Formerly Banned Cards in Commander | EDH | Unbanned Cards | Magic the Gathering | Commander

[@karmacollector7404]

The fact that Kokusho was banned kinda makes me laugh now a days, and then I realize Gary exists so... 😐

[@austin31bennett]

FREE KARAKAS!!!!! If your deck revolves that heavily against needing your commander on the field then it is a garbage deck. Also, just run permanent removal if it's that scary. Field of Ruin, Wasteland, Strip Mine, Ghost Quarters, Vindicate, Blood Moon, etc. Its not hard to play against at all especially in a multiplayer format when the Karakas can only be used once a turn rotation.

[@allisterblossfeld9329]

I was playing magic when koko got banned, but I'm pretty sure it had to do with recurring nightmare. Recurring nightmare is hard to interact with even today. But pair it with kokushu and everyone got to watch you play solitaire. I think they both got banned at the same time, but I'm not sure. Also back then there wasn't a lot of graveyard hate like we have today. So Koku could really wreck games without letting people feel like they could do much about it. Now it's much easier to deal with and pretty much no one is sad that it's unbanned.

[@remy333]

@@austin31bennett totally agree. Even in a general heavy strategy like Najeela, Karakas still doesn't feel broken or bannable to me. Maybe the concern was just ETB abuse early on, but of it's that, then there are so many more abusive cards that still aren't banned.. so I don't get it. FREE THE KARAKAS.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Free the karakas. And not just because I have one deck that needs it : p

[@arthurvandenbergh1881]

The Turtler 31 nah, I think it’s too strong to have a card that can just say: you will never have your commander unless you run land removal, which a lot of decks don’t

[@danielbretado7660]

I'm ok with the current banlist but if I had to choose a card to unban, it would be worldfire. I destroyed the whole world but at least I got rid of that wretched enchantment.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Yes, you are right but I still don't want it unbanned. Everything else can be unbanned silver cards, unique cards, but never worldfire.

[@biggiechee5e2000]

If you draw the right hand with mono red you could cast worldfire turn 1. It's too good for red

[@joeldykman7591]

@@biggiechee5e2000 While you could potentially get 9 mana in opening hand for a worldfire, its basically an exodia hand in magic terms. Even then, you still have to topdeck better than anyone else on the table to win. Unless of course you also happened to have something coming back from exile or a thragtusk at the ready. I'd say that its pretty unreliable, but I'd actually have to see a deck built around doing it. My guess it would be a rakdos deck with plenty of tutors and rits would do it, but I'm not sure if that's any better than just ad nauseum in the same deck. Maybe there's something I'm missing, but i just think its not as good of a finisher as people think it is.

[@nchomeier]

@@biggiechee5e2000 hoooow? I'm kinda new to magic, and only play EDH. How can you do that? My playgroup and I have talked about going at it with no ban-list, and I own a copy of Worldfire...!

[@ThisAreOr]

@@nchomeier Mountain, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, Pyretic Ritual, Seething Song, Fork. Mountain (R) Crypt (2R) Pyretic (1RRR) Vault (3RRR) Fork the Seething Song (1RRRRRRRRRR) cast Worldfire.

[@pabloacedologrono5003]

The Commander´s Quarantine

[@pauldyson8098]

Hey Mitch, Some friends and I started a budget Commander league on MTGO. We quickly realized that Commander staple Sol Ring was a no-go since it's worth about 12 tix online. Conversely, Gauntlet of Might, a card that costs hundreds of dollars in paper, is under 1 ticket on MTGO. Have you ever considered doing a MTGO-specific budget deck tech? Many cards that are prohibitively expensive irl are much more affordable online: most of the tutors, Serra's Sanctum, Nykthos, Cyclonic Rift--heck, you can even get a Mana Crypt for under five tix. Even if you're not an MTGO player, I think this would be a cool topic. I'd be happy to help with research and such!

[@christopherlundgren1700]

This is a great video idea. Cards online are almost always a lot cheaper than their paper counterparts; even in pauper I know you can pick up some commons for fractions of a penny, but you'd be prepared to pay at least a buck for a playset of most cards in paper. It'd be interesting to see the most extreme examples. And since I don't play online, I'm always astonished when a fairly cheap card in paper turns out to be hugely expensive on MTGO because it was under-distributed for some reason. I remember Pernicious Deed used to be very pricey online because there was a shortage of Apocalypse out there, and more recently I hear that Thorn of the Black Rose is in such high demand that they're giving them away as cube prizes. I'll bet there's a bunch I don't know about.

[@pauldyson8098]

@@christopherlundgren1700 Very true about Thorn of the Black Rose. Certain other cards are very expensive: even with the bannings, Wrenn and Six is 110 and Oko is still close to 20. But you can get a promo Gaea's Cradle for five bucks. Online finance is very strange indeed.

[@FlashKillerX]

How actually does the MTGO economy even work. I’ve never understood it, you can get super powerful cards that are extremely widely played for super cheap but certain common and uncommon cards that aren’t played in really any format could be super expensive. It’s wack

[@xavierlanglands9486]

First up there's wayfarer's bauble

[@TheThirdGenQ]

Man, I remember being scandalized when Kokusho got unbanned. Feels so underwhelming now.

[@joeldykman7591]

I play a ghave deck and I dont even run it. Yosei does more to put yourself in a winning position than Kokusho. Draining everyone for 5 tends to put a nice target on your head. so unless you have an unassailable position, you are about to get all the hate for awhile.

