batoning. If the wood slips as the baton strikes the hatchet, there is still the possibility of the hatchet striking a leg, especially if a person is unaccustomed to the hatchet. Worst case scenario, I would rather see someone use a chunk of wood or log as a prop while learning to chop as I demonstrate. I'm not trying to stir things up with this video, but I firmly believe that the ultimate safety is had when someone has mastered the hatchet and is able to control it, anything short of that invites danger. Certainly I think the best use of a baton is in conjunction with splitting or chopping wood with a knife as it gives the knife a use that it never was capable before. Thank you so much for watching the video and commenting with your feelings, I always welcome sincere thoughts. Perry

[@William_Asston]

@@wildernessinnovation Of course. Safety comes with mastery. No rational man can deny that. Thanks for the reply!

[@rockymountainfirewood3873]

Great video. Love the passion. I'll show you how I split firewood in my next video! Check out Rocky Mountain Firewood for all things firewoodin'

[@wildernessinnovation]

Have to catch that, thanks

[@christopherhowlett1096]

Much uncle said tha same thing to me about holding wood while using a wood splitter "you should just practice at it! Ive been doing this for 35 years and always wear gloves." He's now missing his pinky finger and part of his ring finger. Ill take having brains over pretending to be manly.

[@enzowarren9832]

Batoning is great if I’m using a durable knife. Swinging is great if I’m using a hatchet. Mixing up the two strategies makes no sense. If I’m swinging the knife or batoning the hatchet I’m wasting energy!

[@wildernessinnovation]

You are correct....recently I saw a famous survival expert training people how to baton a full forest axe, insane....

[@poipoi300]

I'm not sure using a baton was ever intended to be safer. It might be one of those things that gets lost to time and people interpret it wrong like the blood of the covenant. I feel like in reality it's all about being more efficient. Yeah, the mass of the head drives the w(edge) in, but it keeps it in the wood just as much. If one of your hits doesn't go through all the way, why use your energy to undo some of the work you've done? Instead, use your energy to push it in further from exactly where it left off. With that being said, you're used to splitting wood. I might not bother with drinking-age children and tell them to baton from the get go to avoid injuries regardless.

[@albeklik8055]

Is something bothering you today this is foolish

[@wildernessinnovation]

I don't think it is effective to baton a hatchet and all my life I have split wood like this, it is actually very safe, fingers are not where they would get chopped, like on top of the chopping block or on top of the wood to be split. If a person is going to baton wood for splitting they should baton a sturdy knife not a hatchet. Anyway that's my take. Thanks for your comment and for watching the video.

[@bravodelta686]

Hey Perry, With this wave of comment section armchair OSHA representatives, I've reconsidered just about everything. How long would it take to baton a cord of firewood? I'm considering parking the combine and batoning my fields come harvest. Shoot I'm even considering batoning my steaks from now on because that slicing motion could prove fatal to a digit. So many things to reevaluate now but so little time ;)

[@wildernessinnovation]

Haha, some of this stuff is hilarious....The thing that is scary to me, is that our outdoors community has become so ................ I don't know the word, afraid of everything, perhaps unskilled should be in there somewhere too. When I was growing up we never heard of batoning anything. You used a knife for what it would do, the hatchet came next and the heavy duty work was for the ax. Safety aside using a baton with a hatchet doesn't make sense to me, I can't help but equate that with a carpenter using a baton to hit his hammer to drive in a nail, doesn't seem right to me.

[@The_Gallowglass]

Worst-case scenario, get a good pair of chainmail gloves :D

[@wildernessinnovation]

Hahaha, yup

[@woodlandbiker]

Never have your hand in front of a cutting edge.

[@mikeguidotti217]

Seven fingers bushcraft

[@chriscasey3699]

Why, why, why. Much more control and much safer to drive your lightweight plastic handled Gerber through the bigger pieces.

