Before Elves & Men - What did Ancient Tamriel Look Like? - Elder Scrolls Lore

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In our latest Elder Scrolls video we investigate what ancient Tamriel would have looked like before elves and men.
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The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim is an open world action role-playing video game developed by Bethesda Game Studios and published by Bethesda Softworks. It is the fifth main installment in The Elder Scrolls series, following The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, and was released worldwide for Microsoft Windows, PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 on November 11, 2011.
The game's main story revolves around the player character and their quest to defeat Alduin the World-Eater, a dragon who is prophesied to destroy the world. The videogame is set two hundred years after the events of Oblivion, and takes place in the fictional province of Skyrim. Over the course of the game, the player completes quests and develops the character by improving skills. The game continues the open world tradition of its predecessors by allowing the player to travel anywhere in the game world at any time, and to ignore or postpone the main storyline indefinitely.
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[@chrisdupuis2523]

Frost giant's are easy to explain. See a giant was caught in a fierce blizzard and was forced to seek shelter or perish. This unfortunate giant managed to find a cave which was already inhabited by a somewhat open minded frost troll. After some time and with the blizzard not letting up any time soon the giant thought "eh, what the hell. Any port in a storm I guess" and the rest is history.

[@richardgrice3865]

Brooooooo you made my day!

[@Thor-Orion]

I’m your 69th like. I don’t usually point it out, but on this comment I’ll make an exception.

[@IIAnaxiezzII]

Still less weird than Kirkbride’s lore lol

[@kritizismmusics9737]

Lmao rumble in the caves lol

[@Nami8302_OwO]

Lusty Frost Troll Cavemate Vol. I

[@edgarrice]

I suppose "cat demons" could have been a reference to the more bestial forms of Khajiit. Perhaps more forms of Khajiit arose over time, with Azura playing some role in their origins.

[@codafett]

The fact that Azura specifically is mentioned as the creator of at least 3 races seems pretty signifigant.

[@zacharysnyder2520]

Do you get to the cloud district much. Oh wait it doesn’t exist.

[@BooGulley]

ofcourse it does. Cloud District was before the creation of Nirn

[@bjaxfl]

Boo Gully I died that was funny 😂😂💀

[@lb5560]

Boo Gully I don’t get it

[@ShadowElectricity]

Zachary Snyder UGF pandas?

[@curtiswong7280]

@@BooGulley Cloud district was the core foundation of Nirn, and Nirn was the excess that was added later on. Get your facts right.

[@Leto85]

In the beginning, there was the Cloud District. Then Nirn was build around it.

[@robertrobertson4181]

Have you been to the Cloud District lately? Oh, what am I saying, of course you haven't.

[@casvandijck9338]

@@robertrobertson4181 I got close when I joined the Skyrim Space Program by provoking a giant

[@savagex466-qt1io]

When that first happen to me I honestly that it was a bug. Then it happen again lol@@casvandijck9338

[@VarangianGuard13]

Killing Nazeem: Everyone liked that!

[@Ashathefree8]

Sure I should go to sleep and watch this tomorrow, but on the other hand I’d like to dream about what I watch here.

[@Logan_93]

I fall asleep to camelworks CCC videos normally.

[@Logan_93]

Many vivid Elder Scrolls dreams.

[@SenketsuFi]

Your a truely cultured individual.

[@roercula8425]

The culture is mighty with this one

[@Leto85]

@Jeremiah Kivi Isn't that scary? Or wait, it's probably not. Scary is something after all.

[@ghjfghjfj]

I'm up at 4am and this is my reward.

[@TheDragongod1128]

Same

[@joshuamendivil784]

Same

[@whispro4646]

It’s 2 am here but same

[@jacked4121]

Literally read this at 3:59

[@Jinisinsane]

Skyrim level up drums*

[@karmaraquette3363]

Aren't the minautor a intelligent species like the goblins? They use weapons, spells and in oblivion some proctected the last unicorn.

[@snxffys6436]

I’m used to Greek mythology and the beast coming from a woman who mated with a cow

[@barkasz6066]

FoopNoop *Bull. Cows are female. It was Pasiphae, the wife of king Minos who mated with a sacrificial white bull sent by Poseidon, and produced the Minotaur. (Minotauros, meaning Minos’s bull, so weird etymology in TES).

