More Warlords of Draenor Lore (Thrall Didn't Cheat): CHRONICLE VOL. IV (Part Four)

[@FlyingButtress]

This one's shorter than I thought it would be considering the script was about 5000 words. Also... this video isn't Halloween-y at all. I apologise. I kinda forgot. And also I've been jump-scared by other people's videos and it annoyed me so I decided not to do that to you

[@Smokie1523]

I kinda jumped when i got the notification for the video... i say we count that as your jump scare?

[@Redisia]

Majestic work as always though

[@christiandiaz3459]

another great video. I made sure to give my favorite Butt a big thumbs up lol. always support your butt with a big thumbs up

[@sikhjatt23]

That bloke named after a lentil curry....had me rolling LOL

[@samuelazzaro]

I love how people somehow blame Garrosh completely on Thrall. Remember, when Garrosh was put in charge of the horde, Thrall was getting visions about the literal world ending, so I don't think he had time to have some kind of in depth interview process or something. Plus, he had left Garrosh with advisors he knew he could trust like Carren. In fact, Carren challenging Garrosh to a duel was likely the power check Thrall had been counting on, and could have never expected the poison situation to play out the way it did. Plus, as stated in the lore, Garrosh was extremely popular amongst the orcs. He was the hero of the Northrend campaign. To overlook Garrosh and appoint someone like Saurfang might have fractured the horde. The point is, Thrall 100% had no reason to assume anything Pandaria or Theramore related would play out when he first gave Garrosh leadership of the horde. And, again, if Carren had not been poisoned, he would have easily kicked Garrosh's ass as had been the original safeguard. If Blizzard ever explores alternate timelines again, I think a fun one would be a version where Carren survived and took over as warchief.

[@Thromash]

Thanks for the content mate, always appreciate the effort & work you put in.

[@Dayoube]

You're the most hilarious lore-teller (foreal!) Blizzard should have you make a Warcraft TV-series (WITH AT A MINIMUM 20 EPISODES & MINIMUM 40 MINUTES/EPISODE

[@TM-so4ix]

Keep it up brother! Always welcome a new viewing

[@Otterly_luna]

Woohoo! Glad to see another video from you! ^^

[@How_Is_This_A_Name]

FLYING BUTTRESS VIDEO LET'S GOOOOOOOO

[@Garouwerks]

So THAT was what we were doing. FFS it took a Flying Buttress explanation for me to understand.

[@MorganRhysGibbons]

LOL the weird rock guys lololol

[@ishalef3933]

Those old "craps" are great. They are your masterpiece.

[@FlyingButtress]

I must admit; i did chuckle at some of it as I was cutting it together. Been so long since I made them that I remember absolutely nothing. But... i went way too bloody overboard with captions back then

[@DeCode343]

Clicked and liked, will watch later👍

[@SuperHero3]

Maraad was a personal favourite of mine. His death hit me hard 😔

[@maxthepaladin2147]

Weird rock guys my beloved

[@codywhite6337]

Still love these videos!

[@Wodferd]

Yea on one hand Garrosh is technically Thralls "fault", because making him Warchief in his absence was an amazingly stupid idea, and he was 100% blinded by his respect for Grom when he did it. But Garrosh acting like a homicidal maniac who jumped at the first opportunity to go right back to acting like the 1st Horde, and try replacing demon blood with Sha goo was all on his own. Its also not like this behaviour was news to Thrall, or that he shouldn't have seen it coming, Garrosh had idealized the old horde when they met for the first time in Outlands, on our first time seeing him in Org he immediately starts a fight with Thrall over how the Horde should handle the Scourage in the pre-patch for Wrath, and was so angry at the very concept of Dalaran asking the Alliance for help with Ulduar that it took 5 seconds for him to try killing Varian. Garrosh was only such a shit Warchief because he was an awful pick for it to begin with, and Thrall was an idiot who wanted to try and pay his respect to his dead friend through his kid while ignoring the neon flashing warning signs.

[@ds698]

What ever you need to tell yourself mate. Your dissection of this made up story is telling to how you handle responsibility in the face of problematic actions.❤

[@Skollshorties]

Damn straight.

[@danieltodorov7753]

Garrosh is such an embarrassment to all orcs.

[@Ryno2094]

Garrosh did whatever any orc like him would have done with that seat of power. The fault lies with Thrall.

[@danieltodorov7753]

@@Ryno2094 Nope, Garrosh is the opposite of what an orc should be. Hid in the safety of Orgrimar and had grunts do the fighting for him 99% of the time. Constantly used treachery. Had no respect for shamanism. The list goes on.

[@kbredstar529]

im getting old Tress... my mind is starting to go... i dont remember why I started... i dont even remember if i did it yesterday or last time... im starting to slip, ol' butt. woooo!!!!

