Back to the Future of Wind Energy Technology with Paul Gipe

[@Ikbeneengeit]

This kind of wind engineering content isn't anywhere else on KZbin, I love it, thanks so much!

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

Thanks!

[@VeganV5912]

@@EngineeringwithRosie Heart attack pictures, fatty foods is animals clogged arteries : kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z2bamIypidSCiK8 !!! kzbin.info/www/bejne/pnezd6Gem9p_qKc Vegans don’t have this problem because that is the animals. Vegans don’t get clogged arteries, 4% cancer if you’re vegan. Meat based diet 51% death rate. That is extremely high for a frigging burger etc. Gorillas in the wild, have 1 percent cancer. And they never ever eat animals !!! Peer review science !!!! KZbin delicious vegan food. Time to change ✅❤️😉

[@maroufsultanzada6964]

@@EngineeringwithRosie thanks ...i can not find the starwind in that book. would you please help me? where I can find estimaiton for star wind?

[@haifutter4166]

It took me some time to find this video. This is the best educational video regarding these turbine scams. I wish this would be shown to everyone who stumbles upon one of these videos with their absurd claims. It definitely helps with getting a sense what and what not to expect from each turbine design.

[@TonyGrayCanada]

I've been following wind energy for decades and I have to say that I love your approach and attitude.

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

Thanks, that's nice of you 😊 I've only been at it for a little over one decade, so I didn't see most of these "inventions" I showed here when they first came out. Which means I can understand when others think any non-horizontal 3-bladed turbine is a revolutionary idea.

[@solarwind907]

@@EngineeringwithRosie I’m glad you got Paul Gipe on. When I started in a small wind business decades ago I read his book. He does a good job of explaining why vertical axis wind turbines do not work very well. After several decades and an incredible amount of marketing hype and out right lies from VAWT manufacturers no one has proven him wrong. The physics just isn’t there. Thank you very much! Your science-based videos are a great public service!

[@smueller12244]

@@EngineeringwithRosie, one thing I didn't get from the video....was that I already understood that ducted turbines are more expensive to produce...this is obvious. But your video did not address if the additional cost does indeed pay off in the life of the ducted turbine. Very disappointing lack of economic research...and a very engineering type mindset to just write them off without showing the economics fairly (something like total lifecycle costing)

[@TurbineGuy]

The hivawt has been around that entire 10 years. Surprised you haven't heard of it since i had millions of views for being sent to jail for installing it next to my house. Also I'm the Turbine Guy

[@kenstarcher7394]

Very well done Video!! I have enjoyed working with Paul Gipe for years and he was as straight forward and honest in this video as when we first met ( I am the one in the red checked shirt on page 423). Keep posting videos that keep people thinking and THANKS for your efforts Rosie !!

[@PatJamesRicketts]

I have been researching this for a personal off-grid setup for a few years now, and it is daunting. To figure out a battery bank, which types of batteries to use, BMS, inverters, charge controllers, wiring, solar panels, turbines, small scale hydro-electric, even human power... There are many ways to do it, but it is more often than not a DIY venture. I love that aspect for my own curious, problem-solving nature, but for mass adoption it will continue to be a real hurdle for quite some time. I feel like the best option for myself, and most likely everyone else looking to generate their own power, is a combination of some or all of these things. It really comes down to harnessing what is available in your environment. For example, my land is situated at the bottom of a hill where water pools near the peak, so hydro-electric seems feasible with a small dam, a decent length of pipe, and a scaled down version of a typical hydro-electric generator. Also, I am on one of the windiest coasts in the world, so wind power is something I am strongly considering, but to re-purpose vehicle alternators, electric bike motors, or buy an expensive pre-built generator? it is tough to choose. With advances in solar technology, even in my predominantly overcast climate I can still see some decent charging from a 1200-1800W array. There are so many factors to consider, but with enough research you can feel confident in your choices, and ultimately learn the most from the building and using of the system.

[@ronsmith1364]

The draw back is system cost vs grid tied installation (when its feasible). My one thought for homesteaders is a backup freezer battery bank for out of power emergencies. The cost of a gas generator vs a viable 'offgrid' system drives the generator cost as doable vs a green preferred one. Great points Awesome vlog on a subject I keep in my little green heart ...

[@jeffbybee5207]

Generally where are you? I do think that wind is more practical vrs solar because stormy times I think are when you need the power. But if you live where you can build as logical I like passive annual heat storage buildings

[@acmefixer1]

@Pat James If the water runs year round then use micro hydro- or pico hydroelectric. If the water runs a hundred meters downhill then you may be able to get a few hundred watts and store it in lithium iron phosphate batteries that last a long time. Will Prowse's channel does a lot of the explaining for you.

[@PatJamesRicketts]

@@acmefixer1 I have been learning a lot from Prowse as well. I am currently looking at a 24V series/parralel bank with at least 400Ah capacity. Learning to balance cells, wire components, and source materials has been a journey, but feel it is the right step forward. Power independence is worth the time it takes to learn and implement. Kris Harbour has a cool hydro setup, I was thinking something along those lines.

[@pavelsulc2617]

@@PatJamesRicketts Hello Water is an attractive source of energy, but in my opinion it is the hardware that requires the most attention in terms of maintenance. I find solar energy much better and if you write with you blowing a lot then even a wind generator is worth considering.

[@stauffap]

You're not a "party pooper". This video and a lot more like it are so much needed. More skeptics need to speak up and find the courage to call out unjustified hype with regards to renewable energy sources and renewable energy systems and also talk about what the scientific literature has figured out already. There are a lot of studies of renewable energy systems and unfortunately not many people seem to read them. In fact most people don't even seem to get the idea to read them. They just seem to forget that this subject has been and is being studied by scientists all over the world and that they are publishing studies about it.