[@OuterRimPride]

My guess is that minotaurs were cast out of society by the Alessian Order and grew savage over time, after the rule of Emperor Belharza, who may have been one. It's likely the fanatical order wasn't a fan of beast hybrids besmirching their perfect story of the Empire's foundation and message of mankind's supremacy. I'm inclined to agree with them.

[@fumarc4501]

The Empire should try to reach out to the Minotaurs. They could use the allies after losing Skyrim to the Dragons.

[@curtiswong7280]

@@fumarc4501 The Minotaurs are essentially extinct, or grown so primitive even Nords could be compared to them.

[@DagothDaddy]

If we get Crab people TES 6 I'll lose it

[@Tleanantz]

Crab people already exists in Morrowind and Oblivion

[@thomastakesatollforthedark2231]

@@Tleanantz who then?

[@ceryler.4096]

@@thomastakesatollforthedark2231 The land Dreugh and sea Dreugh are hostile entities that can be found in those games.

[@thomastakesatollforthedark2231]

@@ceryler.4096 Oh. I thought we were talking about a player race

[@ceryler.4096]

@@thomastakesatollforthedark2231 That would be cool, but I doubt it. Some of the Dreugh lore is pretty sweet, what with their coral kingdom dynasties and all.

[@Didwujs]

Damn, why did TES have to nerf the Argonians and other beast races so much. I would love to play as a fox or bird man. Or see the Argonians at their full glory.

[@justin1594]

Well you can play a fox race in Skyrim with a mod lol.

[@fumarc4501]

Bird people would have been cool to see, playable or not.

[@velkarra471]

@@justin1594 As muh as your helpfulness is being appreciated, "there is a mod for it" needs to stop being thrown around. Mods are not substitutions for actual game development in what concerns some stuff.

[@Qbliviens]

I would love to see Argonians more lizard like, like them being able to climb up walls and swim faster in addition to them being able to breath underwater ingame.

[@marsar1775]

@yonson mills hi!

[@davidking6242]

I would love an Elder Scrolls Adventures: Torpal the Pilot

[@EksaStelmere]

Same, would be an interesting concept.

[@Tleanantz]

@@EksaStelmere This as Elder Scroll VI

[@davidking6242]

@@Tleanantz nah Adventures games are slightly different to normal elder Scrolls as adventures are third person action where you play as a set character instead of making your own character like in normal Scrolls

[@fumarc4501]

I’d love to see all the various Beastfolk that used to inhabit Tamriel.

[@davidking6242]

@@fumarc4501 the game should be that you start as Torpal/Topal and he is a young desperate adventurer on his ship the Niben docked at First Hold on the Summerset Isles. From lowly beginings you arrange your crew by sailing across the isles and recruiting adventurers and then begin to chart the seas Wherever you stop you map out the land with explorers and do missions for locals. imagine meeting the bird men of the eight islands and exploring the jungles of cyrodiil, defly guiding your ship past khajit tribes swiping at you or interacting the the queen of the drueghs. so many options.

[@kreb9721]

I think that the Orsimer are indeed a sub-species of Mer. During the quest to find the Dragon Elder Scroll we are tasked with collecting blood samples from all the Elves to simulate the blood of the long lost Dwemer. One of the samples is Orsimer blood, suggesting that the Orcs are Mer or Elves in blood.

[@Darkside-tr3sx]

Orsimer literally translates to 'pig elves' I think

[@fulciserrano]

@@Darkside-tr3sx it translates to pariah folk

[@TengrioftheCrimsonSky]

Programming aside that could be justified with current game logic. He tasks you with collecting the blood of all elven types mentioning them by name. You being a good fetcher after this much time as the dragonboi just do as you're told regardless of your feelings on the matter so you can't be blamed when this crazy guy messes something up.

[@fulciserrano]

@@TengrioftheCrimsonSky he doesn't mess up though, it unlocks the Dwarven cube like he said it would using the different Elvish blood.

[@TengrioftheCrimsonSky]

@@fulciserrano I didn't say it does just giving the perspective if you were actually to go talk to a guy who then needs you to go do Tamriels first ever "Ancestry DNA" test trial lol.

[@kodyjayvin]

Perhaps "Orc" was derived from the material Orichalcum? As the metal is green, if the elves had known of the metal before they went north, then perhaps "Orc" was just used to refer to anything with green skin, and was adapted to include the Orsimer only? It makes sense since goblins have green skin as well

[@jedaye47]

Orc is derived from Orsimer or Pariah Folk

[@faaldeyra]

*Orichalcum is pink in Terraria*

[@kodyjayvin]

@@faaldeyra How is that relevant? It's green in the elder scrolls universe, which is the point I was making

[@faaldeyra]

Kodyjay Pink Skin Orcs.

