Dragon Ball Super Is Actually REALLY BAD…

[@DBZimran]

What are your honest feelings about Dragon Ball Super? Also watch the video before commenting. -_-

[@shadowofthenorthstar989]

it sucked

[@dytgyfgyffuh243]

It not that bad

[@wesleywilliams3846]

It's bad

[@michaeltsholwana5640]

It has several problems, but I still enjoyed it regardless

[@queshabesha]

I tried to watch super and I couldn't,so I just watch gt,z,and Kai

[@Sage2310]

Ironically Gt feels like a better spiritual succesor of Dragon ball z than super ever was, i remember when people used to crap on gt all the time😂

[@Maxjuliann]

Super isn't a successor its made to fill in the time skip after buu before the end of z . Gt was directly after Z because Goku has his blue gi 😊

[@ShikiRyougi05]

Ya'll have such rose colored glasses on lol, GT doesn't even feel like dragon ball for the first half and has some of the worst stories i've ever watched. While DBS is kinda ass in it's own right it is by FAR a better and more fitting successor to DBZ.

[@Sage2310]

@@ShikiRyougi05But you gotta agree, GT's ending was peak

[@ShikiRyougi05]

@Sage2310 oh absolutely. It's a masterpiece. HOWEVER the ending essentially has nothing to do with the series at all. You can just watch it directly after DBZ and you'd have a similar experience.

[@Sage2310]

@@ShikiRyougi05 Yeah I agree, the thing I hate about super is goku's character regression more than anything else, hell he seems dumber than kid goku and less charming,also super massacred my Goats Future trunks and Gohan😔

[@Cassiochory99]

DBZimran, Dragon Ball Super is for the kids, simple and basic, easy to digest, as you said: comercial interest. It's not bad, as adults we have different expectations for the things we hold dear to us. The show is being catered for a younger demographic.

[@kagelynx]

Super is a proud lazy cash cow. GT tried to tell a good story, but it was bad despite a number of great ideas for villains and transformations.

[@blackfrieza1912]

@kagelynx, so basically gt isn't bad than considering the great story, villains and transformation

[@teezy786]

The only bad thing about GT was the Black Star Dragon Saga being so slow paced. Beyond that it was good. The Super 17 arc wasn't long enough that it being bad was that much of an issue. Baby and the Shadow Dragons were really good.

[@daizenmarcurio]

GT couldve had a better story than even DBZ if it had more episodes that expanded everything that was there and gave others things to do. Everything GT had was perfect, it was just executed horribly

[@teezy786]

@@daizenmarcurio I don't disagree with that. The Black Star Saga had good moments but it was too long. The Baby Saga was pretty close to perfect for me so I wouldn't change anything about it. The Super 17 Saga was quite literally just okay, could use some work, and had 18 actually being useful in the fight. The Shadow Dragon Saga was good and I loved how it finally gave consequences to them using the Dragon Balls to solve all their problems and circumvent death every time. On the other characters having things to do it's basically the same in Z and the original too. Besides the tournaments, Saiyan Saga, , Picollo in the Android Saga, Goku in the Cell Games, Goten and Trunks in the Buu Saga and Gohan in the Buu Saga it was still very much the Goku and Vegeta show. Besides Gohan beating Cell it's still Goku beating the bad guys.

[@dankuya]

​@@teezy786The Baby saga easily clears the entirety of Super

[@delix787]

Frieza is a perfect example of character assassination!! He's a comedy relief character now.

[@Ash_Wen-li]

This I actually kinda disagree with. He was turned into a joke once Trunks arrived. At least now he trains and can become a credible threat again. imo Freiza is one of the few characters Super actually did justice too

[@delix787]

@@Ash_Wen-li the idea of freiza teaming up with his hatred of Goku is very bizarre. Not every villain needs a redemption to just be with the main character. It feels wrong.

[@shaileshmishra5503]

​​@@delix787 Bro even Aizen team up with Ichigo Becoz he can't let Yhwach take Decision in his life.. Same with Frieze as well the only reason he team up with Goku Becoz he didn't want Universe 7 to be Erased if it's Erased Frieza will be Erased as well And we all know the only thing Frieza wants to rule the Universe 7 and want's to gain some Height that's all he wants But Still I will say it's doesn't makes sense why he left Goku Alive after Frieza defeat Gas in Manga he have golden opportunitys to Finish Goku and Vegeta once and for all but meh

[@mastertucker]

Not even. Frieza in all the non canon media post Z was a joke. It was literally a gag (an incorrect gag) that he showed up just to be one shot by characters who shouldn't have been able to. What you're referring here to is the one time joke that he wanted to use the Dragon Balls for a petty reason for Broly - which yes is comedic but it still caused the entire threat of the movie. Beyond that his return and use in the ToP was purely uncomedic, and his one gag was immediately followed by serious plot with Black Frieza. You're exaggerating a one time gag that was actually a good comedy bit that ensures our villain stays petty and unlikeable as he should be. That's peak Toriyama Also he wasn't even redeemed, that's what makes it even better. It's nothing short of genius that Toriyama could have made Frieza go through this arc and remain entirely unredeemed.

[@mastertucker]

@@shaileshmishra5503 It makes sense. Goku did that to him, it's literally him trying to humiliate Goku and Vegeta the way Goku did him on Namek. Frieza sees beating someone's ass and letting them live as disrespect so of course he'd try to enact it back.

[@adamquenano8563]

It’s not just bad, it’s super disappointing

[@Jbadman]

Both

[@adamquenano8563]

@ Double Trouble

[@micah459]

It's actually bad

[@2oo_Gnarly]

I see what you did there😂

[@cuju7865]

Pun…

[@gremmythoumeaux2393]

The consequence of making a selfish wish in the Tournament of Power and having the winning Universe erased for it is only present in the anime and there is no mention of it at all. I imagine it’s because when the TOP arc starts in the manga, the 2 Zenos are seen discussing about wanting to eliminate 8 universes because there are too many to look over, meaning these are actions they wanted to genuinely commit. When 17 wishes tehe erased Universe back, he seemingly does it out of spite for the gods and remarks he “Didn’t want them to have their way.”

[@NinthShinigami]

Across the 80-90 different anime and manga I’ve watched or read, Dragon Ball Super is among my least favorite and I would rank it I the low 90’s or 80’s. Besides Broly, and on some days Superhero, I think the series is just a lazily written rehash of so much of what worked for Dragon Ball, with half the effort in the story and characters, or none at all. The only way the characters get stronger is thru transformation, and afterwards, another transformation. Nothing in the series really feels very earned or as satisfyingly written when Toriyama did it in OG and Z. I give it a 5/10 maybe even a 4.5 on some days

[@daizenmarcurio]

I think DBS should continue as movies at this point tbh

[@treymykel]

Honestly GT was never a letdown It did what you need to do it was a follow up sequel that finished up the story of Goku and gave for defending ending to the franchise Super is nothing but a lazy cash cow

[@Insider887]

I really hate how DBS turned Goku into an idiot, I know that he was never a Brainiac but he was never an idiot either, he was smart in his own way and the way they made Goku more mature and heroic in DBZ was a really nice way to show how much he has grown and developed not only as a fighter but also as a person since he first left Mount Paozu with Bulma. What they did to Gothan was even worse, he went from being Goku’s heir and the future defender of Earth to an absolute Joke. It is true that he doesn’t have the same passion for battle that his father had but for him it was never about fighting because he wanted to fight, it was about fighting because he had to fight. Even if times were peaceful he would still have kept training not because he wanted a fight but because he should know that he needs to be prepared for a fight. Exploring the struggles of a human-saiyan hybrid could be really interesting.

[@Ash_Wen-li]

A lot of people will make the excuse "he was always like that" but that's not true. He was initially pretty ignorant of most of the world before he travelled with Bulma but he stopped being dumb somewhere around mid Dragonball. He still had a jovial attitude and acted silly sometimes but never at the expense of his intelligence

[@joseurbina3835]

@@Insider887 Goku being an Idiot in Super huh, why don't you say the same with GT Goku who couldn't figure out how to beat Super 17 when he can absorb Energy while SSJ4 Goku kept Ki Blast Spamming him because of it's Clunky Animation.

[@amoh2513]

@@joseurbina3835 And no one praises GT Goku for that my friend. GT is already hated as it is and it isn't even canon. For a story that is supposed to be a "canon" successor to Z, Super has shit tier writing as it boggled down the MC to a bumbling idiot, made the side characters non-existent, made the villains one-dimensional, ruined the endings of 2 of its arcs with bad resolutions, made almost every transformation a cheap gimmick, I could go on and on. I like Super too, but lets not be delusional here. Pretty much every criticism it gets is valid. Comparing it to GT doesn't say anything.

