For Smart People, the FORERUNNERS were SO DUMB... (Halo Lore Explained)

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Today we take a look at the tragic mistakes of the Forerunners, and how their dumb actions during the end of the Flood War may have doomed the galaxy to an eventual Flood Infection. All that and more during today's Halo Lore video.
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[@pll3827]

Well, there's a reason why Wisdom and Intelligence are occasionally seen as two different attributes in RPGs.

[@kabob0077]

Ancient Humans had a higher WIS than the Forerunners.

[@trekker105]

The forerunners would absolutely put tomatoes in a fruit salad.

[@venomousfrog5546]

This. This right here is the exact crux of the fall of the forerunners.

[@silent_stalker3687]

@@kabob0077 wait until you realize humans were the forerunners until halo 4 decided that debate. Bungi didn’t seem to know which was which

[@DaMasta981]

@@silent_stalker3687 no not really, Bungie made it clear at least that Spark was crazy from his isolation. They tiptoed around it during development until they decided that Humans and Forerunners weren’t the same. Then 343 officially confirmed they weren’t.

[@mespaillat921]

The forerunners being a flawed civilization and fumbling the bag is one of the major plot lines of the series

[@downrangecash2418]

Yeah. Like, a big part of it is how the political battles between the Didact and the Master Builder weakened the Forerunners in the long term. The entire point was that the Flood preyed on the Forerunners' flawed nature.

[@mespaillat921]

@@downrangecash2418 definitely a major factor in the endgame. When I read the forerunner trilogy, I really got a sense of just how damn big the forerunners really were. Millions of planets to govern and the worst example we have is beef between two super high ranking elites and their caste? I wish those were the kind of problems my governing body had in today’s day, like right now 😂😭

[@ARuiz-eu3hk]

Was also the reason why the Precursors rejected them for holding the Mantel because the forerunners we're just assholes.

[@argo9721]

@@ARuiz-eu3hk wait so how are humans any better?

[@ARuiz-eu3hk]

@@argo9721 Never said they we're. The Precursors we're "about to" , keyword here, test them out to see if they can handle the Mantle. But the Forerunners still pissed off about the rejection so they acted like spoil murderous children and kill off the Precursors before they got the chance to see Humanity what they got.

[@collinchristensen7405]

I like to think that the forerunners were just so arrogant, that they simply couldn't believe that they could lose.

[@CoffeeGodAzzy]

But then aren’t the precursors in the same boat?

[@collinchristensen7405]

@@CoffeeGodAzzy All is sweetness to the universe.

[@CoffeeGodAzzy]

@@collinchristensen7405 indeed it is 😂 (I don’t know bout you but like I’ve had a bad bug that got me back into halo lately and I’m tryna re beat every game on legendary in chronological order to the point it’s more addicting than knowledge to Cortana 😂 😭 HW1 and Reach are done gotta grind out the rest)

[@hiimchrisj]

I mean if you think about it, they'd literally already lost and the firing of the Halo array was just a reset button for everyone else but them who'd forfeited the Mantle to Humanity

[@TH3UND3ADHORD3]

@@CoffeeGodAzzy Technically didn't the precursors create the flood (or are the flood?) to get back at the Forerunners for their rejection and blatant disregard of their wishes that humanity should uphold the mantel because the forerunners believed they were superior to ancient humanity. Or I may have that mixed up from the Forerunner book series.

[@Finn_7117]

Forerunners: we aren’t better than you, you’re just lesser than us

[@zetamafia911]

The very definition of "neener neener" as a civilization basically. Installation00's cruel energy video demonstrated that very well I think.

[@chrissonofpear1384]

@@zetamafia911 Well, that was potentially apocryphal, in some ways, as those 'universes' were implied never to become universes, and barely counted as one, yet. See also quantum foam topologies, M-theory, etc. Existing within an EXISTING universe, they likely couldn't have fully expanded, anyway, on this brane.

[@banegas0411]

@Georgetta Foose bot

[@banegas0411]

@Angel Dylan bot

[@flightlessraptor1082]

"lock the flood behind a series of black holes" Someone has been reading too much Fate Of The Jedi.

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

Yes! Celestials are impressive and all that but you can hide all your problems behind huge spacial anomalies!

[@Arthur_Revan]

@@michaelandreipalon359 Black holes are dead stars, not portals god damn it. Well, not dead, more like another stage of life of supermassive stars.

[@empireofitalypsstimfromano5025]

@@michaelandreipalon359 Yeah But They Probably Don't For 1 Reason: If You Send a Ship Straight To The Sun What Happens? It Gets Destroyed. A Black Hole In Most Cases Is Just a Collapsed Star So It Will Probably Do The Same Thing.

[@Arthur_Revan]

@@michaelandreipalon359 Kurzgesagt just released a video, they knew u wanted to know. =D kzbin.info/www/bejne/h6LWfYeEoN-pl7s

[@baer0083]

@@michaelandreipalon359 even if we sent drones, we wouldnt be able to collect any data from them.

[@jonathanaylmer6609]

Sounds like Forerunners had the problem of smart people thinking everyone else would approach a problem analytically like them, and just assumed one day humanity would begin a careful study of the rings instead of fucking around on them.

[@adambielen8996]

Yeah, 2 waring nations crashing on a Halo and duking it out probably wasn't something they considered. But still, it was far too easy to get to those flood samples.

[@lenkagamine4145]

I mean no matter how smart you assume the other person is, the least you could do is put a powerpoint presentation or something to tell you 'dangerous parasite in here, will wreck your shit'. This isnt even a matter of humans fucking around on the rings, I mean what are they supposed to do? if you're exploring the rings you'll end up opening that door. Its not a dumb thing to do, you have absolutely no reason to believe flood will be in there.

[@ouroboros5793]

@@lenkagamine4145 I saw a comment in another thread state that in other material, the Covenant were the ones who messed up and the flood were in stasis pools before they started tearing things apart trying to get the ring to function. After the flood were let loose, the Covenant forces retreated, locking doors behind them as they did. That was my understanding of the comment and I haven't read novels or 3rd party source material myself.

[@lenkagamine4145]

@@ouroboros5793 Well, did the stasis pools have a powerpoint presentation?

[@ouroboros5793]

@@lenkagamine4145 Did you read my whole comment? I haven't read the novels for myself. That's the explanation from a different comment thread. I would assume, as advanced as they are, they would have included the equivalent or a terminal but it wasn't mentioned in the comment, and probably not in the writing.

[@AncestorEmpire1]

Humans: “everyone is stupid except me” Hubris was a big thing with the Forerunners

[@Nexus9118]

Except, that ideology was widely popular amongst Forerunners. Humanity did have a sense of self-awareness. Coupled with the fact that humans did work with San'Shyuum. Forerunners on the other hand seemed isolationist. They didn't accept any other view.

[@freddiecawston2892]

This is literally being proved on the comments as well.

[@AncestorEmpire1]

@@freddiecawston2892 the Homer quote still fits

[@downrangecash2418]

@@Nexus9118 Isolationist? No. More like an overbearing parent. They were the strongest civilization around and dictated policy for everyone else. But because of this they didn't really let anyone make their own choices. Forerunners could draw borders and settle disputes at their own leisure, but nobody else was ever given that choice, and the Ecumene won't listen to you since they literally have to take care of everybody at once.

