Fluke 87V Robustness Tests, Part I

[@robber576]

The 87v is an overpriced dinosaur and flukes reluctance to update this “industry standard” to modern times is astonishing.I mean: a 9 volt battery with a wired dangling 9v clip like a 1970’s walkitalki, really?( no AA), fuses not accesable without killing your calibration sticker?, no threaded metal inserts?, no ac+dc mode?, no msec on the dutycycle?, the tilting bale doesnot properly click/fit in the rubber boot and swivels bad?, the high res mode which is not to spec and therefore must be seperatly switched to keep the rest of the meter in spec? Its a nice reliable and stable meter but imho not worth the 600 euros i paid for it.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

For calling it an overpriced dinosaur, you get your comment pinned.

[@javierpallalorden]

Nice! I am staying tuned for part 2.

[@Gooberslot]

One thing I noticed is how fast the Fluke is when measuring capacitance.

[@altonrowell8137]

I wonder if it will pass the fire in the bond 🔥 fire test. Or maybe the m1 abrams run over 10000 time's test.

[@yambo59]

As I commented 3 months back, I had just ordered a new Fluke 17B+ after watching youre tests including it. Its my first Fluke, ive been completely happy with it and im sure its all the meter ill ever need as a DIY/hobbyist - I thank you for the thorough work you do in testing all these meters in every conceivable way for all to see. I dont know where else one could get a more comprehensive idea of a meters performance and durability than your channel. I do wish the 17B+ had true RMS and a bar graph but I knew that before buying and dont necessarily need them so im just nit picking, it has a large display & good feature set for the price and seems to have better transient resistance than a new 87V - who would have thought. Overall I feel I got as good a quality meter as I could ask for at this price (around $100), and seeing how well it did in your electrical and life cycle tests sealed the deal for me. Now seeing how easily the 87V failed in transient testing I feel even better about my purchase.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

If you look at the spreadsheet, you will notice that I eventually ran a new 87V. I also went back and tried to analyze why the one 87V failed at such a low level. Those videos are data are all free to download.

[@sepertude]

Interesting how EEVBLOG missed all these errors with hi-res mode, nS... :)

[@1pcfred]

If it is overpriced Dave automatically likes it.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

He likes the Gossens and has the same one I looked at but never made a review for it that I am aware of. That meter needs a lot of help. I'm not sure why he likes some of the meters he does.

[@1pcfred]

Dave strikes me as the kind of a guy that is very disciplined when it comes to what he is willing to say. So there's bound to be omissions with what he says.

[@jaydee2620]

I was thinking of buying this meter, is there something else u would suggest ?

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Sorry, but I don't offer recommendations nor do I sell meters. I'm assuming you are a professional electrical tech of sorts.

[@MarcoFranceschini1971]

"Magic box" Joe...including a circuit to simulate thermocouple K type voltage ?

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I started out just plugging a sensor into the meters and holding it with my fingers or blowing on it to see if it changed. At one point I added a K type sensor in the box. I later added a precision source. Like the other features, it just basically tells me if the meter is still working or not. It's not intended to be used for calibration or alignment, although some components do have a fairly tight tolerance.

[@rwbishop]

Joe, when you do the 'chemical resistance' checks, can you do the key faces as well? Especially if said keys are the soft variety... great videos, Thanks!

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Sure

[@1pcfred]

I was surprised you didn't gas the ugly boot too.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Same gasoline and methanol I have applied to other meters. So far, it's not been much of a problem except for the ANENG and Kasuntest cheap meters. Brakeclean would have been a good one to try as well.

[@jamessouth4776]

Hi Joe, another great video, have you ever had a look at the fluke 28ii, very similar to the 87v but different input jack design and other differences, i wondered if fluke had improved any 87v short comings with its more modern design.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I have never looked at the 28II. The only ones I have looked at are listed in the spreadsheet. You may find the link in the description. For what ever reason, the 87V is popular enough that people wanted to see a third test ran.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

@Johnny Tramain Sorry, I have no idea why Dave on EEVBLOG says this. I asked once and I think he said that if you work in the industry you would know or something to that effect. IMO, it's not really what I would want as an electrician. It's also not anything I would want for work in electronics. Maybe it would fit for some sort of technician job. It does seem that a lot of hobbyist covet it for some reason or another but IMO, if I have my choice of Fluke meters, it would hands down be the 189. If Fluke decided to release a new version of it, I would buy one assuming it was made here in the USA.

[@sloveniamotorhead9187]

Joe, you're the man !

[@MarcoFranceschini1971]

The backlight on new Fluke 87V resembles that on Fluke 28II (very similar).

[@wouter_scholten]

A bit off topic for this video, but, I think there were 2 videos where you mentioned what you used to polish the display on a meter and showed the results, which videos were they? Also, did you try if this would fix the display on the Aneng that became opaque where you put the fuel on it?

