Donald Hoffman: Reality is an Illusion - How Evolution Hid the Truth | Lex Fridman Podcast

Donald Hoffman is a cognitive scientist at UC Irvine and author of The Case Against Reality. Please support this podcast by checking out our sponsors:
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EPISODE LINKS:
Donald's Twitter: donalddhoffman
Donald's Website: cogsci.uci.edu/~ddhoff/
Documents & Articles:
1. Could a Neuroscientist Understand a Microprocessor?: journals.plos.org/ploscompbio...
2. Conscious Agent Networks: chrisfieldsresearch.com/CA-ci...
3. The Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen Argument in Quantum Theory: plato.stanford.edu/entries/qt...
Books:
1. The Case Against Reality: amzn.to/3MhW4Wt
2. Vision: amzn.to/3Q4ibTm
PODCAST INFO:
Podcast website: lexfridman.com/podcast
Apple Podcasts: apple.co/2lwqZIr
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RSS: lexfridman.com/feed/podcast/
Full episodes playlist: • Lex Fridman Podcast
Clips playlist: • Lex Fridman Podca...
OUTLINE:
0:00 - Introduction
1:12 - Case against reality
12:40 - Spacetime
37:04 - Reductionism
57:30 - Evolutionary game theory
1:25:53 - Consciousness
2:21:13 - Visualizing reality
2:33:48 - Immanuel Kant
2:36:30 - Ephemerality of life
2:44:56 - Simulation theory
2:50:37 - Difficult ideas
3:05:39 - Love
3:09:14 - Advice for young people
3:11:33 - Meaning of life
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[Lex Fridman]

Here are the timestamps. Please check out our sponsors to support this podcast. 0:00 - Introduction & sponsor mentions: - Calm: calm.com/lex to get 40% off - LMNT: drinkLMNT.com/lex to get free sample pack - InsideTracker: insidetracker.com/lex to get 20% off - MasterClass: masterclass.com/lex to get 15% off - Indeed: indeed.com/lex to get $75 credit 1:12 - Case against reality 12:40 - Spacetime 37:04 - Reductionism 57:30 - Evolutionary game theory 1:25:53 - Consciousness 2:21:13 - Visualizing reality 2:33:48 - Immanuel Kant 2:36:30 - Ephemerality of life 2:44:56 - Simulation theory 2:50:37 - Difficult ideas 3:05:39 - Love 3:09:14 - Advice for young people 3:11:33 - Meaning of life

[Vibrationalmodes]

I just want this video to go viral so I can finally talk about this with others without being perceived as possibly being literally insane at best… :(

[Danielle LaLa]

Omg. SAME! People look at us like we’re “nuts!” Lol. I hope more and more people start waking up and paying attention and realizing MORE! So much more! There’s a lot of us out there I do believe but it’s hard to decipher who’s who!

[Pete Moss]

@I Am they're not nuts, they're NPCs.

[Chico Mendez]

@I Am NPC are non player combatants. In video games you get figures running around in the background. They provide depth to enrich the game play. Watch "Free guy" movie It's funny.

[Tompa]

This "knowledge" is totally useless. It doesn't change anything.

[DeerWolf Unlimited]

@Pete Moss They're in a trance.

[I am Ho1y]

imagine being a character in a book trying to understand your way out of the book into the higher dimension. thats what hes talking about

[tuutuutuut tuutuutuut]

are you referring to 'flatland' ?

[I am Ho1y]

@tuutuutuut tuutuutuut im not aware of what flatland is honestly. but from my own observations in life (im 42 years old now) and being a huge gamer as well, the way i interpret what he means is like imagine AI in a game becoming sentient and trying to get out from inside the game world (2 d space) into our world. imagine a game character trying to jump out of the screen and into our world. it makes no sense because of all thats involved to create the 2d world, characters, rules in the game etc. and what hes saying is that there is stuff that we will never be able to see or understand, similar to an AI character not being able to see the 1's and 0's of code needed to create it and the space its in. hope im explaining it clearly, its as simple as i can try to put it + im not a physicist either

[golu_paswan]

But character trying buliding own knowledge to understand the box sometimes it work sometimes not questions is not about know box what if understand it then stuck your own box then fell alone with your own box you I want connect your box with other then new mix fromed and another layers confusion build that make difficult to understand by other who want know box it goes on unit completely destroy box my thoughts real question is what we doing after we know everything maybe make box more colourful more attractive maybe achieve Direct connection between what you know about or what you try to know . Reality nothing and nothing is is reality

[IFYOUWANTITGOGETIT]

@I am Ho1y I understand what you’re saying. He’s contradicting himself. He says truth is intrinsically hidden from us and then says he is trying to discover new possibilities of truth to replace the model of space time. 🤦‍♂️

[JL D]

Bro there is nowhere to go. We are tied to our bodies in this dimension. Best we can do is take care of it, embody it as much as we can to have a smooth ride... That's why most mystical practices are actually shifting the focus back to some feeling/body/breath. Same as psychotherapy. When you understand that they are intertwined to form this fundamental "user interface", you can transcend it. You're still here, but it doesn't matter as much. Whether your indulge in desire or not doesn't really matter anymore. It's just a product of the user interface. But you have to go through ascetism and "wanting to escape the matrix" first to get it, to EXPERIENCE it.

