The Drydock - Episode 089

[@Drachinifel]

Pinned post for Q&A :)

[@llama718]

Hi Drach. In an completely bannanas world war two where Italy joins the allies, how would this affect the battle of Atlantic and Pacific theate?

[@Alexonthecommisar]

Hi Drach, if in the late 1930's Sweden, Norway and Denmark had formed an armed neutrality pact, could they have prevent the German invasion of Norway if not the invasion of Denmark? Thank you.

[@IO-hh2fz]

Hi Drach, here's a question for the drydock: if a (or multiple) tillman 4-2 BB('s) had somehow been built, how would their armament (specifically their AA) have looked like in 1945.

[@majesticloonproudctions9718]

Hi Drach. I remember in a previous Drydock you were asked that if you were transported back to WW2 or just prior how would you prepare the Royal Navy, one of things you said you would have the Royal Navy do would be construct Fleet Submarines. What would such a vessel look like in terms of design, characteristics and indended specifications, would we be looking at something akin to the Gato or Balao class of USN? Or perhaps something more akin to Amphion Class (I'm not sure what they qualified as) and where would you see there intended area of operations being? Given that a number of vessels are designed with a general area in mind at time i.e. HMS Ark Royal 1938 being designed for pacific operation. Also! Note from your video on the Balao class, I do believe it is pronounced "Baa Lay O" I'm basing that off how the characters in Down Periscope (1996) pronounce it so it may not be the best source, but hey its a source (shrugs)

[@jeffrey8847]

Dear Drachinifel During the Japanese attack on pearl harbor, why did the Japanese use level bomber instead of dive bombers to attack the second row of US battleships? If paralyzing the US battlefleet was the goal, the increased accuracy of dive bombers would have a higher chance to knockout their target. What is the reason for the choice of the level bomber by the Japanese?

[@tomriley5790]

One other point with respect to disguising ships - the luftwaffe used 2d photography whereas the RAF filmed and viewed its photos stereoscopically. This meant that when they atempted to lay out an outline of Tirpitz atempting to fool aerial photography it was quite clear to the RAF that it wasn't the real Tirpitz as it was flat (similar things enabled V1 launch sites to be spotted). I also remember reading about a german prisoner on HMS Ledbury (it was a while ago but I think he was an airman) being asked as they arrived in Valetta why they never attacked the submarines in the harbour. He replied "because we're not stupid, we know they are decoys and the real submarines are in pens cut into the rock." at which point the air raid sirens went off and the "decoys" submerged in the harbour :-)!

[@jonadabtheunsightly]

"... Let's face it, in an era of radar and missile systems, whether you paint it gray, dazzle, this, or whatever is not gonna make that much difference, so you might as well give anybody who is trying to visually spot you a minor seizure by putting a very very crazy, umm, cammo patterns on your ships." Bring on the lime green, day-glo magenta, and hunter orange. The color scheme that says, "We want you to KNOW that our navy is coming for you. Prepare to hear max-volume foghorns playing our national anthem in three different musical keys at once!"

[@deeznoots6241]

Jonadab the Unsightly One might as well add racing stripes to make them quicker

[@dropdead234]

So, Chaos Noise Marines got a Navy?

[@BountyFlamor]

@@deeznoots6241... or to make it more slavic.

[@empath69]

So a return to 'The Great White Fleet'? We don't use coal anymore so the paint won't need to get re-done in mid-tour...

[@adamcarriere4465]

"If you're going to Fight Clash!"

[@leops1984]

"Hopefully, I'm on the other side of the Atlantic Ocean." The intro didn't age all that well, unfortunately...

[@Drachinifel]

Unfortunately this episode was recorded in advance when I thought I'd be away :(

[@kyle857]

@@Drachinifel You will get here someday and we will be delighted to have you.

[@scottdrone-silvers5179]

Well he’s still on the other side of the Atlantic from us, so he isn’t really wrong, is he? 🎶 Someday our Drach will come... 🎶

[@bigblue6917]

In voice only.

[@richmcgee434]

@@bigblue6917 Human voice, even. :) I'm not the only one who kind of misses the old TTS vids, am I? Maybe I've just watched too much of the TTS Emperor stuff for my own good...

[@DanielWW2]

31:24. And that is how WoWS got stuck with: -Kremlin (Stronk Soviet engineering tovarish) -Smolensk (WTF, just WTF) -Vladivostok (no clue how 201.000shp is supposed to fit inside that hull, nor how the standard displacement can be anything less than 55.000t) -Lenin (arguably even worse than Vladivostok in terms of impossible) -Petropavlovsk (220mm guns that outperform German 380mm guns on a very questionable hull) -Tallinn (180mm guns in abysmal turrets that did not work well IRL) -Pyotr Bagration (WTF, again just WTF) That and the Ministry of Balance off course.

[@l7986]

Got balanced by a Smolensk the other night for the first time and I still feel dirty no matter how many showers I take.

[@kurumi394]

@@l7986 The only balancer to that thing is to take a Conqueror and shoot AP at it

[@lrw3984]

where's the other 4 hours you slacker?

[@darrellsmith4204]

I think we need to escalate this up to "English DefCon 1"- i.e., sending a note stating that we found this "somewhat disappointing"...

[@Fallobstwiesen]

The answer for the first question might be rather disappointing. An outdatet und mostly forgotten meanging of "zensiert" is "under the controll of". So I would assume that it just states the owner and its right to distribute the picture.