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I have no idea which videos I showed that polish in but I did post about it on the EEVBLOG site as well. No, I did not try to repair the lens on the Aneng meter. Honestly, for the time invested, it would be cheaper to buy a new meter.

[@wouter_scholten]

Well, it depends on the situation. Most people don't have more than 1 or 2 multimeters, and as the meter was not damaged otherwise, throwing away is a bit of waste, also repairing is better than waiting several weeks for a new one. With a multitool from Proxxon or Dremel, the polishing could I suspect be done pretty quickly, so as I have encountered this issue before with other equipment, it would be interesting to see if such a chemically induced frosting is only a surface layer that can be fixed. But what I wanted to know about the videos was to find out what the brand/type of plastic polishing was: Which did you use? As to the knob testing, that's interesting too in your tests. I feel that none of the meters that I have or had the past 10 or so years (VC 230, U1273A and recently Fluke 289, Aneng 8009) come close in how good the feel is of the 1980s Kaise SK-6220, which has a separate switch from the multimeter PCB. It's like the difference between a IBM clicky keyboard and laptop keyboard :)

[@malgailany]

What is the firmware version of the old Fluke 87V? Thanks

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I'm sorry but I have returned that meter to it's current owner.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Looks like it was 300

[@MarcoFranceschini1971]

Great Joe...i see a Fluke 189 (that i bought new in 2001 as an electronic engineering student)...

[@DonDenaBrenna]

any bets on when this meter fails the surge testing? I say 2.5 KV ! Should be interesting

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Personally, I want to see it go at least as far as the 17B+.

[@DonDenaBrenna]

lol IDK the Chinese flukes seem to do good in your test! Guess we will see soon enough!

[@zemlickapetr]

I'll bet on 1.5kV 1.2/50, same as before. Joe, could you test all the suitable ranges with a 1000V PSU, before engaging impulse tests? Something like a rectified, then multiplied power line would be fine.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I don't think I have a power supply that can drive a meter when it engages the current source clamps. I do run that full rectified 220VAC line test on all the meters but that's as high as I normally go. However, when I first looked at the 87V I did hook it up to the plate supply of an old radio and cycled it through all the modes. 700ish volts at about 500mA. You can see that testing here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bHjcoKiig7SDepY

[@jacksat2252]

I was a Fluke fan ,but these days I always seem to grab my little Brymen BM325 first. Even before my old trusty benchtop Fluke 8840A multimeter with opt 05 & 09 ,i allmost always take the little Brymen.

[@SirBunghole]

Had I not paid only $100 for my F3.01 version I would feel cheated. Even then, I probably should have saved the $100 towards a Brymen. Oh well. At least I now have the smug satisfaction of having the right to complain about this meter since I own one.

[@yambo59]

Glad to hear something good about the 17B+ as I just ordered one. Hope the electricals are as good as the switch life. To me your examination of the new Fluke 87V reveals the subtle beginnings of the gradual sellout and decline in quality of yet another previously iconic US name brand. You cant hardly even buy a decent quality clothes washer anymore, things that used to last decades now are considered throwaway.

[@AlainHubert]

I find it pretty ironic that the new casing colour doesn't match the stand, and on which the finish is of poor quality compared to older production models, since the casing is the only thing left on the Fluke 87V that is made in USA (at least on my late 2017 unit). And I definitely don't like the new darker/greener display background which makes reading the display in dimmed surroundings more difficult than on the older version, and requires me to use the backlight more often, which drains the battery more. The display on my Fluke 115 is much, much better in comparison.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Is your 2017 case as bad as what I show? A few people wrote me after making this video showing me pictures of their cases and it seems like their quality has gone down. Still many people regard the 87V as the holy grail. I have no idea why. I will say Fluke meters in general continue to hold up very well in my tests.

[@AlainHubert]

@@joesmith-je3tq Yes Joe. The same swirly marks, and pitted finish, and mismatched colour as what you've shown here. I can't help but agree that Brymen seems to offer better quality, better features in some of their products for less money. But they don't cary the Fluke name and logo. In all fairness though, I don't think that the appearance of the boot on the newer 87V will have any impact (pun intended) on the ruggedness of it, and its ability to protect it. It's just annoying on a product in this price range. Here's a link to a DropBox folder where pictures of the boot on my 87V are stored: www.dropbox.com/sh/hf0jvb3etoiwyvy/AAD71FHm6QHuGg9PRbGd8nrVa?dl=0

[@AlainHubert]

@@joesmith-je3tq Perhaps the "holy grail" reputation of the Fluke 87V is largely based on the fact that the meter has been in production for a long time, and that Fluke meters have a great reputation for holding their calibration over very long periods of time, despite harsh environments and physical abuse ?

