Final ZE3000 vs HiFiMan TWS800 vs Edifier NeoBuds Pro - Audiophile TWS Earbuds Battle

[@CJDilag]

You should do more TWS/wireless reviews/impressions, Lachlan. Great to see you do these type of products aside from the usual ones. These products were typically frowned upon in the hobby several years ago. Companies, both mainstream and not-so-mainstream, have levelled up the past couple of years in terms of aesthetics, specs, features, build quality, and sound quality. Plenty of choices in the market especially the budget to mid bracket.

[@PassionforSound]

I'm definitely happy to do more, but they continue to perform poorly which suggests less interest in the compared to my other content. I'll try to find a good balance.

[@Berkanann]

Nice. It would have been interesting to include the KEF MU3. Surprisingly good sounding and balanced TWS with the best comfort I tried. I like them a lot more than any Sony or Sennheiser TWS. The KEF is also the smallest.

[@PassionforSound]

I wasn't aware of the Kefs (and therefore didn't have any to compare). Thanks for letting me know about them

[@HiFiGOAudio]

Excellent review! Informative and to the point. TWS are catching up with IEM+tws adapters.

[@PassionforSound]

Thank you. Glad you liked it and you're right!

[@ubacow7109]

Conclusion final audio wins here. Edifier was interesting and hifiman was a mess.

[@PassionforSound]

I still really like the Edifier and Final options. They're both excellent in their own ways

[@josephchamberlain3681]

I think covering TWS earbuds is a good idea. Outside the audiophile community these types of products are sold a lot more these days.

[@PassionforSound]

That's true. Sadly, the performance of these videos always lag a long way behind my others.

[@josephchamberlain3681]

@@PassionforSound ya, I think because the target for these products is less to the audiophile community a video like this has to be framed as audiophile brands compared to more household names. Bose. Sony. Etc. With price to performance being the driver.

[@PassionforSound]

Exactly. I'm trying to be selective about which models I accept for review to only get the audiophile specific products

[@GadZookz]

Thanks for the great video. Now that Final and HiFiMan have some new price-breaking TWS buds on the market, do you have any plans to review them?

[@PassionforSound]

No plans as yet. I might get the HiFiMans, but the Final are uncertain

[@WorldView22]

Lachlan, I'm very excited that Final Audio has reached out to you! Since you asked, and speaking from experience, you should absolutely get your hands for review on the *E5000* earphones/IEMs and *Sonorous VI* headphones from Final; they are both high-end audio products with superb industrial design and their price is great for what they offer; i.e., a very natural, supreme actually, very sophisticated and FR-balanced sound. Happy to provide tips on best configuration for both, if you wish. Best regards.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for the tips on which products to ask about next!

[@yooanto9465]

How is the sound of e5000?

[@PassionforSound]

I can't say yet - still trying to get a reply from Final ☹️

[@yoditonugrahacky765]

ZE3000 or Airpods Pro for sound quality only?

[@PassionforSound]

I haven't tried the Airpods - sorry!

[@guybuddy1]

ZE3000 all the way, although if you like strong bass, get the Airpods.

[@heavynova]

The ultimate TWS is a Centrance hifi M8V2 with your favorite headphones. Just duct tape the unit to the headband

[@PassionforSound]

Lol. Maybe make a custom helmet?

[@holykarmaaus]

Wishing You the Best of Luck to 100K subscribers! 👍

[@PassionforSound]

Thank you, Vicky!

[@ccdani2]

Edifier makes some really good producs , I have their speakers edifier Luna eclipse in my desktop setup and they are amazing , I'll have to check out their earbuds ! Thanks

[@PassionforSound]

I agree. I've been consistently impressed by Edifier lately

[@WildCJ5]

I would love to see a comparison/guide on closed back headphone for those still stuck working in corporate cubes.

[@PassionforSound]

I've got a bunch of closed back content coming soon including the DCA Aeon Noire, ZMF Verité Closed and the new Rode NTH-100. 🙂🙂

[@roopbhadury]

Love your reviews, Lachlan. Your vocal tone used to be more assertive before. Liked that a bit more than your current soothing tone :-) Your channel should be at 50K+ Good Luck!

[@sjqideez6626]

Lachlan, don’t listen to Roop ; ) You have a great voice, you should do audiobooks. Thanks again for this review, I really appreciate your depth & detail within your reviews.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks both. My "new" vocal tone is a result of my 2-year old son sleeping in the room next door. I probably don't need to speak that way anymore, but it's become a habit now 🙂

[@soulshinobi]

The audio for your voice in this one sounds really compressed

[@PassionforSound]

It's the same settings as every other video

[@Hari-kx2er]

Hai, This is an unrelated question to this video. Do you really believe in Headphone cables making a difference to the sound quality? I have seen you stating so in few of your videos such as the Arya stealth review and also in some comments.

