Fixing a mistake & adding compound radius | Fretboard Design Masterclass (v2) | Fusion 360 Tutorial

[@Mister_G]

That parametric vertical fret idea is genius. Kudos to the dude that came up with it.

[@learnitalready]

This is a brilliant tutorial that teaches that a highly complex model can be completed easily with good research and forethought, mixed with a little thinking outside-the-box, and good use of parameters. Well done. Keep up the great work!

[@gsterneman]

Wow, what a difference. Two small changes that I made to my sketch: First, I dimensioned each fret from the nut [ Low_Scale_Length - ( Low_Scale_Length * ( Fret_Space_Constant ^ 2 ) )] as the second fret for example. This is the same formula you used for the vertical fret, and I don't end up with any recursiveness at all. The other change that I made in mine is that instead of setting the heel width as a parameter, I set the String Spacing at the Bridge. This way, I can set it based on the bridge/saddle and determine the heel from there. I can't thank you enough for these videos. I've been banging my head against this stuff for two years.

[@nickdegidio2544]

You are an awesome teacher. I've learned more about fusion then anywhere else. Great videos and presentation. Thank you!

[@henriqueluthieroficial]

To make the fret tang deth align to the fretboard radius, you can create 2 new circles in a offset to the freatboard radius already done, and lofting then intersecting with the freatboard, that way you make it fill the flat cut of the tang.

[@austinshaner]

This is super clever! Thank you! :)

[@alan4401]

Thanks for responding to our feedback. I have a busy day tomorrow. Next job is to create a nut with variable string diameters and different string spacing with either equal string centres, equal spaces between strings or user defined spaces between strings plus user defined distance from fretboard edge to outside of string, just thought I would mention this 😀 Again many thanks

[@austinshaner]

Sorry for the delayed reply Alan! Yes, string spacing, and edge gap, or bridge width and edge gap etc would be a more accurate way of defining this. I asked around a bit before making this tutorial and it was a bit of a mixed bag on what people would find most useful. Ultimately I felt that heel width would be most universal because common drawings from manufacturers include heel width - so many people are used to defining it this way - but if you ar ebuilding from scratch, having control over the string spacing directly could be extremely valuable. I'll likely making a v3 of this at some point to incorporate that.

[@wotanvolk287]

Thanks so much for these videos, great work. I found another way for the fret slotting part that maintains the radius at the bottom of the slot. Instead of a thin extrude simply draw out the shape, one line before the center running parallel, one line after running parallel, connect the tops of lines, connect the bottoms anchor to center line and do a normal extrude instead of thin. Keep tang inset at 0 or less and it works well. It adds a lot of drawing but it's effective.

[@DUY1337GUITAR]

When I modeled my multiscale fretboard, I set my scale length dimensions parallel to the high and low strings (so at an angle), whereas your measured scale lengths are horizontal. I did it this way thinking it would be more accurate, but maybe I was overthinking it? 😂It was tricky to set up. Wished I found your video before.

[@grandadsworkshop2455]

Thank you Austin. I've really been struggling trying to achieve anything of value, I built my own design of CNC (I have an engineering background) but have no experience of CAD or CAM and I'm desperate to use it to build a multi scale guitar for my Son these tutorials have helped enormously (Had to slow you down to 50% sometimes 😊) but my fretboard sketch came out with the same results as yours so I'm over the moon! Also learning about user parameters was a revelation. So again thankyou and all the best to you, your wife and little one in your new home

[@joelbennett9014]

Creating both end radii with constraints at the midpoint of the fretboard end lines so there's a straight plane down the center of the board is pretty much how it would be if someone were to manually form the radius with sanding blocks. Personally, I prefer creating a consistent fretboard edge by constraining the radii to the top corners of the fretboard end lines and lofting/joining the radius to the top of the main fretboard block. That little upward ramp it creates for the string plane (whilst using a single radius across the board) isn't significant enough to not be adjusted out by saddle height and/or truss rod adjustments if necessary. Anyway, very cool stuff - I'm using your fret slotting method from now on, much better than drawing each slot manually.

Many thanks for you efforts on the fretboard model - I learnt so much! As I like zero frets, I adjusted the fret spacings to include one, and a variable for the distance it is from the nut end of the board.

[@BartZuidemaGuitars]

Thanks a lot for your video. I made one change for the projected fret tang sketch ,i projected the variable offset sketch instead of the main sketch. In this way it is also possible to cnc the offset more easy. I will try and workout a nut ledge and compensating nut option, perhaps a idea for a part3?Thanks a lot and keep up the good work.

