DUNE 1984 miniature effects

[@MozTS]

Love Denis’s dune, but really prefer the art direction of lynch

[@StruggleoftheOutsider]

Yes.. except the love the new Dune.. fuck that shit.. but otherwise yes Agree.

[@khyronkravshera7774]

You need to watch Dune Redux aka the Spicediver edit here on KZbin. It is the best version of Dune available on film.

[@StruggleoftheOutsider]

@@khyronkravshera7774 Idk if it's purely "better" in the sense that it's constrained within the limits of a fan edit.. but yeah, def better than the old tv cut for sure.

[@ThePancakeJedi]

Whenever an opinion is given it will be bashed by the entitled person. Edit: As in 'believing their opinion is the correct one'.

[@StruggleoftheOutsider]

@@ThePancakeJedi it's a war out there.

[@RullXov]

The Lynch Dune had great actors, fantastic OST and an awesome atmosphere. What hampered it were things in the screenplay like the weirding modules, the flying diseased baron, and some low tech animation like the guild navigator flying around in space doing things.

[@voronOsphere]

Amazing behind the scenes documentary!

[@gieselats]

Thank you for sharing. Always interesting ans impairing to listen to your stories. Still a very good Lynch movie.

There videos really put light on all the shortcuts and tricks they have to make to make movies, I love them, I watched linch's dune recently after seen part 2 of Denis', I must say, its all pretty much there, making a better cut, adding back some of the cut scenes, fixing some of the green screen stuff and you get a cult classic a shame it will never happen.

[@malicedownunder]

Fabulous! Love the design of so many of these vehicles and items.

[@avi8r66]

I love these videos. And the story in this about the mexican electrickery is hilarious.

[@JJF_FILMS]

Best channel on KZbin

[@gavinelster3168]

Thank you so much. These interviews are outstanding!

[@lipranditoys]

I love this channel.

[@piercefilm]

Thanks!

[@jedgould5531]

5:33 Because worms must have chocolate! 84 Dune models featured much more heavily than 2022 /24 Dune. I would want to be her friend too😏. Yup talented all around. Cinefex has a photo of Daniela working on the Heighliner entrance. Lovely large model.

[@trainlover16]

I wish the 2021 and 2024 adaptations used miniatures too.

[@Oldsmobile69]

They do use miniatures.

[@trainlover16]

@@Oldsmobile69 Really? Where?

[@Oldsmobile69]

@@trainlover16 Some of the scenes with vehicles. Real dust looks better than cgi dust.

[@trainlover16]

@@Oldsmobile69 True. Which vehicle shots used miniatures? The Ornothopters were CG were they not? At least the ones in wide shots were. I know they built full scale props for them for shots when they were on the ground.

[@shannonmonroe5873]

I just thought the characters in Lynch’s dune were IMO more of what I envisioned them to represent. I’m sorry but the guy who played Paul in the new updated Dune looked too frail and weak, while the 80s version of Paul gave more of a innocent, young and somewhat idealistic yet strong and well trained. I didn’t feel that with the new version, they played it off but it didn’t really work for me just too unbelievably IMO. The vehicles and spacecraft also had a fantastic dynamic stylized look.

[@keanueraine]

Both Lynch's And Villeneuve's Dune look amazing. Considering what they had to work with back in 1983ish it's amazing the movie got made at all let alone look as stylish as it did. Also even though it went wonky on a few story points (like the wierding module) it's a fairly faithful adaptation to the book. As a ten year old watching it on the big screen that year, I prefer Lynch's version over Villeneuve's. I've watched Lynch's Dune like 2,3 dozen times since then and while I enjoyed Villeneuve's version immensely, I can't see myself watching it too many more times. I'll probably pop in Lynch's or even Sci-fi channels again before I watch Villeneuve's. (Can't stand what they did to Chani...Chani was behind every one of Paul's decisions and NEVER felt betrayed by Paul...Ever). I would love a faithful adaptation to Dune with Villeneuve's budget and SCi-Fi channel's length of time with a director who wont try to update it to modern day driven agenda's and just keep it faithful to the book with no race swapping, no gender swapping, just a faithful adaptation. Sci-Fi Channel's adaptation is probably as close as I'll ever get and I'll give that Blu-ray up when I'm in hell.

[@Lumibear.]

Excellent video, thank you, but… why chocolate!? No one explains!