[@ariabritton9669]

to be fair, the precursors said the same about humanity. they chose us over the forerunners to have the mantle, which made the forerunners get angry and try to wipe out the precursors, which became the flood. so not only were they kinda dumb, but they're also the whole reason the flood exists in the first place.

[@samblakeley6968]

You know it’s a good day when he’s throwing shade in the title

[@wessthemess117]

I lose interest once I hear this video is sponsored

[@caseyhall2320]

@@wessthemess117 you shouldn't, really. Dude has had a bad run lately with peeps not being into Star Wars right now. At least this way we get a good video and he gets fecken payed.

[@frankboiiz5888]

@@wessthemess117 u could just skip ahead

[@wessthemess117]

I still watched it all🤷

[@milobalcziunas8321]

@@wighensakgr when dumb is the worst insult you know

[@ZeDitto3]

Eck: “Yo these forerunners should have locked their shit up better before turning off the lights.”

[@mj91212]

To be fair, a lot of the supporting materials for the games suggests that the flood were actually being kept in stasis pods. The Covenant were simply cracking open every container and computer panel that they didn’t recognize the purpose for, as they were trying to figure out how to activate the ring. Once they accidentally busted the flood infection forms out of stasis, the Covenant were the ones locking doors as they retreated.

[@leonardofarias8843]

When the Covenant found all these pods exactly? which hour?

[@alexb5766]

@@leonardofarias8843 the covenant definitely released them and then humans ran into them also spark was supposed to keep stuff out and off the ring but he and the other monitors had there flaws loneliness did not help

[@NarsBars]

Hey guys, it's the Lock Picking Arbiter here. Today we have a real treat, an advanced Forerunner stasis chamber. A few years ago, these were thought to be unpickable, but with the tool BosnianBill and I made, they are much easier break into. So first I'm going to apply my tensioning tool. Nothing on one, two is binding... Got a click out of two, got a click out of three. Nothing on four. Got a click out of one, and now a click out of four. Well there you have it folks. While this is a very difficult lock to open, and I am sure the average grunt would never be able to open it on the street, it is still quite vulnerable to a professional. This is the lo-OH NO WHAT HAVE WE JUST UNLOCKED SEAL THE DOORS

[@Suisfonia]

@@leonardofarias8843 According to the books and other source material, it is theorized that it was a few hours before Captain Keyes and his party found them.

[@Deadchannel06]

@@NarsBars nice

[@Rannos22]

I would think interstellar travel would be a big enough barrier but then they left their ships lying all over the place

[@kennyevilmonkey]

Ya, they even left the key to the arc on earth. Humans could have dug that thing up well before they even had advanced space travel. Imagine current humanity just randomly digging up the keys to the ultimate space weapon, forget the flood, we'd probably just destroy everything and are selves fighting over who gets to play with it first.

[@DraikSpectre]

In all fairness, the Forerunners *did* leave countermeasures. It's just that they didn't survive the following 100k years. Most of the Monitors for the Installations went insane- Guilty Spark was barely holding on and Penitent Tangent became completely incapable of maintaining security. Abject Testament just vanished after 80k years. The events of Halo CE occurred largely because the Pillar of Autumn showed up- if it hadn't, Guilty Spark wouldn't have disabled the defenses to allow them to land, and the Covenant would have been blown out of the sky. A full 100k years was just more than even Forerunner AI could account for, at least while they were on the equivalent of a shoestring budget at the tail end of a millenia spanning war and with their last resort superweapon having the unfortunate side effect of totally frying the Domain.

[@Ecthelion842]

honestly if they had just left a half dozen AI's on the same level as the monitors and had them do a council thing, with checks and balances to ensure any AI on the council for that installation that starts to go rampant is shut down and a new one built to replace it, that alone would have solved 90% of the problems. Then including more than just sentinels, like an actual defensive fleet that in a worst case scenario (the flood escape and take over the ring, humans/covenant/jahova's witnesses manage to land and start fucking things up) could completely annihilate the ring and sanitize any resulting debris would have solved both Halo outbreaks. Or even the smarter idea, don't house the flood on your super weapon meant to eradicate them. In Ghosts of Onyx the Forerunners are revealed to be able to hide entire planets in slipspace. Why not have the experiments on a shield world like this to study the flood with protocols in place so as soon as a outbreak occurs and goes out of control the entire facility can just self destruct in slipspace and bam, no more problems.

[@ivanivanovitchivanovsky7123]

They didn't have very good countermeasures. Just kill of those flood forms, store composed and non-composed Forerunners and AI on the Rings and Shield Worlds and nuke the galaxy and then pop back and recolonise everything. They literally were able to clone and reproduce other species after the Halos fired, why didn't they just do it with themselves and have their personalities digitalised and implanted into clone bodies or some such?

[@zk116]

@@ivanivanovitchivanovsky7123 the librarian herself said that restoring a digitalised conscience to it's biological form ended up creation "abominations" or something like that. Plus the Iso-Didact made the decision that it was time for the forerunners to recede from the galaxy due to their sins as penance-- I believe him and the last lifeshaper workers, chant-to-green, settled down on a distant system in the edges of the galaxy to live a primitive lifestyle. The forerunners would eventually die out naturally -- in a poetic way, because they eventually became our forerunners.

[@albertjordan3249]

@@Ecthelion842 The problem is that the forerunners were if you recall, losing a war against the flood and trying to build the halo array at the same time. I'm sure in an ideal scenario, yes they would have included more failsafes and redundancies, but to be considering literally wiping out all sentient life in the galaxy they are well past ideal conditions to build the most secure system. The rings despite their incredible feats of engineering, had a principle purpose of destroying the flood, for all we know the flood containment for future humanity to study to prepare themselves should they appear again was a last minute add-on, and they hoped that the arbiters would be sufficient to maintain security and educate anyone who came to the installation of the risks involved.

[@milaanpatel4997]

@@Ecthelion842 They wanted to, but the council didn't approved enough funds. There were conflicting interests, political and corruption issues. You know, the kind of things we have here on earth. Just scale it to galactic level. The paperwork was not worth the contingency plan.

[@Dwarficus]

4:32 - "Bonk" I saw that grenade bounce off that grunt's head and I laughed.

[@blazedchiller8560]

I saw that too and laughed. I like how he just noped right after and got away from the grenade

[@subraxas]

Radek Bonk - Ottawa Senators :-)

[@emmajay5666]

"Lock the flood behind black holes" Ah create an Unknown Region, because no one ever stumbles into that part of the galaxy.

[@marty2129]

Mnggal-Mnggal and Abeloth would like to know your location :D

[@QrazyQuarian]

*The Reapers also would like to know your location*

[@Psychoangel-d23]

*The ghoul stars facepalm* I can count a couple ways of how that might backfire...

[@MikeJones-qn1gz]

And nothing could ever figure out how to get out, especially a highly intelligent hive mind.

