Emancipating History #7: Indonesia: antikoloniaal verzet en herstelbetalingen

[@000RESONANCE]

Hormat, semua pembicara dan upaya mereka! ✊🏽

[@x11fjh11]

Goed dat dit wordt besproken. Veel van de kennis is niet doorgegeven en /of bekend. De diversiteit was groot. Een eenheidsduiding is niet mogelijk, wel de overeenkomsten van en voor velen.

[@streetscienceofficial8675]

Ja ja ja, Nederland the Collonizer which glorify butchering era in Banda malluku island of Indonesia, Dank Jewel Mevrouw van Nederland

[@ardyalmatsir5603]

regarding "apartheid", could it be the Dutch is the first to implement it much earlier than the South Africans?

[@globalharmony01]

Top Gesprek! Helder! Goede Inzet van Mbak Fitria and Marjolein en Alle Sprekers 🌷💐💙. Om te genezen moet je eerst Erkennen om Harmonie te Creeren 💙🌏💙

[@cSharpIndonesia]

English subtitle please? :)

[@fitriyaniazis8105]

Congrats mbak Fitra 🤗😘 I Proud of You , Fitra Beautiful & Smart 😍👍

[@huubvanbezel5632]

WAAROM BEN JE IN NEDERLAND ----------

[@streetscienceofficial8675]

Because you make them there, Why your VOC and Nederland goverment make falsification about History of Nederland in Indonesia?? Your Nederland Becoming So prosperous And Rich Country by Stealing and Butchering indegenous peoples of Indonesia

[@WesTiel]

Maluku and Papua is not Indonesia we are not indonesians

[@d.janssen66]

Which part of Maluku? There were Moluccan nationalists such as Johannes Leimena and Johannes Laturharhary who said otherwise and who claimed how the Moluccans were for Indonesia after talks and agreements. Furthermore the sultans of Ternate and Tidore from the Northern part of Maluku, Sultan Iskandar Muhammad Jabir and Sultan Zainal Abidin Syah gave their sultanates to Indonesia without the use of arms or an armed struggle. In Papua its nearly the same with the nationalists Frans Kaisiepo and Silas Papare, Machmud Singgirei Rumagesan and Marthen Indey who were for Indonesia because Sukarno himself declared how Indonesia is for all from Sabang to Merauke. It is sad that the names that were mentioned are never really given justice in the history books, as it has been rare to hear the otherside of the story when it comes to this issue

[@dominic0182]

@@d.janssen66 All parts of Maluku, Papua, Timor, Aceh and others that got annexed by the Javanese. Don't name a few names to make your story right my friend. My grandparents fled into the jungles of Ambon, when Soekarno gave orders to the TNI to takeover the Moluccan islands who declared the Republik Maluku Selatan. Yes...there were a few people who desired to work together with the Indonesians (ruled by the Javanese), but for the most people wanted their own country...We don't have the same culture, we don't have the same race, we don't have the same language...you say "But what about Malay?", I say "What about Alifuru!". Same goes for every other place and people that you Indonesians are oppressing every day...by killing their presidents, destroying their culture, make them sing that shitty national anthem of yours...And now you're crying about the history during the Dutch Indies?...forgetting your own actions like working together with the Japanese, killing European man, women and children with your bamboo runcings during the Bersiap. If you like to touch history my friend, yours will also float to the surface and you will loose all compassion.

[@d.janssen66]