[@joesmith-je3tq]

@@AlainHubert Looks about the same as the one I bought. Not a good sign that they are keeping up their quality. I agree that the brand has been around a long time and their current meters (at least the ones I have looked at) have been very robust. The 87V being the holy grail really makes little sense to me. It's not a meter I would want for electronics. If I were an electrician, it wouldn't be my first choice. It really seems targeted to techs. They really don't offer a meter today that I would want. The 289 is about the closest.

[@AlainHubert]

@@joesmith-je3tq Agreed about the Fluke 289. But at $740 (Canadian dollars), I can get two Brymen 869 for that price... The only thing that remains to be seen, is how long a Brymen will retain its calibration over the years. My father has a Fluke 77 (first generation grey, before the yellow boot era began) that is still spot on, and has never required recalibration in over 30 years, and still works flawlessly.

[@Tonyplat98]

Can you compare an 87 V and an 87 III please. I would really love to see that one

[@joesmith-je3tq]

The 87III is an old meter and I would at best be able to buy an old used one in unknown condition. I did do this in the case of the Fluke 189 as there was a fair bit of interest in seeing one ran.

[@Tonyplat98]

@@joesmith-je3tq yeah that makes sense unless it has been calibrated to spec.But I understand what you mean.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

@@Tonyplat98 Even if it passes calibration, I normally run these meters to failure. If there was previous damage to the meter, it could bias the test results.

[@rogert151]

I was looking at the 87v on eBay recently, about 220$ for a clean used one with many bids on each one, so there very popular on eBay, even beat up ones go for over 150$, one thing that's unique about the 87 is the 4gig ohm input impedance mode in the mV range, I don't thing brymen has that feature

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Interesting. Quick look at the datasheet for the 87V, looks like 10 Meg in the mV ranges. I checked mine in the DCmV, 10M.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Could you post your test setup. Are you looking at the AC range where it is AC coupled? If so, that may be misleading.

[@zemlickapetr]

Not really. Page 10 of the manual: Hold Hz % on start-up to enter DC mV Hi-Z mode. 80-Series I & III meters also had that.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Someone else mentioned this Hi-Z mode. I have started to post about it here: www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hear-kitty-kitty-kitty-nope-not-that-kind-of-cat/2450/

[@altonrowell8137]

I wonder if it would pass the 10000 volt 1 million amps starter motor supply test. The last person to try was burned alive.

[@robber576]

The 87v high res mode has an annoying thing and you also didnt notice at the 0.1 ohm test; you first need to put it in the right manual range, then put it to high res and then do the delta-nul, in the wrong order it will not switch to high res.

[@sepertude]

Yes, it can read 0.01 OHM, mine does.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Nice find. The manual only shows 0.1 ohm resolution but indeed, manual range then high res will gain one digit. Not a fan at all with how this works and the fact it is not clearly stated in the most recent manual for a product this mature, seems really poor. The manual shows it can read up to 1090 deg C. Is there a trick to make this work as well?

[@robber576]

That was also my point, it can do highres but only in the right order if you want to use other options at the same time. Its a nice meter but it has some flaws which are at this price level a nono imho and it is in desperate need of a major revision, its just not up to standards anymore, it lacks functionality and is clearly outrun in transient tests by the newer designs of the same company. I also have a V3.03 so i am curious about part2 of this test :D

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Again, the manual shows it can read up to 1090 deg C. Is there a trick to make this work as well?

[@robber576]

Just tried, i get mine with the fluke probe and a lighter easily up to 880 C

[@grhinson]

Per FTC, “Made in USA” means that “all or virtually all” the product has been made in America. That is, all significant parts, processing and labor that go into the product must be of U.S. origin.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I had provided a link to the actual FTC documents on the EEVBLOG that defines the various markings including Assembled like 87V is now marked. Danaher always seems to be in the top companies for unrepatriated earnings. But tax laws being what they are, companies like Apple, Microsoft and should take advantage of them.

[@grhinson]

Usually to qualify for such an tax advantage or subside, a company's final product must have over half of its components made and assembled within the US.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I will leave the tax laws for the experts in that field.

[@RedondoBeach2]

Joe, will you review the new Fluke 87V MAX? www.fluke.com/en-us/product/electrical-testing/digital-multimeters/87v-max The most significant improvements to this meter over the 87V appear to be a better International Protection (IP) rating of 67 and battery life boosted to 800 hours. Your comprehensive assessment of the meter would be appreciated.

[@joesmith-je3tq]

I am not really interested in the original 87V let alone a remake of it. If they decided to bring back the Fluke 189, I would have a look.

[@mikeadler434]

👍👍

[@ahall3823]

50,000 cycles on the dial?!? Really? And what did it prove? ... What an absolutely ridiculous test!

[@joesmith-je3tq]

Why do you feel this test is ridiculous?

[@1pcfred]

joe smith just hates him some Fluke 87V