Fox Reviews | Ultima VIII: Pagan

[@justiceplay_s]

so yeah this was the first game I ever bought on my own at 14, paid full price for this game, and the walk home with the huge box that has fire on it and a huge Wiccan Pentacle on it was the thing to remember!

[@mercster]

Pentagram is an ancient symbol, Wicca is a very modern 20th century invention.

[@stigkenobi7525]

Wasn't Wiccan. The Pentagram is inverted.

[@pureumkim5154]

It is a miracle that I beat this game without understanding much English when I was young- I just killed everything on site. For the jumping platforms, a lot of saves and loads. Not even sure how I figured out that I had to trap the elements in stones...but I somehow did it...Anyway, I still have fond memories despite so much frustration and hours lost-

[@JustMe99999]

They did release a patch that made the jumping easy... still a shit game though.

[@MichelLamblin]

I remember I beat this, but only after I sent a TYPED LETTER by MAIL to EA explaining this one part in the game that would constantly crash and having them send me another set of 3.5" disks to reinstall the game... or it might have been a patch. Hard to remember. Pre-internet PC gaming was an ADVENTURE.

[@JustMe99999]

There was an official patch.

[@Mordy.]

I'm pretty sure that statue lines were MEANT to be that way. The old Pagan religion system was about Love vs War and in the middle a bored arbiter with little to no emotions that served as justice or something :P

[@Tybron]

Yes, that was the Zealot of Apathy. Both Fox and Spoony mocked the delivery of the lines for being bad acting, but given the character was deliberately supposed to be apathetic I'd say his VA was spot-on.

[@Chernobog2]

An easy way to remember the difference between stalagmites and stalactites is that stalaGmites are on the ground and stalaCtites are on the ceiling

[@iambumpy]

I loved the shit out of this game when I was a kid

[@michaelnorrisisdabesteva]

I really wanna see the game properly remade (fleshed out, upgraded, properly finished). Im sure theres some fans out there who would want to do this, I haven't heard of a project of this manner yet though.

[@navystylz]

I'm currently in research mode of building it in Divinity Engine 2 if that style of play interested you. I love Pagan and I also love Divinity Original Sin 2 and feel that platform adds a lot of the core Pagan elements while giving nice graphics and the ability to spin camera in world. Though the most jarring aspect for most would be a turn based combat. But considering the combat in U8 is nearly non existent, might not be a bad thing at all.

[@House2017]

You are the reason why I found Noah Antiwiler. :) Loved his Ultima 9 review.

[@hungarianbeast]

Strange, couse I watched Spoony reviews back when they came out. Now let's check mr Fox out :)

[@ryano9425]

Have fond memories of this game only because it was the first RPG (if you can call it that) I ever played on my brand new 486 after getting a bunch of copied games off a friends older brother. I was absolutely enthralled with the dark world. Wasn’t until 4 years later I got my hands on Ultima VII that I realised how much better the previous release was and if I put 100 hours into VIII , I put 300 into VII , even in 1998. Nice reviews of them both man!

[@JustMe99999]

VII was a masterpiece; it still holds up today. It was the last true Ultima.

[@Francois424]

When playing Ultima 8, you kind of have to re-learn how to do basic things. As you said, ven walking proves to be a challenge. Most of the fun I had in-game was picking a house for myself (there are many choices), and stocking my reagents/items there. Reading the in-game lore thru books mostly, is for the most part interesting and intriguing. I only played the patched version and I never felt the challenges where unfair (well unless you drop thru invisible lava pits that is). I really enjoyed taking my time (as is the case in most Ultima, barring 9) exploring every corner, making my own maps, and finding as much as I can. I played it 3 times, '94, '99ish and 2005, using dosbox, and to me knowing the game upfront really improved my pleasure from playing thru it. This game, alongst with 6 and 9 are the game that should be remade. U6 is good but the engine is absolute crap. If the game was remade in the U7p2 engine, it would be very very good. U3 should also be remade with the U5 engine (or better nowadays, why not) as it's just good enough but the clunky mechanics for party/inventory/food management did not age well. I do not trust EA to make proper remake, even if one of their lead programmer/designer is none only the genius behind U5: Lazarus. But I can always hope. Nice review, and thank you !

[@navystylz]

One of my favorite things as well, was setting up my own home. Especially once becoming master sorcerer.