[@puckthebear]

It is a photograph of a military object and might have had to pass an official authority, stating that can be used by the public without revealing any military secrets. When you watch old British Movies you find a similar note and even a signature.

[@Sigeberht]

Yes, Hoffmann put 'Zensiert' on the front of the postcard, other contemporary German publishers would print 'militarily censored and approved for public circulation' or something along those lines on the back, in addition to the picture number.

[@arkadeepkundu4729]

9:26 The Italians & French are still at it today.The new joint French-Italian frigates, the Horizon class would be legitimately classed as destroyers by most navies. The German Sachsen class aren't that much smaller either.

[@AldanFerrox]

I mean, even most Corvettes today outclass WW2 destroyers in terms of speed, tonnage and weaponry.

[@arkadeepkundu4729]

@@AldanFerrox No. I mean modern destroyers. The new joint French-Italian frigates are 7000 tonnes in displacement with multiple 76.2mm cannons & 48 cell VLS systems. In any non-European navy it'd be classified a destroyer. But they call it a frigate, probably for political purposes. *Hon! Hon! Hon! Zis is not un destroyer mon cher, zis is only un frigaté enorme* Guess old habits die hard.

[@AtomicBabel]

Perhaps, just perhaps it has something to do with the MN's title for O5? Captain de Frigate?

[@williamchamberlain2263]

@@arkadeepkundu4729 no kidding; those things are enormous.

[@WildBillCox13]

Loved the Capitani Romani class. If they had rearmed them/her (Regolo) with the 12.8cmFlaK40 vom Doppelafette . . . 8x 5" DP traveling at 50mph; no waiting! It is evident in hindsight that trying to upgun DDs and DEs was a bad idea from the start. To paraphrase an old saw about military marriage: Large Ships MAY have Dual Purpose Main Battery guns*, but Small ships MUST have Dual Purpose Main Battery guns. *Sanshiki-dan en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Shiki_(anti-aircraft_shell)

[@hothoploink1509]

Is it possible that those cute sounding mines are occasionally typing furiously (searching for friends I presume) in the background of your livestreams? ^^

[@calvingreene90]

If you want to hide a ship in port put a roof over the dock and anchor the camouflaged ship a few miles away.

[@WildBillCox13]

Good 1 m8

[@bificommander7472]

Yeah, I was also thinking "what if we build 10 schanhorst-sized buildings" You can even move the ship's between spots and play a shell game. And like a shell game, the player might not notice that at some point you palmed the ball, ie send them out.

[@thewingedhussars459]

*B-17 misses and hits camouflaged ship on accident*

[@calvingreene90]

@@thewingedhussars459 Clearly you speak of things you lack knowledge of.

[@thewingedhussars459]

calvingreene90 "you're right, we wouldn't get so unlucky to actually get hit by a B-17, how ridiculous" -some poor Japanese sailor, probally (I'm not sure if your being sarcastic tbh, I assume so)

[@davidbrennan660]

Three cheers for Drach for another video to support our continued self isolation... Hip hurray, hip hurray, hip hurray!

[@ryangale3757]

1:06:46 Yeah, can't quite take Ilmarinen seriously there haha. "Yep, don't mind me, just another part of the scenery here, please ignore this ridiculously tall tree coming out of nowhere, it's perfectly normal...." Granted, from the air you wouldn't notice that as much but still.

[@TheParkerrrrrr6]

The hubris and irony of having a ship called the "Invincible" sure didnt help things

[@polygondwanaland8390]

And to give it no armor!

[@LiveErrors]

@@polygondwanaland8390 It had armor, cruiser armor, its a cruiser after all

[@diltzm]

USS Sheer Fucking Hubris

[@alecblunden8615]

It performed well in its intended role as a cruiser killer, and its successors in name showed that the boast was not in the least exaggerated.

[@ovk-ih1zp]

The USN GUPPY Refits were still competitive pretty much right up till USS Nautilus broke the "Rule Book", ran it thru a wood chipper & set it on fire. If you haven't read "Blind Man's Bluff", USN Submariners were doing Bat-$h!t insane, " Your Balls Are made out of Neutronium & are the size of Basketballs" missions with Diesel boats right up to the mid-60's or even a little later. The USN PREFERRED Diesel Boats for espionage & surveillance missions because they were quieter than the early Nuke Boats, which didn't get really quiet until the Skipjack's in the early 60's. I'm sure the RN ran a lot of similar missions with Diesel Boats as well. As for the book, all most all of the missions documented in it are actually still classified, & probably would have stayed that way forever, but the Journalists(Actual Journalist, in fact) got the details from the crews that ran them & the Navy decided that it was to much of a bother to crack down on anybody since the Cold War was "Over" anyway. But there are several missions detailed that I'm POSITIVE that ONI, NSA & the CIA really wish hadn't been leaked now.

[@1QU1CK1]

I worked with a guy who crewed a diesel boat that snuck into Vladivostok harbor in 1965. He said diesel boats are quieter than any "nukie boat". He also said, "Don't ask me how we got in... I'm serious, don't ask me."

[@ovk-ih1zp]

@@1QU1CK1 With all the "New" tech that has been developed to make the Nuke Boats quiet, I bet if the USN decided to build a modern version of a Type VII coastal boat it would be "Wet Your Pants Quiet" & scare the crap out of all the Surface Warfare guys.

[@Moredread25]

I look forward to having an opportunity to meet you when you do get to Boston. Once in a generation events make foolish the plans of mortals. Stay safe and well everyone; this too shall pass.