[@jahmoymignott4081]

@@amoh2513 Super isn't a Continuation of Z it a Continuation of Kai Gt is a Continuation of Z and Gt Goku is more Mature than Super who is an Idiot a Child in a Man Body

[@jahmoymignott4081]

@@joseurbina3835 What are you talking about Gt Goku literally Overload Super 17 with Energy that Using his Brain use yours

[@Unitedtribute]

Oh my god yes! Thankyou for finally saying it. The writing in super is so bad and unironically makes goku a moron. I know goku was never the smartest guy but there's a difference between being naive because you grew up in the woods and spent most of your life training; and not knowing what kissing is, despite having have a doting wife and two kids. Gt with all of its many faults at least respected its characters more.

[@omariwalker1006]

Vegeta admitting that Goku was number one near the end of DBZ was great. Super immediately undoes that statement at the beginning of the show. It was disgraceful.

[@Knk_Nugis]

Yeah, while GT continued with end of Z Vegeta.

[@TheWaveBlurr]

Z should have ended after the Cell saga. Super is a huge nerf compared to Z in terms of characters, tone, and animation. GT even tho it had its problems still was better than super in my opinion. The series even kept the soul and development of its characters from previous arcs. Vegeta was same character from Z in GT and same with Goku. Super completely took that away from them and the result was that goku was a bit dumper and Vegeta is basically an insecure child who has to out do goku in a childish way. Daima is literally the same thing as gt but with super's animation. The only difference is that toei had prep time. If gt came out now instead of daima people would praise it. And because daima is toriyama's last project fans are going to say its the best thing ever especially here in the west. And i agree that there is no more accountability for gokus actions anymore. And don't get me started with 3 different continunity

[@micah459]

The only good thing I enjoyed from super was Android 17 returning and being badass

[@PortalOfAwesome]

You might like GT then

[@Knk_Nugis]

Yeah too bad super saiyan level character is on the level of "Gods". What was he doing during the Buu saga? He could have one shoted Buu. Oh right, he was taking care of animals and didn't notice genocide happening around him.

[@vonnstevens2502]

I thought dbs was like a 6/10 at best. Not aamzing but not that bad. I think the biggest and most glaring problem was the art and animation being so off for like 80% of the fights. How do you have dbz from 80’s and 90’s have better animation than this? I really simply wish toei didn’t rush this product

[@SUPERVEGETTO92]

Im sure the comment section will be very respectful and this wont get backlash on social media at all.

[@eleos-7845]

I’m sure everyone will engage in thoughtful and respectful discourse and not take any potshots 😁

[@AJotasticGamer]

@@eleos-7845 well you were quite right everyone is regurgitating the same thing the video said but in text form

[@Knk_Nugis]

​​@@AJotasticGameryeah, while people blinded by the rainbow still use GT as an argument that their show wasn't that bad or trying to cherry pick something to like from their poorly written toy commercial😂🎉

[@apexpredator9163]

How long did it take for someone to make a video about it. Thats why people should never have hated or talked shit about GT SINCE THATS THE ONLY TRUE CANNON TO Z

[@Arupaca128]

In retrospect, I'm glad we got DB Daima rather than a second season of Super. By choosing to ignore Super's story, it'll help promote the idea that there isn't a single canon continuation to the Buu saga. We currently have GT, Super and Daima as possible versions of what happens after Z (+some game exclusive continuities), and I more than bet you that Toei and Shueisha will want to keep releasing Dragonball projects, even without Toriyama around anymore. But maybe that's just what Dragonball should be post Toriyama's passing, we'll always have the original Dragonball and the excellent world and stories crafted by Toriyama will serve as a sandbox for other stories to be told, without any one being more relevant or canon than others.

[@ektran4205]

dragonball canon timeline dragonball Z between the end of the buu saga and the world tournament(daima and super) GT is a side story

[@joseurbina3835]

Daima still Co-Exists in Super's Continuity, it's just not going to contradict everything too much regardless of what Errors it has like Kibito's Skin Color being Blue & Majin Buu's Body Air Defusing the Potora Earrings etc, even so, both BOG & ROF are still considered real Canonical Events to Toriyama's Vision before Super even Exist, So Daima is not going to Rewrite/Retcon the entire Thing, otherwise there wouldn't even be an "End of Z Arc" to begin with.

[@sammydray5919]

​@@joseurbina3835 The Kibito kai retcon is kind of important because they specifically go out of their way to defuse in Super using the dragon balls but daima established that Buu can already did that for them. So what do they for some stupid reason fuse again and just dont ask Buu again to defuse them? I know its just a case of Toriyama forgot or something like that but it is a pretty large error all things considered.

[@jahmoymignott4081]

@@ektran4205 Gt is the Continuations of Z it really the Successor of A Super is not Connected to Z Timeline it connected to Kai Timeline

[@joseurbina3835]

@@jahmoymignott4081 Z and Kai are the same Continuity, Kai is just a Remastered Anime of Z by cutting down the Filler Episodes, Improved Pacing, Better Voice Acting and it's Faithful to the Original Manga, GT was never a true Canonical Sequel to Begin with and Super was never Planned when BOG and ROF Films came out.

[@Falxifer95]

The fact that Goku in GT, where he's turned into a kid, feels much more consistent with his characterization in the Buu Saga pretty much illustrates the failure of Super's characterization.

[@hurricane7727]

How about Dragonball Daima Kid Goku?

[@Falxifer95]

​@@hurricane7727at this point I'm not really into any further Dragon Ball continuations. Toriyama's passing sealed the deal for me. But that's just me.

[@hurricane7727]

@Falxifer95 It was made by Toriyama before his Death

[@NattyPi]

@@hurricane7727 Daima Goku feels a little like GT kid goku. hes still curious and excited about the demon world so it doesn't come off as being him being dumb. its like he's learning his new body and learning about new things in universe. that can change but so far he hasn't come off as brian dead or annoying. he's like a smarter version of how he was in dragonball as a kid basically

[@AJotasticGamer]

@@Falxifer95I’d say Damia Goku easily is better then GT and Super Goku writing wise

[@azurekite6547]

I really prefer GT over super.

[@rhamelll]

Easily, SS4 Transformation saved GT and is better than anything in super

[@ShikiRyougi05]

That's just nostalgia talking GT is bad...and i mean BAAAAD, SSJ4 is cool and baby is a decent antagonist but that doesn't even come close to redeeming it.

[@luisfernan-s7731]

​@@rhamelllone thing saving a series is still bad

[@MinorPumpingIron]

​@@ShikiRyougi05no, it's his opinion

[@ShikiRyougi05]

@@MinorPumpingIron i know that but his opinion is bad

[@Xenojameser]

I love GT more than super because GT, was going back to the roots of what made the original Dragon Ball before z amazing adventure comedy a few laughs in between I grew up with the original Dragon Ball series Z and GT a space adventure hunting down for the black star dragon balls and I loved it to me super doesn't even feel like it's a continuation or filler in between it feels like just cheap fan service with no real soul compare the GT one of my funniest episodes from GT is the princess trunks episode if any of you watch the original series then you remember that Bulma had Goku dress up as a girl so that Oolong would lead them to where he had the girls GT had more callbacks and the ending was perfect to me GT is the definitive ending to the Dragon Ball series super has its highs and lows but I just don't like it especially with how they treated most of the characters especially Goku they made him really dumb Goku is Goofy and naive at times but he knows when to be serious super Goku is just really dumb is as if they took away all the maturity that he went through in Z just to have write a story

[@iownall2222]

It's a highly disappointing anime and retelling of dbz honestly. They should have focused on the next gen of fighters, gohan, goten and trunks, instead of retelling dbz qmd keeping the focus on vegeta snd Goku. The transformations in super are also just bad

[@BradLad56]

Jiren isn't a villain, he's an antagonist yes but not a villain.