[@oddindian1]

Orichalcum was named after the orcs.

[@sheogoraththedaedricprince9675]

A time before 🧀!? Inconceivable! You know I really like my cheese. I have sampled many different types. Elder cheese, Mammoth cheese and of course your normal Garden variety of cheese. I have not yet sampled Breton cheeses though.

[@eioiio9263]

Yeesh..

[@vexile12]

So how is the Isles doing?

[@docstoise196]

I had a thought about the Khajiit furstocks. It is generally known that there are 16 distinct types of Khajiit, corresponding to different combinations of the phases of the moons, but the 1st Edition of the Pocket Guide to the Empire asserts in exact words "twenty forms have been documented." It never said that there are currently twenty distinct furstocks of Khajiit. What if the Khajiit being molded from the Bosmer is too literal minded, and were instead changed by supernatural forces as the Orcs, Chimer, and Dunmer were during the course of Tamriel's history? Perhaps the moons' phases which now produce Ohmes and Ohmes-raht gave the Khajiit different forms before the arrival of the elves.

[@tyjake8721]

Why don't fudgemuppet do a mini reading book series like reading books from elder scrolls games ? Coz like we really do be falling asleep to these vids hahaha love the contentttttttt

[@insaincaldo]

Gopher has been reading books, if that is of interest kzbin.info/aero/PLE7DlYarj-DdDXMGeSR6YtEWdepCmsVSB

[@stevencase3289]

@@insaincaldo thank you my life is complete

[@SparkyShepard]

According to the thumbnail,ancient tamriel had some sort of crab people surfing. Man,times truly were better before.

[@TeamJella]

Ok boomer

[@theimmortalmadness8010]

Hm? Like surfboards made out of crab people? Now that would be enjoyable. 😀

[@whitesoldier0666]

ok for real now. who the hell gives dislikes to these vids ????

[@slimjim877]

Filthy, filthy talos worshipers, that's who

[@KuromoriArima]

bots obviously

[@whitesoldier0666]

@@bokrugthewaterserpent3012 honestly im with the empire all the way even thi i hate what they did to my boi Talos.

[@andreapasqua8639]

Now now we could blame Aedra, Daedra, Men or Mer. I would say maybe it is them dirty beastfolk that are good for nothing slaves that suck skooma and Hist. Mind you it could be them vile Sloads.

[@Assmaholic419]

@@slimjim877 who do you think you are

[@thealien2437]

Imagine a DLC where we get to explore an ancient Tamriel

[@davidking6242]

Or an Elder Scrolls Adventures: Merethic Era

[@Revan-eb1wb]

Why a dlc? After 9 years? It makes no sense lol

[@Tleanantz]

>DLC

[@unocualqu1era]

Imagine having such low standards for gaming that you wish for DLC instead of full games or full featured expansions.

[@ElysetheEevee]

Revan 1313 They DO have other games you know, like ones still going on. Given the ESO is what, around 1000 years predated to Skyrim, it would make a little more sense even. Just saying.

[@Hibbsi91]

Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the way Topal describes the Khajiit, following him down the river's edge, reminds me of how the natives were described in Heart of Darkness by Joseph Conrad.

[@hatman3445]

You missed the Thrasian Sloads and the Sea Sloads who in ESO: Summerset claim that Summerset Isles belonged to them.

[@handsdown3521]

@@mobilemusic5006 Thrassian Sloads are native to Thras, not to Lyg. And Sea Sloads are native to the underwater kingdom of Ul'vor Kus.

[@SonGara]

Isn't the entirety of ESO considered non-canon or has that changed?

[@hatman3445]

@@SonGara They never been considered non-canon. Everything that happens in ESO is canon in all of TES universe. Only haters call it non-canon.

[@SonGara]

@@hatman3445 I've seen plenty of fans right it off as fan fiction in regards as how it throws a bunch of the pre-established lore out the window. Dragons existing, Argonians and Dunmers being buddy buddy on the same side despite the fact that they were enslaved to the dark elfs during this era, etc.

[@handsdown3521]

@@SonGara there are no "plenty" of fans who call it a fanfiction. I've only seen a bunch of boomers, who only played skyrim, but label themselves as "fans". There is nothing wrong with dragons being there and argonians and dunmers if you read the lore regarding these topics.