@@dominic0182 Hmmm I would say first that its a generalization and secondly that we should pay more attention the context of this as well. The reason for this is because if you're giving the credit to the Javanese for creating Indonesia, we're making the mistake of neglecting the fact how the Sumatrans, such as the Minangkabau, the Bataks and the Mandailing people also played an important role during this period and how the Sumatrans we're the true heroes of conceptualizing Indonesia as a nation-state, especially the Minangs or Minangkabau people because they were the intellectuals and business people of that period. For a start, the Minangkabau are known as a society and ethnic group that places top priority in high education and in their tradition of rantau or of going overseas in seeking, spreading knowledge and in finding new business opportunities and in using that knowledge they have gained abroad to improve their own local communities in Western Sumatra where they are from and based. Many Minangs, such as Sutan Syahrir, Muhammad Hatta went to the Netherlands to study in universities such as Leiden and Erasmus (one building in Erasmus bears the name of Hatta today) to study Law and Economics. Other Minangs such as Agus Salim and Hamka went to Mecca to expand their religious knowledge. As a result, they are widespread across Indonesia and foreign countries in a variety of professions and expertise such as politicians, writers, scholars, teachers, journalists, and businesspeople. The Indonesian language itself was highly contributed from the Minang people, most notably Marah Rusli who gave life to Malay literature with his book Sitti Nurbaya. Other examples include Chairul Anwar, a half Batak-Minang writer who is recognized as the national poet of Indonesia due to his poetry. In general, numeorous Minangkabau writers and journalists have made significant contributions to Malay and modern Indonesian literature. In addition, even though their population was relatively small compared to the Sundanese or Javanese, the Minangkabau is one of the most successful during the colonial period onto this day. After independence, many of the Minangkabau people held prominent positions in the Indonesian and Malay nationalist movement, as the first Singaporean president was also a Minang by ethnicity. For Indonesia it is especially renowned how six of the top ten most influential Indonesians of the 20th century were Minang by descent. Examples of prominent Minangs include Mohammad Hatta the first vice-president of Indonesia, Agus Salim also a former Indonesian government minister of foreign affairs, and especially Tan Malaka who was the ideological father of the Indonesian nation as he is known as "Father of the Republic of Indonesia" who gave the name "Indonesia" for the country when it reaches independence. Other examples include Sutan Syahrir a former Indonesian government prime minister and founder of the Socialist Party of Indonesia who was famous for his underground activities in opposing the Japanese during the occupation from 1942 to 1945, Muhammad Natsir a former Indonesian government prime minister from the Masyumi party. Furthermore, Minangkabau politicians dominated Indonesian parliament and cabinets during the liberal democratic era with Muhammad Natsir becoming Prime Minister from the Masyumi Party. What is even more surprising was how they were diversely affiliated to all of the existing factions, such as Islamist, nationalist, socialist and communist. If you're saying that it was only the Javanese then we are neglecting the fact of how the Sumatrans, particularly Minangs literally BUILD Indonesia as a nation. Without the Minangs there will be no Indonesia on this Earth. On the Japanese occupation, what you ignore is the fact that not only Europeans were killed and massacred, over 4 to 10 million people in Java became forced labourers or Romusha who had to work by the Japanese military in building railroads, toil mines and heavy construction in Sumatra, Thailand and Burma in very brutal and poor conditions. What is often ignored is that the death rate among the Romusha from atrocities, starvation, and disease far outstripped the death rate among Allied prisoners of war to add that up. On the Bersiap period, firstly Indonesians do not call it this but call it "Perang Kemerdekaan" because of the proclamation of independence in 17th of August, 1945 and how this was violated. Furthermore, the TNI had capable commanders who became big shots in the near future such as Abdul Haris Nasution, T.B. Simatupang who were Bataks and graduates of the KNIL, Ahmad Yani, Sudirman, Didi Kartasasmita, Urip Sumohardjo who was the highest ranking KNIL officer of the time who eventually became the Chief of Staff of the TNI. Nasution's doctrine of war known as Hankamrata or "universal people's security" which remains the doctrine of the TNI unto this very day established it as a formidable force. So to respond to your remark it was not just through bambu runcing that the pemudas fought, there were also guns, guerrilla tactics, military strategy and "semangat" that the TNI soldiers used to fight for independence in the Indonesian National Revolution. I think its also quite impressive that Nasution's book "Fundamentals of Guerrilla Warfare" is a standard book for military academies in the West and that his strategy and tactics were learnt by the Vietnamese, especially the Viet Cong during the Vietnam War which gave them victory in 1975. Furthemore, the leadership, endurance and charisma of Sudirman during the war of independence also cemented the Armed Forces as a force to be reckoned with in the political and international realm. On the issue of everyone wanting their own country, I would say we also have to becareful and that there is a misinterpretation here because there were far more people and organizations who wanted an independent Indonesia, which is demonstrated through the BPUPKI or The Investigating Committee for Preparatory Work for Independence in which the representatives of each ethnic group used consensus, deliberation, discussions and debates to decide how Indonesia can be a nation for all socio-ethnic-religious group with the Pancasila serving as the uniting factor of all that was reached again through consensus and discussion. If it was not for the Pancasila, Indonesia would have been broken apart. Other organizations that I can name include Muhammadiyah which Sukarno and Sudirman were part of that also has a lot of Minang members when it emerged there and played a huge role in building the national consciousness of undereducated Indonesians during the colonial period, the Masyumi party which were Islamists, the Nahdlatul Ulama who are traditionalists that has many Buginese and Banjarese members besides the Javanese and the Indonesian Catholic Party that was founded by Ignatius Joseph Kasimo Hendrowahyono and eventually had a lot of Floresian members such as Frans Seda and these parties themselves number in the millions with the first two numbering in tens of millions, which is not a select "few". You can further read on the internet on how this culminated. Furthermore, there have been historical records that demonstrated how even when Indonesia became federalized during the late 1940s, many ethnic groups continue to resist the Dutch through guerrilla warfare and in resisting oppression. To answer your question on the issue of people why there was no division from different races, languages and culture, those differences were never a problem in the first place due to the extensive trade routes that existed in the Malay archipelago and Malacca straits during the pre-colonial period. What united the different ethnic groups was the common goal that the Pancasila gave which implemented a different nationalism from the Western conception of nationalism because it serves to unite and not divide differences of whatever type. Lastly, On the Indonesian language, this language is a standard variety of "Riau Malay",that was conceptualized by the Buginese-Malay noble and ulama Raja Ali Haji so it was never Javanese to begin with. Instead of vernacular Malay, this form of Maly rather represents a form of Classical Malay as used in the 19th and early 20th centuries in the Riau-Lingga Sultanate. Furthermore, the Indonesian national emblem that is represented by the Mythical Garuda was designed by Sultan Abdul Hamid II of Pontianak, a native Malay-Arab ruler. As a result, Malays were more involved than we think and that many Arabs, particularly Hadhrami Arabs were also a part of the struggle and played a key role in the national revolution.