[@adaurysantos]

Didn't he try to kill the bystanders that had already been eliminated? He's not a villain but I don't think he's a good person either

[@Nobody_particular_anywhere]

​@@adaurysantosIn the anime yeah

[@Knk_Nugis]

Super is glorified toy commercial. Like a commercial it has no soul. It is product designed to run on hype. Hype doesn't need story, character development. As long as it is flashy Dragonball super fans will take anything TOEI dumps on them. Look how they glorify lazy recolors as a greatest showcase of creativity. Frieza became a colors changing pokemon. So did saiyans. Vegeta returned to android saga mentality. Gohan at the end of Z chad. In DBS he anorexic nerd that can't keep up with space dogs. Piccolo became comic relief. Goten and Trunks turned out to be never growing midgets. Goku naivety turned to stupudity. Turns out Master Roshi could have prevented everything that happened in Z because turns out he was hidding power rivalring the gods. Tien is nothing but a decoration from the past. Yamcha is... Yamcha but worst of all Yamchas. Broly is canon, but he is emo with anger issues now. There is Berus, dude responsible for everything. Everything including insane food prices in supermarkets. Whiss - uno reverse card that makes everything not having any meaning. Future Trunks - chad Trunks became pussy Trunks. But hey at least he got real pussy (100 year old granny in young babes body). Same old granny has relationship with kid Trunks... Do I need to continue? All fight choreography got reduced to scream and punch really really hard or spam ki blasts like you playing Tenkaichi 3. Also there is lots of power up spam. All dbs fights has power up spam. And somehow everyone has infinite stamina. No mater how near death they are add power up and they again at their peak. Also blood is gone. Blood is replaced by dirt and white goo charcaters spit at each other when they get punched.

[@hurricane7727]

Goten and Kid Trunks are like 12-13 in Super i think

[@hurricane7727]

Mai is age regressed to a Kid so they are the same age

[@Knk_Nugis]

@@hurricane7727 how can she truly be regressed to a kid if Pilaf gang have all their memories?

[@Knk_Nugis]

@@hurricane7727 why they look like 5 year old then when DBS takes place years after fighting Buu? Shouldn't they look like Teen Gohan?

[@hurricane7727]

@Knk_Nugis It was regression in the Body.

[@Vashisthart]

We want a same vedio like this discussing the downfall of Naruto to boruto ..

[@SamsarasArt]

I wouldn't say it's bad, but DBS is mid.

[@garthyahudahandrews8504]

and GT and Daima arent more mid ?

[@Realistic265]

Very very very low mid 😂 in other words very bad 😂

[@blackhan8493]

@@PezintBut Toriyama was involved in the production of Daima

[@NEONlights-lb8um]

It's not mid. It's bad. Gt Is actually much better. Saying this as someone who actually watched Super and GT simultaneously. Super is a bad show.

[@blackhan8493]

@@Pezint Whatever you say bro

[@Hellsing7747]

As an OG fan from 1988, I found Dragon Ball super horrible. But there are some good moments. However, art is subjective. I think Dragon ball should have ended with dbz. The new transformations are mostly made to be able to sell toys. Plus to minimize the cost the new forms are barely different. Ssj4 characters cost more money to make because you need to have a different molding . With dbz characters you mostly need to change the hair color or the hair.

[@luisfernan-s7731]

As an OG fan, it should've ended after Goku married, period.

[@TheSaiyanSensation]

Great video. I consider myself a fan of DBS, but I’m very aware of all of its flaws and how it’s not the greatest. I wish it was better. Here’s to hoping that DAIMA will end up being a great series.

[@jahmoymignott4081]

All these Gt Haters really love Goku Black when he's just a Copy and Paste of Baby from Gt taking over someone body and becoming stronger yeah Edit: and the Ritual for Super Saiyan God it look just like how Gt Goku Power Up to Limit Breaker in SS4 all I see is just Copy and Paste

[@dec2567]

Finally somebody said it. Im enjoying daima way more. super had cool moments and some cool characters but overall it was mid.

[@NinthShinigami]

I’m enjoying Daima more as well. It took 3 eps but the last one sold me on it now 👍

[@blackfrieza1912]

@dec2567, meh daima isn't really good in my opinion

[@dec2567]

@@blackfrieza1912 The lore is interesting to me and it has an old school dragon ball adventure feel. That's why I'm enjoying it personally.

[@garthyahudahandrews8504]

how can you enjoy a story you have already saw already lol we saw kid goku in Dragonball and had to suffer through it in GT which the only cool thing about was SS4

[@garthyahudahandrews8504]

@@blackfrieza1912 yeah i doubt it will breeak the internet like Jiren Vs goku but i guess that means super is bad because it broke tthe internet people are prisoners of the moment

[@ghostteller5773]

The manga is good, but you have to overlook the god awful decision to simply reference and not adapt the Resurrection F and Super Broly movies in the manga.

[@Isaac-ql9ht]

Yh hopefully one day Toyo can retell those stories as it does hinder the reading experience by having them missing

[@BradLad56]

43:08 Laziness had nothing to do with the poor animation. It was the insane time constraints put on the animators to get it out on time.

[@JoshuaPosada6]

Yes!!! Cash grab and lack of substance. Every time I say this, I hear that I’m a hater. It’s the opposite! I LOVED DBZ. It was sad to see super ruin so many characters and see such terrible writing.

[@申月営無営月無営有申]

Tournament of Power was the only arc I enjoyed. Ultra Instinct got me hyped not gonna lie. Broly was perfect for me

[@mayojar5264]

Dragon Ball super just ruins everything that came before it completely disrespects Z and ball.

[@JohnSmith-w9i]

Anime, movies, and manga are all canon material. While I agree with some opinions on this, let's be honest Dragon Ball Super may have suffered from rushed animation at times, but it wasn't that bad. I agree, it could’ve been better, but there were still some great moments. Goku Black was a good villain, and Moro also has potential, with their introductions being well done. Like GT, Super has its flaws, but it also made notable contributions and succeeded in areas where GT didn't. Super still has a chance for redemption with the upcoming Manga and Anime in the future. There are always room for improvement . Personally, I enjoy both GT and Super and I’m just sharing my thoughts. to see fans bash different Dragon Ball series on platform like Twitter it's a bit childish. In my view, each Dragon Ball series have its own unique strengths and gifts.

[@Knk_Nugis]

You: I agree that our holiday could have been better, but our road trip wasn't that bad. It started exciting and we all were hyped! We saw beautiful colors of rainbow, ate food that wasn't that bad, though it gave my brother permanent diarrhea, while my sister suffered a seizure caused by all the flashy lights we saw along the way. Sure we had a terrible car crash at the end and my whole family suffered brain damage, but I am really looking forward for another roadtrip. This time it will be different because unlike the last time I know how to drive.🎉

[@JohnSmith-w9i]

@ lmao

[@jbstarkiller4626]

Am I the only one who doesn’t like the fact that there’s no blood or gore in Super😒

[@joseurbina3835]

Blood and Gore are not always Unnecessary and Needed for the Dragon Ball Franchise, it's not Berserk or Devilman levels of Violence, The Dragon Ball Multiverse Fan-Manga series is a prime example of Terrible use of Blood and Gore.

[@adaurysantos]

@@joseurbina3835 Have you read the manga? Dragon Ball has always been bloody and gorey, even the DBS manga has tons of blood. Dragon Ball Multiverse's use blood and gore is fine

[@TheBlackOtaku]

You know what Dragon Ball Super is in my personal opinion? Dragon Ball super feels like a badly poorly written fanfiction.

[@StaggerjAGGER]

My brother and I had been saying this for years. It has great moments but its not a great series. Definitely better than GT consistency wise.

[@blackfrieza1912]

@staggerjagger, meh not really better at all at especially in the story and character side

[@Just_B0red]

Dragon Ball GT haters and Dark Souls 2 haters are same people I swear to God

[@joshuahackshaw7703]

True he wasn’t wrong there

[@Purple_23184]

Better than gt imo

[@RiddimMixDJX]

I have noticed that my excitement for seeing new DBZ content just isnt there anymore. This video explains why almost 100%. To me, Super has massive potential with the introduction of the Gods of destruction and Angels from different multiverses. Some of those youtube fan stories have great concepts. Like the treat of the evil Multiverses that were disappeared by Zeno and somehow found their way back into existence, now looking for revenge. Or the Merno the Fallen Angel.

[@garthwhitely9012]

Dragon Ball Super is a mess. It’s just a cheap cash grab and terrible storytelling and character development. It doesn’t even feel canon at all

[@Knk_Nugis]

Amen!

[@Gypsygeekfreak17]

here we go

[@Blacklightning95]

Goku had point with letting the next generation handle things. Cause it’s true he won’t be around forever and he won’t be there to save everyone

[@hurricane7727]

In Dragonball Multiverse 321Y series Goku is a Old Man now in it

[@lingricen8077]

Yeh he is right if the reigns were handed to Millennials. Unfortunately, the world unanimously made the poor choice of skipping over Millennials and going straight to GenZ. Millennials have been completely passed over, being given nothing, yet you still see the most creative and greatest minds coming from Millennials. Gen-Z, the most overrepresented generation of all time, have proven over and over again that they are the most useless generation. Despite the insane amount of help and representation they get they still fail at literally EVERYTHING and RUIN EVERYTHING.