[@rolfstalker2986]

Man I hate Garrosh with a passion. I was so glad to see Thrall finally end him. And with regards to Thrall supposedly cheating: Does anyone really believe that Garrosh wouldn't himself have drawn on absolutely any power that might make him win?

[@FlyingButtress]

As far as I could tell - people seemed to think that magic was forbidden in Mak'gora. It seems like maybe people got that from the Warcraft movie but it was never a canon thing. Each Mak'gora is sort of its own unique thing in that the rules are established by the participants before they begin. I cameo'd in a video for Skoll Shorties / Ban'orak years ago and said he didn't cheat. But you still get people that just choose to believe otherwise for some reason

[@rolfstalker2986]

@FlyingButtress I don't know where it's from either. I just find it silly to imagine that Garrosh would not have used magic powers if he had any.

[@Laksilaks]

Suuuweeee!!

[@savagepatty]

Thrall didn’t cheat? Tell that to doom hammer. The reason shamans get the mace is because it stops responding to thrall after the Mak’gora. Thrall also believes he fought with dishonour.

[@DominionSorcerer]

The elements stopped responding to Thrall because he did believe it was his fault Garrosh walked the path that he did, not because he cheated. He thought of himself as unworthy because of that and thus he was. There are no rules in a Mak'gora except for the rules the fighters agree on.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

What a way to excuse Thrall's failures and mistakes. Everything Garrosh told him was ultimately true. Thrall wasn't 100% responsible for everything Garrosh did, but he was still responsible for it enough. This book just made a bad and pathetic attempt at excusing all that. Oh and Thrall absolutely DID want to kill him there. It was no "with a heavy heart". It was a mak'gora. A duel to the death. Of course Garrosh would try to kill him. Thrall sought to do the same, from the very start.

[@FlyingButtress]

I dunno. I guess there's always going to be different perspectives on the whole thing. Imo - Thrall gave Garrosh opportunities to reflect on his actions. By the time this Mak'gora took place; he'd likely reached the conclusion that Garrosh never would. Hell - even after being tormented in the Shadowlands, Garrosh STILL hadn't done any introspection whatsoever and insisted he'd do everything exactly the same. True narcissistic behaviour. No self-doubt. No remorse. His characterisation actually kind of triggers me lol. I detest people like that in the real world

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@FlyingButtress And you're right. What I dislike is that this book tries to essentially whitewash Thrall's own failures. I mean, the book isn't even entirely correct when it comes to their fight - nowhere does Garrosh accuse him of failing the Horde, only that he failed him (which he did). Garrosh did make his own choices and is responsible for them and he did deserve to die. But Thrall not only enabled him to do that, he was partially responsible for what he had become himself. He showed him his father heroic sacrifice, but never bothered to also teach him ehat led Grom to that place in the first place. That's all Thrall saw himself - just Grom and his sacrifice. That's one of the biggest ironies of Thrall's reign - his Horde was supposed to be different from the original one, but it to a great extent *celebrated* many of the figures of the original Horde. Allowed myself to get a bit carried away. I just dislike how this book never really tries to portray Thrall as flawed, as someone who DID make mistakes. Now compare that to Jaina, my favourite character - this book consistenly portrays her as someone who made bad mistakes and depicts her as someone who's often simply irrational. That's just not fair. She gets blamed for things she did, no matter their context, while Thrall gets away, with the author portraying him as a near flawless hero.

[@FlyingButtress]

That's fair. The Jaina stuff was defo a bit odd. There's literal cutscenes of her talking to Anduin; being conflicted about aligning the Kirin Tor with the Alliance because neutrality was important to her. And then Chronicle Vol. 4 is just like "Nah she was never neutral". I'm just doing the books as written but I honestly don't know if these are retcons. Or mistakes. Or 'from the Titans perspective'. It's all a little bit messy.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@FlyingButtress It was written by a person who never had any prior experience with Warcraft, and the book itself seemingly wasn't even really corrected (judging by the BfA/that Shadowlands "players" stuff). So I personally just consider this book to be an unreliable narrative written by someone who's a newbie to the Warcraft universe. Still though. I was so excited for this book... Anyway. Sorry for annoying you with this. It just kinda matters to me.

[@FlyingButtress]

No probs. I think it's nice that people are still so passionate about the story. Sometimes it does feel like people start yelling at me for things that aren't actually my fault but I try to avoid going down the path of becoming one of those 'KZbinrs' that's really stand-offish with their own viewers. Text / written communication is easily misinterpreted after all

[@DawiMan5391]

First.

[@phantom0456]

Flying Butt-ress I love your work, but Thrall DID cheat… and by cheating Thrall cheated us all out of the greatest Warchief that any world in the Warcraft universe had ever seen: Big Daddy Garrosh.

[@FlyingButtress]

@@phantom0456 lol. I guess when you put it that way. I still disagree because I don't like Garrosh but I can't argue with that. Thrall did indeed cheat the Horde out of a warchief of all time

[@That_kind_of_orc]

Coward thrall