[@TheThirdGenQ]

@@joeldykman7591 yeah, even in decks like Ayli he's not that great

[@VoodooDuck]

@@TheThirdGenQ I like him in teysa Karlov :)

[@gabrielgaron6476]

I like Kicking a Rite of Replication targeting an opponent's Kokusho.

[@PalPlays]

@@joeldykman7591 It's in my Marchesa, the Black Rose deck, but I can also make it die once a turn sooooo...

[@ScottSmethers]

I don't know why but Mitch saying "Hey Stibs" made me laugh way harder than it should have

[@NotYourAverageNothing]

PSAriscottle Who is Stibs?

[@Pacuvio25]

I don't get the point of unifying the ban list and the generals ban list. Their purpose was very different.

[@skynyrdjesus]

I mean, the idea was just to make it simpler for new players to get into the format. That might've been a bit misguided, but Commander is the most popular Magic format now, so it's hard to fault them for hedging their bets. But I agree, I prefer the different lists because it adds another layer of complexity and let's you play with more cards, but it's an easy discussion with your play group if you want to play something banned, so I don't lose sleep over it

[@DarthSironos]

@@skynyrdjesus Sounds like a hard discussion to me.

[@skynyrdjesus]

@@DarthSironos I mean, you just ask your play group whether they're okay with you playing a banned or illegal commander. Either they're okay with it or they aren't. It's not like youre trying to do everyone's taxes, it's a binary yes or no question

[@kyleherbold]

I just want my tolarian academy ... broken but beautiful

[@betainvestments7215]

Your content is dope and I really like it

[@connorv3334]

Here's hoping Coalition Victory will be added to this list soon. At least, I hope so anyway

[@RockmeHellsing]

no with 3 cards you can win then it is too easy

[@connorv3334]

@@RockmeHellsing I don't think it's really easy at all, the spell can get countered, or someone could remove on of your creatures or lands, then you just wasted 8 mana for a spell that did nothing

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

I'd argue that happily ever after is just better

[@rickyg4088]

I would love that, but it is pretty easy to win with it. My jodah deck could easily do this, especially with conflux to pull the last ones i needed.

[@kingfuzzy2]

@@rickyg4088 even then it would require set up and is beatable on the second time playing against such a deck because you've seen it before : p

[@EmilioPerezGlez]

I play since the format started and to my knowledge 50 life total was never ever an official rule in EDH; it's always been 40.

[@jacksonstein809]

Also, feldwar sovereign exists now.

[@junhianling]

I'm not too good at explaining this but here goes anyways. If you have any other questions you might want to ask the cEDH players at r/cedh Flash hulk is an op combo. And in cEDH there were multiple hulk piles. Basically hulk piles are what you search with your protean hulk death. So currently the best hulk pile are, Nomads en-Kor, Thassa's Oracle, Cephalid Illusionist or blood pet, spellseeker and Thassa's Oracle. Combo 1: Nomads en-Kor, Thassa's Oracle, Cephalid Illusionist. Thassa's Oracle etb trigger on the stack. Use Nomad's en-Kor to target Cephalid Illusionist. This triggers Cephalid Illusionist ability to trigger and you mill the top 3 cards of your library. Keep looping this till your library is 0. When that is done. Let the thassa's oracle ability to resolve and win. Combo 2: Blood pet, Spellseeker, Thassa's Oracle Order the etb in this order Thassa's Oracle etb goes on the stack first then spellseeker. This allows the spellseeker to resolve first and tutor up demonic consultation. While the thassa's oracle ability is on the stack you sac the blood pet for a black mana and cast demonic consultation and mill you library and win with Thassa's Oracle etb. The problems with flash hulk is how hard it is to interact. For 1U at instant speed the flash hulk player can outright win at any time. Also potential turn 0 win. If you have the right hand. The only ways to stop it is to stop it at the flash part ideally either with counters or with your own win. Other potential ways to stop the hulk player: Torpor orb/hushbringer effect. This stops the thassa's oracle ability. However this is not ideal as it is sorcery speed and in response the hulk player can just flash and win. Anti tutor can also stop the win. E.g. Ashiok dream render, and aven mindcensor. Aven mindcensor can stop the hulk at instant speed but it's 3 mana while the hulk is only at 2. Grafdiggers cage and Containment priest can also stop the hulk from bringing in the creatures from their library. Anything that stops triggered ability can also stop the hulk win by countering the oracle's etb. Such as stifle or trickbind. Trickbind is split second so the hulk player can't counter it.

[@junhianling]

Additionally if the hulk player has boseiju who shelters all. They can make flash uncounterable. But since you are playing in cEDH you are running counters anyways so not too big of a deal.

[@junhianling]

One of the reasons why this is so oppressive is that you are forced to hold up mana for your interaction in order to not lose to the hulk player. As anytime the hulk player can just win with 2 mana. Or you must have force of will ready if you are tapped out. Due to this it's a horrible situation. Damned if I develop my board or my situation or damned if I don't. Also there is a potential for turn 0 win with flash hulk. Turn 0 win: Gemstone caverns, simian spirit guide/elvish spirit guide, flash, protean hulk, any 3 other cards (ideally pact of negation or force of will) Start the game with gemstone cavern exile a card that isn't your combo. At the first players upkeep step exile simian spirit guide/elvish spirit guide then tap your gemstone cavern for 1 blue and cast flash and win.

