Boeing's Starliner *CANNOT* return home without crew

[@ellieinspace]

Sorry audio is mono- i have to manually make it stereo every time and I forgot, please forgive me!

[@Travlinmo]

Don’t worry… I just spun around to the left to make it work. A little dizzy now.

[@carlbrown5150]

Sounds fine to me I am def in one ear.!!😉

[@paulmichaelfreedman8334]

My right ear is not happy with you.

[@carlbrown5150]

@@paulmichaelfreedman8334 My right ear is broken also.!!🤣🤣😂😉

[@op12studio]

@@carlbrown5150 you are deaf in the correct ear then lol

[@amamdawhatever]

I’m sure Boeing is not as concerned about crew safety as it is about the permanent reputation damage caused by rescuing them with a SpaceX vessel.

[@snsm6730]

Correct....Boeing has demonstrated dead bodies resulting from defects in its products are just a cost of business. But, as it is becoming clear slowly that the Starliner is a paperweight at this point options must be now accepted or Boeing stock prices might be effected.

[@makoimonroe2633]

Can't believe they started that a reason

[@ILovePancakes24]

They are already humiliated by the stranded astronauts.

[@snsm6730]

@@ILovePancakes24 Correct...the two folks foolish enough to ride this junker are just to publicly visable. ISS resources I imagine are carefully planned so this puts a strain on things. Not like Safeway can send a delivery guy at lunch 8)

[@nunyabidness674]

@@snsm6730 Please take this with respect, my intent is to show a different point of view. I can think of 3 other "fools" who died as a result of a "Junker"... Astronauts Virgil Grissom, Edward White and Roger Chaffee lost their lives when a fire swept through the command module of Apollo 1...

[@sturek]

send up Dragon with the top two of Boeing and the Starliner project then bring Butch and Sunny back on the Dragon and let the top two come back on Starliner.

[@theguyfromsaturn]

Sadly, Starliner probably has to undock before dragon could go there.

[@roncatdog]

@@theguyfromsaturn Theoretically, Starliner could undock, move a short distance away from the ISS, and fly in formation until a dock becomes available. Dragon could then dock, load up and return to Earth.

[@simoc24]

@@theguyfromsaturn not exactly, clew 8 is leaving on the 27th, one open bay is freed after that

[@SirGreenDay]

There's already a Dragon capsule docked at the ISS. I guarantee that they will use that to bring the 'Not stranded' astronauts.

[@lindenswan4830]

@@roncatdog they could use the arm to move it away.

[@MonsterSound.Bradley]

Boeing: "Getting the crew home safely is our number one priority, well... after our other number one priorities of course."

[@christianlula]

Can you imagine if the astronauts died on the return? I would think Boeing should be more worried about the negative publicity from that than their precious starliner.

[@kentvesser9484]

I remember a spoof of corporate mission statement on an adult-oriented satirical animated show (Harvey Birdman Attorney at Law) and it makes me think of your comment. "Putting clients first by putting employees first, immediately after prioritizing fiscal responsibilities and leveraging profitability towards exceeding by empowering our employees to put clients (and themselves) first, in a diverse and respectful environment of only those that come first, first."

[@danieltam3923]

It was management's decision to go forth with the launch knowing the existence of multiple issues with Starliner. To me, that's a bigger problem having bad decision makers at the helm.

[@pbsamanthamarie]

It is a storyline and it is not True.

[@newstar346]

Boeing CEO's $32M pay check is not enough to rescue these 2 crews back to earth

[@kwent86]

its about 30 Mill for a ride on a dragon capsule I think lol. Guarantee it won't come from his check though.

[@steveaga4136]

32m would be a good start though just throw in all the other bonuses of the star liner executives and it would pay for a crew dragon rescue and leave more than change

[@Danielo197]

While Boeing employees struggle to make ends meet

[@snsm6730]

@@Wi2Low There was a time when a CEO only made a few multiples more then the folks on the factory floor. We also had things like middle class jobs and industry that made things here. Now, we have Boeing where the CEO is more worried about his bonus and stock options then the company he heads or the reputation its squandering.....

[@davidcarroll6020]

Better to bring them back safe rather than risk a tragedy

[@petercozzaglio6070]

Absolutely. Bring them home safe in a Dragon Capsule.

[@SebastianWellsTL]

@@petercozzaglio6070 Agreed!

[@TimJSwan]

Something could go wrong with dragon, too. 🤔

[@dextermorgan1]

​@@TimJSwanLol Sure, something COULD go wrong, but we're talking about Space X. Not Boeing. I shouldn't need to explain the difference.

[@Ron4885]

​@petercozzaglio6070 Exactly. Why do anything risky at all when they don't have to.

[@beckyp867]

I guarantee all the Boeing executives will still receive big fat bonus checks this year. Crew safety has never been the primary factor for them, saving face and getting paid trumps everything.

[@marccram6584]

This is why you don't let an accountant run an aircraft and spacecraft company.

[@automatedrussianbot8043]

Sadly Boeing has lost their ways, this incident is just the cherry on top. if there are ANY safety concerns they should just ride on SpaceX home.

[@jaypie0864]

You al speak as if you have the moral high ground. If you had 15 million sitting in front of you, I guarantee someone else’s safety wouldn’t be your top priority.

[@kpetro1675]

Don't leave out dei as a top priority.

[@dcpack]

yep, so will NASA elites.

[@lektwik]

Safety being the issue the only solution is a ride home with SpaceX.

[@automatedrussianbot8043]

then hand over the starliner project to anyone, anyone other than boeing

[@TheBodiesInTheWaterBeckons]

​@@automatedrussianbot8043no. Just scrap it and divert fund back to DreamChaser.

[@c.a.g.3130]

Oh, nuts. Take a chance. Life is a risk!

[@kudr66]

It may be harder than you think. There is no free docking port and no free dragon ready to fly. Using one docked dragon would to return would mean no remaining life boat and starliner can't safely undock/return without crew. It is a logistical nightmare as it is now.

[@Donald_Turnip]

@@kudr66 It's called space walk with tools as you manipulate a broken spaceship with the Canadarm until a Space X can come dock with it and pull it into destruction like it should be. Not nearly as hard as you think.

[@alwaysprepared]

After everything that has happened at Boeing with their aircraft, how are they even allowed to proceed with these space ventures?? I suppose it's a sunk cost issue, but, at some point, reality must be considered...

[@danieldwyer5139]

The reality is total corruption

[@HDnatureTV]

You know that Boeing is building the orbiting Moon Station - GATEWAY? More like Gateway to Death. Let them go bankrupt. Hire Space X and put multiple space docks and attachment points that people can add solar panels, etc to an orbiting Starship station.