[@jimheimerl1637]

A reply to that same question earlier in the comments points out that chocolate is easier to crush than fiberglass or resin. If the chocolate doesn't melt prematurely, it's a really good idea for the effects they were going for.

[@Lumibear.]

@@jimheimerl1637 aaah, k, cheers, I guess with so little materials to work with that makes sense, still a strange sense, but…

[@jimheimerl1637]

@@Lumibear. Oh, I agree - crazy choice for material, but it worked. One of my engineering classes was for material selection. Sometimes bone was best for a particular set of mechanical requirements. Yes, bone.

[@Lumibear.]

@@jimheimerl1637 well I guess if it works it’s not crazy eh? ;)

[@softdorothy]

Some uneven designs in the first "Dune". Some, like the 'thopter, I thought were poor, but other designs were brilliant.

[@peterdebruyne2286]

As I understand it, the ornithopters were supposed to get moving wings in post-production, but they couldn't get the effect to work or maybe they didn't have the money anymore by then.

[@RideAcrossTheRiver]

Funny thing, but Danielle Verse has blue-within-blue eyes ...

[@pablobal313]

In my opinion Villeneuve's movies have way better script, and very good production design in general, but obviously they take lots of ideas from the Lynch version, I like the so great giedi prime arena scene, but it failed hard in the representation of house Corrino, the "zen" like scenarios felt off the character of the emperor and although I really love Christopher Walken, José Ferrer was excellent, in that case, David Lynch version also is totally on spot...

[@markpaterson2053]

This classic was/is TEN TIMES BETTER than those limp Denis Villeneuve movies that have no character and NO MUSIC; everything about Lynch's version surpasses the limp 21st century version (and every piece of crap Denis Villeneuve makes).

[@salvagedb2470]

Model makers Rule for the Reality you want to see , Fuck CGI ..Its just a Cop out for Hard work an being Original an being an Art , its the Human factor ..you cant Fake that..

[@charlesshamseldin9555]

Still much prefer this Dune over the new one. This film just oozed and dripped a style all its own; and the costumery, to this day, absolutely unrivaled.

[@jameshicks7125]

I agree completely. There are some cringe parts in the David Lynch one but I love the style of it. Denis's Dune immediately felt dry (no pun intended) too many well known actors with too many distinctly different and regional accents. I never saw it on the big screen. It comes across as an "academic" painting if you follow. The kind of art where all the rules are clearly there and it's technically beautiful, yet lacks the soul. I did see Lynch's in the theater and loved it. I think leaving out the Guild was a mistake. Maybe the third film will bring that element in.

[@LordOfNihil]

i kind of have a mixed opinion on this. the visual style was nothing short of spectacular. but the effects shots seemed to be all over the place in quality. i liked the worm scenes in particular. they also really nailed geidi prime. while also having some shots that just felt bungled or like they are showing a painting instead of a scene. lynch dune also gets the worst thopter award. even the scifi miniseries concept was better. new dune hits it out of the park. also costume design i feel was better in new dune. i think it was a good idea to ditch the medieval garb in favor of something more pragmatic. now from a book readers perspective, lynch dune game us more memberberries. i didnt read the books (all of them) until after children of dune miniseries, but then going back to lynch you really start to notice them. little bits of dialogue and a couple sequences that say they really played homage to the source material even though they didnt quite have time to cover everything with as much detail as i would have liked. the miniseries remains the most book-accurate in my opinion and really goes into it in detail (though its worms were lame).

[@patreekotime4578]

@@LordOfNihil They ran out of time and money to finish the effects. If you understand that going in it is easier to appreciate it I think. The models, the sets, the costumes... much of it is unrivalled. The sets especially were hand-carved in wood. Nobody builds sets like that. It's a jewel IMO.

[@LordOfNihil]

@@patreekotime4578 i was always a huge fan of lynch dune. there are a ton of things about it i like.

[@TheRealNormanBates]

I discussed this with my friends. If there was a way to blend Lynch's *Dune* and Villeneuve's, it would be near perfect. Even so, I am one of the weirdos who wishes an army of animators from around the world would animate the 10 hour Jodorowosky's *Dune.*

[@ptonpc]

While the Denis' version is good. Lynch's version was beautiful.

[@patreekotime4578]

I would buy a book just about this! Love all of these images!