[@MaxBraver555]

While you made some points, about characters getting sidelined are reasonable, Gohan has been established that he does not love fighitng like Goku does, Piccolo knows enemies are out of his league, so it was wise for him to sit it out, like he did in Boo arc, while Goten and Trunks were allowed to fight Boo and not in tournament of power, because Vegeta died, Gohan missing, Goku has limited time on Earth, so they’re betting on Goten and Trunks as oppose to ToP, they have other option for fighters for ToP, which could also be, the 2 become too playful and overconfident when they fuse. If you talk about villain complexity or motivation, Cell wants attain perfect form, fight everyone, then destroy Earth, then Majin Boo, tell me about his motivation, destroy planets and its inhabitants

[@amoh2513]

Regarding the Goten and Trunks part, I still think Z Goku would have gone with them instead of Roshi and Tien. He knows damn well the limitations that are tied to humans as he has seen them die to threats they can't handle on Earth time and time again. Yet he goes with them? And yet they somehow manage to fare well in a tournament of multiple universes? That's some bullshit right there. For one, keeping power scaling consistent, neither of them would have been powerful enough to be in the Tournament of Power. Second, Z Goku would have used this as an opportunity for the boys to learn to humble themselves, how cockiness leads to your downfall, much like how Roshi taught Goku in the Tenkaichi Budokai. Sad that Goku ended up forgetting this lesson for most of Super himself. That's not to mention how big of an asset Goten and Trunks would have been in any scenario other than them directly attacking universe 11 fighters (or Hit and Kefla). And the part about Cell, I agree with you. There wasn't much to him as a character. But I think he just made up for it with sheer swagger.

[@MaxBraver555]

first of all, Goku is not always in charge of managing everything, Vegeta also did not want kid Trunks to be there, he was the one who decided that because of Gotenks attitude, for power scaling, that was the point, not every fighter across universe is on Goku, Vegeta, Gohan and Jiren’s level, those who fought Freeza soldier managed, at least expect some other universe fighter to be at those level, while there’s no need for humans to fight those at Goku or Vegeta level, instead stick to those they can handle and have the advantage of teaming up together.

[@lingricen8077]

You’re trying to rationalise anime-tier writing. Just stop. They can pull ANYTHING out their rear, what they chose for super was boring rubbish

[@MaxBraver555]

@@lingricen8077 how about give some more legitimate argument with backing proof, instead of your poor unoriginal "rubbish" "boring" argument

[@lingricen8077]

@@MaxBraver555 You just proved that you’re blatantly bias and disingenuous 😂 just the kind of mentality required to enjoy rubbish **mic drop**

[@markthetopfabricator6047]

Great channel, i watch your Bleach TYBW manga vs anime all the time. I agree that Super has it’s flaws but it still has it’s good points. I honestly think that the Moro Arc is good, while it does have some flaws, it doesn’t have a lot of the big issues that the rest of Super has that you pointed out. 1. (Transformations Are Meaningless) We get to see Goku through out the arc actually train with Merus to learn how to use Ultra Instinct and gets a emotional pay off when Merus sacrifices himself which is the final trigger for Goku to master Ultra Instinct. 2. (Vegeta’s Sidelining) Vegeta actually gets a good focus through the arc with him having a great sense responsibility to keep the namekianos safe, as well as his own story line were he goes to planet Yardrat to train at the same time that Goku is traing, and the new technique he learns is a big key fact in how they defeat at the very end. 3. (The Other Characters Geting Sidelining) Now when it comes to this factor you can only realistically give a hand full of characters a useful place for each story line and give the rest a small moment at best. So does it do this? yes, Buu surprisingly is one of the characters that gets the most shine this arc being very useful through out it especially at the end, Gohan and Piccolo get a lot of very cool team up moments like defeating OG73 the first time, 17 & 18 prove to be very useful specifically against OG73 who copyed Moro’s powers as well against Moro him himself and all the other Z Fighters are given those small moment to shine even by fighting the prisoners, even Yamcha gets a W that should definitely tell you somthing. 4. (Goku’s Character) Except for when Piccolo tells him that Vegeta has changed thanks to him and Goku apparently doesn’t get it, and also the moment where he give Moro a senzu bean (which to be fair Goku did beat the crap out him immediately when Moro decides not to go in peace), for the most part Goku is ok in this arc, his not constantly a cringe idiot through out it. 5. (Boring Villains) While i accept that Moro is not that interesting as a character, he is at least a very refreshing villain from a combat point with ability steal energy and not just another big strong guy, but i'll touch on that point better in no.6, but i do think he is a decent enough villain. 6. (Inconsistent Powerscaling) I would say everyone is around the same level of power we saw them last time, Goku & Vegeta got stronger because they trained this arc, Buu, 17 and 18 where especially effective not necessarily for their power but because of their physical traits and special abilities. But mainly more importantly the reason why the villains were a threat for are main cast of characters specifically the prisoners Moro would steal energy from them making them weaker and also giving it to the prisoners to make them stronger, so i think the powerscaling made sense through out. i agree with people saying that the Moro arc is better on binge, especially on a reread.

[@CoffinKidHxC]

One thing noone seems to mention us how bad the choreography was in DBS. Outside of the movies and Trunks/Goku vs Zamasu/Black every fight basically became punch, block, shoot beam simulator

[@AbdullahDaniyal-d6k]

Goku vs Cell was the peak of DBZ Franchise. Pure martial arts fights.

[@arabbitwhocanuseinternet9657]

Gohan train for like what hour befoee tournament of power and the bastard can fight on par with kaio ken blue goku what the hell ???? everyone got so powerful so fast Why didnt everyone just unlock their potential like piccolo from wishing ?

[@hurricane7727]

Bad writing. I like Dragonball Multiverse Fanmanga Universe 16 Gohan Better. He got stronger From Having Vegito and Bulla Train with him and is a Somewhat Stronger than Universe 18 Gohan

[@bobbystronkdoc8368]

I agree with you on almost everything, great vid brother

[@drmuffinx233]

Thank you bro for saying it, they ruined and milked one of the greatest series to ever exist

[@Knk_Nugis]

It's like if someone made the 4th Lord of the Rings movie with different actors and called it Super Lord of the Rings. Plot: Sauron gets resurrected but this time gets golden armor while Gandalf changes his colors every time he is defeated. All they do is fight orcs all the time with dialogue consisting only of one liners. Also Saruman returns but he is named Ruruman, so it is a completely different villain😢

[@justinrodriguez5957]

Super was simply an attempt to bring Dragonball into the modern era for reasons that could only described as....well easy money from a fanbase that while passionate will not let it go. While GT itself is flawed the concepts themselves were pretty solid. Of which now even with Daima we're beginning to retread. Except now it's the demon realm instead of the universe. I liked the fact GT established consequences for frequent usage of the Dragonballs as prior to Bulma, they were rarely put together. I liked how they integrated SS4 by bringing back the aspect Saiyans were known for, the ape transformation. The attempted world building in GT felt more intergrated than tacted on despite being flawed. And most importantly, I appreciate GT for it putting essentially putting an end point to Goku's adventures. With Super though, it very much feels like "We're going to milk this series till the cow is dust, just sprinkle a new transformation, some new level of power and you will eat that up for days." And to be fair, they're right. I'm not a fan of series long overstaying their welcome but a good chunk of the fanbase definitely think otherwise. Remember when stuff like Gohan Blanco was a running gag until Gohan Blanco actually became real? That's what we're in for.

[@neogamest123logic2]

Super saiyan 3 was explained to Goten and Trunks which you see how Gotenks did it do you need to rematch Z. And you can say it came out of nowhere but 7 years of training in the afterlife is enough reason for me to accept it.

[@FrancBushaj]

The reason of why it feels like it’s outta nowhere is because it doesn’t make sense for Goku’s character in the Buu saga. Unlike the rest of Z, in the Buu saga Goku took threats like Buu seriously, with him trying to dodge almost every attack from Majin Vegeta just so that it wouldn’t lead to Buu’s awakening. So when he revealed ssj 3 later in the arc, saying that he didn’t use it in his fight with Majin Vegeta just because it would “hurt his pride” was WAY outta left field

[@neogamest123logic2]

@FrancBushaj What? Goku was hiding how strong he was from everyone while fighting yakon. What do you mean out of character. Why wouldn't he hold back while fighting Vegeta. The whole time he was trying to talk him down. He already explained how much power it consumes and he only has 1 day pass and it eats up his time on earth. Goku is wise stop this notion that he's not.

