Ep. 594: How Fear & Greed Corrupted American Evangelicalism with Tim Alberta

[@iansullivan9738]

I pointed out to a conservative friend that the GOP had a chance to repeal the ACA, restrict abortion, or any number of conservative gripes. Instead, they passed a huge handout to the rich. This was not appreciated.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Handouts to the rich are the only thing they agree with the Democrats about.

[@SongSwan]

The reason for that is most Republicans are liars as well,they play naive Christians with their God and country BS when they are nothing but leftist.

[@concernedkermit8190]

What did the democrats do to stop abortion?

[@paulacoyle5685]

I realized they didn’t care when the Planned Parenthood undercover videos came out and they just didn’t do anything about it when they had the majority.

[@JesusLovesBest]

Taking FIFTY years to battle for abortion legislation change??? When Reagan was President or GW Bush would have been better times. It would have been more timely to address these - now critical mass - issues,( I think) As a Christian who questioned Trumpism early on, I had no Christian, let alone a minister, defend my stance. OR EVEN ALLOW for any deviance from the Republican/Christian Worldview group-think that swallowed the Evangelical community whole!😢 Yeah, the loneliness still hurts, but I sleep good most nights, knowing I tried to warn them... not so good others knowing I've stopped. Forgiveness, humbleness, and putting self-interest to death have been Holy Spirit drumbeats❤

[@RosannaDAgnillo]

Phil & Skye, all your supporters probably feel like I do, a bulldog ready to defend you. Thanks again for all the work you do in providing a voice for Christians who are not Christian nationalists. I found Holy Post about a year ago and have learned so much, and am very grateful for our community. Kaitlyn & Skye, your new books are my Christmas gifts for many; thanks again!

[@susanb467]

This was a good interview with Tim Alberta. I understand the conflict pastors are faced with, and the desire to have souls listen to the gospel each week, but they also need to consider how what they do and who they support affects their ability to reach people OUTSIDE the church. The people who are in the church, filling the seats and hearing the gospel, are already part of the church. What about reaching people not yet saved? Evangelicals have done more to turn people off from Church in the past 20 years, than any of the enticements sin and the flesh can offer. There was a time, that even if someone didn't believe in God, they respected the church and pastors because they recognized they were trying to do good and were a force for good. Now they oppose social justice and choose to support a presidential candidate who has displayed all the abominations and none of the Fruit. When the hypocrisy is so great that even non believers know an action or behavior is not biblical, there is a problem, IMO. I intentionally visited Christian forums to see how Christians responded to the election of Obama, police brutality incidents starting with Michael Brown, and the election of Trump. The racism and vicious racial tropes and comments as to why black people should be feared was saddening. Speaking as if black people were not Americans, part of the Body of Christ or even human. If I were not already a member of the Church, having grown up in it, there would be little evidence that the Church was a force for good and no incentive to become a part of it. Also the attacks on the LGBTQ. I believe God still has the power to change lives. I believe that once a person is saved and indwelt with the Holy Spirit, it will guide them away from what is not good for them. That there will be no peace in continuing to live in a way displeasing to God. The Church is not welcoming them in to get their souls saved, but want to condemn them for their lifestyle choices when they don't have the power of the Holy Spirit to overcome any of it. There were years when we heard from Franklin Graham and others how being unfaithful in little meant Bill Clinton would be unfaithful in much and wasn't fit to lead the country when he couldn't lead his family, yet Trump comes along and suddenly his sin is between him and God. Praying for Obama using Psalm 109.8. How the Church had to fight against Obama and all democrats to resist evil, but Trump got elected and SUDDENLY all authority is appointed and ordained by God and it was our duty to support him. That lasted until Biden got elected and now its back to the devil being in the ballot box. You think non-Christians didn't notice the hypocrisy? Christians are supposed to have more discernment. Even when that is lacking we have the Fruits of the Spirit as a guide. Nothing about Trump's hateful rhetoric lined up with it. The Church needs to stay out of politics and fix itself. Sorry this is so long but I had to vent.

[@thestraightroad305]

Well said and RIGHT ON.

[@JayFreeburn]

Not too long just well said. I couldn’t agree more. I would add that I don’t think evangelicals realize (some do) how they are being manipulated and in some cases brainwashed by right wing media which plays on some of the fears and subjects that you mentioned.

[@karonaxtra]

Ha! Just saw Tim and his book for first time on Meet the Press rhis past Sunday and immediately thought to myself, 'he'd be a great guest on The Holy Post.' And here he is. 😄

[@Anabee3]

He was also on Michael Steele's ch. I liked it & got way more out of it & it's a lil over an hr. All in one chat, no VIP requirements.

[@MaryM-pp9xu]

I could have listened to this discussion for hours. Look forward to him being on again.

[@We_r_the_resistance]

Thank you SO much to Tim for standing on the word! For so long, I felt alone, waiting for my Christian community to speak truth into the darkness that now envelopes the church. I’m refreshed & affirmed in my beliefs (no we aren’t the crazy ones in this) and I am overjoyed to have found this community❤

[@DwayneShaw1]

here's a little truth in darkness that envelops the church regarding salvation- 1) - There is no scriptural provision to reconcile the doctrines of Original Sin and Free Will Salvation, as pertains to dead babies. According to Christianity we are born despicable filthy sinners deserving of eternal torture and must make a conscious free will decision to accept Jesus in order to avoid going to hell. (John 3:3 - "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."). The most Christians can do is cite vague Old Testament verses from before the New Covenant of free will salvation thru Jesus, or some absurd dogma that has no founding in scripture or church history - which includes the invention of Limbo to address the obvious doctrinal absurdity. There is nothing that says children get a free pass. And if there was a loophole for Original Sin then Jesus is no longer essential to salvation. 2) Jesus hasn't saved anyone (with the possible exception of the thief next to him on the cross - if you believe fairy tales full of crucifixional zombies). According to [1 Thessalonians 4:13-18] no one goes to heaven when they die. Everyone rots in the ground (sleeps in Christ) until the rapture. No one has been saved from death by Jesus - yet ... Again, the most Christians can do is cite another verse that suggests something different - which only demonstrates the Bible is a contradictory mess, and does nothing to show which contradictory passage is the correct one. And millions of preachers have been lying to people at funerals for centuries.

[@mitchmonteith6468]

Bully thy neighbor does not equal love thy neighbor

[@SongSwan]

Neither does stealing from thy neighbor

[@T-41]

The interview was just first rate, very enlightening. Greed and fear combined produces toxic results. In this case a cult has been formed that isn’t going away soon. The question is how much more damage will be done first. Churchill said Americans eventually get things right, but they have to try everything else first.

[@timothymulholland7905]

The most important single course I took, from kindergarten through the PhD, was the high school health course in a public school. You want to reduce abortions, teach the appropriate biology and health content. Putting poor women in jail will do nothing but punish the victims.

[@anabaird3835]

Im not sure what you mean, bc while many schools may have ADDED to the biology & health curriculum (for various reasons) theyve not taken away the basics: The same medically academia you& I, our parents & grands were taught & ARE taught. We knew what does/ doesnt cause pg & so do students today. Yet, the abtn % continues to rise & fall, regardless. #2) You said the ppl who receive (or assist in) abortion shouldnt be jailed (punished) as they are alrdy victimized. The only one victim is the aborted baby & the baby wouldn't be punished/jail bc baby is alrdy aborted by then. Infact, if baby hadnt bn aborted, NO ONE would be jailed/punished, in the first place. The "mom" wouldn't be jailed for becoming pg, she'd be jailed for committing m#rder (aka: abtn). And it IS murder. That's why when drunk drivers k#ll mom's who are pg, the d.d.. is convicted for TWO murders. The consequences of jail works as an added deterrent in terms of deciding to get an abortion. So, again, I dont understand. What am I missing? (Please know Im sincerely curious. Im NOT here to argue, nor aggravate).🤗.

