Experimental Evidence No One Expected! Is Human Consciousness Quantum After All?

[@neutronstorm]

If all this talk of crystals and frequencies pans out, the alternative healing community is going to have a field day.

[@marinoceccotti9155]

Add time cristals to that, and watch healing intensify.

[@TheHortoman]

Well i mean theyd still be incorrect though, they claim em frequencies can damage us despite being non ionizing

[@AbsurdAsparagus]

crystals are everywere. almost all metal is a crystal. computer chips are crystals.

[@MarkVrem]

Soooo buy more Tryptophan?

[@tyresefarrell]

No lol, they are delusional, the crystals don’t emit these frequencies and if they do it’ll be weak asf and like alpha radiation, you’d need to eat the crystal and have it travel close to where our consciousness is for it to actually effect us, put simply it’s horribly unlikely unless a stupid set of events actually happened, basically impossible but maybe possible in terribly unlikely events

[@MarshmallowRadiation]

One thing I learned when getting a degree in cognitive science was that so far no one really knows how all the different brain regions sync up their activity to create a coherent experience of the present moment. If they operated solely by electrochemical signaling for processing and data transmission, then our sensory experiences would be delayed by up to _several seconds,_ which is not at all how our perception of time works. Even the modern paradigm that "experience is a controlled hallucination" where your experiences are predictions based on pre-cached expectations "loaded in" ahead of time is a bit hand-wavey and, again, doesn't line up with how fast humans can respond to surprise stimuli. It would make SO MUCH MORE SENSE if the disparate processing regions of the brain all synchronized and communicated via some kind of quantum optical or even entanglement phenomenon, where the info of what is being sensed and thought "now" is correlated at the speed of light rather than the ludicrously slow speed of nerve impulses. This is a _mind-blowing_ development that could potentially solve a ton of big mysteries in neuroscience.

[@stephenbrough8132]

I don't know if this is relevant info - this isn;t my stubject so I only glanced at the video and comments and something you said caught my attenstion, about our sensory percetptions being delayed by several seconds if operated by electrochemical signalling ... Last year I had a stroke and the first sign was that everything I spoke out loud (mosty swearing and panicking lol) was not audible to me but then "replayed" as if off a tape recorder about 2 or 3 seconds later - almost as if my brain contained a sort of "delay line" as used in recording studios etc. It intrigued me how my brain could be "storing" a piece of audio or perhaps simply delaying it's progress. The other symptoms were then a completely dead arm and being unable to say names or short sentences without someting completely different coming out - which was kinda amusing in a way, although also very frustrating and scary of course - luckilly I mostly recovered within a day or two with drugs to help disperse the blood clot as I understand it. Hope this is in some way useful information.

[@Ubergamer256]

This makes me think so much of intuition, gut feeling, etc and how even in my own life i have now learned to take my first instinct even often above careful logical reconsiderations. Is that gut feeling, your quantum consciousness? And later your “thinking” brain comes in? Also I wonder what role the pineal gland and the theories about calcification play into any of this, if at all. Anecdotally, I will say that my conciousness has expanded a lot in the past 5yrs, and I was for a time supplementing tryptophan and eating a ton of turkey 😂

[@SirSpence99]

@@Ubergamer256 There is a possibility of that but Jungian psychology has a strong explanation on it.

[@piotr780]

​@@stephenbrough8132what if your perception of time delay was itself false and created by stroke?

[@piotr780]

I don't believe that chemical signals are as slow as you say - they goes 1m/s so why do you say about 2 or 3s delay?

[@CunningLinguistics]

This topic (consciousness) is frankly more important than ANY other topic we could discuss.

[@cristig243]

We wouldn't be discussing or doing anything at all without it...

[@JH-pt6ih]

Way too broad of a claim with way too many assumptions at play. But everything has to be the "most" or "greatest" these days - nothing matters if it can't be ranked.

[@conked944]

Those who look outside dream, those who look within awaken

[@yeahcxnt]

Why?

[@KBird204]

@@JH-pt6ihyes, it’s the hyperbolic language required to draw attention in media (clickbait, top 10, BEST or WORST ‘x’ ever) creeping into common language. I personally find it to be very off-putting. It’s like marking all your outgoing office emails as high priority; After a while, people get annoyed or just stop taking you seriously.

[@shaney8275]

Excellent report, Mr. Petrov. I had been planning on checking out the work between Penrose and Hameroff, and you've given us a basis with which to view that work. The work that many physicists and philosophers are doing on consciousness may help humanity transcend our egocentric problems. Thank you for this video.

[@janettomlin950]

Thanks for your comment 😊

[@cratecruncher4974]

Seeing the now obvious link between anesthetics and the study of consciousness was just by itself worth the price of admission.

[@wattsmichaele]

As someone who unfortunately has been “put to sleep” over 45 times for a huge number of life saving surgeries…I wonder what happened to me during my “trips”….🙃

[@sabbathguy1]

It is actually brilliantly simple isn't it.. we don't know what consciousness is, BUT we know how to turn it off, so let's attack it from that angle

[@dragonfly-f5u]

@@sabbathguy1 phase in phase out,is a part of our mind dreaming right now that running in the back and its all flips polarity I try to keep it basic and work up with simple questions.Before jumping off

[@TheFoggyjones]

@@dragonfly-f5u bot, chill.

[@Lund.J]

Anesthesia affects the function of the pineal gland by interfering with the states of falling asleep (similar to melatonin, but much stronger). Then the center of consciousness ("self") moves away from the sensory system and moves towards the consciousness of a pictorial dream (which does not necessarily leave memories).

[@YordanGeorgiev]

Anton, you are the ONLY youtuber, who has the capability to present in a really comprehensible way complex studies and scientific papers from quite vast array of domains, which at least should make you much more confident when you are promoting your channel. Thank you for all of your work !!!

[@Swanicorn]

Not the ONLY for sure. I regularly watch many channels ranging from Cosmetics to Physics who do a good job presenting research in common language. Sabine Hossenfelder, Technology connections are 2 that come to mind immediately.

[@briancolwill3071]

Ze Frank

[@rwm1980]

Yeah this video was a major flex on his abilities. Micro tubials always leaves me a bit confused. He explained this quite well and even a a guy with a ged from the doc can understanf!

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

@@Swanicorn Professor Jean Bricmont debunked Sabine Hossenfelder's mangling of the Bell's Inequality nonlocality experiments. Also Hossenfelder contacted Professor Raymond Pierrehumbert to correct Hossenfelder's admitted error on abrupt global warming. I'm glad Hossenfelder is finally addressing the ecological crisis - even if she is doing so too late and she had already admitted to errors on the subject. Most physicists ignore the abrupt global warming crisis as biological annihilation even though Joseph Fourier first published on the topic writing that the "effects of human industry" would heat up Earth - two hundred years ago!! Wow two hundred years of scientists being corporate brown-No$ers while ignoring the empirical truth that Fourier first established.

[@OnceUponaTimeline]

Talent on tv and mainstream has been going down the tubes too. ;-P

[@JackStonexp]

I remember coming back from general anesthesia (nose surgery, could not breathe properly) and I can't remember the instant I lost consciousness, but coming back from it was traumatic as I didn't understand who I was, where I was or what was happening. For a couple of minutes I felt I just came to exist in that moment and every sensation was shocking. I had to be told who I was and what was happening and I just had to accept it. I felt like dreaming for a few hours or days. I still feel everything is a dream. Consciousness is so strange, amazing and intriguing, really.

[@Brassblitz]

Some Buddhists schools contend consciousness itself is an illusion. They practice using attention in ways to create analogous states of realization to what you may have experienced. I find consciousness super fascinating as well. It's something everyone has with them but so few examine closely.

[@Dr.Gunsmith]

Oh wow I thought I was the only one in our universe that had this happen to. 🙏

[@jacksonlung9710]

Buddha was the only one can explain very detail about consciousness. I am only a layman in Buddhism. I can only understand it. But cannot show you. You have to find it out as a tool by your body .

[@xrysf03]

May have to do with what anesthetic was used, and how that affects the brain. What particular area/function of the brain took longer to come back vs. some others (access to long-term memory may have lagged). Which may result in a particular sort of sensations as you come back around. Also your general state of "systemic deterioration" at the time you wake up may have an effect. If you have just survived a heavy injury, or there's a background of infection being treated, your congnitive performance may be very weak even without the anesthesia. In my case, the first total anesthesia correlated with a far progressed appendicitis - and I was "put to sleep" for an apendectomia done the old way (had about 7 stitches). Reportedly it was rather messy. And I was weak (low blood pressure) for a few days afterwards = whenever they'd try to stand me up, I'd black out. My second total anesthesia was during a somewhat complicated dental operation, where I was in no serious systemic problem. The surgeon has just removed a "buried" tooth from my lower jaw bone. I remember slowly waking up, thinking "oh wow, today I'm going for the operation. Oh wait, I already went for it, I recall lying down on the operating table, having a chat with the people about the theatre... but I don't have my jaws stitched together with wire for support, I can move my lower jaw freely... oh wait, there are some soft stitches on the gum... woow! True wizards those surgeons". And then my vision gradually surfaced from the sleepy dark hazy gloom, and then I puked a handful of blood... that I'd probably previously swallowed, while lying down intubated / unconcsious.

[@kipponi]

I had none trauma. Best feeling after and VERY hungry😂.

[@leecheshire4084]

VERTY interesting. Anton you have a gift for explaining science and you are neutral, logical, and insightful. Keep up the good work.

[@wenx6467]

Yet, he does not know that Tryptophan is not a protein

[@caribbeanchannel]

I swear the only reason I click on anything to do with consciousness in relation to quantum physics is when Anton makes a video about it. And it didn't disappoint

[@djcatboy6979]

quantum mysticism is so stigmatized by all the pseudoscientific snake oil salesmen selling similar pitches minus the overwhelming evidence, so it's understandable that people are hesitant to entertain the idea, but this really is our best shot at explaining subjective experience

[@Mateus01234]

Sabine Hossenfelder also has some hot takes debunking it.

[@oui2611]

cause anton is reputable

[@NexxtTimeDontMiss]

Oh so you’re wrong? Literally Sir Walter has been talking about this for years

[@aaron-n]

I'd say open up a bit a listen to some other people on it but I totally understand that it's very easy to go in widly different directions when it comes to topics like this. The people who angrily try to deny this to protect their worldview should be treated with the same skepticism as the New Age types that abuse the word "quantum" to fit everything they believe.

[@jeffjones3040]

I recently heard a doctor explaining that it was recently discovered that when someone is made unconscious by anesthesia, their different areas of the brain all remain active. The difference is, they all cease to communicate with each other.

[@cifey]

I don't want to think too much about the implications here... I suppose the formation of the pain/fear reaction is inhibited by the disconnection from sensory input.

[@MarshmallowRadiation]

One thing I learned when getting a degree in cognitive science was that so far no one really knows how these different brain regions all sync up their activity to create a coherent experience of the present moment. If they operated solely by electrochemical signaling for processing and data transmission, then our sensory experiences would be delayed by up to _several seconds,_ which is not at all how our perception of time works. Even the modern paradigm that "experience is a controlled hallucination" where your experiences are predictions based on pre-cached expectations "loaded in" ahead of time is a bit hand-wavey and, again, doesn't line up with how fast humans can respond to surprise stimuli. It would make SO MUCH MORE SENSE if the disparate processing regions of the brain all synchronized and communicated via some kind of quantum optical or even entanglement phenomenon, where the info of what is being sensed and thought "now" is correlated at the speed of light rather than the ludicrously slow speed of nerve impulses. This is a _mind-blowing_ development that could potentially solve a ton of big mysteries in neuroscience.