[@cosmiclikesminecraft]

Yoooo Abby pfp pog

[@MistahFox]

I believe the CE line still makes sense, since Cortana also calls Halo a shield world, meaning things on the ring's surface would not be killed, so from Spark's perspective, the Flood are only on the ring and will not be killed by the pulse but killing the rest of life in the galaxy will prevent them from spreading and eventually starve them to death. He was a bit insane...

[@kabob0077]

Well, he is a being made from Human memories and was trapped alone for several millennia.

[@DoktrDub]

Yeah he is insane but honestly that has been proven to be the only true way to stop a galactic level infestation of the flood by wiping out all food sources

[@lonestar_iconoclast]

If my memory serves, the Flood can only propagate with entities with sufficient calcium deposits, sophancy, nervous system configuration, and particular mass of most sentient species. Also, the Forerunners hated Humanity, because the Precursors (the supposed progenitors of the Forerunners,) had granted Humans the Mantle. The Forerunners believed themselves the Inheritors of the Mantle. (And according to the prequel novel series for Halo, Humanity had been fighting the Flood for centuries when the Forerunner/Human War began, and Humanity was actually winning against the Flood until the Forerunner went pell-mell against the nascent Human stellar empire.)

[@richardpatterson1694]

Actually if the flood can't take control of you they can just use you biomass to create pureforms .

[@dr.catherineelizabethhalse1820]

They just prioritize to use bigger ones as attack force and ”feeding” on the smaller more fragile creatures.

[@performingmale4468]

I think it was installation 00 who did a video on this, but not sure. But his theory was that the flood on alpha halo were originally under more heavy guard but the covenant or humans on the ring messed with the security protocols of the ring and essentially let them out. He goes much more in depth on the topic and I think he makes a really good case for it.

[@EckhartsLadder]

That sounds right, but that also shouldn’t be possible. That isn’t really mutually exclusive with this point - you shouldn’t be able to accidentally unleash the flood.

[@kabob0077]

@@EckhartsLadder To add to OPs comment and talk about a different ring, Delta Halo had normal containment procedures in place until something needed repaired however the AI that was requesting repairs was never answered (dispite repeated attempts at contacting Penitent Tangent) and the Flood escaped containment on Delta Halo a couple hundred years or so (I can't remember right now, but the containment breach on 05 has been ongoing for millennia by the time of Halo 2) after the Halo Array fired. We can assume that 343, while spending a significant amount of time brooding and contemplating in his loneliness, was also diligent and cautious with running his Halo Ring until the Covenant and UNSC showed up on his lawn. Especially when compared to Penitent Tangent who essentially let the Flood run free until it gathered enough biomass to make a Gravemind.

[@midgetman4206]

@@EckhartsLadder well the only way to be sure that it won't happen is to kill the flood or the intruders, both not a great idea as both will result in the destruction of information either by it not being there or getting blown up/melted by humans or the covenant (both of which are capable of damaging and destroying forerunner tech)

[@performingmale4468]

@@EckhartsLadder ok fair, but it makes a little more sense that the security protocols were off cause otherwise the flood would have just been spending centuries trapped in a room with doors that have the tensile strength of tinfoil.

[@nweasels]

Tying in on this thread, I saw that theory video too. I believe it was based off the mission "The Silent Cartographer" where in order to actually access the cartographer and locate the control room you have to deactivate security measures for the facility. The TL:DR is basically, due to the remoteness of the silent cartographer facility, it may be possible that it is basically the security control room for a portion of the ring (if not the whole ring itself) and that deactivating the security measures there inadvertently deactivated security measures that were there to prevent unplanned entry into the flood containment facility which allowed the covenant to breach the facility thinking it was a holy site, realize they were in no way prepared for this place and bail locking every door they could along the way out, only for the UNSC to then breach the same facility using the path the covenant came in on. Sidenote, flood containment facilities should just have automated systems that in the event of a containment breach the doors seal and the whole facility gets charged plasma vented into it so all specimens (and any unfortunate SOB unlucky enough to be inside it) get torched. I mean it's the flood. Galaxy-wide neutron radiation cleaning was an option, so a little bit of localized plasma is a small price to pay.

[@thesupertendent8973]

I don’t think they made it super easy on accident or on purpose. This was a race that essentially left the door locked but aren’t back to come back, leaving the sands of time and the lack of instructions to keep the galaxy safe, and since the war was desperate they didn’t have time to do all these better solutions, since they were fighting a hopeless battle.

[@whitehorse8832]

Yea the architecture of halo ce flood installation is vary " purpose only " built

[@mittensfastpaw]

If you don’t have time for a good lock? You don’t keep the stinking samples in the first place!

[@thesupertendent8973]

@@mittensfastpaw As stated by 343 GS, They left it as a way to research the flood because they knew they couldn't be killed by the Firing of the Halo array, which also destroyed the Dominion, and any knowledge the forerunners possessed that would've helped future generations.

[@somedudewithakeyboard5388]

you can tell Bungie improved their intergalactic empires waging war when they went to Destiny... as long as you ignore the Cabal... the Ecumene(not the halo kind, the kind in the book of sorrows)... the Eliksni... the Vex... the Awoken... and basically everything that isn't the Hive

[@rayv98k]

What you talking about, the history and the origin of the hive is interesting as fuck.

[@somedudewithakeyboard5388]

@@rayv98k "And basically anything that isn't the Hive" By that I meant "Every species origin pales in comparison to the Hive" sorry about the confusion

[@HowlingDoom]

@@somedudewithakeyboard5388 I wouldn't say the Awoken's Origin pales in comparison to the Hive at all. The Awoken's origins is as raw as the hives IMO. As for the Cabal and Eliskini their origins aren't gonna be on the same level because they didn't go through the same shit but even then the backgrounds for those two are also pretty well done. The Vex is really the only faction that's been meh, but at the same time it's kinda hard or impossible to really discuss their origins and history when they don't exist within time like everything else.

[@RoseSupreme]

When they're so cocky and arrogant to the point that they can't handle not being the ones to be bestowed upon the Mantle of Responsibility, they're bound to make stupid decisions.

[@sinisterisrandom8537]

No wonder why the precursors gave the mantle of responsibility to us humans. We weren't this stupid, yes we are arrogant, and other emotions but this has for the most part made us who we are, capable of understanding what shouldn't be done. :-P

[@kabob0077]

And understanding what NEEDS to be done as demonstrated by the Lord of Admirals killing a planet to stop the Flood.

[@dr.catherineelizabethhalse1820]

I’m not sure if Precursors and their mantle was so great either. Also my theory is that humans and forerunner were at some point the same but it was Forerunners who started mutating themselves and Precursors did not like that those guys changed their original design.

[@thechroniclegamer4285]

We also didn’t start a 100 year long war with a species because they were better than us.

[@VexArrowEye]

Both the human and forerunners were created by the precursors. The Forerunners rebelled against the Precursors because they believe they had the right to the mantle and didn’t want to be held on a leash. Then precursors created the humans as a more improved version of the forerunners. Big war breaks out and the precursor ultimately lose, do they because turn themselves into dust. This dust leaves the Milky Way galaxy and become corrupted. Eventually it’ll make its way back where the human will discover it.

[@dr.catherineelizabethhalse1820]

@@VexArrowEye Has it been said that humans were created after? I still don’t take everything that happened those ancient times as an absolute fact like whatever the Primordial has said I don’t trust a one bit.