[@Urgelt]

Starliner does not have software to operate autonomously? Then its software is radically different from Demo 2. Which begs the question: what did Demo 2 prove, exactly? It certainly didn't prove the software functionality now in the spacecraft. Excellent reporting, Ellie, thank you.

[@michaelmoses8745]

If that situation is actually what you say, yes. I haven't seen the press conference yet.

[@byrnemeister2008]

Yeah this makes no sense.

[@Urgelt]

@@michaelmoses8745 neither have I. This software thing is just now getting tickled on the intertubes, while NASA and Boeing have been tight-lipped. Ellie was first to bring this into my consciousness. If not a literal scoop, she got out in front pretty early. I know Demo 2 had software problems. After it flew, they found a software glitch that could have resulted in the capsule being smashed by the trunk just after separation and before re-entry. I expected software changes for this mission. I didn't expect them to cut out autonomous undocking. I have to wonder what else they took out. Can the capsule return to Earth without astronauts aboard, or incapacitated? I'm starting to think no self-respecting NASA engineer would want to trust human lives to this thing.

[@JohnnyTalia]

I suspect that Starliner doesn't have the (already proven) autonomous software because Boeing cheaped out on Starliner's systems and there's not enough capacity to load both the manned AND autonomous software at the same time. Which means that to return it autonomously, they will need to remotely wipe and replace the existing software. And who wants to ride a glitchy self-driving space ship back from orbit?

[@user-qt7ud1cl7b]

I don't know if they do or don't but the craft before that one didn't have nobody on it and it was controlled from the ground

[@seandayton4989]

Can you imagine what they would be saying if this was a SpaceX capsule?

[@kevinhancock6483]

Exactly 💯...they wouldn't alow space X to move forward till a full 3 yr investigation..in the hopes of destroying the company & an running them into bankruptcy, because they would want all thier money back the govt/Nasa spent..

[@bigpicturethinking5620]

I have a sneaking suspicion the same political culture is what has kept dragon from already bringing them back. I’m sure space x has probably offered.

[@kenion2166]

100% SpaceX could send up a dragon in less then a week :D

[@palmtreeshenanigans]

@@kenion2166 LOL 48 hours i believe was mentioned. But a week is a reasonable timeframe, as it is not urgent they return immediately.

[@Marine_Ret]

The media would call for Elon being burned at the stake in the public square

[@slithery9291]

Just send up an empty Dragon as a return craft and charge Boeing for all of their incompetence.

[@davidbeppler3032]

SpaceX should charge Boeing $100 billion.

[@leapdrive]

They know that, but they’re either too proud to ask, or Elon is taking his time with excuses skin to FAA type excuses.

[@paulboger3101]

Not empty. With a captain and pilot. Charge them more.

[@LeongGunners]

It's not just the standard empty capsule. I think the Dragon capsule is incompatible with the suits they're currently on. They'd need to either customize the Dragon capsule or make some new suits for the 2 astronauts too. At worst, they might even need to launch some fresh supplies on a cargo capsule to extend the 2 astronauts' stay in the ISS while working on these things. No, actually screw that. That's not the worst. The worst would be having to force the astronauts to come back on a risky Starliner.

[@jimabbey9544]

NASA let it happen ,NASA is responsible! They knew this thing is a death trap but yet they let it fly! They killed 17 already Apollo 1 Challenger and Columbia all because of arrogance and complacency!

[@surferdude4487]

The engineers told them that Challenger was not safe to launch. I hope they listen to the engineers this time.

[@NielsNL68]

Yes, to me it feels we are back in that time.

[@nikwalker7495]

Boeing only listen to the bean counters...engineers they tolerate...grudgingly they certainly don't listen to them, in fact they try and get rid of them is possible, good engineers are expensive , Boeing like to save money for bonusses for their execs. execs

[@surferdude4487]

@@nikwalker7495 There has been some speculation about certain quality control personell going missing in the wake of the unfastened door scandal.

[@nikwalker7495]

@@surferdude4487 Nothing goes to far when they thinking about their own wallet and insuring the gravy train rumbles on.

[@Tyani-sz6cg]

This is why I like SpaceX far better than Boeing. Boeing hides. SpaceX tells it like it is. They shouldn't be able to play these games.

[@lanemedcalf9506]

Thanks Ellie! This was the first video that really explained where things stand at this time with Starliner! You keep things simple and get right down to the facts quickly! Great job, as always!

[@ellieinspace]

Thank you so much for watching ! And for saying that, I’m glad to know that I explain it in a way. That’s easy to understand. There’s a news briefing tomorrow that I’ll be sure to cover as well!

[@douglasstrother6584]

I spent 20+ years as a Test Engineer at a company that supplies space-qualified components whose failure would be catastrophic. This is inexcusable. There is no substitute for good workmanship.

[@garystrankman3841]

Tell that to the Boeing CEO!!

[@briandeschene8424]

@@garystrankman3841 You mean the dopes running Boeing that have only business degrees and zero understanding of engineering fundamentals?

[@gene2256]

D E I

[@galaxiedance3135]

Boeings quality control in Airplanes obviously rubs off for the space program ! Just give all this work to Space X. I trust that company much more. This delay has caused everything else in the future to be delayed. Space X could likely put ISS into a better orbit so they don't constantly drift down to earth.

[@LeonAust]

@@galaxiedance3135 Space X with its Starship is no flag ship either.....not one successful flight in 4 flights yet SLS went around the moon 100 percent successfully on its first flight. Falcon is a good project but Starship so far worries me and I would not place a human on that.......... so far 100% failure of a rocket.

[@Mr5thWave]

This is growing larger and larger as a Boeing self-inflicted issue. To put the ISS in danger is inexcusable.

[@ellieinspace]

Agreed I can’t believe how many problems have occurred

[@simoc24]

@@Mr5thWave self-inflicted is a good word 👍

[@meskes4059]

@@ellieinspaceI can. This is Boeing we’re talking about, after all.

[@TitaniumTurbine]

@@meskes4059 There are tens of thousands of flights using Boeing planes that are taking off and landing every week that you hear nothing about (or apparently even consider). But then you hear about 5 or so issues across several months - again out of tens of thousands of flights - and suddenly Boeing a bad company and is so terrible. Now, I’m personally afraid of flying and I don’t fly, but common sense tells me that if I flew on Boeing 300+ times a year, nothing would happen to me and I’d be safe. Buying into fear-mongering and these kinds of narratives does no one any good.

[@meskes4059]

@@TitaniumTurbine the 10 year service mark on the 787’s coming up. We’ll see what starts shaking loose soon enough. Pun intended.