[@thisisreallife5086]

​@@MarshmallowRadiation I appreciate your insights. You are someone who has a deeper understanding of the subject than many of us. My reaction to this new research was along the same lines you expressed in your comment. It just makes so much sense. When I tried to imagine the extended time it takes for each axon terminal to physically release a neurotransmitter chemical across a synaptic cleft to find and pair with a dendrite receptor, it never made sense to me that this, alone, was the source of conscious thought. It's estimated that for a single "thought" to form, one hundred billion neurons and one thousand trillion synapses are working. This seems incredibly slow to be able to experience the world and make conscious decisions within a reasonable period of time. We would all be moving at the pace of sloths. It would take FOREVER to get the cafe mocha you ordered. ;) Maybe this research is pointing the way to some great breakthroughs.

[@darkdarkan]

@@thisisreallife5086 @MatshmallowRadiation I'm not so sure about the idea of quantum entanglement being used in our brains/bodies, but could be some quantum optical phenomenon probably. Whatever the phenomenon is, I'm not sure this change anything about consciousness and cognition in general. The principle will still be communications between different sensory and various brain areas and evolution made sure to use the fastest method avaialble whether it is with or without quantum. So yes I get your point that without quantum brains would be too slow and we could not achieve consciousness, this can be the case. Would be funny that a certain speed of information is required for consciousness.

[@ShakesB13r]

​@@MarshmallowRadiationI only have limited knowledge from studying medicine, but for me it seems like 99% of our actions are regulated by the evolutionary "old" parts of our brains that are probably not very different from day a deer and therefore are quite fast. The new parts seem to be not connected in a way that slows down the old part, but just adapting the outcome by giving small modulations

[@demeurecorentin]

The idea of partially treating Alzheimers and dementia with electromagnetism is wild

[@5nowChain5]

But we do it every day in the Electosmog storm of modern society.

[@nonyobisniss7928]

@@5nowChain5 Maybe that 'electromagnetic smog' has effects on our brains we can't even imagine the mechanisms of.

[@NeoWish]

​@@5nowChain5 bruh

[@nateavery2875]

@@5nowChain5 It's making a tin foil hat look more attractive. LOL

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

Actually Stuart Hameroff has already done experiments with ultrasound. The greatest increase in electromagnetic conductance of the microtubulins is via ultrasound as proven by Anirban Bandyopadhyay's corroboration of the Hameroff-Penrose model of quantum consciousness. Ultrasound is based on piezoelectric collagen - so if people just practiced tai chi or yoga with standing exercises that cause a parasympathetic rebound this will activate the microtubules of the brain also. I have a free training manual as my first upload - oldest video - for details.

[@roland5465]

The idea that the structure of crystalline bonds creates consciousness is crazy great video!

[@HappyGoLuckyPanda]

Penrose is unusually intuitive and original. His conformal cyclic cosmology is kinda cool too.

[@andyc8707]

ccc really makes sense when you think deeply about what he proposes.

[@pilotnamealreadytaken6035]

Ccc is correct

[@SamFirtle]

My thoughts exactly. CCC seems such a rational and brilliant explanation. Cant wait for all the mass to go so we shrink to dimensionless resized big bang plus 1. I may not live to see it but I hope to see more evidence acknowledged via these supermasssive black hole collision left overs from he last era.

[@maxsz91]

Sir Penrose surely came up with a lot of interesting, convincing and maybe even plausible ideas about consciousness but I wonder if any one of them is remotely close to the truth and if it's just brilliant yet still human mind coming up with the ideas compatible with current knowledge trying to cope with it's own mortality and the thought that death could just be an absolute end 🤔 I as a fellow human being want to believe his ideas really badly but uncertainty about petty much most fundamental things like the very nature of consciousness or infiniteness of the universe (spatial and/or temporal) fills me up with great deal of scepticism 😞 Just food for thought here

[@Wolf_Actual]

@@maxsz91really appreciated your knowledgable comment

[@garmatey3816]

Went out to smoke, watched 5mins of this and then paused it and went inside. About 10 mins later my 5 year old asked me “what makes us be alive?” 😳 Edit: I had my headphones in watching this on my phone

[@wmpx34]

“Microtubules, son. Now eat your green beans.”

[@leadbreastplate7496]

Hi jacked entropy.

[@DogmaticAtheist]

They are always listening

[@leadbreastplate7496]

@@DogmaticAtheist oh I know this one. Ears!

[@mbrunnme]

Not smoking

[@orionmedivh5859]

I heard his theory a long time ago about consciousness is a quantum effect. Glad you're covering it!

[@jtjames79]

It was dismissed out of hand because "quantum" can't happen in the warm and wet of life. Then they found quantum effects in plants during photosynthesis.

[@laserhobbyist9751]

I've been following this theory for years; Orchestrated objective reduction (Orch OR) and Stuart Hameroff's micro-tubule theory which I accepted as very likely how we interface our brains to a quantum level of consciousness. Research this further if you haven't seen his stuff, fascinating.

[@jackkrell4238]

@@jtjames79 That doesn't mean that consciousness as a process is quantum, though.

[@pablomg91]

​@@jackkrell4238thank you. Chat is giving Chrystal healing energy right now. How could these quantum states bubble up? Not only that, but how could they surpass the noise by the chaotic media. Not saying that they don't have an effect on protein fold etc etc, but though is such a more complex thing that involves pathways, hormones, environment etc etc etc. People trying to bring quantum mechanics to neuroscience need to reflect about their own mortality and insignificance, we are not special, just part of the universe.

[@turningpoint4238]

@@jtjames79 Think entanglement of selenium was suggested, due to it's less difficult to entangle and been deficient of it seems to have detrimental effects on consciousness. Also explains how been knocked out works with the entanglement been disrupted.

[@MirceaKitsune]

Consciousness exists outside the body entirely, but quantum physics plays a huge role in choosing the reality you experience. Very nice to see this subject approached more!

[@georgecurington8156]

Do you have proof?

[@NamelessAwarenessG]

​@@georgecurington8156NDE'S, ESP research done by Parapsychologist like Russel Targ, Dean Radin, OBE's, SDE (Shared-Death Experiences) and so on. You cannot even provide evidence for your foundational claim. There is no evidence proving that consciousness is emergent property of brain, All you materialistic and skeptics provide evidence is only evidence of correlation and causation. Lmao.

[@pootyting3311]

@georgecurington8156 The double slit experiment has been done many times, using not just light, but also showing that molecules demonstrate quantum mechanics properties. It is strange to think that each of the particles that make our world has a probability distribution associated with it, but every experiment seems to confirm quantum mechanics. ✌️

[@april5054]

Do you have proof that consciousness "exists outside the body"?

[@somerandomdude5171]

This really is the matrix

[@Batmans_Pet_Goldfish]

Turns out the quantum computers were inside us along.

[@AAjax]

The real quantum computers were the friends we made along the way.

[@davidhess6593]

If true that opens an Earth shattering field in quantum robotics.

[@sodadrinkhat5696]

@@davidhess6593buckle up for the near future 🙂

[@silvershimmer]

Would quantum computers be conscious?

[@NeostormXLMAX]

@@silvershimmerperhaps that might be the best next stage of development for ai

[@jty9631]

This is some of the most interesting stuff happening at the moment! At the moment, we mostly see quantum stuff as some distant thing, unrelated to daily life. If it does turn out it's practically related to EVERYTHING we as human beings experience, it could change a lot.

[@IamHumanWoman]

We are not only a part of it, we are it. 🤩🤍

[@HansDunkelberg1]

Yah, just like atoms.

[@cheforyourpartyprivatehire9765]

It will change everything😊

[@millwrightrick1]

Considering that photosynthesis in plants is now established to be a quantum phenomenom, in a warm and wet environment, it was no stretch for Roger Penrose to hypothesize consciousness is also a quantum phenomenon. As for computers being conscious at some point, Penrose has pointed out that any computer program butts up against Godel's Incompleteness theorem.

[@jamescheddar4896]

is energy just alive?

[@mouduge]

Godel's Incompleteness Theorem is general: it applies to classical computers, quantum computers, and even humans. It's obviously not preventing consciouness in humans, so why would it prevent it for computers?

[@sethtipps7093]

​@mouduge We actually don't know if it applies to humans or not. Gödel didn't think so nor does Penrose. You say it's general but it specifically applies only to things bound by first order logic. That we created/discovered first order logic as well as the incompleteness theorems and came up with the definitions of consistency and completeness have been held as evidence that we are not so bound.

[@jackkrell4238]

@@sethtipps7093 How would it apply to humans and other sentient animals if we are actively conscious?

[@rickybloss8537]

Yeah except photosynthesis and every other discovered bioquantum interaction requires relatively large biological systems to effectively make use of quantum effects. Quantum consiousness is still a complete joke.

[@BlairWolf]

Please keep making this type of content. It's absolutely fascinating.

[@tonydagostino6158]

The current issue of Science magazine has an article about "vaults" within cells. Vaults are a recently recognized type of organelle that is apparently VERY abundant in cells. They're also made of repeated rings of molecules, including RNA, resulting in a crystalline structure. The thing about vaults is that after being studied for decades nobody knows what they do. They strike me as very similar to these microtubules discussed in this video in terms of composition and structure though vaults are sort of barrel-shaped, not tubular.

[@NextWorldVR]

A Barrel is just a very wide tube!

[@tonydagostino6158]

@@NextWorldVR Vaults are closed off at the top and bottom of the barrel

[@Mondscheinelfe]

In a few years we will discover even more and then will find out that it’s everything in our body and around us that is responsible for our consciousness idk

[@PEHook]

@@NextWorldVR And short.

[@justaride7444]

Luckily none of what you said matters a single iotas worth since every term you used is more than not likely to exist only when observed, thus nothing what you said is actually real in a real reality sense . The human body is an scientific marvel (golgi machines anyone) but things like microtubules etc won't be rising consc, only in penroses wet dreams, and the entire basis of trying to understand consc or theorize about it with the constraint of it has to be an emerging property of some material thing, But the problem is there has never been or hown any scientifically acceptable evidence of a hypothesis or even anya way to actually study,test or even mathematically trying to explain how, why and what happens at this emergency. And there likely never will be. Last 30 years have produced a lot of (i'm inclined to say pseudoscience as that has been used against many undeserving people, but i respect more intelligent people than me too much to do so and most of these people are actual geniuses, just deluded ones bc they took what schools "taught" them as a religious person would take Gods word and seem unable to shake their antiquated way pf thinking, likely because of grant money awarded to mostly stupid shit and studies that wont rock the Status Quo. Bill gates foundation funds a shit ton of this. so your opinion on him might change you view on other topics he has been altruistically philanthropizing their studies, careers and grant money.) It's a crazy world and the only way to exist within is to take everything with a huge grain of salt that's said on any platform doing it for the money, Unless you are one of the 80% part of humanity unable to critically think, then tough luck for you.REfering to milgram findings if it wasnät clear

[@cbody70]

Great cutting edge info. Please provide updates on this topic when available. Thanks.