[@js2567]

"Did somebody say. Goblins?" *metal music begins playing*

[@vexile12]

The only good gawblin is a dead goblin so lets make these kid goblins good

[@wanderingdoc5229]

That theory on Orcs and Goblins is very sound

[@MrInternetMan]

14:00 You're forgetting about the Sarpa, a bird-like humanoid type of Argonian.

[@tarponpet]

Sarpa weren't birdlike, they were winged.

[@tomix7712]

@@tarponpet yea, but also Argonians naturally grow feathers. And we're much more spread out. Not saying it is them, but it is a slightly possible theory.

[@AuburnInAutumn]

Birds are relatives of reptiles.

[@oddindian1]

We're not talking about feathers pal. Sarpa literally have reptilian wings.

[@oddindian1]

There are several Argonian types. Paatru, Naga, Archein, Agaceph, saxhleel, etc.

[@KellyVergara]

We have to take much of the history that's learned from in-game books with a grain of salt. The historians that write them get stuff wrong. They say the falmer went blind living in underground for so long. But in the dawn guard dlc we meet what are likely the last two snow elves. The first one tells us that the dwemer were the ones who blinded the snow elves and no one knows how they devolved to become the falmer.

[@Jiub_SN]

That's a Bethesda fabrication to cover their asses when they fuck up lore or do retcons. This wasn't a thing in morrowind. It along with dragon breaks came when Todd Howard decided to change cyrodil into a generic LoTR fantasy world

[@dominic5386]

@@Jiub_SNI thought dragon break was a thing in morrowind and before

[@jamesfrank2108]

You left out Harpys, Ogres, Nymphs/Nereids, Trolls and Dragons in your pre elven pre human map. You don't mention these races that would be in the Merethic Era.

[@AS34N]

Fudge: "...but thats is just a theory." Me: *A Game Theory*

[@alfieingrouille1528]

you should do a vid on the bird people topal the pilot encountered

[@Doralga]

Could have been sapient Harpies hmm

[@alfieingrouille1528]

@@Doralga hmmmmm maybe

[@TheGribblesnitch]

They’ve talked as much as they can about them, father of the Niben is the only mentioning of them

[@alfieingrouille1528]

@@TheGribblesnitch yeah i know

[@fumarc4501]

If they could “fly” maybe they looked more like Harpies, but with bird faces instead of female human faces?

[@fulciserrano]

Really love your theory on the Orcs. Good shit.

[@snakesonaframe2668]

I just want one of those winged snakes. He can sit on my shoulder and I'll name him Fluffy.

[@vexile12]

Those winged sneks are cute but keep it away from me... sneks are so "smooth" that its unsettling

[@snakesonaframe2668]

@@vexile12 there are snakes that aren't smooth! Have you ever seen a western hognose snake? They have what's called keeled scales, to me their scales look like grains of oatmeal lol. They also have chubby cheeks and a cute nose. I have one and his name is Sausage lol.

[@vexile12]

@@snakesonaframe2668 I've seen pissy the hog-nosed cober hehe But i do know that some sneks aren't smooth but they all unsettle me

[@snakesonaframe2668]

@@vexile12 that's perfectly understandable! Lots of people are afraid of snakes. I really enjoy helping people get over their fear of snakes IF THEY WANT TOO and are mentally prepared for it.

[@andreapasqua8639]

What about sloads? If I remember those lil buggers had settlements and dabbled with necromancy and released the plague that ravaged many races.

[@hobbesgoblin2691]

They technically lived off tamerial. In coral cities that now are destroyed

[@VAULT-TEC_INC.]

You guys are KILLING IT with original Elder Scrolls content! Your creativity is in overdrive.

[@slonshiesty580]

Vault TEC wth are u doing here in tamriel hm 🤔🥶

[@StarCrusier900]

I love how that Mountain is having a seizure 12:47

[@cephalonorcan4256]

Honestly I really appreciate you for doing this. You make skyrim lore really accessible and this works as a great jumping off point for your own research

[@chadcolson4082]

"The Elder Srolls: Primal" would be the fire!

[@samfish2550]

I really hope we get a pre merethic era or atleast early merethic era, hell even late merethic era elderscrolls game. I know that it is a vain hope, but I can dream

[@JayLeePoe]

before Elves & Men, it was basically Abe's Oddworld

[@justinjohnson6481]

Just wanna say I love that when I have a question like what was the relationship between the Khajiit and Argonians before the ayleids? There’s a video on that time period from you. Baffles me sometimes, keep it up fudgefam

[@galenjones9529]

Frost giants are likely related to trolls. I think the "normal" giants are indeed related to Nords, as it was said that Nords and giants used to speak a common language before the giant Sinmur and Ysgramor went to war.