[@williambowden4192]

Ed Naha's book: The Making of Dune should be on your list

[@patreekotime4578]

@@williambowden4192 Cool, thank you! I have heard it mentioned before but I forgot!

[@kirk09100]

Really unsung heroes.

[@fogman900]

To Brian and Danielle: Thank you for your absolutely beautiful work, some of my all time favorite visuals ever put to film.

[@jimmyzimms]

Truly great model work and those forced perspective shots are some of the best put on film

[@SB111058]

Lynch's Dune looks way better design wise to the new ones...

[@aliensoup2420]

I think they mainly differed on their general philosophy of design - Lynch was style over function, while Villeneuve was function over style. I am conflicted between the 2 movies and appreciate both for different reasons.

[@chanjackie2299]

@@aliensoup2420 Without style movies die. Hollywood is long dead.

[@jamesabernethy7896]

As good as the new version of Dune is, the Lynch version is still my favourite. I love the style and creativity. The Harvester is a beautiful vehicle. I also love the worms in Lynch's version. I feel because they are puppeteer, they have personality.

[@Xoferif]

I really enjoyed that - thank-you! The anecdote about the chocolate spice harvester is priceless. 😄

[@berendharmsen]

I was confused by the anecdote to be honest. I didn't understand why it was made out of chocolate. I got the impression it had to do with the worm teeth being damaged, but I didn't see how chocolate addressed that problem.

[@piercefilm]

Chocolate gets crushed easily. Softer material than fibreglass or resin.

[@berendharmsen]

@@piercefilm I was just surprised they used chocolate, especially given the heat there. Is chocolate a known substitute for these types of things? I love the creativity if they came up with it themselves.

[@jonathanswift2251]

@@piercefilm Don't Sandworms like the taste of Chocolate? Almost as much as mélange which tastes like cinnamon.

[@foolishwatcher]

@@berendharmsen The behaviour of chocolate can vary significantly depending on the ingredients. The melting is greatly affected by the fat content and chocolate with a high cacao and low fat content does melt less easily and was probably used. Given that the very word "chocolate" comes from the Nahuatl (=Aztec) word "xocolatl", the Mexican crew probably knew exactly how to use this indeed very unusual model building material.

[@entertherealmofchaos]

Brilliant artists, but the time constraints were savage

[@rickytoddbotelho9555]

Stunning visual effects shots. Bravo 👌👏❤

[@rancosteel]

@@rickytoddbotelho9555 The scene where the ship lands after folding space and they departed the ramp. It was done using forced perspective from 30 feet away. Looked so cool.

[@secretsof7431]

this really complements the making of dune book. awesome video thankyou

[@sbcinema]

this was a great movie

[@spacecase13]

I grew up seeing this on cable TV, first in black and white, later in color, and later still the extended version on DVD. I have always felt this film just does not get the respect it deserves and am mystified by it. The effort shown here just turns the feelings I have had for it to 11. The amount of difficulty that was overcome on display here, and the efforts put in to defeat those difficulties is mind melting. I had no idea how hard the production was, the innovation in model building alone is truly astounding. I will be watching it again, but now with new awe and respect for what is in it. Profound thanks for sharing this video.

[@selwynandrews9665]

I agree. Always have had a soft spot for this movie. I know David Lynch has disowned it, and I haven't seen the new Dune movies. However, there is a quality of imagination that this film has that feels more in keeping with the novels, in my humble opinion.

[@thinkbolt]

"Mexican electrickery"

[@quattro4s]

If only David Lynch had the final cut, imagine what would've released

[@BruceStephan]

David Lynch should be proud of his movie , even though it was a real pain to make .

[@aliensoup2420]

The Guild ship unloading on Kaitain, and the Attreides landing on Arrakeen are the most amazing and realistic miniatures I have seen. Fantastic work.

[@williamfawkes8379]

Thanks for sharing this. This was such an important film in my childhood, the first movie that I went to with just my father. The style of this film was amazing. The skill and devotion of production staff in filmmaking in the age of practical effects is something that continues to astound me, the more I learn about it.

[@markpaterson2053]

don't know why it flopped, as everyone I knew back then all went to see it and at work everyone was talking about it. I went to see it a few times, had never seen anything like it, and it was the first time I took interest in the other works of a director. David Lynch has yet to be surpassed since I started noting directors

[@chrissalazar95]

The VO sounds like it was recorded ON Dune 😂😂😂 . I love it! Amazing, never knew about this level of accomplishment. Bravo. And thank you

[@stopmo01]

That was an incredible video. Thanks for that.