[@googleuser318]

Great stuff as always Austin! Your videos have been such a huge help. I noticed my fret spacing measurements weren't checking out when cross checked with things like say the Stewmac fret spacing calc. So an approach I took which also seemed to work well and also avoided the user parameters "stacking" was this. Instead dimensioning from fret to fret using the multiplier I used the same formula you used for the first fret for all frets, except increment the 1 in the (1/12) for each fret. So like this for fret 2 "scalelength_loside - ( scalelength_loside / ( 2 ^ ( 2 / 12 ) ) )" and fret 3 "scalelength_loside - ( scalelength_loside / ( 2 ^ ( 3 / 12 ) ) )" and so on. This way each fret is measured from the nut and not fret to fret.

[@austinshaner]

That's odd, I got exactly the same results when dimensioning to each fret from the nut, or fret to fret. The math is the same if you use 12th root of 2 method. I just converted it to fret to fret to make the sketch cleaner and easier to make parametric.

[@googleuser318]

@@austinshaner I was probably messing something up. But for some reason things were progressively getting further and further out. It was only by tiny tiny amounts but measuring from the nut each time kept it spot on when comparing to other calcs. It's probably 6 of one half dozen of the other. It certainly makes the sketch messy measuring from the nut each time.

[@DanielBorelGuitars]

THANK YOU SO MUCH !!! Your videos are so helpful... Your teaching is clear and save me tons of head ache ! ; ) With the time you save me, I have to support you on Patreon. Thank you one more time for your generous contribution, sincerely

[@erikjohnson2976]

Great presentation! Many thanks, and this will definitely help me to do a much better job.

[@woodjustworks]

I have a question Austin. Did I miss that you did not incorporate the distance between the string and the edge of the fretboard. The scale length is where the string touches the fret, not the length of the fretboard at the side. If I missed this I'm sorry.

[@austinshaner]

Unfortunately I did not. There was so much to cover that I kind of overlooked it. In the 1st video, iI did dimension the gap between the strings and fretboard, but did not use the string construction line as the scale length reference. That being said, the variance isn't huge, and doesn't impact the fret spacing formulas. You'll just end up with a very slightly smaller scale length than Intended I do plan on releasing an updated version that includes string spacing as the driving factor for the Nut and Bridge width, along with variable number of strings etc. Hopefully I can resolve some of these issues in that video.

[@darcyboyer2998]

Great tutorial. Just one thing I'm a bit confused on at around the 16 minute mark. When making a multiscale, compound radius neck why would you use the midpoint of projected lines as opposed to the actual origin which would be the center line of the overall guitar design? It seems that with your approach, the upper most part of the radiused fretboard would be off center. Am I missing something here?

[@phenoix75]

I might be overthinking this, but I see an issue with the radius is if you are making a left-handed guitar, since the strings will be flipped. I'm going to play around with this and see if there is a simple fix for that. Or if I am off base.

[@copperkerf3846]

Nice work, and very generous of you to share this file. I would personally love to see how you'd add the ability to change the number of frets within a particular scale/multiscale. My interest in this is for microtonal fretboards. I've done my own 19 tone equally divided octave frets before on a Danelectro. The work you've done here will greatly enhance my own studies and work. Again, thank you.

[@austinshaner]

Hey Copper Kerf! I just released a new version today which includes variable fret count, though not on a per string basis. What I do is set my heel line to be exactly one fret position past the last fret. So if I selected 22 frets, then my heel position is at 23. I then also subtract one fret slot width from that as well to make sure no extra fret slots are cut into tge design at the very end.

[@copperkerf3846]

@@austinshaner That's excellent! Will you be uploading it to Grabcad? I've resigned myself to temporarily being content with equal octave division so I think your solution is pretty great.

[@austinshaner]

@@copperkerf3846 yes! It's available on grabcad as we speak. I released a new video this morning covering all the changes.

[@copperkerf3846]

@@austinshaner Oh that's amazing! I just subscribed to your channel. Very nice work. It seems that you've inspired many people. That is priceless.

[@shredguitarirving]

Great video, I have 1 Question or issue, when I try tu use the dots to place the natural fret or vertical fret, it doesn't work 100% precise, i has a minor error like 0.012 mm far away from the fret, is it normal or am I doing something wrong? Thank you

[@hatespirit]

Hello Austin, thank you very much for these videos! I-ve been trying to do this, from the previous video and I run into a problem, 12th fret does not meet the mid-point, it's slighty off by .0012in. Is this correct or i'm doing something wrong?