[@barkasz6066]

Galen Jones but giants in Skyrim definitely appear more elven.

[@stonedwizard0420]

Giants are literally gods that can't remember they're gods. That's what that particular breed of Et'ada spirit gave up to make Mundus/Nirn--their ability to remember.

[@galenjones9529]

@@barkasz6066 Nords and Giants were once a single race called Atmorans. The difference is that they divided into two seperate races after the Frostfall of Atmora for some reason. In ESO we meet a Nord woman named Lyris. Lyris has a condition exclusive to Nords called "giant's blood". This condition is likely caused by recessive Atmoran genes that makes Nords huge. I spend 70% of my time collecting and reading books and lore in elder scrolls games. I've filled every library tower, bookcase, and chest with books in Skyrim. To the point that I made a character called Thalund the Chronicler for the purpose of hoarding books.

[@Jiub_SN]

@@galenjones9529I'd reccomend doing it in morrowind, the lore their is consistent and less generic

[@bendover9813]

Dragons used to have villages in the mountains before they started ruling, and they were apparently fantastic smiths. Don’t compare them to Spriggans lmao.

[@Hugealligator254]

How not to be Smaug or literally any dragon in middle earth

[@tarponpet]

Where did you get the info of dragons having villages?

[@mfspawn1474]

But they have no hands, how does one wield a Hammer?

[@caintheweirdo9945]

@@mfspawn1474 if they're like birds (like as far I know Elder Scrolls' dragons, maybe?) I think they use their feet and mouth similar to corvids

[@tarponpet]

@Legendary Vocalists I'm not really concerned about the logistics, there seems to be no reliable source on where he got that info so it's not likely true.

[@linguisticallyoversight8685]

Actually I think there's something more to it than that there are quite a few of what can only be described as winded elf statues all over the Imperial province of cyrodiil and they're always found near the Heartland high elf ruins perhaps interbreeding took place another thing that's bothering me is umaril the unfeathered that implies a lot Calling someone unfeathered is a defining something by its opposite if he was unfeathered his contemporaries must have therefore been feathered logic and I've heard people like zaric zhakaron claim that this is a reference to feathered ceremonial Lake necklaces I guess but this actually doesn't make sense specifically because we never see anything like that depicted the Heartland High Elves were very keen on what they chose to depict

[@TheGribblesnitch]

Dont forget Celethel the Singer is said to have killed Huna with an arrowhead ‘Made from his beak’

[@Autipsy]

Why no grammar

[@ceryler.4096]

@@TheGribblesnitch I always assumed it was involvement of Daedra, not a distinct species.

[@TheGribblesnitch]

I used the gramer of the quote ngl

[@user-ys3jq3uf4p]

Judging by lalorian dynar from eso I reckon they weren’t feathered

[@berilsevvalbekret772]

I really hope we will see more interactable species in TES 6 , ESO with updates etc. Centours , Imga those frog people of blackmarshe perhaps snow elves... who knows. I really hope there will be snow elves in future TES 6 since there is a hope there might be more from the paladin.

[@Jiub_SN]

Falmer are dead, though I could see a questline or book about a regeneration mage from the college of winterhold seeking to cure the falmer currently in Skyrim, though being playable or having a large population of them is very unlikely

[@finnirbjrneklo1246]

I couldn't go back to sleep so I checked my notifications and here I am

[@Voltage256]

It would be great if they made a Elder Scrolls game based in the ancient era

[@mysticranger6894]

I feel like we need a quets mod taking us back in time to time before elves and men in tamriel and we encounter those beings there b4.

[@Lotrprofessor1500]

Is it just me or do I keep getting fudgemuppet and Camelworks confused . I love both but, they seem to be the same person.... or are they?

[@cy3125]

Watching this I started wondering about their ship technology. We see the small ships in previous games and if they try to cross an ocean or fight a war in those they're gonna die. The emperor's ship didn't even have cannons to defend with.

[@ВиталийВиталий-п6ч]

Why do you need cannon when you can have some battlemages? Their spells could be more destructive to the enemy crew and ship's hull, especially with fire spells.