[Ezio Del Degan]

I have watched this 4 times already and every time I get more information or I learn something about this topic. I will most likely have to watch again. BTW I bought Hoffman's book so this podcast has been a great companion to the book.

[Pedro Lopes]

It's been less than a month since I've discovered this channel. You've (Lex) already caused me two life changing events. First the in-depth views on the rise of AI and now this new angle on the nature of reality. I can't possibly thank you enough. Thank you for being who you are!

[Jack Mojo]

Thank the guests too!

[Pedro Lopes]

@Jack Mojo thanking Lex is thanking his guests. I have known some of his guests for decades, having them speak like they do, is down to Lex.

[MotorMania]

How has this changed your life? List some examples.

[Pedro Lopes]

@MotorMania I cannot tell you how these interviews have changed my life. That would be subjective to my own consciousness. What I can tell you is what Lex is doing to me. He is exposing, to all of us, hours upon hours, brilliant minds and their views on reality and the meaning of it all. I'm sure that you, like myself, don't have access to such brilliant minds amongst the people you personally speak to, unless, of course, you work amongst scientists. Being able to peak into some of the deep thoughts of some of the people, Lex interviews, has been, for me, an amazing experience. Some of these people I've known for decades, but I've never before seen them speak as they have here. We live in a world made of deeply stupid people, all around us, it's comforting to know that some of us are actually trying really hard to make sense of it all. That is, in itself, a life changing experience...

[Elvispsi]

It's actually hard to describe how much this talk has impacted on my thoughts and my perspective about our understanding of the Kosmos, as human beings. I could write here a big text, but I won't, I'll just say this: Thank you Lex, and thank you Donald for this experience and the enlightment!

[Stop]

Did it impact your ability to spell Cosmos?

[Pro-social Sociopath]

If you take the time to write it all out I can assure you that I, at the very least, will read it. I love hearing the thoughts and realizations from the perspective of other people on humanity's shared journey towards truth

[For Youtube]

Yeah man cmon right it down it’ll give me something to think about

[Jason Gray]

This touched on a lot of things I have been thinking about. I didn't know what these ideas were called/ if they were being studied already, so it is very nice that other people are exploring these ideas and developing rigorous mathematical structures for the ideas. I wonder if this just happens when you are studying physics/evolution/complexity etc. I'm definitely going to be going down an amplituhedron/cosmological polytope rabbit hole lol.

[Heather Ani]

I love how hard this is. Lex you’re so great at reframing to focus on more user-friendly portions of such complex ideas while allowing the guest’s passion to show through.

[Amy Domenica]

Andrew h is also great at this- we are so lucky to get to hear these things and for free

[Angry Painter]

Thats not hard to understand. Using math language it might look like, but compare these ideas with buddhism practices. Same thing

[Libeer]

@Angry Painter Buddhism practices and Math is different

[TubeYou]

he is full of smoke and mirrors, thats why it appears hard. theres nothing on his words. its empty and devoid of meaning

[Ambient Epicuros]

Lex is the finest interface.

[Aaron Landon]

This interaction between Lex and Donald is so juicy. I could listen to this on repeat. 🤯🧘🏻‍♂️🤘

[Toccoa Davis]

I had a dream once that nuclear war broke out while I was enjoying a day at the park with my friends. It was very cinematic: we saw that impossibly bright light expand out of nothing, and had a long enough fraction of a second to realize that we had died that fraction of a second ago. All of reality came loose in that instant, dissolved into particles, and washed down something like a river of energetic wind, into... Something like a small, dark, blank room, but without walls or describable physical features: it was like the FEELING of being in a room, but there was no room... As the particles entered the "room" they elongated into an infinitude of tiny "worms" or living squiggly strings of all different colours of black--by which I mean... Uh... Like that phenomenon when you squeeze your eyes shut really hard or you're in the dark, and clouds of colour drift across your (lack of) field of vision... Anyway, then the black rainbow of squiggly worms divided itself into six streams that coalesced into separate worm-blob entities, which were me and my friends, "awakening" from an interactive "game" experience, with the general sentiment of "Holy shit! That was intense!" ....and for some reason, this episode reminds me of that dream.

[Serijas]

Interesting. Thank you for sharing.

[dark future]

​@Serijas 😂😂

[ShadowTriadWestWind]

Sounds like a dope dream

[Unpersonable Me]

Were you sober at the time?