[@jayfelsberg1931]

The argument that the U-boat war would have benefited from "radio silence" has some merit based on German planning for operation Wacht am Rhine, where there was little reliable warning of the German offensive and initial shock to the Allies. The Kriegsmarine certainly knew the usual convoy routes and certainly knew where convoys were heading, and could have deployed accordingly. Instructions could be sent from France, the U-boats would simply not acknowledge those instructions and just use local communications as described. Interesting analysis.

[@johnshepherd8687]

A one way broadcast system like the US used would have been very effective possibly using a one time pad. Contrary to common belief Allied intelligence detected the German build up and issued warnings in late November and early December. The Germans were not ready in November and postponed the operation to early December only to postpone it again because weather conditions weren't right. At that point SHAEF G2 thought they were seeing ghosts. General Patton headed the first warning and ordered his staff to prepare a response plan. The scene in the movie where orders a plan to be drawn up in 48 hours was dramatic license. When the Germans attacked on the 16th he simply ordered the plan to be executed when told to counterattack.

[@jayfelsberg1931]

@@johnshepherd8687 I knew the Patton scenario but didn't know intelligence had pegged the German build-up that early and that it was apparently downplayed. I am aware that the Allies had a bit of "victory disease" (that should have ended after Market Garden and the Hurtgen fiasco), so isn't surprising that happened. Patton actions and Bruce Clarke's great fight at St. Vith were they keys to victory in the battle.

[@johnshepherd8687]

@@jayfelsberg1931 it's what the I&W community calls warning fatigue. Too many false calls leads to the crying wolf syndrome even if the false alarms were caused by the threats actions and not bad information. Warning is the toughest intelligence discipline to master and it takes a certain mindset to do it. You have to make the call with incomplete information and without knowing when time is up.

[@sarjim4381]

I also can't locate a picture right now, but I believe the USS _John S McCain_ got a temporary coat of white paint when she made a number of port visits in 2008 to commemorate the centennial of the original voyage of the the Great White Fleet.

[@GaldirEonai]

Finally, the triumphant return of Friendlymine!

[@bificommander7472]

"Let me hug you!" "No! Social distancing! Social disa-" *BOOM*

[@Tank50us]

@@bificommander7472 I wonder who actually voices the mine XD

[@GaldirEonai]

@@Tank50us My guess is Drach and a voice filter, but feel free to put that in as a Drydock question :D.

[@EradWir]

Someone said the mine is voiced by miss drach

[@edwardteach3000]

@@EradWir It is Mrs. Drach, he said so a little while ago when he reviewed/played a board game.

[@Kevin_Kennelly]

Drachisms of the Day 15:58 "At which point it's the Battle Of The Falklands all over again. Just slightly different." 40:49 "Give anybody that's trying to visually spot you a minor seizure."

[@NM-wd7kx]

I saw a Chelsea tractor with a dazzle camo paint job driving down the motorway, I couldn't tell if the resultant headache was from eye strain or rage at the stupidity.

[@AWMJoeyjoejoe]

@@NM-wd7kx that would be a prototype car. They use dazzle camouflage to hide the finer details of the design. I see it quite often in the Midlands near the jaguar and land rover factories

[@AWMJoeyjoejoe]

@@NM-wd7kx gizmodo.com/how-automakers-use-a-wwi-era-camo-technique-to-disguise-1647618861/amp

[@Kevin_Kennelly]

@@NM-wd7kx "I saw a Chelsea tractor with a dazzle camo paint job driving down the motorway". That sounds like a lyric from Yes's song 'Roundabout'.

[@NM-wd7kx]

@@AWMJoeyjoejoe holy shit, that's fascinating, and yes it was in the Midlands. I still maintain it's terrible idea to drive on a public road with a paint scheme designed to ruin depth perception

[@sarjim4381]

The _Le Fantasque_ class was a weird hybrid that was built to engage the Italian _Condottieri_ class light cruisers. They were much larger and more heavily armed while being about as fast as the French ships. _Le Fantasque_ 's only advantage was more torpedoes while having the speed to close with the Italian ships, none of whom could probably out run the French ships. Succeeding members of the _Condottieri_ class added a more reasonable tonnage of armor while still retaining their high speeds. They probably would have severely mauled any _Le Fantasque_ they ran across. In reality, there were only a little larger and not as well armed as a _Fletcher_ class destroyer that was capable of about same real speed. From what I've read, the move to reclassify them as light cruisers after their US refit was a combination of the USN not having ships in a similar class and a nod to Free French sensibilities, since no French cruisers survived to serve with the Free French, and listing them as destroyers would not have been politically expedient.

[@ifga16]

Didn't you do a piece about French buildings being disguised as pre-dreadnought battleships???

[@rutabagasteu]

When hotels went to sea.

[@falcorusticolus4360]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/b6rKiX-kh6agY6M

[@linnharamis1496]

My favorite statement in this video - “a large forest coming over the horizon.” - 😉😉😉😉👍. Thank you - good episode.

[@derzauberer8605]

Too be honest I think the answer to the first question about censorship is that the censored parts of the ships have the imperial german war flag or symbols associated with it on them (decorative at the time) but after 1948 it is not allowed by law to show those symbols/colors/flags in Germany. I think the pictures where from some german publication which then had to censor them before publishing, or they would get into some serious legal trouble.

[@ryangale3757]

In regards to "most unlucky class of ships with over 2 members", I think the New Orleans class of US heavy cruiser would probably take the award in the cruiser category, what with the whole '3 ships sunk in a single engagement, 1 ship gets into a street fight with a battleship and unsurprisingly doesn't come out looking too good, and 1 ship gets its whole front end blown off in another disastrous defeat" result. USS Tuscaloosa was pretty much the only ship in that class that didn't get the crap beat out of them in the course of their service, and its not like they were a bad class of ships either, they just almost all got into really bad situations.

