Dr David & Hui Chun Su Johnson

Composting & Gardening

[@joecaz]

15:30 Make sure it's got enough moisture. And whatever you do, DON'T LET IT DRY OUT, because if you let it dry out, YOU HAVE TO DO A REDO. Microbes will coat all the material with a HYDROPHOBIC SUBSTANCE, and you can't get water into it; they're protecting themselves.

[@tedbrinegar982]

have my system going. Super excited for the results. it is working great so far.

[@SpiritusBythos]

Great couple! Thank you so much for the presentation. So excited to make one. We have a source for free woodchips. Peace

[@tinkernaut8736]

I've had my reactor cooking for almost a year. So far its looking good and has reduced in depth by 40 percent.

[@sycamoreknox9419]

I've got two that I started in the first part of January, I could only acquire 4' 14ga hog wire fencing. After I finished filling the first one the temperature got up to 101 degrees then we had a cold snap with rain and the temp of the JSB went to the 40's, I was bummed, and then the Polar Vortex came to SE OK, and I thought this was a wash because of a couple of inches from the top solid ice. Fast-forward to now the daytime ambient temp is in the upper 60's and the reactor thermometer reads 76.

[@samjardavid6160]

Woww, what a lovely couple 💕💕

[@checkyourbrakes]

I'm so excited to start this on our little homestead

[@incontraincontra9310]

Wow. “Draft Animal Power Group?” That term just gave me chills. What am I missing? How do I learn more about this?!

[@karleichorn5172]

One question I have is, what do you do with the worms in the compost when you harvest it or make compost tea. Do you strain them out to use in the next one or what?

[@michaelmoore7831]

At first I thought, okay it's just a composter that doesn't need turning. But this allows fungus network to set up as well to participate in the composting. Good stuff.

[@tonysu8860]

Any undisturbed compost pile will produce a fungi community. The Johnson-Su bioreactor is not special in creating the conditions for fungi.

[@AGRICHAT101]

Nice info.

[@kimaccardi9817]

Can you use a different nitrogen source than manure? Grass clippings for example

[@tinkernaut8736]

I'm going to try this to use on my raised beds. I'm going to assume this can be scaled down as well.

[@anthonysinclair5721]

I'd check into it before I tried a different scale , I think a compost pile needs to be at least a cubic yard to function correctly and this system probably has min. parameters too. 😎

[@Doitallgp]

It all depends if the thermophilic stage is necessary or not for the system to work

[@tonysu8860]

It can't be scaled down much in size because there has to be enough insulation to trap the heat in the center of the pile. A common problem is that the pile is too small and all the heat escapes.

[@shannonjust]

Are you currently using this method at Menoken Farm? I live in Bismarck and I am wondering how manageable this system is when it's -20f for weeks on end. Is it doable? Does the thermo mass in this design keep it sufficiently warm even in cold harsh conditions?

[@tonysu8860]

There it is. At about 14:20 I've been looking for the exact words by Dr Johnson that describes his opinion of the importance of fungi in healthy soil. It seems that his understanding of healthy soil, and in particular what is produced by the Johnson-Su bioreactor is defective. As part of the recommended process of the Johnson-Su bioreactor, worms are thrown into the pile as a last stage processing of the compost, but here's the catch... Worms are known to be voracious predators of bacteria, virus, single celled fauna and... fungi. Dr Johnson needs to more fully explain the dichotomy of the importance of fungi and promoting the consumption of fungi. Beneficial bacteria is a bit more understandable, consumption of bacteria can probably be explained away by the beneficial worm castings providing a superior breeding environment that produces a net positive growth of bacteria. But, fungi don't grow so quickly and it's common to see mold and various fungus disappear completely from worm bins. In general, practically everyone who has ever observed and studied soils have remarked that worms are a typically good sign of healthy soil so Dr. Johnson needs to resolve this issue in what he promotes... Does he favor worms or a mycelium network? You can't favor fungi if you promote worms that consume the fungi. Also, regarding the Johnson-Su bioreactor... I generally consider it a pretty common cold compost method, especially since it's recommended to run for a full year. That's compared to the proper hot compost method that requires only 90 days to produce compost of such high quality that the results are jet black, the color of pure carbon, and there is no indication what the original materials in the pile were. With a Johnson-Su bioreactor, after a period of time 4x longer you still see branches, twigs, fibrous strands and a medium tan color. Additionally, it seems to me that the cold compost time is mostly a waste, if the final worm stage is what really is producing the compost, then adding those worms should be done as soon as the pile cools below 90 degrees F from the initial thermophilic process which likely would be about 10 days after getting the pile started. The entire pile should probably be as ready in about 6 mths compared to the regular Johnson-Su steps which last an entire year.