[@MSDOSProject]

U2 really should be remade as well. The game has tons of good ideas and interesting concepts but the execution was pretty horrible

[@MSDOSProject]

Also there is a team remaking Ultima 6 in the Ultima 7 engine right now, it looks like they are getting decently close to done too

[@gabm999]

@15:36 I'm dying, LoL. Now i can remember the frustration! In them days, you just had to deal with it, but it was therapy joking about it with my other friends who also played it. Good times.

[@hong-enlin4651]

I loved the music, the game was immersive in it's own way.

[@JustMe99999]

Ultima ended with 7. 8 is a bad game and 9 is a crime against humanity. Real slap in the face to those of us that grew up on these games. At least they used the engine of 8 for a good game (Crusader).

[@SHUPIRATE1991]

I actually played this game because it came free with a computer I bought back in the day. I actually enjoyed its quirky style and dark tone. It was frustrating and I did not complete it because of the bugs but I actually enjoyed it and still look upon it fondly to this day.

[@fucheduck]

Ultima VIII is the eighth game as Serpent Isle was an extenson on tracking down a fugitive named Batlin and part of the story as two parter on a TV series. U 8 is another story. the Avatar hasa voice but other than uttering David Banner outcires he says nothing aloud only in text.

[@mipammoudry5118]

I disagree with the music assessment, the Tenebrae theme is excellent. The combat is broken probably because of pentagram.

[@RealMarcFoxx]

Unfortunately, the combat was always broken -- you can read about it in reviews of the original DOS version of the game. It was one of the more heavily criticized aspects of the game.

[@ThoriumWorksUK]

@@RealMarcFoxx In regards to the ghost being hard to kill, you're not supposed to fight them normally, you are supposed to exorcise them, it says that in the original manual for the game :)

[@Fullbatteri]

REVIEW TIME ON! I was really exited to see how this review would go, excelent as alwasy!

[@philippemts88]

A lot of people hate this game and i agree that some mechanics, like platforming, are broken, but the lore, soundtrack and atmosphere of this game are awesome. I wish someone could make a remake of this on Skyrim engine, would be interesting.

[@RealMarcFoxx]

The Ultima series is ripe for official remakes, but with EA owning Origin and its IPs, I doubt that will happen. Would be great to see the entire series remade, especially Ultima VII!

[@Nah_Bohdi]

@@RealMarcFoxx Only for them to remake it like FF7 and its a run of the mill open world RPG cookie cut like all other games because its made for kids of today instead of the adult of today that played the original? Do you like watching the world burn?

[@MSDOSProject]

I've recently heard from someone that there is a known copy of the Lost Vale out there, maybe one day we will get lucky and it will get leaked to the public.

[@fucheduck]

if they get it to a workable add on I hope they don't 2020sIfy it and only respect the original atmosphere and stick to the Richard Garriot 1994 plot alone.

[@mercster]

The SCUMMVM engine for U8 might be a little more mature... probably based on Pentagram but cleaned up.

[@StarLord66X]

Just watched MJR retrospective and this box art HOOKED me inside.

[@timm_3r]

I remember paying $30 for the speech pack for this. So worth it even if the game is a miserable jaunt.

[@argentorangeok6224]

That first voice sounded like David Spade. I kinda liked the game except for the jumping and the game locking up right before the ending.

[@drrobert7543]

Nice review; at some point I was struck with nostalgia for this game as well, but your review reminded me of the many disappointing aspects. After all these years it’s nice to know I wasn’t the only one who relied heavily on a walkthrough for this game.

[@captainthrall]

You played Ultima 8 in 16x9? wtf is wrong with you?

[@AcceleratingUniverse]

i think your issue with the low accuracy at max stats (and enemies disappearing off screen) came from pentagram and not the game itself.

[@AcceleratingUniverse]

and the strength of the enemy you are attacking has a direct effect on how quickly you level up your stats

[@MSDOSProject]

Idk even Noah Antwiler noted the same issue and I doubt he was using pentagram

[@mynameisroman]

In Ultima 7 and 7 Serpent Isle i knew what i was supposed to do. so i had a goal, puzzles to solve and finished those games. in ultima 8 i was pretty much clueless most of the times what i was supposed to do. yeah i want to leave Pagan but still no clue where to go next. the fighting system was crap. i never finished that game. don't even know how far i got. and don't ask about Ultima 9. I just revently sold it almost in Mint condition because it was so buggy i only spent maybe 30 minutes playing it. was a great series that's probably almost forgotten these days

[@beste_computerspiele]

Thank you, great Review 👍

[@Hammer2k11]

I still have the box of Ultima 9 and it was the most amazing game box ever (for it's time) also including a ton of goodies like the Tarot cards. It's a shame that 9 was so incredibly bad.