[@FrancBushaj]

@@neogamest123logic2 If he used ssj 3 against Vegeta during that fight he would’ve won , which then means that Buu doesn’t gain that energy from their fight, that then leads to Gohan taking out Dabura and also Babidi which i think is WAY more important than “spending up his last day on earth”. Sure, he’s wasting all that time and would probably never see his family again, but if it means that this immensely powerful and destructive being won’t be able to kill them all is worth the exchange

[@FrancBushaj]

@@neogamest123logic2 And also, i never said anything about Goku being an idiot. It’s just that him not using ssj 3 during the whole Majin Vegeta fight while also saying he’s “going all out”, makes him look like a liar and a troll, which i know Toriyama didn’t intend but it still happened anyway

[@neogamest123logic2]

@FrancBushaj I never said you claim he's an idiot. I'm just saying there's this notion going around in the fandom. Goku deceitful practice know as hiding one true power isn't out of character. It's quite the common practice among many characters. I'd never heard it call trolling before and that's new to me lol.

[@shaileshmishra5503]

DBZ Goku 🗿❤️ DBS Goku 🤡🤡

[@francisco65372]

One of the worst things about DBS in my opinion is what they did to Future Trunks at the end of the story, the decision of send him to a random timeline with another Trunks and Mai is really stupid, it could have been one where he could have helped another version of Future Gohan or the timeline where Cell killed him but nah. They even had the perfect chance to give him a good ending with the ToP (It doesn't matter if time travel was a taboo because they break the rules of the tournament many times, but Zeno doesn't give af as long as it's fun). And in the manga they try to make something "fun" making Gohan remind him that he doesn't have his future anymore, might as well make Gohan tell him "Imagine being a weak bitch that can't protect a timeline. But that's nothing for us right, Trunks?"

[@vishwajeetpanwar3271]

GT has some insane arc ideas

[@ItsJustaLittleLuck]

I’ve always believe that people need to understand Toriyama’s decision when it came to Dragon ball Super. As he felt there was no way to develop Goku’s character further, so he decided to revert him to the same character as he was at the start of the series. Even though Goku was a complete character by the end of the Cell Saga. I personally disagree with the way he decided to go with it but that’s not for me to decide. But that aside, other than just reverting Goku he sadly did the same to Vegeta, which I never understood. They actually made Vegeta Goku’s rival, which just completely goes against all the development he had in the later stages of Z. The worst part about it is that Goku never really saw a Vegeta as his rival, only super just pushed the agenda.This was the main flaw with Vegeta that he’d eventually overcome, the fact he was soo fixated on Goku that he would always be behind him. Which only damages Vegeta as a character as it saps all of the growth he had at the end of the cell arc/ Buu arc, making him realise that Goku was always better. I will say, I am very happy that Piccolo got the love near the end of supers run with the Superhero movie. I’m just surprised, GT was way more faithful to all the characters than Super. Its writing was nowhere near perfect but I can watch it more than super in some aspects with the fact that the characters practically are same as when we last saw them. Honestly, if I’m real. Super has made me hate Vegeta and it just annoys me that Vegeta in Gt was what we could’ve got if they didn’t just drain the character growth out of him. It’s a shame.

[@joshuahackshaw7703]

I think TOEI was writing this no?

[@ItsJustaLittleLuck]

@@joshuahackshaw7703 I believe they might’ve had a little influence but I’d have to fact check it. But knowing toei they probably were pulling Toriyama’s leg.

[@joshuahackshaw7703]

@ I see

[@faytwind3913]

DBS has that Sonic X 4kids art style. Yuk Also I hate the powered up farm animal enemies characters. It’s just lazy

[@Gypsygeekfreak17]

The thing is when it comes to moro he is a wizard you would of thought Hey his not only powerful in strength and ki but in magic too you would of thought moro would of used more magic spells to help him in a fight and this in turn would of made the z fighters fight a unique enemy a enemy that’s like babadi but a million times more better with magic like What if he had magic powers to make alsorts of things like Cloning him self Or making him self untouchable Or turning him self in to water Or slowing others down with his magic or time manipulation Or something this is the first time goku and the others have faced off against someone like this a powerful fighter who is also a very powerful wizard Come on it was steering at us the whole time and even if moro was weaker then the z fighters that wouldn’t of mattered because his magic is what would of made him almost unbeatable

[@Saiyan_Legacy15]

Honestly, I loved Super a lot 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@Realistic265]

Not everyone has a good sense of taste 😂

[@AlejandroDeLaRosa05]

Same here. It obviously had its lows but I genuinely enjoyed it more than GT

[@luisfernan-s7731]

​@@Realistic265you're right, I hope you get a better taste.

[@garthyahudahandrews8504]

same i loved the humor as well and vegets character development

[@Saiyan_Legacy15]

@@Realistic265 look who's talking, a person with an Israeli flag on, fuck off

[@strider_hiryu850]

5:33 okay admittedly it does like pretty good on Beerus. though granted, he is a new character created with the new art style in mind. so, he should look good here

[@hurricane7727]

He first appeared in Dbz Battle of Gods Movie!

[@strider_hiryu850]

@@hurricane7727 yeah i know

[@traylonsion7588]

I still prefer it over gt by a mile but I can See why people get frustated over super

[@draggoon9121]

Duuuh😅 it's SuperBad and people where clowning over GT at least that was about dragon balls and that piccolo had his own pair.

[@luisfernan-s7731]

GT is worse

[@UnifiedEntity]

GT was the level of bad Dragonball should never have reached ever again. It was a benchmark of what not to do, despite it having a good ending and interesting concepts. The execution was bad. Super, somehow surpassed it in how bad Dragonball can be in modern day. For instance, Goku as a character himself, even as a child, didn't annoy me on screen, he was NEVER the problem. Goku in Super? Is a problem. A huge problem. A DUMBASS of the ages kind of problem. I don't even want to get into Vegetas regressed ass. Broly, over hyped shit with a nothing story. Great animated fighting but that is literally it

[@lingricen8077]

Also am I the only one who found Goku’s VA sudden inflection to be annoying as hell? He made Goku in super sound like hes nervously asking a question every line

[@UnifiedEntity]

@lingricen8077 Yeah Sean over performs and makes Goku sound very very annoying in regular conversation.

[@BradLad56]

12:32 Hey Goku didn't rob anything imo. Yes Vegeta had the perfect opportunity to kill Freiza but ya know what? He squandered it by taking too long when we know for a fact he can kill enemies in a flash if he wants too. In fact I'd say some of the blame for Earth blowing up can be levied at Vegeta for giving Frieza the time to blow it up in the first place. He knew how dangerous Frieza was when backed into a corner but he still stood there like an idiot charging up his attack instead of firing it off the first chance he got. So you can say that Goku "robbed" him if you want, but just remember that Goku did what he should have from the start.

[@vanderbiltalexsingleton2041]

I actually really like the non movie arcs 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@elinator8889]

super is just a cheap commercial especially how transformations were marketed compared to z. the flashbacks were a lot more toned down in comparison to z and especially how stiff the animations could be with its multiple shiny gloss of layers thar must’ve been difficult to animate with the younger rating too on top of that than z😂

[@mildishnidorino8091]

Now we just need Eyepatch Wolf to fire back with 'Dragon Ball Super - A Ruined Reputation', and then we'll another Four Year Content War arc.

[@wolfknightlord]

BRO you really giving criticism to that ass series, and it's ass writing tropes. Letting Moro get stronger, because we still ain't learned our lesson. I'm including the Manga......I'm about to watch the video now.