[@glassbackdiy3949]

from my understanding after the thermophillic stage a lot of the fungi will produce spores which lie dormant, these pass though worms, you can see them in the finished compost via microscopic analysis, if this is used as a feedstock for compost tea the spores germinate, again visible via microscopic analysis, but it is now common to use the compost as a feedstock for compost extract, the extract is applied in conjunction with fungal foods so rather than 'brew' a compost tea for 36-48hrs all the inputs are applied to the soil mixed in the extract at seed planting stage allowing the plants to feed the microbiology via root exodates. Hope that helps!

[@JayMills11]

What sort of worms can you add to this? Are you going for earth worms or composting worms? If you had this system close enough to the ground, would earth worms naturally be attracted to it and begin to populate it?

[@tonysu8860]

I'm sure composting worms like red wigglers or European Nightcrawlers are what is needed. Those would be known to stay and live in the compost unlike African Nightcrawlers or Canadian Nightcrawlers which would tend to burrow feet into the ground and leave the area.

[@cbysngr1]

Has anyone tried placing the bioreactor inside a greenhouse, if so what were the results?

[@susangichuhi]

Hi, thank you so much for the content. I'm wondering, can you introduce red wigglers to accelerate the process? I look forward to your response. Thanks, from Nairobi, Kenya.

[@equinoxproject2284]

From what I have seen from Dr. David's talks you can put worms in after the pile goes below 80°F. In one video he said the reactor cools enough in 3-5 days. Get a compost thermometer to be sure.

[@susangichuhi]

@@equinoxproject2284 Thank you, I thought it was possible, but then was afraid of the heat. I am definitely trying this one, I like the fact that it saves on space and is maintenance-free.

[@equinoxproject2284]

@@susangichuhi my question is, can you plant into it or is it intended thi be used as an amendment.

[@susangichuhi]

@@equinoxproject2284 yes it is soil ammendment

[@sacredcowbbq1326]

@@equinoxproject2284 Initially, it was used as an amendment. But now, he's found that just treating seeds is enough.

[@Rubibi-saltwaterjim]

I live in a tropical area, the majority of the trees on the property are palms, I would like to stop taking the fronds to the tip, where they mulch them, and take care of them myself onsite, I've got roughly 200 palms and take a 8x5x4 trailer to the tip every 3 weeks, so plenty of material. Any tips for breaking this material down. Hi from Broome, Western Australia.

[@Th4thWiseman]

Use a woodchipper or if you've got a tractor with a P.T.O and 3 point linkage look around for a BED FORMING PLOW, you can mulch it all very fast using this method without digging deep at all.

[@tonysu8860]

A woodchipper won't work, palm fronds are too fibrous. I've seen nothing except a proper hot compost pile decompose fibrous materials like palm fronds, and it can be done well. A hot compost pile works because it achieves sustained temperatures just under boiling for weeks. The Johnson-Su bioreactor doesn't do that so won't break down those palm fronds.

[@davidjohnson1910]

Have you try using a crushing shredder?

[@pixiedogger]

has anyone ever used grape pomace for this process?

[@vaughan_metalart]

I may be a bit late to the party but I live on a measly .3 acre of land surrounded by 100 ft Norway maples and oaks and produce very little in the way of green compostable material vs carbon. The frost line here is 36" . So I have no doubt that this system would freeze fully throughout our winters. Any idea how much the freeze would stifle the process.

[@sacredcowbbq1326]

I'll be watching for the reply to your question too.