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

You can also prevent the win with leyline of the void/RIP/graffdiggers effects

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

@Najawin so which piece do you ban?

[@junhianling]

@Najawin I'm not very good at explaining flash as my meta doesn't have any flash hulk action but I tried to explain a little bit :P

[@xxSaberinyourheart]

5:59 there was me totally smug of getting all of brago's etbs with my faerie artisans. My face twisted into sheer terror when Anje got this bad boy out.

[@creepercraft1107]

For a quick explanation on why flash hulk is oppressive in cedh, it's a 2 Mana, instant speed, both pieces are easily tutorable, and can only be interacted with counterspells, no graveyard removal or creature removal neccicary, win the game. Meaning without something like a graffdiggers cage (one of the only tech cards that can shut off this deck) or a force of will, you can lose as early as turn 1,

[@bernieklau8063]

I love your janky builds like malestrom wanderer and demonlord belzenok. Please do more like that!

[@kingfuzzy2]

Free the jank machines!!!

[@Klinara]

I know I’m exceedingly biased about unbanning tolarian academy for my Urza deck.

[@xwwg1wgax277]

Don't play TA but agreed. Unban. I would have no problems with Urza having TA against Breya or Teysa.

[@TheSynisterMinister]

My gf bought be a tolarian academy not knowing its banned. I wanna use it so bad!!!!!!!

[@gnarly814]

I don't think you guys realize how strong Tolarian Academy actually is.

[@kingfuzzy2]

@@gnarly814 yep infinite Mana before your opponents first turn it's as strong as flash hulk maybe stronger in the right commander.

[@gnarly814]

@@kingfuzzy2 stronger for sure... Flash hulk requires 2 specific cards while tolarian academy will be good at any point in the game, flash and hulk are only useful with each other.

[@BeholdDog5341]

I want to see Paradox Engine unbanned. I know it’s super broken in decks like urza, but I love to use it for value without abusing it to that degree. I understand completely why it stays banned though

[@hannovanbaarle1413]

Problem with it is that its all too easy. generating value with it feels good. but is way too easy to pull off

[@TheSynisterMinister]

My girlfriend is new to magic and for valentines day she bought me a Tolarian academy. I always told her how powerful and awesome it is and how I wish I had one. Not knowing she would end up buying it. Now I really wish it was un banned!!

[@firstandlast.1254]

The tiny benefit you get from it being unbanned is immediately dwarfed by the horrible feels you get from getting wrecked by it. If you want to continue enjoying it, keep it banned. The memory is better than the reality.

[@jasonjames9836]

Need to make a Canadian Highlander deck - Academy is legal there and it is a singleton format

[@bachus9852]

Braids, Cabal Minion, I know that she can be a pain in causual format as a group slug commander, but she hurts you as well and later she is way weaker. There are more broken stuff allowed so yeah

[@FlamingViCTiM]

if she hurts you, you built your deck wrong

[@josefranciscodasilvaeolive674]

The issue is she affects your opponents first. Therefore, of she's out in play on turn one or two, the game typical comes to a grinding halt. That's the argument as far as I know. That being said, I'd love to see it unbanned so it can be a cEDH deck!

[@kingfuzzy2]

Braids isn't hard to beat even if she benefits you. Unban braids plz edh rules committee.

[@corpsecrow1590]

Yes I miss a turn one or turn two Braids. I had a deck build just to sac herself just to bring her back... ah fun times, and what I miss is even if you found a way to exile her, she just went to the command zone. She was definitely my bae.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Wonderful story.

[@optikill3060]

Great video Mitch! Hope to see more content, keeps us sane while trapped inside!

[@heresRIPLEY]

Imagine Beacon of Immortality still being banned. It’s laughable what the rules committee has been allowed to do in the past.

[@stephenr465]

Hi mitch, recently started your channel and you and catching up on all your catalog, it's fantastic. While I just play laid back kitchen table commander, I believe banned as general and banned entirely should be distinguished again. Being in the 99 there is no guarantee it would even make an appearance, whereas certain cards will be very troublesome as a commander casted multiple times a game.

[@countgsox1179]

Wait... When you cheat out chromatic Orey and staff of domination with arcum dagsson you draw your whole deck and win in turn 4 or 5 depending on your mana rocks?

[@teamnormie9235]

I really really appreciate your vids, as im a big budget player and seeing new cards to me that are super cheap is a really useful tool and asset! :D

[@kingfuzzy2]

Me too thanks ( : I love building obscure ways to win on a budget.

[@darrenpapworth2833]

just wondering if you can equip heartless hidetsugu with grafted exoskeleton . would that kill all opponents at the same time?

[@anthonydelfino6171]

I never get support for this opinion, but Balance. White needs ways to deal with decks that do a lot of card draw and land-based ramp that aren't just "give white a way to draw cards and ramp" Every time I talk to people about it, it seems the only objection people have (that can't also be said of many other legal cards) is that it's too inexpensive to cast. And for me, that reasoning to keep a card banned seems hollow considering we allow all the powerful, cheap mana rocks in this format.