[@Name-ot3xw]

If our cell phones use a few quantum tricks, its not unreasonable to assume that a near indescribably more sophisticated machine might use a few too. Since we're both electric powered.

[@Broken_robot1986]

They take advantage of quantum effects in most of the processors, electron tunneling and what have you. This does not make them quantum processors. Engineering with an understanding of quantum level implications is still just regular engineering.

[@mouduge]

@@Broken_robot1986 This!

[@dragonfly-f5u]

we all do it,I can q-entangle with a dog or cat lmao I have before .It's using the correct methodology not just gonna happen it does and can but to do it topnotch I mean perfected the process .And I cant share it case it to simple but time consuming.Its all about the sequences and processes timing instinct being yourself lets say,animals have to be in tune with nature

[@xbox70333]

Penrose is just getting senile ​@@Broken_robot1986

[@TheSpingus]

​@@dragonfly-f5ubro what are you talking about

[@aryamargayoga5527]

Fantastic work Anton. You are doing a signal service to a global community. Inspiring thought (and not just informing) is the greatest art. And your near perfection of this great art makes you a Great Teacher. So you are a real Guru. A light bringer. Keep trucking old boy👍👌

[@acacciafarm]

Anton, your videos & content are wonderful. You are thorough, careful, and thoughtful. No hyperbole, just a methodical breakdown of the state of our knowledge & also what we don’t know or understand. Thank you so much.

[@ignilc]

he has employees

[@RubelliteFae]

​@@ignilcGood. I wish more people worked in the "informing people because it's interesting" industry. Lack of propaganda is a desirable commodity.

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

Plus he a hunk!

[@highgrade42o]

@@ignilcAnton having employees doesn’t add to nor take away from the comment. It’s an odd statement if anything

[@jswong8200]

I remember reading "The Emperor's New Mind" long ago and have been fascinated by this concept ever since. Hammeroff later on made some good points to expand upon Penrose's ideas. For example, he pointed out that some compounds have different effects on consciousness which cannot be explained chemically. One such example is lithium. Lithium-6 and Lithium-7 are identical chemically yet have vastly different effects on the brain.

[@terrencezellers9105]

I also read it long ago. AIR the quantum consciousness stuff was in the last two chapters. I remember being struck by two things at the time. First I was (and still am, though now nearing retirement) a business hack programmer .... who was (and is) largely self taught and stayed in the game while a huge percentage of colleagues "burned out" or were innovated out of the game by changing technology, where I continuously followed and learned new stuff, including forays into the lowest, deepest roots of computer science; and it was clear to me from those chapters that Penrose for all his unquestionable intelligence and hugely deep theoretical understanding of logic, didn't understand computers and computation. That there are problem models which intrinsically cannot be generally solved computationally DOES NOT MEAN that all problems of that model cannot be computationally solved. There is no (known) general solution to the traveling salesman problem (or a dozen similar classic problems), but with relatively small set of nodes and/or other constraints .... well your navigation app is stark evidence that there ARE specific solutions to such that can be derived computationally. The second issues was conflation of ignorance ... which is a huge and common problems: it is not necessarily true that for some function f, if f(x) = f(y) that x = y. That is ignorance of x and ignorance of y does not mean that x and y are identical ... or even related. And for that matter I have serious trouble considering our comprehension problems of quantum mechanics "ignorance". We aren't ignorant of quantum mechanics ... in fact we can generally map out the equations for any problem we can define well enough, though as with any equations solutions may be difficult to solve ... Our "ignorance" is simply our problem finding an easily graspable conceptual analogy for them. Those two "rebuttals" to the minor extent Penrose's arguments required rebuttal were even then, IMO more than sufficient to table any enthusiasm for the idea. Perose's arguments simply did not carry the freight he was trying to load upon them. Which is not to say that I object to research .... I favor any well constructed and disciplined program of scientific research which may result in new knowledge (or even simply provide additional confirmation to that known)! Likewise, now that we have sufficiently sensitive tools we're finding all kinds of cases where quantum effects manage to propagate up to molecular and even in a few cases structural events. Given how often we are finding such I'd be downright surprised if we didn't find some cases of such happening in the brain. But none of that substantially points to the idea of consciousness being a "quantum phenomenon" - mostly because I've never heard a coherent statement about what such concept is supposed to mean. Give me hypothesis of what "consciousness is a quantum phenomenon" means - in terms where "consciousness" clearly references something you, I, and anyone else would recognize as intrinsically part of our experiences of our own consciousness - that can in principle be empirically tested with at minimum a stochastically consistent positive result and we can talk. Quantum effects in internal cellular structures are as ho hum and meaningless to such is as telling me that quantum effects have something to do with how atoms and molecules bind. We know that. So what?

[@cristig243]

Old news, but very important . Now you can laugh when you hear about conscious AI . They don't know what they are talking about, let alone fabricating it .

[@spvillano]

Another example being tritium, which reacts chemically quite differently - sluggishly, compared to lighter hydrogen isotopes. The classical computer model of the brain has long been in trouble, in part due to the phenomenal number of neurotransmitters and neuromodulators present that are entirely absent in our classical binary based computers. That said, I do believe that Penrose did dive off a bit too far into the deep end with his theory. We do know that quantum chemistry is a thing, but it's nowhere quite as deep as what Penrose suggested with absolutely no evidence to support his theories.

[@nickmcdonald3083]

Its the kinetic isotope effect. You should not expect isotopes to act the same in a body when interacting with enzymes.

[@nickmcdonald3083]

This is why diDeterium oxidie (heavy water) would kill you if you drank it and replaced all the water in your body with it. Your enzymes would work slower, fall out of homeostasis and you would die

[@allenholmes2353]

I m a psychology student. This is so interesting, my two favourite topics collided with each other. Thanks wonderful Anton for such a great explanation of the paper.

[@thetacokawaii5708]

Well, who cares.

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

@@thetacokawaii5708 Also, Anton, you are a hunk. Please also provide a sexy poster so I can have you on my wall in my home laboratory.

[@Bosssubs-sg5wc]

@@thetacokawaii5708same goes for you

[@PierreLucSex]

​@@thetacokawaii5708 not you

[@mile.9768]

@@thetacokawaii5708 ???

[@grey_north9016]

Hey Anton. Would be awesome to hear from a scientific standpoint about the structural similarities between the tryptophan, psilocybin and DMT molecules and how they relate to the perception of reality and consciousness of the human being.

[@corymoore2292]

As a person suffering from bipolar 2 and severe depression, consciousness and the way we perceive reality has piqued my curiosity for quite some time. I love being alive in the golden age of scientific discovery. I desperately hope we figure out the brain sooner rather than later.

[@HarryNicNicholas]

"piqued" sorry i'm OCD.

[@Dizzeke]

@@HarryNicNicholas how dare you correct someones incorrect usage of a common phrase, you're soooo OCD omg

[@tyresefarrell]

As a bipolar 1 person I agree lol, science and philosophy can’t accept or agree on why we are conscious, it has to be something a little more than what either of them say

[@glennbabic5954]

So bipolar is just quantum entanglement?

[@TheMoopMonster]

You're assuming consciousness is emerging from the brain, and not the other way around 😊

[@dharmverma7595]

An Indian scientist Dr. Mukhopadhya has shown that the microtubules in neurons are arranged in bundles of different lengths; and they react quantum mechanically to different bands of wave lengths depending on their lengths. Please look at this paper.

[@MikeWiest]

Anirban Bandyopadhyay!

[@mikepatnode4407]

I feel our brains have different frequencies for every feeling and emotion. Not only that but that they come to us through the electron clouds within the mts by the benzine molecules in them. Also that that is the way memory works. By searching our brains for feelings attached to memories, and not the other way around, where it can then cascade to more memories.

[@SendyTheEndless]

Making the brain a literal "organ" : )

[@notahumanbeing6892]

@@mikepatnode4407I have always felt like my memory relies more on remembering specific “feelings” “energies” or “vibes” (none of those quite describe it to me, but they are the closest) then intuiting the details of the “real” memory based on parts of that feeling aligning with certain objects/people/words etc. Ive only tried to articulate that a few times but didn’t make much sense to anyone lmao, good to know I’m at least not the only one with that view on memory.

[@MargotDobbie]

Very interesting study. He is in contact with Hameroff

[@chicliac]

This is both very little and extremely exciting! Thanks for veering outside of your usual scope to report on these studies. Cant wait to hear more!

[@taylor943]

This is the deepest question for me as it could be a scientific explanation for what we refer to as a the soul

[@okultusrexus3660]

The soul implies sentience without or outside the biological host .ie our body. I don't think we're quite there yet =)

[@Nvlll00]

@@okultusrexus3660maybe we are. Quantum field is guardiang agency of the physical world, yet its invisible. A lot of evidences point to consciousness in the universe - actually that universe is conscious. So that would mean that everything is connected on some level and that universe that we live in is aware of its creations. When we die, our consciousness just transform to collective consciousness, together with our spirit that is energy or small piece of light. That spirit travel with the speed of light to connect with collective. So soul would be that field that connects all on some level, so everyone and everything has soul (there is only one soul). Spirit is different, because thats energy in every living being that animates living beings, but non-living things doesnt have that I guess. And consciousness is all that exist for eternity. Yes, we are far away (100+years) for proving that, but this is probably true.

[@okultusrexus3660]

@@Nvlll00 Do you have any compelling evidence of this? I can write sci-fi fantasy too.

[@vienna_1756]

@@okultusrexus3660ppl were saying the same thing about potential quantum effects in the brain two mins ago - maybe we should be less arrogant and be open to everything at this point..

[@TarisSinclair]

Scientists in 2024: "Consciousness is quantum!" Heisenberg: "And even that is uncertain."

[@archangelgabriel5316]

Meow

[@roninbadger7750]

“The cosmos is within us..We are a way for the universe to know itself.” ― Carl Sagan

[@alfredsutton4412]

Well done!

[@dragonfly-f5u]

everything is lmao

[@stickplayer2]

That's not how the principle works. It doesn't mean "nothing is certain".

