Environment Design as Spatial Cinematography: Theory and Practice

[@BobbyJ529]

hilarious how this 1 talk is more informative than a couple of environment design workshops I paid 600 dollars(6week) for. and its free! Great examples!

[@Lishtenbird]

List of mentioned literature: Andreas Feininger. _Principles of Composition in Photography_ Donald D. Hoffman. _Visual Intelligence: How We Create What We See_ Bruce Block. _The Visual Story_ Molly Bang. _Picture This: How Pictures Work_ Don Norman. _Design of Everyday Things_ Grant Hildebrand. _Origins of Architectural Pleasure_ Kevin Lynch. _The Image of the City_ Steen Filer Rasmuusen. _Experiencing Architecture_ Francis D.K. Ching. _Architecture: Form, Space & Order_

[@ZigUncut]

KZbin should allow cut on their android app. Thanks for uploading the list @Lishtenbird

[@TimInPaxAeterna]

Much appreciated! Thanks.

[@noiJadisCailleach]

Thanks. I wish there was a way to pin comments like these.

[@KuroiPK]

Lishtenbird thank you

[@shivlan]

Thanks!

[@WarjoyHeir]

This is literally the best talk ever presented on this topic. No wonder Rockstar is so successful.

[@RockyRacoon5]

Rockstar Games is one of the most secretive game developers out there, so cool to see this.

[@fehix1196]

The speaker is undeniably the expert of this topic.

[@rumfordc]

@@AlleyKatPr0 who is?

[@rumfordc]

@@AlleyKatPr0 sorry i meant "who is the expert on this topic?"

[@davidlubkowski7175]

@@rumfordc read what he said..

[@rumfordc]

@@davidlubkowski7175 what who said? the person who deleted their comments? read the @

[@dddmemaybe]

@@AlleyKatPr0 He found how the physical relationship of our planets and sun work to a certain extent. If I have that right, he's a specialist in spacial understanding but not environment design art nor cinematography, so he only barely fits to this topic.

[@fehix1196]

I love how dense this talk is in truly useful information. The speaker did an amazing job at presenting this too, very wonderful.

[@Will_Forge]

She sure did! I was actually hesitant to click on it due to the title sounding less useful to what I'm working on currently, which might have lead to me misplacing the video on KZbin. Super glad my son wouldn't go to sleep last night, and I was forced to rock him for an extra hour before bed. Great video!

[@paperclip9558]

Everything explained by the speaker are the reasons why R*'s game environments is so good and takes a very long time to create. It was meticulously designed. I always able to get used to the map in their games, because each area of the game map feels and looks different, something that I couldn't find in other urban open-world games. If you play the game long enough and familiar with the map, you can navigate easily without waypoint, because you use those visual cues in the environment as your guide.

[@lewisnorth1188]

I'm so glad rockstar finally did a GDC talk

[@ChrisD__]

Something about seeing GTA loaded up with greybox levels is extremely encouraging.

[@jackgaff7312]

Bro don’t give it away

[@AmabBeats]

@@jackgaff7312 bro u here from twitter?

[@Moon___man]

encouragement intensifies

[@productocamarena]

As an architect, I found this talk fascinating, informative, inspiring...and I love that it feels so multi disciplinar.

[@HeyCiro]

One of the best talks of GDC, extensive research and lots of data. Thank you very much.

[@JonahHawk]

This presentation is amazing. It provides a waste deep look at how architectural, cinematic and graphic design principles all come together to make an exciting world and good game play. What I found especially interesting is that this speakers expertise easily applies in both directions. This presentation would be equally valuable at GDC and any school of design, architecture or film.

[@drumandbassob0007]

Best talk on Environment Design I've seen hands down , I really learnt a lot

[@ugu8963]

Top-down "saliency" is rather called relevancy. Relevancy (top-down, endogenous, related to the subject motivation), seems to dominate on images because of timing also. Saliency (Bottom-up, automatic, exogeneous) dominates in the first moments of an image inspection, as to analyze the elements. So the simpler the image, the faster the top-down processes will take the lead in commanding visual focus. It also means that the faster the pacing of the game (more precisely the faster the images will follow one another), the more bottom-up processes will dominate.

[@tomkirbygreen]

Gosh. This one talk might have just sparked my private research theme for 2023. Thank you ever so much to the wonderful speaker and other folks involved in making this available. Such an upper :-)

[@dbroche]

Fantastic talk -- love how DEEP the science is -- from survivalist evolution to meaningful motion -- simply fantastic

[@crazydave6787]

This is one of the best presentations I've ever seen on any subject :0

[@harrysanders818]

Wow, the demystification part was very enlightening, didn't expect it. So, it's not as simple as throwing in a warm light against a cool background or using high value contrast alone. What a thorough, well structured talk, and great speaker. Invaluable.