[@wildernessinnovation]

My reasoning is that I was trained old school i suppose when an axe was a tool you learned gradually to become proficient with. never in 50+ years have I had an accident, I’m careful in what I do, my hand and finger placement are safe. by using the tool in this way i am faster and more efficient than having to use two tools to do the work of one. But it is a matter of practice, training and experience, a person has to be willing to put in the effort to do this. It’s not hard you just work at it. If a person is not comfortable thought there is always the fallback method of ax and baton or knife and baton.

[@instantsiv]

Yeah.. mass x force = easy... or something like that.

[@earthman4222]

Dude, when I swing my tool I want you holding it so if any fingers get cut off they are yours. There are much safer ways to do the exact same thing you are doing. Oh, and by the way, keep your hands off my tool.

[@wildernessinnovation]

I'm not holding wood for anyone 😐I have been chopping and splitting wood all my life since childhood. Being proficient with a hatchet is a skill that is learned by lots of practice. As time goes on you become safer in its use because your skill level has improved. A person will never become good at golf without swinging a club, an archer must shoot lots of arrows to be able to consistently hit the bullseye, someone who races dirt bikes must ride hard and push the limits to increase his ability. To learn to use a hatchet properly you cannot run away from using it. You have to hold the wood with your hand and guide the hatchet with the other to split the wood. Starting out of course with simple things, not holding the wood at first as you become skilled at controlling the hatchet. A person must progress through the learning process, step by step. Thanks for most of your comment.

[@bradnewman13]

never hold the wood while cutting it period. Simple as that

[@escapetherace1943]

batoning at all is stupid unless you're freezing to death and only have a knife a hatchet > knife for fire, any time, any day and batoning a hatchet is ridiculous, lol

[@wildernessinnovation]

Agreed

[@2ATimothyHarper]

Juggalo Hatchet man

[@wildernessinnovation]

That's me, haha

[@nathansunnaa7222]

Why why why why I don’t get it why do people baton the hatchet 🪓

[@wildernessinnovation]

I don't know either, safety is what I hear - but like most things there is a skill to learn, maybe people don't want to learn....

[@paikinho]

Not sure why baton-ing a hatchet doesn't have its place at times. Baton-ing helps at times with safety. Anyhow, holding a piece of wood while swinging a hatchet toward your holding hand seems even more fraught with peril. That is not helping safety. I don't thinking knocking your hand is generally safe and I worry about such technique as I ponder teaching my 12 year old to chop kindling.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Hatchets were made to be used for trimming and light chopping and splitting. The way they are made is very efficient for splitting small firewood. I have three rules 1) Wear leather gloves, 2)Never put hand on top of wood, 3) Never put hand near chopping block. Learning is a slow careful process, as a person becomes proficient safety improves and so does speed. I'm not so sure Batoning is all that much safer in the end. If a user never learns the feel of the hatchet in his hand and learns to control it he can still be injured batoning. Just my opinion, thanks. Perry

[@paikinho]

@@wildernessinnovation Thanks for the reply.

[@jdee8407]

Save yourself the trouble just use round logs.

[@wildernessinnovation]

What and skip all this fun ?? Haha... I don't normally split much up other than bit to start a fire, I'm too lazy to do too much work, lol

[@takebackroads7053]

Wait, I'm confused. Why is there mass in the head of the hatchet? ;)

[@epic1gamer797]

This is NOT a good technique

[@terryw.milburn6414]

Umm Hmm Use the Tool for what it's intended Safeyt ! ATB Ter God Bless

[@wildernessinnovation]

Right on !!

[@stefan-D]

that looks so dangerous!

[@wildernessinnovation]

It may look dangerous, but the way I hold the wood my hand position never puts my fingers in a position to get chopped. If my fingers are on top of the wood being split then they could get chopped. If my fingers or hand is on or close to the chopping block, then they could get chopped. I keep my hand midway up or higher and hold the piece to be split lightly, just enough to steady it. Anyway, years of practice help to develop a skill that allows both efficiency and safety. Thanks for your comments.