[@TheTyrynir]

Maybe I'm being a bit obtuse, but can I change the adjustment from heel(which I would not be using. It would be a result of the nut width and bridge spacing width) to bridge string spacing instead? I really appreciate that fretfind2D creates the functional shape based on the string spacing and the fretboard overhang is what defines the fretboard dimensions. If string spacing could be incorporated and visible as sketch lines and the overhang taken into account, then the bridge spacing at the end of the sketch model would be correct. Maybe it's just my OCD. I know it doesn't really matter but it helps the functional aspect you are designing create the fretboard for you.

[@gsterneman]

I'm actually using the bridge string spacing as my end measurement instead of the heel, then calculating said heel width. So far, it's working really well.

[@TheTyrynir]

@@gsterneman I played with it a bit, but I just liked the automation of fretfind2D because you can see the string spacing for the saddles and then add how much FB overhang you want which also determines the heel width. I guess quick math work too and just enter those values. I'm just a really visual person so it helps me reassure my OCD that everything checks out, haha.

[@draktheas8153]

Thanks for the amazing videos. Having trouble getting the offset line to appear with the right sign at the step around 32min in. It always wants to make the offset value negative when moved to the outside of the fretboard. This also seems to mean I can’t use negative values all for TangOffset as changing the value from positive to negative or vice versa doesn’t move the TangOffset line at all. Any help would be awesome.

[@monkeyboyna]

Same problem. I resolved it by setting the dimension of one to be Tang_Offset and the other minus(Tang_Offset). That way, you can change the Tang_Offset and the offsets move in or out together.

[@Megalanthus]

Thanks a lot for your amazing work. I don't really understand how the CAM for the slots work. 🥺

[@ViorelStolea]

Curious. Why not projecting the top of the circle of the heel radius on the nut radius plane and make the top of the circles horizontal with each other?

[@samgendler]

Fret_Multiplier is just 1 / (2 ^ (1/12)) so you can set that up as a named constant and then use it to compute LowE_Fret1 and HighE_Fret1. You can also use it when computing the points for the vertical fret = Scale_Length - ScaleLength * Fret_Multiplier ^ Vertical_Fret. I made the width of the extra fret a parameter, too, so that I can easily vary it. Question, do folks using fanned frets adjust the heel width and string spacing so that the strings are spaced correctly over the pickup magnets when the pickup is angled parallel to the bridge? Depending on the bridge chosen, it may not even be possible to adjust the string spacing to compensate. I've never played a multiscale guitar so I have no idea if the electronics are particularly sensitive to that spacing.

[@austinshaner]

Thanks for the response Samuel! One thing I love about this design is how people are modifying it to make it work for them. I asked around before I made this tutorial, particularly about how people would dimension either the bridge, string spacing, or heel. The consensus was heel width would be most universal for people, but likely that defining the string spacing or bridge width (string to string) etc would be more accurate. I think long term, I'd probably like to do a v3 of this that incorporates string spacing or bridge width. As for the pickups, it's my understanding that it doesn't matter if the strings are slightly off center from the pickup poles, as it doesn't impact the amplitude/tone/or volume of the sound unless it's drastically off.

[@aristosuratman4783]

Great video tutorial. Just need clarification, is the formula you used for 24 frets and 12th fret is the mid fret or universally can be used ? How about if we design guitar for 22 guitar's frets and the mid section fret is 12th fret or 11th fret ?

[@austinshaner]

Hey Aristo! Scale length is independent of the number of frets, so yes! it can be used universally. For example you can have a 24 fret guitar with a 25.5" scale lengths, or a 22 fret guitar with a 25.5" scale length - the only difference is that you chopped off the last two frets. Howevee the 12th fret is ALWAYS the mid point of a scale length, even if you have only 22 frets. So I could build a guitar with a 25.5" scale length and only 13 frets, but the 12th would still be the center point of the string.

[@aristosuratman4783]

@@austinshaner Thanks for the reply, you are right, I made mistake when following your video first time. I did from the scratch again, follow your video again and again, then everything went right like what you said above. Many thanks for the tutorial video, very good.

[@joecarpenter5602]

Austin, If I'm just building a non-fan fret (not a fan fret fan) fretboard do I still need two sets of formulas e.g. Low Scale\High Scale? Also, I'm getting an over-constrained error and it wants me to create a Driven dimention instead. Working on trying to figure it out now. Thank you, Joe

[@austinshaner]

Nope! If you are using a single scale length you can make all of the fret lines vertical, and apply one set of formulas. This parametric fretboard however, allows both options. So you would just make both the high scale and low scale the same value and the lines will be vertical. (single scale length)

[@adriankelly8086]

Thank you for this video, great and clear tutorial! Just one question, I noticed that if you use your nut as the vertical fret it adjusts fine but if you make any other adjustments thereafter it breaks the sketch. I assume that some points will lock at vertical fret 0. Is there a way to avoid this without undoing the change of Vertical_Fret=0?