[@Jiub_SN]

@@ВиталийВиталий-п6чcannons are cheaper and quicker to learn. Same thing happened irl with the switch from archers to crossbows and then to those extremely rudimentary hand cannons. Mages might be more effective but cannons are still very effective and very easy to use

[@MrToastyTank]

Thank you for your work man we appreciate it

[@jamiethiele460]

The Atmiants of Roscrea supports the idea that giants and humans are closely related.

[@Julian-vl7vn]

Could you make a video diskussing the 36 lessons of vivec and their meaning? (if they have any)

[@barkasz6066]

Julian foul murder

[@vexile12]

Double Negative has done so

[@justsomejerseydevilwithint4606]

Trolls were apparently once much taller. Frost giants have 5 eyes and regeneration stunted by fire? Seems like a direct corellation to me.

[@phatbassanchor]

Thank you Scott :) Most enjoyable and informative. You, Drew and Michael are Uber-Nerds. That term is far from the slander it once was when first heard in my youth. These days it it high praise, although its meaning has not changed. An Uber-Nerd is the one all the other nerds flock to for answers, a wise sage with wisdom and knowledge to spare. Thank you for generously sharing your knowledge, wisdom, intellect, research and insight. Adventure on friends!

[@ig-88thebountyhunter52]

I don't know about you but I have played Skyrim a lot and frost Giants have only four eyes not five

[@brandonclevenger7050]

Any one noticed the boats in oblivion can't fit under the bridges or across the lake due to rocks or shallow spots?

[@GamerEnthusiast3188]

I am not certain but what was the reason to not highlight Yokuda and the Sinestro Elves, discussions of early Orc, Khajiiti, Atmorans, is it based upon the notion that Yokuda similar to Akavir is a separate continent? It would make sense guess it just throw me off that since the modern Redguard are direct descendants that they'd be discussed more along with the Dwemer. Oh well.

[@thememester1190]

“and Azura changed them into the felines of today, meaning that they are originally of Altmer stock.” Pelinal Whitestrake was right...

[@nehemiahsomers4141]

EIGHT THOUSAND SIX HUNDRED AND TEN

[@GameraS2K]

Instead of completely dismissing the Bosmer in Valenwood, you could have placed the Changelings there instead. This would allow for the Khajiit to have been changed, but Y'ffre had not yet made the Bosmer. A sort of in-between period

[@elijahbutcher9522]

Okay um how do the frost giants have five eyes cause looking at all of the close ups Scott makes on them in the video I only count four eyes not 5?

[@funnatopia704]

"Cat Demons" could indicate that Khajiit used to be a larger and more ferocious race before Azura decided to go back and change them a bit before calling it good, like how an artist will sometimes change a detail in their work because they realized they didn't like what they did before.

[@juarezbandosa8623]

Tamriel, a furries paradise.

[@davidallen9596]

Fudge muppet is a weird name

[@CallumDT]

And cool

[@TedTalbert]

Thanks for the video. Q: What about the Sload? Were they in or around Tamriel before Mer and Men?

[@fumarc4501]

Thras is not part of the continent of Tamriel.

[@reesetorwad8346]

Before Mer and Men (although different, basically the same thing in the beginning) Tamriel looked like a Daedric playground, because that's what it was. The Daedra had no part in the creation of Mundus, but nothing could prevent them from playing with it.

[@bigboytoy96]

Thank you I’m still up, so this was needed

[@roderik4]

I'm not buying that "Khajiit are Aldmer" thing. Both Bosmer and Khajiiti sources indicate that they had some trouble with their form until azura gave the Khajiit their cat forms, tied to the moons, and Y'free gave the Bosmer their elvish form through the green pact.

[@francisharkins]

*talking about the mystery of pre-civilization Tamriel, footage including jittery teleporting beings of all races in the second era.* Lol ESO looks nice, but still doesn't fit to easily into its mold after all these years.

[@joshuamourning6650]

Ive always wondered about pre elven pre human tamriel the possibility of super smart beast folk and the gods bring more active is a awesome subject

[@grayfox9191]

It'd be interesting if the lilmothiit were a padomaic or lorkhanic civilization with shor being represented by a fox and everything.

[@williamfoster9201]

Nothing helps me ease into the evening after a 10 hr. shift at Wal-Mart like one of your lore videos, Fudgemuppet. Thank You

[@williamfoster9201]

I'd lose my shit if I got the chance to interact with the Imga, if ES6 does takes place in Hammerfell (thus allowing us to adventure through jungle / plains)

[@ethanarc]

What if it wasn't Goblins but Ogres that they met?