[@EngineerLewis]

As WTG design engineer from the 1980s I am pleased to see your realistic assessment of new novel WTG designs ....at last! There is nothing new under the sun was a comment from a person who lived around 2500 years ago and it still applies today! The internet is such an attractive place for anyone to present their ideas and so we get the rubbish as well as a few small gems! Working out which ones are gems in the WTG market is a lot easier now you have provided this guidance! Thanks 👏

[@gromett]

I can't believe how many times I have to send a link to this video to people. Latest one is a friend who was looking at Aeromine and thinking it would be the miracle solution to his offgrid energy needs. Thanks for making such a great and useful video.

[@barryhamm3414]

I live in a fairly ordinary suburban house in Brisbane, Australia with an electricity bill that was equal to the GDP of a small country. I make no claim that my calculations were correct but solar panels appeared to make more economic sense than any wind turbine that I could legally erect. Large scale wind turbines erected in a far more suitable location are obviously a totally different story. These new innovative designs are always interesting but it's a huge step between finding something to be interesting and actually spending the $$$s. Thanks for the excellent video (11/10).

[@byGDur]

I appreciate that you presented this topic without being condescending. Well done!

[@edwomer591]

Well nice video and I am glad Paul Gipe is still around. Being from central PA I met him back in the 80's and he was down to earth and no BS back then.

[@GarretKrampe]

I spent 4 years modelling VAWT, and the torque issue I solved at that time in a gyromill with cam config for blade pitch. It got too complex . What I did find is that the apparent "wind" direction settles into just a few degrees deviation at higher TRS's. So a much simplified set up was born out of knowing the low speed would be a bitt ratty but high speed would be a lot more stable in torque output and efficiency. The major advancement came from using the tip vortices as thrust. It also lent it's self to easier maintenance and lower cost to install and transport. The alternator would be modulated to further reduce torque peaks , and that alternator would be at or near ground level giving the "drive shaft" a measure of torque damping. Container sized would produce around the 100KW. Remembering that ease of shipping and installation is much of the equation. There was also the possibility to use radical blade profiles. Biggest issue is the high G loading on the entire length of the blades and it's in shear not tension.

[@jdillon8360]

Thanks for bringing an intelligent, informed voice to this topic. So much hype and misinformation out there, it's great to have your voice in this field.

[@wolrion]

Great vid! Nailed inviting Paul Gipe to an interview. But there's an issue... Just because the project is less efficient than an industrial wind turbine, it doesn't mean it's garbage. Just because an hydroelectric power plant is more efficient than a simple water mill, it doesn't mean that they are useless in a little farm scale. I think you could have talked more about the good projects out there for "backyard purpose".

[@statisticool]

Exactly, not like all of us can or want to install a costly, huge, noisy, animal killer or disorienter on our properties. Just rather a small-scale one to help offset electricity cost and possibly also look cool and have little maintenance costs.

[@2adamast]

Paul Gipe was promoting build and tested systems versus vaporware. Those cheap Amazon "400W" turbines are probably ok once tested as 20W backyard turbines

[@BillMSmith]

Thanks for helping us all stay within the bounds of reality. I do love playing with concepts, but delivering proof in the real world is what ultimately matters. That said, I'm horribly disappointed that my backyard full of squirrels is being so cavalierly rejected as the infinite power source I think they could be. 😁

[@sandramoorewilliams5384]

Thanks for the laugh.

[@Tundracats-u9k]

I remember Paul Gipe's name from the 90's when I was interested in windpower. Eventually I bought a small off the shelf HAWT and set it up in the back yard. Didn't produce much power, too many tall trees. I don't regret doing it, but found the city planning department totally unhelpful and condescending. It was a chapter in my life. My logo has the wind turbine in the background.

[@paulgipe6684]

Yeah, I've been doing this awhile. ;) Glad Rosemary gave me a new outlet.

[@oadka]

As an aspiring mechanical engineer, it is nice to see some real facts rather than the usual hype without facts. Thank you!

[@debbiehenri345]

Thanks for discussing this. I've been meaning to buy or make a VAWT turbine for ages, couldn't decide how to go about it or which brand to choose. Just like solar panels, it sounds like there's still room for improvement with regard to wind turbine tech. It annoys me that the media gets so carried away by new innovations, making you think - This is it! The answer to all energy producing problems! - only to never hear of the innovation again.

[@ViihdeJukat]

The problem with wind is always everyone tries to capture slow wind to produce energy. The energy law states if win has energy -> the collector gain only equal amount energy. So in wind designs the problem is always size. You need eithe big 30m collector to capture enough of that wind to produce energy. a Conical or plaine wings, conical is being the much worse than plain wings because plain wings can capture the the speed of wind not a mass. Think of water the same, if you would want to produce good amount energy you need to capture the speed not the water mass. Because the speed of water has energy not the mass. Think of this way. The mass you capture from wind/water will always be negative to speed of wind/water. In engineering the problem is how to negate the mass and use only speed collecting what in a essence the industrial wind trubines do.

[@dprcontracting6299]

A great vid Rosie. Thanks to you and Paul (now there's a man who has 'been there, done that')

[@handsofrhythm3415]

Is the lovely sound the way Rosie talks because of her wonderful smile? No. It's because of her passion for renewable energy! Please don't stop smiling :) you are the best person on youtube.

[@williamclark6466]

Thank you for another excellent, informative video. I learned a lot and it has not put me off being interested in small or medium sized or truly effective & efficient designs, but definitely weary of unproven gimmicks.