[Toccoa Davis]

@Unpersonable Me Yes. And asleep, even.

[Manish Jethwa]

What a fantastic podcast exploring a theory on consciousness. We are blessed not to have lost Dr Hoffman and maybe the headset still has more for him to see and in turn for consciousness to learn through him as a portal. This interview connected many dots for me in my understanding of what is the self from a scientific angle but fused with alignment to spirituality.

[John Daniels]

"Life is not a problem to be solved, but a reality to be experienced"

[clickityclackity75]

The best thing about this podcast, seems to be the quality of his guests! It’s nice to see intellectuals, communicating with the lay person “the audience” and doing their best to explain to us their work. Love this !!!

[Liberty Springs]

I love his quote"brains are something that consciousness makes up". It reminds me of one of Lex's other guest, maybe Vitalik, that when he was asked "what is money", he said"it's a game". That blew my mind since it made me realize our whole civilization is based on this game we created to see how many people would choose to join different games. You can learn as much from the people who drop out of the game (off-grid or homeless etc) as you can by people still playing the game

[bpalpha]

It would seem this "game" has real consequences such as destroying natural resources and ruining lives.

[Laco]

@bpalpha It's all part of the process and nature.

[Dispatcher]

If No brain, then no consciousness. Brains are a prerequisite

[Joshua Steinke]

I love how we are cognitively catching up to what the truth without words has been trying to tell us during meditation for centuries… wait no space time😮

[YNB tnasty]

It's midnight may 18 2023, and I feel like I've needed this after eleven months of it being dropped I've never been recommended this but yet been thinking of these things so much lately and I thank you for this conversation 🙏

[SlagKing Bran]

I’m really enjoying this podcast as of late. New subscriber. Every time there’s a discussion where the concepts go over my head. I feel the need to grow. Very refreshing.

[Vincent Healy]

The most interesting conversation I've ever seen. I feel stupid and smarter at the same time!

[you2tooyou2too]

Yep. I've always found that the more I know about any subject, the more I know I don't know.

[Tarek Shaalan]

There is no love button on KZbin, but this is really inspiring and truly worth every seconds I spent listening on this podcast, basically open my mind and helped me in connecting the dots on some personal thinking which match the mentioned ideas in this podcast. I read some comments here "negative ones" which lead me to believe how this pure gold of research journey which we had as a summary in almost 4 hours, that humanity have a lot of work todo to reach the level of grasping this kind of research and hypothesis. Lex and Donald Hoffman thank you both for organising and putting the efforts to record it and special thanks to share it in this podcast appreciated.

[Cash Globe]

I left dozens of comments for you to please get this man on the show. My wishes have come true. Much appreciated, Lex. Looking forward to this one 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[PhysicsHack]

Same!

[PhysicsHack]

Same!

[Helen Cahn]

This is so interesting and certainly more complex than the explanations given. As such, there does seem to be some circular logic. Game theory utilizing fitness functions shows that evolution produces an interface, and then it was argued that the interface prevents us from understanding evolution. I do think that logic and reasonings are thought to be outside of this interface insofar as they do allow some understanding of reality. I am so impressed that Lex really did push on the concepts of fitness function and where they come from.

[Timothy Kiser]

My mind (conscious agent)is blown. Many many thanks for giving this conversation to our Universe. I hope it propagates.

[JDL R]

Imagine we get a window into this new reality and see other Ultraterrestrials looking back saying, welcome, what took you so long?

[David]

This is a very important perspective that needs to be seriously considered and not brushed off. What a great episode I love comparing this one to Sean Carroll's perspective. My personal hunch has always pantheistic and panpsychic like this and it's great to know people are doing math and physics into consciousness from this quantum perspective

[WhiteHawk]

Awesome interview both ways Lex and Donald. Subbed! I'm very grateful as it covered many subjects Important to me.Thank you.

[James Gonzales]

Lex, the questions that you ask so many different types of people in so many different fields is nothing short of brilliant. Your show is always mind opening. Thanks for all of the work that you do to make this happen. Peace, Jim

[Robert Ruschak]

We are living the reality in this physical body, whereas freedom is to escape the cults on this prison planet 🌎

[MTNTXii]

@Ronald Renegade I mean look at the subject matter. At that level of "science", there are no solid theories.

[André Miguel]

While I was watching I couldn’t stop thinking about Carl Gustav Jung's theory considering concepts such as personal self, Self, individual and collective consciousness, individual and collective unconsciousness, and archetypes, as a parallel to what Donald mentioned about “The Agent”, “Agents”, Different types of consciousness and so on and so forth.

[Ashenden]

Out of all of what I have experienced, heard or read, this is the first time that I feel completely stupid and yet it makes me feel certain peace of mind.