[@jaredthehawk3870]

By that logic the Italian Zara class heavy cruisers were just as unlucky if not worse than the New Orleans. Remember there were 7 New Orleans built but only 4 Zaras. 3 were lost at Cape Matapan and the last was severely damaged in dock and scrapped after the war. The same goes for the Russian Borodino class pre dreadnaughts.

[@ryangale3757]

@@jaredthehawk3870 That's pretty fair, had forgotten about them. The Borodinos I did think of, but was looking specifically at cruisers, so wasn't counting them.

[@bjturon]

On the size of cruisers verse destroyers, in the David Weber space opera “On Basilisk Station” its made clear that Commander Honor Harrington’s new ship, the elderly light cruiser HMS Fearless, is not much bigger than her previous command, which was a modern destroyer. On US casualties from an invasion of Japan, there are several good books on the end of the war; including: one entitled “Hell to Pay: Operation Downfall and the Invasion of Japan” by D. M. Giangreco and “Downfall: The End of the Imperial Japanese Empire” by Richard B Frank, and “Retribution: The Battle for Japan” by Max Hastings. All make it quite clear that Allied casualties would have been very high, and Japan could have succeeded in a Italian Campaign/Korean War like outcome, bogging down the Allied forces, inflicting so much death and destruction to force the US to the negotiating table for favorable terms. The cost to Japan, would have been in the millions, especially from starvation, which was only very narrowly adverted by massive US food aide in the spring of 1946. Outside of Japan, of course the Soviet invasion, the war in China, British invasion of Malaya, and other fights across the Asia Pacific would have added to the death toll of both combatants and civilians. Fortunately - unlike Nazi Germany or the American Confederacy - Japan surrendered before total collapse. And that was a very close call, given the almost successful coup d'etat of army officers who wanted to fight to the bitter end.

[@johnfisher9692]

Thanks Drach A more normal length Drydock compared to last weeks marathon. Barely in dock long enough for a new coat of paint compared to the previous session where I got a full overhaul. :) Yes the Invincible class got a bad reputation because of Jutland but when used for their designed purpose they were excellent ships. The Germans had the advantage of building their ships several years after the British one's, so if they weren't better, something is wrong with their designers.

[@phluphie]

Only an hour and 12min? Actually Drach, after last week, I'm surprised there is a Drydock this week. Thanks.

[@davefranklin7305]

I think I disagree a little WRT the sub question. First, agree with the crew qual assessment. Second, I'm discounting the torps, and just talking about the boats. IMO, US fleet boat (FB) vs. Type VII is apples & oranges. TVII was optimized for Atlantic, and would also be better in the Med (see how the big RN boats did vs. the latter smaller boats). However, FB vs. TIX is more apples to apples, since the TIXs were for longer range patrols. IMO the FB is much better, especially when you get to the Tambor class and beyond. Having been through both U-505 at Chicago and USS Bowfin at Pearl, the habitability difference is astounding. The only advantage the TIX has is diving depth. Just my $0.02...

[@TraditionalAnglican]

Dave Franklin - You forgot diving speed. Most TIX’s could dive in 40 seconds (TVII’s were required to dive in

[@davefranklin7305]

@@TraditionalAnglican Actually, mods were made to the boats that facilitated them getting comparable dive times.

[@TraditionalAnglican]

Dave Franklin - I understand the best a Gato did was 45 seconds, while a couple of skinny TIX’s got it down to 30 seconds, & a few TVI’s managed 20 seconds. I just wonder how you’d get the thing under in 20 seconds without leaving someone outside the boat! 😱😂🤷🏼‍♂️ But, both of the Germans were more maneuverable once submerged, and some subtypes of both U-boats had incredible dive capabilities. British depth charges were limited to 540’ until the Brits discovered German U-boats could dive much deeper. The Germans called diving deeper than the deepest settings on British depth charges “going to the storm cellar”. www.quora.com/Whats-the-deepest-confirmed-dive-by-a-German-U-boat-during-WWII forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=89766 uboat.net/forums/read.php?3,28019,28046 war.wikia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Atlantic_(1939-1945) No American submarine could even come close - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balao-class_submarine The Germans did have one thing we still haven’t installed on our submarines, a bicycle seat a U-boat commander could sit in while looking through the periscope. But, habitability on American subs was much better than U-boats. That’s been commented on by many surviving U-boat crew members whose U-boats went into the tropics (ours had A/C) or the Arctic (U-boats had no heat, except to de-ice valves, until 1941/2, while ours had heat for the crews).

[@TraditionalAnglican]

Yar Nunya - The Brits were orders of magnitude better at Anti-Submarine Warfare than the Japanese who, by any standard, were terrible at it, & the German U-boats were better set up for a war on commerce & for dealing with ASW than the American subs were. While heaters may have not been needed until the Americans got into the waters around northern Japan & off the north coast of Korea, the fact the Gatos & Balaos had them indicates the Americans considered crew comfort when designing these boats.

[@RonJohn63]

45:02 Wouldn't allied fighters be running sweeps over the island itself?

[@Drachinifel]

They were already doing that during Okinawa, didn't stop the kamikazes, Japan is too large for even the Allied fleet to fully suppress at landing stage.