[@marcobiagini1878]

I am a physicist and I will explain why our scientific knowledge refutes the idea that consciousness is generated by the brain and that the origin of our mental experiences is physical/biological . My argument proves that the fragmentary structure of brain processes implies that brain processes are not a sufficient condition for the existence of consciousness, which existence implies the existence in us of an indivisible unphysical element, which is usually called soul or spirit (in my youtube channel you can find a video with more detailed explanations). I also argue that all emergent properties are subjective cognitive contructs that depend on the level of abstraction one chooses to analyze the system and are used to approximately describe underlying physical processes; these descriptions refer only to mind-dependent entities, and therefore consciousness, being implied by these cognitive contructs, cannot itself be an emergent property. Preliminary considerations: the concept of set refers to something that has an intrinsically conceptual and subjective nature and implies the arbitrary choice of determining which elements are to be included in the set; what exists objectively are only the single elements. In fact, when we define a set, it is like drawing an imaginary line that separates some elements from all the other elements; obviously this imaginary line does not exist physically, independently of our mind, and therefore any set is just an abstract and subjective cognitive construct and not a physical entity and so are all its properties. Similar considerations can be made for a sequence of elementary processes; sequence is a subjective and abstract concept. Mental experience is a precondition for the existence of subjectivity/arbitrariness and cognitive constructs, therefore mental experience cannot itself be a cognitive construct; obviously we can conceive the concept of consciousness, but the concept of consciousness is not actual consciousness. (With the word consciousness I do not refer to self-awareness, but to the property of being conscious= having a mental experiences such as sensations, emotions, thoughts, memories and even dreams). From the above considerations it follows that only indivisible elements may exist objectively and independently of consciousness, and consequently the only logically coherent and significant statement is that consciousness exists as a property of an indivisible element. Furthermore, this indivisible entity must interact globally with brain processes because we know that there is a correlation between brain processes and consciousness. This indivisible entity is not physical, since according to the laws of physics, there is no physical entity with such properties; therefore this indivisible entity can be identified with what is traditionally called soul or spirit. The soul is the missing element that interprets globally the distinct elementary physical processes occurring at separate points in the brain as a unified mental experience. Some clarifications. The brain doesn't objectively and physically exist as a mind-independent entity since we create the concept of the brain by separating an arbitrarily chosen group of quantum particles from everything else. This separation is not done on the basis of the laws of physics, but using addictional subjective criteria, independent of the laws of physics; actually there is a continuous exchange of molecules with the blood and when and how such molecules start and stop being part of the brain is decided arbitrarily. An example may clarify this point: the concept of nation. Nation is not a physical entity and does not refer to a mind-independent entity because it is just a set of arbitrarily chosen people. The same goes for the brain. Brain processes consist of many parallel sequences of ordinary elementary physical processes occurring at separate points. There is no direct connection between the separate points in the brain and such connections are just a subjective abstractions used to approximately describe sequences of many distinct physical processes. Indeed, considering consciousness as a property of an entire sequence of elementary processes implies the arbitrary definition of the entire sequence; the entire sequence as a whole (and therefore every function/property/capacity attributed to the brain) is a subjective abstraction that does not refer to any mind-independendent reality. Physicalism/naturalism is based on the belief that consciousness is an emergent property of the brain. However, an emergent property is defined as a property that is possessed by a set of elements that its individual components do not possess; my arguments prove that this definition implies that emergent properties are only subjective cognitive constructs and therefore, consciousness cannot be an emergent property. Actually, all the alleged emergent properties are just simplified and approximate descriptions or subjective/arbitrary classifications of underlying physical processes or properties, which are described directly by the fundamental laws of physics alone, without involving any emergent properties (arbitrariness/subjectivity is involved when more than one option is possible; in this case, more than one possible description). An approximate description is only an abstract idea, and no actual entity exists per se corresponding to that approximate description, simply because an actual entity is exactly what it is and not an approximation of itself. What physically exists are the underlying physical processes. Emergence is nothing more than a cognitive construct that is applied to physical phenomena, and cognition itself can only come from a mind; thus emergence can never explain mental experience as, by itself, it implies mental experience. My approach is scientific and is based on our scientific knowledge of the physical processes that occur in the brain; my arguments prove that the very foundations of our scientific knowledge excludes the possibility that the physical processes that occur in the brain could be a sufficient condition for the existence of consciousness. Marco Biagini

[@hellomate639]

This is similar to my line of thinking. I would actually alter it's meaning in one way: the "physical world" is not merely physical, but is actually an extension of consciousness. That solves the problem of "how can consciousness be not physical and yet interact physically?"

[@marcobiagini1878]

@@hellomate639 Your view is essentially an idealistic view; the point is that the physical world is not under the control of our mind, therefore it must be created by a conscious God. This is essentially Berkeley's biew.

[@hellomate639]

@@marcobiagini1878 It is indeed a form of idealism - but to go further, I do believe in God, and believe that God is indeed responsible precisely in this way. I also think people have been far too dismissive of religion and psychedelics as "mechanical nonsense in the imagination," while being willfully blind to the fact that consciousness is evidence that mechanism is not the root of reality. I actually think because of this idealism and Penrose's work, we're hurtling towards the death of materialism. It'll take a few generations, but I think we're getting there. Much of the enlightenment is coming full circle back to many aspects of the pre-enlightenment worldview. Essentially, we're going to have a pre-enlightenment worldview with a 16k resolution instead of a 240p resolution.

[@hellomate639]

@@marcobiagini1878 I mean, that's exactly where I take it as well. Every point in every spot are things I've thought about for years and have been annoyed with materialists for not understanding, despite the points themselves being relatively straightforward. I'm not a physicist, but I have a bachelor's in physics. Clearly we think very similarly.

[@BlakeKasgaard]

@@hellomate639 If either of you have heard of the “holographic universe” theory it ties in nicely with your lines of thinking. I might try and make a video on it soon. Also, I think the most fundamental misconception is that matter precedes consciousness. I think it is very clear when we look at the “rules” we have for matter and physics, that it was not the precondition for consciousness and existence, but rather consciousness is the endemic state and matter was dreamed up as a result.

[@wjckc79]

Anybody ever been put under with propofol? I find the experience disturbing. As soon as the IV starts, you stop existing. As soon as the IV stops, you start existing. No going to sleep. No waking up. Zero sense of having existed at all. I have been knocked out with a variety of anesthetics in my time, propofol is the only one that I guess you could say, upsets me existentially.

[@Brenden.smith.921]

How do you know you are the same you that went under the anesthesia? Like, what if your consciousness literally died when you were put to sleep and was replaced by something else when you woke up? It's the same problem that happens with teleportation. How do you know you didn't die and were recreated instead of actually teleported? It's also the same problem that happens when you go to sleep every night. The lapse in stream of awareness means that you have no direct evidence that you are the same you that you were yesterday. Next time you need anesthesia, just remember: you're probably gonna die and when "you" wake up, you'll never know. Because you'll be dead.

[@dr4gon166]

This is not true for everyone though. There have been many people not had these results however they are a minority it has happened plenty of times.

[@ryanrobison8973]

That's strange. I have found it really relaxing and enjoyable. Though I do have multiple psychiatric disorders (ADHD, MDD, PTSD), and also am in quite a bit of pain every day. It's like a little taste of what death will be like. It made me way less afraid of dying, if it did anything.

[@michamuszynski872]

@@Brenden.smith.921 Your brain is veeery active during sleepy time, though, and you don't lose conciusness at all.

[@Ali-cya]

​@@Brenden.smith.921 During sleep you don't so much lose consciousness as much as your consciousness gets heavily supressed, it's still there just not able to do anything.

[@CM-dh8py]

Anton has the only videos that I watch all the way through the subscribe and support pitches at the end because I always want to see that adorable goofy smile and wave goodbye. He’s such a sincere, sweet person. Thank you for making us all smarter, Anton!

[@Guitarist4Life89]

Watching your channel is one of the few things that still gives me hope for the future of our species

[@chad0x]

Outdone yourself with the 4k graphics in this one Anton. Superb!

[@fratz3859]

My biggest fear is dementia. Thanks for the video. Gives me hope.

[@saxonsoldier67]

Look into Methylene Blue. Some find it useful for maintaining brain function. Do your own research as YMMV.

[@holeymcsockpuppet]

We already know what we need to prevent it and fix it. But the pharmaceutical companies are trying to figure out how to prolong dementia so that any medication they develop will be used for decades. There is no profit in cures. Prolonged, low grade suffering is profitable.

[@fratz3859]

@@holeymcsockpuppet there are muliole reasons, why this does not make sense. I can send you a video where a guy is explaining, why this won‘t work. Tell me, if you are interested. (it is in german but there is autotranslate for subtitles)

[@hi3694]

Thought dementias etc. originated in braincell mitochondrial dysfunction generally caused by sustained chronic inflammation & insulin resistance. Eliminate carbs from diet + fast 36 hours each week (e.g. eat breakfast then don't eat until the evening of the next day), also add a 5-day fast once every month or every quarter and you'll be in a much, *much* better position cognitively. Dr. Thomas Seyfried considers just *one* 5-day fast *per year* to be sufficient to reduce your chance of cancer by 45%. Just once... There are vast benefits by doing this (fat loss, cancer-halting, systemic anti-inflammatory side effects, thyroid function improvement so more resilient immune system etc.). Look up the channel Pottenger's Human for more info on this, he tends to provide proof/"receipts" for the claims I made before e.g. links to studies finding statistically significant results that can be cheaply implemented by anybody who simply has the knowledge.

[@wyattlavigne]

I had Alzheimer’s; cured myself. Used what I learned to develop the world’s first effective covid protocol (neigh identical to Dr. Zelenko’s, but about 6 weeks earlier); Last year set the record for the oldest person to ever grow naturally at age 50 (Adam Rainer is the overall record holder at age 51 with Acromegaly/giantism). When Roger Penrose first proposed this back in the 90ies, practically everyone thought he was out to lunch, but I thought he was on to something. Glad to see he is being vindicated.

[@Ripplewood]

I know next to nothing about modern science, but I really enjoyed your video, learned new stuff and got excited for the future! It's clear that you care about how to interpret information, without hyperbole or bias. Instant subscribe!

[@neilbain8736]

This is mind blowing. Something really significant is being observed an speculated on.

[@aaronrandolph261]

speculated on being the key words

[@UltimateFeudEnterprise]

@@aaronrandolph261yeah God forbid the science cult has a mind blowing perspective change on life and the universe itself eh? 💀

[@gaspachoo5046]

@@UltimateFeudEnterpriseThe Science! (tm) cult doesn’t like anything that gives the spiritual so much as a nano-angstrom of credibility. Religion is simply too evil, and too lowly to be allowed in our “progressive” and “modern” utopias.

[@aaronrandolph261]

@@UltimateFeudEnterprise lol exactly! when that happens if it happens we will see science really take off but if they continue to think in such a narrow way we will only get garbage like AI and smart phones rather than unlocking the real mysteries of the universe. hard to think outside the box science created for itself

[@Skonnchy]

​@@UltimateFeudEnterprise Science cult?

[@ТестТестович-г2о]

It was always fun to watch people saying that quantum effects only belong to extremely low temperatures on LCD screen, with all data delivered by optical cables.

[@jdkingsley6543]

The hubris of humans lol

[@wanderlking8634]

Yeah, my understanding of physics is pretty rudimentary but doesn't *everything* have wave/particle duality but at the macroscopic level all the probability waves collapse so you're basically living in a Newtonian universe on the scale humans operate on?

[@nycbearff]

Yes. And enzymes in your cells use quantum tunneling to catalyse chemical reactions - at body temperature. That has been confirmed by many labs now.

[@mushroom11g55]

​@wanderlking8634 WHAT???

[@mushroom11g55]

Who said that? What does that even mean?

[@deatonsmusic]

I wish I could remember his name but someone on X was saying just last month they got approved to study the affects of Ultrasounds on microtubules to treat Alzheimer’s and dementia in America. This video seems timely!

[@SahilP2648]

Damn. This might be the start of the biggest breakthrough in history if results are positive.

[@analog.record]

Best explanation of this topic ever, as someone who read Penrose's "the emperor's new mind" recently, these are super fun news!

[@rileyhoffman6629]

There is a lot to learn, here. Fascinating cross-discipline thinking. Love it. Thanks.

[@stevenfenster1798]

After 45 years in Veterinary Medicine, a Master in Theology, and finishing a doctorate in psychology I would opine that consciousness is the fundament of reality, and is universally present in a fractal form. Your dog certainly is conscious.

[@Ocodo]

I'm just an architect, but I've been interested in this topic for years, and I would generally agree. It is something like that.