[@fiegenfiegen]

Excellent insight on how NOT to read about new renewable energy concepts! I think I will remember about all headlines ending with a question mark being answered No automatically. Let's keep an eye on them!

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

Ha ha, yep it's a fun game to play. I feel like it's about 90% accurate. My last video has "Can Lithium Ever be Green?" on the thumbnail, and I believe the answer will be yes. So I hope that is one exception. But of course this video's thumbnail question's answer is no!

[@nc3826]

@@EngineeringwithRosie but "Ever" is a longtime

[@AnalystPrime]

@@EngineeringwithRosie Green as in up to million times cleaner than the fossil fuels being replaced by EVs and battery storage, yes, definitely. Green as in zero pollution of any kind whatsoever, no, because the factory building the 100% clean and renewable powered mining machines was built from materials from a mine where one person's grandpa used an ICE car and some idiot WILL keep pointing at that as "proof" that renewables and EVs are totally worse polluters than ICE and coal and we should keep giving taxpayer money to oil companies instead of saving the planet. My mother always told me to not call them idiots...but the only explanations for people using that strawman argument(or the one about windmills killing birds) are that either they are idiots who should not be allowed to breed, or they are traitors to humanity working for aliens who are trying to exterminate humans and xenofrom our planet.

[@YodaWhat]

@@EngineeringwithRosie Automatic NO? *_NO!_* ANY simplistic rule is subject to abuse by the unscrupulous.

[@YodaWhat]

@@AnalystPrime Another famous overgeneralization is embodied in your extreme example. Simple selfish greed and/or ignorance is sufficient to explain *_most_* of the world's evils. Even genocide is likely to have roots in old disputes over land, which typically stem from some belief like _"I need that land more than my neighbor needs it, because I don't like him."_

[@andrewcheshire244]

Love your work Rosie, just discovered it and its very useful for my project of creating a portable generator for hiking/outdoors. I find it's really not that complicated, if it spins, it generates electricity. If it spins faster than something else, it generates more.

[@andrewcheshire244]

And I'm planning to do a series of tests next week, testing the best configuration for a number of different blades.

[@peterhulbert]

I always watch your videos for several reasons but mainly because I am hoping to move house and install a wind turbine and your honest reviews are truly amazing and appreciated. My enthusiasm is on turbo and my motive is to do something good and I thank you for the fantastic information and guidance that you all offer. Thank you 😊

[@tomfarrow710]

I run a small wind turbine (450 watts) and other than the wires separating it has been with me since 2008. When I was lowering it for the wire repair I broke the blade(my bad). No it doesn't do as much as I would like because of location, city rules, but it does keep a battery topped off. Thanks for the good information, and keep up the good work

[@Andysfishing]

Nice one Rosie, I used to read the Beyond 2000 books, any new technology needs to be proven before it’s publicly promoted.

[@mcknottee]

Recently discovered your channel, and like it a lot. Episodes like this one are particularly interesting and useful. Cheers, from a fellow Aussie.

[@fredericrike5974]

As always, thank you, Rosie! Sadly, wind energy isn't the only scientific or engineering problem beset with hype artists and sleazy used car sales tactics (think the blonds draped over the fenders of Cadillacs)- nor are normally rational engineers proofed against buying in and getting in so deep they become part of the problem. Again, thank you for a "breath of fresh air"- your best engineering! FR

[@bheineez]

I build my own small wind gen sets. Just don't know how to do "real" testing.. I get volts and amp tests.. charges my batteries and im happy. Great video! Debunk scams is always a good thing. Keep encouraging the critical thinking

[@davidcebon7792]

Great video Rosie. Paul Gipe is a star!

[@kalebbodden2176]

Another banger video. Paul's insight was phenomenal!

[@brianp9054]

3er or 4th video I watch on your channel, definitely valuable content hard to find in KZbin, you won my subscription. Merry Christmas and Happy new Year!

[@nigels.6051]

"Should we ignore all small wind?" If you have a grid connection then yes, because the end cost of the electricity always reduces and reliability increases with increasing power output of the turbine. There is no way a small backyard wind turbine can compete with the latest offshore wind turbines that can produce a day's electricity for a household in just half a turn, and due to their location and height can produce that power most of the time. They are also much better for the environment than building the tens of thousands of backyard wind turbines that would be needed to produce the same power as just one of the latest offshore turbines. Ohh, and due to their height, nearly all sea birds fly lower than the blades can reach!

[@simonromijn3655]

Good points but there are windy cities such as my hometown, Wellington in Aotearoa (NZ) where you have to think some form of rooftop turbine could one day provide affordable electricity to the home.

[@thomassutrina7469]

I see more small wind turbine not turning because they are a pain to maintain for the energy obtained and just getting high enough to have sufficient wind is often the biggest expense.

[@nigels.6051]

@@simonromijn3655 Description of Wellington: "The enclosed nature of the harbour gives many sheltered beaches and bays regardless of wind direction." - There may be some properties there that get good wind, but for most of the population it would make good economic sense to share an offshore wind farm with the turbines located in some the best winds possible. To power every home in Wellington requires a farm of just 5 wind turbines of the latest 14MW variety, with maybe some extras to power your industry.

[@mbergey1]

Yes, economies of scale exist. But by your logic there shouldn't be any rooftop solar either. Rooftop solar continues to sell very well because its offsetting the retail cost of electricity, not the wholesale, and in many situations its a better investment (buying vs. renting). Small wind manufacturers have had a hard time competing with the dramatic drop in solar energy costs but new blade, electronics, control and installation technologies in "conventional" horizontal-axis turbines have lowered paybacks by up to 60%. If you have the space and a moderate wind resource small wind is worth considering to reduce your utility bills. But do your research and don't fall for hype. Oh, by the way, there's no reason to believe that offshore turbines will be more "bird friendly" than onshore turbines. We're not talking shore birds here.