[@rebeccaholcombe9043]

​@@anabaird3835We have a problem with future discourse because in the picture of unwanted reproduction you view the fetus as the only victim. Poor women whose birth control fails, women who've been raped, women preparing to leave dv situations, others who discover their wanted babies have lethal defects, these women are all victims of life society bad fortune whatever you want to call it. But when we deal with laws around reproductive health, these are all situations that occur.

[@kicsms_science3729]

⁠@@anabaird3835 There are still lots of misconceptions about getting pregnant and preventing pregnancy, and some Christians want it only addressed as “Just don’t have sex until you’re married.”

[@kicsms_science3729]

⁠@@anabaird3835 I know many christian parents want that for their children, so it’s tricky to keep a balance between trying to encourage following God’s way vs knowing lots of kids *aren’t* going to do so. Locations with abstinence-only sex ed don’t have very successful stats.

[@SongSwan]

​@@kicsms_science3729The bible says that actually why re you against what the Bible says.

[@kamalastromwall9275]

Skye has often talked about the dilemma of the Pastor only having 45 min with the congregation who are being discipeld by media. I would like to say "Yes And. There are those of us who had Pastors who were being discipeld by media orthodoxy."

[@Dex2R7]

The clarity that you and Tim are providing during these tumultuous times is a breath of fresh air. I hope that others find the message you guys are providing through the same path that I did. That is, how are today's Republicans reconciling lies, hate, fear mongering with Christianity? It's such a counter-intuitive thing to witness.

[@justinprice9017]

Skye and Tim: Congratulations, gentlemen. A most insightful and probing discussion. Many thanks.

[@gracenotes5379]

The central concern for the survival of a recognizably Christian Church is epistemology. The desire to adhere to the truth must first be reawakened, then the tools to discern it taught. "Surely you desire truth in the inner parts ; you teach me wisdom in the inmost place." (Ps 51:5). "For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions" (2 Tim 4:3).

[@brucee8332]

I watched the ordination of new priests and deacons in the Episcopal Church this afternoon, and listened as Bishop Andrus really challenged them, as shepherds, to disciple, and shepherd their flocks, and protect, and challenge us as NOT JUST SHEEP, but as CHRISTIANS, to take up our Cross and follow. He then said, in order to do that, they had to do so first. Taking ministry, service, discipleship totally seriously, as the most important thing in life, is key for pastors, shepherds, priests, deacons.

[@DwayneShaw1]

here's some truth to adhere to - Religion poisons everything. the Bible condones forced abortion "Ordeal Of the Bitter Water' (Numbers 5:11-31) The pious antiabortionists want no exceptions for rape and incest. Why should they? they're positively Biblical. But an exception for punishing adultery? absolutely. It is 'as God intended' The Bible and it's horrid god demands genocidal infanticide, one of MANY examples; (Numbers 31:16-18) "Why didn't you murder the women and children? Who told you to be merciful? Not get back over there and slaughter all the women, children, and babies - except, of course, the virgins. Keep them for yourselves as the spoils of genocidal war" (the little girls, presumably under the average marrying age [at the time] of 14 - get no say) And kidnapping and raping little girls. The Bible is very clear about the proper way to deal with abducted virgins. (Deuteronomy 21:10-14) - "When you're out committing (God commanded) genocidal slaughter and you see a girl that arouses you - after murdering her family in front of her - kidnap her, strip her naked, shave her head, and lock her in a room for a month - until her spirit is completely broken - then, it's okay to rape her" (the girl gets no say) Which is in perfect keeping with Biblical rape laws being about punishment for 'property damage' - (Deuteronomy 22:28-29) - "If a man rapes a girl his punishment shall be to pay the girl's father 50 coins - and marry her so he can rape her for the rest of her life" (the girl gets no say) How long do you think slavery would have lasted if the Bible had condemned it, instead of condoning it more than a dozen times (OT and NT)? How long would gays have to fight for being treated like equal human beings if the Bible , and its god, hadn't said "they are an abomination that shall be put to death" It is long past time that we expunge this immoral Doomsday Cult from our society. That we quit paying deference to a book, and its god, that condones genocide, slavery, kidnapping and raping, murder, forced abortion, misogyny, etc.. That we recognize the troubles these beliefs bring on society. That we quit buying into the Church mandated edict that we must respect these beliefs in immoral fairy tales because they claim to believe it 'extra special hard' Btw, Did you know that approx. 8 million children die every year before their 5th birthday? - millions in their first year - millions in infancy... The thing is, according to Christian Doctrine, we are all born guilty of Original Sin and must ask Jesus to save us from the pits of hell we deserve. But the Omniscient God made no provision for those born disgusting, dirty, filthy, sinners; deserving of eternal torture, who die before they are old enough to make a conscious Free Will 'choice' to accept a salvational bloodbath (John 3:3 - "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."). This horrid oversight has been long acknowledged by the Church, it's why they invented Limbo. - Anyone that doubts me can look it up All dead babies and young children go to hell according to scriptural doctrine. But of course no one (with one exception) has ever been saved by Jesus. In fact it is only claimed (if you believe fairy tales with zombies) that he saved one person - the thief next to him on the cross. According to the Bible (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18) no one goes to heaven when they die, you rot in the ground until the Rapture. No one has been saved from death by the godjesus, YET, and millions of preachers have been lying to people at funerals for centuries. (The most Christians can do is cite another verse that suggests something different - which only demonstrates the Bible is a contradictory mess, and does nothing to show which contradictory passage is the correct one). I am not alone in my opinions ; "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise" ... “What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people.” - James Madison “History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.” - Thomas Jefferson “We discover in the gospels a groundwork of vulgar ignorance, of things impossible, of superstition, fanaticism and fabrication .” - Thomas Jefferson "Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.” - Thomas Jefferson “It is too late in the day for men of sincerity to pretend they believe in the Platonic mysticisms that three are one, and one is three; and yet the one is not three, and the three are not one.” - Thomas Jefferson “Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half of the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we call it the word of a demon than the word of God. It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind. - Thomas Paine “All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.” - Thomas Paine “Lighthouses are more helpful than churches.” - Benjamin Franklin

[@maryherbert9082]

Thank you for these great discussions.

[@helgmelia84]

Skye, I genuinely appreciate your work on The Holy Post, but I have a problem with your logic on one point. In discussing your view of Roe, you seem to assume that a reduction in abortion rates would mean that “more kids are being born into healthy situations with the support they need.” Is that really the case, though? An increase in birth rate alone simply means more babies are being born, not necessarily that they and their parent(s) have the support they need. I know you have a heart for the poor. I just want to make sure that we keep one thing at the forefront of the discussion about abortion: if we demand that more children be brought into the world we must also be ready and willing to support those children. The problem I see with a lot of pro-life groups is that they celebrate the abstract concept of more babies carried to term, but are unwilling to vote on legislation that would support vulnerable and low-income people in raising those same children.

[@mnorma12]

Based on the data we have, we can be very certain that having more unwanted pregnancies carried to term results in worse outcomes for the communities and states that restrict or ban abortion. Study after study has yielded the same result. For further information on just how much of an effect banning abortion has, check out Rockefeller commission 1972, Donohue and Levitt 2001, or Tarman 2000.

[@ZipplyZane]

It's not that a reduction of abortion would cause more kids to be born into a supportive situation. It's that if children are only conceived in situations where a supportive situation is possible, then there would be no need for abortions. Going at reducing abortion by banning it is just the wrong strategy. To stop abortion, you need to decrease the demand. You can't effectively decrease supply: you just make the supply much less safe while negatively affecting others.

[@kicsms_science3729]

I stopped voting for candidates based solely on abortion for this reason! States that wanted to prohibit it were not simultaneously putting policies in place to fund better access to healthcare (pre- and post-natal), parental leave, child care, etc. If a politician won’t spend on something, then they don’t really think it’s important.