[@NotyouraverageYTwatcher]

Check with your local landfill. They should be brimming with yard waste this time of year

[@garthwunsch]

I just posted my thoughts in a longer reply to Jeff Mitchell above. My compost freezes SOLID every winter... yet in the spring, as soon as it’s thawed, it’s full of red wrigglers. so yes, the exposed mass is going to freeze. I intend to build this come spring 2021, but am preparing myself that it may have to mature for two season... I.e. use in spring 2023. One advantage I may have is that I have access to some wood chips that have been aging in a heap for two years. Past experience says that when I put them through my hammer mill shredder, they break up pretty fine, as they’ve already started to be broken down in the pile. So with any luck, I’ll get the compost inoculant in one year.

[@dianeloftness2892]

@@garthwunsch What do you do about watering in winter? Do you keep watering until it freezes? How much water? How often? How do you know when you can stop and then when to start again in the spring?

[@garthwunsch]

@@dianeloftness2892 As I mentioned, I intend to build this next spring, so no direct JSB experience yet, but from over fifty years of composting experience, I know that as we approach winter, evaporation slows down, and so will the microbial activity, so not much point adding water to an ice cube, which is what it will be all winter LOL. If you’re not sure if it‘S wet enough, just stick your hand in and grab a bunch and squeeze hard... you should be able to make a drop or two of water come out between your fingers.To get some idea of what’s happening inside the reactor, buy yourself a long compost thermometer and keep tabs on the temperature. You’ll know when it’s thawed out in spring and when you can start watering. Don’t overthink this stuff... just keep it moist. Excess water will run out the bottom, and if you see that, back off on the water a bit. What grow zone do you garden in?

[@MrJFoster1984]

You must loose a lot of nutrients from the compost out the bottom with the water run off?

[@panstriato2]

Sin mine they're si no runoff I can see.

[@tonysu8860]

You're missing the point how it works... Today's theory is that practically all soils have more than enough P and K and might only need moderate amounts of N. But the most important part that is nearly always missing is not nutrients but a microbial community that enables nutrient uptake into the roots. Compost's main benefit is to provide these missing microbes.

[@xuyahfish]

I've been trying to heat up my compost but it's not been working. 😮‍💨 I don't have manure so that might be the reason.

[@greighenning9091]

Restart the process again. Add 25% of any green foliage evenly throughout the mixture, (which Is the nitrogen content). Maintain 70% moisture. This should work.

[@brianjustice908]

Can anyone tell me if the introduction of charcoal to this system would help or hinder the process if using the compost as an amendment?

[@tonysu8860]

Charcoal would only add risk to your compost pile, possibly making the pH alkaline. If you want more carbon in your compost, you can add more "browns"(dead material) in the beginning. The only issue is that normally the pile is somewhere between 50/50 to 60/40 greens to browns so that there is enough green to feed the bacteria that breaks down both greens and browns. If you add too much browns, then it might not get all broken down. The optimal result for any composting is that you can't identify what you put in the pile in the first place.

[@fishmonger6879]

Can I add shrimp shells & guts from wild caught shrimp?

[@frankfenske7867]

Does a harsh cold winter affect this process?

[@tonysu8860]

No. The thermophilic bacteria will generate sufficient heat no matter what the ambient temperature is if the pile is large enough to provide its own insulation to prevent heat loss. But mind you that I personally feel the Johnson-Su bioreactor is fundamentally insufficient to create good compost so I wouldn't be happy with the results whether the weather was favorable or not.

[@davidjohnson1910]

Yes, it will. Please keep it above freezing and around 70% moisture content. Happy composting!

[@shannonjust]

@@davidjohnson1910 So this can or cannot be done efficiently in a harsh North Dakota winter? Where can one find information on how to do this in -20f winters? How to keep it moist in sub zero? Is this system only for climates that don't experience harsh winters?

[@dougkuykendall1547]

We practice holistic resource management/planned grazing, but have trouble with weeds (especially wooly croton). Part of that may be our fault....too much disturbance during heavy rain and very wet soil. We are subtropical (48"). This was farmed in cotton until probably 60-70 years ago. In this high rainfall area a LOT of topsoil was lost! Anyway, I thought livestock trended the soil to bacterial, even though we have dung beetles? Is that correct?

