Which Suspension Is Best? 👨‍🔬 Scrap Mechanic Science!

[@outzymes3636]

"Scrap wheels aren't in creative. Can you believe that?!" Y e s

[@Durf]

xD

[@edisoncambod8335]

minecreaft 1.17 has now a update

[@edisoncambod8335]

And it's nice I wanna go to the game now!?!?

[@sheepy2345]

@@edisoncambod8335 why is that a question that makes no sense at all and also this isn't Minecraft its scrap mechanic

[@Poatatero]

Edison Cambod This is not discord

[@Backup_Jack]

i really wanted him to try a double wishbone suspension, but he never did :(

[@JamesMonkeyL_13]

Oof

[@JamesMonkeyL_13]

It’s a good suspension

[@user-jt9ns6rf1l]

jackup back, tis me yeetus, strange to see you here

[@Backup_Jack]

@@user-jt9ns6rf1l tis strange to see you here

[@raycar1165]

I've never seen anyone make a 4 link suspension either. Not saying no one has just that I haven't seen it.

[@jimmydcm4323]

Who remembers when he was on multiplayer Monday

[@TxFal]

I also remember when camodo was on multiplayer monday

[@FriskyD.]

Pepperidge Farm remembers

[@FlashDrive356]

I know, I wish he would do more.

[@lukyluk_py]

Good old times ;-;

[@QuackyboiYT]

Yep I do

[@shadowlord0162]

10:30 "it will force these piston suspensions to compress *faster stronger harder* " *daft punk would like to know your location*

[@totalpkgproductions2797]

*daft punk* has *le traler*

[@totalpkgproductions2797]

wat

[@_Cheko_]

i think the front wheels were hitting the body a lot, which was causing all the noise and some bounces

[@robertbalazslorincz8218]

Yes, it was that. As someone who gas played SM for 2 years, I know that the lot of noise and effects are caused by collisions.

[@steeljawX]

Just wondering Durf, but wouldn't a more realistic course test be better for this? You tested the performance of suspension with crap wheels on a relatively flat surface. Most automobile manufacturers kinda go the other way, they test the vehicle on crap surfaces with good wheels; like interval speed bumps and divots. I'm just saying that the knowledge of using actual wheels is a bit of a no brainer and I think cleaner results could have been obtained if the wheels were the same and you had a course with pipes embedded into the ground like speed bumps. But it's interesting that the swing arm bearing systems had those weird over reactions to everything. I'm also not fully convinced that your drop tests for the bearing arm suspensions actually proved anything. From what I was seeing, they bottomed out (natural for suspension to not be able to take an excessive amount of force) and the trail arm (parallel to the vehicle) just happened to have the wheels roll up on the bounce and catch itself. On the sway arm (perpendicular to the vehicle) the wheels catching wasn't as smooth as it wasn't parallel to the rotation of the wheels; causing that wobble. I think you need to re-test those two systems with longer arms intended to catch the vehicle so we can rule out that phenomena.

[@Durf]

yea I might have to revisit this video, do some double wishbone suspensions too, and a better test course, maybe something "real", and a couple other extreme examples (like 3 courses) The octagonal wheels and flat ground was intentional for this video, as a way to see directly how each suspension deals with (consistent) bounces (relative to speed) Normally that would be a bad thing (because mythbusters showed a square wheel still works just as good if it's spinning fast enough), but SM physics isn't the same as real physics... Still though, will probably revisit the idea.

[@littleprincemica2721]

Oh my this is a very. L O N G comment not showing by hate but ok

[@nyscersul42]

Please do revisit! Interesting topic, failing a revisit of this topic, science experiments is a fun format.

[@steeljawX]

@@Durf After playing for a while, I've landed on doing a kind of hybrid rigid-arm/ Christie suspension. Front wheels are welded together so that they're a rigid arm and then they have rotation to also lead back into a leading arm style suspension (a pivot point where the arm ends with the suspension spring hitting between the actual axle and the arm end for suspension) and then flip that for the rear wheels. The advantages to that is that rigid arms are a bit better for off-roading, which a lot of Survival is, and the Christie system just performs better than straight suspension. It gives you a little more room for play. But if you do revisit this, I think taking the off-road slopes of survival would definitely help us consider what could be better over all. All in all, still waiting for Ch2 survival whenever that happens.

[@hunzhurte]

Would have liked to see double wishbone and sway bar suspension in there as well.