[@geth7112]

Did they visit a swamp?

[@godshollownutsack9272]

I watched this and fell asleep halfway through. So I'm rewatching it right now.

[@theimmortalmadness8010]

One word. Actually, two words. Underwater volcanoes. Hm. That's three words... Considering oceans tend to have undercover lava-blasters spread across them, though often rarely, I suspect our primordial busy lizzies did not accumulate their glass from the Big Red Pound of Vvardenfell, but rather, they navigated the gnarly reefs of dancing corals and dodged the more gnarly and insatiable sharks to retrieve their esteemed mighty glass of the past. Makes sense, wouldn't it? Those clever lizards... The dinosaurs would be proud.

[@curvingfyre6810]

Want to know what I think? I think ALL elves are goblinkin. Their brow structure alludes to the small horns seen on orsimer, but also on other goblinkin, including trolls... and giants. Giants who we know share ancestry with man. The orsimer are like as not a superposition between reality and metaphor, cursed by the birth of malacath, but also a distinct evolutionary line from other elves, who stuck more closely to the goblinkin ancestry of the hominids of the elder scrolls. Man is yet another offshoot of a common ancestor, with more in common with the giant and elven lineages. Orcs more with the elven and goblin lineages. Giants with goblin and human lineages. Somewhere, there was once, like as not, a common ancestor to all elder scrolls hominids. Wielding some natural skill with magic, yet with tusks, horns, great size, and the fused fingers of trolls and frost giants. From that common ancestor diverged the species and subspecies of hominid apparent in current elderscrolls (subspecies because the majority of the playable races can interbreed effectively). As this process of biological evolution happened, so to, at the same time, was each crafted by their patron deity. Schrodingers origin myth.

[@wildfire4811]

My brain needs more skyrim instead of school

[@lyka1392]

Pretty sure the lilmothiit are thought to be extinct, not confirmed to be extinct, I personally believe that there are lilmothiit out there, there's already a single dwemer we've seen in the flesh and two snow eleves (although we kill one in dawnguard) so it's not farfetched to think that maybe the lilmothiit are out there in black marsh

[@Jiub_SN]

One dude and two dudes is still extinct. The lilmothit are confirmed to be extinct by Argonians in black marsh

[@wiibrockster]

Dreugh are always the bane of my Morrowind playthroughs. Anybody else find them annoying?

[@LeFaisDoDo]

my dudes straight up shreddin that waveee boiiii fuck yeah!

[@Ray-fk4vh]

There needs to be a mod of this era with the creatures and civilizations you've stated here as playable, the ones that are capable of speech and have at least the potential to make their own civilization like the bird people.

[@flipflopfrog602]

If you like Skyrim check out www.elderstats.com/ it's an interactive database for fans of The Elder Scrolls games to showcase the characters they've created in-game.

[@declanpm8578]

I think you should have included Dragons. Yes they may just appear to be magical beasts but so are centaurs by the same definition. Dragons had an advanced grasp of hierarchy, betrayed each other, fought for territory, had debates in what is arguably the most advanced language on the continent for the time and then later subjugated basically everyone in their territories into worshipping them as gods.

[@SenketsuFi]

Prehistory! love this kind of long lost lore!!

[@JustDevon1]

Did anybody else find it funny that the Elves thought the birdmen were speaking their language until they realized they were just repeating what they were saying, like Parrots!!

[@AuraMaster7]

How do you reconcile this history with the idea that Old Ehlnofey *is* Tamriel and that Aldmeris isnt a continent, but a metaphor for the Dawn Era unity of the elven races?

[@sirsir9665]

Maybe Ysgramor was so badass and strong because the Atmoran gaint heritage. His shield was massive and he some believe he could use his axe one handed. He was said to of killed a giant in one swing of his axe (probably two handed) or something. Maybe he was huge and they just didn't put in game. They could of forgot when they created his character model in Skyrim's Sovngarde.

[@Jiub_SN]

They do that a lot so that's fairly likely. The Nords and giants both developed from atmorans

[@purpledevilr7463]

There needs to be an underwater elder scrolls game.

[@ericupchurch2967]

Sounds like a Mod in the Making... 😊😁🙂

[@glassworktrophic8465]

There sure were a lot of beastfolk back then. Almost like some entity was shaping a bunch of random creatures in the environment into a form like itself to see which would be successful. I mean, you look at that concept art of the parrot-person and it's like... yikes. Just throwing things at a wall to see what sticks.