[@bigblue6917]

The British did hide its submarines in Malta during WW2 by simply submerging them in the harbour during daylight hours and then bringing them back to the surface after dark. They were tied up to the harbour wall during the night and would submerge in the same spot during daylight.

[@thatsme9875]

Hi Big Blue, I have read elsewhere that the Allies had a lot of success against Italian submarines because the waters of the Mediterranean are clear and subs at depth could be seen from aircraft. is that a furphy or not? it seems to conflict with your story about the British hiding subs by submerging them in Valletta harbour during the day. I mean no disrespect, and would be interested in your thoughts/comments?

[@sarjim4381]

Looks like there's another patch of white-out toward the stern on that vessel as well. Maybe another casemate?

[@aurictech4378]

Last time I was this early, USS St. Louis was still building up enough steam to get underway during the attack on Pearl Harbor.

[@toddwebb7521]

I guess torpedo rams become a thing if armor wins the guns vs armor race. Insert hms thunderchilde joke here

[@WildBillCox13]

"Donitz to all U-Boote: Do Not Reply." That might've helped a bit. Just repeat the land broadcasts without requiring boats at sea to answer. That would put paid to Huff/Duff on the spot. A U-Boat transmitting when at sea is giving up its only protection: stealth. IMHO, Hubris and Germanic system worship, along with sloppy Enigma operator technique, killed the U-Waffe. Johnny Walker certainly helped, as did Hedy Lamarr (though she received little-if any-credit).

[@WildBillCox13]

That Condor idea is pretty good.

[@CharlesStearman]

I would imagine the German headquarters would have relied a lot on convoy sighting reports from U-boats in order to build up a picture of Allied dispositions and allow them to co-ordinate attacks by multiple submarines. Without these they would have little useful information to transmit. Before the war it was believed to be technically impossible to obtain radio bearings on transmissions made in the High Frequency band (because of the way the signals were reflected by the ionosphere), which is why the U-boats used it, and the British invention of 'Huffduff' (High Frequency Direction Finding) was kept secret.

[@ShadrachVS1]

"IT'S HEDLEY!!!" This joke makes so much more sense now.

[@DavidConnor]

Radio silence is golden.

[@craigplatel813]

The problem with that is the German sub command didn't know where a convoy was until it was reported by a sub finding it. That would be detected by hf/df and the convoy rerouted, and a ship or aircraft sent to force down the sub. Ad large as convoys seem to be they are very small compared to the Atlantic. Rerouting worked very well to avoid U-boats, even when in a scouting line.

[@LukesYuGiOhChannel]

Tirpitz disguised itself as residential housing or something like that if I remember correctly.

[@1QU1CK1]

As regards the invasion of Japan, my uncle was a Kamikaze pilot at the end of the war. They trained with a broom stick and fake rudder pedals, their first flight would also be their last. When the Emperor gave his famous surrender speech the crazy Major in charge ordered everyone into their airplanes, told them to head for Tokyo bay to kill American ships. My uncle flew home instead. Of course he crashed, they never taught them how to land!

[@jayfelsberg1931]

1. Did the K-burg have to crank its mast to get under the bridge over the Kiel Canal? 2. The Thais have effectively used the small aircraft carrier as a royal yacht

[@yclepe]

perhaps the word censored may be more in the sense of"OKed by the censors"? or sent to the censors and passed or something like that?

[@watcherzero5256]

They may have been censoring the casemate turrets so potential enemies wouldn't be seeing their secondary weapon loadout.

[@verysurvival]

Exactly. It means that the photo is cleared and can be published. Not that they have edited it

[@admiraltiberius1989]

Fantastic video as always Drach. Thank you for answering my question, we can dream huh. Interesting question about the destroyer/cruiser, apparently in the Battle of Samar, the Japanese didn't have proper recognition tables for the escort carriers and destroyer escorts. So they automatically assumed the Destroyers to be cruisers and the DEs to be destroyers. I've read that more then once but I'm unsure how true it is. I now have the imagine of Von Spee's Squadron approaching the German coast, smoke and sparks pouring from overtaxed engines as the stokers shovel every last brick of coal into the engines. The British are closing the distance though, the Battlecruisers can smell blood. Then from the South comes a long column of new smoke, the German fleet is pouring on speed to match the effort given by Von Spees men. How that clash would go...well we can wonder. Lastly, from what I've read the USN Navy was prepared to equip upwards of half its available carriers with fighters only. That way they could maximize the amount of fighters available for sweeps and defense. They were also working with the RN to get more SeaFires to the theater because it was such a fantastic high altitude interceptor. Plus the BearCat could have been pushed into service early had there been a need.

[@mattblom3990]

I think this was way pre-recorded...Drach couldn't travel right now.

[@Tuning3434]

@@mattblom3990 That would make sense, as Drach would have pre-recorded some material before he would leave.

[@admiraltiberius1989]

Of course......duh....I'll edit my comment, thank you gentlemen.

[@mattblom3990]

@@admiraltiberius1989 No worries, you've been around forever here.

[@admiraltiberius1989]

@@mattblom3990 I think I came in around the 20 to 30,000 subscribers mark. And that was some time ago come to think of it.