[@initialyeet3951]

Do you mean suspension with a sway bar? Sway bars are added to suspension, they’re not a type

[@hunzhurte]

@@initialyeet3951 Yeah like sway bar vs no sway bar.

[@knomesaynmafk4789]

Torsion bar?

[@mocanulaurentiu5812]

@@knomesaynmafk4789 torsion bar is sway bar?

[@knomesaynmafk4789]

@@mocanulaurentiu5812 torsion bars and sway bars are completely different. Torsion bar is a suspension set up that uses a twisted piece of metal for lack of better words as the spring. Sway bars tie 2 sides of a vehicle together to stop it swaying. Layman's terms

[@thecreativitysyndrome]

there should be a "strength" setting in the controller, some option that will describe how hard the controller would restrain the bearing when not activated, this would make horizontal suspensions and weights systems a lot easier!!

[@Damian-cilr2]

or maybe a kind of variant of the controller called the "smart controller" with a few more extra functions like asigning inputs for seats to use (a or d or both w or s or both etc)

[@WynterLegend]

I wonder, with standard wheels, and a lower center of balance, would the smart-suspension result in a near-tiltless drive?

[@_Zdex007]

WynterLegend Don’t even need smart engine, just check my workshop there’s the transporter (I think, it’s something with a ton of seats).

[@_Zdex007]

As someone making custom suspension, I always use piston , my older builds use vanilla springs, but I switch to pistons due to the suspension glitch (I happens a lot less with piston). Also, I tried the smart engine to tuned it, but decided to switch back to just using heavy vehicles because they were easier to tune (a lot less stuff to adjust).

[@jackofall9553]

Maybe try a double wishbone setup mixed with the rotor suspension while using the piston suspension in place of the traditional one used.

[@jakemiller581]

Is there a playlist with all these scrap mechanic science videos? I would love to watch more!

[@Durf]

uhh, I have a playlist called ScrapBusters, and it has some videos where I test some... thing... idk how scientific they are 😅

[@tombalmores4669]

The no suspension scrap wheel test is so painful it gave me a headache

[@spacewalk3046]

28:05 Yes exactly! but why didn't u try the vanilla compressed suspension? And can u maybe make a video about this but with other suspension mechanisms from the workshop. (like double wishbone, or dependant suspension)

[@tykiahjames9372]

Double wishbone works fairly well with the suspension pieces replaced withe pistons on medium to large vehicles, especially with modes pistons linked to a configurable setup like durfs smart suspension

[@Dinger_D]

They did it today!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@tr165eaglebsa4]

Durf look up (as the wheel turns) by (US Auto industry) on KZbin, is old but still has good information.

[@Omlet221]

I think adjustable dampening on the vanilla suspension could make them a lot better

[@Baer1990]

I'd make the selfmade scrapwheel with 4 very light blocks, and 1 heavy block. The best suspension can keep the wheel on the gound

[@Pauglin]

I am one of not so many people that had actually spent most of their playtime building suspension mechanisms and tuning cars (right now I have 880 hours on sm). I only watched the first half of the video and I'm not sure if you mentioned something I am about to mention righ now. Basically you can't really say which suspension is the best. You can pretty much tune almost everything to work well. There is not really any suspension type that is superior. And even if you have the best suspension ever but for example your weight distribution succs or your engine is overpowered, the car won't drive well. There are just so many things affecting the suspension performance that I don't really think a test like this proves what is the best suspension type. Also important thing I want to mention: the "bearing with resistance" suspension is pretty complicated one to talk about. First of all, when you make the arms longer, the suspension will get much better (for example with the "I beam" (google "trophy truck I beams" if you don't know what I'm talking about) style, longer arms would mean less side to side movement while going up and down and less camber change too - that would dramatically improve the performance). Another thing is that making the "bearing suspension" that goes like from the front to back is always a bad idea in scrap mechanic. The reason is that in sm the torque is not created in the engine but rather right at the wheels. That makes the suspension want to spin to the opposite side than the wheels (watch kan's video on gyros for quick explanation). That makes the suspension softer or stiffer on acceleration or braking. You might believe that that makes it have more grip on acceleration but that is not the case - in reality it's the opposite.

[@Chronometrian]

Holy hell long message

[@_Zdex007]

For me it’s custom with piston (they don’t suffer from the suspension glitch). I don’t use the smart engine for simplicity and vanilla sakes.