[@dfreeman5050]

I don't agree at all

[@dfreeman5050]

@@Pezint first.... Ok. If you don't agree thats cool. Second, why should i care how valuable your comment is or isn't . I only answer what he ask which was "What are your honest feelings"

[@xenoemblem7]

​@@Pezint You're pathetic

[@adaurysantos]

The reason you don't agree is because of nostalgia

[@adaurysantos]

@@Pezint 4/10 is pretty generous

[@dfreeman5050]

@@adaurysantos not really. I like it for many things like for vegeta growth, good fight scenes, continuing the dbz style and hopefully fix the bad dbz ending with uub, also liking the different paths vegeta, goku and gohan going on and lastly bring in broly

[@TrueReverse74]

Ok, I watched the video, so please take what i'm about to say as me just arguing from a different view point. Alright, i hope you enjoy reading, cause it'll be a long one Super isn't perfect, but I maintain that almost everything from Ultra instinct's introduction in Dragon ball super, is quality stuff, on par with the stuff from Z and OG dragon ball. Let me get the first couple of arcs out of the way so that no assumptions are made on my part. Battle of Gods is a good movie, we agree on that . RoF is a fine movie with terrible implementations. I actively dislike that movie Universe 6 was alright, nothing crazy other than Hit's nonsensical "i'm improving" power that was introduced for no reason. Monaka as a fraud isn't really funny imo either. Goku black arc sucks and I could rip into that for hours, but since we agree, i'm not going to. But i'll just say I hate just about everything except Goku black's fighting style and Zamasu's concept and only his concept, otherwise. It's trash. With that out of the way, I want to start with Ultra instinct, I fundamentally disagree with your assessment. Ultra is not at all inconsistent. Ultra instinct is the most perfect transformation for Goku that has ever been made. It plays on his core as a saiyan raised on earth. What makes the humans special is that they are martial artists at their core and UI serves as the ultimate culmination of all Goku has been taught throughout his life to think and move reflexively serving as road to this power. I think this illustrated well enough in both anime and manga, imo the manga did it better actually. However the important thing to note is that Goku only has an idea through feel and not through knowledge which is why it was important for him to learn more about through Merus, to understand it as a state of being. So while I agree on your sentiment that many transformations, I think that Ultra Ego, Ultra Instinct, Orange piccolo, are all exempts from this observation personally. Goku has mastered UI but it is not his own technique, because he simply copies the way whis does it. Think of it like any other skill there can be 2 masters of karate through achieving the same accolades, but that does not mean that they are on the same level of mastery. Which leads to the discovery of TUI, because it allows Goku to be his TRUE self which is a battle hungry martial artist, which was the core of his ssj power ups before which relied on his saiyan nature to achieve. It's the perfect power up for Goku's path as a martial artist. Now for the defense of the moro arc, I think you're being a a little too obtuse, because Moro is a great villain. We both agree, that his intro was good but I'm not clear on where you think he fell off because the only thing that changed about Moro himself was his design. and keep in mind, I prefer goat moro, but the escalation of the arc was handled well. Both Goku and Vegeta were presented with new struggles and were mostly consistent with their history. The arc dropped great lore, Merus is a great new addition to dragon ball, the Lord of Lords reappearing in the universe was an exciting reveal and while freeing criminals wasn't the most exciting wish, with moro's powers, he could make those bums actually a threat, which boosted Moro's threat level. The Z-fighters got some shine and while I would have liked better action from them, what we got imo, wasn't bad. Now I think I know what your biggest issue is and it's probably the senzu bean. But I gotta ask, Is it really out of character for Goku to be who he always was? Goku as a character is someone who tries to bring out the best in others, he wants to see the good in even the most evil of people, Goku did learn his lesson not to push his beliefs on redemption onto people, that's what he learned against cell, he realize he can't make Gohan like him no matter he COULD be, but that wasn't a rejection of making good out of evil people. Moro is a reflection of Goku's personal philosophy about giving people a chance.He did it with Frieza, he did it with the ginyu force, Vegeta, Jiren, Hit, Piccolo, Tien, Granolah, Gas, the list goes on. I think it's unfair to try and criticize the writing for Moro just because you want goku to be more heroic when the story is telling you that Goku ain't a hero. This is why Merus and Goku's dynamic worked, Merus developed a sense of justice but couldn't change anyone, but Goku doesn't, he just does his best to fight strong people. Goku fought as a Galactic patrolman in honor of Merus, but understood that it wasn't him, that was why he took the Galactic patrol symbol off, cause he does things his way. Moro, parrallels that by being everything Goku has fought before and being a devourer of the creations of the gods. His defeat doesn't prove Goku right, it's the people coming together that makes him right, Uub, Vegeta, Piccolo etc. comes together to defeat someone who Goku wasn't able to change. I think the Moro arc is comeptently written and UI has managed to retain it's meaning. Now for the defense of Granolah. I'll be honest, I really like Granolah (both the character and the arc). I agree that Granolah (the character) becomes too focused on revenge at points, but I think the pacing and character progression in this arc is something to praise. We already agree the beginning was something good, I personally think it was phenomenal, except for how he got the second dragon ball, that was contrived. Let's talk about the wish to be the strongest. I honestly don't see a problem with it, while it's unearned yes, Granolah gave up his entire future to obtain it, which I feel is sacrifice enough to obtain the power he did, but that didn't make him better than Goku and Vegeta, at least I don't think so It didn't undermine their work because Granolah exists to parallel Vegeta. This was a wonderful arc for Vegeta that was set up in the Moro arc about repenting for the sins of himself and all saiyans which weighed him down. Vegeta used to think that he was the sole bearer of all sins saiyans had left behind because he was just evil. Beerus in his rough and agressive way of teaching contrasting whis, tells him that he must remake himself from scratch. Which Granolah is simply unwilling to do, instead he is chained down by the past and that's what the fight with Vegeta amounted to. Vegeta getting Granolah into the headspace of what he has around him. In fact this is probably the one time I'm happy with Vegeta losing because narratively it's consistent with his new road, he's someone who thrives off battle, but his CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT, is what's getting in the way. It plays off his history of being cold blooded and ruthless and his attempt at trying to return to that man, but he simply can't. He's progressed to far. I think that's a brilliant way to explore Vegeta's character that plays on his history. It's through Vegeta that Granolah, who he sees himself in, finally comes to his sense of self in time before he becomes truly lost in his own head on revenge, which I think is great. Now Gas is kinda eh as a villain, but him being a loyal weapon of his big brother is actually interesting imo, it was done fairly well but ended too soon, I feel like elec and Gas should have survived to be introduced later in the future. They messed up there but at the same time Frieza's return was handled way better in Granolah than RoF. I like the bardock stuff too and how he reminded Goku and Vegeta about saiyan pride and I already discussed TUI and why i think it's great. I'd love to discuss more if you're interested. Finally the miscellaneous things. I agree and disagree with, Yes many transformations lack the character defining moments that the old show had. Rage, Rose, Beast and Ssj. But I would say that Dbs is currently fixing that to a degree. The way Cabba transformed the first time is what I expect of a ssj. UE and UI are PEAK meaningful transformations, Orange piccolo is a thematically satisfying transformation, and Blue Kaioken/Mastered blue were both good improvements. But that also doesn't excuse, Beast, Golden frieza, Kale, Caulifla etc. I'm willing to give Goten and Trunks a pass since hybrids are just born better as seen with Gohan and even future trunks (in the manga) and they are related to the most prodigious saiyans in existence. But I agree nonetheless. I also agree that the power scaling is truly unrepairable to a satisfying degree, with the trivializing of God ki. God ki is no longer special and it ruined the scaling. We also agree that super hero is a good movie (aside from beast Gohan). Broly is a good movie. I mostly agree that the Goten and Trunks stuff isn't at all what I wanted out of them, even if I fond Goten in particular enjoyable in that mini arc (If you ask me them becoming galactic patrol men and having soace adventures is way more interesting). Where I disagree is saying that Ssj3 is unjustified when Goku trained non-stop for 7 years, as if he couldn't come up with anything else after discovering Grade 4 ssj in 1 year. I don't think any of the retcons in super really do anything to the original product, most of what people say are retcons aren't even retcons and the ones that are, aren't that big a deal, just weird decisions to make. If you want to see, good lore and how things can be fixed, you should check the Lore of dragon ball Online, it's genuinely great stuff that I think the manga should develop the characters towards. Krillin and Tien become sensei's teaching Support techniques like buffing and nerfing foes, which is a great arc for Krillin and Tien teaches overpowered Ki techniques to combat people who outclasses him physically. another great arc. Goten and Trunks find a sword school, another great direction and Gohan finally achieves balance with fighting and studies and writes a book on ki control for all earthlings and more, it's all great stuff.

[@TrueReverse74]

My final thoughts, I think that the second half of Dragon Ball Super is quality stuff from the Introduction of UI onwards, manga and anime and movies. I genuinely think most of it is of quality. I'm not taking it personal that you don't like it, I just want to explain my view on it and why I think you're being a bit too harsh, I feel GT is a bit too hated as well imo. If you read this and want to have a discussion or I changed your perspective on some things, i'd like that. if you didn't read it, well, that's too bad. I think I covered everything I wanted to, so thank you.

[@KylePhantomK94]

Gonna say this at least, Super may not be that good. But GT is even worse.

[@blackfrieza1912]

@kylephantomk94, naw not really if anything gt is actually better hell even good especially with it's story and characters

[@lewisaino]

GT gave birth to AF and Esencia

[@ShikiRyougi05]

​@@blackfrieza1912please actually go and watch GT again. You'll realize that it's the worst thing in the franchise.