[@dominic0182]

First off...You're trying hard to give a credible response by talking over point with facts (indeed)...Yes, Muhammad Hatta was a Minangkabau and he did studied in Holland...I'm pretty sure there are / were a lot of talented Minangkabau people who helped creating Indonesia. I also believe you when you're saying Salim and Hamka went to Mecca to expand their religious knowledge, although I don't see the point why this would help other people because there are also Christians, Buddhists, Hindus and others. But...when I'm talking about "Javanese", I'm talking about the "heart of Indonesia" (I'm mentioning this, but I'm pretty sure you'll understand what I'm talking about...Just like all your Javanese presidents). About "killing Europeans"...You do know I wasn't talking about the Japanese occupation, I was talking about the Bersiap period (we DO call it "Bersiap" over here in the evil West). Ofcourse...all occupied people lived in terrible conditions and a huge number got killed (Javanese, Sumatrans etc.). But tell me about the huge number of Javanese who worked together and also got trained by the Japanese, seems like you didn't want to give a reaction to that one. About the TNI...Nice info, but why are you talking about the TNI as a organization, instead of reacting to the huge elephant in the room...namely the fact I was referring to it because of the fact Soekarno ordered "the TNI to takeover the Moluccan islands who declared the Republik Maluku Selatan"? About the Pemuda's and their bambu runcings...This was merely a description of their characteristics. Yes there were other weapons, but these bambu runcings were widely the weapon of choice (horrible, almost ritual-like killings)...also so very special, that you've build some statues displaying the weapon like the "Bambu Runcing" monument in Surabaya. But again, you do know exactly what I'm talking about... About "everyone wanting their own country"...First off all, I was talking specifically about Moluccans. I understand you didn't got this point because I didn't mention the word "Moluccans" specifically, but it was a reaction on you talking about Leimena and Latuharhary. Ofcourse to keep people away from this point, you are giving us a complete history of people (surely not Moluccans) that were for the most part supporting Indonesia...while Moluccans proclaimed the RMS on April 25th, 1950. Because of it's immense support (from Moluccans), Soekarno wanted it (RMS) destroyed. About the "few"...again was referring to the small amount of Moluccans supporting Indonesia (in their hearts). I don't have to spell you this one, you do know that at this day...people are supporting the RMS. And we've all seen how Indonesia is treating people who wave the flag of which they desire. About the Malay language...dude...what's your point? Read the context. About your answer as a whole, I do appreciate the effort. There is a lot of information in it that was new to me. Also enjoyed reading it.