[@mr.m2659]

Crab people. So if the yokudans are from a previous time cycle, they would be around when the crab people ruled?

[@mrsamaritan6881]

I'm pretty sure the Rieklings are related to the Falmer, not goblins. They are most likely either an offshoot of the Falmer after the descent underground but before eating the fungus that robbed them of their sight. They may have at first accepted the Dwemers' offer of protection and stayed underground long enough to mutate their form but rejected the fungus (whether openly or in secret) and eventually escaped back to the surface. In fact, they may have even started the war between the snow elves and dwarves when the Dwemer discovered some Falmer were not becoming blind and attacked the ancestors of the Rieklings, forcing the blinded Falmer to come to their defense. Alternatively, they could've been a group of Falmer who returned to the surface earlier than most Falmer and, through living on the surface and a different diet, have recovered their eyesight sooner and mutated their form again (or they were even possibly altered somehow by the Frost Giant Karstaag to suit his own purposes). It is possible that they could also be the result of goblins crossbreeding with Falmer. Goblins don't appear to live in Skyrim but perhaps they once did and there was at least one tribe surviving on Solstheim which interbred with the Falmer on that island when the snow elves returned to the surface. Regardless, it's HIGHLY unlikely the Rieklings were among the ancient people "before elves & men" as they couldn't exist until after the Snow Elves, Dwarves and Nords came to Tamriel.

[@Dezzyyy]

not at all. there's evidence that they're related to goblins in many ways. the skyrim devs had a week where they could do w.e they wanted, in said week they made goblins in skyrim that ended up being cut from the game. later in solstheim, the reiklings use the SAME assets, but blue. Same thing in ESO, the reiklings are just blue goblins in there as well. plus there's evidence that the name reikling is derived from the goblin names as well. there's whole videos on it from either fudge or camel, I just watched it but it's currently 4 am and I'm exhausted so I'm sorry this isn't a very well thought our response. but just letting you know there is proof now that they are related.

[@Pinefr0st]

Ancient Tamriel? Is this before or immediately after the last of the Vault-tek Vaults have degraded into dust?

[@mightymouse5930]

Some boomer downvoted without even watching the video.

[@kobovad]

Ok so I'm no Elder Scrolls lore specialist but could it be that most of the Khajiit subspecies are native to Tamriel but the bipedal kind we know from the games are "cursed Bosmer"?

[@TeamJella]

No, the khajiit are all one race and all of their forms are formed based on the shapes of the moons.

[@kobovad]

@@TeamJella Oh well then, that answers that question

[@CloudsGirl7]

Damn, I want an Elder Scrolls game where you go on a big exploration of this version of Tamriel... I'm not complaining about what I get to experience in Skyrim, but DAMN...

[@litrootkit9263]

Elder Scrolls Online offers that I believe.

[@clericofchaos1]

I've never heard of lamia in elder scrolls. Are they all dead by the time of the games or does Bethesda just not feel like programming them in?

[@emilyhedgehog547]

both? Bethesda tends to change lore and appearances of races all the time.

[@justinlloyd8547]

When I'm not actually playing Skyrim I'm brushing up on my Tamrielic history with FudgeMuppet. Cheers mate!

[@elfchick2264]

What are these graphics from? It’s so pretty! I want to play it and the cobra things are adorable

[@movingparts6270]

Isn't it possible, if not more probable, that Mancon Cameron was referencing the earlier description of Dreughs? Cameron was a scholar, and that reference material was likely available to him, wasn't it? The description of the Dreugh sounds more like a myth created to describe a predatory creature that lives nearby.

[@fumarc4501]

Will you do a video on the various tribes it Men? Ket Keptu of Hammerfell, the Orma and Kothringi of Black Marsh are very interesting and some even exist past the 2nd Era.

[@lowalkerdemolition3255]

You should do a video on if we were to see another playable race that would be so. Love your channel

[@Jiub_SN]

Dwemer or Falmer, also potential for imga if a game is set in valenwood. I think it's likely we'll see a Dwemer return alongside some tech skill eventually, and I could see the Falmer being cured by an organization of regeneration mages

[@Foogi9000]

So basically just another reason why Argonians are really cool.

[@incognito3817]

*Crab people! Crab people! Taste like crab! Talk like people!* If we can’t make you into metrosexuals then we will make you into crab people!