[@PattyEverAfter]

Katelyn answered your concerns at 13:40. I think what's good about having her on the podcast is that she often voices those kinds of concerns to Skyes more black and white views on a lot of issues. Maybe why I particularly pay attention to her opinions.

[@pressia07]

👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽

[@j2jenison]

Petr Chelčický wrote: "Weak is the preaching of Christ's priest who, unable to bring some people into Christ's justice through Scripture, calls upon power [prince] and announces their adultery, drunkenness, and other sins in the church, forces power to punish them, and believes that in so doing he is successful in his preaching.”

[@scottlanesimpson]

Amen wonderful to hear young Christian Men be strong and think clear thoughts of God.

[@onegirlarmy4401]

I learned from Phil- "Qwerty- do you have a verse for us?"

[@nmworkman]

such a great interview with tim alberta - and way to rep. the tigers!!

[@leonl777]

Although I've listened to/watched a few Phil Vischer videos in the past, (which have been very good, particularly on race in the US), this is the first time I've watched a full HP podcast. Listened would be more accurate, as I've had it on the background as I've been working. It is great, and frankly very much a relief to hear conversations like this. I don't live in the US, but have plenty of friends and family who do. We used to watch the rise of Christian nationalism with total bemusement a few years ago, assuming it was unlikely to cross over here, but there's an old adage that whenever America sneezes, Europe catches cold. The Christian community here in the UK is less politicised than the US, but it still has a tendency to veer towards populist candidates, and that can be very costly. I often trot out the scripture "I determined to know nothing among you, save Christ, and him crucified." Some may think that simplistic, but keeping it simple and sticking to the gospel rather than attaching your colours to any 'ism' works. I'm not saying that we as Christians don't foray into matter of our time, but if you align too closely with any political party, their shortcomings eventually become perceived as your shortcomings.

[@Anabee3]

Check out Tim Alberta on Michael Steele's ch.

[@lisafoster3868]

Thanks for stating that Christian should vote strategically and not only on one issue

[@bethprather9241]

😂❤I know God has humor for us at times or forgives mine..Because for years anytime I read the verse 1 Corinthians 34-35.. As a mother of 3 sons whose x spouse didn't come to church with me. I would always immediately think and look around," Really ask who? About the message? Who do i ask if I have questions Paul?".. Lol My husband now is a Christian and I can ask him sometimes.. But I pray and ask God too.. Plus I've learned that the Corinthians had many issues that are a lot worse than was ever taught to me in the past.. ❤😂 At 56 ai sometimes jokingly say," Can I pick and chose when my husband tells me all to.do. because I'm tired a d pretend stupid?.. I'm sorry... Just in NIV and NLT I do love Apostle Paul.. It is like he is always in a rush and hyper .. Tells facts and oh my Galations is awesome clarity

[@NeilDonald-y5h]

I agree that reading more in bigger chunks is effective. However, if we are to read scripture as a story, it must be organized chronologically. For instance, Paul's epistles are arranged from longest to shortest with no chronological or geographical context. Furthermore, the letters were written to specific churches about their unique issues, but we often cherry pick and tie verse from one epistle to those from other epistles without regard for the unique church context.

[@bethprather9241]

I really get concerned and upset because of this huge problem and it is so sad.. BUT I never thought true believers could be put under this cult spell.? .. I know we are still sinners.. But if they dont wake up or havent, Im really concerned

[@chopinksbaul]

Being deceived is a mark of the unregenerate. Jesus said there would be goats among the sheep. He didn’t say the sheep wouldn’t be able to recognize the goats among them. Instead, He said we should be careful so that no one decieves us. Use these things as a litmus test so that you can discern who’s who in your midst and let it spur you to warn them who seem to be going down that broad way or to reconsider whether such folks are worthy of your support, which should be given primarily to those who are of Jesus’ flock.

[@andrewwhittaker2908]

People have always called it a cop-out but, I've always felt that morality cannot be legislated. If we are moral we should legislate having boundaries but to surrender all and trust in legislation alone isn't a winning strategy. We can't solve a problem by simply making it illegal. It's to complicated of an issue much like Imagration.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

“Cop out” is an ironic choice of words when it comes to using the police power of the state.

[@dianefischer6852]

Kaitlyn: “I do a daily search: Whose mad at Phil?” 😂

[@elizabethbillingsley5534]

I asked GPT about women in leadership and preaching. It said the following: The interpretation of whether women can preach varies among Christian denominations. Some believe in gender equality in ministry, while others adhere to more traditional views restricting certain roles for women. It's a topic of ongoing discussion within the broader Christian community.

[@2serve4Christ]

59:10 "But by and large the history of European #Christianity is the record of a #church that relies on wealth, power, prestige, and even coercion and war to advance its cause." - Philip Yancey (author of "Soul Survivor")

[@chappellroseholt5740]

Good morning from the beautiful SF Bay Area. Pro choice IS pro life AND pro family. Anti choice is anti family. I find it very interesting that Evangelicals who are so pro Israel, where the state pays for abortions, life being viable with the first breath, have turned to Catholics in their war against family rights because of this single issue. Even this current Pope who is so revered was complicit in the pedaphile coverup. Catholic priests have abused women and children for centuries and still do. It is hypocritical to align with that church. If Evangelicals are so self righteous on this issue they should at least care about women and children AFTER they are born. Wanted children are loved children. As much as I love you all and the podcast I don't think we will ever agree on this issue of the right of family planning.

[@2serve4Christ]

1:00:00 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. ... Their end will correspond to their deeds. 2 Corinthians 11:13-15

[@MichaelJohnson-vi6eh]

My abortion take feels so weird. If we had the right to abortion decided between women and their doctors, I would be fine. I totally understand when a faithful stance is no abortions except with health/viability danger to mother or child. When we started with ABSOLUTELY NO to ABSOLUTELY ALWAYS, that spelled disaster. In a legal sense, I do feel like state by state is a better option, but that's not proving to make many people happen. Skye got it - focus alone on the White House and the Supreme Court to "force the outcome" was not really the Christian way to handle this. Faith and political hurts the faith and hurts the politics.

[@mirtikaschultz3282]

Good thing abolishing slavery wasn't state by state. Or public school. Or Medicare and Social Security. How about freedom of religion becomes state by state. Hm.

[@bethprather9241]

I hate it all. But God used me in prayer because with all the brought up blasting again. I too felt for girls long ago that were made to abort by church parents, girls or women that went thru hell but ask for forgiveness and gave it all to God, I am prolife, but God does not cause incest and rape. Evil things that happened . Incest of young girls in the backwoods like Alabama and more that went total zero on abortion and if raped they had to prove it. Uncle Joe or dad drunk and rapes young 11 or 12 year Olds happens and has happened. God doesn't cause that. So it is not my decision on what to do. That is between them and God.. From making a prolife against abortion it isn't birthcontrol and I agree wrong to go to the extent that anyone to think they know every single situation or don't believe that rape and incest happens... Wake up and sadly it does. Still between God and them and not our decision to promote rape and incest of young girls. So sad

[@Lerian_V]

​@@mirtikaschultz3282What I came here to say.

[@jahbern]

@@mirtikaschultz3282all of those differ fundamentally from abortion. You know they do. We can’t fix this if people keep reverting to comparisons like this. It doesn’t help. It just shuts down discussion - because if you truly believe slavery is equivalent to abortion, we can’t even start a conversation. We aren’t starting from the same reality. By all means, double down on that stance, but just know that it won’t get you anywhere with people who are pro-choice because they believe in bodily autonomy. You’ll just be railing against the wind. When a woman is in the midst of one of the worst experiences of her life, telling her she’s the moral and ethical equivalent of a slave owner isn’t going to convince her to keep her baby. It’s going to compound her suffering - and possibly make her dig her heels in. If what you want is fewer abortions, meet women where they are. If what you want is to be right, by all means carry on calling women monsters.