[@martinerhard8447]

Because it is

[@carsenbensen9392]

To have your hand anywhere close to the blade or in the way of your swing is absolutely idiotic. Accidents do happen. You are showing the absolute worst way to use a hatchet. Beginners: do NOT mimic this method

[@akivaliaho5166]

NOBODY should mimic this method even if you're an experienced old timer. Accidents happen when you lose respect for the fact that you are swinging a heavy and sharp metal object. When it happens in the backwoods you are fucked. For the alleged increase in wood split per minute you are taking a serious risk! It's relatively as productive yet infinitely safer to use for example tapping method where you bring both the axe and the Wood down into a block sinultaneously and give the Wood (not the axe to avoid lateral movement that loosens axe heads) a little twist.

[@survivingdaddo8040]

Dude...you are going to lose your fingers. Watch Crazy Russian Hacker...

[@wildernessinnovation]

Haha, well I think I'm fine. been doing this all my life and I have a feel for it. My method helps to eliminate hazards while promoting efficiency. Thanks for watching

[@emokiller907]

You make it look so easy, like you're slicing an onion

[@gonetoheck]

Why should you care how someone else chooses to process their firewood ? Why should anyone care what someone else is packing in their backpack ? It's like the bushcraft community is full of people who try to set trends and act like they know it all...as if some feel the need to teach rather than simply share how they do things. I just hate demonstrations... as it's setting a tone of who's the teacher and who's the student... rather than simply sharing styles as social equals. I'd rather camp solo rather than feel there was some sort of pecking order between those present. I don't need the drama.

[@wildernessinnovation]

Old Boy Adventures The whole purpose of making and watching videos is to show something or to see something. Most people like to see things other than what they do or what they know, they may not prefer a different way, but they can make that choice. No one is forcing anyone to do anything. Most of KZbin is demos of some sort, how to do something, how someone vacations, what to see in some other country. On this subject I feel strongly that people should learn to use a hatchet as it was intended to be used as that is the most efficient use of it. If folks choose to baton it that’s just fine, I make my case they make theirs if they want to. As for teacher/student we are all both of those every day as long as we live. Because I give my opinion it does not mean I think any less of someone who disagrees. If you don’t care about anything anyone else does why bother to watch KZbin at all, why comment on my video if it doesn’t matter to you how I process firewood, or how I pack my pack. So in the end it does matter to you how other people do things or you would not have commented - and there is nothing wrong with you doing so. I’m glad you did comment, it didn’t change my opinion and many others may agree with what you said. And thats cool with me. I shared, you didn’t agree along with lots of others didn’t either. I’ll keep sharing which will be helpful to many, while others will just pass by it. Anyway thanks again and have a great day !!

[@gonetoheck]

@@wildernessinnovation I'd never heard of trying to baton with a hatchet prior to seeing your video. But if some of us use this method, why do you feel the need to look down at us as still using "training wheels" ? It's your looking down at others that offends me. It's your pride in your skill with your hatchet that you're trying to lord over others. Does your ego really need that much attention ? You're not the only one who does this sort of thing. I recall another bushcraft channel where he called other people a bad name I don't care to repeat if they didn't like knives with serrations. I love the videos by guys like "primitive technology" who never say a word while they make their amazing creations. Teaching can be done without being smug and condescending. As for the intended use of a hatchet, there are all sorts of bevel grinds and purposes for the edges put on the blades... some are better for splitting wood rather than for carving. Not everyone has your same type of edge on your hatchet. So if someone else has a hatchet that isn't as sharp or performing like yours, you should cut them some slack and not be so judgmental....pretending like you just can't understand how other people choose to do things differently than you do.

[@Ukraineaissance2014]

This is a really, really bad idea, especially holding the piece of wood you're cutting. Yeah yeah real men lose fingers and die of blood loss miles from anywhere or whatever but I'll give it a miss.