[@nigels.6051]

@@mbergey1 Solar is a bit different since the panels used on home roofs are almost identical to those used in wind farms, the panels don't improve performance or cost with size. Installation is more efficient, and they can be installed in sunnier locations, so yes shares in a solar farm should work out better than buying your own installation, but not by a huge amount like with wind. Yes, the larger offshore turbines are bird friendly, apart from for a few land birds during their migrations. The blades are higher than the sea birds fly, so there is no chance of collisions. Many, if not most ocean traveling birds skim the water to take advantage of ground effect aerodynamics, but even seagulls only fly up as far as half the height of the bottom of a GE Haliade X blade.

[@peter.g6]

Thank you for keeping it real, as you guys say :) It's pretty sad to see science being overtaken by sensationalism all over various media. If I got 1 dollar for every revolutionary new battery technology article in the last 5 years, I'd be able to build my own giga factory :D

[@simonlinser8286]

Science reporting is always sensationalized to attract viewers and readers. It's so often complete bs and the writers know it. Real science news is found in peer reviewed journals and such. The average person finds it too boring so science communicators are sometimes prone to say things that aren't based in reality and once one person says it they just get quoted and we forget where the idea orginally got traction. Like... the space elevator. Remember the space elevator? Or just graphene in general.

[@leosbagoftricks3732]

A voice of reason in the darkness- thank you for making this video!

[@thomassutrina7469]

Have one of Paul Gipe books from the 80's. Have an Aeronautical BS degree and for fun as much as anything have calculated design, many over the years. Starting always you do not control the wind direction or speed related to time. Energy in the wind is a cubic relationship. You do not control grid power demand so what you are allowed to supply is not in your hands, and even home systems there are limits on capacity and rate. Can not ignore them because you can not control them they do not go away. (PS earned higher then average salaries as an inventor across multiple technologies. So I like unusual designs and like analysis from principles.) Did lots of vertical axis air foil approaches and some balloon approaches. Never did a ducted because as Paul said material is cost and pointing into the wind with a duct that is massive isn't easy. Also did the bladeless vibrating cylinder. So my conclusion is that the egg beater vertical is the simplest, lowest weight per output, and highest speed range. The problem is control or rather the lack. Have never seen anyone come up with a design that maintains simplicity and has good control. The best candidates are a snip of the egg beater from the bottom 'V', middle '||', and both together. On the balloon side, still need efficient airfoils and the balloon has to have the lowest volume to weight ratio. Tethered balloon problems are all weight and handling. High speed generator to keep weight down and high voltage two wire tether that are like the lightest high power lines a strong center and a conductive coating. High frequency to put the current in on the skin results in a lot of inductance which forces the wires together which leads to insulation problems. and then there is handling of this tether cable and the balloon itself. Take it down in high wind and reduce its size to put in a container. Microwave transmission would eliminate the two wire problems but add weight and inefficiency as a high cost of power electronics in the air and on the ground.

[@jimbobarooney2861]

Great video Rosie, I remember gleaning over that Taxonomy page as a Mechanical Engineering student in the 90s, and after trying to invent some future windturbine concept from the various known effects, Magnus, Venturi, Coanda, etc, conventional is so boring lol

[@AlexanderOlivaAEOC]

that gentleman is the one i would trust to direct an government energy agency, good info, no bs, new subscriber

[@briangriffiths114]

An example of this in the UK was building mounted turbines which spectacularly underperformed as per this extract on page 13 of an Energy Saving Trust wind field trials report entitled Location Location Location; "No urban or suburban building mounted sites generated more than 200kWh or £26 per annum, corresponding to load factors of 3 per cent or less. In some cases, installations were found to be net consumers of electricity due to the inverter taking its power (up to 10W)from the mains supply when a turbine was not generating." I wonder how many people who bought these products were put off renewable energy technologies in general?

[@paulgipe6684]

Thanks Brian for mentioning the GB studies. I emphasize them in my sections on rooftop wind turbines. As you noted, some used more juice than they produced.

[@Sondan1988]

Dr. Rosie's channel is the best.. You don't waste time with a ton of emotional claims and are very analytical. This wasn't negative at all, it was factual....I always look forward to what you are going to put out next. Liked and subscribed from America

[@devluz]

I think you can go with a clickbaity title on this video! xD "Can these experimental designs revolutionize the wind turbine industy?"

[@ArgumentativeAtheist]

You said that as a joke, but that's exactly the sort of small change that could make a big difference to watch time. And for this video I definitely think it's appropriate

[@dicknorton2]

😂🤪😬

[@michaelenglund]

Never. Hate click bait. I block all those and those who makes stupid thumbnails.

[@thatbritishguypatrick]

If tech journalists used Paul's 11 tips, or variation of , before hyping up boondoggle tech start ups it would improve reporting and public engagement with real green energy projects.

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

That is also part of my thinking in deciding to make this video. If you know any boondoggle tech journalists, perhaps you could send them the link!

[@ikocheratcr]

I think it should apply with "science reporters". There way too many news, even on TV about the new wonder game changing thing of today, and reality it is an scam, a lie, hot air; and these "journalists" are only interesting in the attention they get, not providing real stuff.