[@SoultrailStudio]

As non-environment-designer on my way through "all" parts of Game Development, this one is something to actually STUDY. Thank you this amount of different aspects of environmental design. Gotta get several time through this talk to select infos and make use of techniques.

[@golongself]

Thank you, this talk is really great. So many talks leave you wondering if its real or just an opinion, but this talk has such good examples and references. Clearly the speaker is an expert.

[@WhiteNorthStar1]

an exceptional talk, thank you so much

[@DeepCDiva]

Really good talk! I love the use of literature from other media and how they're applied to a map or a level, as it really enriches how we approach game design(Even tho' i'm not particularly fond of how GTA V uses that knowledge in it's worldbuilding, the reasoning behind it is pretty solid and should/can be applied to a bunch of other projects.). Loved the explicit references too, great for future reads!

[@BlueRockBill]

This is the best talk on game design on-line. Period.

[@Cartoonimancer]

OH look, its my new design crush. Amazing talk, and so well presented.

[@joshualarson2808]

This is one of the best GDC talks, and I've watched, or listened to, a LOT on my daily commute. It's not perfect, but it's certainly blameless, except for the title maybe. This talk is less about the games industry's desire to be like film, but more just about fundamental design principles for spaces, with some descriptions of that described in a filmic way. I don't think I've ever seen so many spatial design principles presented as such a comprehensive overview, with book recommendations for further reading by legit authors, with most of the claims each backed by a legitimate study, with defensive statements protecting the scope of the claims, with credited images, with a breadcrumb trail on top, with video examples from everyday players for any naysayers about the video itself. Whoa! There was a link to a video of a compelling rebuttal explaining how the critic liked Baulder's Gate II not catering to the player that much. But it seems safer to learn how to be skilled at catering to the player, because removing those practices would give you an indifferent world without having to learn a whole new way to designing. However, the opposite does not seem true. Being skilled at building an indifferent world, and then removing those practices without learning a new way of designing would likely just lead to a different, likely worse, kind of indifference.

[@Ryan-the-Rocketeer]

you had me at Rockstar north, but this bit at the end was simple yet astounding 45:45

[@Armaan8014]

Yes

[@IronFreee]

Really great presentation, both interesting and useful.

[@infinitesimotel]

This was a great presentation, some interesting insights into the big A gameworld. There were a lot times when I would say that there was far too much overthinking going on to control the player to make sure they do what you intended. It is possible to execute an idea, refine it and just let the player play and it wil still be a riot.

[@cooldoberman2024]

23:27 39:48 47:17

[@pupiberto]

This talk is great, a ton of useful and practical information, we need more like this.

[@Lishtenbird]

Fascinating talk! A lot of intuitively evident concepts, but structured, summarized, and put into context of games. Quite helpful for building general awareness of how these things work.

[@NINEx7x]

Miriam is fantastic! I highly recommend you follow her on Twitter.

[@何子1号]

amazing design!

[@stormsoendergaard3023]

this is amazing

[@carstenklein4568]

Great lecture presenting a very good abstract framework for designing levels in a more holistic kind of way. Thank you very much for the insight! Would have liked the reading list to be displayed or rather included in the description, though.

[@vukbo7859]

Great Talk. Thank you.

[@MilezAwxy]

Now I see why Rockstar makes masterpiece games, it's because their team is made of very experienced artists & developers.

[@sebastianzander87]

23:35 FYI: the German word for sausage is "Wurst" or "Würstchen". "Wiener Würstchen" (or in short "Wiener") on the other hand is a special kind of boiled sausage that is said to have its origin in Vienna, or as it is called in German: "Wien" ;)

[@PacTheOne]

or Kraut ;D

[@RobLang]

This has helped me sort out so many issues for my up and coming environment design. I'm going to attack it with a lot more confidence thanks to this excellent talk.

[@TorQueMoD]

Absolutely fantastic video! I particularly liked the part where you talk about 2D composition and avoiding tangents. Incredibly helpful!

[@matajuegosoriginal]

quincy world!

[@switzerland]

That was awesome

[@homemacai]

This was amazing!

[@sb301office]

really love the presentationnns! im feeling sooo relatee as an architect!!! luv

[@wmka]

Thank you and have a great day.

[@charoleawood]

I think that Bungie's Halo games had very good PvP level designs and poor campaign level designs. Copy-and-pasted level chunks to pad out gameplay time and over-reliance on symmetry make those campaigns very repetitive. A little symmetry is great for multiplayer, however, and since the maps don't have to be stretched out then there is no copy and pasting, just sight lines and goal posts.