[@thomashuizinga4618]

As an old saying goes “One that has intelligence and no wisdom, is just a smart fool.”

[@tortera101]

Really glad your getting back inte more halo content! Been missing it!

[@toby1061]

Best way to deal with the flood is destroy everything they were on. Seriously how did the Forerunners not realize that the Flood would be come a threat, just immediately destroy them instead of just waiting and ignoring them. The Didactic was probably the only Forerunner who realized they need to kill the Flood immediately.

[@14megasxlr]

WHat do you mean "on"? I think you're underestimating the exact scale of the kind of outbreak the Forerunners ended up dealing with. By the time they even noticed it, it was a galaxy wide threat. Destroying everything, even with a scorched earth policy (which both the forerunners and humans attempted) didn't work. I believe they called it the "Maginot Line", a massive, multi-system chain in space where they just WIPED. EVERYTHING. It bought them some time, but didn't save them. Then, their best AI got corrupted, which they didn't think was possible, and if HELPED the flood by turning their technology against them. They were really fucked from every direction.

[@Hawkens4k]

you cant just treat it like a simple infection like normal zombies... because every living thing they infect, they get smarter, more tactical and even can in a literal means, they can be more powerful, they even used both forerunner tech, and the old technology that they once used before to destroy them. even if they never held the samples on the flood research facility's there is no telling that they infected other galaxy's as well.

[@brmo6232]

Remember the flood was fielding entire captured FLEETS of ships

[@brmo6232]

They also controlled nueral space and blocked any faster than light travel using precursor/ forrunner tech. They had indestructible star roads slicing fleets in half.

[@npc6817]

But it was inportant to keep samples, even if the rings did work as intended the flood came from outside the milky way, so it could just return whenever. I'm guessing the plan was to keep the galaxy in this cycle of self annihilation so that the future generations could use the flood samples and their predecessor's technology to improve on the halos until I don't know, they just killed the flood, sort of loke mass effect's citadel

[@palladin1337]

This actually sounds like a pretty interesting story line, either for a series of games or books. Follow a task force, either all Human or Human and former Covenant, as they travel between Forerunnner installations and gradually unravel this challenge set up by them to ensure that whoever eventually found the Flood samples would fully understand how dangerous they are and are prepared to handle them properly. It definitely would have served as a method for outlining the Forerunner-Flood conflict, and potentially even the Forerunner-Human conflict if it was set up by the Librarian. It would also make any potential Flood outbreak even more impactful, because instead of a galaxy-scale threat that's just tripped over it would be something we are supposed to understand and have some measure of control over.

[@adambielen8996]

It would also be funny to set this story in the aftermath of the original trilogy. So you can have all the characters facepalming at the stupidity of what happened and how close the galaxy came to destruction.

[@khandimahn9687]

"For Smart People, the [insert name] were SO DUMB" This applies to so many civilizations in fiction.

[@UGNAvalon]

“Sci Fi Civilizations Too Dumb to Really Exist” is a full-on youtube series!

[@JediSentinal]

@@UGNAvalon generation tech right?

[@khandimahn9687]

@@UGNAvalon I know, I watch them on occasion. Hehe.

[@Hyper_Drud]

@@JediSentinal also Media Zealot.

[@chrisdufresne9359]

Stares at the Minbari

[@ninjachicken9877]

I'm pretty sure the reason Flood samples were stored on each installation was because the Forerunners knew that the Halo array was not the final solution. The Halos were only meant to buy the galaxy more time, as the Flood would eventually return. The samples left behind were for the monitors to study and theoretically discover a proper cure for in the eons to follow the activation of the array. I do believe the novel Halo: Primordium goes into depth on the topic. One of the reasons Chakas was preserved as 343 Guilty Spark is that he contained the gaeis(?) of the Lord of Admirals, and the Forerunners believed that the ancient humans had discovered a cure for the Flood before they were defeated by the Forerunners. Modern humans were never meant to stumble into the monitor's studies before they were complete. But as we know, no monitor was able to finish its task and the Flood research programs gradually fell into discair as the monitors slowly lost their sanity and purpose.

[@jordanblake5916]

Also makes sense when you think that the Flood might just be farming the universe.

[@henry7696]

so the forerunners wanted to expedite the process of making the flood come back by putting them behind 1 thin wall in a room any clown can open?

[@MikeJones-qn1gz]

@@henry7696 I think that had to do more with time, maybe the facilities lost security and in the monitors damaged state he didn’t care, and maybe he let the humans and covenant come in contact with the flood for morbid curiosity and then giving him purpose again in firing the ring.

[@thorveim1174]

I do think the biggest failing of the forrunners was indeed to keep live flood in stasis. What did they expect really, apart from the flood breaking out/being freed by other species that dont know the danger the flood represents? Keeping specimens around is the ONLY thing that allowed the flood to come back.

[@jup331]

The most mindboggling thing is that they obviously have 343 Guilty Spark on Installation 04 who has the capability to teleport. Even if he had to run maintenance priority number one would have been keeping containment. He should have known where Keyes was, teleport/fly to him and just explain it to them.

[@dr.catherineelizabethhalse1820]

Guilty Spark wasn’t really right in the head tho 😄

[@richardpatterson1694]

Remember the whole guilty spark being insane thing and him doing an even worse job of keeping the flood contained than the monitor from halo 2.

[@kabob0077]

@@richardpatterson1694 The one in Halo 2 had that infestation going since some hundred years after the Halo Array fired, no one can compare to Penitent "I'm Gonna Ignore this Repair Request" Tangent in terms of fucking up on the job, 343 had to deal with the Covenant trying to open every locked door and the Humans following in after them. Hell, 343 spent a good chunk of his time Brooding and shit and he managed to keep the Flood locked up for millennia.

[@richardpatterson1694]

@@kabob0077 I was mostly going on about how he quarantined the outbreak right up until the covenant breached the quarantine zone then I remembered he was captured and it was the halos systems that did it not him.

[@tristanbackup2536]

He would actually. But was experience signs of rampacy. You have to watch the terminals, it explains his erratic behaviour as centuries go by.

[@falasnorden4359]

They should've also had multiple monitors on each ring/shield world to counter act crippling loneliness.....

[@tristanbackup2536]

Spark made that reference. I'm guessing the Forerunners didn't know the extreme long-term effects of rampancy after 100,000 years.

[@nweasels]

To be fair, it sounds like (at least shards of) Mendicant Bias have gone through all the stages of logic-plague induced rampancy and come full circle to being a good guy again.

[@dsdy1205]

Inb4 they get sick of each other like a married couple at it too long and start squabbling and waging wars on the Ring's surface which lets out the flood.

[@commanderwookiecopc806]

I have read all the books. Everything they have done makes sense. I am big brain.

[@robertnelson9599]

I have also read those books, I think the Forerunners were not the brightest.

[@Ian501st]

I haven't read shit, they're competent, but are at the end of the day, a society can be or make stupid decisions based on their culture.

[@richardpatterson1694]

Isn't the plot of the forerunner trilogy that the flood used the forerunners religion and ego to play them like a fidel.

[@unofficial_ai]

@@richardpatterson1694 I’m going to read that soon, I’ll find out.