[@mirtikaschultz3282]

No, if a freedom or protection is given, it should apply to all, not some. Some would argue abortion is a right, others that it is an abuse, but it should not be a hodgepodge. If it is a right, it should be a right in all states, just as emancipation is properly to all states or voting rights or freedom to worship. @@jahbern

[@2serve4Christ]

1:01:01 No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money. Matthew 6:24 NIV

[@IntertemporalTraveler]

The fact that we're even considering using AI in Biblical interpretation...is a problem.

[@thestraightroad305]

Modern Americans want the easy way in everything. And the church has embraced, by and large, that feature of the culture. Many pastors don’t want to deal with the unpopularity of confronting their people with the truth. Members of Congress suffer from the same desire for ease and popularity. When the leadership of the country, both spiritual and secular, are trapped in this, we’re all in trouble.

[@MatthewGarner-e5r]

Reasons and strongholds that I believe play into the Trumpism deception: 1.) Fear As a nation becomes worse because of sin and rebellion against God, people become fearful and end up running to worldly solutions to fix their problems. Many are sadly running to Trump to save them instead of running to Jesus. Many have fallen away from Jesus and have gone after an idol to save them. The Bible says, "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land." - 2nd Chronicles 7:14 Trump is seen as this powerful force fighting for good and as God's "chosen one" to save America from the disasters of the Biden Administration, the Democrats, the RINOs, the deep state, the socialists, the communists, the elite, the NWO, and every dark force in this world. Trump portrays himself as the "savior from the swamp." The savior from the globalists, socialists, and communists - just as Hitler depicted himself as the nationalist savior rescuing the world from socialism. For years, Trump has played into this idea by stating over and over "I alone can save America. In reality, they’re not after me they’re after you. I’m just in the way. I gave it all up for you. I will be your retribution." The message is clear: "I am the only one who can save you. I am the only one who stands between you and the barbarians at the gate. If I fall, you are next." This is the voice of a stranger that Jesus warns us of. Jesus warned us that if another came in his own name, the world would receive him: "I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, him you will receive." - John 5:43 Trump is a false light and a false savior. He uses the cross, nationalism, and patriotism to rally support around him. It's the combination of Trump, the cross, and the flag that is so dangerous because Hitler did the same thing. Eventually, people were saying, "Hitler is Germany and Germany is Hitler. He who pledges himself to Hitler pledges himself to Germany." It was this ultra-patriotism that mixed the identity of a nation with a cult of personality surrounding one man. Hitler pandered to the Christians and called himself a Christian. And the building blocks of the Nazi's ideology were intense personal hardness, extreme Nationalism, a belief in the use of violence and terror, and a loathing of leftists and Jews whom Hitler saw as the reason for Germany's decline. Many of Trump's supporters see him as the embodiment of America. In other words, it's just like Hitler was seen as Germany and Julius Caesar was seen as Rome. The Bible says that there's nothing new under the sun. "Those who fail to learn from history are destined to repeat it." - Winston Churchill Many Trump supporters feel he's fighting on their behalf. So, any persecution against him is seen as persecution against them. He has painted half the country as being evil and into two groups: those who stand with Trump are the “good guys” and "true patriots" while those who oppose Trump are seen as evil radical democrats. Since I started warning of this deception in 2018, people have assumed that because I don't support Trump I must be a Democrat. One of the building blocks of the NAZIs ideology was a loathing of left-wing politicians and Jews whom Hitler saw as the reason for the downfall of Germany. This is how a dictator goes after any person who doesn't support them. Here are examples of what I mean, if a Republican speaks out against Trump, they're seen as RINOs. If a Democrat is speaking out against him, they're seen as radical and it's seen as a "witch hunt". If it's any person who doesn't affiliate with any political party speaks out against him (like myself), they're seen as Democrats. If the news media is speaking out against him, they're seen as the radical left “fake news" media. It's no longer seen as a battle between Republicans vs. Democrats. Now, it's seen as a battle between "good vs. evil." In other words, it's coming down to you either support Trump or you're seen as evil. And Trump has stated, “We are a failing nation. We are a nation in serious decline. The real threat is not from the radical right. The real threat is from the radical left, and it's growing every day-every single day. The threat from outside forces is far less sinister, dangerous, and grave than the threat from within.” And he has vowed to target communists and Marxists-ideological groups that he described as "radical left lunatics"-and "rout the fake news media. He is leading people into this cult of fear, division, conspiracies, lies, demagoguery, hypocrisy, ultra-patriotism, and hatred, with an appeal to patriotic violence against all who don't stand with him. He leads people into his cult while portraying himself as their savior. The Bible warns us of this, "I urge you, brothers and sisters, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people." - Romans 16:17-18 2.) Once the church becomes fearful, worldly, and polluted with political or nationalistic aspirations, it loses its vision and becomes a victim of heresy. It looks for a false savior to replace Christ as its head, and this is exactly what we’re seeing today. Many Christians have allowed their faith in Jesus to be polluted with an extreme nationalism and an undying loyalty to Trump. Many have taken the purity of the Gospel and have poisoned it by mixing in this belief that America is to be glorified and Trump is to be idolized. I say this as someone who had compromised with a love for this world. Many professing Christians have this I call it, an Americanized version of Christianity. It's a Christianity more focused on the things of this world. A Christianity that is more focused on America and political outcomes. A Christianity that is all about how God wants them to live a prosperous life on earth. A Christianity that sees the right as the good guys and the left as the bad guys. And this is an example of a false light vs. a false dark because it divides the Christians from their mission field. They feel their country and way of life are threatened and want Trump to get retribution on all of their foes. There's a sense within the American Evangelical community that the fate of America hangs in the balance and that if we don't do something about it then America is lost forever. The devil is using fear as a means to get them to believe that it's okay to take a militant stance and to compromise with the belief that "Might makes right" and "the ends justify the means." I’m not sure who said this, “The most dangerous words in the English language, desperate times call for desperate measures.” It's no longer Democrats vs. Republicans. Now, it's seen as a battle between Good vs. Evil, God-fearing Christians vs. the godless leftists, and Patriots vs. anti-Americans. And anyone who doesn't support Trump is seen as ungodly and an opponent of America. 3.) The black-or-white fallacy The black-or-white fallacy also known as the false dichotomy or false dilemma. This is when one presents two choices as the only extreme options as possibilities while excluding or ignoring other alternatives. Conservative Christians are presented with two ungodly choices (Biden or Trump), one is claimed to be evil, while the other choice is claimed to be good or the “lesser evil”. For years, we've been conditioned to accept the “lesser evil” regardless of how vile a candidate is. And over time, just like the frog in boiling water that doesn't recognize the temperature change, they aren't able to discern that they've embraced a man far worse than they could have ever imagined.