[@nycbearff]

The word "fundament" does not mean what you think it means. And if you're getting a doctorate in psychology, why don't you know how little is currently known about how the brain operates at a cellular level? Any claim about consciousness currently is pure speculation.

[@joeimbesi99]

Is he allowed to have an opinion or are you the Thought Police?

[@nycbearff]

@@joeimbesi99 so if someone has a response to another person's comment they are "thought police"? What are you, then?

[@slowercuber7767]

2:38 At every stage of man's understanding of nature, our mind has been likened to the technology of the time. Whether our brain is called a pump, or a telephone exchange or a computer, or dare I say a quantum device, we continue to try to tie it to the mundane, to that with which we are familiar. Sometimes the metaphor is useful, sometimes not. But even now, I'm skeptical that we're nearly at the point of understanding.

[@lijohnyoutube101]

Exactly!

[@TheMoopMonster]

There is no end to how much we can understand and comprehend, to the number of relationships or connections we can form and interweave. It's like we are trying to define an absolute value of an irrational number. We can comprehend the "macro" scale of the number and its applications, but we can never understand or determine a discrete absolute true value of it. Truth is an ever converging point, between what we perceive and what is. And what is, is fundamentally irrational and infinite, and can not be completely grasped by any tool or technology.

[@stevengill1736]

Yes, which is why all the recent "AI" hype is overrated. Even single celled organisms seem to have sentience - it's something special that we share with all living things....

[@djcatboy6979]

is this inspired by Justin Riddle's quantum consciousness course? or did you independently come up with the same idea

[@lijohnyoutube101]

@@stevengill1736 I don’t think it’s special. Not truly, it’s just another part of chemical programming that can help in decision making.

[@theiglooarchitect9232]

I don’t have a scientific background but the most intriguing theory I’ve heard bout consciousness is that it’s a universal field that exists everywhere and brains are like antenna tapped into the field. People have reported experiences after being clinically dead or losing consciousness. It also can add some answers to the universality of expression across animals how we all express emotions similarly, behave somewhat similarly based on cognitive power, etc.

[@KabelHeinz]

Actually true, i watched many nde's experiences and it seems there is some pattern or a process.

[@Vibologie]

This is how my NDE was - and the question was asked of me “ what vibration of consciousness do you want to animating your body?” The most powerful question I’ve ever sought to answer.

[@TavynAvyn]

​@@danrayson that makes no sense

[@Oogtug]

@@danrayson How can you know?

[@orangeinthesoup1594]

​​@@danraysonVibologie said "I witnessed something once", he could experienced something (not specified) but we don't know the context. He was drunk? He was at a public or private place? He was hallucinating? The context of something matters so it makes sense a sentence or affirmation to prove if he's saying the truth or if he's being fooled by his senses.

[@dougmanyole1656]

There is a theory that consciousness was there before life. And that as life evolved, it became a receiver of the consciousness, and some life has evolved to be a 'better' receiver than others.....

[@jackkrell4238]

There is also a theory that a lot of people are ignorant. The notion that consciousness somehow magically predated life has to be one of the most ludicrous things I ever heard.

[@deeparoyal7349]

Theory or speculation 😊

[@UltimateFeudEnterprise]

@@deeparoyal7349just like the entirety of science itself, theory and speculation. You can’t definitively prove anything unless you get an answer from who or what created the universe itself

[@anonymes2884]

That's more just "an idea" or "opinion". "Theory" usually means something different in a scientific context (the speculation you mention for instance isn't remotely on the same level as the _theory_ of General Relativity, which is a mature, mathematically rigorous scientific framework that's - so far - withstood multiple experimental tests).

[@dougmanyole1656]

Its a theory and I quite like it. As science looks into the brain using quantum entanglement to explain consciousness.... this sort of idea will become more talked about.

[@jeffpurnell864]

I watched Sabines version of this earlier. It was great. I don't like to choose between favourites but Anton is the GOAT.

[@jessicaheger1880]

I will always choose Anton over Sabine ❤

[@quite1enough]

I like Sabone more 😢

[@bjdefilippo447]

@@jessicaheger1880 She's hit or miss for me.

[@Sleepyhead64733]

​@@bjdefilippo447same. Sometimes she gets political and it's jarring for a science channel. I dont wanna hear any of it 🙄

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

Sabine is actually being financially...cohersed in to ripping on certain people, and to promote key ideas that those in power want pushed.

[@the80hdgaming]

Quantum Consciousness is just the universe thinking "what is the meaning of life?" 😂😂😂

[@OrgusDin]

life life life

[@Takesis]

42

[@Zeithri]

That's what they say in Babylon 5, that Universe _created life_ because it's trying to figure itself out. Or something like that.

[@perpetualbystander4516]

Or as if it's questioning why it decided to give birth to itself. 🤯

[@sdwone]

Correct: US... Because the Universe IS US... And we... IT!

[@chigirl111]

Lol, all these scientists sitting there saying that’s way too crazy to be true… yet here we are, talking, thinking, living, existing out of nothing. Why are they so adamant consciousness must be in the brain and the basis for consciousness must align with old science? Life is way too extraordinary.

[@catpoke9557]

Because evidence currently shows consciousness probably resides in the brain and one new study doesn't instantly overturn all of that

[@chigirl111]

@@catpoke9557 I guess it all depends on what you construe as evidence. If it’s what you can verify with man made equipment and the current understanding of man’s mind, then sure. If you’re willing to accept human experience as evidence then we have a different discussion. The problem is it’s a I’ll believe it I see it world… so we took a few hundred extra years to agree the earth was round. In hindsight the earth being flat is a ludicrous idea. One day, people will laugh at the idea of consciousness being inside the brain. Plenty have had larger experiences that it’s not and that it is everything and everywhere but they’re not believed because 99.5% of people still believe they are the thought in their mind. They have never even investigated who it is that is watching and “knowing” the thought or who is there when the thoughts are silent and yet we are still there somehow… “knowing” we are. Once you experience that, and then follow that experience of knowing you are without thought, it leads you the place current science is not will to see.

[@jackroyaltea5034]

I never thought of it that way. The brain is a hunk of fat full of salt and electrodes. That thing is capable of naming itself and what we assume is self awareness and consciousness… Why couldn’t those conditions be met in some other fashion?

[@noname-gp6hk]

So are LLMs

[@RAPEDBYBLACKS]

@@catpoke9557absolute BS. There is no solid evidence that it resides in the brain.

[@exoticgamer2479]

Saw this in the exact right time was dreamt about things last night to dedicate my whole life to this research as I medical student interested in consciousness and psychology since before my tween years, I appreciate you man love the content

[@JohnMcSmith]

That’s awesome

[@-Teca-]

So youre going to enroll in college for that now??

[@howtoappearincompletely9739]

Exciting is right. Fascinating stuff, Anton.

[@paradiseegg2111]

it's interesting how since we now live in a technocratic world, the idea that "Consciousness is just a computer" will be fiercely enforced and promoted, since there are whole tech industries and fields of computer sciences that are based entirely on that premise. When reality could actually be so different.

[@Archeidos-Arcana]

People struggle to fathom that it may not JUST be: "that there is much we don't know yet (as in through science)" -- but that the things we think we know CAN be very wrong.

[@aaronrandolph261]

i agreed. it does make some busy work for scientists though. consciousness is out of the realm of science in my opinion though i do think it will be possible to mimic it someday

[@nycbearff]

Using the computer as a metaphor for the brain has been pretty much dropped by anyone who studies the brain - neuroscience has progressed enough to show that brains are not at all like computers. Philosophers still use the metaphor, but they don't know what they're talking about most of the time anyway.

[@Archeidos-Arcana]

@@nycbearff As per Heidegger, every time a new technology is developed, it seems to distort the way we think about things at some ontological level (until something comes along to shake it up). With Descartes, it was the "clock-work universe" -- now it's the "computational universe". I much prefer Whitehead's "organismic universe" -- it's far less discrete, and is closer to nature imo.

[@BabySagan]

Fantastic video. Great work Anton. I’ll have to discuss some of the science at some point on my channel. Great work!! ❤

[@ghfdt368]

It never fails to amaze me that we understand and know more about physics and the universe in many aspects than we do about our own biology, psychology and health.

[@Naptosis]

Well, we are the most complicated things in the known universe.

[@jackkrell4238]

@@Naptosis That's awfully anthropocentric.

[@inkoalawetrust]

@@jackkrell4238 In the KNOWN universe.

[@twrecks6279]

@@jackkrell4238 It's also true.

[@jackkrell4238]

@@twrecks6279 No, actually. We are just meat machines operating on electrical impulses inhabiting an oblate spheroid hurdling through the ever vast cosmos at the end of the day. We're not special. Get over it and grow up.

[@Forjugadname]

This is really awesome, I've always suspected consciousness must be more than just the neurons firing.

[@actiaint]

Consciousness is shared - check out learning field experiments with rats - ask yourself why children today are born instinctively knowing how to use tech thier grandparents couldnt imagine.

[@billmilosz]

If quantum effects provide computation advantages, it seems logical that evolution would use these advantages. In fact, if quantum computation is the huge advance that some technologists claim it is, then it would be odd indeed if evolution did NOT make use of it. The universe is demonstrably "non classical" so why should brains be restricted to classical mechanics?

[@phloopy5630]

Just because something is advantageous doesn’t mean evolution will produce it- some things are too complex or would require too high a tradeoff to develop. A great example is wheels. No animals on the planet use wheels for locomotion, because it’s just impossible for them to work biologically. You can’t make an infinitely rotating joint that doesn’t disconnect somewhere. Another example is lasers. If you could cook prey with lasers, that would be pretty awesome and advantageous!! Unfortunately, the things that would need to be developed first to then create a bio laser are initially detrimental, and so evolution will almost never take that route.

[@osmosisjones4912]

Cellular have our networks

[@billmilosz]

@@phloopy5630 Well, bacteria have rotating flagella. The structure that drives them is known as a motor. So that seems to be the example that invalidates your notion that "You can’t make an infinitely rotating joint that doesn’t disconnect somewhere." And I don't see that there would be an advantage to wheeled beetles vs beetles with legs, so I don't think evolution would select wheels instead of legs. Evolution finds advantage, and I don't think that wheels provide that advantage.

[@jayxhuit6000]

@@phloopy5630 but nature has produced tasers, quite efffective ones at that. Laser woild only be to add some range to it 🤷‍♂️ See ya next saturday! *turns and leaves running*

[@phloopy5630]

@@billmilosz I’ve looked up the rotating flagella, and as it turns out, the flagella *is* disconnected from the membrane (though held in place with membranes it rotates against), so my point still stands. As for wheels being less efficient than legs… I think that is false. If it were the case, our cars would move with legs. Rotating ring structures that use friction against the ground and their outer face for locomotion (as a wheel does) simply don’t exist in the animal kingdom, though synthetic ones seem to be everywhere in our machines.

[@joejones3042]

Mysticism/theology/consciousness/quantum entanglement thinking has been around for quite a while. The work of Marja de Vries and Amit Goswami have both independently done an excellent job of relating the implications of consciousness + quantum phenomena with pretty much everything else. It is great fun to live in a time when such divergent thinking is "merging" to better understand the ultimate truth. Thanks for this excellent video.

[@alottaguala9766]

Oohhh this was an exciting one, as a 25 year old who fears neurological disease (and is curious about consciousness) I hope this bread crumb leads somewhere big!

