When Light Switches Get Complicated: Dead-End 3-Way Dimmer Installation

[@jragadio]

Can’t wait for the big decision news!

[@shanebibby6006]

Hi Joel love the videos so far been watching a few weeks now. Very nice. Not sure why u didn't do pigtails on grounds. But to each there own. Them wagos that u use are older style. But the 221 wagos are much better u can see the conductors.

[@shanebibby6006]

@@lorenrickey5481 are these mechanically

[@shanebibby6006]

@Loren Rickey I see there not these are acceptable in alot of jurisdiction

[@docferringer]

The 221 series Wagos are see-thru and they also have a spot in the back that you can use to check continuity. Save yourself some frustration and just get the 61x series lever nuts, but watch out: most of the pre-made kits sold on Amazon use the lower-rated 221-41x Wagos. I think I spotted ONE KIT that used the 221-61x series Wagos on Amazon so be careful to get the right ones. The 221-61x series is rated for 10-20 AWG while the 221-41x series is 12-24 AWG. That means the 61x series lever nuts will cover all of your normal household wiring needs.

[@rfbrost]

I have switched to using Wago lever nuts from wire nuts and I have noticed that during box wire "stuffing" / "folding wires" during device installation a lever can get pulled up causing a disconnect or high resistance connection. As a result, I started wrapping the Wago levers with electrical tape (I use orange tape to match the Wagos) to ensure those levers don't get lifted up.

[@BitWalker]

I've also started doing this, but ideally the lever nut goes in last so thats less of an issue

[@wirenut003]

Good job on the installation of the devices, I presently hooked a dimmer up on a 3- way system and it only used one of the travelers on the system kind of odd but I didn't like the dimmer but the customer wanted it. Those splice blocks you use I don't care for them they take up to much real estate in the box with the dimmers and have no room at all.

[@ElectricProAcademy]

Lever nuts are definitely a trade-off of time for space! We are transitioning more and more toward lever nuts, but there are still tight scenarios where having a few wire nuts in the stuff box is beneficial.

[@jaybird4095]

I hope you will be doing a video on the low voltage lighting. What do you like for the DC driver? I have yet to find one that I like. As for stuffing the wires back in to the box. I like to prebend/fold them before I connect the various receptacles.

[@scyarch1136]

It may just sorta be me but man. I HATE when I get stuck needing to use something like a Maestro or other device that doesn't have wings you can break off when using (at least) a carlon remodel box. Old school toggles, receptacles (maybe decoras too, I don't recall) are fine when you can break off the wings to recess it into the cavity built into those boxes where the device screws in and it helps with flushing out the plates to the walls but the dimmers that don't let you do it? /sigh.

[@brixtar]

Have you tried the WAGO 221 series? The standard ones takes 12-24AWG, large ones takes up to 8AWG.

[@ElectricProAcademy]

We're actually moving toward Ideal In-Sure connectors which are very similar!

[@ChristopherJames4]

How many romex cables coming into the box? Are both lights on the same circuit How did you tie the neutrals together? Smacking those switches on and off so hard isn’t a good look.

[@mathman0101]

Tucking and pulling within a box I like the volt claw they come in two types. I also prefer the knipex insulated duckbill flat nose pliers to twist it avoids marking the copper when twisting also create a little strain pulling back a tiny bit helps twisting to be more efficient and secure. I tend to prefer crimps when twisting the ground wire. I also prefer the ideal armor band wrap to avoid inadvertent shorting as wires that are compressed relax in a smaller older box.

[@AdamS-lh2ug]

I see cost/profits are not of your concern…

[@AdamS-lh2ug]

Also, not trying to knock you or anything, it’s just after 6 years of being an electrical apprentice in MN doing commercial work and about to retake my Journeyman (I know, I know, I’m using the excuse MN has a 70% first time failure rate…I’m part of that statistic) I just have never seen half of these things that seem to show up on KZbin. My bags already make my hips hurt, I’m not trying to carry anymore tools than I already do.

[@mathman0101]

@@AdamS-lh2ug I hear what you are saying. Completely understand where your coming from. There is no time nor push for quality in the industry you are always chasing your tail for time. It is just very frustrating for many electricians who want to do better quality work and be better trained and learn to do a variety of interesting work.

[@user-ln7of9gs4s]

What do you mean mechanical connection for the ground? Can you use a Wago?

[@selcoify]

Love the videos! Do you know any 4-way motion sensors or smart switches? I have read some articles online but didn't get an trustworthy answer and would like to incorporate that on my front entrance.

[@jovetj]

Can't stick them at the 3-way ends?

[@selcoify]

@@jovetj I tried the caseta line and did not work. Upon reading further, seems to me that there is no 4 way "smart switch" on the market.

[@lorenrickey5481]

Costco had a two pack of smart switches that I used for the situation you mention. Worked great and the price was good.

[@jovetj]

@@selcoify I don't have a ton of experience with smart switches personally, but the GE Cincs I've worked with would work-it's just that all switches for the load need to be replaced.

[@selcoify]

@@lorenrickey5481 you put the smart switches on the "3-way" part of the 4 way circuit?

[@vince6829]

Thank you for your videos. Much appreciated.

[@kennyvanh]

Was looking for how to connect the 3Way switch, you got everything but that

[@MikeKobb]

Please tell me they eventually got that wall plate to sit flat. I have a gap on one of mine that's a fraction of that size and it drives me crazy. It looks like the box itself is not flat to the wall, so that may have been causing the problem.