[@MatthewGarner-e5r]

4.) The "lesser evil" deception "Reject every kind of evil." - 1 Thess. 5:22 When one chooses a lesser evil not only are they compromising with evil, but this opens the door for a wolf in sheep's clothing to creep in. Satan masquerades as an angel of light. What better way to get Christians to support a wolf in sheep’s clothing than through the lesser evil dilemma. When we vote for a lesser evil not only do we compromise with evil, but it exposes our lack of faith and our fear. At the root of this deception is fear. Because when we fear evil, we'll choose a lesser evil instead of resisting all evil as the Bible says to do. This also leads to Christians not "testing the spirits" and "judging the fruit". We end up putting our guard down and aren't exercising discernment as we should. We end up compromising with the spirit of antichrist. "By their fruit, you will recognize them. What fellowship does light have with darkness?" Many saw Trump as a “lesser evil" without even bothering to truly vet him. Many excused his evil believing "God can use anyone for His purposes” and “I don't need a pastor for a President.” There are many Trump "prophets" who have and are still projecting their will onto God believing Trump is this messianic figure being used by God to defeat all the ungodly forces and restore righteousness, peace, and prosperity in America. This "prophetic idea" is not only a false gospel but gives glory to Donald Trump. They put Trump on the same level as the Lord Jesus Christ ("Trump is my President and Jesus is my Savior"). Their Trump "prophecies" not only add to the Word of God but cannot be backed by scripture. We're told to test the prophecies. This is not only calling evil good but attributing their vain imaginations to a Holy God. The Bible says, "I am the Lord; that is my name and I WILL NOT GIVE MY GLORY TO ANOTHER OR MY PRAISE TO IDOLS." Trump has become an idol. Many have fallen away from the faith and fallen to the false savior (Trump). They love this world. They love for their ears to be tickled. They've lost sight of the bigger picture. As Christians, we are called to be citizens of a kingdom that is not of this world. And if you become so attached and find all of your hope, purpose, and self-determination in the things of this world, you lose sight of the Kingdom of God. People are sadly falling for this false light/false savior deception. When we compromise with a "lesser evil", we end up making excuses for their immorality. We become hypocrites. And what we're seeing are people pointing out the sins of the left while excusing a man who is antichrist in every way. We end up becoming what we say we hate and want to stop. This is a way Satan deceives both sides (the lost sinner and professing Christians). This is how lawlessness increases more. And for those who've never truly vetted Trump with an open mind, how can they claim that Trump is a "lesser evil" when they've never truly studied and tested the spirit of this man? A man whose past and present are well-documented. A man who claims to be a Christian but denies that he needs to repent which means he denies Jesus Christ. A man who does the opposite of Christ's teachings. A man who shows no love and displays none of the beatitudes. A man who sows discord, lies, and is all about himself. A man who makes it clear that if re-elected he's getting vengeance on all his enemies. 5.) "Be careful what you think, because your thoughts run your life." - Proverbs 4:23 Many have departed sound doctrine and their minds are shaped by the things of this world. Their minds are more shaped by the things in parenthesis below than by the Word of God. (Fear, the news, Qanon, politics, political commentators, worldly messages that are centered around living their best life in this world, prosperity, false worldly nationalistic prophets, the NAR, the 7-mountain mandate, Christian nationalism, patriotism, American exceptionalism, political philosophies, conspiracies, social media, coworkers, friends, speculations, lies, etc.). So much propaganda is helping Trump, the same way propaganda helped Hitler rise to power. Nazi propaganda played a large role in the Fuhrer myth which greatly helped unify the German people behind the personality, opinions, and goals of Adolf Hitler. A big part of my testimony is how in 2018, God exposed my worldliness, fear, and idolatry. He showed me how I was allowing worldly things to shape my thoughts and beliefs as opposed to His Word. Even though I professed to be a Christian and that my faith was in Jesus Christ alone, my actions and thoughts showed otherwise. I was more focused on "thy kingdom of America" and "thy will of we the people" than I was on "thy kingdom come, thy will be done." I was putting my faith in other things and was full of fear. 6.) They have an allegiance to politics over being faithful to the Lord Jesus Christ. Politics has become like a religion in this country. I've heard so many people say, "If we don't get Trump back in office, we're screwed" as though he is our hope. "Do not put your trust in princes, in human beings, who cannot save. When their spirit departs, they return to the ground; on that very day, their plans come to nothing. This is what the LORD says: “Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who draws strength from mere flesh and whose heart turns away from the LORD." The Bible says, “Do not turn to the right or the left; keep your foot from evil.” Our Calling as Christians is to take a stand against evil and to resist it. We are called to be faithful only to Jesus Christ. We end up committing idolatry when we place our politics above our Christian faith. "God calls us to stand up for Him! God calls us to be faithful to Him! The Democrats and Republicans are two sides of the same coin. They believe in this world and the things of this world. They preach a false gospel, secular humanism. They say, "Vote for me and together we will build a better world." That is a lie from the devil. That is a false message of salvation, a false gospel. Man will not save himself. Man will not build a better world. Only JESUS will save us and make the world righteous, at His Second Coming. If anyone loves this world and the things of this world, the love of the Father is not in him. Don't be snared by the devil. Put all your hope in Jesus Christ alone. Don't put your faith in man who cannot save you. Christians are not invested in this world. Our treasures are laid up in Heaven. The Bible says the good soldier does not get involved in civilian affairs. We are soldiers of God's army. Jesus calls us to love the Father and seek His Kingdom only. Seek the face of God, and live for Him alone. Give to Caesar what is Caesar's - pay taxes and give him his filthy lucre. Give to God what is God's - give Him your whole heart. There is no place in our hearts for politics or this world. We have a Better Country!” - James Key" "No one serving as a soldier gets entangled in civilian affairs, but rather tries to please his commanding officer." - 2nd Timothy 2:4 "The Lord does not see the world as leftwing vs rightwing. The Lord sees the world as saved and the lost. All political parties are on the Lord's left hand - Republican or Democrat or any other party - they are all the wrong choice. The right choice is Jesus. All political theory - is humanism: The vain philosophy that says man will save himself by his self-effort. Vain philosophy says, "We will elect our champions and they will make great leaders and we will create a wonderful utopia." -James Key 7.) Not recognizing the signs of the times and the spiritual nature of our problems. You really couldn't create a better situation for this false gospel to be embraced. The devil has done his work by creating an ungodly culture and high inflation. It's all set for this false gospel of Trump to be accepted. This is why we have seen his face photoshopped on Rambo, Captain America, and Superman. This is why we see signs, flags, and shirts with "Trump Save America". This is why Trump is compared to the Lord Jesus Christ, King David, and King Cyrus. They're not recognizing the signs of the times and the spiritual nature of our problems. They're not recognizing that this is exactly how the antichrist rises to power. They think they can defeat the evils of this world and bring about righteousness through their idol, Trump. They don't recognize that this ungodly world will not be saved by any man. They have sadly fallen for the false gospel of Trump.

[@elizabethbillingsley5534]

This is what Chat GPT said about submission between men and women: Views on this vary, and interpretations of biblical teachings can differ. Some argue for mutual submission, emphasizing passages that encourage both partners to respect and submit to each other. Others may emphasize traditional roles. It's essential to consider diverse perspectives and engage in open, respectful discussions within your faith community to find an interpretation that aligns with your beliefs.

[@itkirk]

I thought it funny how Sky said in the beginning that they started to turn to non christians for support. It's funny because I'm an atheist and I subscribed to and really enjoy watching the Holy post because I'm interested in knowing what christians are talking about today. THP is having meaningful discussions on how to help people and understand the world today, while others like Sean Mcdowell or Gary Winger like to make people fear the world today. I'm all for helping people to make living easier and help others through troubled times, something I'm convinced everyone on THP does.

[@robbower5489]

@itkirk if you want to know how Christians think, the last place you should listen to is the holy post. Look at how few views their irrelevant videos get. They must be supported through Soros type funding with a mission of good old fashioned communist style demoralization. I’m just here as a troll.

[@Anabee3]

Gary Winger? Are you mistaken him for Mike Winger? Mike Winger is great, I just want to make sure. I ggld & found a Gary Winger in Aberta. Is that the pastor you're referring to? 3 trees Alberta or something like that?

[@itkirk]

@Anabee3 Sorry I meant Mike Winger. Don't know where the Gary part came in. I went to a couple mike winger sermons a looooong time ago when a couple christian friends asked me to go. Didn't really dig his vibe. But that was maybe more than a decade ago. He may have chilled out.

[@prowrestlingisart6742]

I'm always here for Kaitlyn's facial expressions reacting to a Phil or Skye comment - they say a lot haha

[@calebwhitcraft1664]

I knew Skye's analogy before he shared it. I am ashamed but also relieved?