[@garthwunsch]

From watching a lot of Dr. Elaine Ingham’s talks, it appears that your weed issues may be caused by your tillage... at any stage in any weather. Tillage breaks the hyphae and impedes their growth. This causes the fungal community to remain immature. Ms .Su describes it as being thrown out of your house every day and having to start over. All systems need a protected undisturbed ‘home’ to mature in. As the fungal community matures, a natural succession takes place and weeds are greatly diminished. In my personal experience, I have a 1200 sq ft garden that is almost totally weed free. I have been no-till for eight years now, and each year there are fewer and fewer weeds. Takes me about five minutes a week to weed the entire garden. I use mostly leaves, straw and well composted wood chips/kitchen scraps/yard waste as mulch. I don’t think I’ve addressed all your issues, but this is what I’ve experienced.

[@jeffmitchell5401]

so what happens when it freezes? it can be -20 f for weeks here.

[@TS-vr9of]

worms and Beatles will burrow deeper. When it thaws they surface and bring back and spread the microbial diversity from their gut. Also if you focus on building healthy soil the A horizon of the soil deepens, the deeper portions are more resistant to frost and as long as soil temps at depth stay about about 30 degrees F they'll still stay alive in hibernation. Soil residue also helps insulate the ground from the cold and microbes will feed on residue and energy stores in the soil warming the soil similar to a compost pile.

[@larryparks5034]

Dr su and Johnson mentioned the how resilient microorganisms can survive extremes if they couldn't we would all be dead.

[@garthwunsch]

@@TS-vr9of I think Jeff Mitchell is concerned about the worms during the first winter, before the process is complete. the reactor is off the ground, and yes, the worms may migrate out of the reactor into the earth beneath, but I don’t think they will migrate back up in the spring. To your thoughts on worms in the garden... I live with six months of winter, and can assure you that my garden soil does not freeze below undisturbed snow. I’ve even planted an occasional lovely garlic find in February - dig away two feet of snow, and plant... and recover. There is NO frost in the soil... the worms just go torpid.

[@rolandoriggio5026]

Where is he acquiring the info about fecal matter transplants? Does anyone know any good books, researchers, links? Thank you!

[@paganpride464]

Not sure exactly where but I've seen Dr Michael Greger site some of the studies in his videos.

[@garthwunsch]

Mr. Google has lots of information on this treatment.

[@AshoreToo]

CBC Radio (Quarks and Quarks, plus medical programmes) of Canada did more than one episode on this cure. Major magazines should have touched this subject. The closer the blood relation of donor, the better the inoculation result.

[@tonysu8860]

There's quite a bit that has been developed but only within the past 8 years or so. Unfortunately for me, this treatment was not fully available when I had a gall bladder removal, one of many types of diseases that requires the gastrointestinal tract to be sterilized, ie. killing the entire microbiome of the stomach and intestines. Took me weeks to rebuild some of that microbial biome naturally, and IMO has never fully recovered to where it was before my operation. A fecal transplant either from a sample taken from oneself before an operation or from another person is supposed to greatly accelerate recovery. Should be plenty of stuff on the Internet

[@ronlabe5487]

How did they inject the tea?

[@dysfunctional_vet]

i saw a video on this, they take several pounds of it. soaked in water with a recirculating pump (filtered) and the water is titrated into a seed drill aplicator, which puts some in when the seed drops, and there was also a system that bulk sprayed a feild that was growing. i do not have links for those films, but i found them by just searching for composting nothing else in the search bar

[@MrTerence1970]

Is it possible to make a smaller scale for urban house owner?

[@larryparks5034]

I would assume it is scalable as long you follow all the other parameters.

[@garthwunsch]

I’m not sure it would scale down very much. You need a critical mass to get the original thermophilic/heating stage.

[@davidjohnson1910]

You may make it shorter or make one with 2.5 feet diameter and 3 feet tall with one pipe in the middle.

[@hurricanemuscle]

how to build this bioreactor on a largescale?

[@jerrymaxey782]

Air must be able to reach 1 ft in and throughout

[@andrewhague1521]

Can you tell me why you have to drill holes in the drainage pipes?