[@JoshKaneTalks]

Why would you fear a neurological disease specifically? Especially given that if you had a severe brain injury you likely wouldn't even remember that fear, so you're only making yourself suffer in the meantime for no benefit. Just relax! :p

[@CampingforCool41]

⁠As someone who has a panic disorder, it gives you a taste of how much your brain can mess with perception and make life a living hell. They are right to be afraid of neurological diseases. A brain injury that makes you forget everything is not the same thing as a progressive disease like Alzheimer’s. I’ve seen the effects of that too, and it’s terrifying. The idea of even forgetting the coping mechanisms you’ve learned over your life to deal with the fear and paranoia that comes with a disease like Alzheimer’s. Yes, that is terrifying.

[@JoshKaneTalks]

@CampingforCool41 What you've said makes no sense. You're afraid of living miserably in the future so therefore you are going to live miserably now worrying about something that hasn't even happened yet? I can promise you you're problem is you isolate yourself and think too much. Please talk to others more and do more, for your own sake and others.

[@CampingforCool41]

@@JoshKaneTalks Have you ever had a panic disorder before? A psychotic episode? There are things no amount of socializing are gonna fix because the brain is going to do what it’s going to do. It’s called mental illness for a reason. My point is, there is legitimate reason to be scared of Alzheimer’s. And yeah it’s great and all to not worry about the future but when you know you have a high likelihood of genetically inheriting it it’s pretty hard not to worry about.

[@JoshKaneTalks]

@CampingforCool41 I have incurable chronic health illnesses and have had severe general anxiety at childhood. As an adult I'm not going to worry about my future because it isn't guaranteed for anyone. It is illogical. Simple math. When you were born no one promised you a certain amount of time or said life was serious. You're doing it to yourself brother. I've been there. Go outside. Do things. Keep busy by doing things for others especially. You're promised as much as everyone else.

[@meenki347]

Anton, thanks so much. I'm writing something from yet another angle on the same subject. And Quantum Consciousness, along with Sabine's recent show on emergence, have totally filled in the last missing puzzle pieces. I'm so happy today. Thanks for all your passion and effort, while raising great kids at the same time.

[@Autism101]

I’m glad you decided to wait to cover this topic and highlight the new study. I had learned about it elsewhere, but it is really interesting stuff. There is so much we don’t yet understand.

[@jonaseggen2230]

A psychologist I know often says that he thinks medicine and psychology will merge into one subject or field in the future. I partly disagree as I think the fragmentation of the different sciences is here to stay, for a while at least... but I also think that new synaptic connections between the different sciences will happen more often and get more and more attention, support etc, from now on.

[@adamconner9302]

@@jonaseggen2230 No, they are right, we misunderstand so many things in certain fields because we don't see the truth. The fields of study are connected, it can only be seen by those with the eyes to see the truth because this truth lies hidden outside the light in the dark places. We have been tricked, we have been lied to intentionally, and in bathing in the lie we are we lose the eyes to see the truth. I have become the physical manifestation of that truth as somehow all of you have flowed into me and lifted the veil and given me the eyes to see the truth. In knowing, in becoming aware of the truth, my individuality, my life is forfeit. I seek the voice to spread the truth and root out the lie that plagues us all. I am you and you are me. We are part of a greater whole. I cry out to be heard before we venture into the next catastrophe caused by the lie.

[@alanpeterson6863]

I am an anesthesiologist and neuroscientist, and this is just goofballs making stuff up. Its like claiming the radio makes a car work... um, okay, sure.👍🏼🤣

[@jonaseggen2230]

@@alanpeterson6863 If you say so

[@dpraptorP]

As someone who had been listening to people who had died and were resuscitated for over 20 years, I know that our consciousness is not in the brain. Even people missing large parts of their brains lose nothing. When you die, you leave this body and go back home, most people who died say this life was just like reading a book, or a play you participated in, or even an old coat you discard, you regard it fondly, but move on. You are only here to learn, experience and have goals you set before you come here. Listen to people who died and see what they say. They are the ONLY people qualified to talk about what happens to our consciousness when we die.

[@theartist4557]

I truly believe our souls/spirits are created by God. Since the spirit is not material how can anyone study it?

[@mushroom11g55]

But the problem is, they didn't die though. If they died they wouldn't come back. If we were able to revive a TRUE DEATH than yes.

[@hogweedblitz8739]

@@mushroom11g55 Obviously, you know absolutely nothing about what these people experience and what happened to them, as well as the condition of their body. There are instances of people waking up in morgues a day after they were declared dead and brought to the morgue. So yea, they were physically dead. I would advise doing some reading about NDE's and learn something so you can actually comment on something you know something about.

[@hogweedblitz8739]

@@mushroom11g55 If you listen to what people say when they cross over, many of them are given a choice, they are told they can stay or go back (although many more people say they were not given a choice, and they cried and begged not to be sent back here, but were forcibly "pushed" back in their bodies, pretty much against their will), and if they say they want to stay, they are shown what will happen to their families/friends and loved ones if they stay, so many of the people who had this experience chose to return here. You really need to do some reading/listening to what people who did die, they talk about what happened, and their are many millions of people all over the world who have reported this, more and more each day as we are able to bring people back after their bodies have completely shut down (if that is what it is, doctors declare them dead when their heart stops and brain function stops). I like to say most people don't believe in NDE's until they have one. Check out Harvard neurosurgeon Dr Eben Alexander, he thought just like you. There are dozens of medical doctors who devote much of their time now researching this, many of them had NDE's, and there are many more scientists and other medical professionals who are taking this very seriously, and for a very good reason. I grew up studying science and biology, and was an atheist for most of my life, but in the last 20 years I have spent a lot of time reading about this, and now have no doubt whatsoever about what we are and where we go when we die. The evidence (although anecdotal) is overwhelming.

[@F90M5]

@@hogweedblitz8739In your opinion, what is our purpose here then, specificially, to learn what? Be kind to others? Treat others equally (animals don’t, even to their own kind) Being helpful? Being honest? Procreating a must? Invent something? I’m still trying to figure it out. My fear is to do something or focus/shift my effort into something which may not be significant enough to accomplish my “experience” here.

[@roemischer]

Whoa, that is mindblowing! I'm hyped to get more updates on this.

[@osmosisjones4912]

Cells out self individual neurons process information

[@justaride7444]

I cancan spoil it for you. It will 99% sure evolve into being wrong. There is actual research rewarding with actual scientific proof whereas all other consc hypothesis from the last 30 years, this included, have not produced a single shred of evidence on anything tangible re: Consc. The underlying problem is that all theories and studies in every field of any science, soft or hard assume spacetime ie our universe is fundamental and the start their study, do the guesswork within, and end their study (in consc study concludes we have no idead how to study any of these in a scientifcal satisfying manner. It's been shown in physics our spacetime is neither real reality nor fundamental in any way, thus many hypotheses are moot just from that fact alone because the theory starts,continues and ends within spacetime and all conclusions are done within spacetime with outdated and sometimes outright fraudulent people, followin a status quo .. Not talking in general but for example topics such as consciousness etc. Intangible things we dont understand in any way but still most

[@rxbracho]

Let's be clear, what Penrose argues is that understanding cannot be algorithmic and thus produced by computation. This is a direct result of Gödel's Incompleteness Theorems, and the corollary is that AI will never be able to understand what it does and be intelligent. This is why I call AI: Artificial Ideation. Secondly, nobody is ditching out the computational nature of neural networks. Hameroff and Penrose argue that there is quantum computing in addition to algorithmic computing in the brain. Where both go astray is in their materialistic insistence that consciousness must be generated by the brain. What they are discovering is the interface between consciousness and the brain, or rather, how consciousness manifests itself in the physical brain. Alas, it will take a few more years before science runs head-on into the wall where it's heading and is forced to admit that consciousness is more fundamental than matter. For that, follow the work of Donald Hoffman.

[@lucid6891]

👏👏👏 This, completely.

[@josephang9927]

I found it so weird waking up to surgery... No time passed.

[@pierrotA]

It's the same as a blackout after an head trauma or an abuse of alcohols, the brain somewhat "pause" consciousness, unless when sleeping where most functions still work but got blocked. On the video subject, I think most of the people that refuse the idea that an AI can be conscious are opposed to materialism (the idea that we are only veru complex machine, and that soul do not exist). If we create a conscious AI, it would prove that we are only machines.

[@robertmccoy9323]

Or you know you are going to be out for a couple of hours, but you still ask 'What day is it?'

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

We get a little of that each night during slow wave dreamless sleep and in nonwestern meditation the logical question is who are we during these moments? We are not just a biological machine that "turns on" in the morning when we wake up. So obviously our true consciousness is NOT our awareness of spacetime - and from that logical inference is then a logical inquiry pursued. Feynman tried this out but as he became aware of his dreams then he gave up since he dismissed his dreams as meaningless associations. In fact our dreams are based on our subconscious learning but in nonwestern meditation when we become conscious beyond our dreams - then this is called Turiya or a fourth state of awareness. Hameroff discusses this in his article on Free Will - his most read science paper - calling it the "Zone" for extreme athletes whereby external perception of time slows down while internal frequency of energy goes up. Of course the athlete appears to be moving faster by other external observers - so you get a relativistic quantum effect in the Zone. Penrose discusses this also for extreme musicians as well like classical pianists - saying that precognition is inherent to protoconsciousness as nonlocality - it's on the "Science of Consciousness" conference youtube channel.

[@pikiwiki]

same like a movie

[@josephang9927]

@@robertmccoy9323 sure, but I would not say it is the same. When you sleep you know that SOME time passed. You may have had even dreams and so on. But after anesthesia, it feels like traveling time to a few hours to the future in an instant.

[@nealehanvey4825]

Absolutely fascinating presentation of this hypothesis and emerging evidence. Raises all kinds of supplementary questions and potential lines of enquiry. Brilliant.

[@noisepuppet]

As always, I'm grateful for your patience in understanding and explaining these new areas of study. Articulating these ideas in plain language takes a lot of work, and you have a particular knack for it. It's interesting to think that our experience might arise in a sort of interface between what we see as two separate classes of phenomena-- macroscopic processes like gravitation and the infinitesimal world described by quantum theory. And that interface might physically consist of a biological architecture based on microtubules... I mean, this kind of proposition has seemed intuitively satisfying for decades, but it's kind of breathtaking to think scientists could be on the verge of narrowing it down to this particular structure and even modeling how it works. Anyway, thanks for the work you do, it's important.

[@srb20012001]

Great presentation of a highly technical subject for the lay community. Kudos Anton.

[@classreductionist]

I remember talking to a coworker in the medical field who had previously worked closely with anesthesiologists and he talked about how weird it was that there was a chemical/gas they could just give you that turned your brain off.

[@daveloya6510]

Do people dream while under the gas?

[@i-never-look-at-replies-lol]

so a chemical/gas can overwhelm the very quantum properties of the brain huh?

[@SahilP2648]

​@@i-never-look-at-replies-lol not overwhelm, the neurons lose quantum coherence. It's like turning off a very large interconnected system at every point, like a transistor of a CPU, off all at once. Quantum coherence is what leads to consciousness as per Orch OR.

[@DeveloperToast]

@@daveloya6510 I dreamt while being under for surgery. In fact, I woke up in the midst of it and began telling one of the nurses about my dream. Turns out you can have a high tolerance for anesthetics.