[@futureruins999]

I've been waiting for this talk for ages now, hell yes

[@MacSmithVideo]

Amazing talk i learned a lot!

[@AlexStrook]

Fantastic talk !

[@わをりり-b5j]

勉強になる

[@QwertyQwerty-so4kw]

Informative video. Thx

[@billguschwan4112]

2:37 first pass of an environment layout

[@billguschwan4112]

3:29 player controls camera : control environment

[@billguschwan4112]

4:23 compose 3d for 2d

[@suicidalbanananana]

Very informative!

[@dancingbubbles1126]

This is a great talk.

[@TedsWorld101]

Her current job GTA VI?!

[@joenashrty5338]

Yes

[@oufukubinta]

It blew me away that Disney considered spacetime relativity in their design lol

[@CptnHammer1]

I'm so interested how she would approach a top down game where the camera mostly shows the floor.

[@dddmemaybe]

10:53 kzbin.info/www/bejne/iYG9d4mVeqqapJY lol look at this right here from kotor 2.

[@0trustt]

PLEASE REDO THIS TALK FOR RED DEAD 2!!

[@westingtyler1]

This is a fantastic talk. I wish I could have asked a question, but I wasn't there. I'm making a game that needs to look amazing in 1st person 2d (like Silent Hills P.T.) but also in 3rd person (Zelda Breath of the Wild) or in VR. Without "ridly scotting" it and manually reshaping the environments upon camera changes, I have no idea how I'll make it work and look great in all three setups. Ever notice how normal 3rd person games use rooms that are WAY too big and staircases that are WAY too wide, just to accommodate the far camera? Sucks.

[@aldenlopez24]

I'm thinking one way it could work if in third person, the camera is closer and more over-the-shoulder style (like The Last of Us / Resident Evil 4)? The downside is that the character would take up most of the screen.

[@zac_walton]

I know it's a late reply but you could try reeling the camera in and out depending on context? As the other guy said, you could have an over-the shoulder camera or even reel the camera into the shoulder when indoors while keeping it further away for open areas. Alternatively, I prefer Skyrim's camera where the player can manually adjust the viewing distance

[@thisfeatureisstupidxo]

oh wow , she’s a kiwi !!!

[@daxiawang2558]

good

[@alexawinter36]

ЭЙ РАЗРАБОТЧИКИ ВЫ ТАМ СОВСЕМ ОФИГЕЛИ ) ГДЕ МОИ ТАНКИ ) И ВЕООНОЕ ДЛСИ И ЧВК ) ЧАСТНАЯ ВОЕННАЯ КОМПАНИЯ 3 ФРАКЦИЯ ДЛЯ ИГРОКОФ )

[@ty_teynium]

Don't care if I'm first or second. Also I have a question. Anyone can answer this ( preferably those in the industry)... Why not all other studios follow the same approach to theories or practices in spatial cinematography? I mean specifically if it worked for one studio and their project then surely it'd work for the other wouldn't it? Unless would it be too many risks involved?

[@davidblissett5315]

Only large 'AAA' studios can afford the time/money to implement this approach. Their spoiled :). Great concepts though!

[@charoleawood]

It's unnecessary. If you've learned to make pottery and perform at a point you and your customers are satisfied with, then turning it academic isn't needed. It's like learning language, you can either do it in a classroom environment for a grade (terrible method) or you can be around people who speak fluently in your own first language and in the language that you wish to learn, there is no need to start with conjugations and declensions and participles. If you are a confident level designer, you never-the-less have still to rework your designs via playtesting, it makes no difference whether or not you are consciously employing more academicized aesthetic reasons for what you did in designing your environments, you had still better playtest and wisely shift your design if the feedback calls for it.

[@Mikefiser]

Firstly, the title "spacial cinematography" is kind of missleading IMHO. What is explained is just rules of composition or maybe a mise-en-scene applyied to game design, but it is missing (maybe on purpose) parts that connect it to narrative. I also want to comment on Charlie Wood - I think a craftsman's work is defintiely enhanced by knowing the reasons behind his decisions and by learning to precisely name the elements, we learn to analyze the world around us and that helps us better understand it . TO your question, In a way, most of these techniques are definitely used by game designers, I think its not a mistery to anyone who has ever read a book on painting or architecture or any other art form I guess. The brilliance of this talk is those little nuances - thinking about how your greyboxed design is going to be implemented, psychological influence of the angle in which the player approaches the scene, myth busting etc.

