EFOY - Methanol Fuel Cell for Boats

[@christophermendonca]

EFOY 140 SPECIFICATION Amp Hours 140 Nominal Voltage 12V DC Maximum Power 72W Charge Current @ 12 V 6.0A Nominal Consumption / kWh 0.24 Gallon Weight 17.2 lbs. Size 17.44"L x 7.95"W x 11.34"H Operating Temp -4°F to +104°F

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Thanks for sharing.

[@captchrisjones9009]

NYHS Sailing LLC. We distribute and install EFOY in NY, NJ & CT. It is an amazing device!

[@frank12562]

I'm testing EFOY Comfort 80-Direct Liquid Methanol Fuel Cell battery tender for the state of NH. outside all winter long .worked great !

[@PacificYachtSystems]

As a reference point, there are thousands of these methanol fuel cells deployed as backup charging devices in the oil fields. Service companies are replacing AC generators with fuel cells.

[@frank12562]

we are getting 30 day pre 10 liters of fuel

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Same here, on my boat with an EFOY 210, i only use 3 10L Methanol Fuel Cartridges a year.

[@christee2908]

Same thing, 1 canister a month to get power regardless of the weather on my RV. It's a great product for those cloudy autumn and winter days when your solar, nowmatter how large it is, gives you nothing. Then it's really worth the money I paid.

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Same here. Bought my EFOY 210 almost 7 years ago and really glad i did. Especially when there is no easy way to recharge the batteries.

[@markhou]

This could be used at home on a battery array?

[@mostlyharmless5749]

Hi, I'm researching the Efoy as a charger for my RV battery. I do a lot of camping in rec sites without hookups and I use solar power most of the time. I am looking to extend my camping season but the fan in my RV heater is a large draw on my batteries. I'm assuming an Efoy 80 would be able to keep the 12 volt battery charged but I also wonder if the heat exhaust from the efoy unit can be vented back into the trailer to supplement heating? I know that that the exhaust gas should be vented outside but what about the larger vent. Is that gas nontoxic?

[@lomgshorts3]

What about backup battery systems for an Amateur Radio Station? I have 10 80ah batteries 12vdc in parallel for emergency power for a kilowatt transmitter. Will your system manage my battery bank when the line power goes down for weeks due to a hurricane? Or, do I stay with my 8kw generator that is set up to use propane? I do have solar, too. But it will not keep the batteries up until the cloud cover moves on.

[@whatthefunction9140]

What temperature does it heat up to internally?

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Don't know the inside temperature, but the outside case is just warm to touch.

[@graemeschubert6162]

Can it run on Home brewed Methonol

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Graeme, the manufacture of this fuel cell, only approves it's own EFOY Fuel.

[@drjwilber]

seperatin ethanol from methanol - as methanol lower boiling point - first to come off from distillation

[@rustyshackleford3862]

Forgive the ignorance, but why batteries? Why not run its output to a inverter? I understand it would increase the menthol consumption. But is it possible? Or am I just dreaming?

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Good question, battery chargers and power supplies are quite different. EFOY, like battery chargers and alternators, need a battery to act like a spring to handle the sudden adding and removing of loads. You unfortunately cannot connect an inverter directly to an EFOY as it acts a battery charger and not a power supply.

[@cornfedproductions9773]

I absolutely love the technology and the idea behind it and do understand that research and development costs on something like this are incredibly high. But the price is really high. I might be able to jump on board if these units could run on 100% Ethanol, not toxic Methanol. You can drink Ethanol but Methanol will kill you. I’m going to have to run my stupid noisy Ethanol ICE generator till the price comes down and the power out put more than doubles. Keep up the really great work tho. I’m defiantly a future customer!

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Comfed, all good points. Correct the price of entry is still high for many of us.

[@nc3826]

The "You can drink Ethanol, but Methanol will kill you" meme (that I have seen before) is strange.... Since who drinks from a fuel tank?.... (FYI Ethanol isn't a food and will kill you too, just more slowly) Also inefficient corn produced Ethanol, that has been massively subsidized (due to big AG lobbying). Makes far less sense to be used as a fuel, then good old sustainable cellulose/wood alcohol ie Methanol. But the high cost issue for MFCs and the low production, unsubsidized, high current cost of Methanol... Means MFCs will just be used for niche applications... Until the cost of the fuel cells comes down... and ramped up production of Methanol makes it far cheaper... (Like it is in China, where its a low cost alternative to gasoline) So while MFCs are intriguing, since it combines the best of 2 different forms of power production... it just not cost effective on grand scale, yet in the current market...But it will be one day...(check out the below link) www.caranddriver.com/news/a31406874/nathalie-methanol-powered-electric-sports-car/

[@1337fraggzb00N]

When you are dumb enough to drink from a fuel tank, I guess it does not really matter what's in there. Better stop dating near relatives, buddy.

[@cornfedproductions9773]

@@1337fraggzb00N Wow, easy to be one of the toxic people throwing insults on the internet buddy. Take a step back and reread your comment, feel good about your self for trash talking a total stranger just because they kindly voiced their opinion on a product? Your the problem with this world kid. Stop eating tide pods.