[@tanagra2]

It literally took my breath away when you revealed that the Starliner needs a software update to automatically return home.

[@ellieinspace]

I was shocked as well

[@AenesidemusOZ]

Given the capability was already tested and proven, dropping it for 𝘢𝘯𝘺 reason seems almost criminal.

[@jasonowens7829]

Software would not need an update for that.

[@ralphm6901]

@@AenesidemusOZ possibly there were updates in some control and/or thruster systems, and the auto-return has not yet been updated to match?? Still inexcusable, but believable. I mean, they HAD working thrusters, and now they don't, so something changed.

[@mal2ksc]

Even if they hadn't ripped the software out, it would still need to be updated to deal with the current known failures. Also, the ISS has a decent Internet connection. As stupid as it sounds, this may be one of the more reasonable parts of this whole debacle, or at least one of the least disastrous in the end.

[@Gavyne]

Wow this video blew up, good for you Ellie. I still remember the rabid fans that got mad at you for suggesting they were stranded. I hope for the safe return of these astronauts, they deserve better.

[@ellieinspace]

Haha I remember them too! I’m glad I can inform people what’s going on, at least what we think is since so much is being covered up

[@prabhulingpadadayyachaukim6434]

Starliner has blocked a docking port on ISS for 2 months now. and there seems to be no immediate decision on the stricken ship. inexcusable.

[@williampiniarski1702]

Here is the deal - if they lose these 2 on the way home it would be the end of nasa as we know it because there was a safer route. There is no upside to risking this. It going to be over a year before they solve all of these problems with starliner for the next launch (if we see one at all). Dream chaser might be up there before we see SL again. Do NOT risk this.

[@leapdrive]

They’re having problems too.

[@Shadare]

​@@leapdrivea lot cheaper to have your problems on the ground.

[@TitaniumTurbine]

@@Shadare And easier to fix on the ground too. Building any space vessel has its problems but they (generally) get worked out with time and solutions.

[@gregh4284]

Do you also value the 2 human lives?

[@mal2ksc]

Let Boeing send up two people _knowing_ they're going to have to limp the craft home. This could take a while, unless there's some urgent need to boot the ship from the ISS docking port. If it comes to that, let it limp itself home unmanned or die trying.

[@timallred7055]

As a retired AF pilot, nasa should not take any unnecessary risk. Too many NASA executives trying to save political face! We have a perfectly good rescue craft that Space X could have ready in a week. If there is any chance of losing crew on star liner then put everyone’s pride in check and send a rescue mission! Thank GOD that we have a rescue option!

[@kevinhancock6483]

Exactly 💯 %... Perfectly Stated !!!

[@Tubesmaney]

Is it true they could send up a SpaceX craft that could ferry them back home? Someone commented that the spacesuits they used in the Starliner are incompatible.

[@surf-n-turf]

Thank Elon and thank you for your service! My Dad and Brother were USAF (T-33 and FB-111).

[@nodehead9475]

@@Tubesmaney spacex can send there suits they have spare

[@louiscypher4186]

​@@Tubesmaney Those people are full of shit. You don't need a spacesuit to return, Suits are used on re-entry and take off as a precaution in case of partial failure of the capsule. A rescue mission is just that, a rescue. Suit's aren't a factor. The only thing that matters is whether or not Starliner can bring them home.

[@grahammonk8013]

My guess is this a committee problem. Boeing is desperate to avoid the embarrassment of having Dragon make the rescue, but on the other hand, having the crew die on Starliner would be nearly terminal to Boeing's reputation. Making the choice between two equally unpleasant results needs a single someone with good idea of the technical risks and the balls to make that choice. Which isn't going to happen with the committee they will have formed for this.

[@LeongGunners]

Rather than avoiding having Dragon make the rescue, I feel like they are more playing a game of chicken with NASA. I think they are stubbornly posturing while counting on NASA to be the one to ask SpaceX for help. This way they can go "it's not us, we are completely capable, it's NASA that arbitrarily decided otherwise."

[@mal2ksc]

@@LeongGunners I hope NASA is charging them fair market value for their water and food rations at $10,000 a kilogram or thereabouts, plus a fraction of replacement CO₂ scrubbers.

[@demej00]

Game theory.

[@kaasmeester5903]

A safe return plus embarrassment for Boeing, or a return that may be either uneventful or catastrophic. That is an easy choice to make. But the choice depends rather a lot on whether you’re the one running the company, or the one having to ride down on this thing.

[@iqbang9236]

“…having the crew die on Starliner…” For Boeing, this is the cheapest option! Two astronauts will be heroes, the insurance company will pay, and the CEO’s salary will not be affected. As for Boeing’s reputation, who cares? Regardless, the DoD order will still come through.

[@FastTheFood]

They had a "small helium leak" that would not be an issue for the mission... however, that leak has been going for all this time... if is still going. That alone should be a showstopper after this long.

[@stevo8629]

Honestly if you were one of the astronauts being asked to return home on a faulty Boeing vehicle, what would your answer be ..... ?????

[@picksalot1]

Boeing is digging a very deep hole that it may not be able to climb out of, and every day that hole gets deeper.

[@leapdrive]

You can’t go deeper of a hole where they are now. It’s time to call Elon - uncle.

[@stevesmith756]

They are done

[@dextermorgan1]

I'll never fly on a Boeing again. Ever.

[@MattH-wg7ou]

Boeing knows the gvmt/DoD is too dependent on them..."too big to fail" so they have no incentive to avoid failure. What...Lockheed and Boeing. Thats it. Raytheon and Honeywell for weapons but Boeing and Lockheed for aircraft. Thats why monopolies (or pseudo-monopolies) are bad for everyone. Competition breeds excellence!

[@deltavee2]

Excellent

[@abhijeettube1]

I wonder why Chris Ferguson left starliner program, he must have noticed the toxic culture of boeing and the mismanagement at starliner project.

[@chichomancho1791]

this toxic culture is the real corporate culture and corporate values of big money!

[@karlmahlmann]

I hope the Astronauts have a vote on how they get back. They were lucky to make it to the ISS in that broken spacecraft. Sending them back on Starliner would be a very reckless gamble with their lives.

[@kevinhancock6483]

They have no vote ...no say ..it's not the 60s anymore 😮

[@MissX905]

There were prior issues with this spacecraft before the launching of it but the astronauts took their chances to do the mission. I hope they get back safe

[@willyburger]

​@@MissX905the crew has the ultimate veto. They can simply refuse to get into the Deathliner.

[@MissX905]

@@willyburger May the $$ was a motivating factor for them to go on the mission?

[@bobmerrill2057]

Why? Is nasa using Boeing? Troubling. You cannot risk the crews safety pretty simple!