[@richardpatterson1694]

@@unofficial_ai its a good read and it's really informative about forerunner society.

[@maniacalcoast2742]

All I heard was “you need to have a level of common sense” both for the forerunners and their inheritors

[@Therosx]

Ok rings done. It’s Miller time. Sir, I know it’s not in the blueprints but do you think we aught to beef up the security a little? Eh, good enough for government work.

[@vim2286]

Literally what i say when finishing maintenance...i wonder what civilization ending events i may have caused by some Domino effect

[@regishwadum]

They kept some of the flood to study. Common sense tells us to kill those flood as well, but the flood had plot armor

[@augustjay6436]

That's because it came from outside the universe so they wanted to study it in case it came back

[@Fuk99999]

Technically no. This wasn’t plot armor. The forerunner explicitly (in the old lore, as per this video) were about preserving life as much as possible. The flood may be the most cruel and evil thing they ever came across, but that wasn’t a good enough reason to outright eliminate them from existence in the event that they could. Very pacifist mindset. To an obvious fault

[@madtechnocrat9234]

If you don't study the denger you will never truly be secure from it...

[@Fuk99999]

@@madtechnocrat9234 to be entirely fair, I don’t think anyone would have blamed the forerunners if they found a way to completely destroy the flood forever. It would just have been against their own core values as a people

[@CodyHeldreth]

Lot of good it did them, hundreds of thousands of years studying captured flood forms and they have nothing to show for it. Flood outbreak happens? Fire the rings. Million plus years pass, another flood outbreak? Fire again. You'd think in the time since first firing the rings the so called "advanced" Forerunners would have found a way to cure the flood, but they got zero, zilch, nada.

[@Buzzy_Bland]

2:13 “which was outside the firing range of the halo rings” **pans over targets** I see what you did there.

[@BoaPython]

@@g.williams2047 as Eck is talking about the firing range, the image is of a target/shooting range. A "Firing Range" if you will. It's a pun ^_^

[@zilentis1835]

Those are used for reseeding races, it’s from Halo Legends-as most of the footage used in this video is.

[@BoaPython]

@@zilentis1835 Thank you, I did not know that. Today I Learned that Halo Reseeding chambers look like Sci-fi Shooting ranges ^_^

[@andrewbutton2039]

If you watch the terminals in the Halo CE remaster, you will find that guilty spark saw the Autumn coming light years away and was warning them away before he realised they were reclaimers, humans, he then lowered all the defences and welcomed them in. They didn't hear and respond because it was on the wrong frequency, or maybe in an entirely different mode of communication.

[@andrewbutton2039]

In fact, I think (so far, at 7:20) most of the points are misunderstandings of the lore.

[@EckhartsLadder]

Yet the Covenant landed just fine, as did other Aliens.

[@richardpatterson1694]

@@EckhartsLadder because guilty spark lowered the defenses

[@8vantor8]

@@richardpatterson1694 nothing was stopping him from only attacking the covenant and letting the Pillar of Autumn pass

[@andrewbutton2039]

@@8vantor8 I don't believe it's ever been explicitly stated what defense systems the Halo's have, the explanation that makes most sense to me is the defence grid is omnidirectional and indiscriminate, possibly a low power pulse from the main Halo array or maybe a smaller dedicated pulse generator. No idea based in canon to be honest, still, it's stated in the first terminal that Spark was about to fire whatever he had available to fire, until he detected the Autumn was crewed by humans and warmly invited them in. The covenant would have had to leapfrog the Pillar of Autumn at ~1LY when the defence systems were deactivated to have arrived before the Autumn and not have been attacked by the Halo.

[@omarcj789]

I think the asgardians from stargate put it correctly we got so smart that we forgot simple and less complicated

[@UGNAvalon]

So you want someone dumber than you? You’ve come to the right place!

[@omarcj789]

@@UGNAvalon You gotta love Jack O'Neall the OG SG1 leader

[@scottthewaterwarrior]

Oh man Stargate... I need to rewatch that series, then read the comics they have finally started making that continue the Atlantis story line.

[@omarcj789]

@@scottthewaterwarrior been hearing that both fan and cast are trying to get a full reboot on the franchise

[@nweasels]

@@scottthewaterwarrior THERE ARE COMICS?!

[@hardtmannn8804]

They really did fuck up so bad with their own hubris that everything they tried to do against the flood did not work and so they only had the Halos to rely on in the end

[@lenkagamine4145]

I believe the prometheans were working pretty well but they just didnt like that solution.

[@lenkagamine4145]

@Clanner Bob Yes. If you do that. That is what prometheans entail. Genocide or not they still werent *completely* out of options, they just felt the Halo was a better option (though the halo genocides EVERY species)

[@YourLocalLeadFarmer]

Humanity: We're the smartest and best civilization in the galaxy ! Also Humanity: *Proceeds to snort tide pods*

[@LENZ5369]

It was wasn't the Forerunners who 'chose' humanity as successors; it was *a* forerunner -The Librarian.

[@dewdew80]

Didn't the Precursors also choose humanity as their successors?

[@frankg2790]

@@dewdew80 Yes

[@fafnnier5120]

Tbf, Iso Didact doesn't have a problem with it too IIRC.

[@orctrihar]

@@fafnnier5120 The didact haved be locked up before

[@fafnnier5120]

Yep. That's the Ur-Didact. Who later appeared in Halo 4. What I meant is Iso-Didact, real name : Bornstellar-Makes-Eternal-Lasting. Bornstellar is also a friend to primitive humans : Chakas and Riser.

[@chengzhou8711]

I agree, their system of governance is unusually authoritarian

[@collinchristensen7405]

How would you ensure millions of years of civilizational stability?

[@chengzhou8711]

@@collinchristensen7405 Social Democracy

[@14megasxlr]

@@chengzhou8711 pfffthahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[@chadthundercock4806]

@@chengzhou8711 Authoritarian governments have lasted a lot longer though, the only thing I see beating it is neoliberal capitalist hellscape.

[@Commissar_Eiven]

Well I think the United Nations is authoritarian in Halo is because every time they found a new planet The colonizers Wanted Independence and then the UNSC with sends and murder everyone who thought Independence was a good idea

[@goggleheroomegamaple820]

My father told me this in relation to how we reacted to the current virus, hindsight is always 20/20

[@Buzzy_Bland]

Well, if they weren’t, they wouldn’t be Forerunners, would they?

[@dalekbumps]

Forerunners sort of remind me of Time Lords from Doctor Who. They're so powerful and 'smart' that they got too comfortable, and were so dismissive of lesser races that by the time the Daleks had amassed enough forces to launch their attack, the so-called 'higher race' didn't have the ability to fight back in any way other than with a war of attrition, which failed miserably. Good riddance.

[@ladygrey7425]

Well, when you think about it, it boils down to the imperial/hegemonic mindset- "We're the top dogs now! Nothing will ever challenge us again!". Every major power that ever was has risen and fallen, and will rise and fall. Britain was the top dog of the 19th Century, America was during the 20th. China is the top dog of the 21st, and on and on the wheel will spin. Power breeds arrogance, contempt, laziness, and paranoia.