[@tevvya]

Rosie. One of the best ways I can think of to detect novel and useful advances in wind turbines is to ask two questions: (1) What are the major challenges to increasing wind turbine efficiency today? (2) Does this new wind turbine actually address one of those challenges? In this area, I think of advances in materials science and working out better fluid dynamic modelling. Neither one would probably make a good web site topic. Although I have heard about improvements in recyclability in all aspects of wind turbines--especially the blades. The next turbine technology area I would like to see you cover is that dealing with water--both in oceanic (tidal or currents) and river settings. Water has such a wonderful density that allows an electrical generator to be useful at even small scales. I will watch for that topic on your channel!

[@wjhann4836]

I was told about other scam: A friend of mine who is a meteorologist at a well known university had to "just sign off" a wind prediction for a new wind project. But - she sorrow looked over and got some problems with the numbers. Then she made a deep dive into the models. In the data she could reach she never got at least half the numbers. Then she interviewed the researcher. Finally he unveiled, he removed "the wood" (i.e. the covering) from his model - otherwise the model wouldn't converge. Well with her official numbers that windpark hardly would pay off.

[@brucewillingale7245]

Thanks Rosie One thing that is often missed is how to connect it up and the cost of doing so. Once you get beyond the small off the shelf toys. You can't locate it on your roof or in the yard. It's simply too dangerous, where do all the bits go when it self destructs. Not only does it hurt, it costs a lot. What is often dismissed is the cost of a hook-up. Electricity is a highly regulated commodity and there is a premium on this knowledge. The further away the generator from its load the more the costs escalate and the dimmer it's prospect become for all but the most diehard. e.g. If you consider a flow battery or fuel cell, it is far cheaper to pump the electrolyte around than install copper wire. Clearly this an area that requires further input. Someone who has built and operated Vertical Axis Turbines

[@andybaldman]

Funny how this video was recommended to me after watching another ‘innovative’ wind turbine video from a guy looking for investors. (Harmony Turbines)

[@gilbertfranklin1537]

I have also studied many new proposals for small, home-sized wind turbines and agree with Paul that they all seem doomed to failure. I do think that many garage builders who are using partly or mostly accepted designs really do believe they have found the answer. But no matter how well versed they are in design concepts, they don't have all the understanding of what would be financially viable to be marketed as a cost saving method to pay for itself. First, even the cleverest design still requires wind - preferably steady and significant amounts. And continuous maintenance, and rugged durability, and an almost perfect generator of electricity. Of course most also look like they could not last through a strong storm. However, I would love to see Mr Gipe take a look at the Harmony Turbines startup, which is now being tested at three universities. Yes, it has two patents and some backers as they near getting the official test results. They are starting small, with fabrication in a shop built by the inventor, but he is convinced that his device will be an important future for wind energy and has a dream of it being sold worldwide. Almost everyone agrees that it looks different than anything seen so far - but it is supposedly a new version of an older design.

[@LumpyMoose]

I do like the idea of mini vertical wind turbines. Even if they are much less efficient, as given their size you (might) be able to place 4 on each corner of a building that would be unobtrusive as against a single more obtrusive or difficult to locate traditional turbine. How many small vertical turbines would be needed to match an equivalent small traditional turbine? Thinking about residential micro generation rather than commercial…

[@ArgumentativeAtheist]

Paul was great, I loved his checklist and similar methods can be used to assess just about any claim that you could choose to look at. I'm pretty sure Carl Sagan would approve. He could benefit from a teleprompter though :P I've never considered bird deaths in comparison to things like other large infrastructure or traffic before. Definitely a point of consideration. Another great episode, thanks Rosie :)

[@paulgipe6684]

Yeah, it was my first use of a teleprompter! You can find the article on my web site and the list in my book. ;)

[@ArgumentativeAtheist]

@@paulgipe6684 I'll take a look.

[@travcollier]

Yeah... Buildings kill birds and bats. Heck, there are routinely mass kills when a bunch roosting birds get spooked and fly into branches of trees. Birds (and bats) don't handle any sort of blunt force trauma well. The main way to reduce bird kills is to pick a good site that large numbers of birds don't regularly fly through. One of the first large scale windfarms was put right in a migratory flyway... Which is where a lot of the idea that wind turbines are particularly bad for birds comes from.

[@richmoore3925]

I have lived off grid for 6 years in Northern Arizona. There are times we get quite a bit of wind, with that said in the early 2000s the price of solar PV has come down so low that you can produce such a high percentage of your energy needs that it makes it almost impossible to justify a wind generator for the small amount of times that you need to augment your solar system. The building departments require a fueled generator to get a permit on off-grid dwellings and the small amount of fuel you need to burn when your solar is not adequate makes it difficult to justify spending large amounts of money on wind.

[@percy481]

Really nice information.The way he is killing all the myths is just next level.He woke up and chose the violation.

[@billy6220]

That guy Paul was accidentally one of the funniest guys I've heard on KZbin in a while. He probably doesn't realize how hilarious he is when he's busting down all these hot air, b.s. scammers.

[@chrisyoung6108]

I know that Paul Guy. 🤣🤣🤣

[@trueriver1950]

In fairness, the designs that only appear on the internet are extremely bird friendly ... at least till the first prototype is spun up ;) What matters is some ratio like bird stikes per GWh delivered. That number goes to infinity if no real energy has been delivered. That ratio is also useful for comparing small turbines with the gridscale ones. I would love to see those numbers, as intuitively I would find it plausible that a small rooftop turbine is more bird-friendly than a windfarm; unfortunately I would also find the reverse effect believable. Until I see the numbers I don't know which intuition to go with...