[Introspective X]

Lex’s ‘size doesn’t matter’ joke had me 😂😂

[Aliens & Dead Spencer]

A lot of this is flying over my head and I plan to rewatch but I’ll say this…Once while high on acid I swear I nearly thought myself out of existence 😅

[seizon sha]

😂

[Guinness]

I’m pretty sure this guy has done DMT with Joe Rogan

[Nick]

It happens, I once convinced myself I was the reincarnation of Jesus. I’m an atheist, it was a real crisis lol

[SpicoliJoe]

Word!!😂

[Frank Bishop]

@Nickwho said you are not my child -God

[Anya]

Oh, Lex, overload, I know. Thank you for making any information within your ear shot, so available to the masses. They can't take our chocolate away from us, no matter the perception of reality. Ephemeral or not , meaning of life is to recreate over and over love and connection, along with the beautiful moments, such as melting chocolate in ones mouth. Whether this new way of perceiving our world is nihilistic or alluniting, it only further drives thee point that each moment means nothing's and therefore means everything.

[kcsnipes]

I’m out here looking for live I may have found it ☝️ melt chocolate 🍫 with me pls 😅🙏

[Anya]

@kcsnipes what the heck. I we can have intellectual s'mores via chat

[Spider Hacksaw]

I love Lex Fridman because he allows his guests to talk. He doesn't suck up the time with host bull and talking about himself and over complementing the guests, like all the other interviewer shows. Lex gets to the point and lets the guest get to the point. I wish more hosts would be like Lex. He keeps things simple and on point.

[Andrew Hancock]

And he doesn't let the speaker get away with hand waving. He makes them be clear about things, especially when such things seem hard to accept, e.g., how our sense of individual selves must be constituents in a larger universal consciousness. He doesn't hide that this is hard to follow, but he professionally acknowledges it.

[Don Peterson]

Worked in the horse barn would be a solid example .

[stunnedmullet blah]

And he looks good doing it

[BidenSenile]

Joe Rogan is actually masterful at listening and is well known for allowing guests to just go.

[Patrick Sweeney]

Love the analogy of donning and doffing the VR headset in addressing the (admittedly unnerving) recognition that Consciousness precedes and creates Matter (space/time) rather than springing from it. Thank you, Lex, for this amazing interview.

[Julian Keogh]

I love this guy. I like to think of consciousness as unitary but at the same time instantiated. With time being literally a figment of the imagination and not existing in any objective context. Be nice to eachother folks, when you cease to be you will experience another instance of consciousness from beginning to end.

[Mario Casarez]

This podcast was outstanding! Take you Lex Friedman!! Para Adelante!

[Marc Carbone]

Lex love your podcast, I’d love to see you have Tom Campell author of My Big Toe on the podcast to talk more about simulation theory.

[MARK WEAVER]

Good Job, LEX ... been studying existence as a loner since the age of 7 ...the only state is the state of being alone ...the Universe gives full support and challenge according to each persons will. ...I found the catnap and personal space as the door to the Ambient ...the container that exists around each of us ...Knowledge as perfect maturity to be attained and maintained for life #WELLDONELEX

[Tree Root]

Started this several weeks ago and just came back to it yesterday. Maybe the most fascinating episode of any podcast ever. Thank you gentlemen!

[Benedict]

I’m too high for this shit

[Tree Root]

@Benedict or perhaps not high enough?

[Bert Demeulemeester]

I too have been doubling down on this episode tbh. It expanded my sense of reality that was already pretty much in line with this. Listening to this conversation has added some layers to it though

[DestructiveElements]

Agree. I also suggest watching the interview with Joscha Bach. Similar topics

[Tree Root]

@DestructiveElements thank you

[BIGCAT]

This is one episode I need to replay a couple of times. 👍🏼

[John Montalvo]

Thank you both for this masterpiece

[Lyndon Apthorpe]

Absolutely incredible discussion. Thank you both so much!

[Arsene Lupin III]

I cant listen to Donald he talks in hitches and starts. I just can't, he self interrupts. It seems like a glitchy program

[marthaweigh]

These topics NEED to be discussed - especially consciousness - THANK YOU SO MUCH for your fearless explorations ❤️💫

[EPOH]

Its amazing what some think they know but in reality we may never understand unless we can use all of our brain or shown what Life really is. It could be even possible that everything we know. Could be just life living inside of life living inside of another life/energy form. When you start to think about what is the true form of the begining of everything and how did it that form. Its too much for the human brain to understand. There is no way of knowing .We may not even be important enough to need to know, We may be only just a partical or a few atoms that form something way bigger. But what is it and how was it formed. It just keeps going on and on.

[Green_Finger]

Be happy be free live your life :)

[Mars Living]

Be happy.

[pillsburied]

A brilliant interview with a brilliant man. We know that our perception of linear time is an illusion. In that context, what he is saying makes sense. Everything happened "at once" and some mechanism serializes events to give us a "now". Traditionally we would consider that to be done within the brain, but Dr. Hoffman has opened my eyes to the possibility that it _could_ be something else.