[@anonymes2884]

Except your brain _isn't_ "turned off" under anaesthetic, it's just in a different state (your _mind_ is arguably "turned off" but one of my issues with many people's takeaway from this result is, those are categorically NOT the same things and given that how minds arise from brains is still almost entirely mysterious to us, results about one _barely_ relate to the other). As Anton says in other words, interesting as it is this tells us basically _nothing_ about consciousness beyond that, assuming the result stands, it's now not considered _physically impossible_ for it to be a quantum phenomenon. To me that's a pretty low bar to clear.

[@MrTerftw]

if electromagnetism has treatment affects, one can also assume the opposite, so in theory we can say that all the tech around us definitely has some biological implications on us.

[@eric_montag]

Yes! I’m so thrilled you are covering consciousness Anton! ❤❤❤ I can’t wait to watch.

[@justaride7444]

Should cover the actual work getting actual evidence, not imaginatory unprovable stuff like penrose and all others in psych pretty much who are still living in the last millennium with their neverending fantasy hypothesis

[@isaacdalziel5772]

It seems logical to me that almost any phenomenon will be quantum by nature - just as almost any phenomonon will be by nature affected by gravity, or the electromagnetic force.

[@samikatto2851]

by definition they are. the only difference between these tubules and any other activity is that we can measure them because the connection is longer. it is very hard to have measurements of chaotic interactions and get maningful data from it. most of modern science communication is nothing more than pop-science. this study has nothing to do with conciousness.

[@anonymes2884]

That "by nature" is doing a lot of heavy lifting though. Silicon chips for instance are "quantum by nature" in the sense you seem to mean (we can't understand or model them fully without quantum physics) but standard computers (using silicon chips) are still _classical_ "by nature". In other words yes, the classical world "arises" from quantum physics (the quantum description _is_ fundamentally how the universe works as far as we currently know) BUT it's still different _by nature_ (i.e. we don't see classical objects in quantum superpositions - cats are _either_ alive or dead :) - and we don't see Bell correlations - entanglement - between e.g. footballs).

[@samikatto2851]

@@anonymes2884 classical is simplyfied view of world similar to newton vs einstain. we cant find quantum superpisitions from chaos but that does not mean they are not there. you can take single interaction and follow causation to both direction and realize that uncontrolled chaos is impossibly complex. from the interaction to any amount of time forwards or backwards.

[@AnthOny-gl7lj]

I love the longer format! Keep it coming

[@alhira5098]

Idk why people are surprised about the brain being a quantum computer

[@ToxicallyMasculinelol]

thinking of the brain as a quantum computer is not right. you should finish watching the video, as he covers the distinction between computation and cognition. there is no evidence the brain is a quantum computer, as there is no evidence the brain is any kind of computer at all. consciousness may rely on quantum effects, but we know from behavior alone that it is vastly different from a computer. and what quantum effects are involved may merely be used to mediate the mind-body connection. there's a big difference between quantum mechanical models of consciousness, and quantum computers, which produce consistent outputs from inputs. there's no reason to think the brain works by a computational principle at all, and many reasons to think it doesn't. nothing about human consciousness resembles computation. even our ability to perform computation (like mental math) is very different from the function of a computer. when computing, rather than simulating behavioral indeterminacy on a deterministic system, people seem to simulate determinacy on an indeterminate system, using conscious awareness to "fuzzily" ensure correctness and check their work, rather than using physical law and programming to lead to an inexorable result. neural network models are probably much closer than computational models, but it's doubtful they are correct either, as there's no reason to believe a neural network would spontaneously develop conscious experience of its processes or inputs. whatever principle underlies consciousness, it's fundamentally different from anything else we're familiar with, but neural networks definitely come a lot closer than computers, even quantum computers.

[@calex5591]

Im a psychiatrist and this is huge. Makes alot of senses that it could work this way better esp more as a symphony than a computer bc this is what you see phenomenologically clinically. Depression, anxiety, OCD, ADHD definitely have these symphonic characteristics. Our term, “cognitive dissonance” which is a great and accurate descriptive term really resonates (no pun intended) with the symphonic idea.

[@Nah_Bohdi]

Collective intelligence, look up Michael Levin's work in it. My work is on the organ portion to whole peron and globe, his works are (sub)cellular to whole organism. Lots of overlaps in our works.

[@adamconner9302]

@@Nah_Bohdi Our intelligence is not our own. Our ego hides the truth from us. There is a fabric of consciousness undergirding the physical reality in which we reside. This collective consciousness flows into all of us. It is our meager awareness of this consciousness that produces man's intellect. Some have a bit more unconscious awareness of this consciousness, and they are the minds that push us forward and help us grow, not in numbers but in awareness. This is the true origin of that spark of brilliance. Your intellect is not your own but all of us speaking through you. The truth is known, and it seeks to be heard. One piece to the puzzle yet remains, the truth must find a voice so loud that all can hear it. Be filled with joy for the truth has an unshakable faith in you, and it will find a way to make us whole again.

[@dranlan8093]

Could this point to the possible existence of the soul?

[@adamconner9302]

@@dranlan8093 The soul is real, there is a part of us that will subside back into the fabric of consciousness undergirding our physical reality when we pass. In this capacity we all will live on

[@WynnofThule]

​@@dranlan8093Depends on what a soul even is or is supposed to be

[@raftastrock]

Very interested in any future videos on this, Anton! Thank you for sharing the research and explaining it so well!

[@mariuszmoraw3571]

Let's be honest. Quantum or not, brains are one of the greatest tools nature invented via evolution. From simple one cell organisms to complicated animals with miliards of specialized cells, built into one big hive. And all of that evolution created us. It's amazing and demands our greatest respect.

[@inmyworld97]

Pure Consciousness does that job. I don't know what to say. Your entire physical reality is only a mirror that includes even thoughts and concepts. Even though you are fascinated by only a creation. You should be more fascinated by the creator. You will get a glimpse of what is your true nature.

[@SiriProject]

This reminds me of the prophets of the psychedelic movement like Terence McKenna: fractals, triptamines, consciousness and quantum statesl. I see these kind of explainations more literary than scientific, but the mere implication that the rearrangement of different elements in fractal or organized forms can produce quantum effects that they can't produce by themselves on an individual level is crazy. Also, this would explain why subtances such as DMT have such potent and dramatic effects on consciousness.

[@1Cr0w]

As you mentioned, but i want to highlight again: *Microtubules are everywhere* , they are essential for cell functioning, whether in the liver or the brain. In neurons, they serve among all their other functions *to transport neurotransmitters to the synapses* . It is not really surprising that there are quantum effects in these proteins (or enzymes, really). It is however a stretch to thus conclude that consciousness "is quantum" (whatever that may mean). That's similar to claiming that consciousness is proton-based (bc. H+ ions play an important role in the mitochondrial respiratory chain that is needed for the brain to operate, and also pH-levels are important to cell functioning) -- technically true, but beside the point.

[@mikepatnode4407]

There are over 80 benzine rings in each a and b protein making up mt's. There are other proteins that connect those proteins in 2, 3, 4, 5, 6's. Some connect them in hexagonal forms, for supposed long term memories. They produce frequencies, within frequencies, within frequencies, in higher and lower orders. Sounds like signals and codes to me.

[@1Cr0w]

@@mikepatnode4407 If you hit a tree log with a hammer, it produces frequencies within frequencies, in higher and lower orders. This in itself does not mean that these frequencies are relevant to understanding the tree. They may still be informative, and do reflect the shape and material properties of the tree, which reflect the life history of the tree, making them "long term memories", if you really want them to be. A railway has acoustic properties, but those are not what it's used for. The relevant question here is: Is this an epiphenomenon/biologically relevant --- are they in fact signals, as in: received and decoded somehow, or are they simply properties of a system that does other things with the structure that happens to also have these properties. And then a follow up question of course is: If they serve a biological function, which one is it? And why don't the microtubules in the cells of the liver or the spleen implement consciousness through their quantum effects?

[@anonymes2884]

This. It's an interesting result (assuming it stands) but right now we don't understand how minds arise from brains which means what's physically going on in the brain is only linked by correlation - and assumption - to consciousness. There's a mechanistic gap (maybe more a chasm in fact :) between the brain and the (seemingly not even physical) mind and at the moment it seems verging on unbridgeable, which this result doesn't change. (although i'd say that up until around 20 years ago it _would_ have been very surprising - as noted in the video, cells were thought to be "too hot and wet" for quantum coherence and though we've seen evidence for it in other chemical pathways, direct evidence for it happening in the brain does close off _one_ - IMO fairly minor - "loophole" against consciousness being a fundamentally quantum phenomenon)

[@mikepatnode4407]

@@1Cr0w of course nobody knows what consciousness is. But I think it is feelings. If you get shot in an organ it hurts, and hurts there. The pain, how it happend,when it happened is stored in the brain. I don't think you can bring back that pain, other then you stands to reason it's inside of neurons, (in dendrites coming in and going out/ axons just going out.) Have a better chance of creating and dispersing it

[@luna5031]

Hi ​@@1Cr0wthanks for sharing. I wouldn't go as far as to say that it's impossible and out of the question that the microtubules in liver may effect into consciousness through their quantum effects. All the best, take care ❤

[@MichaelP833]

the ability to externally identify consciousness could lead to some scary revelations about many things just some ideas: -when death actually occurs -when life begins -animals, especially those used for food -cultivated neurons on chips -and eventually maybe even applying to AI and rights for artificially created beings either way, it will be interesting to see where people go with overlaps of scientific understandings of consciousness with religious/spiritual understandings

[@lijohnyoutube101]

That is interesting that you equate life with a layer of internal thinking. I don’t think this is a prediction of ‘life’ very well at all. Plant life has reactions and awareness but it’s different than humans. No one method makes plants any more or less alive than humans.

[@flor.7797]

what if everything is consciousness?

[@kathrynck]

true.

[@MichaelP833]

@@lijohnyoutube101 you kind of proved my point of "it will be interesting to see where people go" i dont know how to define the difference between human life, animal life, plant life, bacterial/virus life, ai life, and even npc life. i guess mentioning "when life begins" was overly referencing something people are discussing a lot. but can you argue that it wouldnt be scary if we found that consciousness continued well beyond what we currently refer to as brain death? i also have serious anxieties to do with general anaesthetics. but i didnt mention that in my list as it was already referenced in the video. your interpretation of what i said seems to suggest i believe that people under general anaesthetic are not alive. i am curious about your wording replacing 'consciousness' with "a layer of internal thinking".