[@zachwilliams148394]

wayback machine allows you to find old versions of web pages so if one has a current ban list id search it up on there

[@chunky_boo]

You missed at least 1 which was unbanned from a rules change, unless the rules change came after, Rhys the Exiled used to be banned as a general since he broke his own color identity, since color identity used to only count the mana cost

[@Timmir00]

There are actually a number of others that would have to be mentioned in that case like Thelon of Havenwood and Bosh, Iron Golem. Though these were never explicitly banned, the rules at the time did prevent them from being commanders, much to the dismay of the fungus deck I wanted to make at the time.

[@chunky_boo]

I know there's more I just remember that one distinctly since when I first started I wanted to make an elf tribal with him as the head but he was banned and I remember it was on the banned as general list.

[@gregwalsh5492]

I would love Primeval Titan to be unbanned but being able to fetch any two lands is probably too much.

[@bloodyblades7224]

How exactly strong of a commander is rofellos in relation to say thrasios and tymna with the "only lands no boardstate win with the new thasa's oracle" or urza with his ability to somewhat tolarian academy and abuse winter orb? I mean he's amazing a producing Mana but that what green do, hell selvala does just about a good job but with rofellos it may as well replace her or priest of Titania in the deck.

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

Hes insane. I've seen him go off on turn 4 with untap effects into a genesis wave X46

[@bloodyblades7224]

So has selvala she almost guarantees turn four even with mild interruption What I'm saying is should refellos (given some time to see the situation on the two aforementioned strong decks and the cards that allow such strength) get the unban hammer?

[@justinstreeter5068]

You can flash in worldgorger dragon in case of a board wipe.

[@oblivionsgate3308]

Privileged position or sterling grove I run it in a deck to basically make me I target able for anything affects battle you name it

[@SonAlexander]

I would like to see Recurring Nightmare unbanned. I don’t see why it’s banned as their are plenty of busted cards and combos already in EDH. Nightmare should be legal

[@morgoth2425]

it would definitely complete my chainer, dementia master deck :)

[@Dierk182x]

Hi, do you have a video about the best removals/card draw for every color?

[@1PROFITPROPHET1]

Hey mitch can I get a heart I don't have one

[@kingfuzzy2]

That was nice ( :

[@RetroMaticGamer]

So, just to be clear, Derevi Empyrial Tactician was NEVER banned? The people in my local scene always knee-jerk react to me pulling his deck out by saying “NOPE, can’t play that, he’s banned,” until I show them on the list that he isn’t, which is always followed by, “Wow! He USED to be, guess they unbanned him.” So I can call them out on being pure douchebags... cool!

[@benjamintaylor6878]

Derevi is banned as a general in duels, that could be what they are thinking about

[@aeneas1677]

for anyone wondering, tainted remedy says whenever an opponent would gain life, they lose that much life instead. would that mean that they lose all their life because they would gain Xlife where X is there life total, but then they would lose X life instead, or would it halve their lifetotal.

[@chris_5693]

With Beacon of Immortality and Tainted Remedy the targeted opponent will lose life equal to their life total, putting them at 0 life.

[@zachmozingo1758]

*Casts beacon of immortality at 1 life... Try me now scrubs.

[@Sophia-sh1ky]

Beacon of immortality with light of promise is gonna be disgusting

[@PigeonFodder]

I'm still holding out for my favorite legend being unbanned - Braids, Cabal Minion :'(

[@dabarles]

Same. I just built pox and it would be sweet to have Braids in my meta. Though I catch a lot of flak in my group for wanting Karakas unbanned as well.

[@adencornell5580]

Staff of domination plus voyaging satyr plus growing rights of itlmoc with omnath as your commander or just cast a walking ballista

[@thenussix]

I would love it if they changed the name of the list, if instead of "Banlist" it was a "list of cards we think can be problematic" or something like that, i could use Primeval Titan to get 2 Forests per turn, but the guy playing Azuza cant put Marit Lage into play turn 3, it would get people to talk about the powerlevel of their decks a bit more and some cards are really just on the banlist because they CAN be abused, not because they are ALWAYS overpowered

[@shenronsgoldfish]

I personally enjoy that the cards are banned cause it draws a firm line in what's acceptable like I don't want prime time unbanned because it's the best resource generater for green decks and every deck would become a primetime deck now a days probably with field of the dead

[@firstandlast.1254]

@@shenronsgoldfish I think it's a good thing to have a firm line to separate what's acceptable and what's not. The problem is that this particular banlist doesn't really do that. Coalition victory is banned, but many other similar effects aren't. Biorythym is banned, shaman of forgotten ways isn't. Prophet of kruphix is banned, seedborn muse isn't. These cards aren't all exactly the same, but they're similar enough that it's not really accurate to say that this banlist provides a clear, solid line of what's acceptable and what is not.

[@shenronsgoldfish]

@@firstandlast.1254 i mean the coalition i think has just been forgotten about as being banned tbh~ there are very large power gaps between the other examples you use however. biorythym being a surprise that you just cast makes it harder to react to then shaman of the forgotten ways which has summoning sickness on it's ability as well as a condition that has to be met. prophet of kruphix gives all your creatures flash in addition to untapping lands which is a lot stronger than just untapping lands . like the line i see drawn is winning with bio out of no where or at least dropping everone super low is not cool but you wanna jank it out with a number of cards to combo with the shaman go nuts, if you want to untap lands every turn thats fine if you want to flash in creatures that aren't normally instant speed while you do that's a problem. sorry to wall of text you like that my dude

[@firstandlast.1254]

@@shenronsgoldfish lol no need to apologize I definitely understand the reasoning for the cards being banned, mostly pointing out that the banlist sometimes sends mixed signals. Regardless, rule 0 tends to address every one of these issues; talk with your playgroup and come to an understanding before playing.