[Lee Stringer]

This episode changed my life a bit. Thanks Lex and Hoffman. Never stop.

[Kelly Logan]

Me too

[Claudiu Bele]

Next up try ImmaterialAI, it helps you see depression/stress/sad/etc are just "cool story bro"s

[Matt C.]

Same here, it will inform my decisions and relationships with a worldview that is consistent with observed reality yet more reassuring than nihilism. Being as a projection of consciousness and discovering I am not the projection.

[kittervision]

Welcome down the rabbit hole! It's fun down here- It's infinity deep, and the more you discover the more you learn, the more you realize there's no way to ever have a real freaking clue. But it's sure fun to try to understand

[davidkakn]

same bro especially that last sentence.

[T Peterson]

I love this episode its just so hard to understand what he's talking about sometimes.

[Jamie Morris]

Probably one of the best intellectual videos I haven’t seen in a while. I could pull out a handful of PhD topics from his conversation alone

[Steven Cantare]

Very good. It is possible we are living in a duality paradox where the co creators had the authority to bring this duality forward for souls who want this experience this insane duality separate from Source.. The co creators do not want us to snap out of the illusion of space time and and ascend back to our original state of divine non duality.

[Joseph Solis]

I like this 👍

[Doc]

This is a zeitgeist interview. Talk of these concepts is rife in certain circles and I believe people are awakening. Incidentally, 5-MeO DMT is the psychedelic that opens the portal.

[The Moon and Stars]

DMT gives you a peak, with little to no control, astral projection gives you open access to unlimited knowledge, ability to visit the past and future, and meet your higher self AND remember who(what) we really are. Look into project gateway, then Robert Monroe.

[chaunggyi]

The spiritual expressive essence that Hoffman is determining to prove is one leap forward to thinking about how humans could be more sharing interactive instead of fighting over limited resources. Very interesting dynamics.

[Josef Adams]

This episode is an example why Lex’s podcast is the greatest in the world right now.

[Somebody]

2:25:40

[Sitki Can T]

Exactly!!

[Muratib S. Fatah]

True

[Mark Anthony]

Hip hip Hooray 🙌🎉 The feeling that I ride after each conversation is worth the time investment,

[Jeramiah Parsons]

My brain is exploding in innumerable dimensions. This is a wonderful conversation 🖤🖤🖤

[Jenny Eyles]

It is as if what was said pressed the right button in my mind. The jolt that I have been waiting for, for decades. After watching it 1st time, I stopped using YT and avoided any local or world news, because this interview showed me all I needed to know. I can now stop trying to understand what is happening all around me. All I need is more meditation and contemplation. I have relaxed. I have ordered the book.

[John Daniels]

I didn't think we had time, I thought everything that's happening in this reality, this universe, this simulation, is happening dynamically in real time.

[Patricia]

So wonderful. I have those similar inklings, just don’t know the physics or math. True reality is something I spend a lot of time exploring in my mind and in meditation.

[The cat fun and more]

I pull l

[Taylor Falk]

I love when you hear something so profound, and for a slight second you grasp it, and it unlocks a deeper truth about the universe you haven't experienced or thought of before.... just to have it immediately dissipate like a fart in the wind

[Michael Frey]

Lex: You outdid yourself with this one! You are a brilliant interviewer and the way you are getting out the ideas of such leading edge thinkers as Donald Hoffman (one of my very favorite people on the planet) deserves an immense amount of gratitude. Thank you for such high level conversations! You are every bit as special a human being as Donald is. I really appreciate you!

[Pamela Forward]

What you said. Just love the lack of ego and deep natural enquiry Lex brings to the table

[workman]

gay

[Brian Larsen]

@workman Im happy for you you came out

[glok1989]

It is also so confusing for us because of how messed up our concepts and perception is right from the beginning of our conscious living. Some of it is passed down by language or a lack of it for better explanations of what we actually perceive. I sometimes think if we hadn't have words for perceptions in our brain, what would the thought process be? It wouldn't be blank? Perhaps labeling things has bound us to the way we think and understand. I think Buddhists have been on this "reality is not what our brain perceves" thing for quite a while and the scientists are starting to talk about the same subject only now.

[Tao Now]

This is a ground breaking conversation. And others like this 10 years ago the combination of science and wisdom teachings would be considered taboo basically…. I listen to these two open minded beings 3 times already. Thank you 🙏 for being leaders into a greater and wider explanation of our existence and awareness itself .

[OminousImpression]

This talk has nothing to do with the mythical ideas of religion.

[🥊American Gypsy🥊]

It’s nice when someone makes a major bold statement to bring in their proof. Anyone can say something like they are right!