[@mmk-w4901]

Never I would have imagined that Starliner's crew version couldn't return automatically...?!?!? What's going on with Boing??? 😢

[@rwech]

This is what happens when a company puts DEI considerations ahead of actual qualifications when hiring.

[@MeniKaplan]

This reminds me of a story about how the bridges the Romans built still stand today. Apparently, before the Roman Legion crossed a new bridge, the engineer that designed it was placed in a boat beneath the bridge and had to stay there while the Legion crossed. This is how you use evolution to create better engineering :) Boeing, take notes...

[@ross077]

So it appears that it's not Butch and Suni that are stranded, it's Starliner that's stranded! Unbelievable! You couldn't make it up!!!

[@geekthesteve6215]

They are stranded. The suits they flew up in are not compatible with Crew Dragon, so unless SpaceX has suits that can be fitted they have no possibility of riding home in a Crew Dragon.

[@garavin]

@@geekthesteve6215 You'd think NASA would have required all the suits and ships to be cross-compatible for the basics (life support, data telemetry, comms, etc). But expecting minimal levels of competence out of these clowns is apparently unrealistic.

[@MariaVazquez-du3st]

Horrifying.

[@lauriedavidscarr]

@@garavin… what do you expect from a government agency.

[@jasonowens7829]

Yet, you made it up.

[@jerrypolverino6025]

Don’t trust Boeing! Don’t let Boeing kill our astronauts.

[@kurtvanluven9351]

Does Starliner have a plug door?

[@jtjames79]

​@@kurtvanluven9351MCAS acting up again probably.

[@longshot7601]

At this point I'm not trusting NASA. As safety conscience as NASA is I was very surprized that they launched knowing that there was a helium leak. There is a reason that they did and the fact that nobody is talking about it really makes me wonder. Keep an eye out for NASA employees suddenly getting top level jobs at Boeing.

[@shannon6876]

@@longshot7601 I haven't trusted NASA since learning what they did with the bodies of the astronauts who died on one of the space shuttles that blew up - I think it was the Challenger flight. Absolutely disgraceful and disgusting, all to save face.

[@stevesmith756]

Max8 engineers

[@user-go5oj9ht6y]

They should send the dragon capsule with a redundancy of supplies and not take any risk on the Starliner capsule. There might be a risk of any systems including software , the heat shield, and parachute systems being uncontrollable, and might even cause a percentage of no crew return so in my opinion, we should have redundancy on the Starliner capsule, and it will be the dragon capsule that will safely bring them down to the surface of the Earth. Starliner’s system of control in orbit is the Vision-based, Electro-Optical Sensor Tracking Assembly and if that fails, it might not be good for the crew because everything could be catastrophically fatal for the crew inside.

[@user-go5oj9ht6y]

Sorry if there’s no correct punctuation or correct grammar, I was using voice to text.

[@Ro32da72]

Surely this situation proves part of the point of having multiple suppliers for crew-rated hardware; if there is an issue with one supplier then another supplier is still available for crew transport. The crewed launch of Starliner was billed as a 'test' wasn't it? Well, it got tested, and it broke - better that it broke on the way to somewhere local like the ISS. Bring Starliner home empty, recover it, analyse the defects, learn and move on. Boiled down, this should be an extension of the 'do the simplest (safest) thing that works' theory, but it seems there is again (Challenger anyone?) focus within NASA / Boeing on them not losing face rather than taking the route that brings Butch and Suni home with the minimum of risk. I wonder whether Butch and Suni have any say in what happens?

[@josephroman2126]

Their pre-employment NDAs will prohibit their responses in public.

[@EEVblog]

Shouldn't it be Suni and Butch's call? They are the test pilots, and thier arse is on the line. Space is risky, and they know it.

[@camembert101]

There is risky,the normal kind and then there is risky,the Vladimir Komarov kind...Don't try the second kind.

[@jasonowens7829]

Contrary to what the media wants people to believe, when the tests are done, the crew will return safely in Starliner.

[@unnamedchannel1237]

They don’t have a of the information to make that call.

[@rpmhart]

@@jasonowens7829 Just curious...what are the oddsmakers in Las Vegas saying about that? How about in Houston? Inquiring minds want to know...

[@jasonowens7829]

@@rpmhart The probability is 1.

[@slartybarfastb3648]

With another month of delay, the battery life issue becomes even more concerning. They were rated for 45 days. Like everything on this program, the rules are being bent. Certified for 45 days needs to mean certified. Not 'well we'll just extend (ignore) that'. That is only a symptom of the larger issue. Why wasn't this thruster testing done before launch? It's an issue affecting every one of these thrusters to varying, unpredictable degrees. How could they have not known before launch. Now we find out autonomous docking software was removed which had flown on the tests. This invalidates the test flights. The vehicle should fly crew in the configuration it was tested. What else was added/removed after flught test 1 and 2. Does Boeing and NASA even know? This is not a safe vehicle for too many reasons to allow a crewed return.

[@meskes4059]

It was. They were having issues then, and they still launched.

[@louiscypher4186]

They knew they had issues all along. They were given extra leeway.

[@TimothyLipinski]

The Batteries are rated for 45 days without charging... If you charge up the batteries then they will last a long, long time... tjl

[@slartybarfastb3648]

@TimothyLipinski No, this is battery life rating. The cells degrade during use, whether charging or discharging. Designed for 210 days, but only rated for this flight at 45 days. The clock starts ticking as soon as the vehicle goes to internal power pre-launch.

[@byrnemeister2008]

If it’s going to return unmanned that changes the risk calculation somewhat. Because I can’t see there being any appetite to use Starliner again in the few years left of its life. Certainly not this capsule. So if it doesn’t make rentry unmanned have we really lost anything?

[@jebediahkerman3946]

Of course they're stranded. Supposed to be there a week, now it's 2 months. If my car dies in the desert and I'm stuck for 1 day I'm stranded.

[@ixxxxxxx]

afaik spacex crew demo 1 was extended as well, a test flight being extended is a normal part of a test flight. its like a 98% chance they go home on starliner currently, they are not stranded

[@carlettoburacco9235]

I remember a phrase from Elon Musk regarding the first flight of Crew Dragon: "I'm not religious, but the night before the launch I prayed. Whatever happens I am directly responsible because I am the one who signed and gave approval for everything been done." Rest assured than in Boeing management : "F... them. Whatever happens is not my fault because we held the meetings and sent emails to everyone." Just a little difference.