[@JohnThomas-ut3go]

Roe was no barrier to policies that could effectively address abortion rates. Its been discussed on this podcast how finacial support for families, adequate healthcare, education lower abortion rates more than banes. All these type policies could have been implemented any time under roe and significantly lowered abortion rates. Problem is that the state or federal government offering effective help to the needy is counter to American philosophy especially on the right. It also interferes with church access to those in need for their proselytization efforts which may be a factor in why Christian leaderships are sp against it. Roe was no real barrier. It was a symbol. Thats all it really was. Its just Americans dont want to make progress. They dont want to do real social work. They want the miracle. The one thing that fixes all. It isnt realistic but it is the American way.

[@wendyfilice7274]

Great interview 👏🙏

[@krisschmucker3668]

Guest segment was way too short. Bring back soon.

[@ASOYE3852]

Chatgpt and concordance are nice to have. However, the basic tool required is the Holy Spirit

[@danielfitzpatrick4873]

44:00 I was hoping desperately that Kaitlin was about to accidentally quote Yoda.

[@SandySalmansohn]

Excellent interview.

[@epincion]

Interesting debate - I'm from a multi-generational extended fundamentalist evangelical family (Baptist and Brethren) and long ago left this bubble precisely because its become a very anti-democratic quasi theocratic ideology - one only has to read the Wiki entry on Dominion Theology to see the dark pathway that conservative US christianity has moved onto. Growing up as an impossibly naive teenager (we did not even have TV in our house as it was considered as wrong) I remember the late Jerry Falwell Snr as an occasional guest preacher in our church and finding his sermons to be hate filled party political broadcasts in marked contrast to our regular minister who was resolutely apolitical and a good man.

[@ConnorMarc]

Mike Pence point was spot on. No pity for him.

[@darlameeks]

FYI...the early Church Fathers know best! I became a Catholic when I realized that. 32,000 more babies were born in red states. Okay...red states also have the highest rates of teen pregnancy, so that isn't surprising (per the CDC, 2021). How many of those children are going to be properly fed, clothed, housed, and educated? How many of them have both a Mom and Dad at home who will raise them in the Christian faith?

[@eottoe2001]

Calvinism from the beginning has built within itself its own seeds of corruption. Hawthorne wrote about it.

[@thestraightroad305]

Really? Where? I’d love to read his thoughts on that.👍🏻

[@brucee8332]

Listen to how a pro-choice ethic, which actually is all about Abundant Life, exists in the Episcopal Church. Listen to our amazing Presiding Bishop Michael Curry, and the Episcopal Jesus Movement!

[@veggiet2009]

Here's my idea for an AI Bible tool: start from scratch, an empty chat gpt, and train a model on ancient manuscripts. Only the raw data from ancient languages, let it learn the languages from prebiblical society only. Make sure to include things like the Rosetta stones that let give explicit hints for translation... Then give it biblical texts, then ask it questions.

[@iansullivan9738]

I would teach it several skills using modern day languages, things like idioms, context, cultural references, poetic forms. We can verify the meanings of these things. ChatGPT is probably able to do most of this. What's your reason for doing this from scratch, and having such a small amount of data to work with? Also, won't things like histories, commentaries, etc help add critical context?

[@veggiet2009]

@@iansullivan9738 from what I'm aware the data set would be smaller, but not exactly small. The first point would be to simply see if it could discern meaning from only the available data. The second point would be to try and simulate what a first century person's understanding might be, free from modern influence.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Unfortunately what we know about translation and those cultures is filtered through what and whose research got funded, so it won’t work as well as you’d like and would probably be a function of what we know, not a function of what is actually true.

[@Keepitkind7]

I’m struggling to understand this state-by-state stance. I’m not wholly decided, but it seems odd to have abortion be ok in one state…and one foot over in the next it’s considered murder. As the UNITED states, I can’t see this. Yes, states decide their own course on other issues, but this one is life and death and I can’t make sense of it.

[@mnorma12]

Oh, that's just because it makes no sense. The week before the Dobbs decision, SCOTUS decided that the states could not be trusted to regulate guns, but with Dobbs they completely flip-flopped. Don't look for logic in this illegitimate court.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Slavery had the same problem. Attempts to force one way or the other (e.g. the fugitive slave act) definitely happened before it ended violently. Same problem - “master sex” now rather than “master race.”

[@epincion]

@@Justanotherconsumer Indeed its useful to remember what used to be the law of the land across the USA for hundreds of years and these laws were based on what was considered as 'immutable Biblical doctrine'. 1. Slavery - the ownership of persons as chattel 2. Women as permanent legal minors whereby she had to be under the headship of a man be he her father, husband, uncle, adult son etc 3. Racial segregation in all of life with miscegenation being a felony punishable by life imprisonment (although more commonly if it was a black male and white female he was lynched as he 'must be' a rapist) The long fight to change these laws was fought tooth and nail by religious conservatives using the same arguments they use today against LGBT rights. Its odd how these immutable Biblical laws are no longer considered as doctrine by even conservative denominations

[@brucee8332]

To have Chatgbt interpret , say Ephesians from an Episcopalian point of view would not work, simply because the modern Episcopalian view of scripture is always in community.

[@ZipplyZane]

In this case, I would expect an LLM to function more like a religious scholar. It would be reporting what Episcopalians had actually said. It would be akin to asking on the Christian Stack Exchange what the Episcopalian belief is on something. I'm not saying it would do a good job, mind you. In fact, I think the bigger problem is that Episcopalians very often don't agree on things. I'm not sure you could even have a book written by a human who could cover *the* Episcopalian interpretation. But I'm not an Episcopalian.

[@brucee8332]

The nice thing about being an Episcopalian is, we have decided to agree upon things is less neat Han to live in love with one another.

[@danielunderwood3198]

Pro life legal activists never could wrap their heads around one simple fact Americans prefer liberty and personal freedom. Even if you think that is bad, they won’t care.

[@MatthewGarner-e5r]

You can legislate morality and have every moral law possible; however, that doesn’t change peoples hearts. People will still break the law. A perfect example are the countless number of people who drive down my road like it’s a dragstrip. We need a heart change in America, that only the gospel of Jesus Christ can fix. There’s no political solution to a spiritual problem.

[@complexmindsimpleman6642]

"Not the author of confusion" yet the most confusing text ever requires interpretation, concordance, and inspiration?? If the former is true (which I agree with) then the issue is with the text . A text written hundreds of years after Jesus died and revised countless times for personal and political convenience

[@clemson1993]

Which text was written hundreds of years after Jesus?? I missed that part. Can't imagine why!

[@Justanotherconsumer]

@@clemson1993translations are all much newer, for an obvious one. Part of the interest in the Dead Sea Scrolls was simply how different they were from the usual text. The earliest “standard” versions we have go back to things like the Latin Vulgate, and those are centuries after the crucifixion.

[@clemson1993]

@@Justanotherconsumer yes, but there are creeds that go back to the years of Jesus within those texts. Also, the Dead Sea Scroll of Isaiah is something like 98% identical to the copies we have in existence today. That shows that there is an amazing consistency in the OT and NT that can be tracked backwards to be contemporary with their writers. Further, there is ZERO evidence that any texts changed over time in any way which has anything to do with the point of the texts. Beyond the woman at the well being added at a later date, all other inconsistencies relate to scribes translating an "an" as an "a", etc. Zero doctrinal issues are affected by any of that.

[@rebeccaholcombe9043]

Um, the problem is people. The problem nearly always comes from people

[@Justanotherconsumer]

⁠​⁠​⁠@@clemson19932% can be important depending what’s in it. The amount of ink and bile that’s been spent over the translation of “Almah” show how much even the smallest things can affect doctrine. That we have many, many, many different translations even just to English shows that the Bible isn’t a convenient monolith of unquestioned certainty.

[@cherylwagner4515]

Check the statistics on infant deaths since Roe was overturned, especially in states with strict abortion laws. You will find they have increased. Fatal fetal anomalies were not addressed well. This is your backlash.