[@DoktrDub]

@@ladygrey7425 agreed on that mindset, still China ain’t quite top dog yet, they fail to hold certain industrial, economic and military standards to be classed the top dog just yet, but it won’t be long

[@ThamTvMaster]

This is why Precursor choose Humanity instead of Foreruner

[@TheDemigans]

"It is known as a Flood containment facility as it does just that". 343 Guilty Spark and Penitent Tangent wouls like a word with you about their success rate. You do hit the nail on the head, the flood "containment" facilities are the prime example of how bad the Forerunners are at designing stuff. - where do you put a dangerous species that uses biomass to expand? In your desert biome? maybe your cold tundra biome which you specifically use at control centers to slow the flood down? Nope! Lets put it in the middle of a jungle! - don't put enough flood in one room that they can break it open. In fact, why are there so many in containment at all? You only need a handful in extremely protected containers. - guilty spark says in CE that MC's Mjolnir is of a much lesser design and that he requires a better class suit. Why doesn't Guilty Spark have these suits available for any visitor? - where is a ripcord feature, so that in the event of a breach the facility itself is simply annihilated before it can spread? - Guilty Spark says they should use a tactical pulse from the Halo Array in order to deal with the infestation on the Arc. Why does this require a reclaimer? Why can't a moniter like Penitent Tangent use it to rid himself of his infeststion? Better yet, why doesn't the shielded containment facility have a mini-halo inside to cleanse it in case of trouble? - why can any species at all break the codes to the damn door with something smaller than a LAPTOP? In fact, why are all doors open, with motion sensing to boot? Shouldn't you want your doors locked and coded, with a damn sentinel at every door checking if you are flood or not before you are allowed through? - why are there so many ventilation shafts for the flood to use? And wouldn't you ventilate fluorine products or some other gasses and fluids that melt organic tissue on contact through them?

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

I’ve come to hate the concept of the mantle, the idea that one sentient species is automatically the most fit to govern overlook the needs of every other species is terribly counter productive and reminds me of star wars humanism almost. Shouldn’t the most ideal scenario be each species being able to cooperate for the betterment of the galactic population while having independency?

[@ProofOfLogic]

Speaking of the forerunners being advanced. Cortana was well connected to several forerunner facilities through her time, I find it hard to believe she couldn't find anything on their AI and use that to fix or bypass the problem of human AI rampancy.

[@combativeThinker]

Yeah, that’s a massive plot hole for me too. You would think that she’d be interested in studying ancillas and uncovering the secret to their longevity.

[@captianmorgan7627]

If they were truly very smart and nearly all knowing then any mistake they made would not be understandable by us (and the writer team) or just so small and mundane it would be boring.

[@augustjay6436]

Very smart is completely different from all knowing which they were not

[@Buzzy_Bland]

I like the variety of targets they have at 2:13. Very progressive.

[@midgetman4206]

I don't think those are targets, those look like the things that held species

[@zilentis1835]

As the commenter said, these are essentially advanced cloning/storage devices for reseeding species after the Halo fired.

[@rainfyre2694]

You can’t even use AI because the flood can use Roko’s Basilisk. -something that has been feared that AI could use to escape and dominate earth-

[@wilkdc]

I've been working towards Roko's Basilisk everyday of my life

[@midgetman4206]

@@wilkdc well I put my middle finger up to it, heck you snake robot man

[@UGNAvalon]

I think you mean “logic plague”.

[@theguiltyplayer9207]

Forerunners: We dont make mistakes... The Flood: Hello Again old Friends Soon to be Dead Forerunners: We made MANY mistakes!

[@Callsign_Bear]

The Forerunners: The risks we took were calculated The Flood: H̵̫̬̺̩͔̮̞̘͚̄̅Ů̸͓̠̥̓͌̈́͜Ń̶̨̛̜͔̩̠͖̯̱̦̜̜̈̆̓̈̑̂̆͠͝G̶̛̳͉̘̜͚͇̩̯̲̹̟̔͂̒̿̚͝͝Ę̴̳̬͔͇͈̥̥̤̦͕͈̬̤̃̾̐̽̃̅̅͋͘R̵̡̛̤̗̘̰͖͍̱͚̩̤̜͆̾̿̔̓̋͒͘̕͝ͅ The Forerunners, activating the Halo Rings in their last desperate attempt to destroy the Flood once and for all: But man, am I bad at math.

[@marty2129]

...lock Flood behind a series of black holes... Now, what that solution reminds me of? There aren't that many ancient, tentacly, hungry eldrich abomination imprisoned in a cluster of black holes... :D

[@retrospectus]

I did always wonder why the flood storage facility didn't have sentinels hanging around to contain outbreaks

[@nweasels]

Ancilla union mandated break.

[@davidbarker5648]

Is Master Chief immune? The (Spartans/True Reclamers) without genetic anomalies could be the answer. The forerunners gave their weapons to the one spicies that had the potential to evolve past the influence of the flood. Look at how they are constantly changing MC in both technological/physiologically.

[@dweller132]

I don't think there's a term for it, but I call it the Pandora's Box trope. Some ancient alien race fights a war or something, they preserve everything they can, humanity comes along and messes the whole thing up and then has to fix it as best they can. I think Stargate Atlantis is another good example in addition to Halo, humans go find alien tech and wake up the bad guys in the process, or discover an abandoned project that leads to some major catastrophe. Like when SGA finds the Asuran Replicators, Project Arcturus, or the Attero Device, for example. Forerunners defeat and preserve the Flood, humanity and the Covenant accidentally release it, all hell breaks loose. It reminds me of the stories of pharoah curses too, people finding an ancient and sacred burial place and then dying under unusual circumstances.

[@UGNAvalon]

Who was worse, Forerunners or Ancients? L:

[@dweller132]

@@UGNAvalon I'd say that the Ancients were worse, they left too much dangerous technology around. Then again, a lot of it had to be during their war with the Wraith, the Ori, and the plague they got in the Milky Way.

[@MastaChafa]

Some theories of intelligence suggest that once you get too accommodated, you become less intelligent because you don't have many problems to solve. So maybe the forerrunners became intellectually lazy.

[@surferguy007p8]

I could take on the chief with a blindfold on easy

[@randycox2310]

The thing I hated the most was it is clearly implied Forerunners where to be ancient humans, from 343 guilty sparks monologues to the grave mind calling chief “child of my enemy”. Then they retcon it to these aliens and digital robot warriors.

[@randycox2310]

There is also an Easter egg in the master chief collection of CE where you find a transmission from 343 GS to Pillar of Autumn warning them the ring has defenses and they will be fired on if they or the Covenant ships approach. Then 343 finds “human history” and realizes they are reclaimers and powers down the defenses

[@adambielen8996]

@@randycox2310 There is also the part in Halo 3 where Guilty Spark literally calls Master Chief a Forerunner.

[@randycox2310]

@@adambielen8996 “last time you asked, if it was my choice would I do it” uh... hello foreshadowing

[@kennethnorman4484]

I prefer the original lore where humans were forerunners.

[@BennyLlama39]

I can't help thinking the title sounds like the setup for a joke. : ) Comedian: The Forerunners were so dumb... Some guy: How dumb were they?