[@d.janssen66]

@@dominic0182 Hmmm, saying that all Indonesian presidents were Javanese is a misnomer. The Third President of Indonesia who was renowned as an engineering genius in the airline industry, Bacharuddin Jusuf Habibie's father, Alwi Abdul Jalil Habibie was from the Gorontalo people of the Northern part of Sulawesi so it's not particularly accurate to say all presidents were Javanese, but I see your point, I'll grant you that. I would also be careful because during the Liberal Democratic Era of the 1950s there were also prime ministerial positions that were filled by Bataks such as Burhanuddin Harahap, Minangs such as Muhammad Natsir both from the Masyumi Party and Juanda Kartawijaya who was Sundanese and is famous for the Juanda Declaration which allowed Indonesia to be seen by the world as an archipelagic state as it was approved by the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea. On Agus Salim, I was mentioning it as an example, check his biography, he was renowned for being a journalist, for being a polyglot and a member of the Volksraad. Despite being a proficient speaker of the Dutch language, he insisted to deliver his speeches in Malay, the first member of the council to do so despite hostile reception from other European members. Many other Minang members in the Volksraad such as Yahya Datuk Kayo followed Salim's example. Salim's career after the Volksraad saw him being one of the first Foreign Ministers of Indonesia did a lot for the diplomacy for the Indonesian state during that time. After the Volksraad disbanded, Muhammad Yamin a lawyer and politician who was also a Minang played a key role in Indonesian independence starting with the Youth Pledge of 1928 in consolidating Indonesian as the language of the Dutch East Indies for independence. Some of his other roles roles is in being a member and playing an active role in the Indonesian Independence Preparatory Research Agency (BPUPKI), arguing that human rights should be included in the state constitution most notably in arguing that human rights should be included in the state constitution and by providing proposals on the state basis of Pancasila in 1945. In addition, he is also a member of the Preparatory Committee for Indonesian Independence (PPKI) and the Committee of Nine, which is tasked with drafting the formulation of the Preamble to the 1945 Constitution. Lastly, three out of the four Indonesian founding fathers were Minang, most importantly Tan Malaka, Muhammad Hatta and Sutan Syahrir whose roles I mentioned, the fourth being Sukarno. That is also why I say that the Sumatrans are the true heroes of this country, especially the Minang. It is due to these reasons why I would again re-assert how the Minangs literally BUILD Indonesia from a political, social, economic and literary view. On the Javanese working together with the Japanese we should also look carefully because in Java you're also missing the huge resistances against the Japanese such as the Blitar rebellion in East Java 1945 that was conducted by the PETA or Defenders of the Homeland officer or Shodancho (Japanese word for commander or lieutenant of a Platoon) Supriyadi with his platoon and the Singaparna rebellion of West Java in 1944 by K.H. (abbreviation of Kyai Haji) Zainal Mustofa and his students which gave a lot of anger to the Japanese. Non-Javanese examples include Sutan Syahrir's underground resistance movement due to this antipathy to Japanese fascism and the massacre of nearly the entire Pontianak Sultanate's royal family with the Japanese accusing them as pro-Dutch and a number of other Malay Sultanates as an example in the Mandor incident of 1944 in Western Borneo or Kalimantan when they rebelled against the Japanese with only the future Sultan Abdul Hamid II surviving. These are concrete examples. And yes I do know why it's called "Bersiap" because of how the soldiers used the Indonesian word "Siap" in how they give respect and stay in line. Most Javanese who lived in the rural areas did not even have a choice but either to be Romusha and work as forced labourers to death in the railways, mines or heavy construction either in Myanmar, Thailand or Sumatra in the millions or become Heiho or be auxiliary soldiers. This discrimination continued when the entire Heiho army or navy had to salute Japanese citizens, whether civilian or military. In fact, perhaps the only place that was able to prevent the recruitment of Romusha was in Yogyakarta due to the efforts of Sultan Hamengkubuwono IX who saved his people from being sent to Myanmar to become Romusha by asking the Japanese to allow the building of a water canal (the Mataram Ditch). It's different for youth who are members of PETA or Gyugun who always have promotions or military positions as most PETA members played an important role in the formation of the TNI after PETA was disbanded. People who get into PETA also don't have a choice to join but only a select view. You also had the