[@cornfedproductions9773]

@@nc3826 I joyed reading your detailed comment on why you disagree with what I said, instead of throwing insults at me for my opinion like other horrid people do, I bet tho if you knew why I loved ethanol as a fuel because I can make it from a crop grown on my farm with out all the problems the “large ethanol producers” have to deal with, you might change your mind on the matter. Keep your mind open, lots of different ways of growing and making the stuff. Just my 2 cents tho.

[@joshuanorris9785]

What is the efficiency of this?

[@PacificYachtSystems]

A 1 gallon EFOY jug: M10, provides ~950 amp-hours at 12 VDC.

[@joshuanorris9785]

@@PacificYachtSystems Thank you. What is the electrical efficiency? I heard somewhere it could be around 40 to 70%

[@tahermohammad5295]

Consumtion of ethanol in 1hour tell me jeff

[@fredacevedo2871]

You didn't mention the ridiculous price of the methanol fuel, or the limited availability.

[@esquire9445]

VP racing Methanol is 99.95% pure methanol...it;'s $39 for 5 gallons... just an fyi.

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Fred, good point about the availability. Here in the Pacific NorthWest, many marine stores carry methanol fuel.

[@frank12562]

The efoy fuel comes in two 10 liter cartages per box. Each box runs at about $120 plus hazmat shipping, and can be shipped globally. There are 11.3kwh per 10 liters. Pollution free.

[@esquire9445]

@@frank12562 The interesting thing to me is that efoy claims they sell 100% methanol but that number is not on their MSDS sheets, which is where such claims would hold them legally liable. I know this because I worked in that industry for a while. Perhaps it is 100%, perhaps not. I think it's ridiculous to charge as much as they do for their fuel, it's definitely a reason to not buy their product. That price is $45.42 per gallon plus shipping and hazmat fees... but you can get VP racing Methanol for $7.80 per gallon near your local racetrack. Those efoys are $6000 units, do I care about a warrantee if I use that unit that much? If I use more than 150 gallons before that unit breaks I break even. I have a hard time believing that efoy would break in that amount of time. Safety is another question.

[@richardprice5978]

@@esquire9445 iv seen M100 ( in my area its cheaper than real avgas or 105+ octane leaded and unleaded racing gasoline @ 6-12~ usd aka typical marketing even without having a drag strip by me for 100+miles ) fuel for less than 4-usd-pur usa 🇺🇸 gallon ( in a 5 or 50 drum one if the reasons i was looking at running it in my street / racing engine is it was working out to 2~ usd ish pre dollar 💵 December 2018 to run in the rocky mountains vs premium 95~ pump plus i can say its "eco friendly" ) so someone must be getting a good mark up scam going $$$ 🤷‍♂️

[@Steve211Ucdhihifvshi]

soooo basically its just a generator running on methanol? slowly? or is it a genuine fuel cell One that probably no one could fix in the middle of the ocean? and who sells the efoy fuel in the southern pacific etc?

[@PacificYachtSystems]

You bring two good concerns about Fuel Cells (including the EFOY): 1) fuel cells are complicated and it's NOT lend itself to a DIY fix 2) we recommend fuel cells to coastal sailors because the methanol fuel is NOT readily available.

[@James_Dahlen]

Jeff, i have recently installed the 140 on my Hunter 38 i have found that when motor sailing my battery voltage W/ alternator charging i'm @ 100% charged around 13.8 volts with all my electronics on for navigation etc. The EFOY factory switch off voltage is 14.2 so it would also be running when i'm motoring, this seemed like a waste of energy so i changed my switch off voltage down to 13.7 so that i conserve fuel, have you experienced the same? i find the only time i get to 14.2 volts is with shore power, and or at anchor and at night with minimal loads drawing. have you made similar adjustments or do you just let yours run...

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi James, my recommendation is to manually turn on and off the EFOY unit. Simply, we know better than the EFOY, we can make a decision if it makes sense to have the EFOY on or off. When motoring, I too turn off the EFOY unit as i leave the alternator do the work.

[@James_Dahlen]

@@PacificYachtSystems Sounds good! I found it hard to find local knowledge about the EFOY, because of your videos i pulled the trigger, they are very informative and helpful, keep up the great work! because of you this is how i came to my decision and sized my EFOY system.. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mHLHYZ1qnLF8ZrM

[@esquire9445]

VP racing Methanol is 99.95% pure methanol...it;'s $39 for 5 gallons... just an fyi.

[@frank12562]

efoy voids warranty if non efoy fuel is used two 10 liter cartages come pre box about $120. plus hazmat shipping

[@esquire9445]

@@frank12562 Good to know, thank you.

[@Tore_Lund]

@@esquire9445 The membranes in PEM fuel cells easily get contaminated, and their output drop, so reasonable that warranty only covers if certified fuel is used. Most likely, there are also a percentage of water in it, as the membranes don't like drying out either.