[@PassionforSound]

I absolutely do. I've tried lots of different headphones with lots of different cables and they absolutely influence the sound (for better and worse).

[@Hari-kx2er]

@@PassionforSound Hmm..... Interesting. Do you think those cables were outlier example with huge difference in impedance values or something else to the stock cables? I am a cable sceptic and my personal experiments of trying out few different cables for 7hz Timeless or Hifiman Sundara did not bring out any sonic differences apart from a difference caused by going from SE to balanced. However that is more dependent upon the different amplification circuitry in the Amp in question. I mean, this rabbit hole is already deep. People usually look to create synergy between Headphones and Amps/Dacs. Now if cables cause sonic differences as well, it becomes a three way battle with Headphones, cables and Amps/Dacs.

[@PassionforSound]

In my experience, all cables make a difference. I can't always explain why (particularly for digital cables), but there are plenty of documented scientific factors including inductance, capacitance, impedance, the thickness of the wire (and therefore the depth at which different parts of the signal actually travels) to name a few. In other words, it's not a question of outliers so much as finding cables that are more similar or more different in these ways.

[@Hari-kx2er]

@@PassionforSound What you talked about are the various properties of iem cables. However, the only documented evidence of them affecting the sound quality of an iem is when the impedance value of the cable is very different to the iem causing changes in the frequency response. Similar to an impedance adapter. Another question. You have always clearly states that most headphones require power only in double digit milliwatts per impedance and even something like Susvara only needs 500mW @ 60 ohm. What other quality of the amplifier in your opinion makes desktop amps better sounding than dongle dacs most of which has more than enough power for most open back headphones (according to specs)? For example I find my Hifiman Edition XS sounds considerably better out of my Xduoo XA10 desktop dac/amp rather than my Cayin RU6 which I use for the Timeless alone. I am pretty sure you are not talking about ASR measurement battles 😊 Sorry for bombarding you with questions! Cheers and continue your work 👍

[@PassionforSound]

No problems about the questions and I can sort of answer them all in one go. The measurements we have available are focussed on single factors in most cases like distortion, frequency response, etc. What I think influences the sound of both cables and devices are the interactions of multiple factors. For example, in cables, the thickness and materials used can (according to physics) influence the speed at which different frequencies travel through the cable. That could influence the precise timing of when certain frequencies arrive - only by fractions of seconds, but our brains are extremely sensitive to timing (down to 4 micro seconds IIRC). Combine that with the influence of boundaries where there are impurities in the metal or different metals like copper with silver plating and you have another influence on how the signal travels through the wire and reaches the driver. All of this can alter how we perceive the sound even if it doesn't change impedance (which is also a factor). For another example, amplifiers have characteristics like slew rates that alter how quickly or slowly the amp responds to sudden changes in frequency. There's also intermodulation distortion that refers to how the noise floor of devices fluctuates with the audio signal. It's a tougher test and not one that gets published much, but is very important for how we perceive the sound. In short, there are so many factors that we can perceive, but we can't measure because we don't yet understand exactly how we perceive them. For example, we don't yet understand how the brain takes complex waveforms and unpacks them into all of the individual sounds that make up the whole. That means we can't measure it either. Hopefully that answers the questions (even though there are still more questions remaining as a result)

[@meltyou]

Well there's a couple more 2 driver tws that have audiophile tendencies. And what about noble fokus pro tws? You talked 40 minutes and didn't really cover a whole lot. xD Or the "soon" coming 6/18 driver tws.. Please do more tests.

[@PassionforSound]

I can only work with what I can get my hands on. The channel is still relatively small so I can afford to buy every possible option. I'll always accept people sending me products to review so you're welcome to contribute

[@valeccylinder8703]

did someone A B lypertek Z7 and final ze3000?

[@PassionforSound]

Not me 🙂

[@zeissiez]

Great review, as always 👍 👍 👍

[@PassionforSound]

Thank you!

[@mcsoh5924]

Final ze3000 compared with samsung buds pro, which one sounds better?

[@PassionforSound]

Buds Pro are weightier and can be bassier. ZE3000 is a bit more detail focussed with lovely treble quality. I probably lean towards the Buds Pro slightly, but it's more personal preference I think

[@SimpleMailWork]

I very like your reviews!

[@PassionforSound]

So glad you like them!

[@valeccylinder8703]

Well you forgot the lypertek z7, which should sound best of those

[@PassionforSound]

No, didn't forget anything - I can only review what I can get my hands on from retailers or manufacturers