Fujinkai (women clubs) the task of maintaining the defense of the back line of warfare, such as supporting the advancement of the economy and procuring various war equipmentand along with the Jawa Hokokai. In addition to this, around 2.4 million people died in Java from famine during 1944-45 as the Japanese took the rice storage and cattle for themselves starving the people to eat the bark of banana trees, grass along with dadap leaves and other examples where this is similar was in Korea. On you saying a lot of Javanese being collobarators, that is partially true but that is too generalized and skewed of a view. The majority of Javanese who were Muslims in the rural areas and a huge number of them Kyais (the Javanese word for a Muslim scholar who is both a master in Islamic theology and jurisprudence and a Sufi master) opposed the Japanese because of how they forced them to do the seikerei, in which they had to bow to the sun as a form of respect to the Sun Goddess Amaterasu which they considered as shirk, an act of of idolatry or polytheism (i.e., the deification or worship of anyone or anything besides Allah) with those who resist killed or tortured, most notably K.H. Hasyim Asy'ari the leader of Nahdlatul Ulama or NU which today is the largest Muslim organization in Indonesia and the world. There were a lot of Javanese that were also accused as collaboraters of the Japanese, such as Hasyim Asy'ari when he in fact approved of K.H. Zainal Mustofa and his santri's (students of pondok pesantren or Indonesian traditional Islamic boarding school) act of resistance against the Japanese in 1944 which highly angered the Japanese. If he stayed silent, that is nothing but a sign that he supported Japan They actually wanted to use Japanese propaganda that wanted to attract the sympathy of the Indonesian people, as a vehicle for independence. Kiai Hasyim did not aim to take advantage of opportunities that exist or reflect the meaning of taking it "while there is a chance", seizing the influence and hearts of Japan for personal gain. Learning from his experience when he was imprisoned and tortured by the Japanese at the beginning of his occupation, Kyai Hasyim knew very well the Japanese atrocities and the Japanese typology who were very afraid of the Muslim movements in Indonesia because of their numbers. The Japanese tried what they could to contain them such as through the foundation of Shumubu, the Muslim religious department in Indonesia and in creating the Masyumi party and organization where they also appointed Kyai Hasyim Asy'ari as leader. It's actually quite simple, if Kyai Hasyim really wants to use Japan for personal gain, of course, the offer to become president is very tempting. Of course, if what he thinks is power, position, big name as a leader of the country, choosing to accept Japan's offer, it becomes very logical. However, the proof was not carried out by him, instead recommending Soekarno and Hatta, two nationalist figures to become president and vice president. If only Kyai Hasyim and the above figures had not taken advantage of Japanese politics to prepare for independence, Indonesia might never have had a national army which in the aftermath of independence was instrumental in fighting the Allies and Dutch who wanted to dominate Indonesia again. Second, it could be that the conflict between the nationalists and the Islamists is very strong, so that the basis of the state is not immediately agreed upon. Third, Indonesia's independence was slow, because if Indonesia had been frontal against Japan, it would not have been easy to achieve that independence. Fourth, the ideals of the unity of the people who can firmly accept Indonesia as their homeland cannot be achieved, without Masyumi, Shumubu, etc. Fifth, there are no embryos of organizations that accommodate the struggles of the independence fighters, such as PETA, PUTERA, Jawa Hokokai, etc. Then there is the stigma that independence is a gift from Japan? Is this expression correct? Of course not. Not at all justifiable. It's as if. Instead, it was the diplomatic struggle, negotiations, and of course the military used by Indonesia against Japan that contributed greatly to the independence of this nation. So we must be able to fully understand the reasons for Kiai Hasyim's acceptance of various positions, strategic positions as one of the ways in paving the way to an independent Indonesia. Furthermore, whether we realize it or not, admit it or not, this method is very effective, strategic, tactical, and observant, able to see opportunities and the direction of the struggle ahead. Many non-Indonesians also do not know that he is also a founding father of Indonesia's independence as he also gave the suggestion that Sukarno should proclaim the independence on August 17, 1945 and approved the Pancasila when many Islamists were trying to find reasons to disprove of the Pancasila in uniting the different socio-religious ethnic groups from division.