[@wildernessinnovation]

The safety of doing this hinges on doing it as I show it here, how you hold the piece to be split is essential. There are many videos out that show professional world famous people splitting wood by holding the piece on top then striking with the hatchet, I’ve never condoned this method. The wood is to be held on the side in the top half, the strike is controlled. The holding hand is never on top nor on or close to the chopping block. This method is ideal for splitting small kindling, very fast and efficient. there are skills to developed related to woodcraft for efficiency and safety and this is one of them. A person can opt to not learn a skill like this one and get by but they are never at optimum without it. Like a chef in a kitchen with razor sharp knives, speed and efficiency allow the chef to quickly prepare meals that would otherwise take a prohibitive amount of time to do. Are there dangers, yes, but that is why it is a skill to be learned with time and experience, and once learned is invaluable. Thank you for your comment - Perry

[@nordr]

Very impressive but 99.9% of people watching this video would chop part of their hand off if they used this technique.

[@johnlhigh]

Great technique for those who dont want to lose a finger is to use a "sissy stick". Works great with a hatchet...

[@rn.v4629]

please dont listen to this guy lol,,,, gonna loose fingers

[@The_Gallowglass]

Only if you're not careful.

[@SisterBaby]

I like other videos of yours, but this one is just plain foolish. I wonder how many accidents you've "inspired" kids to have who watch this. There's no need to be a show-off-- your subscribers already know that you are competent. Save feats like this for a firewood splitting contest.

[@wildernessinnovation]

I have not heard of any accidents by anyone from this video or any of the many others like it. First of all i am emphasizing practice. A heart surgeon isn't going to on a whim start operating. Many of the things we do in life carry some inherent danger, which can usually be nearly eliminated by practice and experience. I don't view this as show off, it is how I do it every camp since the 1960's. My dad and my grandfather wanted to teach me skills which they had learned. I had to start out very slow and careful, it took some time. I have a butcher friend who learned from his father, and can hone a razor sharp knife so fast it is scary for someone like me who has not learned that skill. He does not sharpen his blades fast to show off, most of the time no one is watching, the more meat he cuts, the more money he makes, so he does it out of efficiency. I believe that a hatchet was made with a heavy blade like it has so that nothing like a baton would be needed. The movement of the mass of the head is sufficient in and of itself to split or cut. If just using a baton, it would be better not to use a hatchet at all, just use a sturdy knife. Just my opinion.

[@willanthoniozeppeli7913]

My eyes😭

[@tomm7029]

I have reported this video as harmful or dangerous and I encourage others to do the same.

[@danmernyak4987]

This is a pretty crappy way tbh

[@wildernessinnovation]

I like it. It is the most efficient way to split wood with a hatchet. Using a baton is a nice way to split wood down in the case where a person doesn't want or have time to develop the skill to use a hatchet as it was intended, because the work can still get done, and if a little sloppy there is no danger. A point in favor of baton method is that a person could take a very light hatchet into the woods and use a heavy baton sourced from local materials to make up the difference. Thanks for the comment !!

[@danmernyak4987]

@@wildernessinnovation too close to your hand

[@wildernessinnovation]

@@danmernyak4987 I know that is the main thing people are concerned with, but it actually looks more dangerous than it is. I keep my hand only to the side and closer to the top, my elbow is the pivot point, not my shoulder, so if there is hand contact the trajectory of my hand is away from the wood and hatchet. I never hold on top nor at the bottom as a miss is loss of a finger. When I'm splitting I have hatchet control to a much greater degree than if I were chopping. In the end it's just a matter of safe principles and developing a skill over time.

[@gustavocoaching9614]

This guys is reckless

[@wildernessinnovation]

Hmmm - reckless is doing something without learning the skill involved. People can do amazing things, what I'm doing here is not amazing, it is very simple, but it did take time to gain the skill to do it. Hatchets were designed to be used in this manner, hatchets and axes were not intended to be pounded with a baton or mallet, that is why they were made with steel heads with enough weight in them to do the job without needing anything else. There is a place for a baton, but it is limited, generally speaking the hatchet should do the work by itself as guided by a competent axeman. In older times people grew up using hatchets and axes as part of everyday life, they understood how to use them effectively, unfortunately much of that has been lost these days. You free to use a hatchet as you please, in whatever way you feel confident, thanks for commenting !!