[@OldGamerStuff]

I still have nostalgia for the game, but there's nothing in your review I really disagree with. Ultima IX still needs to be reviewed though!

[@avatarklh]

psychedelic mushrooms seems to be left out of this review

[@invisiblesun6595]

I'm going to attempt to play this in DOSBox soon. I've seen and read about it enough that despite the issues with it curiosity has won me over. Quick question for, well, anyone really: has anyone managed to play it with an Xbox controller as opposed to the mouse and keypad successfully?

[@angelinaarnes206]

I got the game when I was 11 because I thought it was edgyyyy

[@Lunarbob19]

I don't understand why you keep saying there is no water magic because the game is incomplete. There is no water magic because it was only hereditary, there is no way you could get in on that.

[@anderewrey]

And the voice of Apathas, which is exactly how it should sound! I guess he was more frustrated because of Pentagram emulation (still not finished) than the game itself. That's why the DosBox way is still better.

[@Tybron]

You managed to summon a hostile demon at 16:10 because you had demon bones WAY too close to the pentagram. You can even see in the video those are consumed along with the candles and reagants. Ragequitting the review over something that's actually explained in the game as a hazard for sorcerors (as well as in the Cluebook) was being a bit unfair. The game was definitely rushed by EA and is indeed missing entire plotpoints, quests, etc. and what's even worse is, there was an expansion for Ultima 8 called Beyond the Veil that was actually completed but never released, and no one seems to be able to find it. I've still found myself hit by nostalgia enough to play through Pagan again, unlike U9 which was just that terrible (even with the fan-made patch that replaces the dialogue to make the plot slightly more coherent).

[@ColdPotato]

I can't even remember if I beat this one

[@oldmate4129]

He looks like the avatar from dungeon keeper

[@Kilthan2050]

It is. EA owned both origin and bullfrog at the time. It was an Easter egg

[@oldmate4129]

@@Kilthan2050 cool i did not know that

[@There-Is-No-Virus]

I gave up playing this one - and also 6

[@blipblub2419]

i cannot handle stretched game characters. in my eyes you have committed a cardinal sin

[@RealMarcFoxx]

I'm used to being ex-communicated from the gaming circles.

[@blipblub2419]

@@RealMarcFoxx shh i cant be seen speaking to you

[@salokin3087]

Ok, so why don't you have more subs?

[@RealMarcFoxx]

My channel used to be mainly about the Souls games (Dark Souls, etc). I restructured my channel around being a more generic gaming channel, and deleted many popular videos. Also, KZbin discourages smaller channels and is pushing channels like mine out of most recommendations.

[@theequitableprose]

Nothing has changed between 1993, 1998, 2004, 2007, 11 14 16. All useless expansions that add voice packs.

[@theequitableprose]

Expansion packs basically died off after that.

[@ZomgZomg007]

wait this game had a minimap O.o?

[@robjones2206]

Nice choice foxeo really different...appreciate some co op help with artorious ds1 if possible?

[@Lofote]

Wait, the music doesn't stand out, isn't memorable? I can't believe that because the soundtrack especially the song from the Docks, Tenebrae and the title always stuck in my mind :-D Of course only when played on a good wavetable soundtrack. Compared to U7 soundtrack which sounds rather cheesy in my opinion... ...but so opinion differ it seems ;)

[@alexbrewis9607]

Agree all the way!

[@mbarker_lng]

God this was a horrid game. It was where I stepped off the Ultima train since U3 and never returned. My brother stuck it out longer. I remember sudden death traps, like a boulder falling out of the sky and crushing him in one shot. And the reload times, even on a higher end machine took an insanely long time.

[@hrungnir00008psp]

I disagree. Ultima 8 was the pinnacle of ultima games.

[@JustMe99999]

You must not have grown up on the games.

[@supercompooper]

I hated this game because of some crash bug and i could never finish it.

[@ankha6415]

I agree, the voice pack was trash.

[@awelder4040]

Yea, you are right this game really sucks...