[@franosbornblaschke3694]

Much maligned, but beautiful film. Great clip!

[@dbaider9467]

Might be the only person I know who prefers/loves this original version over the newer, desaturated, gloomy version recently put out there. Sure, desaturation makes the CGI cheaper and faster to process - remove most of the color spectrum and the computers can render faster - but the downside to this "look" is a visual bleaching and dullness. Lynches version was colorful and lovely to watch.

[@cds2882]

I prefer the David Lynch version of the harvesters to the current version.

[@christophermitchellsr9492]

i had just watched this on Netflix last night so this was great timing . the skill of the builders an how they go about making the models an large scale builds an the backgrounds sets are amazing . the stories that are told by the people who worked on the models an behind the scenes help many people like myself appreciate not only the actors but the people you don't see more so than ever . this is by far the best channel for the behind the camera stories that is on youtube . i look forward to each video

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

Skip the Netflix version - you need to watch the Spicediver edit, here on KZbin - especially if you liked the original cut. I grew up loving Dune, the Spicediver version is the icing on the cake though!

[@andrewglazebrook1585]

Fabulous movie and a unique vision !!

[@kyleashley]

... thank you SO much for sharing, SO many great pix (my eyes are hungrily eating these images like a feast ! ). The interviews and the descriptions and stories are wonderful . The Golden age of Cinema VFX.

[@mattdawg83686]

These pictures are absolutely stunning!

[@gigteevee6118]

This is such a great collection of experiences of making an iconic film! Lots not seen or heard before ❤

[@BrodiBarringer]

And There's the problem with budgets..there is NO NO NO reason to shoot in mexico..or morocco, Africa or any desert outside of the US..damn..exotic locations cost money, inexperienced crew cost YOU money just pay for a pro..US has Every geographical location a filmmaker could ever need!!.. Damn..pay for your own vacation to Fiji, mexico, bahamas wherever, don't do it on Warner bros dime..EVERY film ever made can/could be made in the US..Every!..stay here, keep on or under budget, use pros, stay on schedule..I can make the SAME film for 1mill that you people make for 10mill, NO doubt..Just because you have the money doesn't mean you have to spend all the money..only whats necessary

[@rimurutempest9937]

You should probably look into just how expensive it is to shoot on location in the U.S.

[@Bob-Fields]

LOL, get a load of Cecil B. DeMille here.

[@DavidDouglas-q7v]

You always surprise me with something new and unexpected. Thank you!

[@s2mann]

Very kind comments about Raffaella and how the team pulled together to produce this artwork.

[@Oldsmobile69]

Wow, what a shitshow. Impressive they were able to come out with a film as good as it is.

[@chanjackie2299]

People used to do real work back then, they were concentrated on their aims. Making these miniatures shows they were really talented.

[@Bob-Fields]

"Shitshow"? That's what you took away from this?

[@the.variable.japanese]

Thanks for sharing.

[@jcsk8]

Great art. Missed with CGI but all tthe respect with that artists.

[@jasonrjohnston]

Awesome!

[@bergfruehling]

This is one of your greatest videos so far, not just because of the miniatures but because of all the stories about crazy problems they had to deal with.

[@piercefilm]

Thanks! It was fun to edit and organise all those great photos. There are many more stories I had to edit out because it got too long.

[@greycatturtle7132]

Cool

[@berendharmsen]

To think that initially, John Dykstra was in the picture to do the miniature compositing - that was the one thing Lynch' Dune didn't quite get together. The in-camera perspective shots were amazing, but everything flying looked dated even when the movie came out. They did the best they could, but from this description it was clear that Dykstra was correct when he thought he wouldn't be able to deliver the shots when doing them in Mexico. Warts and all, I still love this film though. Very cool and original models too, with the exception of the Atreides ornithopter, that looked absolutely horrible.

[@jonathanswift2251]

Well said. I think Lynch was a highly visionary filmmaker for Dune. Villeneuve's costumes and other production elements were definitely influenced by Lynch's. The miniatures (especially the Sandworms) could have been better.