[@SwanEdward]

i wouldnt mind seeing tolarian academy unbanned, Gaeas cradle is unbanned and green decks can tutor that thing out with no problem and abuse the hell out of it, artifact decks typically arent green, so theyll have a bit more trouble finding it, and the game has plenty of mass artifact destruction now.

[@kingfuzzy2]

I've seen mono green artifacts but you are right.

[@TOFWHY]

You can't win on turn 1 with a gaea's cradle.

[@raydelmartinez2905]

Nice episode, I did not know commander was out for so long

[@TOFWHY]

It used to be unofficial and it was called Elder Dragon Highlander. EDH.

[@expertionis794]

Unban prophet of kruphix i didnt like having to swap her for lighthouse cronologist

[@matthewhenson4566]

I'd like Rofellos unbanned. I don't think he should be but I wish he was.

[@DanMeisterZ]

Things that I thing shoiuld be banned: Protean Hulk and Worlgrorger. Same problem as back in the day. Unbanned: Braids(just for my pleasure) and Gifts ungiven (because why is the land version allowed but not this one). To be fair.. a lot of them could be unbanned, but people like me would try to break them in casual or Cedh. Because that is what's so much fun in mtg. Grabbing al the cards and making a puzzle and breaking it. But most of them are there for a good reason (yes, even Coalition Victory).

[@Ryluth]

I play painter's servant with life force and Compost in my mono green enchantment deck. When I'm producing 20+ mana a turn I can just counter anything and everything while drawing cards at the same time. It's pretty broken honestly

[@darkmatter32x]

Would love to see Yawgmoth's Bargain. Then again, that is absurdly powerful.

[@edh_alters7116]

Well just at 3 black mana you can use the same card at your end step with Necropotence. Cheating Bargain out early would be great but at 6 mana it will be easier for your opponents to interact with it. Seriously don't know why it's still banned.

[@paranormacops]

Im hoping braids eventually becomes unbanned because magus of the abyss is practically a less powerful version of her and my play group have had braids around for a while, mainly me and we dont find it to be that threatening its just another tax we gotta pay attention to

[@khrisbell548]

I know its broken, but i want my paradox engine back.. :(

[@SlaytanicSuperstarr]

I was playing Commander in 98 and I've never divided 200 life point, maybe some groups did but none that I know of.

[@JoeyjojoShabadoo7]

I remember Channel was unbanned for like two weeks at one point around 9-10 years ago. I was so psyched cuz I ran eldrazi in an Intet deck. Found out on a weekly Saturday edh block at a FLGS. Played the next week at the store with it. Got to combo once with it. Was cool. Came back the next week, and it was banned again. Was like make up your mind already. 🙄

[@killersamson7881]

Unban Balance, it's very situational and mono white or Boros needs to put them Mana rampers, hand size generators, and token creators in their place. 😈

[@anthonydelfino6171]

Pretty sure you're the only other person I've seen advocating for the unbanning of this card. Also the arguments that you can just float mana and do broken things with Balance apply to literally every other land destruction card out there, so I'm not buying that's the reason this card needs to be banned.

[@weirdproq]

I knew about Painter's Servant being banned becuase it combo'd with Millstone, but I didn't even think how it works with Iona. OOF! That sounds almost worse than when Leovold was legal.

[@Myndi84]

2011, 2012... Everyone knows, one names years after Magic sets.

[@adams3627]

I wonder what the logic behind unifying the commander/99 banlist was? There are loads of legendary creatures that only become broken when you can endlessly bring them back to reuse them, it seems perfectly reasonable to segregate the banlists, especially when so many legendaries date from before commander was even a format, let alone a codified one WotC could take into account for game design.

[@TheGrifcannon22]

I would like to see Rofellos unbanned. It may not be as bad now with everything else we have. There's plenty of ways to stop it and single target removal is fairly popular as seen by your most popular cards episode.

[@Evan_Floyd]

I feel like I remember necropotence being banned at one point in the early days of edh for me.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Might have been your local playgroup too.

[@Theneonwind]

I'd like to see both trade secrets and upheavel unbanned.

[@thecrownedninja1808]

Hi new player here I have a question Can I use card from older set from say the late 90 early 2000’s?

[@C.J.33]

for commander? yes. Unless it's on the banned list, you can play it. No matter what set it came from.

[@thecrownedninja1808]

C.J. Wooo thank u!

[@C.J.33]

@@thecrownedninja1808 I feel I should mention that gold and silver bordered cards are banned too. You won't see them on the list, individually anyway. Gold bordered "Champion deck cards" are banned in every format and silver bordered are the "Un" sets which are banned in pretty much every format as well. Un has its own thing going on but it's not really a format.

[@therealax6]

@@C.J.33 Gold-bordered cards aren't specifically "banned" because they simply aren't considered (official) cards. For rules purposes, they are considered proxies. Which means, treat them as such: some people will be okay with them, some will not; ask first.

[@C.J.33]

@@therealax6 obviously if someone says they're okay with you playing them in like kitchen table magic then yes, but in tournament play, they're banned regardless of what the opponent says.