[@bethprather9241]

Sadly just the introduction reminded me of a friend a Christian on FB.. Im not real close but we have discussed scripture many times ans politely discussed or asked a Bishop that is so nice and kind but post way too often the fear, hell, and works salvation and things we dont believe will win others to Christ.. ok.. So I cant remember the basic post it was basic true Bibical I think that had zero to do with Trump, he wasnt even mentioned in this good discussion on Christians and Jesus..She messages me or states something off I didnt get so I did ask.. In a private message Thank God.. ( I mean this was like last year), she just blasted about the fact she remembered I wasnt for Trump. Maybe I said something.. or posted something 2 years before.. Idk? I just ignored it all ( Holy Spirit not me).. and prayed for her.. So sad

[@elizabethbillingsley5534]

Basically Chat GPT tells us nothing. Try asking it about the soul, it doesn't know ans never will.

[@Anabee3]

OR you can catch a full 1hr& 5mins of Tim Alberta at Michael Steele's ch. & you don't have to be a VIP of any sort.

[@eliaspascoe5108]

What happened? It's simple, a black man was voted into the presidency (twice) and gay marriage was legalized. "White lash" plus "christian lash" fueled by a charasmatic movement known as NAR 1:01:44

[@rodkuehn8157]

The problem of evangelical behavior is far older than the 80s. Perhaps the issue is that the bulk of American Christianity has never taught the primary responsibility of Christians is to Love Your Neighbor as described by the 2nd Greatest Commandment. Quite the contrary. White supremacy has often been the operating principle, particularly in southern denominations that formed to support slavery and the Confederacy. When the current corruptions developed, congregations were left at a theological loss as to how to respond appropriately. Fear and bigotry triumphed because they had no foundation of serious Love Your Neighbor.

[@thestraightroad305]

Not to mention “deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow Me.”

[@toddwiese7023]

Skye: Thanks for going old school and bringing back taco the bell.

[@RichyK]

When someone finds that much wrong with Evangelicalism, he is no longer an Evangelical. He should be honest and call himself something other than evangelical. That he is not.

[@thestraightroad305]

Maybe it’s the other way around.

[@RichyK]

@@thestraightroad305 Bible-believing Evangelicals care about politics because they have to live in this world with the policies that politicians implement. That is not wrong. If so, what is wrong with it?

[@thestraightroad305]

@@RichyK I agree with you that it’s important to care about the policies enacted by politicians. But I think evangelicalism, if it is teaching the gospel of Jesus, should express the character of Jesus: humility, willingness to suffer with others, compassion for those who are outcast. I don’t see the kingdom of God as described by Jesus as compatible with trying to rule through political power. I notice that there is a significant amount of teaching in the American church today that is militant, seeking power to control by force and even aggression. I notice that many of those in power who associate themselves with the evangelical church do not seem to see the Sermon on the Mount having any relevance to their speech and actions. Of course, this isn’t all churches. My own church, which is firmly seated in the Evangelical arm of the Body of Christ, is committed to the principles of the Sermon on the Mount and to worshipping God, not man, as the One who saves and delivers. This is just the way I am seeing it.

[@JayFreeburn]

@@thestraightroad305we forget to mention that so many Christian’s are at the very least influenced, and at the extreme brainwashed, by the very corrupt and untruthful right wing media machine which plays on their fears with false information, wrongful fear-mongering and manipulates them into believing lies in order to make them vote a certain way, so that the politicians of the machine’s choice get elected.

[@JesusLovesBest]

When normal, rational, and common miscarriage care is endangered... you've went toooo far!

[@glenngiordano8286]

Hi, I do enjoy your show even though I'm an atheist, although I don't like that term, I guess I'm more of a quantum god believer. I like your discussions, and I like that you don't seem like a bunch of Ted Cruz's together. Watching your discussion on AI today, it made me think of a couple of so-called spirit-filled Christians and tell me because I was an atheist tonight told the joke about Jesus saving by clipping out coupons that they would be happy to find out I was burning in hell for that joke. And I thought today if anything would be the downfall of Christianity it would be AI. A lot of your own folks call AI the antichrist. My question is, you only have voices on your show that are in your bubble, why not bring on a scholar like Bart ehrman on and civilly discuss the differences in the point of view that each of you share. No offense to Caitlin, but if the wind was at her back she's about 16 years old comparatively. Just my thoughts.

[@brucee8332]

And Episcopalians always go back to their Via Media of, not Sola Scriptural, but SCRIPTURE, TRADITION, REASON, EXPERIENCE.

[@davidnuss1242]

Prolife advocates are really just probirth. If we are prolife, shouldn’t we be concerned about the whole child and the environment they are or are not nurtured in after birth. I see too many prolife folks who could care less about these kids days after birth.

[@Anabee3]

How? I mean, how are you even exposed to all those ppl ("too many ppl") who are on contact with that many unwanted babies, in the first place, that "they" couldn't care less about? Is it your line of work? Are you sure you're not just getting this from watching social media? Bc it seems very unlikely that's so much of your real life experience. And you sound like all the talking points, mashed altogether, from the college kids who yell at abortion abolitionists. And what makes you think "they" don't care about the newborn babies? Is it bc they don't take the baby home to raise on their own? Maybe they're already at their legal limit, but still dont want to see other babies get k#lled at the hands of an abortionist. Being ill-equipped to raise a child you didn't conceive doesn't mean the person doesn't CARE about the baby. I mean, if they saved the baby from being m#rd#red THAT alone shows they care DEEPLY for the baby-AND the birth mother, as well. And there's LOTSA wonderful parents & families desperately waiting in line to adopt. Its 100% free to the birth mother, the adoptive parents pay for EVERYTHING, incldg the prenatal care, hospital, delivery, lawyer etc., & adoption is SO MUCH EASIER than ever before in history, in EVERY WAY. Btw: just so you dont sound any more uneducated/"unaware (im trying to use nice, sugar-coated words with you): I believe you mean "...couldN'T care less about..." rather than "...COULD care less about..." If you COULD, indeed, care less, then that means you still have atleast one more CARE left in you before you get to zero, thus you COULD, indeed, care LESS. HOWEVER... If you could NOT care less, that means your care level is ALREADY entirely depleted. Zip. Zero. Zilch. That's why you could NOT care less. There's simply no care in you. Just like when ppl say "Im not doing NOTHING" If your NOT doing NOthing, you must be doing SOMEthing. or in slang speak: "That ain't NOTHIN'!" If it ain't NOthing, then it must be SOMEthing. Hope that helps. 🤗.

[@123JWJWJW]

Need the hashtag: Who's mad at Phil? - #whosmadatPhil

[@davidwilkins5932]

Being raised in the Southern Baptist Church, I remember a lot of this “under siege” and “persecution” business as far back as the early 1960’s. But then it was mostly an undercurrent, but now it’s been put obnoxiously on steroids. Most of it has grown in lockstep with other right-wing media, which purposely has endeared itself to these people. Sorry to say, as a Christian since 1969, I tend not to associate with them, or even go to church. They, more than any other single group of people are doing massive damage to the actual Gospel of Christ.

[@epincion]

I have the same background as you and agree that when I was a teenager (1970's) it was mostly portrayed as a spiritual war going on now about where you would spend an eternal future, and there was a lot of emphasis on separation from 'the world' for 'purity', but then with the rise of Dominion Theology (there is a great Wiki entry on this) it became Christians seizing control of society now (the 7 mountains of Dominion Theology) and remaking America into a quasi theocracy and ending liberal democracy.