[@mdhofstee]

A note on Downfall. I did some research on this as my grandfather served on LSTs during the war. I never got a chance to meet him but I will in the future. In any case futures aside one thing I did find out is Nimitz and company were very concerned over this invasion. The general idea that I read was the idea of loading LSTs and other invasion craft with as much 40mm and other anti aircraft weaponry as possible. The plan would be to start a fake invasion and try to get the Japanese fleet and aircraft to attack them. The end result would be a huge battle. A key secret that was not talked a lot about was the fact that squadrons of bombers were being outfitted with radar to help in the aircraft detection over Kyushu as the island has been noted to be mountainous. The key thing in this that the Japanese had the suicide boats that were discovered after the war and that would have made even the fake attack dangerous. In the end the the actual invasion would have been relatively safe provided the Japanese would launch a full scale attack on the fleet. If they waited until confirmed landing craft were landing troops then it would be a bloodbath.

[@MartinCHorowitz]

On the submarine comparison late war US subs had superior Radar and FM Sonar. The Sonar enabled subs to evade mines. The US subs near the end of the war were more reliable.

[@stewartellinson8846]

The Advent of the Graf Zeppelin would have mainly benefitted the kreigsmarine through the development of expertise in airborne anti-ship operations. The Luftwaffe's attacks on Scapa Flow wereat least partly hampered by their lack of training in that type of operations and the assumption might be that an operational Graf Zeppelin would change this.

[@DeerHunter308]

Do you ever consider culling some of your questions from Patreons so that some of the more rediculous questions are deleted ? Like or similar to: "What if the Bismark had 32X8 inch guns ?'" and the like?

[@briancox2721]

German lookout if the RN disguised Hood as a forest island, " Scheisse! The limeys sent Robin Hood and his entire forest to find us!"

[@adamtruong1759]

Wait, wouldn't Macbeth be more appropriate for this joke?

[@MartinCHorowitz]

I am looking forward to a special on the Arboretum class of tree covered ships of British Navy. Like the floating Island in Dr Dolittle :)

[@rtello45]

Started watching Dr Clarke after your endorsement in this video. Thanks for more voluminous hours to devour. Love the videos. PS - Your production is better ;)

[@craigpalmer9196]

HF-DF radio direction finding, simple tell the boats to shut up. orders still go out etc.

[@DavidConnor]

Wolfpack boats were required to report convoys, prior to attacking, to assemble the pack. Better to close in, fire torpedoes, report whilst torps are in the water and evade. Wolfpack teammates could home in on the reporting boat's grid location. A Convoy cannot change course or distance quick enough to evade a portion of the encroaching pack. HF-DF alerted escorts of U-boats, on a bearing, before the attack. Radio silence is golden.

[@SkywalkerWroc]

"By the time you're listening to this, hopefully, I'm on the other side of Atlantic Ocean" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH .... 😭

[@willrogers3793]

58:15 “Fine, then! I’ll make my own battlecruisers, with bla-...uh, I mean, belt armor and turtlebacks!”

[@glennricafrente58]

Whoa, way too brief a section on state yachts. More details, please! Names, specs, service histories, which one could beat all the others in a one-on-one fight ....

[@Depipro]

Close to the end of this episode, I can suddenly imagine a steampunk version of HMS Hood, featuring a gigantic lever for the captain, with which he can toggle between "HMS Hood" and "HMS Wood", involving the opening of all kinds of grotesque hatches, out of which an abundance of trees and bushes emerges. The key word obviously being "imagine". :)

[@UnintentionalSubmarine]

29:30 Don't forget you promised me to deliver a critique of the Soviet Project 21 battleship. And I feel it falls into this group. Anyway, I would be perfectly fine with it as part of a special or something like that, no need for it's own 5 Minute Guide. That design grinds my gears badly.

[@roelantverhoeven371]

talking about state yachts, would you be willing to do an episode on Belgian fast minelayer Artevelde? she also doubled as gunboat and royal yacht. and she was pressed into kriegsmarine service as K4 Lorelei... she's an interesting design

[@thatsme9875]

towards the end of WWll, when the IJN was on the retreat and had little air cover, some of the smaller IJN vessels, would spend the daylight hours hiding under overhanging foliage in mangrove swamps and up narrow creeks. there was even an Australian Army training publication which told the reader how to identify suitable areas where the IJN might be hiding landing craft and smaller vessels.

[@goodman4966]

happy easter to you all

[@lycossurfer8851]

After last weeks episode, this feels like your old 5 min guide. :-)

[@Baby_Valentine]

French Pre-Dreadnaughts were just way ahead of their time, disguising themselves as hotel blocks.

[@Cbabilon675]

I would love to see what a refitted HMS Hood would have looked like sometime in the future. Happy Easter to all.

[@adamwright9517]

The Konigsberg's funnels were darker too, I think.

[@misterjag]

On the Konigsberg, the fire control system and the bow turret have been censored.

[@rudolfpeterudo3100]

Also for any vessel that carries guns or weaponary is deemed to be a warship and as such does not need to pay port dues or require the service of a pilot.

[@Thunderous117]

I can’t tell if the Victorian paint scheme makes the type 45 look more or less like it got caught mucking about and was forced to wear a dunce cap

[@jkausti6737]

About the Finnish navy vs Kriegsmarine quation, you seem to forget the Finnish heavy coastal batteries. This because the only place that would take place would be near the Finnish coast, where the two Finnish coastal defense ships were intended to be used. Ilmarinen and Väinämöinen were meant to be used in tandem with the land (island) based coastal artillery.

[@Drachinifel]

I factored them in, but also had to factor in the Luftwaffe, and foxed emplacements are much easier targets than moving ships.

[@jkausti6737]

@@Drachinifel True. Though that again brings up the question when this supposed conflict would take place. In early 1940 the Luftwaffe would be limited to bases in Germany and occupied Poland some 600 km from Finnish coast, in September 1941 they would have gained access to bases in Estonia which would have made the Luftwaffe a totally different matter.