[@Burnul]

honestly, I want emrakul the aeons torn unbanned because it is my favorite card. like it is so broken and easy to cheat out it would be a ton of fun to play, but the downside is it's to much fun to play against.

[@geekdude1]

jsyk at the start of test of endurance's intro ya said beacon of unrest rather than beacon of immortality

[@PieBandit]

I kinda wish they would unban prophet of kruphix. I get why they banned it, but it's also a very fragile creature. Definitely not biased at all because it's perfect for a morph Commander deck I play *whistles innocently*

[@anthonydelfino6171]

It's not all that fragile when the person playing her always has the mana open to defend her from removal (and is in some very powerful card draw colors to make sure that their hand is loaded up enough to have the means to do so)

[@cursedluigi]

Id like to see prophet of kruphix unbanned. Yes, it is extremely powerful and easy to cheat out, being a creature, but there's already so many effects that are similar to it, and other cards/combo pieces that are just as strong if not stronger. It dies to removal, it costs 5 mana, and if it's only going to be a problem in CEDH, then let the casuals play with it just like flash hulk and thassa's oracle.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Yes, unban it it's definitely not too broken

[@danieldonaldson744]

Rules Committee: We can make a game where 4 people sit around with a hundred cards on the table, manage the stack, and find a way to make sense of the game as its being played. Rules Committee: Banned as a Commander is just tooooo hard for these kids. That move was total chicken shit. Based on some very quickly deleted comments on MTGSalvation, the reason was because going live with 2 ban lists was overlooked in the MTG software, and having 1 ban list was just easier. Braids is awful as a commander, but as one of the 99 she's a solid addition to attrition based control decks. Such a weak self-hamstringing move that's had repercussions since then.

[@AcogR4C]

People: I'm early Me:Laughs in Korea it's 10 pm LOL

[@c0barsm]

Recurring Nightmare. The card is just as fair as Hulk, and prob more fair with how many combo's that kill on the spot Hulk can get nowadays with Thasa's Oricle. It is just nostalgic value good stuff and I want it back so bad!

[@JoeyjojoShabadoo7]

Hidetsugu was banned? I’ve had a Hidetsugu deck for the last 10 years. Must’ve been banned before the combat commander damage was instilled.

[@JoeKell365]

i'd be okay if the RC unbanned Coalition Victory. not only do you have to control all the colors among your creatures and all the basic land types, but if you somehow lose either a color or a basic land type, the spell resolves without effect and the game continues. plus, if you resolve a Coalition Victory, you definitely deserve to win that game

[@therealax6]

It's probably a lot more OP when you can have effects that give lands every basic land type (Dryad of the Ilysian Grove comes to mind). Your commander is probably all colors in that deck. So that's really only three cards you need: your commander, the card that gives lands all basic land types, and one land.

[@ninacochrane569]

I still think OG Odric should be banned. It has all the hallmarks of being banable. - Uninteractive? Check. Doesn't target a player or their permanents so hexproof/preventative measures do nothing. - Powerful? Yes. "I choose that none of your creatures block" is just obnoxious. - Uninterruptible? Yup! Cannot be stifled. - Feels Bad moments? Check. Having all your mana dorks block and die just sucks. - Fast? Seen it online and punching by turn three. I hate Odric, Master Tactician so much, he's my Lord Windgrace. I had a guy at my LGS who played Odric and every game I'd either have to focus him in multi player, or just concede 1v1s as we sat down. Eventually he built a Brago blink deck, and it was at least tolerable.

[@kingfuzzy2]

Against odric run humility or something that punishes his effects bming everyone.

[@Tariq8ification]

Skip to 1:44 to cut to the chase.

[@chewdustfreeze]

Unban everything! Leave the banning to playgroups. This is a casual fun format.

[@thepi3rad3r]

If your playgroup is all fine with playing some of the currently banned cards then just do it, you don't need to follow the banlist if it's casual

[@conlanrichichi2328]

The commander ban list needs to get it's act together.

[@xwwg1wgax277]

Removed ** lol

[@firstandlast.1254]

Agreed

[@kingfuzzy2]

Everything except for worldfire needs to be unbanned and if primeval Titan is unbanned it needs an errata.

[@firstandlast.1254]

@@kingfuzzy2 lol what a horrible idea. What's wrong with worldfire? The banlist, while definitely not perfect, serves an important purpose.

[@hiddenleaf414]

aragonjohn7 ??? Have you played against a Stax Braids/Leovold??

[@abusofnuns9499]

Please make a deck tech for Arasta of the Endless Web, and Ayara, first of locthwain!!!

[@dr_mayday813]

I want to see recurring nightmares unbanned. Out of all the cards on the banlist, that one I don't get.

[@thrash208]

As much as I love reoccurring nightmare I totally get it. It's basically untargetable repeatable recursion and at 3 mana no less just impossible to deal with unless you have a counterspell or kroisin grip.

[@xwwg1wgax277]

@@thrash208 yeah absurd card lololol the less you understand why it's banned the more it prob should be. If we were allowing ban lists lol I say no altogether but nightmare should be banned over flash and iona. Not playing magic is a part of playing Magic lol

[@theroxenes]

@@thrash208 "impossible to deal with unless you have a counterspell or kroisin grip." How so? The ability can only be activated at sorcery speed. If any removal gets pointed at it before you activate it, it gets blown up.