[@ellieinspace]

This is sad but so true

[@GregiiFlieger]

Cannot imagine sitting on the ISS wondering when I am going home… would take a huge emotional stability…

[@phildurgin652]

Said this 45 days ago. 1) Send crew dragon up with the next astronauts/ cosmonaut with suits built by SpaceX for Suni/Butch….Boeing/ NASA has their measurements 2) send those two back in the crew dragon a few days later 3) release the starliner back and see if it makes it 4) After the crew capsule has been checked out, launch it back to the ISS with empty seats but with cargo to account for the expendables used by Butch and Suni, food water and other items they consumed while in orbit Cost will be about $200M for the rescue but its cheaper than losing two astronauts

[@AenesidemusOZ]

Turns out Starliner CAN'T return without crew. It can't undock or execute a re-entry burn without meatsacks to push the buttons. This is kindergarten-level idiocy by Boeing.

[@TimJSwan]

It can't even be undocked... 🤦‍♂ so someone will have to sacrifice themself to just get that dock free?

[@GntlTch]

@@AenesidemusOZ You gotta be kidding !!!

[@jhoughjr1]

Actually....

[@jpm5205]

Who are you? 45 days ago???

[@SkodaZek]

Boeing’s negligence has resulted in the loss of 346 lives in recent years. Do we need to add two astronauts to that list before we allow an obviously broken company to collapse or at least restructure?

[@dirtydave4351]

Is that counting the whistleblower? They have some shady stuff going on.

[@Theover4000]

@@dirtydave4351 Whistleblowers*

[@GntlTch]

@@dirtydave4351 Two !!!

[@HALLish-jl5mo]

​@@dirtydave4351 Which whistleblower, the one that FINISHED WHISTLEBLOWING IN 2019 and was suing them for discrimination, or the one that was only whistleblowing AGAINST A BOEING SUPPLIER, NOT BOEING THEMSELVES? Like, you could have done the most basic amount of research here. Boeing would have been risking being shut down as a company to avoid a fine in the first case, and literally no consequences in the second. They had no motive.

[@palmtreeshenanigans]

@@HALLish-jl5mo The one that was killed for speaking out about the issues, putting people's lives at risk for profits. Boycott Boeing and even if their aircraft are grounded due to lack of customers and they survive with their military projects, well so be it. Spacex is quickly making them irrelevant in space, and others will do the same to their military contracts. They are enemy number one for every aspect of our lives.

[@Blue_Maxxx]

The big question is what do Butch and Sunny want to do? Take the death trap home or a Dragon. I wouldn't want anything to do with Starliner! Even if NASA threatened to fire me for refusing to us Starliner.

[@cat22_a1]

Also, how informed are Butch and Sunny? Have they been kept completely up to date? They need the complete story in order to make a decision that might cost them their lives.

[@louiscypher4186]

​​@@cat22_a1Astronauts are insanely loyal to NASA, even if they are fully informed if NASA tells them to go, they will go.

[@TNitroH]

Getting fired is better than getting un- lived

[@user-qk1zi8mz8h]

I think it's better for them to come in the dragon spacecraft just get them safely back here

[@mikenoel3522]

No one should have ever been flown on Starliner. Imagine if SpaceX had the same problems. Would they have let them fly? This is just scary to think they are actually thinking of putting astronauts back on that thing. How many other problems have they missed? They missed a lot before flight!

[@ocker2000]

I got a lot of nasty pro Starliner feedback on FB when I mentioned the difference in funding between Crew Dragon and Starliner. Glad you pointed out that this is a sensitive issue among space enthusiasts. I think you handled it carefully in your video. Well done.

[@mrbaab5932]

Nasa paid for SpaceX development costs. The difference with SpaceX is they put some of their own money in first to get things going and in later contracts Nasa repaid the development costs.

[@Stansbrokenhandle]

With all due respect, the feelings of "space enthusiasts" is about the last thing that matters in this situation.

[@jamesengland7461]

This is clearly stressing them out! Butch has pulled his hair out and Sonny' is standing on end like she got hit by lightning! 😂

[@Bushodai]

The stress must weigh heavy on their shoulders ;)

[@davidgenie-ci5zl]

Her hair is a joke, she is a bad example of an astronaut, her antics on the ground prior to boarding was also bad. very unprofessional. DEI

[@bigpicturethinking5620]

@@davidgenie-ci5zlyeah her little dancing routines are unnecessary.

[@lyntedrockley7295]

Interesting, I thought so too re, all these replies. Why is her hair like that when his isn't, and surely hair like that is a hazard, shedding loose hairs or getting tangled in equipment. And WTF are they doing up there all this time,? That hair must be getting on the other's nerves.

[@akdm82]

@@davidgenie-ci5zlwow! So an astronaut can’t have some personality? Ever heard of Buzz Aldrin? Why can’t Sunni be herself too? I bet you’re a ton of fun at a party. 🙄😜🤣

[@pidjones]

A three hour tour....

[@paulboger3101]

That's what I thought!!!!! The theme song to this mission is Should I Stay, Or Should I Go by the Clash!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@Lifestoquick]

Did Gilligan's Island say that it was meant to be a 3 hour tour, hence your text. either way I love it!

[@tcmw779]

test Starliner as much as possible UNTIL it messes up the schedule, bring Butch & Sunni home on a Dragon, then JETISON Starliner and make room for stuff that works

[@Chris-un4ns]

I'm surprised it even got launched, I wouldn't get back on it.

[@lorentzinvariant7348]

It is unacceptable to risk their safety just to save face.

[@jeremyfarmer2502]

Agreed

[@davidgenie-ci5zl]

every space flight is a safety risk, and a waste of taxpayers money.

[@jeremyfarmer2502]

@davidgenie-ci5zl it's not a waste of tax payer money because space exploration and space science can be used for the better of mankind. However, that money can be wasted on poorly conceived project and bad ideas

[@TitaniumTurbine]

@@davidgenie-ci5zl Then why are you here if it’s such a “waste of time”? The universe holds a lot of answers that the big book of fairy tales does not. I’d easily pay double whatever percentage of my taxes goes to making sure space exploration is continued. What are you afraid of them exploring/finding?

[@flybywire5866]

Unacceptable for whom? That depends on the priorities people have.

[@dionysus2006]

There is enough doubt that they shouldn't attempt a return on Starliner. Crew Dragon can handle 7 with 3rd row seating. They need to have the extra seats and suits on the ISS. Then they could come back with Crew-8

[@bbeen40]

Exactly! Bring up the seats and suits on Crew-9. Have the CanadArm yeet the starliner away from the ISS.

[@kaasmeester5903]

@@bbeen40Space curling.

[@dionysus2006]

@@bbeen40 If it yeets it hard enough maybe they don't need the thrusters. Scott Manley would probably know.