[fk linny]

The entire time I was watching this I couldn't help but think of the book simulacra and simulation by jean baudrillard. So many concepts about an interface and interpreting reality through symbols etc. that Donald Hoffman was talking about was very similar to this book.

[Alex L]

Movie The Matrix was inspired by that book

[lewis richardson]

Lex you’re the most patient, thoughtful and curious person I’ve ever had the pleasure of watching on KZbin. Honestly your videos have changed my life. I have always been curious to. I’m a carpenter originally now i have projects for some lovely people. I’m a good crypto trader to but don’t invest in me enough. Anyway i love the content you share. A big thanks from me too you ❤

[Anth C]

The opening line about madness and truth is solid - well done Lex on putting this together

[what what]

it’s completely ridiculous

[The Roving Scientist]

Excellent subject and very well interviewed. Thank you

[XVITNG]

This dude has to have a team of people reading his guests books and then coming up with questions. And even sending him the questions on the computer as he is doing the interview. - cause that would be insane if this dude actually read his book and is able to ask these deeply thought out questions on the spot like thjs.

[Kyler Braden]

I mean he is like an MIT educated engineer so it’s not that crazy that he can keep up.

[XVITNG]

@Kyler Braden I’m not saying he isn’t super smart. But I mean even if he were the smartest guy on earth- it would be difficult to Fully listen and come up with such great questions every time. And besides the ability- he has a major podcast - why wouldn’t he have other people throwing him ideas for questions? He wants to have the best podcast possible. I doubt he lets his ego get in the way about having help.

[Andrew Glass]

Finally someone that makes 'sense'. Consciousness is prime, energy is just communication, Adamus physics 101. THANKS for the talk.

[M]

I’m surprised Bernardo Kastrap hasn’t been interviewed yet. How fun it would be to actually get some of these people together to talk with Lex moderating.

[Steven Carter]

Love your work, Lex. We are infinite, temporarily human, eternally conscious. Fly on...

[Benjamin In Korea]

Between Robin Hanson's interview and this one, my brain has been battered into a quivering mess. I love it.

[chris haughey]

Yeah I love this shit

[Lieven Yperman]

Do you know Bernardo Kastrup? If not, I highly recommend looking into his theory of consciousness.

[olafboisvert]

fr back to back 🤯

[JesterBear]

Check out Jason on his KZbin channel Archaix. He's a chronographer of history and has come to the conclusion that we live in a simulation.

[sharingmyviews]

@Lieven Yperman love him

[Jan Morgan Orr]

Ugh….. I Love This Stuff!! Thank You Thank You!! Lex when you say you have been looking for infinity everywhere…..maybe it is the vector of time that is infinite… we are only granted the information necessary to navigate the sector we find ourselves in but we do have access to information from the past which we use to help manifest our futures.

[david centurio]

This guy over here doing a quintuple axel backflip in a seated position with his mind to tell us to meditate and shut off the mind. I like it

[Anonymous]

Gibberish.

[Meshuggah Dave]

@Anonymous Jealousy and envy.

[Anonymous]

@Meshuggah Dave Bulverism and Projection.

[Gromexecutive]

Wow. What a freaking conversation. The immersion into our simulations is truly something I have't ever perceived before. That "nothingness" truly has a sense of being. Our consioucness creates out of nothing. Everything is nothing until we say otherwise.

[Nonie Kendrick]

Wow. I can remembering thinking in a similar vein when I was a kid. I often wondered if the green of the grass I saw or the blue of the sky I saw was the same colors to me friends. I wondered if things existed only because I saw them. Then I read Heidegger in college & my head shaking went all Tex Avery. But oddly, I always believed in my hunches & emotions; I never questioned the ‘ephemeral’ possibility of my feelings/emotions, especially the stronger ones such as love, grief, or that which prompted passion. These things often kept me in my own periods of quiet contemplation. I wondered if adjectives were just triggering “word realities” that made us cognizant of our own unique version we associated with the verbiage of colors, of feelings. I was always well aware of perception & it’s subjective differences. This is heavy, fascinating stuff.

[GrayBeard_gamer]

I started struggling with perceived reality versus evolution as a kid. I would look at a meadow of flowers or the last rays of the sun streaming through a break in the clouds creating a salmon glow and wonder why I felt that these were beautiful. I could understand that looking at a table full of food would trigger feelings of anticipation, excitement, enjoyment and satisfaction, because the food is connected to survival. It still seemed a stretch, or a leap, to get to "beauty." But we don't eat a meadow, and we certainly don't eat a sunset. My dad was a scientist in biology who was considered to be at the very top of his field of research, so one of the two most significant people in my early life was firmly attached to evolution, theorems, statistics and probabilities. He explained the world to me from his absolute perspective. But he could never explain to me how a universal sense of beauty evolved. Where did this come from? What prompted the need for it to arise to evolve within our species?

[Scott Koenig]

Well sunshine is essential to your survival....