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

I've found that path to eternity is just a better version, since the flipside is a land, instant speed and cant be countered after it first enters

[@kingfuzzy2]

Put Laquatus's Disdain on an ichochron scepter deck yourself and opponents deck is shut off.

[@julianb.f4007]

But what about 1v1 commander?? (Lol jk)

[@RedCometNurse]

Tolarian Academy isn't inherently any more busted than Gaea's Cradle or Serra's Sanctum. Token generation breaks all three. So I kinda want to see Tolarian Academy back.

[@SenseiShional]

You can't pop free enchantment that produce mana on turn 1, drop serra's sanctum, tap it for urza and proceed to win on turn 1 with serra' s or gaea's.

[@haydndale402]

Trade secrets my play group allows this card but 99% of the time they only draw 1 or 2 cards

[@PaulGaither]

Why was Beacon banned? Before 2008, most creatures were bad. Of the good ones, most were good as cheap agro threats for 20 life durls, combo enablers, or control finishers. Take a moment ask ask yourself how many creatures you play were printed in 2008 or after... then ask what powerful non-creature spells do you play which were originally printed in 2007 or prior. • Hexproof wasn't a keyword and only about 5 creatures had it. • Creatures with EtB triggers existed, but most spells on a stick were far and few between, and most were kind of trash. • Infect didn't exist. • Even token swarms were not really a thing. Sure, squirrels existed, but tokens only came into their own after Spectral Procession proved its worth in the original Black White tokens decks... which was also 2008 and later. • I could go on... but the game has changed a lot.

[@lukenzur1667]

cards that are not one sided should not be banned as well cards that require other cards - such as: Balance, Braids-Cabal Minion, Coalition Victory, Sway of the Stars, Upheaval, and Worldfire - hey if you can cast it, well you earned it and the commander Leovold - sure it limits draw ability but if played at my table, he would be an auto target of removal quickly, so how many times can you play him... most commanders are auto targets and if its a 99er - he can be removed permanently ... so idk, maybe in cedh but i dont play cedh

[@crushcreate1461]

I think they should try to shrink the banlist as far down as possible simply for ease of use. Cards like Iona and Biorhythm don't need to be banned. Only cards that are powerful to the point of breaking the game. I would even go as far as unbanning the mox.

[@corekidfrom9700]

I'd like to see Emrakul (aeons torn) unbanned, BUT, with the rule of the "Banned in the 99/as a commander", because I don't know what's difficult about that rule. And why Emrakul ? It's awful as the command zone, both for the player having her as a commander and for the opponants, it restrains her controler to a colorless deck, not the best, and it's a pain for your opponants because they know that she will hit the battlefield In my playgroup, they've been nice enaugh to let me put the card in the 99 of my Golos Eldrazi themed deck, and yes I won with this card, but.. 3 times? It was just luck when I drew her for the most times, and the majority of times, my oppenent killed me faster than what it takes me to cast her (either hard casying or cheating), so yeah.. why not unbanning her?

[@linushernandezris6647]

Why was Kokusho banned?

[@kingfuzzy2]

Combos and a higher power level than most cards then.

[@noahwolff5455]

So glad painters servant was unbanned. I'm building scarecrow tribal edh and I really need that janky ass combo to go off just once

[@CidHighwindRocks]

Unban balance. Green is by far the most powerful colour in commander part of that is the general rule of mass land destruction. Balance removes alot of but not all land. Also white needs all the help it can get.

[@thepi3rad3r]

I don't know why gifts ungiven, panoptic mirror or recurring nightmare are banned

[@TOFWHY]

Because Panoptic Mirror gives you infinite turns and there are shit loads of extra turn cards

[@thepi3rad3r]

@@TOFWHY Yeah, I understand that part. But there are tons of other infinite turn combos, and a few of them, ie ezuri or narset, involve commanders, making them aruably more reliable. Plus, there are other infinite combos that are cheaper or more resilient. And they don't seem to have a stance of wanting to ban other infinite combos, so I'm just confused why they chose this one.

[@lthammox]

Think they should unban Rofellos and Tolarian Academy. Yes , they are stronger than Serra’s Sanctum and Gaea’s Cradle, but these kinds of effects are not more broken than other cards like Urza etc.

[@calebb1178]

Tolarian academy would ve a staple in any artifact deck and would male urza unstoppable, the value it generates is insane hence its banning

[@muffinshorts8993]

Honestly, I wish CEDH had it's own banlist. I'd love to see braids, paradox engine, and leovold shake up the meta.

[@Sophia-sh1ky]

One card im surprised is not banned is child of alara, considering how un-fun it is to play against that thing

[@1bluebirdz]

Rofellos should be unbanned already, we go so many effects similar to his now that it's almost inconsequential to keep him banned.

[@lolimmune]

Unban braids! I wanna Dark rit sol ring, turn one braids

[@dabarles]

I would like Karakas to come off the ban list. Some commanders are way to powerful and there are also a random smattering of annoyances that happen to be legendary. Since it's just a bounce effect, it's not like it's straight removal. Since commander is also a multiplayer format, having to deal with everyone's commanders/legendaries puts a strain on the effect. It's also limited to white only; a color already known for creature removal. Controversial opinion, but one that I think is fair.

[@TOFWHY]

If Karakas exiled itself it'd be fine. But are you really saying that if your opponent was bouncing your commander at their first priority, EVERY time you got them in, you wouldn't get pissed off?