[@charoleawood]

@@Mikefiser Knowing the reasons behind ones decisions, as taught by academia, never improves an artist's work especially when some of those "reasons" turn out to be false, as Miriam demonstrated with "leading lines" myth. Why she finds it useful regardless is probably because it was taken as gospel for hundreds of years and it's simply a comforting lie getting her through the labor of art production. It turns out, as well, that thinking with the right side of your brain doesn't make you a "better" artist, a myth that was around for decades. My argument can be boiled down to this, art is not science, attempts to interpret it scientifically are no less legerdemain than flipping a coin or making shit up. I think that Miriam is clearly very, very intelligent and her work is good, but the knowledge she presented was more interesting to me as information about her interests as a successful artist than anything else.

[@Mikefiser]

I am sorry but your argument reads something like "studying does not improve ones artistic skills", which is just bullshit. I guess you just haven't explained it properly and so it's kind of pointless to comment on it.

[@bobfluencer]

boss

[@Rice8003]

I gotta stop drawing and start reading

[@IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII4]

Gta 6

[@thingonathinginathing]

Gta 666

[@PacTheOne]

*paths.veg=false* k

[@CrossfacePanda]

This approach actually explains why most Rockstar games doesn’t do it for me. Not saying their approach is wrong, of course, but it’s diametrially opposed to what makes a game engaging for me. It does however make a lot of sense for a studio who’s main focus is being cinematic.

[@thFaust]

I agree. When I play a game I would prefer to experience a world that seems to make sense within its own rules, instead of being designed all focused on the player and gameplay. The amusement park pictures in this talk also show this problem, I don't want to feel like going along the rails of a carefully curated attraction in what should be a more interactive medium.

[@sumdude5172]

Please give examples of games that you do enjoy. Most of the content she presented is almost fundamental, meaning it should be applicable in almost any setting. Maybe the games you do enjoy follow the same rules, just more subtle or nobody spells that out. Or maybe they break the rule deliberately and successfully. Nevertheless id love to know

[@AaditDoshi]

I'm curious what games you find engaging. Because this is quite fundamental in single player games. Half life, uncharted, God of war, etc, all use these spatial organisation techniques to guide the player without explicitly needing ui markers.

[@thFaust]

@@sumdude5172 My examples of really good worldbuilding would be mostly older games such as Baldurs Gate II or the early Gothic games. I don't disagree with most of the principles mentioned in this talk (which are presented perfectly btw.), but with the underlying assumption that game worlds should be (entirely) optimized towards the player. A video that mirrors my opinion and elaborates that point is: kzbin.info/www/bejne/enTJeIdjpMajgpY . What are your thoughts on this?

[@thFaust]

@@AaditDoshi I am not against those signposting techniques, they surely are better than ui markers. But I think they should be in places where they would be in the virtual world, instead of specifically along the gameplay path. I personally found Morrowind more engaging than Oblivion or Skyrim for example, when it comes to that. And yeah, very cinematic games like Uncharted are probably fine they way they are, they maybe don't need an extensive world design outside of the gameplay (since it's about the linear story). But open worlds like gta I think should be designed to be a plausible world first and then slightly optimized towards gameplay and the players view. I feel that lots of modern games do this the other way around, which leads to me feeling like on rails in a kind of empty gameworld.

[@Khnshfkt.rockstargamesindia]

Who came here after reddit discovery

[@TerraUnityCo]

666th like :) Great video by the way

[@hanselthecaretaker]

My only complaint is it’s a full year after the release of their biggest, most ambitious and cinematic game to date and no mention of it.

[@RadeonVector]

oh nice I learned that today's Rockstar is a misperceived affordance

[@V3RM1LI0N]

58 minutes and nobody asked about GTA6 smh

[@larrykingschair2153]

It’s a game developers conference. Could you imagine if one of them blurted out “wHeReS gTa 6!?” I couldn’t imagine the embarrassment.

[@colin-campbell]

54 people are pretentious.

[@niks660097]

there is no such thing as fluid motion in GTA 5, walking/running/interacting is janky as fuck especially in online, where even 20ms ping is not enough...

[@BirshanRamzyCaraccio]

second

[@BirshanRamzyCaraccio]

I always come second ;)

[@doughdog7]

Last

[@bnxcvii44]

first

[@Psilocervine]

you must live a very fulfilling life

[@oliveiraluis3540]

Nothing realy new about this. Games, and defenitly AAA games, have been done in the past with screen comp in mind, I mean, half life, bioshock, GTA 4, that bridge next to the appartment in the begining, that looks like Once Upon a Time in America... I mean cmon... She looks like somme decorator babling this and that an the other... alright... so a curtain there, take a bit of the table there... really...! Cmon...

[@ddddzzzz5426]

are you mentally ill by chance?