[@barta9342]

De toenmalige archipel is niet te vergelijken met de moderne UN staat Indonesia . Zoiets als het huidige Nederland gelijkstellen met de seven provinciën. Nederlands Indie ontstond door vestiging van Europese migranten op Java en inspanningen van de VOC =een particuliere internationale handelscompagnie. Het eindigde met de annexatie door Hiro Hito in 1942 . Van de bevolking van de archipel was ongeveer 0.4 % Europees of Indo-Europeaan . Na de proclamatie van de onafhankelijke republiek 1945 begon de Bersiap op Java en Zuid-Celebes. een genocide op niet-Indonesiërs. De Nationalisten keerden zich ook tegen politieke tegenstanders en de divers onafhankelijkheid bewegingen oa de Communisten (Madiun affaire 1948 ) . Het perspectief van de Nationalisten is een onafhankelijkheid strijd . Het is meer een ultra nationalistische machtsgreep in de archipel die leidde annexatie van oa West Papua 1962 en onderdrukking van onafhankelijkheidsbewegingen in de archipel. 300,000 inwoners van voormalig Nederlands Indië vluchten als repatriant naar Nederland.

[@RHK45]

Ze hoefden niet te vluchten. Ze konden Indonesiër worden. Ze wilden gewoon hun priveleges houden en konden niet accepteren dat Nederlands Indië verleden tijd was. En wat betreft de bersiap. Wie niet luisteren wil, moet voelen. Dus dat gezeur over een heel klein akkefietje als de bersiap is onterecht. Indonesië heeft daar al excuses voor gegeven.

[@barta9342]

@@RHK45 Tja als je de feiten niet onder ogen wilt zien . Bersiap 1945 is genocide . De doelwitten van de doodseskaders ; ongewapende burgers .mannen ,v rouwen en kinderen van niet Javaanse afkomst en vooral alles met Europees /blank bloed maar ook chinezen en Molukkers. (raciale discriminatie ) en politieke tegenstanders. Schattingen 35.000 slachtoffers van vernedering , verkrachting, marteling ,afslachting . Men is niet gevraagd of men Indonesiër wilde worden. Madiun affaire 1948 het afslachten van 45.000 vermeende communisten , politieke tegenstanders van het nationalisme van Sukarno en Hata Iedere onafhankelijks beweging binnen de archipel en papua is met geweld neergeslagen ook op de Molukse eilanden waar het RMS ideaal nog steeds leeft. Indonesië heeft vooralsnog geen excuses of herstel aangeboden aan de slachtoffers. 300,000 repatrianten zijn uiteindelijk gevlucht naar Nederland waaronder 4200 ex Knil . Inderdaad veel KNIL militairen hebben hun carrière als beroepsmilitair voortgezet als Indonesiërs in het Indonesische leger. Uiteindelijk is de zogenaamde onafhankelijk oorlog onnodig geweest. Het koloniale bestuur was al de richting van zelfbestuur ingeslagen en het was slechts een kwestie van tijd geweest . Inderdaad de bersiap was een klein akkefietje als je het afzet tegen de communistenjacht in Indonesia waar men schat dat er zo;n 2 miljoen slachtoffers zijn gemaakt .

[@jameswoods4821]

KOM DAN NIET PRATEN, IN HET DORP VAN MIJN OPA WAREN ER VEEL MASSACRENS IN DE WOONWIJK JOGJA EN JIJ VINDT DAT EEN GEBRUIKELIJK DING OM TE ZIEN EN OP TE MERKEN

[@ricardoaletrino2202]

​@@RHK45inderdaad vluchten hoefde niet. Mijn vader had de keuze gemaakt om voor de jonge Republiek Indonesie te dienen.....en hij behoorde tot de eersten jonge officieren vd Indonesische strijdkrachten...mijn vader met zijn on Indonesische voorkomen en meer eropeesche uiterlijk werd geliefd door zijn manschsppen.....en wij hadden een goed en gellukig leven in Indonesie zonder racisme en discrimnatie.... Oya de bersiap tijd mijn moeder en haar familie werd gered door hun voormalige huishoud hulp een Sundaneese man..... en de Indonesische politie te Sukabumi die hun in veligheid brachten naar de14e Bat te Bogor bij de demarkatie gebied van Nederland... het was een tragedie de bersiap maar dat was geen officiele beleid van de toenmalige jonge Indonesische staat jegens de Belanda's en hun sympatisanten.