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

That is a very good point, and a real tick in the pros column of making a website instead of hardware. No birds killed in the making of a website... I like your bird deaths per GWh metric. I would love to see it, but few manufacturers are doing bird studies, and when they are done it is very dependent on the installation site. Some bird species are more prone to hitting wind turbines than others.

[@paulgipe6684]

Yes, birds/TWh or GWh is the best metric and it is what I use. ;)

[@DreadX10]

@@paulgipe6684 You need the percentage of (passing) birds killed per Joule to have the 'best' metric. So a 'population-loss per Joule' metric. Otherwise, you can't compare two wind-turbine set-ups in two different locations.

[@BillHartCooks.]

Thanks for this one. I still think that every home owner should consider some sort of renewable energy and storage as a backup. If the laws in your area allow grid tie without it costing more... Go for it. I don't think the future is millions of stand alone off grid generation stations, but instead a large amount of aesthetically pleasing solutions that every location does that can feed back into the grid. If every house hold and business captured the solar and wind that occurs naturally around their structures and were able to offset their demand on the grid..... Well that would mean that we would have to depend on giant generating stations less. Not eliminate them but depend on them less. I experiment with some solar, some very small wind and some very small micro hydro. I am still grid tied, and I will be as long as there is a grid. I offset about 10% of my power needs, but I keep at it.

[@TurbineGuy]

I am a big fan of hybrid systems. Wind solar and battery bank. I show people how to diy on my channel. I work with big names like xcel , not some random guy I India charging a cellphone

[@dj_laundry_list]

Yes! My favorite engineering show!

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

Engineering with Rosie is your favourite?! 😍😍 Thanks 😊

[@mrrberger]

Tip for you guys is to blink. When reading teleprompts the eye blink rate drops and becomes unnatural for viewers. Increase blink rate, use larger text, sit further from the camera, reduce L/R eye movement, delivery seems more natural for the viewer. An engineer once said to me, "Wind energy is capital intensive so the less you want a windy area the more cost effective wind turbines become." I'm still trying to work that one out.

[@eskileriksson4457]

Thank you Rosie! Insightful, as usual. You're one bird I'm glad has survived all those new turbines. Sorry, letting myself out..

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

😂 yeah that was a good one, I'll let you stay.

[@Torulv]

just started looking at domestic wind turbines. you saved me a lot of time

[@doktaahwho8858]

I'm still curious to see what the Rosie Barns home built turbine will look like. And not of the gingerbread variety, more of the engineering variety.

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

I am super keen for that project too! But living in an appartment currently, it doesn't make sense to start such a project right now.

[@factnotfiction5915]

Given the material, I suspect the gingerbread variety turbine is the harder and more difficult project; even for one who lives in an apartment.

[@doktaahwho8858]

@@factnotfiction5915 I was hoping she was going to get a chance to try melted gummies as a adhesive this time around. But she's not doing the gingerbread thang.

[@jeffbybee5207]

@@EngineeringwithRosie is moving to an estate part of your dreams? If so I hope this works out for you. As will Roger's said buy land there not making any more of it

[@MrChris20912]

This is great! i have at least one of Gipe's books on my shelf.

[@CyPorter]

Thank you for making this video!

[@billblomgren9618]

The City of Altoona in Pennsylvania is surrounded by mountain top turbines. (The traditional ones)-- Only problem: After they were installed, the state noticed that rare bats were being blendered by turbines....so they are required to be disabled from Sunset to Sunrise. The time they are needed for solar supplementation.

[@haliondreams]

Great content and resource links. Thank you

[@colinbateman8233]

I love the honesty of your video look forward to enjoying more

[@BakkenNation]

Question for you - could you use existing wind turbine tech but without the generator to just assist the turning of the steam generators in old school coal power plants? So essentially creating a wind-assisted coal power plant? I'm thinking if this was plausible it would save the cost and resources of building more generators and reduce the C02 from the old plants. Band-aid fix I know

[@mikefallwell1301]

Interesting.

[@johnmedlin8112]

Rosie, have you done any videos on VAWT design modifications that address the design's inherent flaws? Such as the cup design used in wind meters. How much of an improvement in it's efficiency could be achieved by ruducing the wind resistance of the cups moving into the wind. If a cover were introduced that moved indendently from the blades so as to shield the upwind side equipped with a tail like that used in a wind vane so the covered side is always the upwind side. I don't know if my description makes sense, let me know.

[@DreadX10]

When covering one side you basically create a vortex and have the turbine spin in the centre of it. More efficient but also a lot more material needed and therefore less kWh per installed kg.

[@AcademyInstructor]

yeah you did sound pretty negative, considering that there must be a large market for small set ups (camper vans, increasing small home market, more and more people trying to be less reliant on big business etc) Maybe you could have painted a rosier picture by naming a couple of good products you found while researching the topic. That would have balanced out the article, by giving someone researching the topic, both good knowledge on what to look out for and examples of what to look for. Not sure why everything has to be so polarised today, everything has two equal sides. Keep smiling

[@Altenurgy]

The whole point is that there aren't any good products to mention.

[@always-ask-why]

Thank you for this! When I drive thru the California San Gorgonio Pass wind farm it seems like 80% of the wind turbines are not spinning. Maybe they are broken? If a traditional wind turbine has a much higher probability of being broken at any point in time, how does that factor into overall cost effectiveness? I read that vertical turbines while less efficient are also much more reliable and cheaper to maintain.

[@SKYGUY1]

So Rosie... I live in southern AZ, USA with some 300 sunny days a year... But here in the mountains we also have wind sometimes 24 hours a day. If you were to purchase a small backyard vertical axis wind generator for yourself, with your own money... WHICH ONE WOULD IT BE? Same question to Paul too. That's what I wanted to hear.