[GrayBeard_gamer]

@Scott Koenig Of course, but it seems a stretch, if not a leap, from seeing a beautiful sunset to feeling like you're going to survive a little longer. When I look at my pantry stocked up for the winter, it is a very different feeling of satisfaction and survival from the feeling of inner tranquility from looking at something "beautiful." But that's just me. . .?

[digitalwasabi2]

Did you ever consider the possibility that God created you and also instilled in you an appreciation for natural beauty?

[Manifestus]

@Wuodan Strasse why you being toxic? Why religion triggered you ?

[RoxanaLorenaD]

I wonder how Hoffman has put the "conscious experience" (for eg. tasting chocolate) into mathematical terms, seeing that it's an axiom (assumed truth) in his theory. It seems like something very hard to do, to describe it mathematically.

[Benjamin Morrison]

This conversation is one for the record books.

[Chaz titan]

I have a book my old girlfriend got me that claims it's about a nurse that was requested to talk to the alien that crashed in roswell, from Amazon. It was from the pov from the nurse sorta on her mental death bed, not wanted to follow the nda or whatever they forces on her. One of the relayed messages from this e.t. when she asked, how do you fly such far distances and so fast. Paraphrasing of course. The e.t. basically said, why do you burn things to move around? You are just flying around inside your mind. Sounds like the book however fiction was more true than I care to consider

[Marcello Spinella]

Top notch stuff. Keep it coming!

[katy B]

This guest reminds me of my brother. He has schizophrenia and can ramble on just like this guy...always talking about space, time, loops, etc.

[Swoozy]

It’s always been my belief that when we take psychedelics, we are opening ourselves up to be able to perceive reality more closely to the way it actually operates. We “see things moving” because in truth, they are moving. Everything is vibration, and if you take enough acid or mushrooms, you can literally see that.

[Kenny Omg]

You can also see it as what the limits and capabilities of our interfaces are. Kinda like plugging in an usb drive and executing the software on it to see what happens.

[Daniel The Avatar Channel]

💯

[Robin Luich]

Some of don't need drugs to see what is there. God simply puts us in the know

[Yo]

Best Damm podcast by mega far distance on this show, Wonderful video 📹 👏 👌 🙌 hands up Lex.

[Psycho]

damn, all the conversations are so inspiring and fascinating, thank you so much h

[lee jones]

While I don't think I'm insane, these ideas about "reality" do truly tax my thinking and hurt my brain. I will certainly have to listen to this again, and possibly buy the book. I had decided years ago that having a brain made to cope with three and sometimes four dimensions made it unlikely I would be able to understand theoretical physics and advanced sciences, regardless of my interests. Listening to Dr. Hoffman makes me wonder if I can even understand the realities of everyday life. I'll try to understand as much as I can of what he is sharing, because it is new to me and fascinating. But if I can't get my mind around it much, my limited brain's illusion of reality is working well, and it won't bother me that it is another illusion. Thanks for another great podcase.

[the EQUATION]

The fundamental basis of any understanding is sincerely wanting to.

[Tuco Ramires]

Amazing research team.That was impressive.

[Mr.Nobody]

I love that disclaimer at the beginning. Couldn’t have said it any better

[Jaganath]

This is simply the most interesting stuff I have heard in my entire life. It actually takes my anxiety away.

[Red Horse Adventures]

Your anxiety is perception...

[Brother Parker]

I don’t suffer with anxiety but listening to this confirms I’m exactly where I need to be even when I think I’m not.

[Red Horse Adventures]

@Nickolas Gaspar Sounds like that is your perception.

[Burial]

I have never understood people who talk about their "anxiety", it's even more strange when they frame it as some sort of diagnosis. Anxiety is a part of life.

[Red Horse Adventures]

@Nickolas Gaspar that are based in a reality that doesn’t exist 🤔

[A. Acquah]

I love your introduction to this podcast. Truth or madness....!? but what if both concepts are twin flames - the truth is not devoid of madness.

[Madonnalitta1]

There's a fine line between genius and madness.

[Extreme Deer Habitat]

The arguments he makes that we are using our consciousness to create the world is precisely the conclusion I reached after experiencing a DMT trip at the age of 72. I am a retired biomedical scientist and tried to interpret what I experience as an observant biologist rather than just going for a ride. My sense of what happened visually is that I have a capability of creating a visual representation of my consciousness that, when disentangled from sensory inputs paints pictures conjured up by subconscious elements of my self (probably not the right term) that are rendered onto my visual field in as fine a detail as I normally render the world that is presented to me by my sensory inputs (light striking my biological sensors and then being interpreted by my brain) or being "painted" before me. Afterwards I discussed with my guide the sense that I was using a "pallet" to paint the so-called hallucinations and under normal sensory control I use to "paint" the surroundings that I perceive. I said that when I look at you I am creating a picture of you, that when I turn my head I wipe out that painting and replace it with whatever else comes into my visual field. So in a visual sense we are clearly creating the world as we look at it and rendering it in some representative fashion. But somehow, on DMT the "pallet" suspends painting the outcome of the usual sensory inputs but instead paints pictures from another source, which I interpret as being what Jung would call the unconscious. The fact that I experienced a phenomenal degree of trailing as I came out of the experience made me feel that the mechanism was more like motion pictures than painting because a trailing image is like a series of still pictures that normal blend when presented rapidly but that they were slowed down to reveal a series of still images during the transition period from the trip back to normal reality.