[@brandonstouffer]

It would be a huge publicity win for SpaceX if they had to rescue their competitors. Boeing needs to step up their game if they want to avoid this

[@marcondespaulo]

This was already a loss for Boeing. But who's keeping score?

[@paulmichaelfreedman8334]

One way or another, Butch and Sunni aren't complaining. They're getting 10x more time in space than originally planned.

[@meanderinoranges]

Boeing better not put astronauts at risk to in order to save face.

[@gergister]

Lately, when Boeing steps up - mostly dead bodies. Hope it's not what you meant

[@louisianahighball4705]

I wouldnt put it pass boeing to sabatoge a rescue, whether legal suits somehow or what have you. If they are crazy enough to do other things they have done... I wouldnt be shocked.

[@oldtimefarmboy617]

All things considered, they are probably afraid the doors will blow off over Paris during reentry.

[@ajvonline]

Leaders at Boeing should have swallowed their pride two months ago and returned its astronauts to Earth by the safest means available... Hello. This is Boeing. Is Elon in?

[@johnjamieson7688]

What bothers me the most is the lack of transparency on Boeing's part. The longer this goes on the lack of information grows. As a result, speculation from all sources grows. That is a bad look for Boeing.

[@thomasboese3793]

Boeing has been VERY OPEN. About all of the negative comments being made, they think it's unfair and should stop. So they did, stopped talking openly about everything.

[@paulpaulsen7777]

I think they already know it will do the Columbia spray dance

[@dougwitte765]

Transparency is not the issue. You do not give out all the vital facts to the public ever! They have no idea what goes own in making decisions with all the engineering that was done to make this happen. All tests must be made to ensure safety no matter how long it takes. Did you know of all the setbacks SpaceX had in the beginning with their new vehicles. Worse than this. It takes time to refine the designs and protect the astronauts.

[@rosswarren436]

NASA isn't much better. For instance, they let 12 long hours go by before telling us more about the status of the Cygnus NG-21 cargo carrier. For a public agency, that's inexcusable.

[@IronmanV5]

"Three separate, well-placed sources have confirmed to Ars that the current flight software on board Starliner cannot perform an automated undocking from the space station and entry into Earth’s atmosphere.." I had to re-read that several times to make sure I wasn't hallucinating or imagining what he wrote. McDonell Douglas was the worst thing to happen to Boeing.

[@thomasboese3793]

After the merger, they kept the glowing name of Boeing and installed the failed team from Micky-D. I think the bottom 5% of any business class could have done a better job.

[@HarveyJay-qw2gk]

Starliner cannot perform an automated undocking from the space station and entry into Earth’s atmosphere.." Isn't that just so handy. :"we can't determine what happened all the parts burned up on reentry,"

[@williamscoggin1509]

If the people that are arguing for them to come back on Starliner were the ones who had to ride in it, they would sing a different tune. 🤨

[@MissX905]

The astronauts knew the risks involved but still went on the mission. This spacecraft had issues way before the mission

[@robertstrickland2121]

At this point, the risk of an unmanned undocking is too high. Someone has to be onboard in case of a thruster malfunction.

[@jamesdellaneve9005]

I work at Boeing. Who would’ve thought that 20 years of executive leadership with finance backgrounds would lead to failure everywhere in our company. I am retiring in February. I tell the new hires to move on. You can’t fix this broken culture. They’ve made the engineers dispirited. Every project is a cost exercise. I run big projects and programs. You get help from executives when you are over budget or missing schedule. They are asleep until cost or schedule is affected. They have no passion for the customers or technologies.

[@AenesidemusOZ]

Every "calculation" mentioned is either bureaucratic of financial. The only "calculation" worth a damn is based on the safety of the astronauts.

[@drumzone5]

WTF is up with Boeing?!? They seem to be on a downward spiral with their entire operations from their production of airplanes to 'starships' and it's so sad to watch...like a slow motion train wreck.

[@michaelotoole1807]

Boeing is also making a mess of the new airforce one contract. and the fuel tanker contract. they cant seem to do anything right.

[@Ask-a-Rocket-Scientist]

MBAs can kill any company.

[@jessiejanson1528]

To be blunt, Boeing fired it's managers that understood engineering and hired people that only care about cutting costs in order to help improve Boeings balance sheet. Across every aspect of Boeing they have REMOVED inspections to verify both the quality of work and that the work was done. In one example, an inspection team over 150 problems on one plane which they reported. They were told that they found too much and were given a fraction of the time to inspect it again, when the lead refused they were fired. This resulting in a much smaller incomplete list of things to fix. The starliner requires two inspections to verify the parachute is attached, Boeing skipped both and it slammed into the ground during a test since they forgot to attach the parachutes. Boeing has skipped countless inspections for aircraft, some resulting in trash and debris being found in the floors and walls. They also found tools in the walls and alcohol bottles in the open, showing inspections didn't occur during the build or after for it's final inspection prior to delivery. The USA military had rejected delivery of cargo planes from Boeing for to trash and debris on the floor and walls which may threaten the crafts safety of something is damaged. They have had countless issues. The issues that brought down two planes were similar, they cut corners to save costs. Rather then a redesign of the plane they threw large engines on it making it inherently unstable. They tried to fix this with mcas, but fight critical systems are supposed to have 2 to 3 backups. 3 let's one fail with the other two agreeing so the pilots don't need to be aware. 2 let's them know there is a problem and one doesn't agree, they can ignore very erranous data, but still choose to turn off one sensor or the other. Boeing chose just one this flight critical system, so when there is a problem the plane just tries to kill everyone, if it's right after takeoff they are pretty much guaranteed dead. Boeing also chose to not incorporate the new system into the training since it was more post of another older system so crews were unaware how to deal with it in an emergency when they lack time. They say the pilots made mistakes with the system, but their actions show they didn't understand the problem. Had Boeing stuck to industry standards and by all rights, what is normally required for flight critical hardware, the crashes never would have happened and the crew might not have known of the issue. Boeing for it's part did include a warning light if the airline bought the luxury package with leather seats for it's planes, otherwise they didn't even get the warning light for the flight critical system. Boeing has assassinated two people just prior to testifying, one that even joked "if I kill myself, it wasn't a suicide". Boeing should be shut down but they have friends in the military and with various senators that make sure Boeing doesn't face serious consequences.

[@stevepirie8130]

They’re trying to force NASA through Congress to return to the gravy train contracts as fixed price is showing how poorly they’re setup.