[@dabarles]

@@TOFWHYI'm saying it's getting to be a necessary evil. A lot of decks I play are focused on rigidity without the commander being an absolute, so opposing karakas isn't too terrible a pain. Plus, the karakas player has to juggle several opponents. And it does have a mana ability that they may need to use. It'd be like saying "oh no. They keep using Rishadin Port on my Gaea's Cradle." Because that's fair Magic.

[@TheDaneamal]

Iona. I considered her my third strongest angel in my Kaalia and had her in it since I first built it then, wham! Banned. Also prophet of kruphix. If im allowed to run Narset as a commander. I should be allowed to use a card that allows turns to move to an opponent. Even if i do get really good value.

[@anthonydelfino6171]

As the person at a table more than once playing a mono-color deck, no to Iona. One of my first matches ever and I had just build Krenko, was the only person at the table playing red at all, and one of my opponents pops down Iona and names red. It really sucks to be the one person just sitting there while everyone else gets to play if you're not killed, and it's just as bad if you are picked off as a result and the game then continues without you for another hour.

[@muffinshorts8993]

@@anthonydelfino6171 the problem is that there are other ways to do this in the format like contamination. If something is unfair like prophet of kruphix, then I can understand banning it, but I don't think we should ban cards for being "not fun". If we're doing that, then we may as well ban all counterspells.

[@anthonydelfino6171]

Not being fun is literally the reason they gave for banning Iona. So.... I understand your opinion, but it seems the rule committee would disagree. Additionally while some people look at counterpsells as being unfun, others aren't bothered when their spells are countered... whereas I can't name a single person playing a mono colored deck shut down by Iona who was still having fun. Iona is a single card that can lock someone out of the game entirely, counterspells stop one spell from resolving, very different in scale.

[@muffinshorts8993]

@@anthonydelfino6171 the problem is that fun is relative. I agree, getting shut out of a game sucks, but iona was a fringe card that has answers. There's plenty of colorless removal to deal with it. I'm just not a fan of a card being banned in any format because it's miserable to play against. We have mass land destruction, flash hulk, stacks decks etc. Most people find those archetypes unfun, unless you're piloting them. All I'm saying is that "Sheldon thinks this card is oppressive" is a very poor standard. But that's what we've got for now :/

[@anthonydelfino6171]

Plenty? Not really... and most of them aren't cards you'd run unless either your meta has an issue with rampant Ionas or unless they fit your deck archetype. If I'm playing mono white, there's not really a reason to run, say, Scour from Existence when white struggles to ramp and has access to much more efficent forms of removal. Addiitonally most of the forms you can use are slow and require you to have the card available to you to play already, since you can't use your colored spells to tutor it up (no using that Enlightened Tutor to find Spine of Ish Sah) In my experience, I often had to rely on other players to answer Iona when playing a mono colored deck since usually my answers were colored cards, and that in itself was the reason she was so oppressive to mono colored decks. Also it's fair to say that they probably wanted to enable more creative decks by unbanning Painter's Servant than keep Iona in play and make decks able to do a two card, completely lock everyone out of the game combo.

[@triploshadow]

I don't think theres a reason for Roffellos to be banned anymore, not with nissa and nyxbloom already generating tons of mana.

[@Ianoxen]

Its not just the amount of mana but the speed. Having Rofellos makes it sure that you have a first/second turn mana dork that doubles your mana as early as second/third turn. And that is EVERY game if hes your commander.

[@triploshadow]

@@Ianoxen He dies to any sort of incidental damage like literally anything kills him plus you will only get value out of him on turn 3 where you can add an extra 3 mana considering no1 dealt with him. Also you have to build a monogreen deck which locks you out on many greats cards.

[@Ianoxen]

@@triploshadow But you could say that with any commander that has a toughness of 1. The deal with him is even though he is fragile and not strong himself the amount of ramp is ridiculous. Even if he is monogreen, having consistent access to for example 6 green mana on the third turn in almost every game is powerful which deems him bot enjoyable to play against especially in casual formats. Not all players have removal ready in their opening hands.

[@triploshadow]

Nai Xo you won’t win as monogreen simply with ramp. It is strong yeah but its not broken specially since you have 2-3other players most of the time. I mean yeah you can probably play some huge creatures on turn 3-4 but the players with white or black can probably kill them or wipe the board with even less effort.

[@herald9204]

Honestly? Fastbond. Green ramp kinda weak, it needs the help

[@catboy_on_main]

I dont wanna make green stronger but Rofellos still being banned is kinda dumb imho

[@Blackvolttage]

Balance, by a long shot. How yawgmoth's will isnt banned when balance is?

[@kvetchenfinks7044]

Unban biorhythmn. An 8 mana sorcery that can win you the game is fair!

[@xwwg1wgax277]

My favorite card I never played with lol

[@alexgillard7886]

UNBAN BRAIDS, CABAL MINION I just want bae back :(

[@JalebJay]

I'm trying to figure out the reason that it's banned. I think the main issue is turn 1 dark ritual, sol ring, braids and everyone is locked out of playing the game cause they lose their lone land every turn.

[@alexgillard7886]

@@JalebJay It really is strong as a commander. But in the 99 it's pretty much just a weak Smokestack. They got rid of the 2 different lists because it was "confusing" apparently.

[@Mattress1996]

No fuck off -sincerely, people that like to play magic