[@TomMcinerney-g9b]

There are 0 (none) commercial VAWTs that I'm aware of. Many successful propeller HAWTs....

[@tomr5121]

You can build a 10-12ft (1-1.5kw) axial flux horizontal axis turbine in your garage for a "reasonable" price if you're handy and have enough property in a breezy location. It's just very situational. I've helped install a couple myself, fun times!

[@dorrinw9560]

Thanks for the info. I am just an old layman wanting, if possible, to put in a system in our 'finally bought' retirement home, to keep costs down in the future when we really have a fixed income. I don't understand all the math and jibber-jabber (though I do know that they are valid and necessary) so you get an excellent thumbs-up from me in your gentle explanation. Two questions I have: (1) where can I go to just get an answer I can trust to just say "buy one of these 3 or 4 systems for your location, budget, and needs", and (2) can you give a presentation about combined V/HAWT that uses a deflector to scoop the wind to blades within a VAWT. I understand that deflecting would reduce efficiency but would results still end up in the positive?

[@EngineeringwithRosie]

There are a couple of links in the description to small wind certification bodies. Check out those lists and buy one that meets your size and cost requirements. Note that the specs on the indepentent certification sites can be EXTREMELY different to what the manufacturers claim, so be careful that you don't trust the websites in these cases. And the manufacturers who haven't been independently certified? Then you've got no way to tell how much power, noise etc you'll really get. For your second question, I haven't seen anyone do this successfully. It always ends up more complicated and more expensive than a normal design. Maybe one day in the future someone will make it work, but so far hundreds have tried and all have been worse than existing designs.

[@dorrinw9560]

@@EngineeringwithRosie Your prompt response was a surprise. Thank you for your time and gentle guidance.

[@shortbuslife3440]

Trying to build my own wind turbine after buying one last year (lantern type) which couldn't even reach operating voltage let alone wattage, so far it seems to work well both in horizontal and vertical positions but I haven't found a generator that I am happy with as most don't put out high enough voltage, and I need to refine how it's made (it's a bit DIY looking at moment).

[@jasonhaymanonthedrawingboard]

Ok so what if you combine dyson parts to create a turbine? Basically using the wind to create a negative pressure system for a self sustaining turbine. I’ve seen many designs just non on a smaller scale. My thinking was to combine the parts of the dyson cyclone vacuum, with the bladless technology . From the fans to Frankenstein a generator together. I’m not all sure what has been done in the past to combine jet engine technologies to current turbines design?

[@philipdurling1964]

On the domestic level, whether you use HAWT or VAWT, wind turbines are supposed to be used in partnership with a PV array. In the end it all comes down to personal choice. The industrial level where one has a farm of HAWT, they appear to work well enough. But the jury is still out on VAWT in the urban environment.

[@MicahMelnyk]

Excellent video and commentary on the hype and reality of new tech!! Thanks.

[@Jeemus.]

That was incredibly interesting and also pretty hilarious! We keep falling for the same old tricks again and again. I agree that a lot of this is people getting very excited at the idea of a revolution in wind, which is great, but as you say these products are often not fulling the need people have in their minds. It was interesting you pointed out that these old failures can get a second chance if the wider system and technologies change. I wonder if you have any thoughts of breakthroughs in other technologies/regulations/behaviours that might indirectly benefit the adoption of wind turbines? It's still yet to show it's worth but I like the Alpha311 concept, as it makes more sense thinking of it as using wind turbines to improve the efficiency of cars, rather cars to generate wind energy. People have been chasing incremental improvements in car efficiency for years and it will be interesting to see if it is more cost effective to reduce the energy loses though recapturing it rather than focusing on the car aerodynamics etc. Thanks for the great videos as always!

[@bgdexter]

The advances made in electric propulsion systems have a strong tendency to benefit wind turbines (power generators generally) as well. I.e. power electronics efficiency, improvements in electric motor designs (which become generators with mechanical power input), gear box efficiency & endurability. Another field strongly coupled to wind power efficiency is aeronautics & aerodynamics (blade design = wing design, see e.g. vortex reduction), and of course advances in compound materials. Graphene has been hyped a bit too much lately, but we will definitely see some outcome for both electromagnetic systems and material technology from this in the near future.

[@dirksmit6144]

Great video..buid my first wind turbine 9 years ago..stil learning.

[@bobcole3852]

Although we live at high altitude and have regular high winds, it's updates like this that keep me focused on solar.

[@MihailG5541]

There is an error in the table at 11:34 It must be 5 kW VisionAIR 5 turbine, not 1.5 kW

[@Jeonyoungjune]

Hi Rosie. I built a Vertical Axis Wind Tirbine blade with the structure of geodesic dome structure. It can be increased the size of vawt produce. It can be lift type or drag type or mix type.

[@karlmullowney998]

NICE ROSIE ! Great Video Rosie THANKS !

[@tomkelly8827]

I think that this video is excellent if you only are considering commercial large wind turbines. Certainly when wind speeds are high and consistent, the three blade version wins out. As a homesteader, do-it-yourselfer though, I can build a small wind turbine from the scrap metal pile here and make it look nice and produce some electricity without a massive tower here in the forested rolling hills where I live, while also looking really cool while it happens. There is a lot to be said for smaller, more tangible turbines that can help people to appreciate the possibilities in the wind more. So engineering and investment wise, large three blade turbines are best but smaller, varied wind and artisticly, I still love vertical axis ones. It is always good to be reminded that there is a true king of the wind though, in case anyone was confused about that. Certainly loads of hype to cut through to find the truth

[@_-martin-_]

I would love to hear your insights on Denmarks new Energy Islands project and their Power-to-X strategy. It is going to be a game changer for the energy industry. A pioneer project that opens up a new wind energy market around the world.