[@ElectricProAcademy]

That's typically what you get from screwless plates (from our experience)...

[@MikeKobb]

@@ElectricProAcademy Mine are nearly all flat, except for one where there's a hump in the drywall. It took a fair amount of fiddling, and I have a level 5 drywall job.

[@helmanfrow]

Some electricians I know run their switch legs on blue-jacketed cable to keep things visually distinct and to minimize confusion.

[@xephael3485]

Plenty of 3-way compatible dimmers are on the market nowadays

[@emmettiness3774]

Can you put two 3 way switches on 1 light?

[@DR-um2bv]

Yeah

[@shubinternet]

Mixing Wago and some other type of lever nut?

[@jumper233]

I believe the solid gray ones are wago 222 and the clear one is wago 221.

[@TH3mrBROWN]

Had sort of an unrelated question, was wondering if a switched outlet/receptacle can be added on the load side of a GFCI receptacle? So for example going from load out on GFCI into a switch that controls an outlet for a light.

[@nhzxboi]

Why not? You can add anything to the load side. If it works, it works. If it doesn't, something is wrong. GFCI doesn't care.

[@TH3mrBROWN]

@@nhzxboi I know it'll work, I guess I should have asked if there is a code restriction?

[@ptso7580]

Outdoor light on a GFCI is okay. No code restrictions. Just put a label indicating the fixture is on a GFCI circuit.

[@jerrypruden887]

We can’t do your ground trick in Canada

[@Vamanos46]

Waiting for matter compatible switches.

[@JohnThomas-lq5qp]

If I was only attaching a thin wire from a dimmer to 1#14 guage wire always used the smallest wire nut ( orange ) to save space. Biggest joke is the combination receptacle with USB charging ports . Well over 1.5" deep and almost need two shoe horns, rubber mallet & a prayer to get it to fit inside of wall case.

[@ElectricProAcademy]

😂 So true! Brutal!

[@michaeljavert4635]

Because of the problem you ran into, is why I am a fan of my idea to have a J box that is separate to where all connections should be made, instead of in the gang box. Yeah, it's another hole in the wall but it's why wall plates are made. There are even spring loaded. I hope to one day spring loaded ones made of porcelain and either come with design, or a way that any design or picture can be custom printed with ease or order from store, or those artsy people can do something themselves to decorate it, or just leave it plain. It makes so much more sense than fighting with a stuffed box that also need to hold switches, outlets, and sockets.

[@shubinternet]

So, as a customer, I appreciate a contractor that goes the extra mile to make sure I'm satisfied, and that takes real care of the final fit and finish. However, I hate upsells. Feel free to ask me if there's anything else I'd like that may be beyond what we originally asked for, but don't spend a lot of time trying to sell me on the latest whatever that you're trying to push. Pushing upsells at me is the quickest way to ensure that I never, ever call you again.

[@jovetj]

There's certainly a fine line between offering upsells and pushing them down the customer's throat.

[@MikeKobb]

Yeah, agree. I appreciate it very much if a contractor brings an option to my attention that I hadn't thought of, or wasn't aware of. Basically, something that I don't even know that I want. But don't try to get me to buy something I don't need and won't use. The stuff Joel was talking about sounded much more like the former category to me.

[@johnfranks]

Those screwless plates sure do cost a lot to not sit flush against the wall. I'm pretty disappointed with the ones I've installed. =/

[@MikeKobb]

I have them in my house and they (nearly) all sit flat after a great deal of futzing with them. The one that doesn't is due to a bit of uneven surface on the wall itself. But they are definitely very finicky.

[@armandol1826]

Use Lutron claros. They fit nice on wavy walls lol

[@jensschroder8214]

Why is this a 3-way switch or dimmer? 1st way: Common contact connected to contact A 2nd way: Common contact connected to contact B Where is the 3rd way?

[@ericfraser7543]

6:04 it doesn't fit probably because those wagos taking up all that additional space in your electrical box... wire nuts take less space...

[@nhzxboi]

I watch these out of enthusiasm. I have no concern with upselling or gravy work. Industrial electrical engineer here that enjoys seeing what others do. I'd think if you're a budding electrician and like challenges, industrial is the meat and potatoes of challenge and intrigue, Residential(for the most part) is cookie cutter and repetitive. Nothing against it but the new installations in construction are simply robotic tasks. Want some fun? Get into industrial.

[@timroberts6046]

I have done all phases.. while technically you are correct on new construction residential.. remodel and service work in residential is another level..a good residential guy know ways to get wire in places you can't imagine. The amount amount of sheet rock repair that I see when Industrial and most commercial electricians I see trying to do residential is almost double..

[@Shrampion]

Is there more money to be made in industrial? Where would you recommend a new master/journeyman like me (6 years experience, mostly residential & commercial) to start? I could subcontract for a company because I have my own truck, tools and liscence

[@nhzxboi]

Industrial allows you to be creative and innovative. Yes, industrial(power plants, manufacturing, etc.) needs people that can think and innovate...not just follow blueprints. Not that it is renegade but the problems require thought. Just knowing that an AFCI or whatever is required in a particular situation would be very very boring to me. Let me find out why that RS485 or whatever network is not working. How can we correct this power factor problem? It's just something you can sink your teeth into if you're not into the cookie-cutter things. Cookie-cutter works but, to me is boring.

[@ElGalloGus]

wagos, backstabbed, oldwork box not installed properly, wirenut for ground...... i dunno about this video "smh"

[@rsporter]

0 for 3 there bud.