[@jhoughjr1]

Boomer executives

[@Little908]

My left ear found this video particularly entertaining and informational to watch

[@ellieinspace]

I’m so glad! Maybe next time I can hang out with your right ear 😝

[@privateerburrows]

Well, risking people's lives other than in war is a delicate matter. Risk cannot be completely eliminated. Even astronauts on Dragon are taking a risk; but the risk could be said to be very small. In fact, not just small; the risk aboard a proven vehicle is not easily calculable, as all parties involved have made efforts to consider all possible risks and mitigate them. This is what is usually considered acceptable risk where human lives are concerned: Risk that is unknown, because known risks have been addressed. But this is not the case with Starliner: Starliner has TWO issues, that we know of, publically; possibly more that we haven't been told. One issue is helium leaks, which are said to be not too serious, but which have not been explained away yet. The other issue was with thrusters that appeared to have stopped working, then started working again, then stopped working again. And here again there has not been a satisfactory explanation for the failure mode. The closest I heard to a theory for what's going on was that some gaskets had been eroded or chemically denatured by fuel, and bits and pieces of the gaskets may have broken off and ended up clogging the fuel filters (which, I believe, are there to catch solid ice pieces of cryogenic fuel, but don't quote me on it). While this explanation sounds PLAUSIBLE, the question is, can the theory be DEMONSTRATED? And I'm going to guess the answer is no, for if it had been demonstrated we would all have heard about it by now. But the worst pair of new news is what you've just reported, namely: 1) The absent autopilot ability to fly back to Earth without crew, and 2) the lack of over-the-air software updates for Starliner (should I say "over the vacuum" updates?). These two unbelievably retardedly missing features are the crowning jewel of Boeing's incompetence.

[@goldgamercommenting2990]

I thought there won’t be a rescue dragon… Fortunately for me I can figure out the only method… a rescue Soyuz which ironically was used after the Columbia disaster to send American astronauts home who were stranded up there. It’s de javu all over Starliner is currently running thruster tests… the results are unknown. So in theoretical it could return home but slower than usual

[@Tyani-sz6cg]

Anyone else had a feeling this was not going to turn out well, months ago? Was watching it live and figured that thing would be coming back by itself, and the two crew members would return home on a Dragon. Time for Boeing to close this part of the company and focus on aeronautics.

[@kagazuki]

Does NASA really want to risk 2 lives to save Starliner?

[@MicheleLLOYD-bk2mt]

Yes

[@MicheleLLOYD-bk2mt]

Yes. Lives have NEVER been important to yanks. Only $$$$$$$.

[@robertherrmann4823]

No. Lives equal publicity.

[@HALLish-jl5mo]

Risking two lives to save [Spacecraft] describes the first crewed flight of Gemini, Crew Dragon, and Starliner. Just launching is doing that. Take such an abolitionist approach to risk and you'd never fly new spacecraft.

[@kagazuki]

@@HALLish-jl5mo I know what you're saying just getting out of bed is risky these days. I meant that, with the known Starliner problems can prove fatal on reentry. As exemplified by Shuttle Columbia that had a dislodged foam on launch and ultimately caused its disintegration on reentry.

[@yourhandlehere1]

Nobody is standing up for Boeing...unless they have money in it. They need to take the loss...not the astronauts.

[@robertbrassell1215]

I would imagine the existing software and profile assumes all functioning thrusters. So if many thrusters are disabled and possibly asymmetrical, they would certainly have to come up with a new set of software to fly the same return profile.

[@tonyug113]

the software should cope with disabled thrusters, imagine if they lost a few when coming home

[@louiscardinale1701]

Looks and sounds like the silenced whistle blowers were correct about boeing.

[@jerrypolverino6025]

The Bean Counter 1 is not safe. Let Dave Calhoun fly on that junk.

[@lethargogpeterson4083]

Bean Counter 1. Nice.

[@paulpark1170]

He was let go end of July. they didn’t let him stay till end of December like he stated.

[@jerrypolverino6025]

@@paulpark1170 That’s good news. Thanks.

[@woodmanengineering9708]

Two space walkers ...push Starliner away from space station. Wow wouldn't that be hard for Boeing to swallow.

[@thomasboese3793]

Great, adrift in space and still no way to get home via Starliner.

[@AenesidemusOZ]

Adrift, uncontrolled, essentially on a random trajectory and velocity near the ISS (and other craft over time) ... Not a good idea.

[@MissX905]

Too much risk of it once undocked to crash into the ISS tho

[@brianb6969]

Ellie, 55yo US Navy Vet here in MO. Love You're Channel! I Believe They're Way Back to Earth, Should be on a FALCON 9/DRAGON! I mean , the Dragon Capsule has Bought Back like 50 ish People, To and From the ISS... God Bless you Ellie, and Thank You for doing All You Do!!! I'd Give Anything to Visit STARBASE! So envious! LOL

[@egooidios5061]

The fact that some people contemplate returning the astronauts in a potentially unsafe vehicle, speaks volumes about Boeing already.....

[@wilboersma9441]

When I first started the video, you saying "what the heck is going on" matched really well over a muted video of Suni on the station and I thought it was her saying that and I was like "OH DANG, IT GOT REAL" lol

[@sstrick500]

Have someone go in and push the "undock" button real quick then run out. Kinda like trying to beat the garage door closing.

[@AenesidemusOZ]

I'm sure McGuyver could figure it out if he had a ball of string and a paperclip.

[@Logoseum]

There is no reason to risk the lives of the crew if they don't have to...and they don't have to. Send up SpaceX Crew 9 as planned this month and return Butch and Suni on it to buy time to sort it out.

[@garavin]

I think the Crew 9 Dragon has to dock at the port currently occupied by Starliner. So one way or the other it has to leave before the Dragon capsule can connect.

[@Logoseum]

@@garavin jettison it

[@Theover4000]

@@Logoseum I was saying the same thing, but one glance at other comments, and apparently the stupid capsule is unable to do that on it's own.. Wtf???

[@rushthezeppelin]

​@@Logoseumthe problem is that the problems with the thrusters could cause it to hit the station on undocking....pretty sticky situation.

[@msromike123]

I'm glad Bruce Willis didn't have to nuke that asteroid by being transported by Starliner. It would have taken a month just to upload the correct software.

[@kevinhancock6483]

😂😅

[@rushthezeppelin]

For some reason my mind went to The Fifth Element and i was confused 😂

[@kaasmeester5903]

That would have made for some boring cinema. Instead of them fleeing the exploding Russian space station after refuelling, you see Willis feeding 3.5” floppies into a computer as he watches the progress bar get stuck on 98%. *cue dramatic music*

[@genonote228]

It's time for Elon to send an Optimus robot to fly Starliner home... 😮😮😮

[@gneruinseruihnutshnu]

Anyone else noticed, how mass media constantly forgets Butch exists when reporting on Starliner Sunita Williams?

[@begelston]

Who's Butch again?