[@Pauglin]

@@_Zdex007 you can avoid suspension glitch pretty easily

[@_Zdex007]

Pauglin I usually prefer not having to deal with it.

[@Pauglin]

@@_Zdex007 ok, my problem with vanilla pistons is that you can't adjust the stiffness on them and they tend to be pretty stiff

[@indisputablefacts8507]

I did some experiments in my survival world to come up with the quickest car for getting around (on-road). I messed with a bunch of stuff and didn't seriously find much of a difference with any design. Then I happened to time how quick my (unloaded) delivery wagon got down the road. (You've probably got a similar vehicle - capable of carrying a few dozen crates). So yeah, that clunky truck was nearly twice as fast as my small roadsters.

[@rysiii811]

what about multiple types of suspension simultaniously (especially the one on bearing, both types or in combination with vanilla suspension)

[@RatoCavernaBR]

I wonder how important in the lore of the game ledges will be for developers to hold it in survival.

[@daanbos5918]

the major advantage whit piston suspention is you can make a lowrider

[@brianfox340]

0:30 into this video I paused to subscribe and comment this. Second day playing the game, and this is the kind of content I adore.

[@robertbalazslorincz8218]

The rolling motion depends somewhat on how high your center of mass is, too. It's like a lightweight train on bad quality track: it is just as an uncomfortable ride.

[@robertbalazslorincz8218]

Idea: make the car relatively heavy, and have a low center of mass with the wheels being tilted inward at 25 degrees, and have "soft" suspension.

[@final_catalyst]

I found a upside-down U with suspension on both arms to be quite effective. It allows for individual tires to dip well the bumps get absorbed.

[@adonai4493]

Try to recreate a torsion bar suspension see if that helps? That might be really good it’s one of the smoothest suspensions I know

[@christophercain7343]

20 minutes longer than it needed to be

[@markorahoske6931]

This is why i like From The Depths, you are given a myriad of information for your craft, you can even put a LUA block on it, it drives me nuts that there isn't some sort of information giving device that's easy to use in this game.

[@Cr4sHOv3rRiD3]

It was a while i didn't play scrap mechanic, but I remember i was always making dual shock suspension system with vanilla parts and with pipe pieces. I was testing it back then with different setups and combinations and found that perfect one. I was using medium sized custom build dual shock suspension only with vanilla parts and Installing them on the bearing drive as well, it was perfect combination, my vehicle was never roll over. I would like to see you testing those type of suspension in the future and I think to come back to play the game again, it was a while and for sure they've change some things there :D

[@Durf]

I tried to record a followup vid, but I think I just have to do it again lol, some combos I missed for sure! It'll be fun to come back to this experiment :D I'm not a vanilla building expert, but I'll try with some workshop examples too

[@Cr4sHOv3rRiD3]

@@Durf I think the workshop have some nice examples of whisborns i didn't search them but you can make it work nice in vanilla, Also you can mix both suspension with the piston, and you will get like Adjustable Double Wishborn and it is even better :D, it was really good time spent experimenting on those back then :D

[@dhlabsgaming1065]

durf,you can go into the test branch to get the survival parts in creative.

[@Damian-cilr2]

the controllers should probably have a smart variant that allows you to change the stiffness of it,and some other stuff

[@henrydutoit69]

“These Results don’t reflect my narrative let’s go with it anyway “-durf the scrap dwarf

[@durgun8247]

The problem with vanilla suspension only being able to be tuned to hard or soft bumps can be fixed with shock absorbers. If you don't know, shock absorbers are a sort of spring that increase the force exerted when compressed, so that the suspension pushes down faster when it needs to.

[@HEXAN-SC]

I love how you made a trailing arm and wishbone suspension of blocks niced

[@justaguycalledjosh]

By increasing the frequency of the bounces, you increase the average height of the wheel centre and decrease the suspension travel, putting less force on the body.

[@farbenfrohesgrau4056]

Maybe, but also due to the faster spinning wheels, the gyroscopic efekt increases resulting higher stability

[@maxis_scott_engie_maximov_jr]

1:30 If I remember correctly they aren't perfectly cylindrical, it's like an approximation of a cylinder, the physics engine probably does have Wheel colliders that are much smoother but the problem is that those colliders aren't modular and can have only one specific direction

[@dragonmen0027]

I was wondering how you made the number highest number lock with that smart logic?