[@blackfrieza1912]

@ShikiRyougi05 . Naw not really it has story and not dumb plot, more serious episodes and especially the stakes sorry not sorry don't care what you say

[@ShikiRyougi05]

@@blackfrieza1912 the first arc in GT is unironically the worst thing i have ever sat through...you seem like you don't even remember GT icl.

[@zuniversemangacompany6516]

I do feel as tho Dragon Ball as a whole has lost the concept of character growth and telling for the character's point of view meaning how to build upon a character's place within the world;/story

[@ubaidahhussain8373]

Toei is one most greediest company that cause goku regression to bumbling idiot. Never forgive them.

[@joshuahackshaw7703]

Well you aren’t wrong there they mess up in that regard

[@ektran4205]

goku in z was selfish, its the dub that made him an idiot

[@ExplainingPerspective]

SSGSSJ did not come out of no where. It was Due to Whis' guidance on Vegeta's and Goku's (at the time) current limitations in battle. By finding harmony to keep the Ki within, they clashed blows and found the answer needed. It was to master the form of masters, Super Sayian, while within God "Mode". It was very flushly explained throughout the entire 27 episode rehash you bagged.

[@hurricane7727]

In Dbz Rof Movie The Ssgss was How Goku and Vegeta can Fully tap into God Power on their own

[@WannaDJ]

I’m glad I’m a person with simple taste. I loved and enjoyed both GT and Super. I still tear up and get the chills when I rewatch Jiren vs Goku/Freezer. There a lot of flaws for sure, just like DBZ had. I just love DB.

[@adaurysantos]

DBZ is pretty much flawless before the Cell saga

[@shaggywhite2205]

Goten being forgotten pisses me off

[@darklordyianni4463]

Read the manga. Nuff said.

[@greyworld6242]

Great video DBZ!

[@drfirebone1-936]

Finally more people are realizing it

[@garthyahudahandrews8504]

@@Pezint or peoples expectations arent that high but will go and promote Daima like its such an amazing original concept

[@drfirebone1-936]

@ I know right the dragon ball community is one of the worst fandoms ever and like to shit on any media toriyama is not evolved with . But when he is people act like their is no problem when he reset everyone charater arcs to cell saga in super and let toei ruin his work. The fan mangas are way better than super ever was. Imagine Naruto coming back and it had 3 story arcs repeats. And don’t get me started on the powerscaling

[@shadowofthenorthstar989]

i knew it was garbage since the beginning but i was tolerant of it until Goku black arc that's where i started hating it

[@AJotasticGamer]

⁠​⁠@@garthyahudahandrews8504 nobody said it was big dog it’s the concept GT wasted done right. Don’t start spewing Daima slender

[@EWOODJ]

I disagree

[@Tysuonet]

Taste issue

[@insertnamehere236]

I was only privy to some of the production hell issues in the first few arcs, but this described a tone of the issues teenage me kept seeing when Super was still releasing but didn't know how to describe, heck in the tournament of power despite how hype Goku V Jiren was, after enough time I'd notice the fact that some of their scenes were literally just goku and Jiren awkwardly standing or falling based on the environment changing with them being practically still, while a bunch of rushed lines and weird looking arms were being drawn on screen to make them look like they're fighting super fast. Sure that's an optical illusion DBZ has done to better effect before, but it was done so long and so jankily that it was almost like an uncanny valley effect on me

[@josukejones6566]

Hold on now, I see that jab you threw at team 4 star and that’s ain’t cool. Everybody knows dbza is a FAN MADE PARODY! If someone chooses to be willfully ignorant and take that as what the characters actually are then that’s on them

[@DBZimran]

It isn't a jab when you're pointing out a consequence of their work. A LOT of people are "willfully ignorant" and ignore their request to check out the original work.

[@Mavuika_Gyaru]

Ask Openheimer if he felt guilty about Hiroshima and Nagasaki. He didn't kill anyone yet he felt horrible for creating nukes

[@josukejones6566]

Bro you are blaming them for the thoughts of other people. Team 4 start made basically made a joke that’s it that’s all. You can’t blame them for people choosing to be ignorant.

[@nightlydata2181]

@@DBZimran That's their fault then but u make it come off as TFS's in the vid which is the issue

[@DBZimran]

Well TFS are responsible for the stereotypical jokes spreading, that's an undeniable fact.

[@insanemakaioshin]

I will be the first to hate on Super, but I like how it handled transformations. In the RoF saga, it is mentioned by Whis that transformations are useless and the series always prioritizes new techniques over transformations. The theme, that the series fails to follow most of the time, is transformations are garbage and techniques are king. 37:35 - It openly says that S-cells are built up by training. Training is a type of hard work! 38:53 - I'm in the opposite camp, as I over analyze everything, so more lore and less mystery is good. 39:18 - False! You openly said that S-cells are increased by training. That means Saiyans who work hard can eventually become SSJ. Sure some are more predisposed to it than others, but it always requires hard work and effort. Caulifa, Kale and Cabba were soldiers that regularly trained. Cabba for the King's army and the others for the rebellion. 40:19 - That's just Gohan's genetics. He's always been like this since his introduction. He was stronger than Raditz despite never training. To conclude, I agree with almost everything else you said.

[@skyrogue1977]

I think Super should’ve just been a series if films as opposed to a show.

[@hurricane7727]

The first 2 movies were originally Z Movies and Dbz Battle of Gods movie ssg Goku vs Beerus had some Blood in it

[@xavierbailey7183]

I agree that super is a terrible successor to the original manga it just have to many Unless and unneeded transformations

[@joseurbina3835]

To be Frank, I would still watch Super over GT any Day, while GT does have much Stronger Concepts than Super, but GT's Writing is much more Worse after post Baby Vegeta Saga, Honestly, I don't find "Dragon Ball Super" all that Bad, it isn't like the "Modern MCU," "Star Wars Sequel Trilogy" or "Sonic Meta Era" Levels of Terrible, but it's more like the "DC Extended Universe" level of a Rocky Ride, it got Conflicting and Polarizing Criticisms but can manage to still be Watchable regardless of Flaws.

[@Jason-Skywalker]

Dragon Ball Super is *so* bad that not even this video goes into enough depth to break down everything wrong with it.

[@Knk_Nugis]

Someone needs to make a 12 episode series "How greed ruins legacy - Dragonball Super"

[@mastertucker]

This is such a biased take. I mean from the get go with forms you can't even call them "to sell toys". Toys aren't DBZ's largest market unlike something like Kamen Rider - and they were made mostly by Toriyama who didn't just make things for no reason other than the cash grab. Plus Toriyama made them entirely unplanned, one at a time, without some greater scheme like a company. Ironically the forms Toei DID make up are the least able to be made toys to begin with as they're all aura changes - those figures aren't the ones getting constantly reprinted. We also all know the story of SSJG, how first drafts handed to Toriyama were of buff Goku with a cape and big hair. Lazy would have been just taking that draft, but Toriyama made extra work for himself to back and forth to get the design to look consistent, how forms are supposed to look. That's just objectively not lazy, it's factually confirmed motivation and process we know wasn't explicitly to make toys. Shouldn't spread misinformation like that. He can't even be accused of making a simpler design to make it easier for him later because he wasn't drawing by that point. And with each form being all done by the one guy, and each time the next one was not planned, it's flat out asinine to claim that he did it all for toy sales. Toei didn't force him to make new forms it was his choice. And each one he made with the reasoning and mechanics in DBZ that he'd always set in place, to make these forms look like they should have. That just sets the tone for the rest of these critiques - a bunch of bias and "I don't like ____ so it feels like it was made because x reason" instead of actually looking into why and how Toriyama did each thing that he did in the past and present that resulted in what we got. Goku was always an idiot and it makes him a more charming character. Opinion sure but it's an opinion that lines up with Toriyama's and the opposing opinion isn't a fact either - but it is pretty close minded. Vegeta has had better development and use in Super than most of DB content, same with Gohan. Again wrong with Gohan: 'Hasn't trained for years, suddenly fights Blue' Except he spent the years between RoF and the ToP training back up to snuff and then regaining ultimate on himself (which grants missed potential). A few years of training isn't a short period of time. And yes, he was training from the end of RoF all the way up to Moro. Like, look at your Frieza example: 'Frieza coming back with god levels of strength defied the expectations from the original series' no it did not. If any of you think this isn't how it has to happen I'm sorry you were wrong. Original DBZ taught us that your potential is based on how strong you are casually when you're born. Yes you can train and beat the elite but Vegeta has always had a higher potential than Goku that he has character flaws that hold him back from. Gohan's potential is because he could summon large amounts of power at age 4 greater than Goku ever could at 12-18. And DBZ taught us that at the start of your training you power skyrockets with little effort, and if you have high potential that effect is only exacerbated. So if Gohan can multiply his power hundreds of times over as a kid at a power level as low as his, and you think Frieza can't eclipse ridiculous gaps in power by starting training while being born at namek saga level strength, with that kind of potential? You're just being stubborn and your expectations were wrong. Base Goku in Buu Saga still wouldn't beat Namek Saga Final Form Frieza at least without major difficulty, but so many fans think everyone can just automatcally body everyone from the last arc. The power scaling makes mostly perfect sense (the manga has some huge flaws but more earlier than at present, the anime is the better series for Super) it just takes more than two seconds of thought and getting rid of some of the dumb preconcieved notions fans have had forever. 17 is just built stronger than Friieza, same logic. Not plot armor. It's the logic Toriyama set up. The methods of transformation and power gain ARE the strategic means of winning battles, figuring out how to condense Ki to make a new kind, abusing the mechanics of SSJ to get God Ki on 1 and (for Trunks) 2, finding out how to layer techniques. The shows of power aren't arbitrary when they use preestablished logic to reach new heights. It IS a shortcut especially for Frieza, that's the POINT. DBZ is ABOUT training all you can to defeat the born elite. The villains are supposed to be easily strong so that Goku and Co can use hard work or hard logic to beat the naturally born elite. That cycle literally defines DBZ how can anyone miss that point? Opinions are fine but there's a lot of objectively incorrect information here that these opinions are being based on.