[@TeenageMutantZuckerTurtle]

The Forerunners were highly intelligent fools

[@titonfall2317]

first comment

[@le_travie7724]

The shield worlds were the Diadact's brain child. He would not have agreed to leaving samples on them.

[@clintparsons3989]

The most unbelievable thing in the whole franchise is how they kept everything so well dusted inside. Advanced swifter technology.

[@LHJlives]

You gotta appreciate the Flood’s desire for poetic justice: the Halo rings destroyed precursor technology which included the Domain. The Forerunners won the war by destroying their soul... again, first time was when they committed genocide against the Precursors which led the attackers to commit mass suicide or self-imposed exile due to their actions.

[@dsdy1205]

You know, that probably to quite a large extent explains why the Forerunners didn't lock down their shit better. They trusted the Domain to such an extent that its word was law, and they expected Humanity to be able to access it when the time came. But then the firing of the Rings destroyed access to the Domain

[@palpatinethesenatehog7086]

#askeck Can you pls do a video about all the rules, tracks and how fast can podracers go?

[@Wyatt125]

yeah

[@Yutter89]

I figured it was more due to the covenant forcing their way into the ring against all caution

[@wolshak112]

It's funny because the ancient humans defeated the flood.

[@EvanHBogle]

A Halo related video on my birthday, thanks Eck!

[@EckhartsLadder]

Happy Birthday King 🎂

[@hokutoulrik7345]

I can understand the need to understand the Flood so that another method could be found to destroy them, but keeping Flood spores around is a BAD IDEA.

[@hunterwaguespack3963]

Love the halo videos Hope u do more warhammer video too

[@col.mustard2192]

Even in real life humanity has had to consider leaving messages for future generations about dangerous stuff we've left behind, namely nuclear waste. The following is an extract of a message written on buried nuclear waste to deter future intrusion: "This place is a message... and part of a system of messages... pay attention to it! Sending this message was important to us. We considered ourselves to be a powerful culture. This place is not a place of honor... no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here... nothing valued is here. What is here was dangerous and repulsive to us. This message is a warning about danger. The danger is in a particular location... it increases towards a center... the center of danger is here... of a particular size and shape, and below us. The danger is still present, in your time, as it was in ours. The danger is to the body, and it can kill. The form of the danger is an emanation of energy. The danger is unleashed only if you substantially disturb this place physically. This place is best shunned and left uninhabited." This message is repeated in several languages. WHY DIDN'T THE FORERUNNERS LEAVE A MESSAGE LIKE THIS! We didn't even get a goddamn post it note goddammit.

[@unofficial_ai]

Well, in order to actually access any Forerunner technology, the one trying to access it has to have Forerunner blood in them. That is why, for example, the Prophet of Truth used Miranda Keyes to fire the rings, because the San'Shyuum can’t use Forerunner technology. Or they can’t use it to the same effect. I just finished The Cole Protocol in my Halo release order watch/play/read through, so it may have changed in a later book/comic. I’ve played all the games though. Just haven’t read or watched anything beyond 2008, excluding Halo 4: Forward Unto Dawn and Halo: Nightfall.

[@EckhartsLadder]

Yes, but the Covenant were able to brute force (no pun intended) there way into the flood containment chambers

[@unofficial_ai]

@@EckhartsLadder lol Yeah that’s true, I didn’t even think about them doing that. You’d think the Forerunners, with all their advanced technology and incredible intelligence, they’d put the Flood in an impenetrable fortress, not something a couple Brutes could break down. I mean, I understand they can match a Spartan II in strength, but still. Nobody shouldn’t be able to break into a Flood storage facility so easily, it’s silly. I’m not bashing on the lore, just the Forerunners being dumb, like you explained. Anyway, great video, love the content! Take care Eck!

[@connorross4571]

Humans don't have Forerunner blood. Their genetics gave them full control of Forerunner technology due to the Forerunners repurposing their technology to accept Human access.

[@aarondavis816]

My headcanon has always been that the Forerunner assumed they wouldn't ACTUALLY die in the Halo firing. Like. They KNEW they would but they assumed they wouldn't. Like a smoker knowing that smoking causes cancer but assuming HE won't get it

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

I mean shield words were made so you do have a point. They probably figured enough of their species would survive to govern the rings afterwards..not just one insane didact late to the party.

[@GeorgeBPryor]

That’d make a great bit of lore, like the surviving Forerunners were en route to The Ark in preparation for the firing of the Halo rings, but their group got cut off by a Flood ambush, and the delay resulted in them being caught in Halo’s pulse, leaving no one to enact the plans they had to restore the galaxy...

[@ZSTE]

Only bullshit excuse I could give is Covenant probably knocked out the ring defenses in that area since Keyes and his crew came in after the Covenant were already there. Forerunner stuff is more aimed at killing Flood than shielded Covenant troops armed with plasma weapons that melt sentinels. That said, still does seem very odd that the defenses would be so weak on the rings.

[@LibProjet]

They were lowered by the monitor because he saw the piller of autumn coming it's way and in the lore humans are next to claim the mantle of responsibility, so he let them in and at the same time the covenant too.

[@ZSTE]

@@LibProjet That magically makes all Flood storage areas totally open with minimal sentinel defenses?

[@LibProjet]

@@ZSTE I like to think they forced there way in but the title of the video does say the forerunners are dumb

[@jefferymosdell2490]

As I understand it, The Covenant were the ones who broke The Flood out of containment on Alpha Halo because of a mistranslation of what the facility was. Plus they were never shy of just breaking into whatever was in front of them if they didn't understand it. The map Lockout comes to mind when containment is brought up, say a breach occurs there, what are a handful of The Flood gonna do? Fall off of a cliff and trudge through a frozen Hellscape? Not likely. And with the facility on Alpha Halo, if they didn't get access to Covenant and Human vehicles they would've had to walk through a muggy swamp to get to anything important. Putrifying corpses in a woefully humid environment aren't gonna last long. Delta Halo was a crapshoot because of those unknown meddlers breaking containment and leaving Penitent Tangent to try and stop a full-scale break out. I don't think the Forerunners were an incredibly wise people leaving an intergalactic threat like that alive, but to say their containment was bad is doing them a disservice. The Covenant would've cracked open that facility regardless of how intensive the containment protocols in place were. And Humanity are the Reclaimers, so that is a worry there, a bunch of hapless scientists walts on into what they think controls the weather of an Installation and then we have another outbreak. But the Sentinels are incredibly skilled at eliminating infestations on a local or Installation-wide scale, just look at what they were accomplishing on The Ark after High Charity crashed.

[@funkykelly7130]

Pog halo doge be pog

[@RalseiSmokerOfBlunts]

Busting open alien stasis chamber in a creepy swamp facility at 3:00 AM (GONE WRONG) 🤯😳😱 (NOT CLICKBAIT) 💯

[@jacobwarkentin2156]

Can’t wait to explore the crashed high charity in infinite. Hope we learn so much more about the flood.

[@nweasels]

.....the what?