[@itamarblomont700]

No this is some high quality skrepscience

[@ianowens1905]

I use low friction blocks for wheels and thrusters. Try it, it works really well

[@noobplayer_23]

Scrap mechanic That’s a name that I’ve never heard since a long time ago

[@clanpsi]

I really wish they would allow you to set suspension ride height and stiffness separately.

[@axelk4921]

that is the exact reason why mercedes benz invented the space link axle in 1982

[@Scrap-Bran]

"my vehicle is powered by snakes" lol

[@Ion_el]

Youre videos are getting better

[@paolob.5667]

10:31 More than ever hour after our work is never over

[@hunzhurte]

*Dank Punk intensifies*

[@paolob.5667]

@@hunzhurte lol

[@clownofwar]

You could use the bearing forward linear facing suspension, for a tank or somthing

[@sirengine2548]

I will try piston suspensions. Thank you for clear explanation

[@initialyeet3951]

Those wheels were hitting the body, and you should have tried double wishbone

[@MrRyanroberson1]

i would like to advise you try full body suspension. attach the wheels to an H-shaped frame, and attach linear springs or pistons to each wheel.

[@claytonheath484]

Will there ever be a video or stream where durf doesn't complain about scrap mechanic

[@matthewirvine1361]

Would the bearing arms benefit from being longer? For example on the ones going widthways would it not massively reduce the change in camber for the same vertical travel? Therefore keeping the wheels in better contact with the surface to correct the steering issue. It would potentially allow for longer travel suspension too if you were building an off-road vehicle

[@Chronometrian]

Hmmm I do believe a design of both the vanilla suspension block and the bearing suspension design mixed together would be a pretty good tank based suspension

[@_Zdex007]

ATALICKES BLACK PANTHER that’s either a swing arm suspension (side to side) or trailing suspension (front to back and it’s one type of tank suspension )

[@oroel4910]

"My vehicle is powered by snakes" PETA wants to know your location

[@Trouble_2X]

Durf please test double wishbone and solid axle suspension maybe with some other more obscure suspension types in another video please. Also please test double wishbone with the suspension with the bearing that mounts the suspension to the body directly above the other bearing and with the mounting bearing closer to the centre of the car as when the angle changes the leverage changes so that the effective stiffness increases with compression so that it can deal with both small and big bumps. If you push this to the extreme you can have the suspension larger width ways than length ways although this transfers alot of weight to the outside wheels while turning so makes a fast car but the outside has soo much grip it may role

[@szymongaming1113]

i tune suspension so the car is half a block down and 1.5 blocks up so it can retract well and it can go down well thats why i keep my speed high

[@janbaxa3282]

What if you do bearings (last design), but longer arm with suspension???

[@_Zdex007]

Jan Baxa That would make the suspension softer with the same power setting, it’s called trailing arm (the front to back one), the side to side is a swing arm suspension.

[@whyiwakeup6460]

Ah yes “suspensions”

[@SagaciousDjinn]

Sus pension. My dad has one of those.

[@Durf]

@@SagaciousDjinn HAH

[@Tommy-pv1vh]

the front to back bearing suspension is called a trailing arm suspension

[@Melly_The1]

you can also use a stop sign as a scrap wheel

[@TheMaddestMan1]

what if he did all suspensions at the same time

[@birdthenerd5967]

Who remembers old scrap mechanic

[@tykiahjames9372]

Double wishbone paired with rotational shock absorbance for pitch on tank tracks works like you would not believe it is just 👌 amazing when done right May upload my chassis blueprint for it if anyone want to give it a test

[@kiro_derg]

combine the two types of bearing suspension

[@TheZiiFamily]

This is cool but can you make a tutorial and how to use the gyro hovers and how to make a small gyroscope (I want to make a hover/flyer)

[@AmericanFry]

great video but anyone building a performance car wont just slap suspension on, i use wishbone or other ways depending on the size and the uses. the only time ive ever done straight suspension to block to bearing was my first car

[@RasseruS]

@Durf You should do some testing on 6 and 8 wheel suspension. Also, test with Christie suspension, Horstmann suspension, torsion bar suspension and spring suspension.

[@steeljawX]

There really isn't such thing as torsion bar in Scrap Mechanic. The closest he could do would be the vertical bearing suspension on the last vehicle. There's no material in the game that will twist or flex aside from pistons, bearings, and suspension springs. So you can't really make a suspension based on the concept of torsion bars. The closest thing to it is to get bearings to act as though they are torsion bars. Great idea, it's just the game's limitations will only allow the most jank pseudo version unless there's a mod out there with an actual torsion bar system in it.