[@esquire9445]

@@Tore_Lund ya, I don’t have an efoy. But if I did I wouldn’t worry about a warranty. I would only worry about fire danger by using the wrong fuel. That being said, you can also get pure methanol from chemical manufacturers that is less expensive. The efoy company really rips people off. It really wouldn’t take long to use enough cheap fuel where the savings would pay for a new efoy.

[@Tore_Lund]

@@esquire9445 Atleast, if someone wants to try this, try to dig up some service manual /datasheets / random university papers on Methanol fuel cells first, to figure out how much distilled water needs to be added to it, unless the Efoy has a seperate water tank? Hydrogen fuelled fuel cells have a bubbler on the H2 line so the membrane doesn't dry up and cracks. It will be in the order of half a cup per gallon Methanol.

[@kenpole3058]

Expensive? Yes, but if you afford it, it’s a great product. And, no. I don’t have one - no need where I sail - nor do I work in the industry. I’ve just researched the cell technology extensively and know a couple of skippers who swear by them. ⛵️🇨🇦

[@richardprice5978]

can it run a small 4-6 usa 🇺🇸 ton A/C system? reliably in say a hybrid type car ( as a range extender of some sort rather than starting or adding a ICE diesel engine to run accessories or propel it down the road ) or drive a slow accreting ( sub 120kv / 200hp ish ) E/V conversion vehicle 🚘

[@SOLDOZER]

If the EFOY emits carbon dioxide, where do you keep it where it's allowed to run and not kill everyone in the cabin? I would assume it had to be up on deck when running.

[@PacificYachtSystems]

A methanol fuel cell emits as much carbon dioxide as a cat breathing. Humans also emit carbon dioxide and cannot live in a closed space without ventilation.

[@nc3826]

and its CO not CO2, that is a real health risk for breathing in.... since CO replace O2 in the body...

[@stotas2]

4.24 of no info other than its methanol

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Stotas,Can you tell me more about your question? Did you want to know how a fuel cell works.

[@stotas2]

Pacific Yacht Systems hi yes was hoping to hear how it works,voltage, what amps. Many thanks

[@edza4028]

stotas2 that Didnt go well for you did it

[@alaskanalain]

@@PacificYachtSystems How much? can we use regular methanol and can I get fuel all over the world?

[@wickedleeloopy2115]

I remember these in 2006

[@bill2292]

My GOD, you're a smart guy, with lots of information, but this video, like most of your videos, is just a gloss-over sales pitch. The fuel is $32 a gallon....

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Bill, not sure if this is sarcasm or not. Your right some 4 mins won't give me enough time to explain the inner workings of a methanol fuel cell. Here is a link to more info on the benefits of Fuel Cells, most of it published articles.

[@PacificYachtSystems]

www.pysystems.ca/products/power/methanol-fuel-cell/

[@simon6071]

EFOY fuel cells run on methanol, which is not widely available. Bloom Energy's solid oxide fuel cells run on gasoline and natural gas, which are widely available. (Green New Deal banning fossil fuels in the USA is touted by Joe Biden, a senile, hypocritical, radical left politician, but rejected by majority of the American people. )

[@simon6071]

Solid oxide fuel cells can be used for for producing electricity with natural gas, for powering or extending the range of electric cars, for making silent and efficient portable generators, etc. Green energy should not mean banning fossil fuels. It should mean using both renewable energy and fossil fuel energy complementarily, efficiently and in a more environmental friendly way.

[@svosprey]

@@simon6071 Not so! I already voted for Biden 3 times so he is popular.

[@Errol.C-nz]

80amp/hr...a day?...put up a tech to tell us not a salesman

[@PacificYachtSystems]

Hi Errol, not sure i get your question. Can you be more specific?

[@richardprice5978]

@@PacificYachtSystems 80 amps at what voltage? = wattage

[@UrgenthelpwithSubscriptionsHel]

@@PacificYachtSystems you such a kid without knowledge. You shouldn't be promoting generators. You memorised from the paper to present. And when someone puts a clear question, you aren't able to answer. You have no clue...no skills. You shouldn't be on youtube. The guy was asking you abouy watts output. How many watts per hour. I will make it clear.... So....at 12v how many amps? If is 14v charging battery bank, you must have a rated Current input. Ampers..... How many ampers output? 14v 10A? 14v 20A? This has to be per hour....not per day. Technology its clasified rating per hour...not per day. Batteries are rated 12v 20Ah( means 20A in one hour) So if you can't give an answer....go back to school or take some private teacher to help you understanding the electricity. World its full of scammers presenting produtcs. You tube its full of useless people like you. Go back to school child.

[@mbburry4759]

@@UrgenthelpwithSubscriptionsHel geez man, little excessive there... Nothing wrong with saying power in different ways, not like you cant convert it. But amps per day without knowing voltage is not a meaningful specification

[@drjwilber]

@@PacificYachtSystems it was specific enough

[@The_Unobtainium]

do not waste your time dear viewers - it's just a salesman talk. No useful information here. Zero.

[@arnieus866]

Jeff Cote does work for a company that sells stuff. So what? Short YT vids are not what he does. He also offers extremely detailed FREE presentations on all aspects of boat electrical systems based on years of experience on thousands of boats. His knowledge is greatly valued by a large boating community.