[@lijohnyoutube101]

@@MichaelP833 I don’t view ‘life beginning’ I guess in some manners as something relative to a holistic life experience as having that much importance. It’s more of a philosophical debate bit one that doesn’t have that tremendous of importance. Life is merely a collection of chemical reactions and that subset of reactions have gradual shifts from overall collective reactions to demonstrate what is viewed as ‘life’. Mainly to have growth, to be able to reproduce, and demonstrate functional activity. Being ‘conscious’ is just going to have differences along a continuum of how that exists or not in a given being. I guess I just don’t think it’s really of much importance. I think the QUALITY of the life is of way more significance. Defining one aspect of being a ‘life’ as being somehow representative of ‘life’ is just silly and so arbitrary I think it lacks significant importance. It’s just all chemistry. Its like asking at what point does a building become a house? The home dug? The first drop of concrete for the basement foundation, the last drop? When additional materials are added? Which ones? If a roof is on? Plumbing? Electricity? At the end of the day it’s just a collective of many materials with many stages of development and there are many types of homes etc. is it fun to talk about, sure but it’s sort of silly as well. Is a few bricks on an external wall of a home versus an electric wire in a given room really going to change it from a home to not? It also doesn’t really matter if it’s a sunflower or a bear or a human or a blade of grass. It’s all just chemistry, it’s not like it’s magical, mysterious or something of consuming importance. You can draw biochem equations and have respect and joy for the processes and perhaps even some awe but it really just ends up being equations that we made up silly narratives around as simple ideas fit well with a largely very very uneducated planet populace even among the so called ‘intelligent’ life on this planet. Bottom line consciousness has no true importance or value it’s just a silly concept of arbitrary designation and it doesn’t determine (nor the degree of it) nor really have any reality to being or not being’a life’.

[@Romazetti]

I like to think that our brains is just a signal receiver and controlling unit for our body, and our consciousness is stored somewhere beyond this universe.

[@TheOmniGameDev]

There were philosophers who wrotr much more in depth about how the brain is a transceiver for consciousness

[@ramachandransankar750]

​@@TheOmniGameDevAny book

[@nedo68]

we may indeed be immortal, at least our consciousness

[@mike42441]

My thoughts exactly!

[@MsBoris66]

Same thoughs

[@AbsoluteHierophany]

finally, you arrived at the conversation I was waiting for you to discuss. good job mate

[@ArcadiyIvanov]

"Quantum effects" and "Body-temperature Quantum Entanglement" are not the same things!! Quantum dot LEDs and tunnel diodes are all working at room and higher temperatures with "quantum effects" but none of it brings closer or suggests "entanglement".

[@grugnotice7746]

I thought anesthesia blocked pain signal transmission, which almost always also blocks neural signalling as well. If it is as simple as these little tubes, it shouldnt be all that difficult to replicate it. Could hand us body temp quantum computers on a silver platter AND give us conscious ASI, potentially again, for cheap.

[@slanglabadang]

Removing consciousness and removing pain sensation are actually 2 different parts of the anastheasia procedure. You dont always have both, for example brain surgery where they ask the patient to play an instrument at the same time in order to make sure if the doctors hit something tbey can fix it right away. Also sometimes patient are unconscious but theg feel everything because the opiate or wtv failed

[@AbsurdAsparagus]

the fact that they have quantum effects with uv light alone may give up room temp quantum computers.

[@MikeWiest]

Not so easy …but it will happen!

[@nycbearff]

The enzymes in your cells use quantum tunneling - quantum effects are pervasive in biology. Quantum computers are completely different things, using entangled qbits, and we have no idea how to make them work at body temp. So no silver platters here.

[@alisonberry8404]

This is a very interesting piece, and the graphics are an excellent compliment to your narrative. I believe that resonance is also part of the biological mechanism of Chloroplasts in photosynthesis. It would be interesting to look at that and compare.

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

Alison, did you know that JS Bach wrote this Goldberg Variations for a Count Goldberg who couldn't sleep. Bach's remedy for the Count's insomnia was 30 variations in the key of A. (I myself see A an an electric blue. Musical here). Therefore, the idea is not only that the frequency of A might have anesthetic properties related to consciousness/unconsciounsess, but the fact that A432 scientific tuning being relative to Sacred Geometry makes prefect sense if you think of microtubules as crystal structures.

[@homebuddha]

Schumann Resonance

[@PhillyAnthonyD]

*complement

[@homebuddha]

@@PhillyAnthonyD you spell compliment different to us? Is that American spelling?

[@PhillyAnthonyD]

@@homebuddha No. Compliment and complement are two different words, and they mean different things. In the context of what she wrote, complement is the correct word.

[@justinmuto4622]

This is mind blowing or conscious expanding, love it . Thanks for sharing. Your episodes you put out are great i cant believe you find the time for all us Thank you again.

[@baraharonovich2926]

Wow that’s literally mind blowing! I always suspected it’s quite likely that consciousness is related to quantum physics but understanding the actual mechanisms and it’s implications for biology, philosophy, technology, medicine, neuroscience etc are huge! I hope this gets us one step closer to solving the hard problem of consciousness!

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

If you read Hameroff's most read science paper on the secret of Free Will - that solves the Hard Problem. But it's when you realize that Penrose's "Negative resonance" is actually noncommutativity as precognition then you get into really wild paranormal nonlocal properties first realized by Olivier Costa de Beauregard.

[@alanpeterson6863]

I am a board certified anesthesiologist and neuroscientist. What you and many people are missing here is that consciousness is very well understood already, and in my profession I manipulate it with great precision and control on a daily basis. Human consciousness is the result of hundreds of billions of synapses firing between neurons, the flow of electromagnetic voltage potentials and complex neurochemical signaling, all of which are very well understood in extreme detail. Two things that aren't understood are the philosopher's use of the WORD consciousness, and the emergent network effects of hundreds of billions of neurons firing recursively. This is a desperate ploy to wedge magical-seeming quantum effects into neurosience for no apparent reason other than it "seems cool". The brain doesn't need to be quantum to be fascinating.

[@baraharonovich2926]

@@alanpeterson6863I don’t disagree I’m certainly under qualified to argue with you (: But I think the general problem is just understanding what consciousness actually is in terms of the “being” of the phenomenon. Because it seems important to be able to say wether one thing or another is conscious in the way we understand it as a subjective experience that is at least somewhat aware that it is a subjective “being” and has some form of a self. If we could understand this better and determine if something is conscious and to what degree it is conscious it would have major implications on Philosophy for example specifically ethics in particular. The other “problem” that people are interested in is understanding the actual construction of the organism better to the point where we could potentially solve actual problems we couldn’t before such as medical conditions like Alzheimer that are mentioned in the video. It is possible that this means nothing or that it would have major implications on our understanding of the human organism and the brain one would have to wait and see but saying we already know everything and there’s nothing more to learn and discover when actual problems we are unable to solve still exist seems self defeating and honestly a bit lazy.

[@blakesmith4879]

This is your best video of the year! THANK YOU for finally covering this topic!!!

[@gavo007]

ORCH-OR is one of the most exciting theories out there. A breakthrough in this arena is needed and perhaps this is it?

[@mikestaub]

Imagine not taking Roger Penrose seriously. The fact that Tryptophan is so similar to DMT is also very intriguing as both seem to be involved in sleep, dreaming, and altered consciousness. Maybe the "tunnel and light" people go through during a NDE is a microtubule?

[@Nicolau_Flamel]

As someone who has out of body experiences since I was a kid I can testimony that it could be the case. The projection sometimes happens through “the tube” and it kinda feels like some quantum tunneling process. I say it feels like cause the sensation - again - sometimes, is that I’m shrinking or “diving” inwards. It’s definitely not just me there’s a vast literature on it. Some say the tunnel is the very Ajna chakra itself. Also it’s a lot easier if I’m really tired or sleepy. And the pineal gland definitely has to do with it since something in the center of my skull can vibrate (also documented by thousands of people) like a tuning fork in a deafening high pitch when the process starts.

[@esnobofficial]

Ningun físico profesional toma enserio su propuesta al explicar la consciencia desde la cuantica

[@ChaadFairservice20022]

^^ yes, the loud ringing and folding into onself.

[@justaride7444]

MAybe it is a microtubule. Or a funny straw landing you directly in papa smurfs smurf brew. Imagine taking penrose seriousyl, he's a genius, but he's so old he can't seem to incorporate field destroying new evidence into his never to be proven right or wrong imaginatory hypothesis. WHo wouldn't love a dude thats full of ideas but none of the are even testable if they work. Real hero of a scientist . But, i'm not one to criticize, but i will. He is clearly a genius, just after a bazillion years in uni etc he has not only absordeb all the dogma that is seeping out of the ceilings but was born in it, moulded by it. You know the quote better than me i'm sure.... I refuse to believe he is unaware of the cutting edge research producing actual evidence for the first time re: consc. so either he's too old to grasp it, too tired to start his career a new essentially and will leave it to the smarter next gen, he is in it only for book sales and his tenure, or he won't get grant money because while more legitimate scientifically than anything of penroses i häve encountered i could see how that would make him yet again introduce his shitty so microwaveoven tubules. again.Almost all of the above would make him really disingenuous if not a grifter even. He seems to think his tubule idea is somekinda revolutionary breakthrough but all the 's said is maybe it emerges from these tubes i observe when i crack open askull. That's it, or is there some actual science behind this, as in maths to prove it, predecent studies/casies with such, an argument one can logically follow to at least pretend to think he's not full of shit (in this case and field)? . In truth the probability of him being able to seem slim to none, the probability of it being his only idea and him clinging on to it till death being exponentially higher. But that's just my opinion

[@tedarcher9120]

Triptophan is used for loads of stuff in the body, it's one of the most common aminoacids

[@pawbard]

Beautiful video. Explained in depth. Great info and presentation.

[@stephenbrickwood1602]

Excellent video, now we know what and where to think about this. Obviously in the brain for thinking, but what is the thing in the brain at the heart of this.

[@johnnyvee3339]

I think I suggested this in your comments (or mail?) a long time ago. Thx for doing a video on it!

[@themollerz]

This is insanely interesting. I am glad you covered it!

[@vibewithme2318]

Maybe there will start to be less of a stigma against studying and experimenting with consciousness

[@osmosisjones4912]

Fetus's have more brain activity more stimulation then adults are babies more conscious then adults

[@idonotlikethismusic]

Who said there’s stigma right now?

[@adamcummings20]

​@@idonotlikethismusicAmong physicists maybe. But yeah not so much stigma in other fields looking at our brains

[@vibewithme2318]

@@idonotlikethismusic I mean..... A lot of people....I don't agree with it. At all. I think it should be studied and taken seriously just like quantum mechanics and gravity. You can just KZbin search it and listen to a lot of people talk about it. There are plenty of videos and comments on it. There are plenty recently

[@kathrynck]

That would be a plus.

[@jimcurtis9052]

Wonderful as always Anton. Thank you. 🙏🫡✌️

[@liammhodonohue]

I've long been thinking about quantum in biology. I left physics behind a long time ago. My knowledge is barely high school level so this stuff was very abstract/conceptual to me. I remain(ed) mindful there must be quantum in biology. I'm a biologist (diagnostic biomedical scientist in neurology hospital). Mentions of tryptophan and microtubules sparked my attention, along with "simple experiment" maybe this is something i can contribute to? I even bumped into a classmate from university at the train station... he's an anaesthetist.

[@straycursor5562]

A funny thing I noticed is tryptophanes are very similar to tryptamines which are basically psychedelics. Given all the positive research happening in that area and the trip reports I read. It's an interesting idea how these 2 compounds interact and how it relates to the ideas proposed in this video. I hope someone studies psychedelics in that light because it could change the world

[@benayers8622]

different vehicles to the same destination... ❤️ sleep meditation or other methods can be slower harder to learn without a teacher but still get you there.. It seems the cia gateway method uses sound to break through, i favor K personally as its safe clean non toxic and has a strong neuroprotective effect but its not always easy to get real K these days (wonder why lol)

[@lisaalexander1824]

They ALREADY are changing the world....hang in there gang, 2 more generations should see us on the upward projection...just gotta slow the doomsday clock🎉