[@Drachinifel]

@@jkausti6737 very true, hence in my answer in the video it would vary hugely as to who would win almost on a monthly basis as other issues strengthened or weakened the available German forces

[@hatman4818]

1:02:30 Not warships, but I do remember one story. I think it was during the PQ-17 disaster, a few straggler cargo ships managed to escape the germans, and decided to hole up by arctic ice. One of the captains had the brilliant idea of using some of the massive amounts of white paint in the cargo hold to disguise the ship as ice, and then roll out some of the sherman tanks on deck to turn the cargo ships into a makeshift battleship in case the Kriegsmarine found them.

[@bkjeong4302]

Re: disguising ships, while it wasn't an anti-bombing measure, possibly the craziest example (and perhaps the most pointless example, due to it being used on ships that were obsolete on launch) has to be the secrecy around the Yamatos, to the extent we still don't know quite everything today.

[@Lazarus7000]

I think, and hope, that as technology improves and all military vehicles move towards active camouflage techniques, (that is, say, the entire outside surface being made up of display monitors) we will see the ability to return to peacetime paint schemes at the push of a button.

[@halorulez786]

Ooff. Don't know how I feel about this 1 hour episode after that 5+ hour monster last week..... Im just jk amazing video as usual!

[@aaaronmiller100]

Could they have removed some indications of damage that may have been the result of an unlucky crewman prior to sailing? It looks like smoke stains to me..

[@ifga16]

The Russians disguised a ship as a group of buildings. I believe it was one of the Gangut class ships. There are photos out on the net, but I cannot find them at this moment. The Gangut was near Leningrad so I think that it is the one.

[@brianreddeman951]

I didn't hear mention that you need a full crew trained in carrier operations which without you might as just have a ship with no planes. :)

[@carlcarlton764]

Graf Spee making it home? Here is my take. Once his task force reaches the North Atlantic he dissolves it. The small cruisers and several captured and now armed merchant ships go merchant raiding inside the trans Atlantic SLOC. While all this fun and games happens S&G try to be inconspicuous and make it through the Denmark Strait.

[@bengrogan9710]

A Question on fleet speeds and fuel use - You've mentioned several times that different ships have substantially different fuel use at their optimum Ferry speeds What vessels determined a standard rate? Where destroyers and fast ferry craft optimized for in the fleet speed due to lower fuel reserves on the vessels, with Heavier ships being forced to burn the boilers harder or Where Capital ships prioritized as, in theory, smaller ships would be more easily refueled when underway?

[@robschoenbaum2593]

Hi I'd like to see an episode about Capt.Hugh Mulzac, the only African-American captain of an US Navy warship, a Liberty ship, in WW2. I had the privilege to meet him when I was a child and he an old man. His autobiography, "A Star to Steer By," chronicles his lone battle against a u-boat, a contest that circumnavigated the globe and ended when Capt. Mulzac brought his ship safely to harbor in England At the time I met him the late 1960's, he was still battling the aftermath of Joseph McCarthy's anti-communist nonsense. McCarthy, who died a discredited drunk, was not merely a liar, sociopath, narcissist, but a bigot too. Among his targets was Capt. Mulzac who he labeled a communist and, for a time, had his US Navy pension removed. I would love to hear more about him and his adventures, both against the Germans and the bigots in the US military.

[@darrellsmith4204]

33:00- What in the name of all things sacred and holy was that ?!?

[@andyjim1734]

Friendly mines. Watch his Operation Cerberus for context.

[@AtomicBabel]

A kind of Easter egg

[@JohnE9999]

She's adorable!

[@tomhsia4354]

Gotta love those mines! BOOM!

[@desert_jin6281]

Explosive hugs !

[@Tepid24]

47:04 Mash casualty events Like what happened in Ireland?

[@watcherzero5256]

The Graf Zeppelin might have had some utility in supporting Barbarossa and particularly the assault on Leningrad, if it could get out and back before the British could put together and launch an interception force.

[@stevehomeier8368]

In the Cruisers v Destroyers segment; what 3 ships are being shown?

[@MS-gr2nv]

Whole episode without shitting on USN, well done!

[@andrewszigeti2174]

Wait, is it Drydock time again? I just finished watching the last one yesterday?

[@RedXlV]

With regard to disguising ships in port, it would seem like the obvious way to handle the fact that the enemy already knows what your port looks like would be to also use decoys. Something the Royal Navy was already doing to some effect with the demilitarized training ship Iron Duke (nearly identical in hull dimensions to an Revenge-class battleship) and a pair of merchant ships with wood and canvas fake superstructures.

[@Ulrich.Bierwisch]

Censored German photo: I'm sure you needed a permission to publish pictures of military equipment at that time. So if someone took a picture of the ship and he wanted to print and sell the picture, he needed to get it censored. This doesn't mean something was changed. Censorship was official law in Germany before WWI. Actually, we had something like this in Germany during the cold war. It was called "Luftbildfreigabe". If you wanted to publish pictures you took from a plane, you needed an aerial picture permission. Is was checked if something of military importance could be seen in the picture.

[@dzejrid]

Another drydock? Jesus Christ I haven't finished watching the previous one yet!