[@ricardoaletrino2202]

Waarom woont dhr.Pondaag eigenlijk in Nederland.....het land van de dieven ?

[@silver17s91]

Omdat Nederland aangepakt moet worden

[@ricardoaletrino2202]

@@silver17s91 dhr Pondaag is te gast in Nederland. Als je Nederland will bekritiseren doe dat vanuit je eigen land , is meer geloofwaardiger. Een land veroordelen en bekritiseren maar ondertussen wel je boterham daar verdienen en mee profiteren van allerlei maatschapelijk en sociale voorzieningen. Wees een kerel en woon in je eigenland en bouw je eigenland op levert jouw bijdragen. Het hele punt is tocht uiteindelijk dat iedereen in zijn eigenland moeten blijven en afblijven van een andere land. Want anders vertoon jezelf een koloniale gedraag.

[@herbertwijchgel6137]

Pondaag scheldt op mensen uit Heemskerk maar woont al sinds 1969 in ...............................Heemskerk .Pondaag scheldt op Blanken maar is al decennialang met een Hollandse getrouwd ! Pondaag scheldt op Indo,s maar hij is zelf een Indo en zijn dochtertje ook ! Als Jeffrey niet door zijn Indische moeder was meegenomen naar Nederland op zijn 16e ,liep hij nu sigaretten te verkopen in Jakarta en had geen A.O.W gekregen .

[@bendesa]

Moet je even naar de video kijken. Hij legt het namenlijk uit waarom hij in Nederland woont

[@ricardoaletrino2202]

@@bendesa ik heb alle begrip voor indo eropean ( indische nederlander ) die een keuze maakt om in Nederland te gaan wonen en Nederland als hun vaderland ziet en beschouwen.....daar hebben ze alle recht . Maar deze man Pondaag ..een man van noord- celebes etinische afkomst....een Indonesier dus.....bekritiseerd Nederland vanwege oa hun koloniale verleden....hun koloniale gedrag...vanuit een land die hij verafschuwd....is in mijn optiek kort gezegd schijnheilig. Een Indonesier die koloniale verleden van Nederland veroordelen heb ik geen enkele bezwaar tegen. Maat niet een Indonesier die hun eigenland verlaten ...geen enkele bijdrage levert aan de opbouw van zijn eigenland en eigenvolk verdiend in mijn inziens geen enkele vorm van respek. Indien hij een gegronde reden hadden om destijd zijn land ter verlaten en verblijven thans in Nederland dan is dat zijn eigen keuze....wij leven tenslotte in een vrije wereld.....maar dan vooral gedraagd je als een dankbare gast....respekteerd het gastland en zijn bevolking......kortom hou vooral je bek dicht over Nederland. Indien Nederland uiteindelijk blijkt geen goede en beschaafd land blijk te zijn voor dhr Pondaag....dan koop een enkele reis richting Manado ( noord-celebes ) en is hij gellukig in zijn eigen " negorij "....en doe dan van daaruit Nederland bekritiseren. Algemeen gesproken heb ik geen enkele respect voor land verraders....

[@Djiejejdj]

Pondaag is a psychiatric patient.😂

[@Jblah]

hes smart. He stepped up for his people. What did u do?

[@Harambe2016]

Jelyta, heb je nou niets beters te doen?

[@b1t0k01]

jank programma..

[@huubvanbezel5632]

ACHTERLIJKE hAAT

[@streetscienceofficial8675]

Jajaja Nederland love Slaughter and Butchering peoples in malluku island, never admit The Truth of VOC, Falsification of History by Dutch goverment, Bravo Collonizer happy Falsification