[Nils Johansson]

I bought the book. This is the truth on reality. Don is aligned with the truth of things. There is spirit matter that is consciousness. He is parting the veil the blocks us from seeing the the true reality outside of time and space and the laws govening this sphere! Thank you.

[Mark Henry Ramsey]

I’m beginning to be intrigued with the idea of universal Consciousness (big C) which we all (and all things) are a ripple of (if that’s the right analogy). In that we are all one consciousness but specific expressions of. This would tie into Jung’s collective unconscious. I can imagine the geometry of that being akin to a fractal that spans all time and space.

[Madonnalitta1]

I've been thinking this too, and that all life are perhaps slivers of this Consciousness trying to experience the material.

[Mark Henry Ramsey]

@Madonnalitta1 or perhaps (analogy alert) all life is one note in the song of consciousness.

[OminousImpression]

Well, that is certainly not the universal experience of every human or living being, so one would first have to demonstrate that everything we currently experience is wrong.

[Mark Henry Ramsey]

@OminousImpression what is it precisely that you object to?

[Pedro Jim]

I have outer body experiences while sleeping and it has changed my view of reality. It's all types of cool and weird.

[Kevin]

“You will find either madness or truth and you won’t know which is which” wow that sure is exact to my experiences

[Eris]

well youd hafta be a little mad to think youve actually found truth. you can cook the perfect omlet in your mind, but you cant eat it.

[Eris]

I dunno who Zach is, looks like he runs some sort of online publication. But If youre into Gematria, id recommend looking into the Erisian Law of Fives. 😉

[B]

I like to say they'll call you mad for speaking truth in a mad world.

[Eris]

@B if you think youre speaking truths in a mad world, you might actually be the mad one. You can tell someones mad when they start yelling "IM NOT MAD! YOURE MAD! YOURE ALLLLL MAD! I JUST KNOW THE TRUTH!"

[The Clean Hand]

Daily.

[Walter Carol]

The idea of the ephemeral notion is a hard one to grasp. I walk on a dirt road and see tire tracks. I talk to my friend later that day and find he drove down that road. Who supplied the tracks? Did his consciousness somehow provide me with the tracks to observe? I love trying to bend my mind but my gosh ... it's a pretzel right now 😀

[Thomas Boswell]

Its like a ratio of what you know to what actually is. Representing reality is just adding another step.

[Markus Schulz]

This is cutting edge!! Love this conversation and will be sharing it with as many people that I can! On a somewhat related note, I think having Sadhguru on this podcast would be such an intriguing expansion on the topic, he is someone who can definitely bring another perspective on this topic around consciousness from a 100% subjective experience as he claims. Someone who dug all the way in, "to the bottom"? Would love to see this conversation happen and tied into this line of questioning - Joe Rogan had Sadhguru on as well last year or so, and while that was a good interview, I think Joe failed to ask a deeper line of questions that Lex could probably bring to the table / Sadhguru would be able to clear up some confusions as well. Let's make it happen! :D www.youtube.com/@sadhguru

[Louis Browne]

Right or wrong, one things for sure, there are going to be some very interesting movies based on these theories over the coming years.

[Chris Klugh]

I think with the development of AI going on today (April 2023), we will be for the first time might be able to have a better theory of conscience. If we can say a computer has it, what a place to be able to reverse engineer it from.

[Joanne M]

This is all finally coming to the Light !! This interview should go global to wake people up and get them thinking in a new and better direction. Thank you very much to both of you for the great talk

[Tom Tom]

But you didn't hear what he really said because if you did he would be wrong out you never experiencing reality.

[Joanne M]

@Tom Tom I did listen. There is so much more to come that will be shocking/enlightening globally. Wait for it :)

[Tom Tom]

@Joanne M He said you were wrong.

[hello world]

If I was asked to choose whose voice would narrate the end of the universe at the very end of time, I think it would be Lex Friedman.

[Bud Robinson]

This is the smartest guest, ive never been so lost in this podcast.

[prosperouseye]

Starting @ 51:40 Lex's point about maybe the "pursuit is not a fruitful one" may be a very important point. Even for someone like myself and others who enjoy questioning EVERTHING. 🙂

[Ddyve]

so many questions i want to ask but this is just incredible