[@austinshaner]

Hey Adrian, When I tried that while developing this I got an off result as well. I think as long as it's any positive number that's not zero, you should be OK. So even .000001 or something like that, nothing that would make a difference to the design, but maybe annoying. However, for some reason my latest file doesn't have that issue (not sure why). I can even type -1 as the value and it moves the dimensions off the fretboard. That file is available on grabcad If you want to check for any differences

[@bassguy1965]

I have really enjoyed the video. I have a couple of questions, If the use case for this fingerboard is that you can plug in different scale lengths and it will generate a new layout based on Scale, Vertical Fret, and width at nut and heel. It would seem the last piece to conquer would be the number of frets to draw. I cannot seem to find a way to make this work for a guitar that may have 18 frets and also work for a bass that might have 24 frets. Any Ideas? 2nd question is when you are setting the width at the nut, you are setting the height of a line that is perpendicular to the center line. Is it the nature of CAD/CAM that you do not need to have a "Real" anchor point to measure from? I cannot figure out how someone would accurately measure the width of the nut because there isn't a square edge to measure from. Thanks for the video!!

[@austinshaner]

Hey Tal! I haven't quite conquered variable frets yet, but my gut tells me that until Fusion incorporates equations into the rectangular pattern feature, what well have to do is model all 24, and cut off what we don't need. So this could be done before hand by parametrically controlling where the heel line is (similar formula to my vertical fret), or afterward with an extruded cut.

[@austinshaner]

As for your second question, fusion can toally dimension it any way youd like. I chose to dimension it that way, though I could have gone I to greater detail on why, because that's the orientation we care about. Because you could theoretically have a 6" nut, but with a 1.75 neck width at the nut (measured perpendicular) . I asked myself, what do we care about more? The size of the neck were wrapping our hand around? Or the actual length of the nut? Which one gives us more Info on how this guitar will feel and play? I'm working on a v3 version that automatically generates this nut and heel width based on the amount of strings, string spacing, and edge gap . Which would eliminate the need for this type of dimension.

[@bassguy1965]

@@austinshaner I agree, I was playing with trying to do just that with some sort of intersection using heel length. I will let you know what i can figure out.

[@bassguy1965]

@@austinshaner I am a bit pedantic about things that can be measured and was concerned about the minor (rounding type errors) discrepancies that occur if you pull the dimension as though the strings were parallel to the centerline. After I posted this, I did some math, and it is really pretty trivial. I was worried about the theoretical difference and forgot about the real world not really working to theory. Thanks again

[@bosticcustomguitars3249]

I can't get the Offset Command to make the positive value as you do. What am I doing wrong?

[@austinshaner]

Hi there! I occasionally run into this issue as well, it seems to be more of a graphical error. Once you change it to a positive value and it doesn't move, try changing it to a much larger positive value, say 1" instead of .1" and see if it makes that switch. If so, you should be able to change it to the number you actually want. Or at least that's how I've been able to fix it.

[@bosticcustomguitars3249]

@@austinshaner Thank you for your response. You're very patient. If you will, please show me my flaw in operations order. 1) Command "O". 2) Select line(s). 3) Fusion then auto snaps Offset Line to 0.03937, hit enter. 4) I then double-click the dimension to change the number to 1", and the line moves further toward the fretboard center. I'm sure it's simple to fix and I know it doesn't hurt the end goal of parametric control; except for just making the tang offset a positive number in the user parameters. It's just frustrating because my first attempt (from this video) performed as expected. My current attempt (from the next video for adding compound radius) is performing great except for this one issue. Thanks, Austin!

[@glasgowguitarist3636]

I just tried to set the verttical fret as the nut position (Fret 0). This worked fine but every time subsequent attempt to set a new vertical fret broke the model. Has anyone found a way to set the nut as the vertical fret as Strandeberg uses?

[@austinshaner]

It usually works for me to set the 0 fret as the vertical, but I have experienced what you are talking about. If fusion keeps throwing a fit about it, I'd suggest keeping the formula in your master template file, but removing it in any design that you need the vertical nut, and instead just applying a vertical constraint. I know that's not a good answer, but fusion seems to be temperamental with applying a 0 dimension to anything. It kind of assumes that if there is no dimension, then it should just be a constraint.

[@meeloo0]

13:20 Lefties are rightfully offended by this comment!