[@joykeebler1916]

- every pastor points to the church across the street as having the yeast in it and theirs as being the loaf in the oven

[@JesusLovesBest]

◄ Isaiah 31:1-4► 1 Woe to those who go down to Egypt for help, who rely on horses, who trust in their abundance of chariots and in their multitude of horsemen. They do not look to the Holy One of Israel; they do not seek the LORD. 2 Yet He too is wise and brings disaster; He does not call back His words. He will rise up against the house of the wicked and against the allies of evildoers. 3 But the Egyptians are men, not God; their horses are flesh, not spirit. When the LORD stretches out His hand, the helper will stumble, and the one he helps will fall; both will perish together. 4 For this is what the LORD has said to me: “Like a lion roaring or a young lion over its prey- and though a band of shepherds is called out against it, it is not terrified by their shouting or subdued by their clamor- so the LORD of Hosts will come down to do battle on Mount Zion and its heights. 1:12:46 1:12:48

[@michaeldunigan1067]

Just as Yeshua paid a price for our salvation there is a price to pay to fulfill righteousness such as the pro life position. Legislative and judicial remedies do not pay that price and only exacerbate the problem. Mainly because they are external and are at enmity with the flesh. Joel 2:13, 14. Is the correct way to remedy the problem of abortion. To rend your heart and mourn until our Lord fixes the matter. It works because it is an internal solution. A heart cure.

[@michaeldunigan1067]

Perhaps Yeshua was right when he said that you can't get good fruit from a corrupt tree. Using Trump to accomplish a righteous result is making a deal with the devil. After a while we will reap what we have sown.

[@chuckthompson5724]

His name is Robert Stephanus so Steve not a bad guess.🤣

[@carakellmeyer5037]

Please stop with the bell. Its distracting.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Forget the holy post, how about the holey hat?

[@RichyK]

After watching this segment, I have a fair number of questions: 1. Are you saying that Evangelicals should stay out of politics? 2. Should Christians not run for office? 3. Who did you all vote for in 2016? Trump or Clinton 4. Are you saying that the Democrat party is not causing persecution towards Evangelicals? 5. Are you saying that we should ignore the evil that Democrats are supporting, such as the LGBT agenda, especially the transgender movement? 6. Why do you say that America was not a uniquely blessed nation? 7. You are doing a lot of judging of motives of Evangelical pastors who are concerned about the way our country is going? You assume they are greedy, you assume they are hypocrites, you assume they don't believe what they speak. You have a very negative view of Evangelicals who are involved in any way in politics. Is our country not worth saving from the evils that the Democrat party, the party of the far Left, is trying to implement in our county? 8. Do you not believe that Christians' rights to share the gospel are not being diminished by the policies of the Democrat party? 9. Do you not believe in America first? Are you globalists? 10. You act like some pastors in the past used fear to warn people about bad things coming was a bad thing. Warnings are not a bad thing. Why do you feel they are? 11. Are you against Pastors telling their people what is going on politically and to tell them to get out and vote? 12. It almost seems like you don't care about all the bad things going on in our country. Just ignore them and share the gospel. Why can't both be done? 13. Trump was not my first choice in 2016, but although he was not a Christian, he was pro-Christian, and his policies reflected that. 14. Are you open-borders people? 15. You guys are so anti-Evangelical, that I can't quite place you. What do you call yourselves? 16. Are you what some call progressive Christians? 17. Why does your guest go on Leftist news programs and basically condemn evangelicals for being in politics? The Lefties love to hear that talk since it may encourage evangelicals not to be involved and maybe even not to vote. It's not a good sign when the Liberal media like what you are saying. 18. Do you guys vote? And if so, for what party?

[@elatino2001]

TwiXTer is a great name

[@andym4695]

And Trump will fix it all.

[@MRB-19]

Re AI, "artificial" = "fake" 🤔

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Artificial, awful, and amusing?

[@seahag6118]

I’m sorry Love to listen to your podcast but I can’t stand French’s sense of humor.. he’s always mocking something & he’s NOT as funny as he thinks.. he’s a distraction so I unsubscribed even though your voices are very much needed.. 🤷‍♀️

[@thestraightroad305]

That’s how I feel about Phil’s approach…

[@mikelynn8977]

So Trump is over the target and has been for the past 7 years. Sounds about right. Get help for your TDS.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Or, as Kaitlyn points out, he could just be taking flak because that’s also what happens when you’re wrong. If a guy who cleared a church with chemical weapons for a pointless photo op is Christianity for you, I’d ask you to consider whether that seems to be behavior that honors Christ?

[@mikelynn8977]

@@Justanotherconsumer if murdering babies, encouraging homosexuality, transexuality, pushing 57 genders on children , mutilating children, punishing the innocent, acquitting the guilty, covering for bribes is Christianity for you I would suggest you examine yourself. And of course trump is wrong because you are right and you have TDS with the holy posters. If you stand with the democratic party then you are pure evil because the spirit of Babylon is at work in the democratic party!

[@mcpetzold]

So the Holy Post is over the target and has been for the past 7 years. Sounds about right. Get help for your HPDS. If Trump taking flak is an indication that he is right, why isn't it the same for the Holy Post?

[@chopinksbaul]

Mike, your comment about encouraging homosexuality, etc. seems to be a culture war and a fight with imagined enemies that are conjured up by fearmongers who profit from riling up the passions of simpleminded people. Be disciplined in your speech and identify with particularity those instances where these evils you have identified have been advanced by these podcast hosts or guests. If you cannot identify specific instances of such advocacy, your criticism is invalid ranting and is merely venting bile, which is sin. Fix your eyes on Christ. Read your Bible. And ask God to help you repent and to free you from the spirit of hatred that has gripped your heart.

[@Anabee3]

Those who support djt are the only ones with tds.

[@impalaman9707]

I look at abortion through the historical lens of slavery. Okay---should we have gone more slowly on slavery in 1865, so as not to make the slave states mad when the "emancipation proclamation" was made?

[@thomasmealey2661]

The slave states wouldn't have been signatory to the founding of our country if the northern states hadn't bent to allow slavery into the founding of the U.S. So really the terminology, We the people meant land owners not all men. Oh, by the way, Texas pretty much controls what goes into our school history books and other subjects so is there any surprise that we are taught Confederate history.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

We didn’t really go “slowly” on slavery in 1865, the conservatives saw the next four moves in the chess match and flipped the board over because they saw they were going to lose. Given that forced pregnancy is a form of slavery, equating abolishing slavery with abolishing abortion requires some massive failures of logic.

[@76JStucki]

When The Emancipation Proclamation was made, it only applied to the Union. And it was 1863, not 65

[@76JStucki]

@@Justanotherconsumer”forced pregnancy” is a form of slavery? Nope. Aside from rape victims (a small fraction of abortions), literally no one is “forced” to be pregnant. Comparing pregnancy to slavery would be like saying people in Africa in 1820 (or whatever year) voluntarily boarded slave ships and found an owner they liked, and then went home with him and complained that they had to pick cotton. No. That’s absurd. Someone who chose to have sex is not “forced to be pregnant.” Ridiculous.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

@@76JStucki forced to remain pregnant is the charge - also, they almost always didn’t choose pregnancy. It’d be like if they chose to go out for a walk and got captured by slavers - they only chose the walk. If Jack the Ripper pulls a knife on someone in a dark alley are they obliged to let him kill them because they consented to go in the dark alley, or are they allowed to fight back? They only consented to the dark alley, not to getting murdered. There is a minority that chose pregnancy and later chose abortion. Those are often stories like where the fetus dies before coming to term and other situations where failure to perform an abortion requires callous disregard for the safety of the one who is pregnant.

[@steveericson6209]

"If you would just put your faith in Donald Trump, most of your problems would resolve themselves," is what my Christian Councilor (assistant pastor, former Bible college president with 5 degrees) told me. Many evangelical "leaders" have forsaken Jesus for Donald Trump. I now see some Christian households in my area flying banners that say "Trump is King!" at Christmas time. And they are becoming militant.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Not seeing trump is king flags, but I did find Trump MAGA King and other MAGA King flags on a quick Google search.

[@joykeebler1916]

- there was a picture one day that someone drew of a watermelon with a crown on it - and they had a college masters degree