[@meowinghowler]

@@begelston Barry Wilmore, the commander

[@begelston]

@@meowinghowler I was kidding. It's like the other guy playing next to Jack Black in Tenacious D.

[@changeagent228]

I used to be quite neutral about boeing. Now I wouldn't trust them to open a can of beans.

[@simoc24]

Eric’s article I read it TWICE, since it is so insane 🤯 software?? Why change software in a certification flight?? Is that even legal?? I am at a loss of words 🙄

[@ellieinspace]

I’m shocked his article hasn’t been talked about more I made this video last minute because this was too bonkers not to address

[@MichaelWinter-ss6lx]

They had to change a good amount of the Starliner software, but if its this much, there should never have been crew in an untested vehicle. If the code is not even modular, what profession did they pay to write the code?

[@simoc24]

@@ellieinspace bonkers is the right word 😜👍 Boeing is the COMPLETE opposite of SpaceX, Clearly the left hand has no clue what the right hand is doing 🤯 that’s the only plausible explanation I can think of 🙄

[@AdministrativeReload]

If they actually flew it with a software package that wasn't able to return without crew input, that is bordering on criminal. What if something happened to the crew and they were not conscious to provide input?

[@tanagra2]

@@AdministrativeReloadbrilliant comment

[@thomasboese3793]

Sounds to me like the software team took two approaches to landing Starliner, with/without crew, and developed two very different programs for the two different scenarios and only one program can be loaded at a time. If I were a betting man, A dollar gets you 13 donuts there is no way to update Starliner's software once in orbit. (Boeing is on a money-saving run. Why make things complex when you are never going to use it.) Could SpaceX put another two seats into the next Dragon going to the ISS, and play a game of Rock, Paper, Scissors between the six crew who should come home as to which two stay a bit longer? This is getting to be worse drama than high schoolers dating.

[@Adventures-and-More]

In another twist, the astronauts are rumoured to have developed a physical relationship with each other

[@ianPedlar]

Well obviously the main concern should be with the safety of the crew, especially Suni because she is a legend. We can't lose Suni! Politics be dammed!

[@hedleypepper1838]

The whole point of having 2 launch providers us backup. So if they need to send dragon to get sunny and butch. Then that is exactly the point of having 2

[@ryanm7263]

The problem is that the backup in this case is the only American company which can build a functioning spacecraft at all. Starliner hasn't failed because of an anomaly. It has failed because Boeing is collapsing under the weight of its own incompetence and dysfunction.

[@1sames]

I hope they decide to use Dragon, do the software update over whatever time it takes, and let Starliner come back on its own. If they're trying to save face, they've already failed. Let's do the safe thing.

[@dougwitte765]

Starliner does not have the capability to return on its own I think.

[@challenger2ultralightadventure]

Is their doubt that Starliner can safely return Butch and Suni? The honest answer is simply yes! No amount of boasting or posturing can erase that doubt. They should do the adult thing, call the mission a partial success, and have them return on a Dragon.

[@hobbyguy79]

Priority #1 must be the safe return of Butch and Sunny. Obviously, regardless of the vehicle used, there is always risk involved because it's forking space travel, but if there is even the slightest question or uncertainty around Statliners ability to fly you can not put then in it. It's not Apollo 13, there are other options available.

[@briandeschene8424]

It sounds like Boeing was trying to pull a fast one in that they loaded different software for the two uncrewed test flights vs the crewed flight. My guess is that the initial test flight had unified software (uncrewed or crewed) which was very buggy causing test flight one’s abysmal mission. They patched the heck out of it good enough for uncrewed test flight two to “pass”. But have more properly rewritten code on this first crewed flight without uncrewed capability. In IT you see this kind of thing often. Production code isn’t ready for initial demo’s or trade show so you write stuff good enough to impress while Production code is completed. What ends up being sold and shipped is not the same as that code written to impress early on.

[@michaelfink64]

NASA requires the risk of crew loss on any flight to be < 1/270. If the testing of Starliner does not predict a risk as low as this, it is a no-brainer; the crew must return in a Dragon capsule.

[@kenbrady4275]

At this point, I think Boeing should cut their losses and back out of the whole program. I see no way they can salvage this mess. The opportunity has passed them by and it is not only throwing good money after bad but it puts a serious risk on the lives of the astronauts and the already damaged reputation.

[@waynewilliams8554]

@kenbrady4275. Boeing isn't going to lose anything. We taxpayers are footing the cost!!

[@mal2ksc]

They're like disgruntled employees _trying_ to get fired because if they quit, they _definitely_ won't get Unemployment. There are huge penalties if they back out, so they're trying to get _thrown_ out.

[@TheNorthwestForager]

Why not let the astronauts decide whether to take dragon or starliner home?

[@zanelittlegray]

It can’t return home w/out a crew? GOOD! They should tear off its heat shield and then de-orbit the piece of junk.

[@kevinevans7507]

So we need to 1) Do more testing. Possibly that's done. 2) Bring Butch & Suni home safely - but according to Terran Space Academy, who knows more about than I can find out - not in Starliner. 3) Let Boeing save some face. So, what if we send whatever additional hardware might be necessary for the undock itself software update to be installed, then put some experiments we can find to claim they are quite important to return automatically in Starliner: if it returns "Man it was great that Starliner was there for that!" If not, 'Well, those experiments weren't that important anyway." And then when the news cycle is full of other stuff bring them home.

[@Real28]

It's getting more and more difficult to stand behind Boeing. These 2 need to come back, we cannot have a tragedy at the hands of reputation. I hope NASA is not willing to do that. That said, Boeing needed this to go smoothly as they haven't had the best of years. It is going the other direction.

[@nor4277]

That's Boeing problem. Thinking about money over safety.

[@GntlTch]

These are self inflicted problems. A result of putting greed and profit above quality and ethics. Boeing management deserves no sympathy. Unfortunately, it will be the lowly Boeing workers who don't have golden parachutes will pay the price,

[@brianw612]

A lot of us talk how bad SL is and how they shouldn't return on it, and all SX rescue stuff. I just hope NASA is putting total focus on the two lives whatever they decide. No reputation, personal or corporate, should take a higher place than that.

[@deltavee2]

Not according to Boeing.

[@fr57ujf]

The longer this goes on the greater the doubt that Starliner is safe. You can't roll the dice here. A Dragon rescue mission increasingly seems the only choice. Forget the problems with scheduling changes and Boeing's reputation - the astronauts' lives are the only thing that matters.

[@sxsignal]

I'm curious as to how their food situation is going? this was obviously unplanned and my be going through their reserves

[@tubester444]

It’s a no-win for Boeing. Even if some accident happened on the return that was out of their control, they would still incur the blame.