[@fjalics]

Large turbines have a huge advantage over small ones. They can be put 100m up, where wind speeds are higher. The power in wind goes up by the cube of the velocity, and the swept area. Long blades are your friend, unless your turbine doesn't last, or can't survive a storm. Most people should just put up solar pannels. But there are places that really are windy close to the ground. I read an article that said if all the leaves and branches are on one side of trees and bushes, you might be in one of those places. Now if you are off grid, in the winter, you might want every kwh, so it might be worth it.

[@fjalics]

Also, the biggest thing in wind power right now is the Haliade X, but the SG 14-222, Vestas V236-15MW, and the MySE 16.0-242 are coming.

[@archiearmour5949]

What would you say are best turbines in 15-50kw range for an area with 7.3 meters per second wind speed ?

[@curteckert2698]

What about the new Harmony Turbines. What is interesting is that they have been very guarded in making any claims. I am hoping that when they complete their prototype testing and build actual wind turbine that the data will be available. Their concept is good - I hope them well.

[@melellington1333]

I read that amazing book "Wind Machines" in the early 1980s and have been unimpressed for 40 years whenever I encounter some so-called "new" windmill technology.

[@wammo12345]

In physics at school I sometimes sat next to a guy who kept trying to invent perpetual motion machines, and every time he was as emphatically animated as the time before. He really did believe. I bet he's a salesman now...

[@petersilva037]

Can you do an video about Solar updraft towers? I doubt they are "the future of windo energy" but I´ve loved them since driving by the one in Manzanares 30ish years ago. I understand they are less efficient than pv farms, but I´ve always wondered if treating the bottom part as greenhouses would change the economics of it. having the turbines near the ground is a good thing.

[@Jan-Eric-1970]

Thanks for sharing: Very good video!

[@royharkins7066]

Brilliant vid Rosie thanks 😊

[@ryanjamesloyd6733]

Robert Murray Smith made a low wind speed turbine that functions comparably to a commercial 1kw turbine in typical conditions (built, tested) using a low torque high speed design, built out of a washing machine drum. it's over on his channel. So, whereas I'm sure Mr. Gipe is generally correct in his cautions, it's not impossible.

[@DreadX10]

Robert also had an interesting back and forth with his viewers in designing building his wind-turbines. I liked that a lot. But to be honest, the wind-turbine wasn't put to the test for years and years and doesn't provide long-term data (as in when do we need to replace bearings and such?)

[@ryanjamesloyd6733]

@@DreadX10 id figure youd get at least a few years out of it. If you greased it every once in a while, no reason to think you couldnt get a couple decades out of washing machine bearings, considering the weight theyre designed to deal with.

[@DreadX10]

@@ryanjamesloyd6733 True, and are build for 1600 rpm for the centrifugal cycle so that's okay too. And you would pick the smoothest of old bearings you have on hand so the one with the most life still in it. But what I meant was also with foul weather and storms over-time. So more an exercise in looking at the design(s) and trying to predict what will break first and why. An engineer standing next to a wreck of his device can tell you exactly how much the design can take, whereas an engineer next to a working single prototype can only predict how much it can take. ;-)

[@dasautogt]

Not negative, realistic. Thanks.👍

[@davidkatuin4527]

Well, the difference between cost effective and efficiency. Actual results of a particular design. Maybe talking about hype vs (as an engineer) build and test wind turbine designs and showing the results. Or not and just talk about stuff. Thanks for the vid.

[@ry__6988]

I had heard that as a rule of thumb that the tower contributes about half the cost to practical wind turbines. What do you see evolving there? I have to admit, I had a wild flight of fantasy seeing the dirigible (floaty) ducted turbine: Could this be the next big thing (in engineering challenges)? No not really.

[@rosswalker390]

The tower does not cost 50% of the total cost of a conventional turbine. Probably about 15-20% depending on hub height. Biggest cost items are blades, gearbox and electrical system.

[@Einhorn-ut1mm]

Best information ever! Thx

[@justincase5272]

Design Criteria: 1) Scalable to provide energy in the range of that used by most homeowners such that the mean power produced over time, including losses in battery storage, exceeds mean requirement. 2) Affordable on a total life cycle cost per kW-hr basis. 3) Low initial cost.

[@hollywoodmcadams5604]

I didn’t see any comment about the use of diesel generators used to heat the windmills-in cold climates. They freeze up. So, what the point in those climates ? I’m all about clean energy,but we’re not there yet. Also, now there are great concerns with the heavy EV autos & truck crash testing. You don’t stand a chance in a conventional vehicle in a crash situation.

[@terrinewman7390]

Rosie, what would be the best design for charging cell phones and lights and the like ? I want to keep it as simple as possible and be effective as possible!

[@paulgaiser4360]

Excellent video!!!

[@easternwoods4378]

In the end all wind turbines run up against Betz Law. Efficiency is basically How close can you come to that limit. How can I calculate how much I can expect to produce with a vertical axis. Do I use 3, 5, 6, 7 or more blades? Do I use many thin blades or fewer large blades? Do I overspeed ? Vertical axis, at least small scale require much less as a foundation.

[@JosephMullin]

It isn't the blades and the wind capture that needs to be looked at, it is the generator that needs to be redesigned or improved to generate more energy at lower speeds.

[@TomMcinerney-g9b]

generators can use speed or torque: a transmission (or belt drive over pulleys) can exchange torque and speed