[@hurricane7727]

Super Saiyan God Goku first appeared in Dbz Battle of Gods Movie and unlike Super's Goku he actually was disgusted at the Super Saiyan God Power feeling that its Not His Strength.

[@hurricane7727]

Even in Dragonball Mutliverse a Fanmanga i like that Goku and Vegeta Gained a New Form by Rigourous Training that Basically Unleashes all their ssj Forms( Ssj 1 - 3 ) Combined Power and even fans have said its like Attaining Mystic Form without Elder Kai.

[@CurtisMorris-d3r]

Vegeta had more complex development in Z with his existential crisis at the end of the cell arc. His presence in Super doesn't carry the show like it did in Z, He's a sidekick in Super.The writers in Super did him the worst in the Moro arc,They hyped up Vegeta as this Savior but robbed him of victory so dude with a family that he's fighting for but still is a jobber?

[@mastertucker]

@ that’s not really the core of his development though. The moment in cell wasn’t all that complex, it was deep but not complicated or layered by any means. Vegeta’s character development has always been centered around giving up more and more of his pride. The fact that we see him able to recognize something too far above him and humiliate himself to save his family is huge. The fact that he’s willing to now ask others to train him, the continuation in his faith in Goku from buu saga. I mean the black arc itself was literally centered around him and his family entirely. Goku was player 2 in that whole arc. I mean Vegeta was the sole reason goku was able to win. Without him, no energy gain. And like we gotta stop pretending that getting the final hit on the final bad guy is what matters. Vegeta’s importance in that fight was key. Moro arc has a lot of flaws but that wasn’t one of them. And in granolah he’s perfect. And now he has to get a hold on UE like Goku did Ui, leaving so much open for Vegeta focused content. It’s just so reductive and shallow to consider him a “jobber” just because he didn’t win.

[@CurtisMorris-d3r]

@@mastertucker The development in Super seems very artificial...it comes out of nowhere. Vegeta and Piccolo plus dende live on the Same damn planet he could've told him he regretted killing his kind...But all that came in the Moro arc.. So we are counting Gags scenes as development? This man was still denied trying to do fusion dance at first and reuse a lot of his character arc from the Boo saga in the Tournament of power...It was embarrassing. A lot of his development might be filler in super that's why we see him kinda regressing then gaining then repeat. I don't care how you explain it,Vegeta getting robbed is bad writing it happened in the revival no F movie and retelling.I believe the Moro becomes that movie in the second half of the arc so I don't why this arc gets any love. I hope he's better used in Daima than he is in any arc in Super,I don't think he's going to get any development in Daima since it's short but he can be more useful.

[@vapixdarmana4428]

The child argument doesn't hold water for me. There's a clear difference between the child characters fighting for their planets survival and competing against multiverse level threats like Jiren. One is basically home defense, and the other is not.

[@DBZimran]

The ToP threatened erasure of their universe, that premise is: "fighting for their planet survival".

[@xenoemblem7]

​@@DBZimranWell it's on a universal scale lol

[@DBZimran]

​​Arguably Buu was also a universal threat, he was destroying planets like it was nothing. @@xenoemblem7

[@jahmoymignott4081]

@@DBZimran is Kai Buu Universal since Super is after Kai I only know that Z Buu is Universal

[@yuro-h7m]

Everyone knows that dragonball isn't good because of its plot, but its action. There's nothing wrong with that - different anime have their own strong points, but DBS didn't play to that strength. The villains weren't nearly as iconic as in DBZ, the power ups just felt like plot armor, and worst of all, they sidelined every character besides Goku, only to make him look like an idiot.

[@Witchhunter7020]

Sometimes I used to think dragon super manga just tries to do damage control most of the time to the anime as it was the anime which was a head most of the time.

[@Spnozilla]

I think Super was still a step up from GT overall. Not to say that GT was bad in its entirety but Super fixed a lot of GT’s faults such as having Goku being the only one that mattered. That said, Super did have many flaws like you’ve stated which make it worse than Z overall IMO. Like how the Goku Black arc was resolved in the anime or that the first two arcs were rehashes of movies. Personally when it comes to the Trunks and Mai stuff I don’t really care too much about it. Romance in Dragon Ball was never really all that good and at its best it usually serves as the means for future plot related stuff to happen later like Trunks existing.

[@texcorps9432]

All of Dragonball supers hypertension moments aren't due to the moment being hype mostnof the time but my already established connection to the franchise and these characters

[@shinigamikiragami6886]

The only part of super that I disliked was the resurrection F arc. It felt boring and so linear despite all the z fighters fighting freiza’s army. There was also that frieze soldier who trained with frieza who I was hyped for because it could spin off to a new staple villain character but no, captain ginyu took over his body. I was happy to see a conclusion with ginyu but it came at the cost of an intriguing character. There was also gohan… he was one of my favorite characters and to see him regress to that green tracksuit wimp was just a disappointment…

[@hurricane7727]

I liked Dbz Revival of F movie more than the Super Version plus Art work was Better

[@redlox2]

I honestly feel this is what happens when the original creator was done with the series years ago. And goes fairly “off hands” when it comes to the rough ideas. (And you know when Akira did not want Dragon Ball evolution as the “legacy of the dragon ball series” and basically forced himself to script up two movies which lead to Super.

[@curtisKDashfisher]

Granola becomes a side character in his own arc 😭

[@BlissfulSekaiX]

Eh I don’t think Super is really THAT bad . The only thing that is most disappointing or kinda bad is the major power cliffing but even then characters like Piccolo, Granola, Gas, Moro etc do make sense for them being stronger overtime with plausible explanations in the manga. And I personally don’t think Goku’s character got regressed at all since in the manga if anything his character got even more developed with him and him gaining back his memories of Bardock and his mom along and his knowing what Saiyan pride truly is with Vegetas character of him openly being riddled by guilt but is able to regain sight of his pride as well and is able to break free of such guilt as explained by beerus as well in the granola saga with both of them sticking to their convictions and accepting their nature.

[@BlissfulSekaiX]

So I think Vegeta and Gokus character arcs and their growth have gotten pretty exponential in the manga at least and Vegeta getting sidelined isn’t really also apparent in the manga either since Vegeta is pretty involved within each arc and him having a good role to play in each one which serves for their overall victory of their new villain. But I know you kinda went over mostly the anime at least so I can see why you guys will think all of this stuff but I think most of the issues with super gotten pretty much patched in the manga at least.

[@Dr.Jekyll_]

Let’s just say dragon ball doesn’t have the smartest writing. Dragon Ball 🐉 is the Swiss cheese of anime, plot holes everywhere and nothing makes sense. There are so many plot holes in DB that there are 100’s of fan channels basically dedicated to explaining all the inconsistencies, bad writing and plot holes, the mental gymnastics fans have to go through to understand all the nonsense in DB is actually kinda sad. 😅

[@SeiyaTempest]

I liked Ultra Instinct and the Broly movie. Super Hero was okay too, but everything else has been disappointing.

[@guve25]

I expect click bait content but turns out all points are valid. The retcons are totally unnecessary, and the pacing of the training is weird. Gohan deserve the spotlight, but the build up is eh.