[@berendharmsen]

@@jonathanswift2251 I think Villeneuve also conceded that he was in several cases inspired by Lynch' movie and he appreciated the visual style. The costumes and sets were amazing and hold up very well today. Ironically, I think that the 'guild highliner cathedral cockpit' that they were so proud of in this video actually turned out to be one of the weakest miniature sets of the movie. For me, they feel like bit of a break in the style of the sets and it feels a little slapped together. Part of it is of course also that they had to composite the navigator into it and that shot also didn't quite come together. Not to mention the fact that the psychedelic visualisation of the space folding, and the subsequent 'fade in' of the ship over Arrakis aged really, really badly (in fact, it looked wonky even when it came out). I was amazed to see how incredibly large some of those ship models were by the way. So much bigger than ILM ships of that age used to be. I was also surprised to see that the large cylindrical Guild highliner was actually a model. The way it was shot, both the shot of the full-sized ship and the decorated door detail always looked like paintings to me - and they might as well have been, because you only ever see them from one, and only one, static angle. As I said, I hated the yellow Atreides ornithopter, but the rest of the vehicles worked for me. The sand worms may have been a little hit-and-miss in some of the shots (especially when you see them from a distance), but many shots looked surprisingly good I thought. Back then, I certainly thought they nailed the design of the worms, but they clearly struggled with making the scale of them to look convincing all the time. But given the tools they had to work with, I have a lot of respect for what they managed to come up with.

[@jonathanswift2251]

@@berendharmsen The production design and Art Direction were generally excellent--it needed a master VFX supervisor of miniature photography like Dykstra to bring it to full, convincing fruition.

[@berendharmsen]

@@jonathanswift2251 Agreed. Although to be fair to those that ended up doing it: given the circumstances under which they worked it's actually amazing it ended up as good as it did. The details in this video are amazing. Not just the challenges of the electricity supply, but also that snippet about the flies: the idea that you need to fumigate the set before you start your motion control shot. The idea that they were genuinely afraid that watching dailies you might find a shot ruined because you would see flies in some of the frames is just too surreal for words.

[@Epoxinator]

I liked some of the model designs in the 1986 version, but they were shot poorly, and not convincing at all.

[@jo-annfat-bricks2471]

Sean Young is Amazing!

[@piercefilm]

Most of her role was cut out of the film. Luckily, she went around with her super 8mm camera and filmed behind the scenes.

[@spazoq]

Everything in this movie was amazing, except the Thopter. That thing was so far off from what it should have been, it really jerked you out of the movie.

[@LukSter18998]

does look a bit train car cratelike😅

[@berendharmsen]

Also, I have to ask: is the fact that the model unit supervisor is billed as 'Brian Smithies' an indication that this was really another special effects professional that wanted to have his name removed from the credits? Only joking of course. Or....?

[@piercefilm]

No, that's his name. He started working on Thunderbirds with Derek Meddings and later supervised the model work on Dark Crystal and various Bond films. A model making legend!

[@berendharmsen]

@@piercefilm I just blame you for me not knowing that. 99% of my knowledge about model-based special effects comes from you! 🙂 I'm so glad you are now finding other sources to add stuff to your channel and continue to build your channel into a great resource about the coolest aspect of special effects: a one-stop shop to learn about the legends of shooting models for film. Every time you post a new video is one of those 'drop everything and watch' moments.

[@CarletonTorpin]

Hearing that they had to spend 5 minutes before each take, in order to remove the flies from the set, I'm reminded of the Puffins that were in Star Wars (8?). Maybe they could have made a creative decision to leave the flies on the set, and if they sneak into a shot, then just say it's a tiny, Proto-Guild Navigator.

[@piercefilm]

When shooting motion control you do a frame of film every few seconds so any flies would appear and disappear wrecking the shot

[@CarletonTorpin]

@@piercefilm You are so right! Excellent point.

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

Talk about blue balling - why was the model made out of chocolate? Did she think the worm was real and wanted to give it a treat?? You can't mention a fact like that and not explain it. And finally... Did they eat the model afterwards??? These questions deserve answers.

[@piercefilm]

It needed to be a soft material for the animatronic worm to crush it easily. In Mexico, chocolate is everywhere.

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

@@piercefilm, and the question I forgot to ask was - how did she keep it from melting in the back window of her car? Chocolate melts in my cupboard during summer... In northern England!

[@robertevans8126]

:)

[@hugoverdeguer6891]

Outstanding!