[@wallacejenkins4747]

Uh high charity is crashed on the ark not zeta halo which halo infinite takes place

[@ne3333t]

That's the problem I have with Onyx. If the forerunners were able to make something so large and advanced, why didn't the Halos have that many sentinels? If they could have that many sentinels, there is no way they could lose against the flood. The way the forerunners are portrayed outside of the bungie games are way too advanced for the story to be convincing. The Ark and the Halos should have been their biggest accomplishments. Shield worlds just do not fit.

[@macwelch8599]

Are there any HALO movies that I need to watch?

[@richardpatterson1694]

You don't need to watch any but there is forward unto dawn and halo the Mona Lisa.

[@unofficial_ai]

Halo 4: Forward Unto Dawn

[@ninedivines5374]

Not that you should actually watch no

[@richardpatterson1694]

@@ninedivines5374 what do you mean there pretty good. Except nightfall some of it's good but the other parts are just stupid.

[@ninedivines5374]

@@richardpatterson1694 I personally don't mind them but I am a nerd so I doubt anyone less invested would enjoy them

[@samuelzuleger5134]

I get the lore that the Forerunners has some issues with humans, but why not just leave a note and some basic tech on Earth (where the human seed was "planted" after the rings were activated)? Just save humanity a few thousand years of muddling around trying to discover things like wheels, iron, and gunpowder. Maybe a few notes on technology, Forerunner teachings, and what the Flood were. If you want your "reclaimers" to prep for a future attack, you might want to tell them about it and leave some notes. Doesn't seem like a bad idea.

[@darthvader4594]

I hate how 343 made forerunners so human not just in physical form but in technology too,i mean you are telling me that hyper advanced civilization that spans the entirety of yhe the galaxy and can build artificial stars and planets are still using handheld weapons?

[@ericsmith7176]

I mean what other kind would they use. Ass held weapons. They got to be held somewhere.

[@richardpatterson1694]

Hey man just because your a highly advanced race of galaxy spanning planet builders doesn't mean you won't want to still shoot stuff. Plus there weapons shoot anti matter rounds. It's like looking down in the necrons or elder for using handweapons or swords and spears.

[@masterofthelag8414]

@@richardpatterson1694 If they do shoot antimatter, it sure doesn't look like it in the games (or they're shooting practically none of it), their weaponry is pitiful in halo 4 but Antimatter is literally the most destructive thing possible in theory (a bullet's worth of anti-matter would literally vaporize earth)

[@richardpatterson1694]

@@masterofthelag8414 its vaporized any target without energy shields. And of course there not gonna make it too overpowered because game balance.

[@jesussilva201]

You can say the same with Bungie and how they made humans. It's the 25 century and we are still using fire weapons

[@kevinwilson140]

The whole lore of halo is dumb, compelling but dumb. The story would work so much better without the flood, just the earth and covenant fighting over ancient technology. I get it's a biblical allegory but they don't make any sense especially with the expanded lore. But there's so much of the lore and ships and factions that are nonsensical it's fine

[@beardedbarnstormer9577]

I think one thing we can’t comprehend about the forrunners is how insanely long in time they were the pinnacle. When you’re at the top for that long you lose a littler perspective

[@beardedbarnstormer9577]

@Clanner Bob spot on example

[@ibuttchuglsd6668]

Halo is legit every 80s scifi action movie ever. The worlds smartest people doom the human race with some dumb bullshit. Then some dumb as bags of rocks marines/mercenaries and endless magazine super soldiers shoot shit until it's all better.

[@TheBlackBrickStudios]

I think it’s a great bit of subtle storytelling (that was completely undermined by 343) that the Forerunners thought so incredibly highly of themselves that they truly believed that they were the natural end point of every society, like they believed that the seeded humans and Covenant races would all become carbon copies of the Forerunners, completely ignorant of divergent societal evolution because they were so sure of their own misconceptions of society. The inadvertently doomed their inheritors because of their hubris, which is brilliant.

[@the_gaming_rabbit8017]

The Precursors held the original mantel of responsibility, then they passed it to humanity which caused the Human Forerunner war. Then the Precursors attempt at self-preservation failed creating the Flood.

[@justinjg99]

So is captain jacob keyes the grave mind ...and why not ??.....👀👀👀💀💪fight me 👊😐

[@sunyavadin]

Storing the flood on the rings would only really make sense if they'd allowed the Monitors control over connecting the Index to the Core, a task only a Reclaimer can do. Then it would have made absolute sense to keep them on the rings since any containment breach could instantly be dealt with by using a tactical pulse similar to what was done at the Ark. Keeping them on installations within the gas giants like we see in Halo 2 made more sense, as then there's the potential to dunk the entire thing into the planet's gravity well, but on the ring's surface?

[@nathanshkopiak9060]

The reason that flood activity was so high on installation 05 was due to 2401 Patient tangent's laziness and lack of care.

[@richardpatterson1694]

Imagine letting the flood get away only a few years after the entire galaxy had just been killed to stop them.

[@VegetaLF7]

That and 2401 being captured by the Flood meant it couldn't respond to the increasing threats. Between 2401's ineptitude and capture combined with Arbiter foolishly dropping the shield that kept the Flood at bay on Delta Halo (you lower it on your approach to the Library, this lets the Flood out of the Quarantine Zone and begin spreading) and suddenly a small outbreak damn near conquered the galaxy. The Flood are *terrifyingly* effective. It just goes to show how dangerous they are, that a couple of mistakes were taken advantage of to escape.

[@Commander-Riot-Wolf115]

"We defeated our enemy what should we do?" "Keep em around there's gotta be a cure for literal changes to the infected peoples cells and the other various changes like snapped necks because they couldn't bear the mutation that the pain brought upon them."

[@taylorlathem6654]

One counterpoint though, in order to become that advanced or knowledgeable humanity needs one thing: lots and lots of time. The forerunners didn’t know how long it may be before more extragalactic flood came in and had they set the bar too high it may have been too late with humanity totally unprepared. At least this way the UNSC have a chance to strategize and utilize what little technology they have. Love the vids man!

[@KertaDrake]

I call it realistic. If modern humanity had a galaxy-spanning empire we'd have people denying the danger as infection forms latched onto the person next to them and probably people screaming that the Flood is people too...

[@elroyscout]

To be fair to the forerunners, their final war with the flood was an unmitigated car crash of a conflict with them allways on the backfoot, fighting a plague who had a personal vendetta with destroying the Forerunners and their civilization, and they had to deal with a full blown AI uprising. The fact they had A solution at all is a minor miracle, the fact its more full of holes than a screen door is honestly expected

[@AnubisSolvang]

Simply put, they needed the most advanced species in the galaxy to be stupid so that the Halo games could happen.

[@donutlie315]

i mean if 1000 A.C humans saw modern humans, they would think were super smart but were just advanced, we still as dumb

[@Arwingmaster23]

Ah the Forerunners, the clear case of "Highly Advanced" not equaling "highly intelligent"

[@dananab140]

It's not always about smart and dumb sometimes it's about ego some of the smartest people I know keep dumb people around for ideas if you're smart you can think your way out of a problem easily if you're dumb you have to come up with ideas to figure out and try a lot of different things until something works sometimes smart people's ego get in the way of them solving solutions they get so focused on one thing trying to make it work that ultimately they end up failing

[@Harshhaze]

Forerunners also didn't believe in safety railing, putting them in violation of OSHA