[@tonysu8860]

The idea is to introduce necessary air circulation into a "no turn" pile. Ordinarily hot compost piles need to be turned to introduce air into the center of the pile when an unturned pile has literally burned all the oxygen by aerobic bacteria. The Johnson-Su bioreactor is one design that attempts to avoid the hard manual work of turning by providing a way for fresh air to be introduced in the center of the pile.

[@andrewhague1521]

@@tonysu8860 Yes, but you remove the pipes don't you, so why the holes?

[@hansscholte5472]

@@andrewhague1521 the holes is just extra but not absolutely necessary

[@davidjohnson1910]

The pipes came with holes when we purchased them.

[@Veronica-nq9kr]

Where can I find the instructions to make this?

[@123476565656]

It's called the Johnson-Su Bioreactor. Here's the link to his video on it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/eqm4eJ5na5Z_r5o

[@richardmang2558]

The instructions I found are on the California State University Chico website. www.csuchico.edu/regenerativeagriculture/bioreactor/bioreactor-instructions.shtml , ironically the instructions are from New Mexico State University.

[@Liverpoolboy01]

B.s! Re health. Autoimmune system!

[@user-rq8vw6fy6s]

المواد اليش تخفوها مواد تخمير

[@evegrowing7749]

I have a feeling this J Su bin is just making leaf mold, humus, or “DUFF” (Detritus Under Forest Floor) any standard compost bin could easily make without all these added parts. IMO they should seek the heat to speed up the process. Once the “thermophilic phase” (I’ve gone five months with heat well over 130F) is over this biodiversity, or fungal dominate compost will come once the worm community is added. One week of heat, and over a year for completions IMO is unacceptable. They could be growing food with this compost within six months from activation of pile. Design your “CBCB” (Carbon Based Composting Bin/Bioreactor) in a way that’s easy to maintain the heat. Since these bins are carbon based there’s no turning rather fluffing the pile with a iron rod to rejuvenate the bins heat. The continued high heat softens the material, speeds up the process again making ready for the worm community that I feel is really getting this biodiversity we all seek. Good information here, but not a big fan of the bulky bin feeling it’s more of a contraption.

[@parmbirdhaliwal6311]

Hi Eve do you plan to try this on worm bins or for bucket gardeners some small system .

[@evegrowing7749]

@@parmbirdhaliwal6311 I’ve been working on CBCB for several years now. I’ve sustained very high continuous heat between 130F to 160F many months at a time.

[@123476565656]

They did a lot of testing on this to see the specific biodiversity in the pile over time. I don't remember what video it was in, but time does make a big difference based on the data that they got from their experiment. It could have all kinds of variations if you want, but based on their observations it wouldn't be quite as biodiverse, and therefore possibly not be as robust. If you have data from doing your own version of this I'd be highly interested in speeding up the process too!

[@evegrowing7749]

@@123476565656 Not having a paying university with many devoted volunteer students eager to learn at my disposal working on my hypotheses my data for now are my plants grown. I grow food with my particular CBCB technique six to eight months after activating my bins. It is my theory the positive biodiversity and fungal activity David is creating comes from the specific compost being used and the worm community that’s added after the fact which is key. There’s a reason David’s CBCB technique rarely if ever uses household compost only using outside carbon debris. Do you think David’s CBCB technique has more biodiversity than worm castings? Do you think he ever tested this thought, I think not. David does great work teaching about the need for biodiversity in soil, but feel his fungal making contraption that ultimately our tax dollars continue to pay for is a lot of nonsense, it doesn’t make sense to me. facebook.com/100018200612430/posts/725277638088917/

[@mordechaimordechai]

What? A bong hit transplant? 😂😂😂 thanks. Make america inate again

[@JohnSatire1]

He is a heretic.

[@matildawhittington7132]

Why so?

[@JohnSatire1]

@@matildawhittington7132 everything he is saying goes against current science. and he clearly has no understanding of autism in any way shape or form.

[@matildawhittington7132]

@@JohnSatire1 I got a bit curious about this theory. It's been tested and with some interesting results: journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0068322

[@garthwunsch]

I may have missed something, but isn’t he discussing agriculture practices, of which he’s a renowned world leader? I think your comment is misplaced... you must have been commenting on another video... or you’re a troll!