[@spawnnumber2126]

If you did this in a survival custom game, you could have both scrap wheel, and modpack.

[@silenceddreams121]

Love your channel and science towards suspension

[@Vlad-te5ij]

The bearing suspension is the best when this is installed on an independent suspension

[@nyscersul42]

Transverse and longitudinal, is the orientations of the suspension bearings.

[@jimmyziegler8456]

how come in survival if you don't have suspension you don't have bumps and it's a smooth ride. COME ON SCRAP MECHANIC!!!!

[@hpetty9404]

You should do this for steering as well...

[@gdshippo2402]

Can you do a double suspesion with the vertical suspensions? Suspension down to the axel point then another to control the sway of the vertical flex? I'm referring to the bearing style

[@deltacx1059]

So your "side to side" bearing suspension is very similar to swing axle suspension which has unique issues you may want to read about, also don't use it for steering because it's issues are so much worse when used for steering.heck reading about the different types of real suspension would help you a bit.

[@blazindragon296]

or make an actual suspension like a control arm then have the struts to it. I did it on my vehicles.

[@LaPatateDouce]

Turn on the dev mode in a survival map and get the survival unlimited inventory (with scrap weels) ;)

[@jimmyziegler8456]

Durf an idea for suspension what if you made a scissor lift suspension that you can adjust the height of the vehicle with smart engines.

[@_Zdex007]

The Guy 5 why using bearings to emulate a piston when there’s already a piston in-game?

[@rauphire_stone9189]

What if you do suspension combinations?

[@Iamthevoids]

Omfg the talking stain outtro, that had me lauging for a hot minute, great vid nonetheless

[@domhuj]

Maybe you could try to make a Tatra 8x8 suspension, and try to test it?

[@ejon3423]

In scrap mechaic, tuning the suspensions, changes a lot the behiavour of the car.

[@gooberman1484]

Durf you make my day better :)

[@Dergishmere]

doing double suspension works well, one stronger than the other. you missed that one

[@tanjanaude790]

i wish i had scrap mechanic because it looks like such a fun game

[@Durf]

I do a giveaway every month on my second channel! you can enter directly from this page on my website: scrapmechanicmods.com/giveaway

[@tanjanaude790]

But it say sorry limited Steam Accounts are not allowed

[@tanjanaude790]

But it said

[@Durf]

​@@tanjanaude790 oh... Steam says your account is limited until you spend your first $5 ... There's nothing really I can do about that unfortunately :

[@tanjanaude790]

That sucks thanks tho

[@atomictesting6412]

You should try them with wishbone suspension

[@zdendapohlriech]

The wheels of the third car Are shaking like you were driving czech D1 highway(made from concrete panels)

[@sethpederson9180]

Ive sat awake at night wondering this question

[@LGSyrus]

And what about wishbone and other suspension mechanics?

[@SUPERTALETV]

Durd you can go into the test Branch to get survival blocks in creative

[@shamelessape1]

you would think that they would work on the physics in a game that is mostly about driving

[@Thetitaniumsteppermotor]

All way bearing suspension vertical and horizontal

[@Aero2045]

Welcome back to “scerap mecniac”

[@imadeyoinoraka779]

How to make a double wishbone woth a stiff axel for steering? (Im just mixing up words cuz im no car guy)

[@1sannn]

Ever tried combining types? In real cars they mix different types. Leaf springs and springs at least, if not a couple types

[@captaincookie72]

Good to know! Good to know.

[@ACupOfDuck]

What would happen if you do them ALL at the same time?

[@delavanty]

The ending needs to be longer aaaa

[@nighthawkgaming1962]

what about a spring type kinda like the side ways bearing 1 but with more suspension bits. if that makes sense

[@_Zdex007]

Nighthawk gaming The side to side suspension is called a swing arm suspension.

[@nighthawkgaming1962]

@@_Zdex007 ah ok

[@LCOfficerUNIT097]

Not sure why you would want to do suspension tests with scrap wheels. They’re designed to be abandoned asap once you get your hands on beeswax for normal wheels

[@TheMrSeagull]

One thing of note - the Scrap Wheels have *more* friction than the other wheels.

[@Durf]

oh really? I didn't know that! I'll be sure to try them in my follow up vid! turns out they are in creative for 0.4.8 test branch