[@williamstall4420]

Great vid as usual but I gotta ask... What the heck is a DIDO anyway? Why name a ship that? Also, my uncle joined the Navy in 1938, one afternoon the warning that the battleship Arizona he had joined after completing radioman school was going to have gunnery practice didn't reach him. Stepping out onto the main deck for a smoke (the deck was supposed to be cleared of course) he was looking forward and didn't notice the Y turret turning until the 14" barrels were almost directly above him. When he woke up in sickbay from being concussed from the discharge of two 14" guns above him, he was a bit deafened for the rest of his life and his days as a radioman was over. But he transferred over to Quartermaster and therefore spent all of WW II on the bridge of the ship he was on at the time. As such, he was one of the few eyewitnesses when the famous -infamous? "Where, repeat where, is Task Force 34. The world wonders." was handed, (very, very hesitantly by the radioman) to Adm. Halsey. As he told me later it was the first time he'd ever seen a man go white with anger. Balling the message up Halsey threw it to the deck, cussed for a solid minute and left his command bridge. Curious, my uncle picked up the message, un-balled it, read it and put it in his pocket. According to my uncle he kept the message and then misplaced it during on of the many moves he and my aunt made during his 27 years in the navy. Do you have any idea what happened to the message? Was my uncle telling a sea story or was it possible he did have it? BTW, as usual the crew gave their own rating of what happened and the verdict of the crew on the Battle of Leyte Gulf was, "The Old Man F'ed up."

[@joshthomas-moore2656]

33:05 sad mine is sad poor mine don't worry Scharnhorst we be around soon

[@kurumi394]

Yamato Musashi Shinano The three of them took up like 4% of the Japanese GDP of the time and then all three did nothing and sank spectacularly

[@GaldirEonai]

For the the armor vs guns question...so basically you'd get Warhammer 40k space combat :P.

[@jrd33]

In the Battle of Tsushima, practically none of the Japanese shells of any caliber managed to penetrate the Russian battleships' main armour. The Japanese still won decisively, apparently mostly using HE shells. With the quick-firing 6" guns, a Japanese battleship like the Mikasa is firing far more 6" shells than 12" shells once the smaller guns are in effective range (a broadside of 7 6" guns at maybe 4 RPM compared to 4 12" guns at 1 RPM).

[@paulwillson8887]

Graf Zeppilin in1940 big problem is German naval aviation would be learning how to operate the aircraft off carriers . They would be where RN, USN were in the 1920s. And that is if Goering would share aircraft .

[@TraditionalAnglican]

Paul Willson - And that’s if you could actually land an BF-109 on a carrier without crashing.

[@VersusARCH]

1:11:25 Funny thing in the Japanese kamikaze night attack on Ulithi anchorage that saw the USS Randolph hit with hundreds of casualties of the two airplanes involved the other one managed to mistake access road and a tower on an island for a ship and crash into it.

[@gkett1609]

a follow up question on your Mark 14 torpedo. first the observation. Germany, Britain and the US all tried to (and failed) to start the war with a magnetically armed torpedo. i have not seen anything about France, Italy or Russia. Japan entered the war with the best torpedo bar none. why? what was special about the Japanese methodology in early development of the Long Lance torpedo?

[@garfieldfarkle]

I need another week to get to the end of Episode 88........

[@strawberrydragon1]

22:34 im not sure if the german navy could even use carriers properly like the british, americans, or japanese

[@WildBillCox13]

Unluckiest class? Zara.

[@WildBillCox13]

Followed by the Clemson

[@WildBillCox13]

The Alaskas had a SIngle Rudder. Total Fail. Why do I think so? A ship meant to hunt down cruisers was unable to maneuver at speed OR slow. More Baltimores (et al) would've done the job cheaper (no need for the 12" gun). Imagine any Axis capital ship being swarmed by four or five Baltimore class heavy cruisers. "Once we catch you in our sights it's: Boom Boom! Out go the lights!"

[@bkjeong4302]

@@WildBillCox13 There's also the fact that they were big-gun combatants built after such ships were obsolete....

[@WildBillCox13]

@@bkjeong4302 Agreed. A transition from all gun to mixed gun and missile armament on new built ships (and conversions) would soon leave them a pointless expense.

[@bkjeong4302]

@@WildBillCox13 Why were the Alaskas not cancelled? Or the Iowas for that matter.

[@peterides9568]

We'd love to have you down under to look at Vampire and Onslow at the National Maritime Museum in Sydney, once the pandemic is in hand.

[@WildBillCox13]

All national ships carried saluting guns for entering port or honoring equals.

[@koini11]

Re the paint schemes. Is it still actually worth sticking to the flat grey? I can see why it was worth doing before you could spot your enemy beyond visual range but are ships now just painted that way because that is what we expect them to look like rather than having a practical purpose?

[@ShadrachVS1]

Understand this is for the US Navy... once something becomes a tradition it takes an Act of God and Congress to get them to change it. I would imagine there are all sorts of strange to us traditions in most Navy's that are more than 80 years old.

[@EradWir]

Not an expert but optical recon via satellites is a possibility so the Grey hides the color pretty well especially if und cloud cover or fog.

[@gokbay3057]

Some Destroyer Leaders are also sometimes considered Light Cruisers

[@kopfauftischhau216]

Well, technically the channel is part of the Atlantic, meaning that you are in fact on the other side of the Atlantic (when looking at you from mainland Europe) :)

[@davidhegstrom3580]

Regarding the Finnish Navy what about the two Deutschland class pre dreadnought were they still around or the Admiral Scheer and Lutzow we still in commission would they have tipped the balance?

[@pwmiles56]

00:34 You might have mentioned it is the 1905 Koenigsberg, a famous ship whose career in East Africa is referenced in the postcard. "Zensiert" means merely it passed the censors. The rest is fanciful